Approach The Bench: Law & Order General Discussion Thread

[Maherjunkie]

Oh he's the perp alright, but I'll stop there.

[wknt3]

2 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

The library where I work just got the complete set of all seasons, so I checked out discs 1 & 2 for the weekend. At 6 minutes and 57 seconds into the first episode [Correction: I must've put in disc 2; this 1st of a 2-part episode is 1.15: "Torrents of Greed"] a homeless witness describes the suspect as "Mean looking. Fancy suit. Like Donald Trump." At 8 minutes in, back at the station, the detective is trying to make his case to Captain Cragen that it's mob connected and not gangs: "No. The guy was wearing a suit. Remember? Donald Trump?" Further Trump discussion should go to that thread in the Politics board, but the lines made me wonder how far Drumpf would've gotten in the early 90s. Just to be clear, Donald Trump is not mentioned again in the episode. Trump is not the perp; he is just an archetype (the perp even has reddish hair).

1 hour ago, Maherjunkie said:

Oh he's the perp alright, but I'll stop there.

I think you might have this episode confused with 7.4 "Survivor" @Maherjunkie. That's the one with Trump as the perp. I'm sure that's what you meant right?

[shapeshifter]

Quote from 7.4 courtesy of IMDb:

Quote

Detective Lennie Briscoe: How come rich guys always owe a billion dollars? 

Detective Rey Curtis: High finance, Lennie!

[Maherjunkie]

Oh he's the perp alright, but I'll stop there.

I meant that as a sneaky aside.

 

But season one is on WE TV right now.

Those Donna Summer moans are coming out of me already.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

The second half of Torrents of Greed, otherwise known as Don't Ever Fuck With Christine Baranski, is about to end on WE, and it occurs to me that this was the first witness Ben indirectly got killed. I think. Somebody with a better memory can correct me if I'm wrong.

Edited December 15, 2016 by Cobalt Stargazer
AND is not AT. Duh.

[Maherjunkie]

Does Old Friends count?  I guess that was the second.    Your characterization is so true, by the way.

[roseslg]

Random thought I had yesterday when the season 1 abortion episode was on, I would have hated to had Max and Rey partnered.  They were both so goddamn sanctimonious!!!  Jesus! 

[Maherjunkie]

I'd hate to be needing sympathy from those 2, at least as a non-Catholic liberal.

[303420]

We on Mondays, TNT on Tuesdays, We and Ion on Wednesdays, Ion on Thursdays, Sundance on Fridays. God help me.

Anyway, today I saw the season five episode "Family Values." It's the one where it turns out that the cute and innocent 17-year-old daughter was having an affair with her stepfather, who killed her mother but framed the stepdaughter for it.

The daughter: a teenage Sarah Paulson:

 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

16 hours ago, roseslg said:

Random thought I had yesterday when the season 1 abortion episode was on, I would have hated to had Max and Rey partnered.  They were both so goddamn sanctimonious!!!  Jesus! 

This might be better suited for the UO thread, but I liked Max. His conflicts with some of the aspects of his job as a practicing Catholic, like in Prisoner of Love, rang true to me, and its Max who listens without saying anything censorious to Mike during Indifference when Logan tells him that some women provoke it when it comes to getting hit. 'Course, partnering him with Rey would be like the eventual combination of Serena and Nora, a bit much to take, but on his own Greevey struck a nice balance with Mike's high-tension act.

3 hours ago, 303420 said:

We on Mondays, TNT on Tuesdays, We and Ion on Wednesdays, Ion on Thursdays, Sundance on Fridays. God help me.

Anyway, today I saw the season five episode "Family Values." It's the one where it turns out that the cute and innocent 17-year-old daughter was having an affair with her stepfather, who killed her mother but framed the stepdaughter for it.

The daughter: a teenage Sarah Paulson:

 

And the stepfather's (other) girlfriend was played by Anna Holbrook, of Matrimony's "the dancin' naked idiot family". :-)

[Maherjunkie]

And dumb as a sack of hair!

 

Maybe Mike needed to be judged on that one.  Provoke yes, but follow through, no.

[BW Manilowe]

21 hours ago, 303420 said:

We on Mondays, TNT on Tuesdays, We and Ion on Wednesdays, Ion on Thursdays, Sundance on Fridays. God help me.

Anyway, today I saw the season five episode "Family Values." It's the one where it turns out that the cute and innocent 17-year-old daughter was having an affair with her stepfather, who killed her mother but framed the stepdaughter for it.

The daughter: a teenage Sarah Paulson:

 

I think WE actually airs on Tuesdays, Wednesdays, & (at least most) Saturdays. And Ion airs Midmorning Wednesday through 1AM Thursday. At least if you're talking about the original show.

[roseslg]

19 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

This might be better suited for the UO thread, but I liked Max. His conflicts with some of the aspects of his job as a practicing Catholic, like in Prisoner of Love, rang true to me, and its Max who listens without saying anything censorious to Mike during Indifference when Logan tells him that some women provoke it when it comes to getting hit. 'Course, partnering him with Rey would be like the eventual combination of Serena and Nora, a bit much to take, but on his own Greevey struck a nice balance with Mike's high-tension act.

Yeah, I didn't hate Max (didn't care much for him), but it was good that he was paired with Mike to provide some kind of balance.  Max and Rey would make my head explode.  The only detective I ever really hated was Detective Beauty Queen.

 

I miss the Wednesday evening marathons on WE.  

[Maherjunkie]

Well there on Tues and right now.

[HunterHunted]

On 9/1/2016 at 4:00 AM, SparedTurkey said:

Yeah no, I think they were very much pushing her Texan roots in the first few episodes she was in to be honest. Abortion, death penalty - they hit them all. Then I think they settled down with that stuff, and Angie Harmon was charming enough to make you kind of ignore the odd crap thing she would say every now and then. I'm kind of glad she wasn't there when Branch was - I think they would have doubled down on it and made her less of what she was.

She was big on personal responsibilty for all - witnesses, defendants, bloody stupid jury forepersons. I appreciated that more than anything.

I'm watching Punk right now. It's an episode that I hate because Abbie is so doggedly "Rah, rah! Personal responsibility! Rah!" that she can't see that the defendant, Alice, was clearly being victimized by the victim. I love that everyone can see that Abbie is being just completely awful. She is being unreasonable and stubborn. It's hilarious that Jack sets Abbie up by having her cross examine the defendant. Abbie was being so spiteful that it was going to be obvious to the jury they should be sympathetic to the defendant's arguments. I generally like Abbie, but she was fairly horrible in her first season.

I was a little bit irritated that Abbie glossed over how prisoners can't consent to sex with guards. It's because the guards control every aspect of a prisoner's life that between the two can turn coercive in an instant.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Up way too early, and Empire is on TNT.  Julia Roberts and her four hundred teeth never fail to annoy me in this episode, to the point that I half want Abbie to reach over and smack her when she snarks at her and Jack about taking a complete stroll. "Wow, you're quick." Ugh.

[BW Manilowe]

The Mothership runs on TNT nonstop (well, there are commercials) until 6PM Eastern/5PM Central Time Today. Gotta love Super Bowl Sunday marathons for people who aren't football fans!

[SparedTurkey]

On 1/9/2017 at 4:48 AM, HunterHunted said:

It's an episode that I hate because Abbie is so doggedly "Rah, rah! Personal responsibility! Rah!" that she can't see that the defendant, Alice, was clearly being victimized by the victim. I love that everyone can see that Abbie is being just completely awful. She is being unreasonable and stubborn. It's hilarious that Jack sets Abbie up by having her cross examine the defendant. Abbie was being so spiteful that it was going to be obvious to the jury they should be sympathetic to the defendant's arguments. I generally like Abbie, but she was fairly horrible in her first season.

I was a little bit irritated that Abbie glossed over how prisoners can't consent to sex with guards. It's because the guards control every aspect of a prisoner's life that between the two can turn coercive in an instant.

I don't hate the episode entirely. I do think Alice probably did play the victim in that first trial and that probably did colour Abbie's view of her in this one. At least, I believe that's what the episode was showing.

What I disliked was the Abbie's rape reveal. I dislike it when rape is used to show why a woman is "tough" and harsher on something that the leading "man" would be. While obviously Abbie was wrong about prisoner consent to sex (i.e. its obviously rape) to her turn soft on Alice because they were both raped and blamed themselves just leaves a weird impression. I'm not saying Abbie shouldn't have adopted a less strict opinion but tying it to a rape? Lazy and cliched storytelling to me.

[Xeliou66]

I agree, that was lazy and cliched writing, I didn't like it. Abbie was a massive bitch in that episode and I didn't like how it was all explained by the date rape story, it was a case of lazy writing. I didn't hate the episode, but, I did hate Abbie in it and the ending was bad writing. 

[wanderingstar]

"Couples" was on TNT this morning, and I realize now how much I really love that episode. How could I not with dialogue like this:

(Briscoe & Green enter an apartment where a kidnapped woman is about to give birth, and Briscoe prepares to help with the delivery)

Briscoe: Get me some towels and boil me some water.

Green: Doctors really do that?

Briscoe: George Clooney does. That's good enough for me.

[AnnieBananie]

There are so many different networks playing the episodes that I can't keep them straight, but a lot of the censorship I notice really drives me nuts. Some words that have been bleeped are "crap," "dump" (as in "take a dump,") and other relatively innocuous words, in my opinion, particularly because these episodes are airing at night. A lot of visual images have been blurred, too, like a man in his tighty-whities. Has anyone else noticed this, and if so, found it to be a little too much? 

[GHScorpiosRule]

1 minute ago, AnnieBananie said:

There are so many different networks playing the episodes that I can't keep them straight, but a lot of the censorship I notice really drives me nuts. Some words that have been bleeped are "crap," "dump" (as in "take a dump,") and other relatively innocuous words, in my opinion, particularly because these episodes are airing at night. A lot of visual images have been blurred, too, like a man in his tighty-whities. Has anyone else noticed this, and if so, found it to be a little too much? 

Oh @AnnieBananie! I posted about this very thing a couple years ago! Sundance, a movie channel, is the worst offender! It makes NO SENSE.

[topanga]

17 hours ago, AnnieBananie said:

There are so many different networks playing the episodes that I can't keep them straight, but a lot of the censorship I notice really drives me nuts. Some words that have been bleeped are "crap," "dump" (as in "take a dump,") and other relatively innocuous words, in my opinion, particularly because these episodes are airing at night. A lot of visual images have been blurred, too, like a man in his tighty-whities. Has anyone else noticed this, and if so, found it to be a little too much? 

I think it was Lifetime that bleeped out when Ross (I think, maybe?) read a letter from a defendant talking about his sexual exploits with women. And one line of the letter stated that he likes it raw (or she likes it raw). Anyway, Lifetime bleeped out "raw." The thing is, these L & O episodes talk about brutal rapes and murders, sometimes in graphic detail. If someone were to be offended by the word "raw," they probably shouldn't be watching this show. 

 

Can anyone tell me the name of the episode where Lenny finds his daughter dead? I caught the final scene just before another episode was about to air. Great work from Jerry Orbach.  "That's my baby. Oh, what am I going to do, Rey?" I was close to tears after watching that 30-second snippet. 

Edited February 15, 2017 by topanga

[Xeliou66]

Damaged was the one where Lennie's daughter was murdered. Orbach did play it well, he showed just the right amount of emotion without being over the top. He was a terrific actor. 

And I totally agree about the goddamn censorship. It is so stupid, this show is about violent crimes, anyone who can't take some profanity shouldn't be watching. It isn't a fucking kiddie show. Also this show aired uncensored on NBC in the 90's, but it can't air uncensored on Sundance, a premium movie channel, or WE, a channel with a ton of reality trash? I prefer ION and TNT because they don't censor anything. The worst example of censorship is when they censor the word douche in Fools for Love, because it has relevance to the case : Rodgers tells the cops that the killer used a douche on the victim and that's why they didn't have DNA, but without the word douche it leaves the viewer very confused. 

I hate censorship, people aren't babies. Fuck the Parents Television Council and any other pro censorship groups. 

[wknt3]

On 02/14/2017 at 8:34 PM, AnnieBananie said:

There are so many different networks playing the episodes that I can't keep them straight, but a lot of the censorship I notice really drives me nuts. Some words that have been bleeped are "crap," "dump" (as in "take a dump,") and other relatively innocuous words, in my opinion, particularly because these episodes are airing at night. A lot of visual images have been blurred, too, like a man in his tighty-whities. Has anyone else noticed this, and if so, found it to be a little too much? 

We've noticed and ranted about this many times! I don't know if it's laziness or some sort of rights issues legal stupidity, but it seems like every network but TNT airs the OTA syndication cuts that were edited to be shown during the day and not offend anyone anywhere so much that station managers or advertisers get scared off. It's especially galling on WE where something innocuous like "nuts" gets bleeped and then they show ads for their trashy reality shows that have language 10 times more offensive!

Edited February 16, 2017 by wknt3
accidentally deleted stuff when posting

[Xeliou66]

Yeah there is no excuse for the censorship on WE and Sundance, they both show stuff uncensored that is way more offensive than L&O but with L&O they censor it. I'm so fucking sick of the channels treating the L&O audience like babies. ION doesn't censor either, I've never heard anything edited on there, as well as TNT. But honestly it's pathetic. 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Sundance was showing the episode where the failed artist murdered a woman who provided financial support for other artists (I can't remember the title right now, but it was a Briscoe-Green ep) and in the scene where Ed and Lennie are talking to a sculptor who had also enjoyed her patronage, and they blurred out the breasts of the nude statue she'd been working on. Very strange.

[Xeliou66]

I'm enjoying the ION season 20 marathon on today. I really liked the lineup of Lupo/Bernard/Van Buren and Cutter/Rubirosa/McCoy. The episodes were high quality as well. Just saw the one about the Brazilian scientist that was poisoned, interesting episode as there was no murder as the scientist survived, and everyone involved was unlikable. 

[HunterHunted]

The last 3 seasons were a return to fine form. It sucked that it was cancelled just when the show had gotten really good again. One of things I loved about the final seasons was Jack discovering how annoying McCoy like shenanigans from the other side. I loved his irritation and bemusement watching Cutter pulling a Jack.

[Xeliou66]

Season 20 was the best season L&O had in several years. It was interesting seeing Jack as DA and how he had to balance the interests of his office and politics with getting justice. He gained an appreciation for what Schiff, Lewin and Branch had done. I remember he said one time, "now I know why Adam Schiff was so grumpy". It's a shame NBC canceled such a great show. L&O was great in almost every year of its run IMO, season 17 being by far the weakest link with the awful beauty queen cop but almost all L&O episodes are re watchable. 

[merylinkid]

Detective Beauty Queen -- UGGGH.   It was like they said "Fine, you want to complain there are no female detectives, we'll give you a female detective."   Then wrote her completely unlikable so they could say "We give you what you wanted and you still complain.   You're never happy.   We're going back to male detectives."

[Xeliou66]

Yeah they certainly didn't do a good job with her, she was a terrible actress and had no chemistry with anyone, between her and some really subpar episodes writing wise, episodes such as Release, Melting Pot and Talking Points were really poorly written and cliched compared to most L&O episodes, season 17 nearly spelled the end of the show. Fortunately they got rid of Beauty Queen cop and got new writers and the show improved in season 18

[GHScorpiosRule]

5 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Detective Beauty Queen -- UGGGH.   It was like they said "Fine, you want to complain there are no female detectives, we'll give you a female detective."   Then wrote her completely unlikable so they could say "We give you what you wanted and you still complain.   You're never happy.   We're going back to male detectives."

UGH is right. And she was horrible in her guest appearance in the previous season, "Flaw," which concluded the crossover with SVU. She was either a hooker or some witness who knew who the bimbo killer was or something. Beauty Queen Milena Govech, and the actress who played Alex(?), the ADA who replaced Rhombot and who was also killed off, also appeared as the mistress of the killer? someone in the season before.

Why no, I don't watch this show multiple times at all!? Whatever gave you that idea??

[merylinkid]

Annie Parissi -- yeah when I caught her in a rerun, I was like -- wait what.   Guess she was only stripping to afford law school.   

Did not realize Milena Govech had been on earlier.

Recently I caught one that surprised the hell out of me.   He played a character  (I think the guy who did it) in a season 2 episode.    Heard the voice and went, wait, LENNY?????    

[GHScorpiosRule]

8 minutes ago, merylinkid said:

 

Recently I caught one that surprised the hell out of me.   He played a character  (I think the guy who did it) in a season 2 episode.    Heard the voice and went, wait, LENNY?????    

HAH! No. Lenny played the defense lawyer for the woman who killed her estranged hubby and his mistress, a la Betty Broderick, and emotionally blackmailed her son to lie about it. "Wages of Love" I think is the episode title. And son was played by Geoffrey Naufts, who would go on to make appearances on Intent and SVU. ?

And now I've got Shirley Knight's character's "25 yeeeeears. We were married for 25 yeeeeeeears" running in a loop in my head!

Edited February 25, 2017 by GHScorpiosRule

[merylinkid]

I could remember what part he played.   But I was still "whoa, wait a minute, what is Briscoe doing."

[WendyCR72]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

And now I've got Shirley Knight's character's "25 yeeeeears. We were married for 25 yeeeeeeears" running in a loop in my head!

OMG. If we drank every time she said that line, we'd be dead from alcohol poisoning. And not-Lennie's name there was Frank Lehrman.  :-)

[WendyCR72]

Milena Govich was on the one-season 2006 Conviction, the show that had Alex Cabot from SVU as Bureau Chief (and suddenly turned from someone for the victims to a bitchy bureaucrat, but anyway...). Wolf really tried pushing her on that show, too. I recall her opening credit had her character in her bra or whatever. Julianne Nicholson was also on that and, like Govich, got a regular gig with Nicholson joining CI. So Wolf must keep people in mind.

[wknt3]

9 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Yeah they certainly didn't do a good job with her, she was a terrible actress and had no chemistry with anyone, between her and some really subpar episodes writing wise, episodes such as Release, Melting Pot and Talking Points were really poorly written and cliched compared to most L&O episodes, season 17 nearly spelled the end of the show. Fortunately they got rid of Beauty Queen cop and got new writers and the show improved in season 18

Yeah if Connie Rubirosa didn't come in during Season 17 and revitalize the DA's side of the show it could have been the end of the series. It might have been a necessary evil since it showed that maybe Dick Wolf and the producers knew more than the network execs what made the show work and the idiots seemed to leave them alone for a couple years (until they cancelled the show...)

[Xeliou66]

Detective Beauty Queen was the worst actor ever to appear on L&O, she had no talent and never would've gotten any job if it wasn't for her looks. Rubirosa joining did help in season 17 because Borgia sucked and had no acting talent either and her and Beauty Queen at the same time would've probably gotten the show canceled.

[GHScorpiosRule]

3 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Detective Beauty Queen was the worst actor ever to appear on L&O, she had no talent and never would've gotten any job if it wasn't for her looks. 

She really is. And even though he ended up being guilty, I was really disgusted in that one episode where they were questioning this Guy who was involved with some terrorist video (he claimed he was just an editor or movie maker or something), she got up in his personal space, whispering in her attempt to be all "sexy" to make him uncomfortable because of his or his people's religion. It made me uncomfortable and I don't get bothered easily. If the genders had been reversed, no WAY would they have had Green getting all in and seducey in a female perp's space and face. It's like the only skill she had that would work in interrogations, was her "sexuality." Which, no, I don't think she had anything. Connie Rubirosa??? EXUDED sexiness like nobody's bidnez! And I say this as a straight female!??

Govich couldn't even sell a credible arson investigator on Psych! Which she did a couple years later after being booted from this show.??

[Xeliou66]

I agree, Rubirosa was much more attractive. Beauty Queen had no talent or personality and was only there for her looks. 

But I have to disagree about her using her sex appeal against the Muslim guy. Unlike hardcore SJW's, I don't feel any sympathy for terrorists who commit mass murder or chop people's heads off because something offends them, and I don't give a fuck about their feelings. 

[Xeliou66]

So I'm up late tonight and watching on TNT, I love their all night L&O marathons. Just saw season 13's Shangra La, about the girl who posed as a 16 year for a decade and fooled everyone and murdered the teacher when she found out, very good episode. Very good case and lots of good one liners from Lennie and Branch, and it had a lot of the best recurring characters, Skoda, Rodgers, Brody, and Jessica Sheets, one of the best and most underrated L&O defense lawyers. 

Now they are showing Fontana episodes, right now it's the one about the Bill O'Reilly like right wing mouthpiece who got shot and the loon woman got manipulated by the wife to do it. Pretty good episode, Fontana is always fascinating and while not always likable, he was entertaining and a good replacement for Lennie as he brought his own unique style to the show and didn't try to be Lennie 2.0. 

[KHenry14]

On 2/25/2017 at 10:05 AM, Xeliou66 said:

Detective Beauty Queen was the worst actor ever to appear on L&O, she had no talent and never would've gotten any job if it wasn't for her looks. Rubirosa joining did help in season 17 because Borgia sucked and had no acting talent either and her and Beauty Queen at the same time would've probably gotten the show canceled.

I'd disagree that Annie Parisse doesn't have any acting talent. She was very good in the WWII mini-series "The Pacific" as Lena Basilone. They wrote her too soft as Alexandra, as she can definitely play some one harder like Lena

[wknt3]

1 hour ago, KHenry14 said:

I'd disagree that Annie Parisse doesn't have any acting talent. She was very good in the WWII mini-series "The Pacific" as Lena Basilone. They wrote her too soft as Alexandra, as she can definitely play some one harder like Lena

I agree that the problem was writing more than performance. I'm not sure it was too soft so much as just not really having any distinguishing characteristics. It seemed like they wanted to go a different direction than past ADAs, but never quite figured it out, They probably would have been better off with a man, but NBC would never have allowed that. By the time Connie came in they knew they needed to go back to the proven formula - she was an intelligent assertive woman who respected Jack and learned from him, but was willing to question him and argue for her POV when she thought it was important in the mold of Claire, Abbie, or especially Jamie. Once they decided to write a character with a personality and character traits even if it invited comparisons to the past things started to click. So I really do blame/credit the writing for the difference. It sure helped that Alaina de la Garza and Sam Waterston had amazing chemistry from the beginning though!

[Xeliou66]

Agreed, they never seemed to know what to do with Borgia, but she was annoying. She was very religious and conservative and seemed somewhat preachy and uptight and whiny, she seemed weak and not at all likable. She lacked passion and enthusiasm. Uninteresting. I felt practically nothing when she died. 

Rubirosa was a great character, even if she was somewhat reminiscent of Kincaid and Ross, she was a unique and strong character in her own right and she became one of my favorites. She had excellent chemistry sun all of the cast and her addition made the second half of season 17 interesting, had Borgia remained, well I would've had some trouble getting through those episodes and I'm almost positive the show would've been canceled.

Edited March 1, 2017 by Xeliou66

[Xeliou66]

Watching some excellent season 10 episodes tonight, saw Killerz earlier, I wanted to punch Olivet, the judge and the clueless whiny mom for getting that psychotic killer little girl off. There is no question the bitch was going kill again, and I didn't understand why Olivet took her side and then her condescending line to McCoy about why he was going after her, I agreed with Skoda when he told Olivet she had gotten soft. Skoda was by far the better psych expert IMO, I usually liked Olivet but I hated her in this episode and in a few others, she could be very sanctimonious and condescending. And the stupid mom saying "please don't take her away from me, she's my best friend", wake up idiot, your daughter is a sociopath who was on her way to becoming a serial killer and you are clearly clueless and have no control over your kid. What about the parents of the kid who was murdered, don't they deserve justice. Fuck her and fuck the judge for buying her sob story, that episode pisses me off more than perhaps any other L&O episode, that one along with Manhood.

Next up was DNR, one of my favorite episodes. L&O at its best, good investigation in the first half, clever legal maneuvering in the second. Judge Grobman was a memorable and sympathetic character, the actress managed to make the audience feel for her instead of finding her annoying because she was in such deep denial. Great episode, with some great lines and memorable scenes, especially the last 15 minutes with the courtroom testimony at the competency hearing and the husband finally confessing. 

Skoda has been on most of the episodes I've seen tonight, and I have to say he is a greay character and my favorite of the recurring characters. Anyone else love his appearances? 

[andromeda331]

3 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Watching some excellent season 10 episodes tonight, saw Killerz earlier, I wanted to punch Olivet, the judge and the clueless whiny mom for getting that psychotic killer little girl off. There is no question the bitch was going kill again, and I didn't understand why Olivet took her side and then her condescending line to McCoy about why he was going after her, I agreed with Skoda when he told Olivet she had gotten soft. Skoda was by far the better psych expert IMO, I usually liked Olivet but I hated her in this episode and in a few others, she could be very sanctimonious and condescending. And the stupid mom saying "please don't take her away from me, she's my best friend", wake up idiot, your daughter is a sociopath who was on her way to becoming a serial killer and you are clearly clueless and have no control over your kid. What about the parents of the kid who was murdered, don't they deserve justice. Fuck her and fuck the judge for buying her sob story, that episode pisses me off more than perhaps any other L&O episode, that one along with Manhood.

Next up was DNR, one of my favorite episodes. L&O at its best, good investigation in the first half, clever legal maneuvering in the second. Judge Grobman was a memorable and sympathetic character, the actress managed to make the audience feel for her instead of finding her annoying because she was in such deep denial. Great episode, with some great lines and memorable scenes, especially the last 15 minutes with the courtroom testimony at the competency hearing and the husband finally confessing. 

Skoda has been on most of the episodes I've seen tonight, and I have to say he is a greay character and my favorite of the recurring characters. Anyone else love his appearances? 

So did I. The mother already proved she couldn't control her child, so what was the judge and Olivet expecting? Cross their fingers and hoped for the best? They basically let the girl get off for murder and there was nothing to prevent it from happening again. Have fun explaining to the next victims parents why you let the kid off.    

[Xeliou66]

Absolutely, I hated Olivet in that one. The girl's mom was such a whiny bitch and in deep denial. That girl would be a terror to society and she belonged in an institution, I couldn't believe they just let her off for killing a little boy because it might ruin her for good. She was already a lost cause, she should've been locked away. That episode may piss me off more than any other L&O.

[andromeda331]

1 hour ago, Xeliou66 said:

Absolutely, I hated Olivet in that one. The girl's mom was such a whiny bitch and in deep denial. That girl would be a terror to society and she belonged in an institution, I couldn't believe they just let her off for killing a little boy because it might ruin her for good. She was already a lost cause, she should've been locked away. That episode may piss me off more than any other L&O.

Yes, she should have been locked away. I couldn't believe how the judge and Olivet talked as if they were worried about messing up the girl or something. She already was messed up. She killed a little boy. She belonged in an institution and it was the best place for her. If they were so concerned about you'd think they realize that locked up in an institution full of trained doctors was the best place for her. Better locked up now (and possibly getting real help) then prison in a few years after she's killed again.