S02.E10: The Last Light

[raven]

Quote

The remaining members of the group fight back enemies, both living and dead, on their quest to save the future.

AMC+ airdate: 2021.11.28 AMC airdate: 2021.12.05

Be mindful if you participate in the Live Posting Topic - that topic will follow the show as it airs on AMC, so AMC+ viewers will be one episode ahead.  DO NOT SPOIL those who are watching on AMC.

[Mr. Sparkle]

Yep, that ended just as unsatisfying as I thought. No resolve, no Rick, lots of monologuing. 

We can discuss the scene after credits for the next couple months. 

[Smad]

Jadis needs to die. She is as evil as one can be. Keeps talking about people as a resource but is all in on genocide. Girl you make no freaking sense. I hate that she won the 'blame game' between her and Elizabeth. Everything Elizabeth did was for nothing. She sacrificed her humanity and lost everything anyway, both her daughter and her position. And funny how one's own kin dying can make one question their own choices. Well as I said in the episode 9 thread, she should have formed an inside rebellion or taken out Beale or maybe even let the evil plans slip to the CR. Have fun in the gulag.

So the French created the virus huh. So much for space spores. I find it hilarious that the US got a harmless version of the strain that produces slow and dumb zombies (not counting S1), has tons of armed civilians and military/police/guard and still completely fell apart. Meanwhile Europe managed to have survivors despite insanely powerful walkers, unarmed populace and lack of armed forces. And hey there Dr. Jenner. It's also interesting that this is retroactively admitting that Darabont had the right idea in S1 with the faster walkers who retain some form of intelligence.

Of course the only characters they killed off were two I really wanted to survive. But why did Huck have to die in such a dumb way? Instead of just killing Jadis she decided to have a fight with her and even handed her a weapon. And I knew this show was never going to kill off any of the kids because this franchise has lost the balls to do that a long time ago. They couldn't even show us Elton's arm getting chopped off after being bitten.

[Mr. Sparkle]

44 minutes ago, Smad said:

But why did Huck have to die in such a dumb way? Instead of just killing Jadis she decided to have a fight with her and even handed her a weapon.

This. The fate of the world hangs in the balance, but let's make sure it's a fair fight. Same with Felix and that other schmuck, but I care much less about them. 

[Smad]

3 hours ago, Superclam said:

This. The fate of the world hangs in the balance, but let's make sure it's a fair fight. Same with Felix and that other schmuck, but I care much less about them. 

You forgot the third instance of this stupidity. When Will was at the CRM truck, the soldier had his weapon pointed at him and instead of shooting Will he decided to rush him instead.

[heisenberg]

That was useless...  Not much happened and it was all a stereotype after an other.

Speaking while fighting, check.

Speaking while dying, Check.

Telling the plans to the enemy, Check.

etc...

There was more "Let's talk about my feelings" than other stuff going on.

What bothered me in this is the fact that people are overweight in the apocalyse.  Don't get me wrong. I am not fat shaming and i am overweight, about the same as Silas.  But if I cross half of the country by foot you can be sure that i will melt like snow in the sun.  Iris is back on the road killing zombies but I bet she can't bend over to tie her shoe.

So in the end,  I guess that if I had not watched this serie it would not have change anything to the whole story.

7 hours ago, Smad said:

So the French created the virus huh.

I am french canadian and I had to watch the subtitles.  C'était pathétique...🙂

[Mr. Sparkle]

5 hours ago, Smad said:

You forgot the third instance of this stupidity. When Will was at the CRM truck, the soldier had his weapon pointed at him and instead of shooting Will he decided to rush him instead.

I thought Will's gun ran out of ammo, which was another cliché we saw. Guns are always loaded with unlimited ammo, until of course, plot demands that they run out. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

9 hours ago, Smad said:

So the French created the virus huh. So much for space spores. I find it hilarious that the US got a harmless version of the strain that produces slow and dumb zombies (not counting S1), has tons of armed civilians and military/police/guard and still completely fell apart. Meanwhile Europe managed to have survivors despite insanely powerful walkers, unarmed populace and lack of armed forces. And hey there Dr. Jenner. It's also interesting that this is retroactively admitting that Darabont had the right idea in S1 with the faster walkers who retain some form of intelligence.

I need to go back and watch the final scene. I was kind of waiting for something more interesting to come in the after-credits scene (Rick, or at least Otis) so I didn't give it much attention. My 10th grade French won't be much help. 

[Smad]

2 hours ago, heisenberg said:

What bothered me in this is the fact that people are overweight in the apocalyse.  Don't get me wrong. I am not fat shaming and i am overweight, about the same as Silas.  But if I cross half of the country by foot you can be sure that i will melt like snow in the sun.  Iris is back on the road killing zombies but I bet she can't bend over to tie her shoe.

You know people have been trying to talk about this before and always get downvoted into oblivion or told they are fat shaming and what about 'representation'. Lets get something straight, at the beginning of the apocalypse there can be overweight people. 10 years into it? Unless you are living somewhere untouched by this apocalypse, hell no. Just like you wouldn't find overly muscular people. It's funny that I have an easier time suspending my disbelief for zombies than overweight/overly muscular people. But how am I supposed to take the survivors plight and struggle with finding food and living on spiders and worms while traversing thousands of miles seriously when you have people like Jerry, Eugene, Tyreese, Iris, Silas, Abraham, Denise, Olivia and so on? And wasn't there a body builder among the group Maggie came back with in S10/11? Even in big walled off communities like the ones we have in this show, food rationing will absolutely be a thing. Iris and Silas walked from Campus to New York and didn't loose any weight. In this episode apparently they walked from New York to Portland and Iris still looks the same. And I bet if we'd seen Silas in full after he became a soldier, he'd still look the same despite having gone through military training.

2 hours ago, heisenberg said:

So in the end,  I guess that if I had not watched this serie it would not have change anything to the whole story.

Well we don't know yet. After all those Rick movies are totally gonna happen and they will deal with CRM. Considering the end credit scene this episode mentioned that one of the french scientist teams was on a seminar in Ohio...that's where Commonwealth is.

2 hours ago, heisenberg said:

I am french canadian and I had to watch the subtitles.  C'était pathétique...🙂

Nah it's not something that was said so it's not your fault. When they do a wide shot from behind the french guy (just before he shoots the scientist), in the upper left corner is something written close to the ceiling. It translates to 'the dead were born here'.

38 minutes ago, Superclam said:

I thought Will's gun ran out of ammo, which was another cliché we saw. Guns are always loaded with unlimited ammo, until of course, plot demands that they run out. 

Will and the CRM soldier both had run out of ammo. The soldier was about to reload his rifle when Will came. The problem is that the soldier has a gun on his left hip. And instead of drawing that gun and simply shooting Will, he decided to rush Will instead.

Edited November 29, 2021 by Smad

[Iguessnot]

4 hours ago, Smad said:

You know people have been trying to talk about this before and always get downvoted into oblivion or told they are fat shaming and what about 'representation'. Lets get something straight, at the beginning of the apocalypse there can be overweight people. 10 years into it? Unless you are living somewhere untouched by this apocalypse, hell no. Just like you wouldn't find overly muscular people. It's funny that I have an easier time suspending my disbelief for zombies than overweight/overly muscular people. But how am I supposed to take the survivors plight and struggle with finding food and living on spiders and worms while traversing thousands of miles seriously when you have people like Jerry, Eugene, Tyreese, Iris, Silas, Abraham, Denise, Olivia and so on? And wasn't there a body builder among the group Maggie came back with in S10/11? Even in big walled off communities like the ones we have in this show, food rationing will absolutely be a thing. Iris and Silas walked from Campus to New York and didn't loose any weight. In this episode apparently they walked from New York to Portland and Iris still looks the same. And I bet if we'd seen Silas in full after he became a soldier, he'd still look the same despite having gone through military training.

Well we don't know yet. After all those Rick movies are totally gonna happen and they will deal with CRM. Considering the end credit scene this episode mentioned that one of the french scientist teams was on a seminar in Ohio...that's where Commonwealth is.

Nah it's not something that was said so it's not your fault. When they do a wide shot from behind the french guy (just before he shoots the scientist), in the upper left corner is something written close to the ceiling. It translates to 'the dead were born here'.

Will and the CRM soldier both had run out of ammo. The soldier was about to reload his rifle when Will came. The problem is that the soldier has a gun on his left hip. And instead of drawing that gun and simply shooting Will, he decided to rush Will instead.

Since these actors aren't actually traveling cross country on foot, I have to hand wave the extra girth; but there is no reason why Iris' clothes needed to be spray painted on her. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

11 hours ago, Smad said:

Will and the CRM soldier both had run out of ammo. The soldier was about to reload his rifle when Will came. The problem is that the soldier has a gun on his left hip. And instead of drawing that gun and simply shooting Will, he decided to rush Will instead.

I believe the old adage "you don't bring a knife to a gun fight" comes into play here. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

13 hours ago, heisenberg said:

What bothered me in this is the fact that people are overweight in the apocalyse.  Don't get me wrong. I am not fat shaming and i am overweight, about the same as Silas.  But if I cross half of the country by foot you can be sure that i will melt like snow in the sun.  Iris is back on the road killing zombies but I bet she can't bend over to tie her shoe.

They eat at the same hotel where they wash their hair, the men shave and the women shave their legs and underarms. 

[Smad]

7 hours ago, Iguessnot said:

Since these actors aren't actually traveling cross country on foot, I have to hand wave the extra girth; but there is no reason why Iris' clothes needed to be spray painted on her. 

Then they shouldn hire different actors to begin with. I don't judge overweight people since for some it doesn't have anything to with over eating but it's a medical condition. But if you want to sell me that this is an apocalypse where people often struggle with having food at all and sometimes travel thousands of miles, there should be wear and tear on the alive people just as there is with the world around them (perfectly mowed lawns aside).

59 minutes ago, Superclam said:

They eat at the same hotel where they wash their hair, the men shave and the women shave their legs and underarms. 

They do that in period pieces from the Middle Ages or earlier as well. Always gotta look Hollywood pretty.

[Utpe]

Well, this entire series was a chore to watch.  Not even a slight mention of Rick Grimes in the end.  But, hey, at least we got to see Dr. Jenner.  I guess that's something.

[Daltrey]

6 hours ago, Utpe said:

Well, this entire series was a chore to watch.  Not even a slight mention of Rick Grimes in the end.  But, hey, at least we got to see Dr. Jenner.  I guess that's something.

She never used his name, but Jadis did refer to him when Huck asked about her trading someone to be accepted in. I actually enjoyed the show, for the most part, but it really did kind of fizzle at the end without any kind of real resolution. I really hope some of these characters at least receive some sort of inclusion/conclusion if and when these Rick movies ever surface.

[BasilSeal]

49 minutes ago, Daltrey said:

She never used his name, but Jadis did refer to him when Huck asked about her trading someone to be accepted in. I actually enjoyed the show, for the most part, but it really did kind of fizzle at the end without any kind of real resolution. I really hope some of these characters at least receive some sort of inclusion/conclusion if and when these Rick movies ever surface.

I think we may see them before the rick movies, which are definitely going to happen. (TRMWADGTH)

my initial thoughts are that the TRMWADGTH are not going to about rick being captured and being a prisoner / soldier of the CRM. I always thought that was problematic because surely rick needs to appear in the main show's finale, and if we were to see him in that before any movie came out then we'd know what has happened to him anyway, rendering the movie pointless. So. either rick isn't going to appear in TWD again, which would be a bit shit, or the movies will take place mainly after the events of the current TWD series.

My guess is that there will be stuff about the CRM and the power struggle between the military and civilian leaderships in the current TWD, and this may include a cross over with both Fear and TWB. silas has clearly been embedded in the CRM for a reason, and they'll possibly use him in the future, remember he has the picture Iris drew of the four of them to remind him who he is when he's become a brainwashed CRM drone in the future, the picture is what will snap him out of the brainwashing and bring him back on side.

It looks like Rick has become some sort of super soldier for the CRM, yeah, that rick, the most incompetent leader in the apocalypse who's got nearly everyone who ever followed him killed , but whatever. i'm assuming this is his great value to the CRM, unless they were doing some research into why post apocalyptic communities were failing, and  after they studied rick that was when they decided killing everyone with mustard gas was a kinder option than leaving people like him in charge

There's a lot of stuff tied up in the end credit sequence, not least that the zombie plague was manufactured by the french, and some of the scientists involved in the project were in Ohio, near where the commonwealth is now, when it went down, also, zoombies!

My guess is that the CR / CRM power struggle will be resolved along with the Commonwealth plot in the current TWD series, and TRMWADGTH will be about Rick and whatever's left of team fucknut going to the land of the cheese eating surrender monkeys to find a cure to stop reanimation.

A sort of Team fucknut's European zombie vacation.

[Smad]

3 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

It looks like Rick has become some sort of super soldier for the CRM, yeah, that rick, the most incompetent leader in the apocalypse who's got nearly everyone who ever followed him killed , but whatever. i'm assuming this is his great value to the CRM, unless they were doing some research into why post apocalyptic communities were failing, and  after they studied rick that was when they decided killing everyone with mustard gas was a kinder option than leaving people like him in charge

Is it sad that I was lmao at this part? Finally a like minded individual. Rick 'the leader' Grimes has always been an immense source of frustration for me. What made it even worse was that no one else was allowed to be competent even in basic things so as not to give viewers the idea that maybe Rick shouldn't be the 'chosen one'.

3 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

My guess is that there will be stuff about the CRM and the power struggle between the military and civilian leaderships in the current TWD, and this may include a cross over with both Fear and TWB

I doubt it will go that far in the main show. At most we are going to get a revelation that the Commonwealth had or has some deal with the CR(M) (otherwise they wouldn't be standing anymore 2 years after the events in WB). CW might actually have been a trading partner unlike the other communities from WB. But there is no way they are going to get that deep into a possible conflict between CR and CRM. I could see them do that on Tales.

3 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

There's a lot of stuff tied up in the end credit sequence, not least that the zombie plague was manufactured by the french, and some of the scientists involved in the project were in Ohio, near where the commonwealth is now, when it went down, also, zoombies!

There is no way they aren't going to pay off the fact that one of the french research teams was in Ohio. They will be in the Commonwealth, either hiding their true identity like Yumiko's brother or CW is also doing their own research on the virus. And we know our group is gonna snoop around (it's already been hinted at in trailers with Daryl and Carol IMO).

[oakville]

On 11/28/2021 at 7:04 PM, heisenberg said:

So in the end,  I guess that if I had not watched this serie it would not have change anything to the whole story.

I am french canadian and I had to watch the subtitles.  C'était pathétique...🙂

The actors in the after credits scene did not sound like they were from France.

[heisenberg]

1 hour ago, oakville said:

The actors in the after credits scene did not sound like they were from France.

They also did not sound like they were speaking french, they were mumbling whatever with few words thrown in.

[theredhead77]

I'll just be over here on my solo bench as someone who enjoyed this show. Maybe it's all the pandemic isolation but while this 2 season capsule series wasn't perfect, it was a different spin on the TWD universe.

I accidentally read this thread last week and spoiled that Huck was going to die, but I would have guessed she was going to manually blow up the gas anyway. I really hope Silas stays true to his heart, and doesn't become a true CRM solider, but Jadis is 110% on to him and he may just buy into needing something to belong to.

What does TRMWADGTH mean?

[Mr. Sparkle]

20 minutes ago, theredhead77 said:

What does TRMWADGTH mean?

The Rick Movies Which Are Definitely Going To Happen. Credit goes to @BasilSeal. As I'm sure you've guessed, there is doubt that they are definitely going to happen. 

23 minutes ago, theredhead77 said:

I'll just be over here on my solo bench as someone who enjoyed this show. Maybe it's all the pandemic isolation but while this 2 season capsule series wasn't perfect, it was a different spin on the TWD universe.

I can agree with that. I didn't hate it, but it could have been much better. 

[OoohMaggie]

The last post on the live watch thread was Nov 8th 😥, it deserved better than that, it did improve towards the end 👏`

If only it had started like that who knows where we’d be now 🤔

How is it that the people on the main show are struggling to find a tin of beans, yet a short walk away from wherever these people find a fully functioning science lab, water, power, obviously food.
I enjoyed the ‘Darth Maul’ encounter, they obviously had a few quid left in the budget and rather than spend it on a realistic explosion, they brought in a proper fight coordinator. It’s a shame he couldn’t teach the group how to jog swiftly around and past small groups of Walkers, instead of going straight through the middle getting covered in blood.

So, in TRMWADGTH we’re definitely going to see Queen Bitch Jadis 😁, Big Gruesome seems to be getting a few more paydays, if Twerky girl turns up in Portland looking the same I’m calling BS.

Wheres Maggie? It’s been far too long 😔

[OoohMaggie]

On 11/30/2021 at 1:28 PM, BasilSeal said:

A sort of Team fucknut's European zombie vacation.

Is Chevy Chase still alive? 🤔

[Smad]

3 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

How is it that the people on the main show are struggling to find a tin of beans, yet a short walk away from wherever these people find a fully functioning science lab, water, power, obviously food.

Well the scenes at the end have time jumps in them even if they aren't defined. We know that the scientists set up shop not far from the lab in a shopping mall, although it was mentioned to be temporary. Where they got all the lab equipment however...who knows. The group that headed to Portland looked like they stepped outside of that mall and there is Portland. They were wearing the same clothes, carrying no bags and there was no wear and tear on them (and Iris still didn't lose a pound despite them traversing the entire continent on foot unless it's Portland, Maine). Silas already was up in ranks, watching new recruits.

How they get food and keep clean like that? A wizard did it (just like S1).

[kevvoi]

Iris and Hope talked about the relocation - I thought that they mentioned Columbia's lab facilities as a place to set up the new research lab (but I am not sure that makes much sense geographically - not that it is any clearer to me where in New York they are supposed to be at).

[rmontro]

Well, that was underwhelming.

 

On 11/30/2021 at 12:24 AM, Utpe said:

 Not even a slight mention of Rick Grimes in the end.  But, hey, at least we got to see Dr. Jenner.  I guess that's something.

Jadin referred to him saying that he was really an "A", but she told the CRM he was a "B".  Because if she had said he was an "A" he would have ended up on the research tables.  WHAT is an "A" and a "B"?

I would think an "A" would be an alpha, or leader.  But if that's the case, why would they cut the "A" up on the experimenting tables instead of the less valuable "B"?

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, kevvoi said:

Iris and Hope talked about the relocation - I thought that they mentioned Columbia's lab facilities as a place to set up the new research lab (but I am not sure that makes much sense geographically - not that it is any clearer to me where in New York they are supposed to be at).

I believe the mention was Cornell (in Ithaca) not Columbia (in NYC) - which, considering the CRM-established Research Facility is based in Ithaca, makes total sense.

If you’re an absolute fucking moron totally unconcerned with hiding from the people from whom you’ve just escaped, that is…. 🙄

[kevvoi]

Thank you! you are right it was Cornell which makes a heck of a lot more sense than Columbia.

[Nashville]

3 minutes ago, kevvoi said:

Thank you! you are right it was Cornell which makes a heck of a lot more sense than Columbia.

Geographically, at least.

[Smad]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

If you’re an absolute fucking moron totally unconcerned with hiding from the people from whom you’ve just escaped, that is…. 🙄

And that's exactly the problem. They decided to set up literally next door to the CRM. Unless the CR(M) gave up the location with no scientists there and the whole place overrun, it's the worst place to be. These people won't even be able to grow food since the CRM might send patrols that far out or all the helicopters flying around will spot something. If the CRM abandoned the place, fine...but they didn't show/tell us that they abandoned it. And they also didn't show/tell that the scientists eventually moved on from the mall and went somewhere else (even though it was mentioned to be temporary).

[Nashville]

 

21 hours ago, Smad said:

And that's exactly the problem. They decided to set up literally next door to the CRM. Unless the CR(M) gave up the location with no scientists there and the whole place overrun, it's the worst place to be. These people won't even be able to grow food since the CRM might send patrols that far out or all the helicopters flying around will spot something. If the CRM abandoned the place, fine...but they didn't show/tell us that they abandoned it.

Yup! An abandonment of the CRRF may have been at most somewhat implied by Jada’s departure - but it would be ridiculous for anyone to assume the CRM would simply walk away from its resource investment in the facility, housing, and ancillary support systems.  Any Cornell-based activity by the escapees would in essence be sitting on the doorstep of an active CRM military presence - be it residential OR salvage - for years to come, and simply hoping their paths never intersected.

 

Quote

And they also didn't show/tell that the scientists eventually moved on from the mall and went somewhere else (even though it was mentioned to be temporary).

If I recall correctly - BIIIIIG ‘if’, that - the general implication was:

1. Iris and Elton and some of the Perimeter folk were accompanying the main portion of the scientists in their trek across the United States from upstate NY to Portland OR.
2. Hope and her dad / Felix and William / the other Perimeter people were staying in the area with the remaining scientist contingent with the notion of resuming some portion of their research, using the Cornell University facilities as their base.  

So: #1 is marching a bunch of lab rat Office rejects across some 2700+ miles of walker-infested wilderness, while #2 sets up housekeeping on their former captors’ front lawn - and these are the great minds which are going to save humanity?

Boy, do I feel better about humanity’s chances now.
Morons.

Edited December 7, 2021 by Nashville
Clarification

[BasilSeal]

9 hours ago, rmontro said:

WHAT is an "A" and a "B"?

Perceived wisdom is that A stands for After and B for Before. Dr Lyla tells Hope that most of the subjects in her lab were found in the outside world after they'd been bitten or were already dying, (ie After), the link with the main show is Jadis who was supplying these test subjects, or at least some of them, to the CRM.

 

14 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

Is Chevy Chase still alive? 🤔

think he is but Technically he wouldn't need to be alive to appear in this show,

[Nashville]

23 hours ago, rmontro said:

Well, that was underwhelming.

 

Jadin referred to him saying that he was really an "A", but she told the CRM he was a "B".  Because if she had said he was an "A" he would have ended up on the research tables.  WHAT is an "A" and a "B"?

I would think an "A" would be an alpha, or leader.  But if that's the case, why would they cut the "A" up on the experimenting tables instead of the less valuable "B"?

The whole A/B classification thingie has never been fully explained - more below.

 

14 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

Perceived wisdom is that A stands for After and B for Before. Dr Lyla tells Hope that most of the subjects in her lab were found in the outside world after they'd been bitten or were already dying, (ie After), the link with the main show is Jadis who was supplying these test subjects, or at least some of them, to the CRM.

But Rick invalidates that interpretation; Jadis made a big point of saying Rick was an A who she (mis-)represented as a B because she “owed him that”, and it’s not like Rick had been bitten but magically became un-bit on Jadis’s say-so.

The truth is, we still don’t have much of a clue.  We know (at least partially) the results of being classified one way or the other - i.e., get labeled an A and you’ll ride a slab and get bit - but we still don’t know:

1. The “entry” criteria for initial A/B classification; whatever THAT may be, it’s (a) at least partially subjectively based on the perceptions of the person doing the rating, and (b) not something which can be immediately and objectively proven/disproven.  Jada’s spur-of-the-moment change in her initial Rick assessment is how Rick got slipped through the cracks.
2. What exactly ends up happening to those labeled B, beyond baseline survival.

 

Quote

think he is but Technically he wouldn't need to be alive to appear in this show,

Or Chevy could pull a Bill Murray/Zombieland schtick; best of both worlds - and BEYOND!!!  😉

[rmontro]

14 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

Perceived wisdom is that A stands for After and B for Before. Dr Lyla tells Hope that most of the subjects in her lab were found in the outside world after they'd been bitten or were already dying, (ie After), the link with the main show is Jadis who was supplying these test subjects, or at least some of them, to the CRM.

So what would a "B" be?  Someone who wasn't dying (which Jadis was lying about)?  Wouldn't the doctors take one look at Rick and say they had him in the wrong pile?  And what would be the value of a "B" person?  Isn't it essentially just a person?  Just someone to put to work, I guess?  It's hard to imagine Rick being that cooperative, unless they're going with the old trope of him losing his memory.

Regarding the post credits scene, it looks like they're going to be experimenting more with different kinds of zombies.  Now that they are past Robert Kirkham's part in the stories, I guess they can do anything they want.  Some have referred to World War Z, but I also remember Z Nation.  The big rolling "hamster ball" used in the previous episode reminded me of Z Nation.

 

[Nashville]

15 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

Perceived wisdom is that A stands for After and B for Before. Dr Lyla tells Hope that most of the subjects in her lab were found in the outside world after they'd been bitten or were already dying, (ie After), the link with the main show is Jadis who was supplying these test subjects, or at least some of them, to the CRM.

 

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

But Rick invalidates that interpretation; Jadis made a big point of saying Rick was an A who she (mis-)represented as a B because she “owed him that”, and it’s not like Rick had been bitten but magically became un-bit on Jadis’s say-so.
The truth is, we still don’t have much of a clue.  We know (at least partially) the results of being classified one way or the other - i.e., get labeled an A and you’ll ride a slab and get bit - but we still don’t know:

1. The “entry” criteria for initial A/B classification; whatever THAT may be, it’s (a) at least partially subjectively based on the perceptions of the person doing the rating, and (b) not something which can be immediately and objectively proven/disproven.  Jada’s spur-of-the-moment change in her initial Rick assessment is how Rick got slipped through the cracks.
2. What exactly ends up happening to those labeled B, beyond baseline survival.

Okay - memory has been somewhat refreshed now, and @BasilSeal was right about A = “After” (recently infected) and B = “Before” (uninflected).  Apparently the CRM has a moderately insatiable appetite for As upon which to experiment, and Jadis & the  GPKs were suppliers.  Indicators were:

1. The Negan incident. Jadis had Negan tied down (badly) to a garage creeper and planned on inflicting a bite upon him with the cart walker.  Jadis had apparently already radioed the CRM to pick up a fresh A, intending Negan to fill the bill - hence the black helicopter appearing towards the end of the Jadis/Negan exchange.
2. The Rick incident.  Jadis had never specifically told the CRM that Rick was an A - but Jadis, desperate for entry to the CR, had lied earlier and said she had an A when the CRM made it crystal clear (a) no pickups would be forthcoming without trade in exchange for transport, and (b) the CRM was really only interested in As at the time.  The CRM folks were pissed when Jadis showed up with a B (Rick) instead of the A she’d promised them, but took him in because of his injuries.  What happened to Rick later is unknown.

[ctlady]

On 11/28/2021 at 7:04 PM, heisenberg said:

What bothered me in this is the fact that people are overweight in the apocalyse.  Don't get me wrong. I am not fat shaming and i am overweight, about the same as Silas.  But if I cross half of the country by foot you can be sure that i will melt like snow in the sun.  Iris is back on the road killing zombies but I bet she can't bend over to tie her shoe.

 

On 11/28/2021 at 9:17 PM, Smad said:

You know people have been trying to talk about this before and always get downvoted into oblivion or told they are fat shaming and what about 'representation'. Lets get something straight, at the beginning of the apocalypse there can be overweight people. 10 years into it? Unless you are living somewhere untouched by this apocalypse, hell no. Just like you wouldn't find overly muscular people. It's funny that I have an easier time suspending my disbelief for zombies than overweight/overly muscular people. But how am I supposed to take the survivors plight and struggle with finding food and living on spiders and worms while traversing thousands of miles seriously when you have people like Jerry, Eugene, Tyreese, Iris, Silas, Abraham, Denise, Olivia and so on? And wasn't there a body builder among the group Maggie came back with in S10/11? Even in big walled off communities like the ones we have in this show, food rationing will absolutely be a thing. Iris and Silas walked from Campus to New York and didn't loose any weight. In this episode apparently they walked from New York to Portland and Iris still looks the same. And I bet if we'd seen Silas in full after he became a soldier, he'd still look the same despite having gone through military training.

THIS!  THIS!  THIS!  It has nothing to do with 'body shaming/fat shaming' or 'body diversity' - this isn't a Gap commercial for jeans [SMH]  It's about the reality of the situation.  I call this the 'Hurly on LOST' syndrome.  How could a guy of his size be stranded on an island and didn't look as if he lost an ounce by the series finale.  And LOST was pre-Castaway, which got it right.  But as someone else stated, it all comes down to have pretty Hollywood people in the roles.  I mean, who wants to watch a show with a bunch of emaciated actors? (p.s.:  I would)  

And it's not just Iris being dressed in skin tight clothes, but they also did that on TWD with Maggie and Michonne.  I don't care that you're slender and fit - that's gotta be hella uncomfortable when you need to be limber and quick to fight off walkers, not to mention when you're walking around for days without proper hygiene that's quite a recipe for a yeast infection waiting to happen

Don't get me started on Soldier Silas.  Not only do I think he'd make it past the first day of boot camp, he would've been looking like GI Joe afterwards.  

On 11/29/2021 at 9:53 AM, Smad said:

They eat at the same hotel where they wash their hair, the men shave and the women shave their legs and underarms.

And the women either have an endless supply of feminine hygiene products, especially when they're out on the run for months.  

[heisenberg]

On 12/29/2021 at 10:00 AM, ctlady said:

And it's not just Iris being dressed in skin tight clothes, but they also did that on TWD with Maggie and Michonne.  I don't care that you're slender and fit - that's gotta be hella uncomfortable when you need to be limber and quick to fight off walkers, not to mention when you're walking around for days without proper hygiene that's quite a recipe for a yeast infection waiting to happen

Yep, that too.  

[Genius]

I finally caught up with the end of this series.  I appreciate that it ended up being a CRM show that has greater consequences for the TWDU, as opposed to the obnoxious teen angst show that it started as.  But ultimately I was underwhelmed.  And this may be an unpopular opinion, but I just don't think the actress who played Jennifer/Huck was up to the challenge.  That character was maybe the most complex in the entire series, and that actress's idea of showing complexity was licking her lips, "talking tough," and clomping around.  I kept wondering how remarkable that role could have been in the hands of a better actress. 

And also, seriously - the CRM wouldn't think to check the local underground mall that's nearby?  Wouldn't they have thoroughly mined that already for any valuable resource?  And yes, it drives me crazy that there are apparently societies with every resource including electricity, food, water, hygiene products, etc., yet Alexandria is starving.  Come on.

[Mr. Sparkle]

33 minutes ago, Genius said:

And this may be an unpopular opinion, but I just don't think the actress who played Jennifer/Huck was up to the challenge.  That character was maybe the most complex in the entire series, and that actress's idea of showing complexity was licking her lips, "talking tough," and clomping around. 

No, this opinion was shared by many. 

[Genius]

20 hours ago, Superclam said:

No, this opinion was shared by many.

Ooh I should go back and read all the episode threads for some Huck trashing then.

[Mr. Sparkle]

My personal feeling is not so much against the actor as it is the writing and direction. Someone wrote those lines, and someone okayed her rendition of the character. 

I'm not familiar with her other work, so I don't know how talented an actor she really is. 

[borealis]

46 minutes ago, Superclam said:

My personal feeling is not so much against the actor as it is the writing and direction. Someone wrote those lines, and someone okayed her rendition of the character. 

I'm not familiar with her other work, so I don't know how talented an actor she really is. 

She was in The Americans, playing Nina. I loved her in that! I think, like you, that it was more writing and direction here. I did notice that she seemed more 'off' in this role, than when she played Nina, and Nina was a more nuanced, in-depth role.

BTW, I would recommend The Americans to anyone, anywhere, all day, every day!! LOL 

[Nashville]

On 1/12/2022 at 11:20 AM, borealis said:

She was in The Americans, playing Nina. I loved her in that! I think, like you, that it was more writing and direction here. I did notice that she seemed more 'off' in this role, than when she played Nina, and Nina was a more nuanced, in-depth role.

Same here; Annet Mahendru‘s inclusion in the cast was actually why I decided to give TWDWB a chance in the first place.

 

On 1/12/2022 at 11:20 AM, borealis said:

BTW, I would recommend The Americans to anyone, anywhere, all day, every day!! LOL 

Echo that, in spades - phenomenal show.