S04.E02: Sam’s Dad

[eel2178]

12 hours ago, sweetandsour said:

Diane was insane to taste the red substance.  No matter what it is.  Even if it's tasty food like raspberry coulis.  It was on the wall of an old house.  Applied with some unknown tool.

The original wallpaper most likely has lead paint in it.

[HurricaneVal]

I'm on the fence about Patience.  I'm thinking the roster of ghosts is getting pretty full, what with the core house ghosts, the cholera cellar ghosts, the redcoat shed ghosts, Crash, Stephanie, plus Carol and now plus Patience.  I think the writers need to do a little housecleaning, but they've kind of written themselves into a corner:  the core house ghosts are beloved characters, and nobody wants to see them go, yet the easiest way to write off someone like Carol or Patience would be to have them sucked off, then how is that fair?

At least Stephanie only wakes up very occasionally, and Crash is usually just in the background, and with the exception of Nancy and Nigel, the cellar and shed ghosts only make rare appearances.  Frankly, I'm glad Nigel has moved back to the shed, and presumably Carol is there as well, in her relationship with the piper.  Or drummer?

That said, I think it would be funny if Patience is drawn to Jay, or rather Jay's cooking.  She's lived in the dirt for so long that the tantalizing kitchen smells are irresistible to her.  She has a whole moral dilemma over the sin of gluttony, but can't resist the compelling fragrances of exotic ingredients and preparations.  Eventually, she just retreats to the pantry, where she stands there and huffs curry, cardamom, and garam masala all day.  She begins to idolize Jay as the creator of her new obsession, and his easy going attitude starts to rub off on her, and loosens her up to the point where she gets sucked off because of her enlightened attitude.  I see Flower's influence helping there too, little nudges to self-indulgences.  Like Flower did for Hetty.

[KarenX]

I loved when Sass explained to Patience that the couple got married in the car and that did the trick. It was an unexpected pairing and I laughed. There is a lot of comic potential for her character. I like her in the house!

Yes, there are too many ghosts now. I have mixed feelings about dropping Nigel to make room for her, though. I want all the core ghosts to stay and Nigel and Nancy are core now.

[Skooma]

2 hours ago, shura said:

Yes, and then he was joined by Hetty, Pete, Trevor, etc., then Sam came on the scene and wrote a book about Isaac. My point is, all of these people knew about Arnold being a traitor and could have told him. 

Isn't that pretty much what Jay told him?

Also Alberta.  But none of these ghosts seem interested much in history.  Maybe Pete at most.  And unless Issac brought up the subject they wouldn't have.  Also my pov is it is a comedy show so just go with it for the laughs.

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

If I take what Sam's dad said at face value, about why he did not attend Sam's recital, it seems quite likely his ex-wife was poisoning Sam's mind about him. Which, unfortunately, happens a lot when parents divorce and one parent has primary custody and is bitter about their ex. He said she threatened to throw a fit if he even showed up. That's pretty extreme.

And some people posted above reminding us that Sam's mother was not the nicest person spending her time endlessly criticizing and tearing down Sam when she was growing up and even as a young adult.  That was the crux of the whole episode about Sam's mom's ghost in an earlier season.

So if she was that way with her only child who she had no beef with one can imagine how vitriolic she would be toward her former husband.

[Lugal]

2 hours ago, eel2178 said:

The original wallpaper most likely has lead paint in it.

Curious about that, I looked it up, and discovered that the good news is they would not have used lead paint on wallpaper.  The bad news: a lot of Victorian green dyes and paints were colored with copper arsenite.

Hopefully any lead and/or arsenic based paints would have been removed in subsequent remodels.  Or at the very least they would have to be removed during Sam and Jay's renovation (which would up their costs tremendously).  Otherwise, knowing there's lead or arsenic-based paint in the B&B will sends guests running out the door faster than SIN appearing in blood on the walls.

[kathyk2]

2 hours ago, HurricaneVal said:

I'm on the fence about Patience.  I'm thinking the roster of ghosts is getting pretty full, what with the core house ghosts, the cholera cellar ghosts, the redcoat shed ghosts, Crash, Stephanie, plus Carol and now plus Patience.  I think the writers need to do a little housecleaning, but they've kind of written themselves into a corner:  the core house ghosts are beloved characters, and nobody wants to see them go, yet the easiest way to write off someone like Carol or Patience would be to have them sucked off, then how is that fair?

At least Stephanie only wakes up very occasionally, and Crash is usually just in the background, and with the exception of Nancy and Nigel, the cellar and shed ghosts only make rare appearances.  Frankly, I'm glad Nigel has moved back to the shed, and presumably Carol is there as well, in her relationship with the piper.  Or drummer?

That said, I think it would be funny if Patience is drawn to Jay, or rather Jay's cooking.  She's lived in the dirt for so long that the tantalizing kitchen smells are irresistible to her.  She has a whole moral dilemma over the sin of gluttony, but can't resist the compelling fragrances of exotic ingredients and preparations.  Eventually, she just retreats to the pantry, where she stands there and huffs curry, cardamom, and garam masala all day.  She begins to idolize Jay as the creator of her new obsession, and his easy going attitude starts to rub off on her, and loosens her up to the point where she gets sucked off because of her enlightened attitude.  I see Flower's influence helping there too, little nudges to self-indulgences.  Like Flower did for Hetty.

Patience will have to adapt if she wants to stay in the house. She can't tell Sam who loves Christmas not to celebrate the holiday. She would never accept two gay ghosts living there If she couldn't live with people who shared her beliefs how will she live with people who are liberal. I don't think there are too many ghosts since most of them are recurring.

[Chit Chat]

21 hours ago, shura said:

Also surprising that Isaac doesn’t know about Benedict Arnold.

Look how long it took him to realize that dinosaurs were real!!  

1 hour ago, KarenX said:

I loved when Sass explained to Patience that the couple got married in the car and that did the trick.

Sass can be pretty snarky and quit-witted!  I hope that we'll learn this season how he met his demise.  

[kathyk2]

1 hour ago, Skooma said:

Also Alberta.  But none of these ghosts seem interested much in history.  Maybe Pete at most.  And unless Issac brought up the subject they wouldn't have.  Also my pov is it is a comedy show so just go with it for the laughs.

And some people posted above reminding us that Sam's mother was not the nicest person spending her time endlessly criticizing and tearing down Sam when she was growing up and even as a young adult.  That was the crux of the whole episode about Sam's mom's ghost in an earlier season.

So if she was that way with her only child who she had no beef with one can imagine how vitriolic she would be toward her former husband.

I hope we see flashbacks to Sam's childhood to see who is right. If Sam's mom was making it difficult for her ex to see Sam he could have fought for custody. Her mom could have taken out her anger with her former husband on her daughter.

[Chit Chat]

30 minutes ago, kathyk2 said:

If Sam's mom was making it difficult for her ex to see Sam he could have fought for custody. Her mom could have taken out her anger with her former husband on her daughter.

I liked that Sam told her dad that she didn't think about things from his point of view and that it was probably more complicated than she realized.  At this point, maybe it would be best for both of them to wipe the slate clean and start over. 

Sam has a lot of unanswered questions, but it might be more painful to dredge up all of the details.  She doesn't have her mom to corroborate or deny whatever her dad says, so it might be best for Sam to try and let that go.  The true test will be going forward, and she'll know for sure if her dad is sincere in wanting to have a relationship.  He seemed like he was.  It helps that his girlfriend was kind and Sam liked her.  I'm rooting for them!

[possibilities]

I live in a 300 year old house that was converted into apartments in the 1980s. When I moved in, I received papeerwork saying that they could not guarantee it was lead-free, and it definitely isn't. I know, because lead paint cracks differently than more modern paints, and the doors on some of the rooms have the typical lead-paint cracks.

This is the 2nd apartment I've lived in that is like this. 

There is a rule that you have to de-lead if there are young children as tenants. But I don't have kids, and also this is not a law that is consistently enfroced, because suing a landlord is a great way to wind up homeless in a housing shortage, especially if you're low income.

Hetty said the wallpaper was original, so I'm guessing Sam and Jay have an exemption from any laws about removing it, based on "historic building" status.

 

I've given this a lot of thought! 

 

 

[shura]

4 hours ago, Chit Chat said:

That was a big deal!!  One thing I learned from touring the Biltmore Estate in North Carolina was that dresses with buttons going all the way up & down the back was a status symbol too.  It meant that you could afford to hire someone to help you dress and button up all of those buttons!

So, by this measure, a zipper would be a status downgrade then, because it takes way less time to zip it up and you don’t have to pay as much for labor?  And nowadays you have husbands to do it for free 😌…

2 hours ago, Lugal said:

Hopefully any lead and/or arsenic based paints would have been removed in subsequent remodels.  Or at the very least they would have to be removed during Sam and Jay's renovation (which would up their costs tremendously).  Otherwise, knowing there's lead or arsenic-based paint in the B&B will sends guests running out the door faster than SIN appearing in blood on the walls.

I would also assume/hope that they just wouldn’t be allowed to run a B&B without having brought everything up to code.

 

[shura]

3 hours ago, Skooma said:

Also Alberta.  But none of these ghosts seem interested much in history.  Maybe Pete at most.  And unless Issac brought up the subject they wouldn't have.  Also my pov is it is a comedy show so just go with it for the laughs.

Oh, it’s not really a problem.  I just found it curious that, for all the ghosts’ complaints about how they have heard every single story from one another thousands of times over the years, a thing like what happened to someone a few of them know of independently never came up.  It’s like talking about a common acquaintance. Jack from accounting?  Moved to Arizona.  Benedict Arnold?  Traitor.  And Isaac probably even mentioned Arnold when he was dictating his book to Sam, so she might have filled him in too.  But yes, it’s totally possible that none of them ever mentioned it.

The thing that bugs me a little is when the show seems to suggest that a ghost does not know about something because he died before it happened, duh.  No, he was still around to receive the info after he died.  The reason he doesn’t know about it is because the later ghosts or Sam haven’t told him.  The writers don’t need to give the false “because it happened after he died” reason, they are better than that.  In fact, they don’t need to give any reason.  They can just lampshade it if they must, like they did with the question of where Patience can possibly get all that blood from.  Or have Trevor say something like “oh yeah, I guess we never told him”.  I think the laughs will still be there.

[Chit Chat]

41 minutes ago, shura said:

So, by this measure, a zipper would be a status downgrade then, because it takes way less time to zip it up and you don’t have to pay as much for labor?

Zippers might've been expensive when they first came out, so only the wealthy could afford them?  Maybe zippers were seen as "fancy" when they first came out.  

[possibilities]

11 hours ago, ams1001 said:

I wonder if she has to wait a certain amount of time before she can do it again...

She did it twice this episode, so it's still going to be a problem even if she has a "refractory period". It could be great on Halloween, though. Word gets out, and they will have a lot of guests on 10/31.

 

10 hours ago, Driad said:

Could Sam have told her father that SIN had been on the wall when they got the house, and they had tried various preparations to try to remove or cover it?

Wouldn't Dad and GF have noticed it when they first went in there, though? And wouldn't Sam and Jay have covered it up with something, even if they couldn't wash it off? Even if paint doesn't work, they could hang a picture there.

 

 

[Annber03]

12 hours ago, DanaK said:

Patience can not just make the walls bleed, but she also makes a message appear. That's pretty nifty and handy power

I said this elsewhere, but remember how freaked out Jay was back in season one when Trevor was writing on the bathroom mirror? Now Patience is showing off her power and can write messages as well, Jay may wind up just deciding to forgo showering altogether :p. 

11 hours ago, Lugal said:

Now that Isaac thinks he's being a better person, he's getting even more insufferable.  I do think it's a nice touch that the other ghosts didn't want him there.

It's so in keeping for Isaac to completely go about the whole "being a better person" thing in the most wrong and over the top way possible :p. 

But yeah, this breakup, he can't blame Nigel this time, 'cause it's not Nigel's fault or decision that they're not together now. He'd have to look inward and take responsibility for himself and his own actions and that...is not his strong suit :p. So he's doing what he always does when he's got some deeper and difficult emotional stuff he doesn't want to deal with. He puts up his front and puts on his pompous/arrogant/self-absorbed persona. The only question now is how long he'll be able to keep it up before the cracks start to show. And I think once that happens, or once he does something for purely selfless reasons without worrying about how it fits into his whole "be a better person" thing, that will help start turning things around for him and Nigel, and make it easier for them to finally start properly working things out. 

Edited October 26 by Annber03

[possibilities]

How would Nigel ever trust him again, though?

[Annber03]

2 minutes ago, possibilities said:

How would Nigel ever trust him again, though?

Geuss it would just depend on whatever he does that really shows how much he's changed? That's a good question, though, yeah - I honestly don't know what it would take for that to happen. But considering all the other stuff Nigel's forgiven Isaac for (up to and including being the reason he's, y'know, dead and a ghost :p), I imagine there's got to be something that will work. When Nigel told Isaac that he couldn't stay mad at him, I truly think he meant it. 

Even if/when they do work things out, though, I can absolutely see the "Isaac left him at the altar" thing becoming a running joke of sorts among the ghosts. 

[Skooma]

35 minutes ago, possibilities said:

How would Nigel ever trust him again, though?

Easy.  When the writers decide Nigel can.

[Bastet]

1 hour ago, possibilities said:

How would Nigel ever trust him again, though?

He shouldn't any time remotely soon. 

Which isn't a knock on either of them.  They should both grasp the simple concept they're at significantly different points in their lives/after-lives, and their mutual crush among their limited options doesn't translate to an eternal commitment. 

This relationship had entertaining moments, but that it's done - for now, at least - is not any great tragedy, especially for Isaac who has only had this one relationship as his honest self.  Being ghosts significantly limits their dating pool, so it's sad, but everyone needs to move on.

[Chit Chat]

On 10/24/2024 at 8:24 PM, Browncoat said:

Patience's ghost power is a really good one!  But Patience herself is going to wear really thin really quickly, I'm afraid.

As Hetty said, "she's a lot!" 

I find Nancy to be hilarious.  "If I'm dead, why does my butt still itch?"  It's those little moments of her walking by and dropping those little gems that I find so amusing.  

Jay could've told the delivery driver that they were working on a Halloween prank.  That poor guy will probably never go back there again!  I can't wait until we get the episode where....

Spoiler

Jay can see the ghosts.  That info has been out there, but I tagged it just in case some don't know about it.  

 

[DrSpaceman73]

18 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Yeah. But I bet the writers toyed with the idea of having Sam & Jay explain that the red paint bleeds through every paint they tried covering it with, and they thought they'd found a paint that permanently covered it, but apparently not. 

Hrmmm... If they painted a room dark red, then Patience blood might not be noticed…
I personally think the fad of painting rooms dark red (first saw it in in 2001) is awful, but then I can't stand light green either.

 

Red room.....red room

[iMonrey]

14 hours ago, shura said:

Oh, it’s not really a problem.  I just found it curious that, for all the ghosts’ complaints about how they have heard every single story from one another thousands of times over the years, a thing like what happened to someone a few of them know of independently never came up.  It’s like talking about a common acquaintance. Jack from accounting?  Moved to Arizona.  Benedict Arnold?  Traitor.  And Isaac probably even mentioned Arnold when he was dictating his book to Sam, so she might have filled him in too.  But yes, it’s totally possible that none of them ever mentioned it.

I think it's important to remember how much Sam and Jay have changed the ghosts' lives . . . uh, afterlives. They had never even seen a TV before Sam and Jay moved in. Crash, Flower, Stephanie, Pete and Trevor all knew about TVs but Thor had no idea what it was when it was first hooked up. There are lots of things it seems like the older ghosts should have known about but I think their interactions before Sam and Jay moved in must have been very different and perhaps much more limited. 

[possibilities]

I like the idea of Patience spedning her time huffing smells in the pantry. She and that very creepy child ghost we saw in only one episode might get along.

[Lugal]

15 hours ago, Chit Chat said:

Zippers might've been expensive when they first came out, so only the wealthy could afford them?  Maybe zippers were seen as "fancy" when they first came out.

According to wikipedia, zippers were first patented in 1892, so for Hetty to have one before she died in 1895 would be quite the status symbol.  The newest thing like a telephone.

19 hours ago, Skooma said:

Also Alberta.  But none of these ghosts seem interested much in history.  Maybe Pete at most.  And unless Issac brought up the subject they wouldn't have.  Also my pov is it is a comedy show so just go with it for the laughs.

Also, Isaac is not exactly the type to "listen when other people talk" and having dealt with people like that IRL (and not for centuries like the ghosts would have) eventually you just give up trying.  Look how long it took him to learn about dinosaurs.  Isaac asked Sass if he knew about dinosaurs, Sass's response was: "Yes, because I pay attention."

[PaulE]

On 10/26/2024 at 1:34 AM, Annber03 said:

On 10/26/2024 at 1:28 AM, possibilities said:

How would Nigel ever trust him again, though?

Geuss it would just depend on whatever he does that really shows how much he's changed? That's a good question, though, yeah - I honestly don't know what it would take for that to happen. But considering all the other stuff Nigel's forgiven Isaac for (up to and including being the reason he's, y'know, dead and a ghost :p), I imagine there's got to be something that will work. When Nigel told Isaac that he couldn't stay mad at him, I truly think he meant it. 

Even if/when they do work things out, though, I can absolutely see the "Isaac left him at the altar" thing becoming a running joke of sorts among the ghosts. 

Also, when Nigel assumed Isaac was expecting him to return to the shed he was sad but accepting--he had an "if it has to be, it has to be" attitude.  Although he can fly off the handle and take offense easily, I think he just gets on with things and doesn't nurse personal grudges--his anger at and resentment of the revolution was primarily for his king and country, not himself.  His kerfuffle with Hetty and Trevor didn't last long and doesn't seem to have had any lasting consequences.  And he basically admitted he'd been foolish to hate the mansion ghosts all those years when when he could have enjoyed their friendship instead. So even if his love for Isaac weakens at some point, I think he'll be able to forgive him (I suspect he already has).  It would be sweet if he and Isaac could eventually resume their daily walks simply as friends.

Edited October 28 by PaulE

[shapeshifter]

On 10/25/2024 at 5:32 PM, KarenX said:

I loved when Sass explained to Patience that the couple got married in the car and that did the trick. It was an unexpected pairing and I laughed.

Sass has totally got Patience's number.
I look forward to Sass feeding Patience lines that give her a way out of her emotionally unhealthy habits of thinking
— and doing it with LOL one-liners.

Hrmmm...I wonder though if Patience's ideas sustained her wandering alone in the the dirt for centuries?
And/or did Patience's mindset keep her from finding her way out of the dirt? Like a commitment to her situation as being penance for some sort of sinning.

[Annber03]

32 minutes ago, PaulE said:

It would be sweet if he and Isaac could eventually resume their daily walks simply as friends.

I can definitely see this being how they decide to reconcile after they sort out their issues. Starting anew and becoming friends again and then slowly building back up from there as time goes on. 

I like your analysis of Nigel as a character, too. Yeah, his temper flares quickly and yet it also dies just as quickly. Isaac is the one who tends to hold grudges and linger on petty slights (or perceived slights). 

[possibilities]

nevermind

 

 

Edited October 27 by possibilities

[iMonrey]

There's a creepy undertone to this show I don't normally think about because it's so silly. But when Frank snuck into Diane's bed and the camera swung around to reveal Patience standing there, that was genuinely creepy! Like something out of a serious ghost story. I don't think it would have been as effective if it had been Thor or Sass but Patience in her black and white Puritan outfit standing there in the dark is disturbing.

Sam and Jay are running a hotel knowing full well there are ghosts watching the guests in their rooms doing God only knows what. This hit home when Frank and Diane were having a private conversation about Sam's mother and Pete and Sass were standing there eavesdropping. 

I don't think I'd want to stay at Woodstone knowing there are probably ghosts in my room watching everything I do.

[PaulE]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

There's a creepy undertone to this show I don't normally think about because it's so silly. But when Frank snuck into Diane's bed and the camera swung around to reveal Patience standing there, that was genuinely creepy! Like something out of a serious ghost story. I don't think it would have been as effective if it had been Thor or Sass but Patience in her black and white Puritan outfit standing there in the dark is disturbing.

Sam and Jay are running a hotel knowing full well there are ghosts watching the guests in their rooms doing God only knows what. This hit home when Frank and Diane were having a private conversation about Sam's mother and Pete and Sass were standing there eavesdropping. 

I don't think I'd want to stay at Woodstone knowing there are probably ghosts in my room watching everything I do.

The ghosts have admitted up front that they sometimes watch guests having sex, and Jay knows the only time he's safe is when Sam is with him.  The poor guy can't even get naked in the shower because he doesn't know if a ghost might be  present.   Knowing the ghosts exist and might be standing right next to you, yet being unable to see or hear them, would definitely creep me the hell out and/or make me completely paranoid.

[Annber03]

That's one detail I've always apprecaited with this show, how Jay's always the one making a point to tell the ghosts not to spy on the guests. He knows firsthand how creepy it is to have ghosts watching your every move while you can't see them, so of course he'd be a little more sensitive to that where others are concerned as a result. At least he's fortunate enough to know the ghosts ARE wandering around the house, even if he can't see them. The guests don't even have that luxury. 

[Bastet]

I watched this episode with my mom and we both only laughed once (but in different places).  It just did not land with me.  When it ended, my mom said, "They need to send Patience back to the dirt in a hurry."  I'm not digging her (no pun intended), either.  Hetty and Isaac are always funny when they're awful, but she isn't.  The only thing funny is how the others react to her.  Hetty's "She is a lot" and comment on how it's one extreme or another with her (when Patience said they need to take to the marital bed and procreate) were perfectly delivered, but the actor playing Patience is not making the character work for me.  I cracked up at the flashback of her being thrown out of the community in her first episode, and the shenanigans in the dirt were fun, but it turns out one episode was my limit with her.

I'm not buying this "It was all because of her mom" excuse, but if Sam is, fine, and I hope they continue to get closer since he's the only parent she has.

Thor and Flower continue to annoy me as a couple (they make no sense, and have no chemistry), so if I don't even get the Nancy humor now that the throuple is over, I'm going to dislike their relationship even more.

Nigel bugs me a good 50% of the time, so I'm glad he's back in the shed.

Pete's "Call me Daddy" thing did not land, at all, for me.

So this episode was pretty much just a compilation of things/people I don't like, and is not one I'll ever re-watch.  I didn't love last week's, but I liked it, so I figure I will still really like the season as a whole.  Just not this episode.

 

[kathyk2]

35 minutes ago, Bastet said:

I watched this episode with my mom and we both only laughed once (but in different places).  It just did not land with me.  When it ended, my mom said, "They need to send Patience back to the dirt in a hurry."  I'm not digging her (no pun intended), either.  Hetty and Isaac are always funny when they're awful, but she isn't.  The only thing funny is how the others react to her.  Hetty's "She is a lot" and comment on how it's one extreme or another with her (when Patience said they need to take to the marital bed and procreate) were perfectly delivered, but the actor playing Patience is not making the character work for me.  I cracked up at the flashback of her being thrown out of the community in her first episode, and the shenanigans in the dirt were fun, but it turns out one episode was my limit with her.

I'm not buying this "It was all because of her mom" excuse, but if Sam is, fine, and I hope they continue to get closer since he's the only parent she has.

Thor and Flower continue to annoy me as a couple (they make no sense, and have no chemistry), so if I don't even get the Nancy humor now that the throuple is over, I'm going to dislike their relationship even more.

Nigel bugs me a good 50% of the time, so I'm glad he's back in the shed.

Pete's "Call me Daddy" thing did not land, at all, for me.

So this episode was pretty much just a compilation of things/people I don't like, and is not one I'll ever re-watch.  I didn't love last week's, but I liked it, so I figure I will still really like the season as a whole.  Just not this episode.

 

I agree with you about Pete and Sam's mom. I'm getting flashbacks between Sam and her Dad and Lilly and her Dad on Cold Case it's too easy to blame the parent that is dead. I love Thorfinn and Flower it helps that they aren't the smartest ghosts in the house.

[iMonrey]

19 hours ago, Bastet said:

When it ended, my mom said, "They need to send Patience back to the dirt in a hurry."  I'm not digging her (no pun intended), either.  Hetty and Isaac are always funny when they're awful, but she isn't. 

I feel like the general consensus is that Patience needs to go. The first two episodes of the season have really revolved around her. A good villain is fun for a one-off, like Elias or Stephanie. But just one episode. We don't want a character like that full time. I hope the writers understand that. I'm worried they might think bringing in new characters like this keeps the show fresh, but it's to the detriment of the characters we already like when they focus so much on a newbie.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 10/24/2024 at 9:43 PM, shura said:

I’ve got to say, if someone tells me he recently became conservative and doesn’t want me living in sin, and then I wake up and see the word “sin” written in blood on the wall?  I’m blaming that guy!  Sam’s dad is different, apparently.  Not even a stare in Jay’s direction.

I don't think he really believed Jay felt that way, but was confused enough to agree to separate rooms.

Once he saw the blood, he figured the whole thing was a plot by Sam to keep them apart.

How long are Thor and Flower going to be able to keep the nature of their relationship a secret from Prudence? They are physically affectionate with each other in public. I don't think Flower would agree to lie about being married.

It's a good thing Patience never learned of the throuple (although Nancy's a loose cannon), or of Nigel and Isaac's relationship and their sexual preferences. She would consider Alberta a loose woman, and Carol a harlot.  How can she bare (not trying to be funny) to even look at Trevor's exposed legs? That's why I don't think she'll be a permanent member of the cast, but will actually be sucked off (yeah, the joke writes itself.)

On 10/25/2024 at 3:31 AM, sweetandsour said:

Maybe the apparent majority of viewers will get two birds killed with one stone if Patience and Carol (where's she been, e.g. who has she been screwing?) inexplicably become best friends and they wander off to live on a corner of the property together.

Only if Carol repents for her many sins.

On 10/25/2024 at 7:02 AM, shapeshifter said:

It seems like a setup for us to see Patience get "sucked off" when she resolves the prejudices with which she was indoctrinated against the real principles of her religion — if there were any worthwhile principles taught. 
Maybe Flower can teach her a thing or 2 about selfless love.

I agree. After all, the Puritans didn't survive as a culture, even though they were slightly less rigid than Prudence was.

On 10/25/2024 at 10:08 AM, shura said:

Now, the adult Sam wanting to do that flute performance - that was unbelievable.

Pretty sure it was a recorder - even worse!

[Ilovepie]

This wasn't my favorite episode. I thought the whole explanation for the "sin" on the wall was insane, and not in a funny way. If I was Sam's dad I would be talking to Jay about Sam's mental health. That is not just passive aggressive, that is psychotic.

And I am with everyone that has already had enough of Patience. It seemed like a total plot hole to just not lie and say they are married. I was glad when Sass said it because I was yelling at my tv to just lie to her the whole time! 

Sometimes I just wish Sam and Jay would explain things by saying the house is haunted. 

[proserpina65]

On 10/25/2024 at 12:58 PM, Lugal said:

The Pilgrims (technically called Separatists) were a different sect than the Puritans.  Close but not the same thing.

They also sucked, however.

On 10/25/2024 at 2:40 PM, Daff said:

As someone noted above, Arnold was a very successsful general. Treavor commented that Isaaac  died before he was disgraced.

I guess no one mentioned it to him after he died either.  (A later ghost, like Pete or Trevor could've learned it in school.)  I imagine Arnold wouldn't have come up nearly as much as Hamilton did, though.

[shapeshifter]

On 10/25/2024 at 10:08 AM, shura said:

Now, the adult Sam wanting to do that flute performance - that was unbelievable.

10 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Pretty sure it was a recorder - even worse!

I'm imagining Sam's Dad thinking to himself during Sam's recorder performance for him — while smiling, of course:
{{And I almost dodged this bullet}}

 

[ItCouldBeWorse]

2 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

I was glad when Sass said it because I was yelling at my tv to just lie to her the whole time! 

Yes, but if she eavesdropped on future conversations and overheard the term "girlfriend", she'd know she'd been lied to.  Which still could have happened after they lied to her and they all went back inside.

 

[Ilovepie]

20 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Yes, but if she eavesdropped on future conversations and overheard the term "girlfriend", she'd know she'd been lied to.  Which still could have happened after they lied to her and they all went back inside.

 

But they did lie to her anyway so it would have at least saved them from the "sin" wall in the bedroom. Patience has no idea how modern life works so they can keep lying to her if that keeps her under control. It's either that or they are going to have to have some kind of conversation similar to what Sam was saying to her and give her the ultimatum to either accept that modern life is different now or go back to the dirt....

[Annber03]

Speaking for myself, I have no problem with Patience thus far. She is a lot, for sure, but I think it also helps that the other ghosts acknowledge that, and I like that she's throwing the household off kilter a little bit with her creepiness and attitude on things. 

Plus, I've kept up with some spoilers about this seaosn relating to what's going on with her, so I think that helps me as well. But that's for a whole other thread. 

But yeah, given NIgel just moved back into the shed after having lived there for a good portion of time, I wonder if Patience will wind up finding her own place on the property as well, and where said place might be if she does. I keep imagining someone chilling in Jay's restaurant at some point, though if that were to happen, Patience would obviuously not tbe the most ideal choice for that :p. 

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Yes, but if she eavesdropped on future conversations and overheard the term "girlfriend", she'd know she'd been lied to

It could be very humorous for the ghosts and Sam to make up definitions for words like “girlfriend.” 😉

2 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Patience has no idea how modern life works so they can keep lying to her if that keeps her under control.

Yes. A potential comedy goldmine.

51 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I wonder if Patience will wind up finding her own place on the property

Sure.

[Skooma]

13 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I feel like the general consensus is that Patience needs to go. ...

Huh?  What consensus?  I love Patience added to the cast.  They were all way too much on the same page.  We NEED someone to stir the pot.

7 hours ago, Annber03 said:

Speaking for myself, I have no problem with Patience thus far. She is a lot, for sure, but I think it also helps that the other ghosts acknowledge that, and I like that she's throwing the household off kilter a little bit with her creepiness and attitude on things.

I concur.

[Daff]

I’m pretty sure the plastic “instrument” played by Sam was a “Flutophone”. It resembled a recorder, yes, but was passed out to entire classrooms in the ‘60s. It came with music and instruction books, and was intended to teach the rudiments of music in an engaging way. The class would learn a song and hold a recital. (The baby boom created cramped conditions in elementary schools-no space for a music classroom-the teacher was itinerant, going to the regular classrooms).

[iMonrey]

21 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

That's why I don't think she'll be a permanent member of the cast, but will actually be sucked off (yeah, the joke writes itself.)

Maybe she'll even go down on them. She and Elias would make a good pair.

21 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Pretty sure it was a recorder - even worse!

Which is pretty rudimentary for a 5th grader. I think we played those things closer to first or second grade.

21 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Sometimes I just wish Sam and Jay would explain things by saying the house is haunted. 

And they can prove it. They did it with Bela. 

[PaulE]

On 10/28/2024 at 2:40 PM, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Pretty sure it was a recorder - even worse!

Aw, don't say that!  One year, in elementary school, my entire class learned how to play the recorder (yes, that's what Sam was playing, not a flute) and the first song we learned was "Hot Cross Buns," the same as Sam (the tune consists of only three notes so even novices can't mess it up too much).  I was so proud of myself.  Of course, I was only a little kid at the time, so I agree, playing it for your dad as an adult is a bit lame.  But still, nostalgia . . .

[ItCouldBeWorse]

20 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

It could be very humorous for the ghosts and Sam to make up definitions for words like “girlfriend.” 😉

Sas already told her that "girlfriend" meant "sort of like a wife, but they're not actually married yet."  They can't keep changing the definition, can they?  On the other hand, if Patience thinks Sam's father's girlfriend/"wife" can procreate with him, she is very naive indeed.

 

Edited October 29 by ItCouldBeWorse

[ams1001]

6 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Which is pretty rudimentary for a 5th grader. I think we played those things closer to first or second grade.

I never played the recorder but I started flute in 4th grade.

[Annber03]

I definitely remember playing the recorder in elementary school. That scene with Sam gave me flashbacks :p. 

[PaulE]

16 hours ago, Daff said:

(The baby boom created cramped conditions in elementary schools-no space for a music classroom-the teacher was itinerant, going to the regular classrooms).

That was partly it, but in many school districts it was also because they didn't take music seriously.  We now know learning music helps kids learn math, motor skills, and teamwork, but back then I don't think too many educators realized that.  Also, I'm afraid a considerable number of dads thought playing music (or singing, or, God help us, dancing) would turn their sons into sissies.  So creating a dedicated music room wasn't high on the agenda, even if they did have space.  Oh, the good old days!

Edited October 30 by PaulE