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S05.E06: Chapter Eighty-Seven


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Jane struggles with giving Rafael his space after she discovers that he is hiding a secret. Jane and Michael uncover clues about what happened the day he "died." Petra wants to fit into JR's world and enlists Jane's help. After a few attempts to get back into the groove, Xo and Rogelio work together to try and find a new normal. Meanwhile, Alba confesses her feelings about Jorge.

Promo:

Original air date: 5/1/19

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(edited)

Thoughts:

  • I don't know who's in charge this season, but I'm really sick of all the characters having such shitty attitudes towards each other.
  • Oh, Raf's on anti-depressants, which cause mood changes, so I guess his nasty behavior from last week (and all weeks coming forward) is excused now 🙄
  • I'm assuming he's depressed because of Jane, right? She's the reason he breathes. All that time he waited for her husband to keel over, so he could finally shoot his shot was for nothing. He just can't live in a world where he is second choice again. How will he go on! (SN: In no way am I minimizing mental illness. This show just annoys me.)
  • Still no Michael and Ro reunion? No mention of one? I understand scheduling conflicts, but there is no reason it couldn't have happened off-screen.
  • The sex stuff was a bit forced imo.
  • Glad Alba is standing up for herself.
  • Pissed at how they're setting up Michael to be a jerk about the past, so there will be extra reasons if she decided to leave him.
  • Am I the only one that doesn't care about the Rose stuff anymore?
  • Let me guess, Michael is going to go into Witness Protection? 🙄
  • I thought he gave up the cop job because he failed the physical and didn't want to be relegated to desk duty because of the lack of excitement? I remember this because everyone was wondering why he would choose to pursue law when most of that involves sitting at a desk for long periods of time, but whatever. I guess it's Jane's fault now.
  • Annoyed at everyone shitting on Jane this episode and glad she set Petra straight.
  • Not a lot of Mateo today, which is always good.
  • I liked the twins. They're such good little actresses.
  • 5.19 is Michael and Jane's wedding anniversary. Also the last episode of the show.
  • Is the lighting weird this season to anyone else? Like there's some weird filter being applied in post or something?
  • Is Dennis working with Rose?
  • Next week in Montana. Michael: "Jane, move back with me. Mateo will love the fresh air!" /Jane: "I'm sorry, but I can't. I still love you, but we're not the same anymore. This would never work." *runs to Raf* "So, I've had my time with Michael, and I'm ready to choose you first now."/ Raf *happy*: "Oh, I love you so much!" *spins her around* "Just to be clear, this means I'm not second choice, right?" 🙄
Edited by MajesticMariposa
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Thanks for giving me a chuckle, Mariposa.

Because I am really struggling.  I’ve gone from not knowing what to feel, to feeling upset because it seems that  I’m just going to get a little taste of Michael before he’s snatched away forever. I will probably for real cry. 

I’m too mired in that to analyze other aspects of the show. 

Still love Petra.

Am enjoying Ivonne Coll, but the actor who plays Jorge is Terrible IMO.

To me the Ro/Xo storyline was ok. I don’t know how they could have done it better, honestly. 

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1 minute ago, BAH said:

Thanks for giving me a chuckle, Mariposa.

Because I am really struggling.  I’ve gone from not knowing what to feel, to feeling upset because it seems that  I’m just going to get a little taste of Michael before he’s snatched away forever. I will probably for real cry. 

I’m too mired in that to analyze other aspects of the show. 

Still love Petra.

Am enjoying Ivonne Coll, but the actor who plays Jorge is Terrible IMO.

To me the Ro/Xo storyline was ok. I don’t know how they could have done it better, honestly. 

You're welcome for the laugh! Glad I could bring joy to someone this evening.

I totally feel the same way. This season is making me mad and sad in a way I've never experienced with a show before, and I'm also struggling to process my feelings.

I love Petra too. Her attitude was just too much for me this episode.

The actor who plays Jorge does suck. He's too dry and stiff. I wonder if he's not used to this format of television?

The Ro/Xo stuff always seems after school special-y to me. Like, with the abortion. I'm glad they're bringing awareness to things, I just wish there was a smoother way to do it.

Where is everyone tonight? Usually there are more replies by now.

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(edited)

The best part of the episode was Petra and Jane dancing together. Though, I am glad that Jane called Petra out  on being a crappy friend.  

JR being ready to stand up to her friend about Petra gave me a sliver of hope that may be they can truly move past what has happened.  I want them to either move past it or breakup because Petra's behavior is starting to make me cringe.   She screwed up badly and she is truly trying. However, this episode made me realize that I can barely stand to watch her go to the lengths she is going through prove herself to JR and now JR's friends.

Tonight confirmed what I had suspected before about Michael becoming a hybrid of Jason/Michael.  It is good that Jane recognized that they had both changed.  Michael responding by essentially saying he feels the same about her as before just reminds me his behavior from earlier seasons which made me not like him and Jane together.  I feel that Jane despite her mixed feelings might have more clarity in this situation than he does and might be the only one to see that they are not longer compatible.

I am tired of Rose aka Sin Rostro.  I have been a fan of the actress since her Legend of the Seeker days, but even she cannot make me interested in what her character is up to now.

It bothered me that the first thought was that Rafael had a drug problem not that he was taking pills for a legitimate reason.  Though was he drinking those pills with alcohol last episode? That is usually not recommended.  

Edited by miasth
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(edited)

After school specially lol.  I hear that. They’re (Jaime/Andrea) really too good to be “used” for that IMO. 

I seriously have wondered if they have plucked the Jorge actor off the street.  Don’t know what his background is!

my husband and I both laughed out loud at Anna and Elsa’s scene—they are good indeed!

west coast hasn’t even watched.... seems like there’s always a delay on here...

Edited by BAH
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Well, I guess they are trying to say Michael and Jane are different people now and if he hadn’t ‘died’ they would have broken up cause he was a lying liar who lies? Ugh. 

Loved the opening with Jane the Smooth Operator.

This episode was better than last week, but I think they are heading towards ruining Michael.

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(edited)
3 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

Well, I guess they are trying to say Michael and Jane are different people now and if he hadn’t ‘died’ they would have broken up cause he was a lying liar who lies? Ugh. 

Loved the opening with Jane the Smooth Operator.

This episode was better than last week, but I think they are heading towards ruining Michael.

IKR. It’s really tough to swallow.

@miasth yeah I felt optimistic for jR and Petra, too. #silverlining

Edited by BAH
Obvious
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1 hour ago, MajesticMariposa said:
  • 5.19 is Michael and Jane's wedding anniversary. Is that the same date as the last episode of the season?

There are 100 episodes all together for Jane the Virgin, and this was chapter 87, so we have 13 more episodes so I don’t see how the show could end on 5/19. But I have seen 5/19 mentioned elsewhere as the end date, and am puzzled by it. 

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(edited)
9 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

There are 100 episodes all together for Jane the Virgin, and this was chapter 87, so we have 13 more episodes so I don’t see how the show could end on 5/19. But I have seen 5/19 mentioned elsewhere as the end date, and am puzzled by it. 

Just realized the confusion. 5.19 (Season 5, Episode 19) is the last episode number, not the date. Sorry, I was writing too quickly!

Edited by MajesticMariposa
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5 minutes ago, MajesticMariposa said:

Just realized the confusion. 5.19 (Season 5, Episode 19) is the last episode number, not the date. Sorry, I was writing too quickly!

Ah, that makes so much sense! Thanks!!!

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My problem with the whole "Jane and Michael are different people now so they shouldn't be together" thing is that I don't really feel that Jane is any different than she was four years ago.  She's still a mother of one who lives at her grandma's house (and only moves out when she has a guy to move in with, at no point has she ever been financially independent), she still works at the same hotel and writing is still just a side gig for her, not a full-time profession.  So what exactly has changed about Jane?  I guess all of her bad traits have been dialed up to 11 and her good traits have all but disappeared but that's really more due to crappy writing than actual character development.  

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Michael has had his memories back for how long now? And he still hasent interacted with Xo, Alba, or even his bestie Rogelio?! They talk about him, but apparently no one actually wants to talk to him or see how he might be doing.  Mateo just hates him now, and he haven't even seen him reunite with his parents, its just been his partner,who actually does seem somewhat happy to see him. Raf, who rues the day he came back, and Jane and her dithering. God, I dont like this Jason/Michael hybrid plot, like they only gave us half a Michael, and are going to end up using this as an excuse for Jane to ditch her dead husband guilt free and run back to Raf. Seriously, does no one care about what the poor guy went through?!

I mean, I guess its good that Raf is dealing with his depression, and I would love the show to address his mental illness issues from the past, but they arent really doing that, but its like all his life is based around Jane, who didnt even want to break up with him. She just wanted to spend some time figuring out her feelings for her dead husband come to life, which is understandable, he was the one who kicked her out of their home and said he didnt want to see her. 

Petra really was being a crappy friend, but her and Jane dancing was really cute. "Is that Times New Roman?" "Who cares, shes rich!" 

*Sigh* Why did they have to bring back Michael is they just wanted to ruin him, and have Jane "officially" choose Raf? 

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(edited)

I liked the previous episode better, I think. It was better crafted. Too little Rafael, waaay to much this weird Jane/Michael interactions where he constantly undermines all Jane's fond memories of them and yet saying he still has feelings for her. Whatever.

Petra/JR were better in season 4 when it'd been hot and electric. Now it feels like a snooze. They should just get married and get it over with. I just don't care enough.

Jane chasing after Rafael and saying all the wrong things (imo) was seriously boring and unsatisfying. "I care about your well-being and you not being a drug-addict because it's my family we're talking about", or something to that effect didn't endear me to Jane in the slightest. Well, she wanted to make Rafael's depression all about herself and her wishy-washy behaviour in the end, so maybe the first option was the lesser of two evils. I wish she'd say like, I'm your friend and I'm there for you or something, like she wanted for Petra to act towards her. Alas, no. It's all self-centered all the time with Jane.

The horny Alba plot and Rogelio/Xo plot was so meh.

Edited by CooperTV
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I felt for Petra because she only confronted Raf due to Jane and then Raf told her not to tell Jane what was going on with him (which is understandable), which left Petra in a tough position. She had to know that "I handled it" was not going to be enough to get Jane to back off, but she did try to protect Raf's privacy and request.

I know that Raf doesn't want to share this info with Jane, but it was clearly affecting his ability to parent so it was not wildly out of line for Jane to want to know what was going on with him. Yes, she's his ex and therefore not privy to details about his private life, but she was correct when she said that his behavior was affecting their son and their family. You can't just NOT pick up your kids and you also can't expect your ex to drop everything to pick up said kids every time you forget, especially if you don't tell her that something is going on.

How much time has passed since the last episode? I'm all for Raf going on anti-depressants if that's what he needs but it seemed a bit sudden.

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So, this episode was basically about everyone in the older generation being horny? lol. In all seriousness, Ro/Xo was good. I get that part of Alba's character evolution is resolving her conflict between religion and female sexuality, but I'm not sure I buy her suddenly being a vibrator expert and chatting away about her masturbation strategies.

My general frustration with the love triangle notwithstanding, I really don't understand what they're trying to do with Michael and his relationship with Jane. That somber "we're just different people now" scene seemed like it was closing the door on their reconciliation, which I thought was a weird choice to do after Jane's feelings had just been a huge plot point, but that was apparently a segue to them taking a spontaneous trip to Montana, where I'm sure Jane will be put off by JaMichael's cowboy skills and give him another lecture about how They've Changed? I'm with @tennisgurl that this Jason/Michael hybrid is just a lazy vehicle to assassinate Michael's character and torpedo audience nostalgia around Jane and Michael's marriage to justify her returning to Rafael in the end. At this point, I would've preferred Michael stay dead, rather than resurrect him to ruin him. Are we sure Jane isn't imagining him? It's bizarre that everyone else keeps talking about him (and how rude and inconvenient it is that he came back from the dead!), but apparently only Jane ever talks to him.

Giving Petra Zany Adventures in Lesbianism this season is amusing and cute, but feels very disconnected from everything else happening. Zelda Williams looked hot as hell. Also having Petra/Jane breathlessly giggling with their faces two inches apart while the audience chanted "Kiss! Kiss! Kiss!" is just blatantly fucking with Jetra shippers now haha.

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Don’t think you or anyone will have to put up with the love triangle much longer, Snark.

At this point I would enjoy it more if Michael does turnout to be an illusion. If it is, would that be their grand nod to magical realism? Sure hope this all makes sense in the end.

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(edited)

Ooh, SnarkEnthusiast, I love that theory; I wish there were a way to make it work that everyone could buy and be happy with, or at least tolerate.  It's still annoying that Michael hasn't interacted yet with Xo, Ro, and Alba.     

Edited by Turtle Wexler
Clarifying which "he" I meant.
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this Jason/Michael hybrid is just a lazy vehicle to assassinate Michael's character and torpedo audience nostalgia around Jane and Michael's marriage to justify her returning to Rafael in the end. At this point, I would've preferred Michael stay dead, rather than resurrect him to ruin him. 

This says everything. I don't know what other drama they could have created for the final season but anything other than this would've been better.

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7 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Are we sure Jane isn't imagining him? It's bizarre that everyone else keeps talking about him (and how rude and inconvenient it is that he came back from the dead!), but apparently only Jane ever talks to him.

😂🤣

I would actually be on board with that. I haven't seen this episode yet, so I don't know if anyone talks to Michael in this one other than Jane, but Rafael has talked to him. So, there goes that fun theory.

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Well I watched it.

I guess the idea that they're just different people now and that's why they wouldn't work is okay-ish, but the problem is... why? I mean, I still feel like this storyline is completely unnecessary. There was nothing to indicate that Jane had unresolved feelings about Michael, or that Rafael was still salty about Jane choosing him... nothing. Michael also added something to the new Sin Rostro angle they're playing with now, but this is literally something they pulled out of their asses right at this moment, so they could have come up with something else that didn't include Michael. Michael's return continues to feel 100% unnecessary and almost... mean.

Like I've always said, this is all just so that Jane can choose Rafael over Michael and he can be her first choice.... only it's been years since the triangle existed and nothing in the recent sstoryline indicated that this was needed now. So, it continues to bother me to see them destroy Jane and Michael retroactively, even now crapping on their "sappy" past together because Michael is now Jacheal and oh my what would the boys at the ranch THINK! 🙄 And pfffs they wouldn't have worked together anyway because he gave up his career for Jane ! 🙄  Speaking of, is this what really happened? I could've sworn they told Michael that he couldn't be a cop anymore because his injury left him too weak and he couldn't pass the physical that cops need to pass.

I'm also not sure I get or like what they're doing with Rafael. I guess it's their way of maybe getting him to mend some wound he hadn't really worked on, but seeing him fall apart like this instead of being there for Jane or fighting for Jane or just something that seems healthier and more mature just continues to make me think that he's not ready (will he ever be?) to be Jane's or anyone's endgame. And there's so little show left to turn this around, that I'm afraid that they won't really convince me.

As for the rest, Petra's twins are the cutest!

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There’s so much about this show that I enjoy. But I really wish that I could detect even a whiff of romantic chemistry between Jane and Rafael. I so want to be on board with the couple that the show clearly wants us to root for.

Whatever Jane and Michael had, I bought it completely. Frankly, I cried when Jane and Jason said goodbye to one another (even though I didn’t care about Jason at all) because the actors really sold it & have such great chemistry together.

It’s never a good thing, IMO, when a show has to sully one relationship in order to make another shine. And that’s the only reason I can think of for why the show brought Michael back.

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(edited)

Yeah, it’s amazing that, even though we barely knew Jason, we could FEEL that  special something during that scene between them, you could se Jane really feeling all their history and their love... and Jason just kind of quietly being his sorta thick cowboy self.  They —Gina and Brett—-are magic together. And I guess that’s why so many of us bought Michael and Jane. (Not all of us, of course).  

Edited by BAH
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I always thought Petra and Rafael had better chemistry together.  Even now, Petra seems better able to understand him. But it's really wishful thinking for me to hope that they would ever put the two of them together again, and she has JR now so . . . 

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(edited)
On 5/3/2019 at 3:22 PM, natyxg said:

So, it continues to bother me to see them destroy Jane and Michael retroactively, even now crapping on their "sappy" past together because Michael is now Jacheal and oh my what would the boys at the ranch THINK! 🙄 And pfffs they wouldn't have worked together anyway because he gave up his career for Jane ! 🙄  Speaking of, is this what really happened? I could've sworn they told Michael that he couldn't be a cop anymore because his injury left him too weak and he couldn't pass the physical that cops need to pass.

THIS is what gets under my skin most. Regardless of how you feel about Jane/Raf or Jane/Michael (and now Jachael), they're just using Jachael as a mouthpiece to mock and belittle those who enjoyed their original relationship and Michael's true characterization, because apparently you can't organically have Jane choose Raf without slandering and shitting on a huge chunk of the series...which should tell you something. And it's made worse and flat out embarrassing by having Jachael spout this cringey brand of regressive, emotionally constipated, borderline homophobic toxic masculinity. "I was kind and empathetic? What do you mean I wasn't embarrassed by my wife? What a cuck I was! What a weenie!" It's the antithesis of everything that made Michael wonderful and loving, which is the deliberate intention. And you're absolutely correct that Michael had to leave the force as a result of lingering health problems from the shooting, so Jachael's random claim that it's all Jane's fault and she guilted him into retirement is yet another lazy retcon to irrevocably damage Jane/Michael by creating friction that will ruin Jane's nostalgia and therefore cause her feelings to cool. And let's face it, this zombie ship is being kept afloat by pure nostalgia, because Jachael (and Jane and Jachael's attitude towards one another) fucking sucks.

Edited by SnarkEnthusiast
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Very strange as has been pointed out that Michael and Rogelio have not met up again yet. I think there was a line about Jacob/Michael visiting his parents though. Can't remember (ha!) whether that was before or after his memories came back.

I'm holding fast to my theory that Jane and Michael will re-fall in love with the people they are now. Because otherwise this is a shitty thing to do to fans. I agree Jane and Raf have no chemistry while Jane and Michael have heaps.

Don't care at all about Sin Rostro. Was relieved to hear her say to forget about Micheal though.

Loved Alma's vibrator speech to XO for personal reasons. TMI to explain. 😉

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(edited)
On 5/4/2019 at 9:48 PM, arty said:

There’s so much about this show that I enjoy. But I really wish that I could detect even a whiff of romantic chemistry between Jane and Rafael. I so want to be on board with the couple that the show clearly wants us to root for.

Whatever Jane and Michael had, I bought it completely. Frankly, I cried when Jane and Jason said goodbye to one another (even though I didn’t care about Jason at all) because the actors really sold it & have such great chemistry together.

It’s never a good thing, IMO, when a show has to sully one relationship in order to make another shine. And that’s the only reason I can think of for why the show brought Michael back.

This is why chemistry is subjective. In my opinion J/R have better chemistry than J/M. They actually have all  3 you need. J/R are HBO while J/M is Hallmark. But again we all know chemistry is a matter of opinions. 

Edited by Simba122504
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I don’t hate the Michael/Jane/Rafael triangle but I definitely think it was a mistake to resurrect Michael. The show doesn’t feel the same; like it’s lost some of its charm.

I loved the Xo/Ro story line. Very true to life and I like that there wasn’t a quick, happy resolution.

Alba took me out with her line about Barack Obama. You go girl!

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22 minutes ago, woodstock said:

Alba took me out with her line about Barack Obama. You go girl!

Horny Alba is freaking me out a little. I'm glad she got her groove back, though. If only Jorge would have stepped up to the plate...

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I really don’t understand how it is understandable for Jane to have these conflicting feelings about Raf and Jason/Michael but it isn’t understandable for Rafael to have conflicting feelings about how he is to proceed here? Trust me, I’m not trying to downplay the actions of Rafael or Jane at all. I just really am confused about how he was “supposed” to act. This isn’t a one-time situation and as it has been stated before, neither Jane of Rafael deal with things rationally (talking first reactions here). Just that if Raf gave her the time to figure things out. how would that look? She still lives there and sleeps in the bed with Raf while exchanging flirty texts and lunch dates with Michael? I am totally pro-therapy and have actually been to therapy sessions. I refuse to believe that any therapist wouldn’t advise Raf to remove himself from the situation temporarily (at least to gain some clarity so spthings aren’t so muddled). Was he supposed to give her the card he wrote her or write her something else (which to me is possibly the best way to get his feelings across) and get blamed for being emotionally abusive in her exploring time? We aren’t perfect and neither are JtV characters.

As I said in last weeks forum, what the heck happened to all the character development we had to sit through for four seasons?? You mean to tell me we watched Raf and Jane get to the point where they talk about EVERYTHING and now they just resort to season 1 antics? Where is the sense in that? Haven’t the writers spent season 4 talking about how they both grew up and became better ppl with the communication and less judging (although let’s be honest, judging is in Jane’s DNA lol). How am I supposed to get over this writers?? Also, find someone worthy of Petra or stop trying. Petra has also made mistakes but this groveling thing ain’t it. Best JR step aside for someone better for Petra cause how exactly are we working if you can’t fucking trust me?

Btw Mateo is a brat. Totally understandable that his world has been turned upside down but these antics started before Jane was asked to leave the apt. He hits the girls continuously and isn’t reprimanded and then the girls are scolded in front of him by HIS MOTHER so of course he thinks his actions are now justified. Look how Jane even treats Petra after the hitting was brought to light, as if this is now Petra’s fault that the girls defended themselves. If you listen to that whole argument, the twins say that they hit him when he hits one of them first. Mateo’s only argument is that they leave him playing alone. Like WTF?!? So their twin bond makes it fair game if hair pulling and kicks. Is there any wonder that he acts out this way? 

Anyways, I know this post is long, probably convoluted and full of spelling errors but I just had to get all the thoughts out. This is also what happens when regular life interferes with tv and I’m now catching up on the last 2 episodes of JtV before the next ones airs. Damn responsibilities lol 😂 

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On 5/2/2019 at 12:58 PM, SnarkEnthusiast said:

So, this episode was basically about everyone in the older generation being horny? lol. In all seriousness, Ro/Xo was good. I get that part of Alba's character evolution is resolving her conflict between religion and female sexuality, but I'm not sure I buy her suddenly being a vibrator expert and chatting away about her masturbation strategies.

I thought it was just me! I mean, I love that Alba is not so tightly wound but her discussion with Xo about the need for backup batteries was LEAPS over her character development in one scene. Like WTH kind of vibrator is she using and can we have a link to it? Apparently, it works miracles and can change your whole personality in a few weeks. Self love is good but is it THAT good? 😂 

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