Shangrilala

Omg I flove Sharon. That post is so nuanced, it is absolutely perfect. Translation - okay little girls, listen to the advice of somebody much older than you and much wiser than your momager. Go back to the damn sandbox where you belong.

Or perhaps one of us works for Life & Style...the plot thickens. I liked that story about North and her jealousy issues. She was only 2.5 years old. And I'm sure Kim's statement about North pushing him around all the time wasn't a literal "She pushes and punches him" all the time as opposed to, she takes his toys, she bosses him around, and yes, she has probably hit out of frustration or jealousy. That's hardly uncommon stuff when you have a jealous older sibling. And I had heard of that juicebox trick before. Overall I thought the story was kind of cute and relatable. Keep in mind that because Kim breastfed North it was probably easier to breastfeed Saint in that she knew what to expect and better manage things. She might pump and dump when traveling, and keep a stash of breastmilk in a freezer for when she's out of town. And those stories about the breastfeeding could have been when Saint was just a newborn and she was still at home with him. It doesn't necessarily mean it happened when he was 6, 7 or 8 months old. It could have been when he was 3 or 4 weeks.

Ever wonder we're still following these people? https://www.thrillist.com/entertainment/nation/why-kim-kardashian-is-still-famous

Wait I don't get it. That's not Caitlyn?

Those restrictions are basic pregnancy guidelines - except in this case they are in contract form. THe only one that jumps out is the sexual activity 3 weeks prior to implantation and then during implantation. And that's just biological logic there.

She really is a cutie. And...i also like the Arthur George socks. *sheepishly slinking into a corner now*

You and me both, my friend, you and me both. Who ever called drug use "dark things"? No one.

I thought all of the women looked strung out. Jezebels is a brothel, nothing more, nothing less, where the Aunt's are the pimps to a certain extent. I wonder if the girls are drugged at the "jezebel's center," or wherever they took Moira, and turned into "controlled" addicts, or if they self-medicate to make it through each night.

I actually wondered if the entire situation with June was a complete repeat of the situation with their prior handmaid. Something about the way he pulled her down and held her made me think that he'd been involved with her as well. And as he pulls away from June, it was an effort to not get too involved (no hurt or guilt), but also to try and spare June any conflict or further emotional turmoil that could lead her to do the same thing. That's interesting. Except I don't think the Commander truly recognizes June as having value. He can...just get another handmaid. He did before. Granted, I don't think he would apply that logic to anybody but himself, but in his own case, he's above everything.

But keep in mind that a woman can only get pregnant when she is ovulating, and that's really just approximately a 36 hour time period in any given month. The ceremony is tied to that time period and only that time period. And we saw that in the show - when the doctor offered to try to impregnate her, she was sent to him because the ceremony was that night, and as he examined her, he commented that she was soft, and now would be the time to do it. Not to go to far down the biology route, but that was in reference to her cervix - when a woman is ovulating, her cervix is high and soft. When she's not, the cervix becomes more firm again. So it ultimately doesn't matter if June and Nick have sex every day, or if the Commander rapes her 1 week after the ceremony, or if they even used technology to determine the age of the fetus and when it was conceived. Even with the technology, any pregnancy and conception "date" still would go to at time when the ceremony is also taking place because it's the only time of month she can get pregnant (or a couple of days before because sperm lives in the body for up to 5 days). And there are ways to track when a woman is ovulating, without bringing in the technology, and once you know that cycle, you can continue to track it in the homes with the martha's, wives, etc., being in the know. It's not just June's body that is at the mercy of everybody, it is her fertility, her cycle, her womanhood. All of her "worth" is tied up in 36 hours of an egg releasing. There are of course women who have a cycle that isn't quite as regular, but I actually doubt that they would have been made handmaids because Gilead didn't just need fertile women, they needed "dependably" fertile women. I think I finally have my answer to why June and Luke don't make sense for me. For one, I don't think it's uncommon for an outgoing, strong, intelligent woman to sometimes marry a man who is kind of opposite of that. But in terms of the idea of love, the idea of a soul mate and why these two came together...I'd argue that Moira is her soul mate -- her equal in intellect, in personality, in interest, etc. We've seen more emotion out of June when she's with Moira than we've seen with Luke. The idea that the bond of a close female friendship can transcend the bond of a romantic relationship isn't unheard of. And I wonder if Atwood purposely created the character of Moira in that way as another way to examine the different roles that women can play in each other's lives and the value of female companionship. If there is a love story to be found in this show, it's not June and Luke or June and Nick. It's Moira and June...it's just not a romantic love story. The Commander is evil. He is vile. And every time they do the camera shot where you can only see the whites of his eyes, I get completely freaked out. The way he talked about "the collection" of women, his shaving of June's legs, the way it is all a game to him - he's not just above the law, he created the law - is so fucked up and just a brilliant interpretation of the character of the book. In the book I always thought of the commander as weary, his breaking of the rules as some indication that he didn't like the world he had created but was forced to live by it. This interpretation? Truly sinister. I don't understand what I'm supposed to do with Nick. Do Serena and Fred know he is an eye but they know that his loyalty is to them, first and foremost? Why aren't the wives allowed in the city formerly known as Boston? Makes me wonder what else is going on there during the day. One thing that the book constantly repeats is how all of this is new to this generation, but it will become normal in time. Seeing June go from red shift, to sequined dress, and back to red shift -- which felt "normal" to you? Well done, show, well done.

It occured to me today, that when they blew up the white house, it must have included every member of cabinet, because there is a presidential succession line that I believe goes right down to the secretary of veteran affairs? We have systems in place to ensure the government keeps going should something of this magnitude happen. And let's not forget the shadow government, which I assume still exists, although perhaps not to the same extent that it did post 9/11.

It's interesting, I'm rereading the book and I just past the part where Offred envisions what happened to Luke - either dead in a ditch or in an empty cell. Yet everybody assumes, given what we know of the regime, that he is dead. But I don't think the story ever actually confirms that. So I guess the show took some liberties here. Unless confirmation of his death comes later and I just haven't gotten to it yet. I only remember

.I won't lie, I think part of it is the actor and his delivery. I'm not a huge fan (as opposed to the commander who makes my skin crawl and takes the role to such a sinister level, beyond what I ever thought in the book - mucho kudos to the actor). I don't know what I envisioned for Luke, but this definitely isn't it. I want to reach into the screen and shake him, every step of the way. Luke is probably a tough role to play I imagine. What exactly are you supposed to do with him? I don't like the portrayal, but I have no suggestions either.

I thought the very last scene was the best we've seen from the actor (part of why I don't like Luke could have to do with acting choices). You know that when they handed that envelope he thought she was dead, then realizing she was alive, what she asked of him ("save hannah" - as a mom, THAT is the point that made me cry), but back to the sheer relief that she was alive and there was just the slightest glimmer of hope. The actor did a good job with that. Timeline question: they say June is 31. It's been 3 years. That means she was 28 when she fled and Hannah was supposed to be 5 at the time. That means she bad Hannah at we, but was pregnant at 22. So....when did she meet and marry Luke? Thinking they should have made her a few years older here. She met Luke as a professional, not a student. Right?

I've started reading the book again, and a few things jumped out at me. We know that Canada is still Canada -- and that they were hesitant to engage their brutal and militarily mighty neighbor to the south. They say that in the "q&a" section of the book. But I noticed that Offred talks about some type of military upheaval that has happened in latin america. It's just a reference, where she says "after the xxxxx seized control of Columbia." towards the beginning when she sees they have oranges in the store. Do we know much about the rest of the world in the book? Was Gilead just part of a global upheaval? Something similar to the arab spring but more widespread? Or -- was that just a historical note of the time it was written because central american crises that started in the late 70s? Looking for both a book expert and historian on this one, I guess. Watching the show and seeing that Mexico is willing to trade handmaids, I wonder if I missed something in the book that the problems that led to the rise of Gilead were also on a global level.

That's an interesting article. But tying it back to the novel and the show, I always assumed that one of the problems was that what we knew-- or thought we knew-- about fertility hadn't been successful in solving the problem. Hence the rise of this kind religious zealoutry around fertility...everything else had failed. Hence their argument that it was a punishment from god, hence their belief that Gilead was the answer, and by forcing a group of women into reproductive slavery it would eventually lead to a time where the turmoil and stresses that might contribute to fertility issues are taken away for them, leaving their bodies to heal and do what they are supposed to do. Hence Aunt Lydia's "it will become normal" talk, which I believe is abbreviated from the book where she actually says "it will be harder for you, the next generations will be easier because this will be their world," an extension of her "Freedom to and freedom from" philosophy. Am I supposed to respond to articles and the show here? Or does that type of discussion happen elsewhere?

There were so many Battlestar similarities - the photo wall on Galactica, finding refuge in the bombed out cafe in Caprica. And I'm sorry, but pre-mayday reminded me of The Wish in Buffy with giles, oz, and others rescuing people with the school bus. It jumped out so strongly in both cases I wondered if there are people on the Handmaids Tale production tem that worked on either of those shows. Luke. Oh Luke. The urban intellectual who's really not all that enlightened but hides that fact behind his black rimmed glasses, basic clothing, and long pauses between sentences to appear deep. NYC is filled with Lukes. Then shit gets too real and all they can do is....provide long pauses between sentences. Let's face it. June had the connection to the guy who was getting them out. Luke was sitting there making them wait for visas for a country that no longer existed. Kind of like Scarlett O'Haras father thinking confederate bonds still had value after the south lost the war. But he was losing his mind. Luke was an idiot. I think he has wised up now in current day, but that was frustrating to watch to the point that it lacked common sense. GTFO of Gilead asap, and it should have happened the day they gunned down government.

This. Domestic feminism only works if people choose the lifestyle. And the people who choose the lifestyle are able to enjoy making that choice because of those who fought for women to have these choices to begin with. I have trouble feeling sympathy for Serena Joy. She may or may not realize it, but she formed her opinions from the standpoint of privilege - she lived in a society where she was able to embrace her views, speak out on her views, publish her views. She can hide behind her standpoint that "this is god's way" but she doesn't seem to understand that the society she helped destroy is the same society that allowed her to SAY "this is god's way" in the first place. She helped create this world. She's not a victim. Remove that choice, and what do you have? Oppression. Simple as that. And in the case of Gilead, brutal oppression. So, I know that by making Luke alive, they are going to expand the story line in a different direction. I just really hope they are careful how they do this. As somebody said at the end, June's monologue felt very hollywood. The entire ending felt hollywood. I think there are so many things about Gilead to explore as it is, weaving the characters into the story, I'm not convinced that that having Luke be alive is the right way to go. In the book

The sock stocking things are odd. But the dress is striking. And I like that she wears the dress, it could have easily gone the other way.

I don't get it. I watched clips of Kim on Ellen and I thought she looked fantastic. Her hair, makeup, dress, etc. She had personality, and despite saying "like" a million times, she was well spoken and articulate. I thought it was one of her better interviews, especially in terms of her physical appearance. And then we get this. I dont get how she goes from looking great one minute to 3 times her size the next.

I don't think any reaction would be outright directed at Nick but rather his wife for suggesting that he is incapable of impregnating June and I don't think it would be just be mad. Remember...men aren't infertile in Gilead. Women are barren. And it was the Commander who played a major role in making creating this world. And considering what a sick fuck that bastard is, how he thinks genital mutilation of a woman is a "very small" problem to take care of, his look while he was raping and violating June, I don't think it ends at mad. There are myriad reasons why Serena had that conversation, whispered in the garden. She may be a wife, but essentially doesn't have any rights either. Not that I have much sympathy or her. She's vile. I know it was meant as symbolism but I wondered if there were elements of "gilead" underground lifestyle that existed at that point in time and they were just getting bolder.

I had real issues with that sex scene at the end. I didn't consider it to be pornographic, that's not what I found offensive. And I can't say I was offended by it. It was just so deeply desperate and sad. Was it supposed to be empowering? I suppose that's what they were going for but it didn't come across that way to me. It made me think that Offred has a death wish. Maybe her making that choice and decision, knowing the potential end result, is what makes it empowering, but it didn't go that far for me. It was just depressing, desperate, and broken to the point that I could barely watch it. Granted, there's a lot of this show I can barely watch, but if this was supposed to make me feel that Offred had somehow found some strength, it was lost on me. And Alexis Bledel lost me during that car scene. She didn't look invincible. She looked like Rory Gilmore had run into a garbage can because her boyfriend had distracted her while driving.

In the book We haven't seen this in the show yet, and we might not. But I hope they do because I think it just adds to the desperation of these women and their fear of repercussion over something so trivial.

I haven't gotten all the way through this episode yet, but for those commenting about Serena staying in the room with Nick and June, I think we shouldn't forget that she probably has to. Otherwise her plan could easily fall apart. I think Serena knows that it might not happen right away (this is her second or third handmaid?), and that Offred and Nick having sex may have to be an ongoing occurrence. She and Offred can enter Nick's apartment and have a reason, but Offred certainly can't be seen coming and going on her own. Even if it is for a quick 10 minutes. Now for a dumb mechanics question. How does this work exactly? I mean during both the ceremony and the scene in Nick's, you have June basically lie down and pull up her skirt. There's no foreplay, no arousal, nothing. How do the men just perform on command? Even if we are to believe that the commanders get themselves going a bit before going into the ceremony, there's that time period of prayer (there's nothing better to turn you on like some twisted Gilead old testament!), and eventually they move to a bedroom (or does the ceremony take place in the bedroom? I thought the prayers were in a different room). But besides. Serena and June go up to Nick and Serena says, go ahead. And poof. Nick is up and going? In what is quite possibly the least arousing situation humanly possible? I know in a prior episode we show that the commander has some trouble with performance, but I'm surprised that's not an every time kind of thing. When I saw the preview of the commander talking about wanting to make a better world, I thought it was said with an element of regret. Clearly I couldn't have been more off-base. There's a special place in hell for that man.

Right, I remember that part. They blamed middle eastern terrorists when it turned out to be a homegrown coup - the book doesn't get into that much other than to say that they gunned down congress (I always assumed they basically massacred everybody during a state of the union, or maybe I read that?...hmmm...where's Kiefer Sutherland when you need him?) and they only really give a one line nod to the terrorists in the context that nobody thought to question and they let fear take over while they slowly stripped away rights. Atwood sums it up pretty quickly in the book, if I recall and on the show they cover it in the conversation between Moira and June. But when "they" take over for security of the country...how did they come to be at such a substantial size? I always assumed that a new regime took over entirely. For example, Offred says in the show as she exits her office that she doesn't think that's the army, she thinks it is a "new kind of army." Did she mean same people, new mission and directives? I always assumed it was entirely new regime. A new army -- soldiers who agreed with the so-called values of the Gilead leadership. Perhaps that's where I'm off. Maybe instead it was current military - the US army, navy, air force - doing their jobs and following orders of the new leadership. But we also know there is a war going on, so if that's the case, there were clearly divides in the military. So again, that brings me back to my question of how did so many people get behind this to begin with, not just to pull off the slaughter of the government, but to also enslave the american public into Gilead - how did they have so much might behind it from the get go? Perhaps I'm just too optimistic in my belief that at the end of the day, common decency wouldn't allow something like this to happen in a country that has enjoyed relative freedom for nearly 250 years. Afterall, optimism is a crucial survival mechanism.