S10.E12: Homeschooling

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Main topic: Homeschooling

Also: Kevin McCarthy's ouster as Speaker of the House; Franklin, TN, mayoral candidate Gabrielle Hanson; People on TV share completely unhinged conspiracy theories about Taylor Swift; the surprising importance of emojis on 'Divorce Court'  

Original air date 2023.10.08

[Annber03]

Gosh, is that Hanson woman involved with the people who wanted their kids to be taught Nazism? 

If nothing else, this episode highlighted that for all the, "THINK OF THE CHILDREN! WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN?!" hand wringing I hear so many adults going on about in this country, we legitimately do not give a single, solitary shit about children or their rights or safety. We've seen that in a horrifying large-scale way with the lack of any sort of serious action regarding school shootings, and now we've got people pulling kids out of school because OMG THEY MIGHT LEARN ABOUT SEX* OR LGBTQ+ PEOPLE THE HORROR or because there isn't any "Nazi curriculum" available or because parents want to abuse their kids without any higher ups poking around and getting into their business, and that's all apparently just fine and dandy with way too many people. 

But sure. They totally care about "the children". Mmhm. Nothing to do with some warped desire to be totally controlling and authoritarian and able to push a bunch of bigoted, outdated worldviews without pushback, nope. 

*Seriously, I would love to know what the hell kinds of schools these people's kids had been going to where they're supposedly learning all this super frank stuff about sex, 'cause the general consensus I've always heard regarding sex education here in the States is that it sucks and is absolutely laughable in terms of being specific about anything. And that's just for straight people. If there are schools teaching sex ed that covers other sexual orientations, they must be few and far between. 

That Hanson woman running for mayor sounds like an absolute nightmare and I would love to hope she gets absolutely trounced in the election, but knowing how the world works, and considering the fact we can't seem to get out of this vice-like grip that the MAGA cult continues to have on this country, well... As much as I'm enjoying seeing the GOP implode in on itself because of their insane antics, I wish it could happen without the rest of us being affected by the fallout. 

But yeah, just to recap, LGBTQ+ and drag queens? Bad for kids, in Hanson's eyes. Having white supremacists as her security detail? Yeah, that's totally fine. That won't confuse or upset children at all, I guess. Holy lord, how is our country in this state, I don't understand? 

Thank goodness for that reporter, though. I hope he continues to hold Hanson's feet, as well as other politicians' feet, to the fire like this. 

In non-disturbing topics...I have never once given a shit about who Taylor Swift is dating, and I still don't care. Watching grown adults analyzing this stuff as they are is...truly something. 

[Lantern7]

Did we really need to see prancing sheep during the end credits? I don't want to think about what their eyeballs look like.

Another depressing subject. Then again, John doesn't cover the fun stuff. I never consciously connected homeschooling with child abuse . . . well, not mental abuse. Or weird-ass curriculums. The one with all the chores seems ideal compared to that designed to raise Nazis. And it's mostly done with a lobby that picks and chooses their battles to defend their agenda. Gosh, that sounds unique.

Gabrielle Hanson seems like a unique lady. Let's hope it stays that way, and that the people in her area are smart enough not to vote her into office.

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

In non-disturbing topics...I have never once given a shit about who Taylor Swift is dating, and I still don't care. Watching grown adults analyzing this stuff as they are is...truly something. 

Eh, newscasts will always have extra time for gossip and minutia. It helps that Trevor Kelce has replaced Rob Gronkowski as America's Tight End (lovable and talented), and that he was famous before he was connected to Taylor.

[Spartan Girl]

My feelings about Hanson can be best summed up by a Randy Rainbow song parody: “girl, you’re a Kaaaaaaarrreeen!”

”Having children does not make you inherently virtuous.” THANK YOU, JOHN. That’s exactly what I want to scream at every single one of those “parental rights” idiots. Rights to do what exactly: control every single aspect of their lives instead of letting them grow up and form their own opinions?! That clip of how homeschool helped that bullied girl was nice, but it’s just too bad the homeschool association cares more about enabling and catering racists and abusers than actually helping children.

[JustHereForFood]

It's telling that some people scream about parental rights, instead of children rights.

Regarding that candidate, holy shit, she sounds like a lot even by her party's standards. And isn't it illegal to lie about an endorsement like she did with that photo?

As for homeschooling, count me as one of the people who immediately connects it with fundamentalist parents not wanting their children to learn that the Earth isn't flat or that evolution exists. I didn't consider the other aspects like having special needs or disabilities that the school doesn't account for. But still, even if there are some positives, it absolutely should be much better regulated. It's unacceptable that parents can skip any official curriculum and teach their children whatever they want to, apparently with no actual qualification needed. I was wondering why this is legal and as soon as John said the word lobbying, I sighed why didn't I see that one coming?

Seriously, why are so many people against regulation? I get that there are some people who will abuse it to go on a power trip over innocent people, but in general, I think that if you have nothing to hide, you probably shouldn't be afraid of others checking the situation. Also, it seems to me that some of the people who start screaming about government interfering with their rights are perfectly ok with interfering in the rights of others in other aspects (Somehow, by some logic I don't understand, checking if a child is abused is interference, but forbidding abortion to someone who might be pregnant as a result of abuse is not. Not wanting your child to learn basic minimum about sex at appropriate age is fine, but other parents letting their kids see drag is not. Because reasons.)

Also, this will probably not be popular, but that woman who was for homeschooling because to her the curriculum was too whitewashed looked like the same type of fanatic to me as parents who don't want their children to learn about slavery or LGBT+ people. She still supports the flawed system that is against people like her, just from the other end. I get that she's probably right about the curriculum, but the correct way IMO would be to try to change it for all schools, not to create one for her own children. Plus, you know, parents can still let their children go to school AND teach them the other stuff they want them to know in their free time.

Apart from the potential abuse and insufficient education, there is probably also the problem with lack of socialization. If parents want to control what their children learn, they probably want to control who they meet with and might only let them socialize with children in their own bubble which can't be good for them. They deserve to meet people and make friends outside of their parents' supervision.

[smittykins]

24 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

As for homeschooling, count me as one of the people who immediately connects it with fundamentalist parents not wanting their children to learn that the Earth isn't flat or that evolution exists. 

Also, “Owning human beings is wrong.”  I know at least one of the three Christian homeschooling curricula John mentioned in the broadcast basically said “Slavery really wasn’t that bad;  not all masters were cruel, and many slaves were brought to Jesus!”

[kittykat]

Yeah this another depressing one.  The sad thing is most of these people pull their kids out of school because they *shudder* just might be indoctrinated with that damn liberal socialist agenda with a side of CRT only to force their own ideas with a Christian slant.  

I've always wondered about the abuse angle with homeschooled kids so I was not happy to learn my suspicions were correct.  And of course there's some crackpot coalition who are coming out against laws that actually PROTECT CHILDREN all while wringing their hands Helen Lovejoy style.

I'd be happier about the Kevin McCarthy ouster if it weren't for the fact that someone worse is likely getting the job.  Gabrielle Hanson is just another example of that party's direction and what they will continue to tolerate.  How is she not ousted from any campaigning after being caught in all her lies is beyond me.  That said that Tennessee journalist is a freaking hero.

[peeayebee]

10 hours ago, Annber03 said:

Gosh, is that Hanson woman involved with the people who wanted their kids to be taught Nazism? 

I could have sworn that John did a little story about Hanson already. Maybe I had posted about her here. Can't remember. 

Here is a story about her having been arrested for promoting prostitution.

I thought there was something about her crazy spokeswoman, too, but I can't find anything about that. Maybe I'm thinking of a different woman candidate.

Quote

If nothing else, this episode highlighted that for all the, "THINK OF THE CHILDREN! WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN?!" hand wringing I hear so many adults going on about in this country, we legitimately do not give a single, solitary shit about children or their rights or safety. We've seen that in a horrifying large-scale way with the lack of any sort of serious action regarding school shootings

Right. "Think of the children except when my rights are threatened."

Quote

In non-disturbing topics...I have never once given a shit about who Taylor Swift is dating, and I still don't care. Watching grown adults analyzing this stuff as they are is...truly something. 

I'm not invested in who Taylor Swift is dating, but I did roll my eyes when she was apparently dating Tom Hiddleston, esp when he acted all over-the-top head-over-heels crazy about her. Definitely some kind of publicity thing. So... I don't think it's completely unreasonable to think there might be some kind of professional angle to Swift and Kelce's relationship.

1 hour ago, JustHereForFood said:

It's telling that some people scream about parental rights, instead of children rights.

Children's rights up to the moment of birth.

Quote

Seriously, why are so many people against regulation?

Fear of a slippery slope?

Quote

Also, this will probably not be popular, but that woman who was for homeschooling because to her the curriculum was too whitewashed looked like the same type of fanatic to me as parents who don't want their children to learn about slavery or LGBT+ people. She still supports the flawed system that is against people like her, just from the other end. I get that she's probably right about the curriculum, but the correct way IMO would be to try to change it for all schools, not to create one for her own children. Plus, you know, parents can still let their children go to school AND teach them the other stuff they want them to know in their free time.

I'm sure it's hard to fight for change when your entire state (like Florida) mandates that African-American studies can't be taught. I don't know where this particular woman lived. And even if you can fight this in local districts, it takes time, and what happens with your child while this process goes on? 

But it is strange, as she acknowledges, that she has to depend on this lobbying group for support while disagreeing with much of what they stand and work for. Teaching your child in your free time is an option, but if a parent is home anyway, then I can see them wanting to take on the entire education at home.

Patrick McHenry as "Patton Oswalt’s ventriloquist dummy" was perfect.

 

[JustHereForFood]

26 minutes ago, kittykat said:

I've always wondered about the abuse angle with homeschooled kids so I was not happy to learn my suspicions were correct.  And of course there's some crackpot coalition who are coming out against laws that actually PROTECT CHILDREN all while wringing their hands Helen Lovejoy style.

I also have a suspicion that the people who insist their children need to be homeschooled are also against regular doctor check-ups because they might force their children into vaccinating against life-threatening diseases or something, so that's another abuse prevention gone.

[andromeda331]

This was so depressing but not surprising. God forbid we have regulations to make sure kids are being educated or at very least aren't being neglected and abused. Oh no can't have that. Then again we also can't have any actual gun regulations despite all of the school shootings. Good comparison to NRA it's the same thing. I've been worried about homeschooling since they started loosening the regulations. Yeah, a lot of people have good reasons to home school their kids. I felt for the girl being bullied and how much better homeschooling was for her. One of my co-workers had to pull his son for health reasons. But there's also parents' who have bad reasons for it. To neglect and abuse their kids. It shouldn't be hard to regulate for them. 

[DoctorAtomic]

Wow is John right about the airports, and wow is that Hanson lady a piece of work. 

I couldn't identify a Taylor Swift song if you bonked me over the head with it, and even I feel bad for this lady. Incidentally, the % of NFL female fans is almost half, so that guy was full of it. 

The thing that gets me is that your stock (very) right-wing talking points (not run of the mill 'small government' 'fiscal responsibility' conservatives) have been the same since the 80s, and none of what they're clutching their pearls about ever were true. You'd think someone would point that out.

I'm also surprised a state hasn't sued that homeschooling is unconstitutional. 

"Fancy name change" for Vader is a deep cut. 

[Annber03]

11 minutes ago, DoctorAtomic said:

Incidentally, the % of NFL female fans is almost half, so that guy was full of it. 

Yeah, that struck me, too. I was like, "...really? Boy, that's news to my mom and sister, both of whom are big football fans and have been for years." 

[DoctorAtomic]

I get that banter and cross talk are part of those morning shows, but don't just fabricate either. 

Neither Swift or the NFL are hurting financially. 

[peeayebee]

1 hour ago, DoctorAtomic said:

Incidentally, the % of NFL female fans is almost half, so that guy was full of it. 

That surprises me. Certainly there are a lot of female fans, but I wouldn't think the percentage is more than, say, 40%. Is that almost half?

Quote

I'm also surprised a state hasn't sued that homeschooling is unconstitutional.

How so?

 

[andromeda331]

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

Yeah, that struck me, too. I was like, "...really? Boy, that's news to my mom and sister, both of whom are big football fans and have been for years." 

So was my mom. My dad was a fan but my mother the biggest fan I knew. She had her favorite team. She watched every game, knew all the stats and everything. 

[purist]

21 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Did we really need to see prancing sheep during the end credits? I don't want to think about what their eyeballs look like.

I was enjoying the footage of gambolling lambs and thinking how nice it was that the LWT team had given us something pleasant to look at after the heavy story about homeschooling.

And then ... the close-up on a sheep's eye reminded me of the part of the story I had already expunged from my memory. 😟

Edited October 10, 2023 by purist

[One Imaginary Girl]

I never noticed it before, at least not as much as on Sunday's show, but there was too much shoehorning of current slang for my liking. I had to look up "snatched" and "zaddy," and "No notes" is a meaningless Twitter cliche. It was all so try-hard.

[Hanahope]

I can't get over that guy saying third graders were being taught about anal sex.  Really?  in what school?  i cannot imagine any school teaching that at all, and certainly not before 5th grade or so when some schools start to teach reproduction (because girls start getting their period around that time).  and i can't imagine any school teaching such details.  

And I guess for some people, its no longer bad to be considered a Nazi.  Just incredible.  who is proud about wiping out/enslaving all races except for white, blond haired and blue eyed ones?  

 

[peeayebee]

1 hour ago, Hanahope said:

I can't get over that guy saying third graders were being taught about anal sex.  Really?  in what school?  i cannot imagine any school teaching that at all, and certainly not before 5th grade or so when some schools start to teach reproduction (because girls start getting their period around that time).  and i can't imagine any school teaching such details.  

The same schools where the students are pooping in litter boxes.

[Shrek]

20 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

 

The thing that gets me is that your stock (very) right-wing talking points (not run of the mill 'small government' 'fiscal responsibility' conservatives) have been the same since the 80s, and none of what they're clutching their pearls about ever were true. You'd think someone would point that out.

 

People do point it out thousands of times a day but those type of people don't want to actually look into anything, they just want to rant about what they are told to on face book, fox news, twitter, truth social etc. and have always lived their lives that way.

[smittykins]

On 10/9/2023 at 11:39 AM, JustHereForFood said:

I also have a suspicion that the people who insist their children need to be homeschooled are also against regular doctor check-ups because they might force their children into vaccinating against life-threatening diseases or something, so that's another abuse prevention gone.

Several years ago, after NYS ended its religious exemption on vaccination, I got an ad on FB: “Concerned about NY’s new vaccination policy?  Homeschool!

ETA:  I have a thought regarding the woman whose afternoon “school” schedule consisted of chores:  most conservative Christians believe that a woman’s primary purpose is to be a wife and mother, so I wonder if this was considered “practice” for the role; maybe her parents thought “Why do you need a college degree anyway?”  I’m reminded of the woman in the “Shiny Happy People” documentary whose father told her that she didn’t need to go beyond fractions in math because “you’ll need them for baking.”

Edited October 11, 2023 by smittykins

[peeayebee]

On 10/9/2023 at 9:16 AM, peeayebee said:

I thought there was something about her crazy spokeswoman, too, but I can't find anything about that. Maybe I'm thinking of a different woman candidate.

Just quoting myself here as I discovered it wasn't Gabrielle Hanson's spokesperson I was trying to remember, but her campaign manager/aide. Her name is Erin Mazzoni.

First off, here's a video (embedded in an article) of the intrepid reporter, Phil Williams, talking with Hanson and Mazzoni about that photo of the women at lunch. It's whack-a-doo. 

And here's a video of Mazzoni also being whack-a-doo.

https://youtu.be/RzLgxtzQE-Q?si=LqYqiAQMKE1PYuvD

 

[marina to]

On 10/9/2023 at 9:10 AM, JustHereForFood said:

Also, this will probably not be popular, but that woman who was for homeschooling because to her the curriculum was too whitewashed looked like the same type of fanatic to me as parents who don't want their children to learn about slavery or LGBT+ people. She still supports the flawed system that is against people like her, just from the other end. I get that she's probably right about the curriculum, but the correct way IMO would be to try to change it for all schools, not to create one for her own children. Plus, you know, parents can still let their children go to school AND teach them the other stuff they want them to know in their free time.

What free time? If she is responsible for dinner, laundry and getting children to bed, or even driving kids around to extra curricular activities, there may not be the time to counteract the messages they are getting that their history is not worth mentioning and that they are less than the white kids. She mentioned how it was making the environment uncomfortable for the child and you are branding her a fanatic for wanting to shield her child from in-your-face racism?

[JustHereForFood]

12 hours ago, marina to said:

What free time? If she is responsible for dinner, laundry and getting children to bed, or even driving kids around to extra curricular activities, there may not be the time to counteract the messages they are getting that their history is not worth mentioning and that they are less than the white kids. She mentioned how it was making the environment uncomfortable for the child and you are branding her a fanatic for wanting to shield her child from in-your-face racism?

Wow, chill, I'm not branding anyone as anything. I just say that she is using the same logic as those on the other side, that the school is not going to teach her children what she wants so she has to do it herself. I think that it would be more productive if she tried to get changes to the curriculum so that all children at their school would benefit from it, teaching only her own kids something doesn't help change the system. I am not sure how the argument about free time works if the alternative is that she takes over all of the child's education - surely she needs more time for that too? Neither option looks good from that perspective.

 

Back to the main topic - I have actually been thinking about this episode a few days ago and one thing occurred to me. John said that in some states parents can take their children from school with no reason given and no further checks from the school, right? Wouldn't it be logical (if the goal was really protecting the child's rights and not parents') if there was some sort of evaluation with a psychologist or social worker or someone like that where they would ask the child why do they want to be homeschooled and see if that is something they are really ok with? Like, it would be one thing if the child says "I have been bullied at school and I feel safer at home" or "I have a medical need and I feel better if mom takes care of me." and another if they say "I really miss my friends, but mom says the school is indoctrinating us." which could be something that requires a closer look. Not to mention, checking if they are learning all they should instead of, as they showed, doing chores.

Also, not having access to school also means not having access to a library, in some cases the only library they can visit and I believe there are currently a lot of important points being said about the importance of school libraries, with all of the book bans going on.

[swanpride]

I am kind of stunned - I mean, I knew that home schooling was allowed, but I wasn't aware that there weren't any tests or any oversight at all. 

And yes, so much for "think of the children". It stuns me that the so called "land of the free" treats children like the property of their parents. One of the reasons home schooling isn't allowed in my country (only if you go to a judge, proof that there are good reasons for it and that you are able to provide the necessary education), is that in our minds, children have right to socialise with other children from different backgrounds. They need the interaction to develop properly. And if you dislike how state school do it, there are options, but all those options involve said children being out if the family bubble.