S07.E10: The Fixed Point

[scarynikki12]

Quote

The Legends are tired of being chased by an evil A.I. and her robo-soliders, so Sara decides to create an aberration that will allow the team to take back the Evil Waverider.

 

 

[scarynikki12]

Ah, the plan to save ole Franz is a plan to defeat evil Gideon and her bots.

Glad Nate's poor artistry continues. Made for a funny scene. And the car did look like a hippo so good call Gary.

I wonder if one of the reasons they went with the stuck in history angle for this season was because of how great everyone looks in the clothes.

Mysterious Old Man has a magic mirror that reminds me of when Iris went into the Mirrorverse. Clever calling his bar The Fixed Point. I'd love to see a skinny guy wearing a brown suit and Cons hanging out in the background.

They may not be dating but Astra and Behrad are cute when they flirt.

Hee, Zari and Spoons are so awkward as they start their one on one hang. So cute as they try to find a common interest.

Ok, Random Time Traveler Dude, stop laughing. The Legends brought Beebo into our lives and you will show them some respect!

Ok, Sara, you got a ladder to the face but the team can learn from your experience.

Ok, we need to teach Gwyn a few things and stat.

HA! Zari and Spoons are bonding over hating other people and how awesome they each are. Love it.

It makes me sad to see uncertain Sara but at least she's expressing herself with the team rather than Ava.

Ok the Sara and Nate stuff reminds me how she offered to be his new bro when Ray left. Glad they're revisiting that offer because dropping it immediately made no sense.

Team failing over and over montage! That was funny and making the patrons love Sara.

Spoons is ace! Neat.

I wonder if Mysterious Top Hat Guy is also Mysterious Old Man? He benefits from the fixed point not being changed.

I'll give Ava credit for not pretending she wrote Lin's speech. 

Ok, the Random Time Traveler Dudes are now Team Legends and showing the proper respect. Finally.

"Take a chance on Sara Lance!" I may be chanting along.

Original Face THAWNE is Mysterious Top Hat? Nice twist! And he has no speed? Even better!

I absolutely loved Sara's chat with Thawne and him being on board with the plan for 40 min. Guess we know what next week's episode will focus on! Get into position Team!

[Lady Calypso]

This skyrocketed into being one of my favourite episodes of Legends ever, for one simple reason (but also a bunch of other reasons): SPOONER'S ACE. They actually had Zari utter the word ACE. We have official asexual representation! 

For people who don't know, asexual representation is pretty rare. There's only a handful of canonical asexual characters on any TV show, movie, or other form of media. I can only think of a couple of asexual characters that actually say they're ace, and even fewer who are done well. So this is an EXTREMELY poignant moment. I can't accurately describe how important that scene is. 

Plus, the episode was actually really great, especially after a somewhat weaker episode. Gwyn/Ava pairing up was great, because Gwyn got to talk about his dilemma with his sexuality vs his faith. It was a really nice moment and really gave development to Gwyn's character. We heard a little bit about it before, but not in this capacity and I did love Ava really supporting him and wanting to find a way to have him happy. I wonder if they can do it. 

Sara got to lead and kick ass! Nate got a substantial role with being her number 2! And Thawne returns! And actually gets development! This Thawne is great because he's not overused and his development makes total sense. This is what I love about Legends. And they have approximately an entire episode, minus commercials, to get things back on track. Or else Sara gets to be part of the Fixed Point.

Speaking of the bar, it's actually a phenomenal idea to have this going on. The owner, who I assume is a version of Father Time, was a great guest star, and I didn't even hate the time traveling kids making fun of the Legends, mostly because it was clear they were doing it because they were scared to try themselves.

Overall, 10/10 episode. Top episode of the season, which is hard to say since most of this season has been top notch.

[Lantern7]

I fucked up and turned the cable box off, so I missed the first ten minutes. It bites that there's no "Start Over" function for the CW, as least on my cable box.

Poor Sara. I mean, she did get what she wanted, but it was tough to see her get dragged over and over. It's not that she's perfect. It's just that she's supposed to be the one Legend that can screw up the least . . . so her failing was demoralizing. But she managed to complete her mission with the help of . . . Eobard Thrawne. This is the Reverse Flash that doesn't look like Harrison Wells.

Is "random" the right word to describe his return? We haven't seen that iteration of the character in almost five years, and now he's guarding the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand. It's a nice concept, and it opens up the possibility that "fixed moments" have similar guardians. Hell, entire lifetimes might be protected. I mean, what time traveler wouldn't want to take a run at Hitler*? But Thrawne's return was . . . ."What?!" In the best possible way.

I figured there was a small chance Spooner would be revealed as Astrasexual. ACE also works. I've only seen one other character on a TV show that wasn't into sex and attraction in that way. Has that become more commonplace? It does give a nice balance to the Legends, in that all sorts of woo have been getting thrown around . . . including Gideon & Gary. That's still a bit unsettling for me.

*Aside from Gwyn, of course. I don't think any of the Legends has the heart to educate him about Hitler. Finding out that was a second World War distressed the guy enough.

[lurker22]

This was another great episode, especially for Sara. I didn't think I would get to see the Sara I know again after Robo!Sara, but I was wrong. This is the Captain Lance we deserve. Capable, driven, and would do anything for her team/family. And occasionally needs her team to pull her out of her self-doubt. Nate is no doubt her right-hand man here. I miss these two together. Nate is doing for Sara what Jax used to do. And they really work well together. It was sweet to see the whole team rallying behind Sara to give her the confidence boost she needed, and that helped her get the job done. And she did it the Legends way, by failing and learning from them. And she earned the respect of the whole bar in the process. I definitely wouldn't mind if we just keep this group in the bar as the Legends team.

Did this episode double Sara's death count, lol? Nice that it was Sara who meets Thawne, since she (and Nate) are the only ones who know him and have a history with him. Why do I have the feeling that someone from the Legends team will be leaving the team and replacing him at the fixed point?

Love how gleeful Gideon was when she found out it was a man who was killing people, not time itself. 

I was wondering where the fight scene that Caity posted last week went to. Turns out she posted a week early. The aerial cartwheels/handless flips she did in the episode and during rehearsals are just as amazing.

Maisie did a good job directing the episode.

Edited January 27, 2022 by lurker22

[scarynikki12]

1 hour ago, lurker22 said:

Why do I have the feeling that someone from the Legends team will be leaving the team and replacing him at the fixed point?

There’s no way Thawne actually wants to be a Fixed Point guardian forever so I expect him to try and sabotage the team so that Sara will be forced to take over. My money is on Gideon being the one who actually does since she can stick around as a voice. Or maybe it’ll be evil Gideon. 

[lurker22]

Maybe the reason Thawne is helping the Legends is so he can sneak away on or steal the waverider and go somewhere the Time Writhes can't find him. Maybe one of the robots will replace him. 

[kirinan]

2 hours ago, lurker22 said:

Maybe one of the robots will replace him. 

My bet would be on Robot Sara. She was the one having doubts about the way things were progressing in their episode, and she's got all of Sara's talents and powers—and, I would also bet, she still has our Sara's sense of right and honor. I could see her volunteering to stay, and Thawne could be none the wiser that it's not the real Sara. 

[tennisgurl]

The Fixed Point bar, where all the time travelers who try to stop WWI meet, was honestly one of the cleverest ideas that the show has had in awhile. I bet there's a dinner somewhere in Austria where all the people trying to kill baby Hitler can get burgers before they try and fail to kill baby Hitler. That is just such a fun idea, I really want to know more about the old guy who runs the bar. The Arrowverse version of Father Time? I thought he was the man in the top hat, but his actual identity was way better. This was a great episode, one of the best they have done in awhile, and its been a really solid run of episodes. It really felt like Legends in its glory days, wacky concepts, character development, but also with some real serious things happening. 

Spooner being ACE is awesome, there is so little ACE representation in media and so many people are confused by what it actually is, its so awesome to see it on television like this. Also nice to see Zari and Spooner hanging out, while acknowledging that they rarely do so and that they have little in common on the surface.

I LOVED seeing Sara getting so much time to shine, and that she and Nate got so much time together, they really work so well together. He really works so well as her number two, they have the most experience on the team and have known each other for a really long time now, this feels so right. This is the Captain Lance we all know and love, badass, a natural leader, will do anything to protect her team/family, I wanted to join the bar in chanting her name. 

Nate has many strengths, but drawing is very much not one of them. "How does the hippopotamus fit into this?" I like that they leaned into his historian side this week, and I loved how supportive he was of Sara. 

Gwyn and Ava had a really nice subplot, they had hinted before that Gwyn had trouble reconciling his faith and his sexuality, but I was pleasantly surprised that they really went there with it. It really helped to develop Gwyn and it let Ava show some real empathy, even if she had to steal a bit from LMM to really get her point across. I really liked him explaining his dilemma, and this is one of the good things about finally having a main character from the actual past in the cast, they would actually have a very different perspective then our modern heroes which can be really interesting. Maybe Gwyn could talk to Spooner or one of the Tarazi's, who are also religious? 

I so did not see Thawne coming at all, its been quite awhile since we saw this version of him. 

[AD35]

During the scene where Sara was trying to prevent the assassination of Franz Ferdinand (and failing repeatedly) am I the only one who managed to hear Dead Or Alive's You Spin Me Round (Like A Record) sung in German (or whatever langauage it was)? The voice was definitely going for a Pete Burns sound.

Edited January 27, 2022 by AD35

[scarynikki12]

1 hour ago, AD35 said:

During the scene where Sara was trying to prevent the assassination of Franz Ferdinand (and failing repeatedly) am I the only one who managed to hear Dead Or Alive's You Spin Me Round (Like A Record) sung in German (or whatever langauage it was)? The voice was definitely going for a Pete Burns sound.

Oh totally.

[thuganomics85]

When the mysterious guy played by Timothy Webber first showed up, I thought the show was going to do their own version of the TVA from Loki for a second, but I should have known Legends wasn't going to be that obvious (plus the Time Bureau basically already did all that.)  Instead, we visit a "Fixed Point bar."  A place where time travels go to drink, make merry, and take turns at trying to change a "fixed point" in the timeline that is suppose to be set no matter what.  Definitely a fun idea and I wonder whatever infamous fixed points there are where time travelers do this.  Obvious, I imagine there is one that tries to stop Hitler's rise to power/World War II, but I wonder if they also have during events like preventing Pearl Harbor or (more recent) 9-11.  The possibilities are endless!

Zari and Spooner was a fun pair for all of the episode, but it leading to the reveal that Spooner is ACE was unexpected.  I'm sure there where some in other places in the next who rolled their eyes and grumbled about social commentary, woke, PC, etc., but considering how I can't even think of any ACE characters out there right now, it is nice seeing a show have one that isn't just a random guest character, but one of their regulars (even if she was a newer addition.)  All things considering, I thought they handled it pretty well and both Lisseth Chavez and Tala Ashe were great in that scene.

I also liked them diving more into the fact that Gwyn is gay, but is still religious and part of a faith that considers it to be wrong, so that conflict will always be there for him.  I imagine there are other people like that out there and is probably something that can weigh heavily.  It was nice seeing Ava be there for him and talk him through it: by far the best use of her this season for me.  But I hope they don't drop this identity automatically, because it something that interests me.

Can't argue with Sara being front and center in the mission again (glad that's starting to happen more often now), and reminding everyone why she is the captain: not just because she's a badass, but because she has to shoulder the Ls as well.  And then Nate coming through as a good support system.  Again, I really think he's the better choice to be her second in-command now.  As long as it doesn't involve drawling...

Glad they got Maisie Richardson-Sellers back behind the camera.

Gideon with drinks might be the best Gideon yet!

Behrad and Astra are getting more flirty with each other, I see.

Finally, Eobard Thawne!  No, not that Thawne, the other one!  It is so weird that while I grow tired of the version on The Flash, this one just had me loving every minute of it.  It's not like I think Tom Cavanagh is bad in the role; far from it; but there is just something about Matt Letscher's portrayal that I really enjoy and wish we got more of it.  Can't wait to see where this goes next! 

[blackwing]

I enjoyed this episode, because to me it felt like classic Legends... the Legends are trying to prevent/alter some event in history.  None of that campy sci-fi B-movie aliens crap from last season.  I loved the sequence of Sarah's attempts at stopping the assassination.  So funny.  I presume that all of the other contestants went into this knowing full well that they might die.  The one guy we saw, died from the failed bomb.  But I would think that other people who got taken out by the ladder for example would survive to try again.  Pretty grim.

I'm not familiar at all with ACE (never ever even heard the term before) so I thought it was interesting that Spooner brought this up.  However, I rolled my eyes at Ava's pontificating about love is love is love and how Gwyn should be who he is.  This show (and the CW network in general) has always had gay characters on it, so at this point, it seemed kind of unnecessary for them to keep trying to educate viewers like this.

[kirinan]

8 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

When the mysterious guy played by Timothy Webber first showed up.

Thank you. @thuganomics85! I couldn't figure out where I knew him from, but as soon as you mentioned his name, I remembered him as Jerome from Men in Trees. (And a lot of other shows, too, but that was the specific link my brain was searching for.) I've always liked him, and would love it if he somehow showed up in one or two more Fixed Point bars along the way. 

Edited January 28, 2022 by kirinan

[Sakura12]

I'd start watching this show again if they have more episodes like this one. Where Sara actually gets to be a part of the team and talk to them about things other than Ava. She is so much better then just being Ava's cheerleader. 

You'd think Sara would be famous alone for being the unkillable. Even before she becoming part Alien. 

I didn't expect to see Thawne again and I prefer Matt's version over Tom's. I liked that this was the one that Sara outsmarted in S2. But I also don't trust him. I'm wondering if he wants her to fail so he can get out of the time loop. Then they can have roboSara take his place or if alien hybrid Sara, if Caity wants out of the show. 

[appositival]

So Gwyn, who doesn't like to be touched, is converted to a hugger when Ava hugs him? I swear, she must have pheromones that just don't translate through a visual medium like my TV.

[StaceyNotStacie]

23 hours ago, Sakura12 said:

I didn't expect to see Thawne again and I prefer Matt's version over Tom's. I liked that this was the one that Sara outsmarted in S2. But I also don't trust him. I'm wondering if he wants her to fail so he can get out of the time loop. Then they can have roboSara take his place or if alien hybrid Sara, if Caity wants out of the show. 

Quick question:  Outside if the Legends, Stargirl and the Super Cousins, I haven’t watched any of the other CWverse shows other than crossovers. Is the character that we saw last week the same guy that caused all of the trouble during the most frequent Flash event but played by a different actor?

[scarynikki12]

1 hour ago, Stacey1014 said:

Is the character that we saw last week the same guy that caused all of the trouble during the most frequent Flash event but played by a different actor?

It's hard to succinctly explain but, yes. The Thawne that shows up on Flash is played by Tom Cavanaugh while the one who has been on LOT is Matt Letscher. The Thawne with Matt's face is the original version from the future while the one with Tom's face is one who traveled back to Barry's time and took on the persona of Harrison Wells which includes his face via technology. That's all the detail I'm going into mainly because it would take days to make it make sense and, honestly, it still doesn't really make sense even to those of us who have seen every episode of Flash. 

[mary2013]

What was the song that Ava quoted from L-MM?

[Sakura12]

7 hours ago, mary2013 said:

What was the song that Ava quoted from L-MM?

He said that during his acceptance speech at the Tony's. 

[janeta]

@Lantern7

 

You can stream the CW shows on their app on any device. (I end up watching a lot of these on my iPad.). It’s free. 

[benteen]

Great episode.  Plots like this are one of the reasons I enjoy Legends so much.  The Fixed Point Bar and Sara and the teams attempts to alter history were great fun.  It's been great seeing Sara take so much if a leading role again in the past few episodes and not be defined completely by her relationship with Sara.  Thawne's appearance in the story was unexpected and clever.

[benteen]

On 1/27/2022 at 6:35 AM, lurker22 said:

Did this episode double Sara's death count, lol? 

Heheh.  Reminds me of the Lex Luthor concussion counts fans used to keep track of during Smallville.

[akg]

On 1/26/2022 at 9:08 PM, Lady Calypso said:

This skyrocketed into being one of my favourite episodes of Legends ever, for one simple reason (but also a bunch of other reasons): SPOONER'S ACE. They actually had Zari utter the word ACE. We have official asexual representation! 

This made me so happy. Zari was excellent in that scene, switching from 3 guys to 3 girls for the FMK game and then moving on to explaining asexuality. No pauses, no weirdness, just two friends chatting.