S11:E02: Pig Butchering

[peeayebee]

Main topic: Pig Butchering

Also: Book burning; Comstock Act; thin baseball pants

Original air date: 2024.02.25

[Enigma X]

Does anyone with a Max subscription through Prime able to view this episode?

[peeayebee]

I can't answer that. I have a Max subscription. (I was wondering why I had to start the thread.)

I hadn't heard of pig butchering. That is so horrible, for both the ones being scammed and for the middle-men scammers who are forced to do this. I had no idea. Watching the father and then daughter start to cry made me cry.

I was glad John said not to laugh at the people getting scammed. I admit I shake my head when I hear about people getting taken in, but I do understand that if done well, you just don't see that it's happening. Several years ago I came THATCLOSE to getting scammed. I was selling an armoire online (Craigslist), and I missed the red flags. I was actually in line at the bank to wire money to the guy when a person in another line told me it was a scam. I couldn't believe I'd been so dumb.

As John said, the best solution right now is education. Warn people about it. 

As for the IVF/Comstock story, so maddening. Repubs are scrambling. "Yes to babies! ... No IVF, no babies? Uh..."

The see-thru baseball pants are ridiculous. I guess MLB was trying to save money. Will they get new pants? (I'm reminded of the punchline to a joke: "Get me my brown pants!")

[JustHereForFood]

I almost didn't watch it due to the name, I thought it would be about actual killing of animals which I can't bear.

Damn, those people are obsessed with written porn, aren't they? One might think they go to those meetings to listen to some new material, lol.

The fact that the same people who are for banning abortions claiming that they just want more kids are also against helping women get pregnant is infuriating, but not surprising. Because it's not about children, it's about controlling women, full stop. Forcing women who don't want or can't afford to have children to give birth ad also keeping other women who DO want to have children from having them. It looks like they are not consistent, but they actually are, because the goals are cruelty to women and control of women.

[kittykat]

Infuriating, both subjects.  I've been following the IVF story all week and yes it's very much damned if you do, damned if you don't.  Women who don't want kids: forced to carry to term; women who do want kids but can't naturally conceive: tough shit!  We've known for so long that it was never about the kids but about power.

The pig butchering scam ended up being more depressing.  I feel awful not only for the scammed but the people enslaved into working as scammers.  It's like, how can we abuse human rights even further...oh wait here's how!  

I know John likes to point out how this was supposed to be a comedy show but it really has evolved into so much more.  It's no surprise that the episode was light on jokes because none of these subjects are funny or could be made into something humorous.

That said I kind of want a rainbow tree.  I actually like it better as a tabletop.

[Lantern7]

Brutal episode. Pig butchering is a thing where the only winners are those going straight to hell after they die. Good for John to educate us. We need a new name for it, though. I didn't need to see the cute pigs and be reminded they're the main ingredient of pork. On the bright side, I liked the graphic for it.

The new MLB uniforms are getting roasted by everyone. It is a "And Now, This"-level issue where it's not important enough to warrant John spending 25 minutes on it.

You think the meetings people see the fearmongers coming and make them recite stuff they find objectionable? That's some cringe comedy there. I'm also wondering if the rainbow tree people ever got found and subsequently throttled for ripping people off. It's not pig butchery, but it's pretty bad. "Swine Shoving"?

[peeayebee]

1 hour ago, JustHereForFood said:

Damn, those people are obsessed with written porn, aren't they? One might think they go to those meetings to listen to some new material, lol.

I forgot about this part of the show. At first I wondered how such books were in school libraries, but I believe these were in public libraries, no? I wish people would mind their own business.

59 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

I'm also wondering if the rainbow tree people ever got found and subsequently throttled for ripping people off.

I wonder if that's the same type of ripoff that I had at Christmas. I ordered an item from a site I later learned was a scam site. The stuff comes from China, but you don't get what you ordered. It would be 1) a low-quality item, like the rainbow tree; 2) a completely different low-quality item; or 3) nothing at all. I got a completely different item: fake RayBans. There's no response from "customer support." At least the rainbow tree lady got a big laugh out of it.

[DoctorAtomic]

I'm calling a huge bs on the people reading all the dirty books. First they had to find them. Then peruse them and select a book/magazine. Then go and read it in front of everyone. One lady was reading gay porn. Ok, sister. Like you couldn't just research adult material and see if the library carries those items. 

For someone who 'never said the f word in her entire life,' it sure rolled off the tongue. 

I do feel bad for *some* of the people being scammed. I don't think minors should be sending people money online. Maybe that's a good first step. 

Also, stay away from crypto!

[ALenore]

The story about people being enslaved and forced to run scams was a plot to a Magnum PI episode a few months ago. I thought maybe they exaggerated some in order to have a more complicated story, but I guess not.

[Annber03]

4 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I'm calling a huge bs on the people reading all the dirty books. First they had to find them. Then peruse them and select a book/magazine. Then go and read it in front of everyone. One lady was reading gay porn. Ok, sister. Like you couldn't just research adult material and see if the library carries those items. 

For someone who 'never said the f word in her entire life,' it sure rolled off the tongue. 

My. Thoughts. Exactly. I love how thse passages are supposedly SO objectionable that these people have to raise a fuss about them at public meetings...but they're apparently not THAT objectionable that they can't stand there and read those passages out loud, in front of an entire crowd full of people. Just spare me and shut the hell up already, you sanctimonious whiners. One seriously wondesr how people like this manage to leave their house every day if that sort of thing is supposedly so upsetting to them. Good lord. 

As for the Alabama ruling...it continues to be absolutely maddening that we've got these old white guys continuing to control what people are and aren't allowed to do with their reproductive choices, of any sort. I hope people continue to drive home this issue all the way up to the election, and I hope the GOP's efforts on this issue backfire on them spectacularly in November. Every single politican who keeps pushing for this kind of insane restrictive legislation needs to be removed from office. Period. 

"We want more kids." Good on that reporter for pointing out the inherent contradiction in saying that while one's policies are doing the exact opposite. Also, what about those of us who DON'T want to have children? We have the right to make that choice, you narrow-minded simpleton. 

Just. It's 2024, for fuck's sakes. Why the HELL are we still having to deal with this bullshit? 

That pig butchering scam story was fascinating. And horrifying. Especilaly the part about the scammers themselves also being exploited and scammed, and how easily they get lured into this dark world. I know, obviously, that international law enforcement has a LOT of issues they're tackling right now, but yeah, if the departments who do handle things like this are able to find some way to crack down on this kind of scam, then great. In the meantime, I appreciate the awareness, especilally given how savvy this particular scam looks to be. 

I had the exact same reaction as the one lady did to that newscaster transttioning from the baseball uniforms story to the one about snakes XD. Holy shit, that could not have been more perfectly timed if it tried, LOL. That was hilarious. 

[DoctorAtomic]

It's not even vanilla porn. Like they all just randomly picked the books about butt sex and 'every kind of job you can imagine.' 

[JustHereForFood]

51 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

It's not even vanilla porn. Like they all just randomly picked the books about butt sex and 'every kind of job you can imagine.' 

Meh, I've read more explicit stuff in fanfiction. Bet they go after that next.

[arachne]

Never heard of "pig butchering" as such, but I know about a lot of stuff like it. Years ago, I almost fell for a scam for software to fix what I thought was computer damage. Had to close and then re-open my bank account. (Lucky to have a computer-savvy friend helping me out.)

This is why I have nothing to do with bitcoins or online dating apps. 

[Annber03]

11 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

Meh, I've read more explicit stuff in fanfiction. Bet they go after that next.

Lord, don't give them any ideas. 

But that brings up another point - it's cute (and by "cute", I mean "utterly baffling") that people, to this day, STILL seem to think that magically removing books from schools and libraries will somehow protect their children from whatever it is they think they need to be protected from. I guess the internet or kids having friends with more liberal parents aren't a thing in their world? 

Their freaking out about this will also further ensure that their children will never open up to them or want to talk to them about anything, no matter how innocent or risque it might be. Like, I'm sorry, people in that video, that you're apparently completely incapable of having a mature, honest conversation about sex with your kids, but that's frankly your problem to deal with, not mine or anyone else's. 

[JustHereForFood]

3 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

Lord, don't give them any ideas. 

But that brings up another point - it's cute (and by "cute", I mean "utterly baffling") that people, to this day, STILL seem to think that magically removing books from schools and libraries will somehow protect their children from whatever it is they think they need to be protected from. I guess the internet or kids having friends with more liberal parents aren't a thing in their world? 

Their freaking out about this will also further ensure that their children will never open up to them or want to talk to them about anything, no matter how innocent or risque it might be. Like, I'm sorry, people in that video, that you're apparently completely incapable of having a mature, honest conversation about sex with your kids, but that's frankly your problem to deal with, not mine or anyone else's. 

Exactly, plus don't we all know that making something banned just makes people more interested in it? There is that whole saying about forbidden fruit. I think I have already seen some people posting that their bookshops have displays of "banned books", or even some Banned books week event or something.

[peeayebee]

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

Also, what about those of us who DON'T want to have children?

What? Don't you know that sex is only for procreation?

[DoctorAtomic]

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

Like, I'm sorry, people in that video, that you're apparently completely incapable of having a mature, honest conversation about sex with your kids, but that's frankly your problem to deal with, not mine or anyone else's. 

That's not entirely true. The one person talked about how the dad sat them down to discuss the eating of the butthole. 

This reminds me of the satanic panic back in the 80s. It's not about the actual books now or the music then. 

[iMonrey]

On 2/26/2024 at 10:36 AM, peeayebee said:

I was glad John said not to laugh at the people getting scammed. I admit I shake my head when I hear about people getting taken in, but I do understand that if done well, you just don't see that it's happening.

This is true enough. And yet, when John says "these people lost $350,000" my immediate reaction is "you have $350,000 dollars???!!" I mean, it makes it kind of hard for me to sympathize, you know? I don't have anywhere near that amount of cash to invest, and even if I were 100% confident about a specific investment I would only put in a tiny fraction of that amount to test the waters.

23 hours ago, kittykat said:

  I've been following the IVF story all week and yes it's very much damned if you do, damned if you don't.  Women who don't want kids: forced to carry to term; women who do want kids but can't naturally conceive: tough shit!  We've known for so long that it was never about the kids but about power.

I was a bit disappointed John didn't make much out of the actual ruling, which when read aloud sounds like a church sermon, full of references to God. John doesn't typically shy away from the topic of religion in politics.

[heatherchandler]

On 2/26/2024 at 11:03 AM, JustHereForFood said:

I almost didn't watch it due to the name, I thought it would be about actual killing of animals which I can't bear.

 

I kind of wish he would do a segment on it, if he hasn’t already.. it’s worth it’s own segment, it’s horrifying.

 

I think a lot of people put their whole savings into these scams, or even borrow money to invest.  I was surprised someone put over 2 million into it.  I guess if you think it’s a legitimate app, you feel comfortable putting it all in.

[Hanahope]

how is an app that has as its primary use committing crimes allowed to be platformed?

[peeayebee]

I'm sure the people getting scammed didn't put the whole amount, like $350,000, in at once. Maybe they started with $1,000. Then they see on the legitimate-looking app that they made a great profit. So they put in a little more. More success. And so on until they've invested hundreds of thousands. 

[Hanahope]

i  guess these scams must continue over quite some time, like several years, or those victims (as opposed to the victims forced to be scammers) already have access to a lot of money.  i mean, even if someone is earning $150,000 a year (pre-tax), its going to take some time to have enough disposable money to invest $350,000.

This obviously doesn't count for the bank ceo that embezzled from his bank.  

I can't imagine anyone who doesn't already know that anything crypto is a scam.  i've never heard anything legitimate about it.  

why are the baseball pants so thin?  MLB trying to save money?  or is there some aerodynamic reason for running/base stealing?

[peeayebee]

My sister has invested in crypto. She got into it several years ago from a financial newsletter she used to subscribe to. I've said negative things about it to her a couple of times, like it's a pyramid scheme, but she's convinced it's a good investment and that the U.S. is going to get rid of the dollar. She HAS made money, but she hasn't withdrawn any of it yet. She's also had a bunch of coins stolen/hacked from her several years ago. That was a few thousand. I wish she'd cash out. 

As far as the pig butchering goes, my understanding is that scammers study social media to find good victims, i.e., those that would likely have money.

[IvySpice]

6 hours ago, iMonrey said:

And yet, when John says "these people lost $350,000" my immediate reaction is "you have $350,000 dollars???!!"

And the father and daughter were interviewed in front of a pretty nice motor home. I wonder if that's where they have to live now.

[wknt3]

2 hours ago, Hanahope said:

i  guess these scams must continue over quite some time, like several years, or those victims (as opposed to the victims forced to be scammers) already have access to a lot of money.  i mean, even if someone is earning $150,000 a year (pre-tax), its going to take some time to have enough disposable money to invest $350,000.

There are victims who earn more than $150K per year. There are also victims with inherited money, and people who use non disposable money to invest - after all why not cash out your 401K and get in on the ground floor of this great investment which is up 23% for the year? Or take the money from your home equity line of credit since the returns are so much higher than the APR. I haven't necessarily seen this particular variation, but in my work I have seen plenty of scams and various bad investments including "legitimate" crypto and there are more people out there than you think who can find $250-500K.
 

1 hour ago, peeayebee said:

As far as the pig butchering goes, my understanding is that scammers study social media to find good victims, i.e., those that would likely have money.

Social media is one place scammers find victims. They also buy or hack the same contact lists used by luxury marketers and financial advisors. And sometimes it's like telemarketing where you simply keep "dialing" until you get a live one. There are a lot of business models fraudsters use.

[marina to]

Finally got around to watching and I had said everything John said about Uber just this afternoon! 

Really glad he talked about the whole fetal personhood bullshit and the Comstock Act. I've known about this for a long time as I read Jessica Valenti's Abortion Every Day (highly recommend) but most people have no idea.

I run a Blue Jays fansite and had heard nothing about these pants. Granted, I don't read everything. Wonder why they made the switch?

The main story is horrifying. Wish I had anything more constructive to say, but nope.

ETA: Update on the pants from CNN:

Quote

In a press release, Nike said that it worked with more than 300 players to design a jersey that was more breathable, lightweight and stretchy.

Players also wore them during last season’s All-Star Game, and Nike and MLB said they were well received at the time.

“They’re designed to be performance wear as opposed to what’s been traditionally worn, so they are going to be different,” MLB Commissioner Rob Manfred said about the uniforms.

“I think after people wear them a little bit, they’re going to be really popular.”

 

Edited March 2 by marina to