Flipping 101 With Tarek El Moussa - General Discussion

[topanga]

On 9/11/2020 at 2:10 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

This comes back on Thursdays at 8 central, and must only be for the four unaired episodes, since Flip or Flop will be back with a new season Thursday October 15 (15 episodes).   If F or F is taking the slot, then maybe the story about not many episodes left unaired of 101 was true.  

As much as I hate to admit it, Flip or Flop works better than either of the hosts’ individual shows. But I’ll still watch these remaining episodes. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

HGTV is desperate for unaired programming, that's why we're seeing short seasons, so I guess until they can film more, it will only be 4 or so episodes of this show.   However, this coming Thursday, there are four 30 minutes episodes listed as new.    I wonder if the first two are just reruns with added pop ups?    

I will watch the Tarek shows, F or F, and 101, but the Christina show bores me.   

I'm watching the shows with extra scenes, and the brothers who were had real estate, and construction experience were smart to split up and do separate projects after this.   They couldn't agree on anything, kept doing exactly what they wanted to do, no matter what they decided.   

Then Victor who bought the house sight unseen, or he would have missed the deadline to be on the show, bought a house with a shared driveway, and didn't want to put a garage door from the alley, so a buyer would have access to their own property.     He fought his own wife, and Tarek on everything, and in any other market than L.A., he would have lost his shirt.    He didn't improve on the second flip he was on with Tarek later in the season either.    

The new episode with Pino and Patsy was interesting.   That was a tiny house, and they did a nice remodel on it, but to sell for (I think) over $700k was bizarre.   I'm wondering (the new episodes were filmed pre-Covid and there are leftovers from last season) how the pandemic will effect the L.A. market?      

Edited September 18, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[LittleIggy]

The prices those houses in LA and surrounding area sell for just boggles the mind. In other parts of the country, one could buy a mansion for the same price.

[topanga]

4 hours ago, LittleIggy said:

The prices those houses in LA and surrounding area sell for just boggles the mind. In other parts of the country, one could buy a mansion for the same price.

Right? I can’t believe someone is going to pay over $700 k for that 1600 sq. frío,e—if the deal goes through. It still had that ugly retaining wall in back.

[CrazyInAlabama]

Unless they rip out the entire retaining wall, and do a real foundation, and a great quality retaining wall then that wall will be coming down very shortly.      They will need to do a lot of dirt removal for the base of the wall.  I bet the cost of a real wall would be over $10k

The sale that shocks me is the one with the shared driveway, where the neighbor had a bunch of wrecks parked in the driveway.    Also, the house with the first floor master, and the two doors to the master bath.    

Edited September 18, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[topanga]

There’s going to be an entire teevee special about Tarek’s proposal to Heather? How much attention do these two people need? Two caveats: Tarek looks handsome in a tux, and I like Heather on Selling Sunset. But a TV show? 

[MsTree]

13 hours ago, topanga said:

But a TV show? 

Not a TV show, per se, but only part of one episode. At least that's my interpretation of the preview.

[ByaNose]

16 hours ago, MsTree said:

Not a TV show, per se, but only part of one episode. At least that's my interpretation of the preview.

Like, I said on Christina’s thread. Why do TPTB think we care about this?! Just show the flips. That’s what people are there for. Personally, I don’t care what Tarek and his Christina look alike fiancé are doing.  IMO!!!

[MsTree]

4 hours ago, ByaNose said:

Like, I said on Christina’s thread. Why do TPTB think we care about this?! Just show the flips. That’s what people are there for. Personally, I don’t care what Tarek and his Christina look alike fiancé are doing.  IMO!!!

On the flip (NPI) side, some of us enjoy a glimpse into their personal life, especially since we've witnessed all the divorce drama and cancer drama. IMO, it'll be nice to see Tarek happy for a change.

[ByaNose]

29 minutes ago, MsTree said:

On the flip (NPI) side, some of us enjoy a glimpse into their personal life, especially since we've witnessed all the divorce drama and cancer drama. IMO, it'll be nice to see Tarek happy for a change.

Yeah, everyone can have an opinion and be a fan. That’s what’s great about the USA. That said, it does crack me up seeing all these pictures of Tarek (trying) to look and act young with his clothes, jewelry & personal life. Of course, he gets to have fun for a second time but it’s amazing how fame (and, a divorce) changes someone. He’s is 39 so I guess that’s still young. I’m almost 56 and maybe I’m projecting too much. LOL!!!!!

[sue450]

14 hours ago, ByaNose said:

Yeah, everyone can have an opinion and be a fan. That’s what’s great about the USA. That said, it does crack me up seeing all these pictures of Tarek (trying) to look and act young with his clothes, jewelry & personal life. Of course, he gets to have fun for a second time but it’s amazing how fame (and, a divorce) changes someone. He’s is 39 so I guess that’s still young. I’m almost 56 and maybe I’m projecting too much. LOL!!!!!

  did anyone see that tarek ex christina and her new hubby ant have separated???  did not even make it to the 2 year anniversary......covid times are hard but Ant has 2 kids with the ex and christuina  has 2 kids with her ex and they (ant and  christina) both had a baby together.......it has been a tough covid year but shouldn't they try and get counseling  at least do so work to make it work??? those poor kids

Edited September 20, 2020 by sue450

[lynxfx]

Caught up on the show last week. As a watcher of most of the flipping and remodel shows it isn't bad. Better than Christina's show but has room to improve. If the rumors of expanding to an hour are true I think that will help. Too much happens in very little time.

That said, as a flipper myself, I know this show is far from reality. The numbers are fudged beyond recognition, especially the closing costs both during buying and selling. Since nearly all of them were hard money loans they are ignoring a lot of the fees initiating the loan which at these amounts is thousands of dollars. I do like that carrying costs is up front and center during the show. That is a good thing and keeps focus that money is going out the door every day. Not sure if they include the other costs like utilities, HOAs (if one), insurance etc.

Now for the people they picked. I hated almost all of them for one reason or another. First you have the failed flippers that won't listen to Tarek's advice. You have the lazy family flippers that are doing the bare minimum for flipping. All they have to do is manage the contractors and show up and they can't even do that. Yet they somehow sell and make money according to the show. I have more respect for the ones that actually did a lot of the work, especially this early in the game. The shoddy work done by licensed contractors is inexcusable. The crap tile work at that one flip with the grout not even cleaned up was embarrassing. The mixed color counter tops, my god. 

Then you have the 'hollywood' types that want in on the investing and start at the MDLLA level. The woman really thinks she is a designer. The argument over the cabinets was comical. "I don't want to follow trends, I want this to be the new trend." Then she picks the ugliest, cheapest looking cabinet combo that then gets installed wrong. The original cabinets looked better and I cringed when they took a sledge to those perfectly fine cabinets. At least with Property Brothers they try to salvage good stuff and donate it when possible. 

The 19 year old that was working for an investor pro-bono seemed like a good kid. He listened and grew over the short episode. At that age didn't seem cocky and looked to be trying to make a career out of it. 

Lastly, none of these places would have sold at those prices or in that timeframe without the staging which looks to be donated by HGTV. (They show the name of the staging company as a giveaway) How much else is donated, I don't know. Maybe we'll get a flipper from the show to give out the dirt someday. 

Lastly lastly, how the hell are these new flippers getting hard money loans for half a million dollars? My first flip I got a $100k loan and it was quite the process even though I had perfect credit, cash in the bank and low debt. Multiple ones required detailed rehab plans and costs along with expected resale price compared to actual comps. I was denied by 2 before getting the 3rd to accept after I agreed to put 25% down.

[ByaNose]

4 hours ago, lynxfx said:

Caught up on the show last week. As a watcher of most of the flipping and remodel shows it isn't bad. Better than Christina's show but has room to improve. If the rumors of expanding to an hour are true I think that will help. Too much happens in very little time.

That said, as a flipper myself, I know this show is far from reality. The numbers are fudged beyond recognition, especially the closing costs both during buying and selling. Since nearly all of them were hard money loans they are ignoring a lot of the fees initiating the loan which at these amounts is thousands of dollars. I do like that carrying costs is up front and center during the show. That is a good thing and keeps focus that money is going out the door every day. Not sure if they include the other costs like utilities, HOAs (if one), insurance etc.

Now for the people they picked. I hated almost all of them for one reason or another. First you have the failed flippers that won't listen to Tarek's advice. You have the lazy family flippers that are doing the bare minimum for flipping. All they have to do is manage the contractors and show up and they can't even do that. Yet they somehow sell and make money according to the show. I have more respect for the ones that actually did a lot of the work, especially this early in the game. The shoddy work done by licensed contractors is inexcusable. The crap tile work at that one flip with the grout not even cleaned up was embarrassing. The mixed color counter tops, my god. 

Then you have the 'hollywood' types that want in on the investing and start at the MDLLA level. The woman really thinks she is a designer. The argument over the cabinets was comical. "I don't want to follow trends, I want this to be the new trend." Then she picks the ugliest, cheapest looking cabinet combo that then gets installed wrong. The original cabinets looked better and I cringed when they took a sledge to those perfectly fine cabinets. At least with Property Brothers they try to salvage good stuff and donate it when possible. 

The 19 year old that was working for an investor pro-bono seemed like a good kid. He listened and grew over the short episode. At that age didn't seem cocky and looked to be trying to make a career out of it. 

Lastly, none of these places would have sold at those prices or in that timeframe without the staging which looks to be donated by HGTV. (They show the name of the staging company as a giveaway) How much else is donated, I don't know. Maybe we'll get a flipper from the show to give out the dirt someday. 

Lastly lastly, how the hell are these new flippers getting hard money loans for half a million dollars? My first flip I got a $100k loan and it was quite the process even though I had perfect credit, cash in the bank and low debt. Multiple ones required detailed rehab plans and costs along with expected resale price compared to actual comps. I was denied by 2 before getting the 3rd to accept after I agreed to put 25% down.

Great overview of flipping. HGTV has always glamorized flipping. It’s obvious they have always fudged the numbers and also had things donated for free. Occasionally, there’s been a loss on some of these flips but usually it’s always some big return. All that said, as god is my witness I never even thought of getting a loan to flip a house. Now, I can make my millions by getting a loan. Who knew? LOL!!!!!!

[lynxfx]

31 minutes ago, ByaNose said:

All that said, as god is my witness I never even thought of getting a loan to flip a house.

Given that most people starting out don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars to buy a house full stop, your hard money loan at 12% is the most common method to get started. If you are lucky you might find an investor to put up the cash but they will usually take 50% of your profits. The ultimate goal of a flipper is to create a bankroll that allows you to be the "investor" and keep it all in-house. Becoming an agent also increases the profit margin. Goals that are quite hard to achieve in even the best circumstances. 

Sadly (based on who you are) we might actually be heading towards another 2008 scenario which will become prime timing for flippers with cash on hand. There is a neighborhood next to me with homes that sold for $600k in 2004-2007. In 2009 they listed for $180k. They still haven't reach their old highs since they are dated inside, topping out around $550k. But the people that scooped them up after the crash and held onto them are making bank. Remodel them now they might match the new construction at $700k. I'm out of the biz now due to covid and a medical condition. 

Has anyone been able to find any of the homes on zillow? We've discovered many HGTV shenanigans in the past that way including seeing all of the deals that didn't go through. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

Since the new episodes are only 30 minutes, I suspect the other part of new episodes are the reruns with pop ups.    

The Compton house with the bizarre ceiling is so hysterical to see again.   Tarek must have been desperate to have this fool flipper on again.    Even in that crazy California market, I still am amazed anyone moved to that part of Compton, and paid that amount for that house.     The overhead shot of the neighbors was not good.  Then the idiot flipper said the addition was permitted, but it isn't permitted, and they had to get approval.    Who checks with their realtor, instead of the city to find out about permits?   

So the new episode was a beach town remodel, and the people profited $270k, but yet they didn't have enough money to replace the old aluminum triple pane windows?   And who decided the tiny bathtub in the other bath room was a good idea?   That should have been changed to a shower.     Also, this was when the Covid lockdown started, both flippers have risk factors, and when they could go back to the house, the wife was wearing some bedazzled mask?  

The two tiny bedrooms, and that tiny 'third' bedroom was horrible.  The thought of people actually buying that place for $1.5 million is staggering.     The dog part of the open house must have been a set up for filming.    I'm wondering if there was something wrong with the pool, maybe it looked better on TV, then the actual physical shape?    

The one thing I loathe more than the flippers that never listen are the quirky ones that are all into the smudging, and all kinds of new age stuff, when they aren't even doing the work, and concentrating on their flip house.     The Covid shutdown was a bad thing for time lines, and for other reasons of course, but they just kind of went through the flip as though time wasn't of the essence, and as if the market couldn't tank on them.       

I'm waiting for the show when one of the flippers takes forever with a hard money loan, blow the budget on trendy stuff that is taste specific instead of appealing to the biggest buying pool, and the place either never sells, or the price goes so low they lose a bundle (not that I bet we'll hear about that).  

I didn't want to hear about repeated smudging, getting rid of bad vibes in the house, and wanted to see more remodeling, and real flipping work.     Actually, the wife looked familiar.    However, since she was blonde, and involved in real estate in California, I bet she's been on House Hunters, or something before.  

Edited September 28, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[LittleIggy]

$2.5 million for a 1600 sq. foot house under an airport flight path? 😮🤦‍♀️ It never ceases to amaze me...

I reacted like Tarek (with a few more profanities) when that couple brought the bulldog to the open house. Are you kidding me! Then they had the nerve to let him get into the bathtub. How rude and inconsiderate.

[readheaded]

On 6/9/2020 at 12:16 AM, sue450 said:

the windy city rehab lady with the ombe hair color...she is SOOOOOOOO annoying!

Exactly, and her pants look like a rat chewed on them.

[Frost]

On 9/24/2020 at 6:38 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

So the new episode was a beach town remodel, and the people profited $270k, but yet they didn't have enough money to replace the old aluminum triple pane windows?   And who decided the tiny bathtub in the other bath room was a good idea?   That should have been changed to a shower.   

I really didn't understand that house.  It had two good sized living spaces, one with a fireplace, plus the large brick floored room, right?  And two small bedrooms and one miniscule bedroom barely big enough for a crib.  Not to mention the tiny bathroom.  So they block off one end of the brick floor area for....an office.  There wasn't any way to reconfigure to have three normal sized bedrooms and two nice bathrooms?  They'd still have plenty of living space.  Tarek never said a word.   The whole thing didn't make sense.  

[MakingBacon]

The Playa Del Ray house didn’t sell for $2,500,000, it sold for $1,500,000. I think Tarek said it sold for $1,560,000 or so which I believe be was the original list price. I live in Los Angeles and spend a lot of time looking at houses for sale online. That house was on the market for months. I have seen it many times on Realtor.com. I knew immediately when I saw the beginning of this episode it was the same house because the front of it is unique and makes it look kind of slanted. I even checked the website to confirm and it is now listed as sold.  I was very excited to see the before and after.

From the website, the house and pool/small yard looked great. It turns out to be an illusion because on the show it just looks odd and small. This is why you don’t buy a house without seeing it in person.  I also don’t understand why they would take a kitchen that used to have a gas stove and put in an electric stove. They are just not common in single family homes here. 
 

I am actually surprised the house was not listed for much more. Playa Del Rey is next to Manhattan Beach and a few minutes from LAX, plus it has a pool. It’s in a nice area. I do wonder if there was something else going on with the house for it to be listed so low. A house near the beach with a pool is a unicorn. 

[lynxfx]

1 hour ago, MakingBacon said:

I am actually surprised the house was not listed for much more. Playa Del Rey is next to Manhattan Beach and a few minutes from LAX, plus it has a pool. It’s in a nice area. I do wonder if there was something else going on with the house for it to be listed so low. A house near the beach with a pool is a unicorn. 

I looked at apartments in Playa del Rey when I first moved to LA. The airplane noise is ridiculous and constant which nixed that plan. I don't know how anyone could live there, especially buying at that price. I did go to a bunch of open houses in that area before. Most were on the edge of the hill so they had views but were listed for $3-5m and probably twice the size. I honestly don't remember any pools so that is probably rare up there. Still I wouldn't buy a place between Culver Blvd and the airport. For those prices you could get a great place in Palos Verdes Estates and still be close to Manhattan or Hermosa Beach. 

The superstitious people are annoying and I don't know why they keep getting airtime on these shows. MDLLA also had one come in a house. At least Tarek kept making faces during it. I like dogs but man that was rude what they did. We usually make people put on the booties over their shoes with new flooring. 

The addition built on the previous episode house was a good call but again I want to know what these people are doing for money. Their budget was $30k going in but had no problem hitting almost $140k? They still had a hard money loan and most have specific requirements for drawing credit for the rehab bits. Even harder when your last 3 flips lost money. Was it all family money? So many questions.

These two eps they did call out the cost of staging with one only doing a couple rooms and the other doing it themselves. I wonder if HGTV stopped providing (if they were) because they sure haven't put those costs into the numbers.

[iMonrey]

I see that they are repurposing earlier episodes as "Master Class" episodes with "bonus footage." I'd like to know what kind of bonus footage they can squeeze into a 22-minute episode and what could be gleaned from said footage that's new. I'm so tired of this little trick TV plays smacking a "new" label on reruns so your DVR picks it up. I also hate the stupid little pop-ups, they are so useless and inane. "Tarek says buyers are attracted to natural lighting." Well, duh! I never knew! Talk about your insider info.

To be fair it looks like they were in the middle of the season when the pandemic hit so I guess they've got to fill the airwaves with something. This is the first episode that mentioned it. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

I read a few months ago that Tarek said there were four unaired episodes when the Covid shutdown hit. and prevented them from more filming.   The Master Class episodes are so lame, but better than nothing I guess.    Then, in a couple of weeks, it will be Flip or Flop's new season, with 15 or so episodes.      I don't like that the flippers can be totally incompetent, and still make a huge profit.    However, I'm guessing that some of the ones that really screwed up probably did get their price, but had to pay credits to get bad tiling, or other screw ups fixed.    I'm guessing that the downturn in some markets will eventually screw up the long time some people take to do flips, and lead to flops.     

I think they've always under reported credits that buyers demand to fix items, closing costs, staging, etc.    Unless Tarek or one of the flippers handles a sale without their commission, then that's another cost that's often under estimated.    

I can't believe the flippers on tonight's new episode.   They are beginners, spent way too much, and bought a huge three story house in Pasadena.    They managed to screw up every single part of the project, and after working for months the house is still studs, open floor trenches, and nothing being done.     They worked for months, finishing nothing, and seem to have zero emotion or commitment to finishing this.   Their idea of moving the kitchen, and putting atrium windows is so bizarre.   If they ever get to the point of actually doing the atrium windows, I'm betting that something from the hill above will come crashing through.    After seeing this episode, I wouldn't touch that house with a 10 foot pole.    They didn't even pick out tile or flooring until Tarek came along with the wife to go to the tile store.     The husband wanted the cheapest, low grade tile, instead of something nice, and more appropriate for the estimated selling price.    In a multimillion dollar house, you don't cheap out and use the cheapest, ugliest subway tile you can get for a kitchen back splash.  Of course at the rate they're going, they'll never finish anyway. 

 I usually hope the flippers will make a profit, but with this couple, I don't.    They must have thought this was an easy way to make money, and they were so wrong.    I thought it was interesting that only the husband showed up at the end, so the wife really lost interest. 

They're doing the Master Class of the Hoarder house, where the wife is going to be her own general contractor.   This is the one that ends up with three or four varying shades, of kitchen counter top.   This happened because the couple were never at the house supervising installations.  This is also the master bathroom where they put another door in the first floor ensuite, and the doors actually hit.    I can't believe these fools actually sold this house, and made a profit.   However, since the closing costs are so under reported, I'm betting they barely broke even.   Even if the wife/realtor was a dual agent, there is probably a payment to the broker for the sale too.   

The couple looked upset when Tarek said to get rid of the smell from the hundreds of rabbits taken from the house, they would have to removed the floor and subfloor, and take all of the drywall and trim up to three feet.    Then in the bonus scene, the flippers are complaining about the smell from the rabbits, and the couple tried to save money by not taking up the subfloor.     I can't believe anyone bought that house, and I wonder if it still smells?   The house sold for over asking, and the couple made over $110k profit (I'm betting minus fixing the counter tops, and whatever else the buyers demanded they fix, or give credits for). 

Next week's new episode of this is an hour long, so I suspect it's the season ender (Flip or Flop starts on 15 October in the same time slot), and the proposal episode.  

Edited October 3, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[LittleIggy]

Pasadena: I thought that house was awesome with great potential. Too bad those idiots bought it. 

[sempervivum]

Pasadena flippers- I missed the beginning of this, so I'm wondering what they did for a living. They seemed totally inept, yet not very concerned about the money they were hemorrhaging.

I loved when the husband got all excited (the only time during the whole show) about his brilliant plan to remove the main staircase and relocate it to the OUTSIDE of the house in a GLASS addition! Tarek looked at him stone-faced and snapped 'No'. 😄

Despite being slapped down by Tarek several times, they still acted so pleased with themselves when he came back expecting to see some progress, and instead they handed him their new blueprints for the goofy changes to the kitchen and master suite.

I'm sure he'll pull their fat from the fire in the 2nd episode, but I'd actually love to see them fail, they deserve it.

[LittleIggy]

I don’t think they said what those Pasadena idiots did for a living.

[CrazyInAlabama]

I'm guessing any follow up with the Pasadena people will be another 30 minutes of nothing.    My guess is if they ever do anything with that house it will be to  sell it to another flipper to actually do the work.    Whatever the two flippers did for a living, I'm guessing the money they're spending on that flip was just extra.     As Tarek said, they had no passion for the house project, and apparently thought that any crazy idea they had for the flip would be magically done.   

I think the kitchen move, and atrium windows were stupid.   I wonder how long before the exposed kitchen atrium windows end up with a tree branch through it?   Or a tree from the steep hillside next door topples over, and hits the house?     The outside glass staircase was even stranger, and if it was an added form of egress, it would have made sense.   Removing the interior stairs was idiotic.   Can you imagine buying a house where the only way between floors is a clear glass enclosed staircase?    

Edited October 3, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[iMonrey]

Quote

The wife wanted the cheapest, low grade tile, instead of something nice, and more appropriate for the estimated selling price.    In a multimillion dollar house, you don't cheap out and use the cheapest, ugliest subway tile you can get for a kitchen back splash. 

To be fair, it was Kenny who wanted cheap subway tile, not Somer. 

That said? They're both idiots. They must have a lot of money to burn. This was the most colossal flop we've ever seen. At the 25 minute mark I was wondering how the hell they were going to wrap this up in five minutes.

I think they were right about the master bedroom needing to be reconfigured, although the layout of that entire house was odd because of the way the building was shaped. But moving the kitchen into the living room was idiotic. This is a really upscale, if odd, million dollar home. You don't want to walk in the front door and right into the kitchen! What the hell were they thinking?

Quote

I don’t think they said what those Pasadena idiots did for a living.

They said they ran their own business. Past tense, if I'm not mistaken. Probably right into the ground.

Edited October 2, 2020 by iMonrey

[CrazyInAlabama]

I fixed who was at fault on the tile.      I can only imagine what a house finished to their vision would look like.   

Spending all of that money to move the kitchen was ridiculous, but the strangest idea was the outside staircase.   They were the most passive flippers ever.    They should have bankrolled a real flipper, and just stayed out of the flipping business.     

Another article about the show says Kenny sold his insurance business, and Somer is a 'design enthusiast'.     

If they were acting as their own general contractors, then the flippers either needed to remove the debris, or hire someone to do it.   They also needed to hire a real contractor to oversee everything, hire subs, etc.    

Edited October 7, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[MakingBacon]

The flippers in Pasadena didn’t seem to care so much about the delays so I assumed money wasn’t an issue. Maybe they won the lottery and this was their play money or maybe they actually inherited the house so it didn’t matter what happened to it. I don’t get why a beginner flipper would start with such an expensive house, especially when they were only looking to make a $200k+ profit. Seems like they could have made more than that on only a couple of flips at the same time with less money spent.

What drives me crazy is that the house was already pretty nice. It was likely already livable. It didn’t need too much work other than an updated kitchen, bathrooms, fireplace and the stairs. The same generic work most of the flips require. The rooms were a nice size and the huge windows we were great. The house reminded me of the something in the hollywood hills that’s all glass with amazing views. 

[Grrarrggh]

On 10/2/2020 at 9:44 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

Spending all of that money to move the kitchen was ridiculous, but the strangest idea was the outside staircase.   They were the most passive flippers ever.    

I get what they wanted to do with the staircase, and it would have looked awesome. But it wasn't worth it in that house. If it was a $5-10m house sure, an architectural detail like that would be worth it. 

[lynxfx]

Just watched the Pasadena couple. Wow not much I can add that hasn't been already said. One thing that really irritated me was how messy the work site was. They kept doing demo but would just leave piles of debris everywhere. Wtf?!?

I really wonder what these people do on a day to day basis. They are their own site manager so they should be working with their subcontractors daily and at least one hanging out on site to keep work going. Tarek is right that they are pushovers and being taken advantage of. 

Preview to the engagement special. My wife and I had that spa to ourselves as well. Only reason was that no one else happened to be there that weekend. It was pretty cool. We stayed at the Wrigley mansion. I recommend it if you ever want a fun getaway that isn't crazy expensive. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

I'm watching some of the marathon, leading to the season two finale (yes, only four new episodes).   Next week starts the new season of Flip or Flop. 

   The house that had the fire damage was bizarre.   I had an attic fire about 10 years ago, and something was very off about the time line on that one.   My contractor and the insurance adjuster were there the next morning, not months later.    The son on that one sleeping until noon was ridiculous.

The mother and son duo where she was apparently financing everything by taking extra shifts at her nursing job kept that business going.    I hated her son, and Tarek were talking as if she was goofing off, when she was probably bankrolling everything.  

The last new on with Sherry in Rancho Palos Verdes would be better if it was the entire hour.    How does she think flipping a few condos equips her to do a million dollar property just stuns me.   How can you even get permits without approved engineering, and architectural drawings?   I wonder if she has all of the permits? 

Sherry the flipper is not impressing me right now.   She went on vacation?   That's so strange.   

It's just like last week's flip in Pasadena, no sense of urgency, refuse to listen to Tarek, not getting a contractor, and not overseeing the small amount of work that's actually accomplished.    The tile work is horrible.   

For a million dollar plus house, the kitchen doesn't look any better than the generic kitchens in cheaper flips.    I can't believe they just patched that awful tile in the master bath, and the rainhead shower is so low.     I don't think anyone who watches this show will touch that house, it's going to need a lot of work.   I wonder what other mistakes were made, and drywalled over?    I couldn't believe her first kitchen design was with the washer dryer in the kitchen itself.   

I hate that she sold for almost $200k over asking, and I hope the buyers got a lot of credits to fix all of the bad work, like the master shower.  

So many lazy people who think that flipping is a gold mine.     The only reason I can even watch this is that I'm guessing that the credits given to buyers aren't mentioned, the carrying costs are a lot more than admitted, and I bet that the profits aren't as big as the simplified profit, and costs presented.  I'm guessing that with the expenses we don't hear about, that the rookies are lucky to break even.  

I have to applaud Tarek, his kids are wearing life jackets.    

Congratulations to Tarek and Heather, and I hope they'll be very happy together.  

Edited October 11, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[LittleIggy]

I recorded the season finale so I could ff through Tarek and his girlfriend/now fiancée. I’m interested only in the flip. That woman was almost as pathetic as the Pasadena couple. Why do these idiots ignore Tarek’s advice about hiring a GC and an architect. That view was stunning. Anyway, the recording cut off before the end. 😡 Did she sell the house?

[MsTree]

2 hours ago, LittleIggy said:

Did she sell the house?

Yes, 2.1M (or so they say)

[MakingBacon]

I call BS on this episode. No way did the flipper buy this house for $920k. I think this was either a house she already owned for awhile, lived in, inherited and/or received as part of a divorce settlement. This was not a house that was in such a bad shape that it would be sold for so little but she could Later make a more than $700k profit for a flipper who didn’t actually seem interested in flipping. Other than the people with the smaller home flips, I think a lot of these people aren’t actually purchasing these homes to flip. They are just getting rid of something they already own so they are in no rush to finish the job and recoup any money put into it. 

Edited October 10, 2020 by MakingBacon

[CrazyInAlabama]

Yes, it was on the market for $1.9+ just under $2 million, and sold for $2.1 million.   However, I'm betting that as Bacon said, there is no way she spent almost a million on buying that place.    I'm also guessing that there were huge credits for the master bathroom shower tile, and other screw ups.   I wouldn't even touch that house, even if I could afford it.  The finishes you could see were bad enough, but who knows what flaws are behind the drywall? 

I hated the kitchen. The cabinets didn't look high quality, and the finished kitchen looked like every other flip home I've seen in the past few years, and didn't look equivalent to the high price of the house.        I've seen more high end cabinets and kitchens on some of the higher priced Flip or Flop remodels.   Even if a flipper doesn't know how to design, then you go to every open house in the area, look at online real estate ads, and see what features are put into houses in the price you're shooting for.      Since most of the flip houses want to appeal to the biggest buying pool, then you want to match what the most recent renovations in the local area look like, with cabinet styles, and color palates that sold.   

My guess is that the sale price is legit, but any credits, commissions, etc. are taken out of the sellers portion, and don't effect the overall sale price, just the profit the flipper makes.  I absolutely agree that this was a free house to the flipper, so she knew she would get a lot of money out of it.   

 

Edited October 12, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[lynxfx]

Found the Rancho Palos Verdes place on zillow. Despite the completely unrealistic story it seems to checkout. It really did sell in Nov 2019 for just $920k. The only prior sale info is from 1985 at $200k though so I'm going to guess it is a family property and they under valued it for her to buy.  It also has a lot of land down the hillside.

She got it listed on 5-31-20 for $1,940,000. Final sale was $2,037,000 on 7-31-20 with 3 pulled offers the first month. That is a surprisingly quick sale. The show is claiming $2.1m so it is possible that there were credits that brought the price down. I don't believe credits show up bundled into the sale price as that would affect the commissions. Still that is a monster profit for such a horribly executed flip which only took 5 months to get done in the end.

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/2736-San-Ramon-Dr-Rancho-Palos-Verdes-CA-90275/21352904_zpid/

[CrazyInAlabama]

Good sleuthing on that one.     You can still see the sod lines, because they didn't put it in early enough, and water enough for the sod to grow together.      For staging they should have rented something more high end, not patio furniture that looks cheap.      I realize they also have the hillside, but I would want a fence keeping the top of the yard separated from the hillside below.     I can see a kid going right off that hillside.    The people looking at the open house that were talking about the end of the yard needing a fence, and then sending their kid out to look at the view on the edge of the yard was very scary.

I bet the only person that does anything with the super steep part of the yard is whoever mows, and maintains it.   

 Is this the Pasadena remodel from two weeks ago?  https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1299-Wellington-Ave_Pasadena_CA_91103_M14894-44016      for just under $2 million    If it is the bedrooms look small, the kitchen looks OK.     If they paid $1.2 million for it, with renovation costs, carrying costs, assessments, etc. then $700k won't be a profit for them after commissions, and everything else, plus it's still on the market after almost a month.   Time for a price reduction. 

A big mistake in my view is that the cabinet for the fridge is too small.    For a $2 mil house, there is nowhere to put an extra fridge, or freezer, and the fridge nook looks standard size.   If someone wants one of those huge fridges, then they will have to rip out cabinets to do it.  

Edited October 13, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[lynxfx]

Yeah the hill isn't exactly usable space. There is a path that leads down so I guess someone could make a nice hidden sitting area down there. The bonus is that you'll never have anyone block your views. RPV and PVE are my favorite areas around LA if I was to actually buy a home there. You can get a lot of bang for your buck there compared to your typical highend LA real estate. 

[iMonrey]

Hm. I seemed to have missed the much-promoted season finale with Tarek proposing. I only got "Master Class" episodes on my DVR. 

Quote

So many lazy people who think that flipping is a gold mine.  

Well HGTV is responsible for a lot of that. When they feature idiots who don't know what they're doing and yet miraculously end up with a huge profit in only half an hour, people are bound to get the wrong impression. It also happens to be exactly what Home Depot and Lowes want people to think.

[lynxfx]

On 10/11/2020 at 5:32 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

 Is this the Pasadena remodel from two weeks ago?  https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1299-Wellington-Ave_Pasadena_CA_91103_M14894-44016 

Yeah it does look like it came out alright but you can never see the work quality from photos. 

So it took 4 extra months compared to the RPV one. That one had multiple offers the first month, this one has had nothing. It is a inique property but in a good way. All those levels plus only a covered car port for a garage. Not worth dumping $2m on. It took 6 months to sell to a flipper. 

[StatisticalOutlier]

On 10/13/2020 at 6:31 AM, PoshSprinkles said:

Re: The Pasadena house that wasn't finished on the episode but is now completed if you look on Realtor. 

Is that a return air vent directly in the middle of the kitchen???

Looks like a supply vent to me, and it looks like the only one in the kitchen.  A couple of pictures later I see what looks like a return air vent under the stairs.

Quote

That's where I disagree. I don't think the white/grey open concept DOES appeal to the widest buying pool. I think these people have been brainwashed into thinking they're supposed to like it so they claim to. 

I'm ashamed to admit that I find it very appealing.  I haven't gone so far as to picture what it would be like to live in, but visually, I love it.  It makes me glad I'm not in the market for a house right now because I would have to work hard to overcome its appeal.

[CrazyInAlabama]

The Pasadena house has apparently switched realtors.   The price started just under $2 million (in September), dropped to just under $1.9, then with a new realtor went back to just under $1.99 million in mid-October. 

https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1299-Wellington-Ave_Pasadena_CA_91103_M14894-44016

The pictures seem blurry this time.     I also hate the breakfast bar, because it looks like it's in the path from stairs to kitchen around the island/peninsula.   

The interview with Tarek from a couple of months ago said there were only four filmed, but unaired episodes.   So the Pasadena one, the Palos Verdes one, and two others they showed as Season 2, combined with the other 'enhanced' Season 1 with little blurbs added in them, and I guess that was season 2.      I'm sure they completed F or F months ago, and with Tarek's 'we buy anything for cash' section to his business, there should be a lot of potential flips to supply their show, and the flipping business.   

Edited November 1, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[lynxfx]

1 hour ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

The pictures seem blurry this time.

Looks like the realtor copied the thumbnails from the previous listing and re-upload them as the full res. Rookie mistake or a realtor that doesn't understand technology. Surprisingly quite common. I've even seen it on some listings on Million Dollar Listing LA. They spend $5k on a pro photographer and then have highly compressed photos on their website. 

Were there going to be any more episodes? Or are they waiting for after Flip or Flop airs their season?

[sempervivum]

I wonder if the Pasadena house includes the hillside (beyond the retaining wall)? Much of the view will be compromised if someone decides to build on that hill. Maybe it's state owned or zoned not buildable, but that would be the first thing I'd check out. It also looks like prime landslide and fire area.

[StatisticalOutlier]

18 hours ago, lynxfx said:

Looks like the realtor copied the thumbnails from the previous listing and re-upload them as the full res. Rookie mistake or a realtor that doesn't understand technology. Surprisingly quite common. I've even seen it on some listings on Million Dollar Listing LA. They spend $5k on a pro photographer and then have highly compressed photos on their website.

Thanks for posting this.  All the pictures were blurry on my PC screen, and I couldn't believe it because really??  But then I shrank the entire page, and once it got really small, the pictures were clear.  So, thumbnails.  That's ridiculous. 

If I were trying to sell something, I'd put the website advertising it up on every device I could get my hands on to make sure it looked good everywhere.  I'd like to think that blurry pictures would make me decide not to buy a particular house, but it's definitely likely to make me get frustrated trying to look at the listing, and possibly go away at that point.

[CrazyInAlabama]

When I put my previous house on the market, the realtor had a professional photographer she worked with.   Then in a couple of days she sent the photos to me before she posted it.   When she posted them on her website, it automatically posted the listing on realtor, zillow, and a bunch of others.   

I couldn't believe the blurry photos on the Pasadena house, for something they're trying to sell for almost $2 million.   I wonder if it was deliberate, to make buyers schedule a showing to see what the place looks like in person?     I thought the breakfast bar was absolutely in the traffic pattern, the kitchen seemed small, and the master bedroom was the only decent size bedroom.  Even if I had the money, I wouldn't buy a house with the hillside right there.   

Edited November 5, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[CrazyInAlabama]

I'm watching the rerun marathon on HGTV, and there are so many flippers that screw up constantly, and still make a killing in the market in the L.A. area.        The woman who has the huge house with the spectacular view, and screwed up everything, and took a vacation in the middle of the flip, was irritating.   I hate that she was lucky enough to sell for so much over asking, but that was because of the market.      There was a lot of the work in that house that I'm sure the new owner had to rip out and redo.    The show claims she sold for $2.1 million, which was a profit of $700k or so.   This was also the episode where Tarek proposed to Heather on Catalina Island. 

The second season starts airing next Thursday, the 16th in the 8 Central, 9 Eastern slot.   

At least the first episode is an hour long.  I'm hoping it's not an entire season of half flipping with novices, and the other half of the show engagement and wedding stuff.   However, I'd rather see Heather, than Christina on anything. 

Edited September 9, 2021 by CrazyInAlabama

[Gam2]

I much prefer this show to Flip or Flop because I cannot stand that phony, Christina. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

So, episode 1 season 2, Tarek goes house hunting, boring.     But his foolish flippers from Vegas certainly hit every stereotype of rookies, but they've been flipping for years.   I'm guessing made up drama, because they really didn't show any 'Vegas contractors' doing anything to the house.     I hate that people can go so far over budget, and still score a bonanza.      

They also did an update from the multistory house in Pasadena, Kenny and Summer, from last season, the flippers put way too much time and money into it, they finally finished, and it sat on the market without offers for at least a month.    The husband had sold his business, and decided he wanted to be a flipper, and the wife was an amateur designer.    The finished product was not impressive, bad tile jobs, the bedrooms were small for a house of that overall size.   The design, and floor plan was strange.    The flow on the living room/kitchen area was off, and the hillside with trees was right next to the house, so I'm guessing the glass atruim/sun room will need a lot of glass replaced from fallen branches.   THe flippers even put two different colors of gold fixtures in the main bathroom en suite. Having the stairs outside to the front door without a handrail would be a deal breaker for me, I think that's totally unsafe.    I bet they lost their shirts on the project.       They went from $2 million list, to $1.9 list, after a month on the market with no offers.  Since their break even was about $1.7 million, plus continuing carrying costs, and I'm sure they will have to do some credits for the bad finishes,,I doubt they will make a profit..    

Update, the Pasadena house is still for sale, for $1.850 million, and it's been for sale for over a year, it's been taken off and put back on the market.  I think they said they bought for $1.2 million, so with renovation, permits, and carrying costs, it's not going to be profitable.    It hasn't been offered for $2 million like Tarek said since Fall of 2020.   

https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1299-Wellington-Ave_Pasadena_CA_91103_M14894-44016

At least this set of pictures are in focus.   Since break even was $1.6 mil. or $1.7 mil, my guess is they'll lose money on it.    There are a lot of reasons I wouldn't buy this house, even if I could afford it.    The steep hill on the lot, having to go up the outside stairs to the front door (there may be internal stairs from the car port), but that's still hauling everything up stairs, at least a full flight.    The bedroom are small, except the owner's suite, the kitchen bar is in the main walkway on the main floor, the only bathroom that seemed big was the en suite, and I don't like the slippery looking tile.   All of your lot is very steep, keeping up with the tree maintenance will be a nightmare.   How many times will you have to replace glass on the kitchen/atrium/sunroom over the years from tree branches, or entire trees falling on it?   

I was stunned when Tarek said the outside stairs to the front door without the handrail was a smart move.  I can't believe they got a certificate of occupancy for that set of stairs, without a handrail on either side, and if you fall, you end up a couple of feet down on the concrete planters.   If I was house hunting, I wouldn't even go in the house.   They should have enclosed the garage, and put a door up. 

There are 29 competing homes on the MLS in Pasadena, they have flatter lots, and don't have small rooms, and have better floorplans.   There's another one with a much flatter lot, that is very comparable square foot, with a much better floor plan, and for a comparable price, and there's actually a flat yard, with a nice garage.   The style is very comparable too, plus the competing property has a second floor deck, back and front yard landscaping, and areas to enjoy.   The Pasadena flipper's house didn't have much of what buyers are looking for apparently, because even in a booming seller's market, this house has been on the market forever, and had numerous price reductions.

I think the Pasadena house included the hillside, and the front area, because I think it was an 1/3 acre or so, all vertical, and I bet that was the hillside, and front bushy area too.   I can't imagine what that home and property are like during a heavy downpour. 

The flippers picked the wrong location, the wrong house, and should have saved their money for some other business, because as house flippers they're never going to make money.   

I wonder if the local code enforcement inspectors for the city or county saw that episode?    I can't believe that staircase without a handrail was code. 

The woman from Season one that had the huge house on the hillside, sold for twice the profit anyone else had (over $700k), and now has relocated to Atlanta with her husband, and wants to flip there.   

I think Legacy (the ballroom dancer pro with his flipping partner), will be on this week (he's at least making an appearance on a second flip this season).  I hate that they made so many huge mistakes, and they still scored a big profit.  

Edited September 19, 2021 by CrazyInAlabama