Felicity Smoak: Bitch With Wifi

[apinknightmare]

Thank you for that. Wait she went to his house 3 times?

 

Yeah. She went there the first time looking for him because he'd been MIA for a week working on his suit. Then she locked his system. I think she left and then came back again, although I can't remember exactly what about, so maybe she only left once. But anyway, she brought him some food and then told him he needed to take a shower, so he did, and then he came out into his living room after the shower in only a towel and they kissed which I guess led to the sex which thankfully they spared us having to watch in any way, shape or form.

[Password]

they kissed which I guess led to the sex which thankfully they spared us having to watch in any way, shape or form.

I knew we would be spared because only Oliver gets sex scenes...which aren't really ever sex scenes so I'm cool on that front.

She should've let him be MIA.

[Danny Franks]

So Felicity is supposed to be a Vice President in the company, yet she's going to Ray's house to make sure he eats and washes (and gets laid)? Sounds like she's more of a PA to him than she ever was to Oliver.

 

I wonder how EBR feels when she reads new scripts and has to try to make sense in her head of why Felicity is doing and saying the things she is. Sounds like she's completely given up on Oliver, if she just lets him go off to die again, and responds to it by having sex with her boss.

[Angel12d]

From bitterness thread:

 

This season just....it's made me annoyed at pretty much every single character.

 

I've also been having problems with Felicity. I know, I know, unpopular opinion but I'm not here for this cliche. I was delusional to think once Olicity was becoming a real thing, that it would stay uncliched, but I was wrong. Felicity's turned into someone that just...isn't quite Felicity anymore. I mean, on the outside she's pretty much the same but I'm seeing subtle things in her character that does not make me feel like she's the Felicity we've grown to know and love. I know I should be understanding of why she's angry at Oliver, I should be on her side and I should be happy that she's her own person but...I'm just not, and I can't even explain why. Maybe it's my mood right now, maybe it's just more of last episode, maybe it's the season in general that's making me more critical and cynical, but...I just can't get behind Felicity right now. I really wish I could articulate exactly what my issues are with Felicity, but I can't. And honestly, I don't think it has much to do with Laurel joining Team Arrow at all. It's my own issues with how they're treating Oliver and Felicity, and Felicity's role on Team Arrow in general. I appreciated that Felicity did things that were out of the norm for TV shows, where she could stand up to Oliver but still be there for him, no matter what. How she couldn't quit Team Arrow because of him and Diggle. But now? I can see her quitting at the end of the season and only coming back if there was a major crisis, and that's not how I felt in season 2.

 

I've been annoyed at every character too because they're not acting like the characters I've grown to love. Every single one of them (bar Laurel because she's one of the main problems here and she's always been inconsistent) has been twisted to fit someone else or some dumb plot. It's terrible.

 

I don't think that's an unpopular opinion. Not everyone loves Felicity. That's fair enough. To each his own. I have plenty of issues with how they're writing her character this season and the only thing that's saving me is my love for her from s1 and s2. I'm holding on to that. She's one of my favorite characters on this show. She breathed life into it when she became a member of the team. She breathed life into Oliver too (her and Diggle both did this, I won't undermine his importance there).

 

But I admit I'm conflicted. I absolutely support her right to move on from Oliver because he's making stupid decisions and still not choosing to be with her even though he loves her. There comes a point when you have to protect yourself. And I can't fault her anger at times. I'd be angry too. But I think they've kind of gone too far maybe? She just feels too bitter lately. Too snappy. This isn't the Felicity I know and love and I know that because she was so consistent throughout s1 and s2 that the difference in her behavior now is startling. You only have to watch old clips on YT and it's like a completely different person. But that's not Felicity's fault. She's just been warped  to fit everyone else, so others can have more relevance. That doesn't make me hate Felicity. That makes me hate everyone else and the stupid reasons why.

 

Honestly, I feel like we'll get the real Felicity Smoak back once they stop writing for plot and start writing for character again. I don't know if that will happen any time soon but there comes a point when all this terrible shit has to stop so... fingers crossed?

Edited February 26, 2015 by Angel12d

[Lady Calypso]

You know...I've just learned that I should never go to Marc's tumblr page. Ever. His answers are so...pompous. It would be better if he shut his mouth and didn't post probably every message in his inbox. 

 

I'm so tempted to go send a few messages to him, myself, asking about why Felicity is a walking cliche, why Olicity has to have a freaking love triangle and all angst, and why can't he leave well enough alone. Well, maybe better phrased. 

 

And then maybe I'll send him questions about other characters.

[DrSpaceman10]

You know...I've just learned that I should never go to Marc's tumblr page. Ever. His answers are so...pompous. It would be better if he shut his mouth and didn't post probably every message in his inbox. 

 

I'm so tempted to go send a few messages to him, myself, asking about why Felicity is a walking cliche, why Olicity has to have a freaking love triangle and all angst, and why can't he leave well enough alone. Well, maybe better phrased. 

 

And then maybe I'll send him questions about other characters.

 

Be sure to ask him about Thea/Felicity scenes, he loves that question ;)

[SmallScreenDiva]

Much has already been said and written about Ray's stalkery behavior so I'm not going to add to it. But I'm one of the very few on this board who think he hasn't quite crossed that line. Regarding the whole boss/employee thing, I would take more exception if the show is about the workplace. But "Arrow" writers have repeatedly shown the inability to write accurately about jobs, job descriptions, workplace hierarchies and dynamics (I point you to the many, many scenes of Laurel attempting to be a lawyer and also the QC drama from last season), so I'm going to reserve my rantings about the subject to emails to the network, the show and the producers.

 

As for Felicity being snappy and more bitter, well, she is. I do miss the "old" Felicity who is quippy and funny and more light-hearted, but it's unfair IMO to compare S1 and S2 Felicity to S3, because ... well just look at this entire season. To borrow Oliver's words, this has been a season where "nothing good happened." It's one heartache after another for almost all the characters. Even her interactions with Ray, which were supposed to provide the light-hearted moments for the show, per the EPs, often have that sad tone kinda hanging over them. I hope she gets a chance to blow up and that she's given a target for her wrath. Preferably someone with the initials MM.

[CabotCove]

So Felicity is supposed to be a Vice President in the company, yet she's going to Ray's house to make sure he eats and washes (and gets laid)? Sounds like she's more of a PA to him than she ever was to Oliver.

Or she is being a friend, because that's what friends do, care about their friends physical and mental states. And she went on her own accord and this wasn't about business, well not that kind of business.

To go all the way back to the original question you posed, @wonderwall: I think we're supposed to see a growth arc for Felicity where she moves into Boss mode, where she's running all these superheroes, realizing her own reasons for being in the fight, and becoming this confident person who stands up to all these Big Bads.

That sounds like the idea. Her growth arc gets a thumbs up from me. She can't just go back to being just "Ollie's girl" or the "funny girl" she has grown beyond that. I don't think its realistic to expect her to be unchanged years on, especially when she resides in this hellish, doom and gloom universe (Flash included). Of course I don't want Felicity to ever stop being funny (NEVER) and being a light in the dark, there is a way for her to grow without dimming her lights, at least completely. Edited February 27, 2015 by Conell

[Morena]

 

[Ang]

I refuse to watch ep 15 so I have a question. Felicity playing house this ep with RoboCop, how did it come across? I mean did it seem like displaced feelings? Is she giving up on trying to convince Oliver at all? Is she trying to save Ray (really)? The EPs seem to be trying to sell that Felicity actually has feelings for creep and vice versa. What did it seem like?

I thought it worked better than some as a genuine relationship with its own merits. When she kissed him it was after hearing him talk about HER, and how she came first with him, and there was such a look of relief and wonder on her face. It was obviously at least in sharp contrast to her relationship with Oliver.

(Edited because trying to type on my phone while having a real life was a ridiculous idea....)

Edited February 28, 2015 by Ang

[Carrie Ann]

As critical as I've been of the writing for Felicity this season, I think there's a reading of what's happening with the Ray/Oliver situation that would suggest that she is actually not particularly introspective. Not particularly comfortable with searching her soul, or looking too closely at her real, deep feelings about things. Because she's so well-adjusted, generally speaking, and so self-aware in other areas, I just took it as a given that she's always understood and accepted her feelings about Oliver. But if you consider that maybe emotions and real connection are the one area where complexity scares her a bit, it makes a lot of other things fall into place. Her relationship with her mother, for example, seems like another example of avoidance behavior (ditto the change in look post-Cooper).

 

To me, it would explain her ability to compartmentalize, and even her ability to stay positive when things are really shitty. It could also be a facet of the reason that she hasn't expressed her own feelings for Oliver to anyone--she possibly hasn't even figured them out herself. Her wording to Ray in whatever episode where she could only say that Oliver was more than a friend, seemed not so much like trying to hide what he was, but more like she really wasn't sure herself. And yeah, their relationship to each other isn't easy to define, but her feelings for him should be a little easier, given the amount of time she's had to think about it. Which is why I think that maybe she just doesn't let herself think about it in too much depth, not even after he died.

 

Anyway, if my reading is correct, it would also explain how she could move on with Ray, even how she could be...not discouraging of his advances while Oliver was dead--while still not discounting her feelings for Oliver, or making her seem like she is knowingly leading Ray on in some way. She truly doesn't know that she is.

 

None of this makes me feel any better about the way this has all played out, and I have strong doubts that I will be satisfied with the resolution here, but if I choose this headcanon, it does make me feel a little more understanding of Felicity, as she's been written in S3.

[statsgirl]

Marc Guggenheim said in one of his nefarious tweets that Felicity isn't aware that she's in love with Oliver yet.  (I take this as proof that we're involved in different shows.)

 

The other thing I thought of was in 210 when she was talking about Barry's coma and said "finally a guy is interested in me and he ends up in a coma".  A few episodes later when Caitlyn said that Iris had been visiting Barry a lot, Felicity said something about even in a coma guys move on from her.  After all, her father, the most important male relationship in a child's life, left her and left her after they'd done a lot of bonding.  So it sounds like she really doesn't see herself as someone men are interested in and want to be with. When Oliver finally told her he loved her in a way that wasn't back-handed, he kissed her on the forehead and left, and since he got back he's been shutting the door in her face again and again.  So maybe she does think that she's not lovable and Ray sleeping with her, or rather not sleeping but just the sex part, is recreational sex on his part rather than feelings for her.

 

On the other hand, she did have that whole relationship with Cooper that contradicts everything I just said.

Edited March 1, 2015 by statsgirl

[BkWurm1]

As critical as I've been of the writing for Felicity this season, I think there's a reading of what's happening with the Ray/Oliver situation that would suggest that she is actually not particularly introspective. Not particularly comfortable with searching her soul, or looking too closely at her real, deep feelings about things. Because she's so well-adjusted, generally speaking, and so self-aware in other areas, I just took it as a given that she's always understood and accepted her feelings about Oliver. But if you consider that maybe emotions and real connection are the one area where complexity scares her a bit, it makes a lot of other things fall into place. Her relationship with her mother, for example, seems like another example of avoidance behavior (ditto the change in look post-Cooper).

 

To me, it would explain her ability to compartmentalize, and even her ability to stay positive when things are really shitty. It could also be a facet of the reason that she hasn't expressed her own feelings for Oliver to anyone--she possibly hasn't even figured them out herself. Her wording to Ray in whatever episode where she could only say that Oliver was more than a friend, seemed not so much like trying to hide what he was, but more like she really wasn't sure herself. And yeah, their relationship to each other isn't easy to define, but her feelings for him should be a little easier, given the amount of time she's had to think about it. Which is why I think that maybe she just doesn't let herself think about it in too much depth, not even after he died.

 

Anyway, if my reading is correct, it would also explain how she could move on with Ray, even how she could be...not discouraging of his advances while Oliver was dead--while still not discounting her feelings for Oliver, or making her seem like she is knowingly leading Ray on in some way. She truly doesn't know that she is.

 

None of this makes me feel any better about the way this has all played out, and I have strong doubts that I will be satisfied with the resolution here, but if I choose this headcanon, it does make me feel a little more understanding of Felicity, as she's been written in S3.

This fits into the other aspect of Felicity that I think I sometimes forget, that she is a very methodical and logical thinker and that does include the ability to compartmentalize, maybe more than the ability but the tendency to compartmentalize and in conjunction with this, things that don't or won't fit into an easily understood compartment could be something she just avoids thinking about or like after Cooper "died" she seemed to take all the feelings that she'd been letting herself have and stuff them all away where they couldn't hurt her anymore. 

Edited March 1, 2015 by BkWurm1

[BkWurm1]

So maybe she does think that she's not lovable and Ray sleeping with her, or rather not sleeping but just the sex part, is recreational sex on his part rather than feelings for her.

 

On the other hand, she did have that whole relationship with Cooper that contradicts everything I just said.

 Edited by statsgirl, 18 minutes ago.

 

Ah, but in her mind what she did caused Cooper to first be taken away from her but then choose death rather than jail and I have to think the way they were acting, she was planning on visiting and waiting for him but he too left her.  Cooper just reinforces everything she thinks.  Then she finds out at least he wasn't dead but he still proved IMO by his actions that he didn't really care for her.  However she looks at her time in love with Cooper, she's got to be thinking it was a disaster and chances are she's still blaming herself.

Edited March 1, 2015 by BkWurm1

[statsgirl]

You've reminded me of Laurel saying "everyone leaves me", you know, like Tommy and Sara did, by dying.

 

It's true, at first Felicity would have thought that Cooper left her by committing suicide, which is more agency than having a rebar fall through you.  But in fact, he faked his death to get away from  her.  You're right, every man leaves her, from her father to Cooper to Oliver.  Maybe with Ray, she just wanted a few moments of oblivion before he moves on too.

[wonderwall]

Can someone please explain to me why they feel Felicity's agency has been taken away from her?

[statsgirl]

I think Laura Hurley does a good job in her review of Nanda Parbat. I quoted from it on the relationships thread about how she seems smaller this season than before, but the whole review is worth reading. This part made me sad

 

it seems like the deep bonds between Oliver and his first two partners never existed. Oliver and Digg affirming their brotherhood only makes Felicity’s exclusion from the Team Arrow hijinks all the more upsetting. She was more involved in the action back when she was just an IT girl patiently listening to Oliver’s stories about laptops and sports bottles.

[BkWurm1]

Can someone please explain to me why they feel Felicity's agency has been taken away from her?

For me, I feel like so much of this season isn't about Felicity doing or going after what she wants but what she is allowed to have. 

 

She is trying to have something bigger and meaningful and instead of being able to have it on her terms, she's left to find another lesser version of everything.  There is a layer of resignation to everything that hurts to witness I think in part because she was/is such a fantastic supporter of others.  The only support she gets this season is from Ray and while  I've never found him to be this horrible guy or a scary stalker, he's not sweeping Felicity off her feet or making her fall for him over Oliver, he's just the only one that is saying he wants her or needs her or values her and it feels like what she does with Ray isn't about their relationship so much as it is about what she's not allowed to have anymore in her other relationships. 

 

I can't help remember the look on her face at the restaurant at the beginning of the season.  Such anticipation and hope and happiness.  I don't see any of that anymore.  She isn't the type to let herself linger in her pain so we see her living in the moment a lot with Ray and I think that takes away her perspective.  The absence of pain isn't the presence of happiness. 

Edited March 1, 2015 by BkWurm1

[TanyaKay]

I have serious issues with that examiner review. Anyone who thinks Felicity Smoak is a gold digger needs to get his or her head examined.

[kismet]

As critical as I've been of the writing for Felicity this season, I think there's a reading of what's happening with the Ray/Oliver situation that would suggest that she is actually not particularly introspective. Not particularly comfortable with searching her soul, or looking too closely at her real, deep feelings about things. Because she's so well-adjusted, generally speaking, and so self-aware in other areas, I just took it as a given that she's always understood and accepted her feelings about Oliver. But if you consider that maybe emotions and real connection are the one area where complexity scares her a bit, it makes a lot of other things fall into place. Her relationship with her mother, for example, seems like another example of avoidance behavior (ditto the change in look post-Cooper).

 

To me, it would explain her ability to compartmentalize, and even her ability to stay positive when things are really shitty. It could also be a facet of the reason that she hasn't expressed her own feelings for Oliver to anyone--she possibly hasn't even figured them out herself. Her wording to Ray in whatever episode where she could only say that Oliver was more than a friend, seemed not so much like trying to hide what he was, but more like she really wasn't sure herself. And yeah, their relationship to each other isn't easy to define, but her feelings for him should be a little easier, given the amount of time she's had to think about it. Which is why I think that maybe she just doesn't let herself think about it in too much depth, not even after he died.

 

Anyway, if my reading is correct, it would also explain how she could move on with Ray, even how she could be...not discouraging of his advances while Oliver was dead--while still not discounting her feelings for Oliver, or making her seem like she is knowingly leading Ray on in some way. She truly doesn't know that she is.

 

None of this makes me feel any better about the way this has all played out, and I have strong doubts that I will be satisfied with the resolution here, but if I choose this headcanon, it does make me feel a little more understanding of Felicity, as she's been written in S3.

 

 

Marc Guggenheim said in one of his nefarious tweets that Felicity isn't aware that she's in love with Oliver yet.  (I take this as proof that we're involved in different shows.)

 

The other thing I thought of was in 210 when she was talking about Barry's coma and said "finally a guy is interested in me and he ends up in a coma".  A few episodes later when Caitlyn said that Iris had been visiting Barry a lot, Felicity said something about even in a coma guys move on from her.  After all, her father, the most important male relationship in a child's life, left her and left her after they'd done a lot of bonding.  So it sounds like she really doesn't see herself as someone men are interested in and want to be with. When Oliver finally told her he loved her in a way that wasn't back-handed, he kissed her on the forehead and left, and since he got back he's been shutting the door in her face again and again.  So maybe she does think that she's not lovable and Ray sleeping with her, or rather not sleeping but just the sex part, is recreational sex on his part rather than feelings for her.

 

On the other hand, she did have that whole relationship with Cooper that contradicts everything I just said.

I think when MG means she is not aware, I think it can be translated as the above top quoted well written explanation from @Carrie Ann.

 

Emotional compartmentalization does occur and I feel like it does occur more frequently in intelligent & logical minded people like FS. She always wants to solve the mystery. But the problem with an emotion like love & relationships is that they can be messy and often do not have easily defined logical reasoning. Just look at the amount of posts on this forum that revolve around the analysis of love & relationships. Trying to solve it is not easy, but add onto that the personal experiences of loss & hurt that shes experienced as a result of L&R, it becomes clearer that if she is/was experiencing feelings for OQ those would go in the box & be compartmentalized for analysis later. Dealing with those emotions would be very challenging considering the circumstances of s3a, nevermind the mindf**ck that she must be living in s3b. OQ is a mystery she wants to solve, but its getting too illogical. Whereas RP and her attraction to him are very logical & easy to understand. RP fits her checklist and their relationship is not as emotionally charged as her relationship w/ OQ. Its simple, easy & available, it will likely not stay that way - but that can be dealt with tomorrow. So in many ways her approach to relationships is very self-aware & self-delusional at the same time.

 

In this post I use relationship as a broad term, not just restricted to romance but encompassing friendship, partnership, u know all the ships that can exist between 2 people.

[Carrie Ann]

Can someone please explain to me why they feel Felicity's agency has been taken away from her?

 

I don't feel like Felicity has lost agency, and I think it's easy to spot the difference when you look at Thea, who until 315 seriously had none. But I do feel that Felicity's story this season mostly serves the plot/stories of others, and I think it's possible people are conflating the two concepts. 

 

Examples of times I think Felicity showed unquestionable agency (def. as a character operating on their own agenda with their own goals, active in their own story): walking away (and staying away) from Oliver in 301; taking the job at PT in 302; going to CC to see Barry in TF 104; taking Cooper down in 305; maybe kissing RP in 307; walking out in 310; walking back in in 311; refusing to work with Merlyn in 312, and then shutting it down with Oliver later; initiating with Ray in 315.

 

In at least half of those examples, I think there's a stronger argument to be made that actually Felicity's actions serve other characters on their journeys more than they serve her. So it doesn't really feel like agency; it feels like support. And it feels particularly egregious when she is/was a love interest to four of those characters, and her actions there are related to that role. Let's review what MG has to say about that:

 

Q: Before the season started you said that Felicity's identity journey was whether or not she was only Oliver's crush object or did she exist outside the foundry? While a good idea in theory, all you've done this season with Felicity is to make her Ray's crush object also. Felicity deserves so much more than to just be a love interest. She should have been the one to build/use the ATOM suit, so that she could have been the center of her own story. She's more of a crush object now than in S1/S2.

 

MG: I’m sorry you feel that way.  You have to admit, though, that by pursuing a romance with Ray, she’s making a decision to not just stay in the lair and pine for Oliver.  SHE initiated with Ray in 3x15.  Yes, it’s romantic, but it’s not passive.  She made an active choice.

 

So, it is sufficient for the writers that Felicity's primary role is that of love interest for the menfolk. It is enough for them that she is active in at least one part of her love life. But every step of the R/F relationship has basically been: R wants something from F, F puts up a roadblock, R persists, F agrees, R gets what he wants. The job offer, going to the dinner meeting, helping him with his suit, starting a relationship. I'm not saying I think Felicity was coerced into sleeping with him, and I agree with MG that she did technically initiate, but it still followed the pattern. Ray gets what Ray wants. 

 

And Felicity theoretically gets something out of all of these things too, but as @BkWurm1 says above, it feels like Less Than. She gets a relationship (but not the one she really wants), she gets out of the lair but ends up in another lair, she theoretically helps the city in a new way via a different dude. She gets this VP job title, but as Laura Hurley said in her article, what we actually see of Felicity doing her job shows her in the role of personal assistant. But she didn't initiate any of those things. Ray did. And that's just it, in a nutshell. She's there to assist Ray's journey, and what crumbs of screentime are left are devoted to challenging or assisting Oliver (or Laurel) depending on what the writers need that day. So she does technically have agency, and she is technically getting some of the things she seemed to want, but only as defined by others, based on what they want from her and what the plot needs her to do. Her agency, like her whole life, feels Less Than, right now.

Edited March 1, 2015 by Carrie Ann

[catrox14]

 

MG: I’m sorry you feel that way.  You have to admit, though, that by pursuing a romance with Ray, she’s making a decision to not just stay in the lair and pine for Oliver.  SHE initiated with Ray in 3x15.  Yes, it’s romantic, but it’s not passive.  She made an active choice.

 

See this sucks. Felicity was seduced by Ray Palmer with job offers, awkward flirting, the building of suit etc.  So yes Felicity made a choice to be with Ray who is really jsut a dorkier, creepier, more desperate to attach to someone version of Oliver. I mean they even had Felicity make that fawning speech about someone saving the city when she was IMO clearly projecting her feeling about Oliver onto the available hero.  And that doesn't feel like much of a choice to me.  YMMV

[quarks]

I'm also questioning that Felicity really did much of the initiating there. It's not just that Ray's been doing most of the pursuit, as CarrieAnn just broke down for us: Ray  asked Felicity out to dinner, Ray initiated their kiss, Ray told Felicity he was now building the suit because he cared about her, and Ray walked out of his bedroom just wrapped in a towel which is such a television cliche for seduction attempt that Friends and The Mindy Project have both made fun of it. 

 

To be fair, I don't think that Felicity has really initiated much with Oliver, either. The only relationship we've seen her initiate on the show is with Barry, when she asked him to be her plus one, unless we're arguing that her telling Moira that she discovered Thea's parentage, or telling Laurel that putting on a leather costume to go beat people up is an awesome idea, count as Felicity's attempts to start relationships/friendships with them.

Edited March 1, 2015 by quarks

[statsgirl]

With Oliver though, Felicity did initiate the "don't kill people who are the single-parents of young children" when she walked out on him and she's been a major force in making Oliver into the hero he is... I mean was before this season.  (The stupidity of choosing MM repeatedly over Thea and innocent people hurts his hero status.)  She also started the "don't touch me or dangle maybes you're not going to carry through" when she walked away or shuts Oliver down when he keeps trying to play his game.

 

With Ray, as quarks pointed out, What Ray Wants, Ray Gets.  It may take some time and Felicity might resist for part of an episode, but the roadmap in their interactions has always been set by Ray.

[Betweenthisandthat]

So maybe she does think that she's not lovable and Ray sleeping with her, or rather not sleeping but just the sex part, is recreational sex on his part rather than feelings for her.

 

I don't think Felicity has to lack self-awareness and self-worth to be with Ray.  I'm oversimplifying things, but that's the reading I'm getting here.  The timing of her being with Ray, that can be questioned and blamed on bad writing but I don't think this act takes anything away from Felicity.  I see her totally in control of her actions right now.  Her identity doesn't depend on Oliver or being in cahoots with Team Arrow.  She has her own life and desires that might be getting fulfilled elsewhere.  That's what I've been getting this season.  She's no longer revolving herself around Oliver or Diggle or anyone else.  I don't know if she's even dependent on Ray either.  She seems in control there, too.  Felicity was the one trying to help him, setting the terms in which she'd help him, and she's the one who after admitting clumsily that she's attracted to him, initiated their kiss.  This feels like the opposite of what she has with Oliver now.  Oliver sets the terms of how they'll be involved romantically or not.  He told her they can't be together.  Oliver does what he does and she responds and reacts.  

 

Felicity's life is more separate from Team Arrow as is used to be, but that's being developing since Sara's death and since she decided that being in the Arrow cave wasn't all she wanted.  It might not be a good story, but this is all about Felicity, who she wants and what she wants. Oliver is written as someone she can't have or can't want because of this horrible Malcolm and Ras horribleness.  Ray is a richer Felicity, so she's drawn to him.  If anything, all three of them are serving a badly written love triangle where they're all making weird choices, but they all have agency. 

[wonderwall]

This is what made me nervous with how 3.01 played out....maybe I can be with you...whoops never mind

I love you, but it doesn't matter.

You love me, but THAT doesn't matter either.

Felicity really does deserve better.

 

In the end, Felicity deserves happiness. Whomever that may be with. Whether it's Ray, Barry, Oliver, or any other man she may cross paths with in the future, I just want Felicity to be happy. We may not feel like these men are good enough for Felicity, but all that matters is whether she believes they're good enough for her. And Felicity? We all know that she never settles for anything less than the best because she knows what's best for herself. 

 

From what we've seen, I don't think Ray can make Felicity achieve the same level of happiness as Oliver. We can see that from her interactions with Oliver in episode 1 and 8 compared to all of her scenes with Ray. This is the main reason why I'm opposed to Ray/Felicity. So right now, for me, Oliver is the guy for Felicity. That may change in the future if she finds someone better for her, someone who makes her happy as she makes him, but we aren't at that point yet (if ever). 

 

Regardless, I don't want them to get into a relationship until Oliver is ready to be in a relationship. Until he learns how to communicate with his partner, until he becomes more open to his emotions as well as a future. That Oliver, the man who we know he's going to become, deserves Felicity because I believe that man and Felicity would make each other very happy. The man he is now? He doesn't deserve Felicity. And Felicity knows that which is why she's taken romance with him off the table. 

 

All we have to do is wait until Oliver gets his head out of his ass and starts to grow as a person. In the mean time, Felicity will find happiness elsewhere and I can't blame her for that. 

Edited March 2, 2015 by wonderwall

[dtissagirl]

In the end, Felicity deserves happiness. Whomever that may be with. Whether it's Ray, Barry, Oliver, or any other man she may cross paths with in the future, I just want Felicity to be happy. We may not feel like these men are good enough for Felicity, but all that matters is whether she believes they're good enough for her. And Felicity? We all know that she never settles for anything less than the best because she knows what's best for herself. 

I read this paragraph, and the word "happiness" made me wish Felicity had gal pals and girls night, and hobbies, and a fufilling career, and that she was having fun while saving the city along with Team Arrow. And if she happened to have a boyfriend while at it, that he were only responsible for part of the happiness, not the whole thing.

The idea of tying her entire chance at happy life to a guy just rubs me wrong, no matter which guy. Especially since she's the one mainly supporting these dudes emotionally. But this is all I see in the writing of this season, and all I see is sadness instead of happiness.

I even worry that when this temporary thing with Palmer is over, and they go back to Felicity/Oliver, that the fact that they tied Oliver's humanity to Felicity becomes a burden to her.

[wonderwall]

I read this paragraph, and the word "happiness" made me wish Felicity had gal pals and girls night, and hobbies, and a fufilling career, and that she was having fun while saving the city along with Team Arrow. And if she happened to have a boyfriend while at it, that he were only responsible for part of the happiness, not the whole thing.

The idea of tying her entire chance at happy life to a guy just rubs me wrong, no matter which guy. Especially since she's the one mainly supporting these dudes emotionally. But this is all I see in the writing of this season, and all I see is sadness instead of happiness.

I even worry that when this temporary thing with Palmer is over, and they go back to Felicity/Oliver, that the fact that they tied Oliver's humanity to Felicity becomes a burden to her.

 

I didn't mean to say that having a man in her life is the only way Felicity will be happy, but I think that it's all dependent on what she wants out of life.

 

I guess I believe that Felicity wants a future with a family of her own which is why a guy (or maybe even a woman if that's how she wants to roll) is important to attaining that. I know she hasn't expressed this sentiment, but I can only imagine that this is what she would want. Maybe not now, but definitely later in life. She is only 25 years old. 

 

I don't even feel like tying Oliver's humanity to Felicity would ever be a burden to her because all she has to do is be herself in order to harness that light inside of Oliver, which isn't that hard to do. But I also feel like Oliver's humanity isn't solely tied to Felicity. It's also tied to his sister, his family, as well as his friends (Digg and Roy). This season has shown that Oliver's humanity has been tied to the people he's closest to, and it's not just Felicity.

[dtissagirl]

I think the show is saying Felicity's happiness is tied to a man. And the writing is framing it as her giving emotional support to these guys make them heroes.

But the text doesn't spend any time on what she wants, or what she gets in return, so all we can do is guess. I honestly don't know if she wants a family, because she's never said it, or had a scene like that one with Oliver looking at her, and Lyla and the baby in 301. I know Oliver wants that, and that he feels like he can't ever have it, because I saw it on the show. Felicity at best got "quiet dreams", and "fantasize", both of which are super vague, and imo, if you go into the writers room and ask them to specify what kind if dreams and fantasies, they wouldn't know. And I bet moneys if you ask Guggenheim what else beyond romance does Felicity want, there'll be nothing. Because it's not Felicity's story. She's just the support.

[wonderwall]

I don't think that this season showed me that Felicity's happiness is tied solely to a man. I think it showed me that Felicity is tired of being alone after years of being just that. Is it so wrong that she actually wants a person to share her life with? To be in a committed relationship? I don't think so. I think it makes her human. I think Felicity got a taste of what it was like to not be alone for once, and that literally blew up. And now she wants more of that because maybe she figured out that's what she's been missing all this time. Felicity's happiness probably isn't solely tied to a man, but I'm sure that a part of it is. I don't see anything wrong with that because I can relate to that. 

 

I agree that what Felicity wants requires a bit of fanwanking (in fact in order to understand almost everything on this show right now requires fanwanking), but right now I don't really mind that we don't know what she wants. All we know is that she doesn't want to be alone. And if she actually wants to be with someone, then more power to her. Also, I guess I wasn't clear, Felicity wanting a family is just my headcanon. When Felicity said she wanted more out of life than being stuck in the foundry, I thought she also meant a family somewhere down the line. 

 

Regardless, the show suffers because it has 500 characters to focus on and every character has suffered because of it. Laurel has suffered because we don't understand her motivations and her arc was too rushed, Diggle has suffered because he's been sidelined, Felicity has suffered because what she's feeling and what she wants hasn't been explicitly portrayed and her interactions with various characters have become limited, Thea and Oliver have suffered because of plot reasons, Ray suffered because his characterization and origin story has been weak... This better change in season 4. 

Edited March 2, 2015 by wonderwall

[statsgirl]

Felicity's life is more separate from Team Arrow as is used to be, but that's being developing since Sara's death and since she decided that being in the Arrow cave wasn't all she wanted.  It might not be a good story, but this is all about Felicity, who she wants and what she wants. Oliver is written as someone she can't have or can't want because of this horrible Malcolm and Ras horribleness.  Ray is a richer Felicity, so she's drawn to him.  If anything, all three of them are serving a badly written love triangle where they're all making weird choices, but they all have agency. 

In theory, maybe that's what they wanted to do.  The problem is that Felicity went forth from the Arrow cave, and instead of a richer life, what she got was to be a glorified babysitter to Ray.  She accompanies him to business dinners so she can talk him up, she follows him to meetings with civic leaders (goodness knows what she does there), when he's obsessing she tells him to eat and take a shower and puts him to bed so he can get some rest.

 

She doesn't do anything beyond her Team Arrow stuff and working for Palmer.  Worse, in terms of emotional connections, this season has cut her connections not only to Oliver but to Diggle and Roy as well.  When Felicity cries, it's only Ray there who is still practically a stranger. When she needs to have a girl talk session if she's not in a cross-over with Caitlin, she's only got Laurel who as a bitch to her for two seasons and pushed her aside in the last episode so she could talk to Oliver herself.  Felicity's only social supports now are two people who barely know her.

 

Maybe the EPs had in mind to expand Felicity's world but what they actually did was make it narrower and poorer.

[CabotCove]

So, it is sufficient for the writers that Felicity's primary role is that of love interest for the menfolk. It is enough for them that she is active in at least one part of her love life. 

 

Except the part where her having a job (at QC/RP), assisting with "hero" business/es including Team Arrow,  having friends are independent things from being a love interest.

 

Her identity doesn't depend on Oliver or being in cahoots with Team Arrow.  She has her own life and desires that might be getting fulfilled elsewhere.  That's what I've been getting this season.  She's no longer revolving herself around Oliver or Diggle or anyone else.  I don't know if she's even dependent on Ray either.  She seems in control there, too.  Felicity was the one trying to help him, setting the terms in which she'd help him, and she's the one who after admitting clumsily that she's attracted to him, initiated their kiss.

ITA

We may not feel like these men are good enough for Felicity, but all that matters is whether she believes they're good enough for her. And Felicity? We all know that she never settles for anything less than the best because she knows what's best for herself.

From what we've seen, I don't think Ray can make Felicity achieve the same level of happiness as Oliver. We can see that from her interactions with Oliver in episode 1 and 8 compared to all of her scenes with Ray.

 

 

Alright. If we are trusting Felicity judgement here then I don't see why it cannot be possible that she could find the same happiness with Ray (Barry) or even more some day. She has been shown to like the guy as a friend/colleague/lover. Yes Felicity likely has much deeper feelings for Oliver but she has been falling for him for 3 years, she just recently met Ray and she likes him, who knows how she will feel in a couple of years . Right now Felicity has this vision and dream of what man Oliver can be and the  great life she can have with him, but what if that future she envisioned doesn't happen the way it does in her head. Or she could get it and realise that is not how she wants it after all. with Ray she knows what she is getting into, she doesnt have to wait for him to be change into a "new man". Oliver is a huge gamble, Im not saying it cant pay off but in Diggle's words "Love is about finding the person who's already the right fit" there is something to those words. Ironically that's what Felicity was to Oliver but he is turning out to be the reverse for her.

 

I will accept it if Oliver is who Felicity wants and chooses but right now I sinceriously question how and why.

Edited March 2, 2015 by Conell

[wonderwall]

Except the part where her having a job (at QC/RP), assisting with "hero" business including Team Arrow, are independent things from being a love interest.

I think that the problem people have is that we don't actually see Felicity engage in things that are independent from her love interests. We know Felicity has a life outside of the cave. She has a high paying job that keeps her busy, she even eats lunch with her employees, and she still helps TA when they're not focusing on Malcolm. Just those two things take up so much time out of a day. In fact, it's realistic that she doesn't have time to do anything else unlike Laurel who apparently has time to be a lawyer, go out at night and fight crime, as well as train. 

 

The problem isn't that Felicity's life is revolved around who she's dating, it's what the episodes show which make it seem like that even though it's not true. That's the shows fault for having too many characters. 

 

I think that Felicity has been unfairly judged this season. But it's also the fault of the writers for portraying her as they currently are. Felicity has been removed from the main narrative which never bodes well for any character.

[CabotCove]

I think that the problem people have is that we don't actually see Felicity engage in things that are independent from her love interests. We know Felicity has a life outside of the cave. She has a high paying job that keeps her busy, she even eats lunch with her employees, and she still helps TA when they're not focusing on Malcolm. Just those two things take up so much time out of a day. In fact, it's realistic that she doesn't have time to do anything else unlike Laurel who apparently has time to be a lawyer, go out at night and fight crime, as well as train.

 

Ok this I get, I wouldn't mind more scenes like she had in The Origins, with just Felicity chilling at home, and having scenes with someone like her mother. No love interests barging in all the time. 

Edited March 2, 2015 by Conell

[Betweenthisandthat]

I will accept it if Oliver is who Felicity wants and chooses but right now I sinceriously question how and why.

 

That's where am I at the moment.  Why is Oliver supposed to be the one to make her happy given how this season has played out?  What is it about Oliver that she's supposed to love or wait for?  He's the hero of the show but what exactly does he have to offer any woman seeing as he's dedicated himself completely to fighting crime, saving Malcolm, and besting Ras?  I'm asking this in all seriousness because I'm not seeing it.  

 

If anything, this proves that Felicity isn't shallow.  Abs and a tortured hero complex isn't enough for her.  Being held at bay with a kiss and an I love you while Oliver chooses to go on another deadly quest isn't cutting it either.  While the timing was bad, I understand Felicity's choices more than Diggle's in this last episode.  Diggle has a life, a fiance, a baby and yet he's risking all of that to support Oliver recover his pride and Lyla encouraging that was mind blowing.   

 

Anyway, I get that Oliver might be drawn to Felicity because she's his light but I have a problem with that because I don't know if he sees her for what she is either.  While I enjoyed their friendship and saw potential, I don't like the idea of either one of them idealizing the other.  I don't like the idea that she's supposed to pull him out of the darkness he's continued to choose for himself.  It's bad enough that every hero is supposed to need Felicity.  It's worse if she's also supposed to save them from danger and from themselves as well.  Oliver is screwed up and has been for a long time.  What does he have to make someone else happy if he can't make himself happy?  Exactly what can he do to make Felicity happy given the choices he's been making with his life, choices partially based on the fact that he doesn't think he deserves happiness or a normal life?

 

It would be great if Felicity had her own story related to Team Arrow that wasn't only about romance but about her being her own hero.  While I fail to understand what the show is doing with Oliver, Ray isn't that much better.  I'm rooting for Felicity to be happy, continue to find agency, and to stay away from men who stick their heads up their own asses.  As long as she does that, I'm cool with whatever she does.

[CabotCove]

Some good,strong points there Betweenthisandthat, will crossover with some of this to the relationship thread.

[Curious]

The issue here is that both Felicity and Oliver have helped each other change and or grow since they met. Ray has offered her a better job and he has been open with his romantic feelings. It's all nice and good but eventually a smart girl like Felicity needs someone that helps her grow and challenge her also. People keep asking what does Oliver do for Felicity or how can he be good for her because he is all messed up emotionally, psychologically and make bad decisions right now.

Felicity already knows this. Sometimes I think she forgets, especially  in the last year but Oliver basic thought process has not really changed. He just had many scares upon scares piled up on him in a short period when he thought he could somewhat relax. Date from hell, Sara being killed, Thea/Malcolm stuff and being killed on top all his prior 5 years of crazy, tortuous stuff.  He was just about to be okay before all that stuff happened but the writers have other ideas.

Oliver has given Felicity back her mojo since he met her. She was hiding when he first met her and he helped her to reclaim her courage, strength and wanting to be a part of something more. Felicity has given Oliver a lot more intangible things that he really needed and still do.

Oliver will be messed up for many, many years to come. Some times will be worse than others. In all relationships, whether friendship, family or love relationships one person do end up providing the majority of the support, especially if the other person does not have good coping skills.  

Just a fact of life. It is not about keeping score but just helping each other when we need it most. The other/s who is in that relationship HAVE to understand and be okay and strong enough for that otherwise things will fall apart. They have to be willing to push past whatever block the other tries to put up and just keep chipping away. Yes it may get tiring, thinking you are doing all the work, but that's why they say it is selfless love. You are not a doormat you are a helper or facilitator. The joy and satisfaction you get when the person FINALLY is in a better place in life is unfathomable.

So in conclusion I think Oliver and Felicity do offer each other something in their relationship, whether it's friendship or more. Just my opinion.

(Ha I think this belong in the relationship thread)

[wonderwall]

(Ha I think this belong in the relationship thread)

 

I don't care where this belongs. I love it. I loved all of it.Thank you :')

 

In the end, if Oliver and Felicity can't deal with or be there for each other at their worst, they don't deserve each other when they're at their best. Even when Oliver is being unreasonable or just acting crappy towards Felicity, she's still there for him and supports him (whether that's platonically or not). Then there's Felicity who hasn't ever really hit rock bottom for Oliver to be there for, but if episode 5 is any indication, I'm pretty sure he'd stick by her side no matter what. 

 

And I know that some people can say that Felicity hasn't really been there for him at all this season because she literally yells at him all the time now... Well, there are different ways of being there for someone. One of my favorite quotes is this: “The problem with most people is they would rather be ruined by praise than saved by criticism.” -- Which, imo definitely relates to Felicity's 'treatment' of Oliver this season. In the end, Felicity's looking out for Oliver. She tried to 'save' him from his choices but he didn't listen. 

Edited March 3, 2015 by wonderwall

[BkWurm1]

Oliver will be messed up for many, many years to come. Some times will be worse than others. In all relationships, whether friendship, family or love relationships one person do end up providing the majority of the support, especially if the other person does not have good coping skills. 

 

Just a fact of life. It is not about keeping score but just helping each other when we need it most. The other/s who is in that relationship HAVE to understand and be okay and strong enough for that otherwise things will fall apart. They have to be willing to push past whatever block the other tries to put up and just keep chipping away

 

I agree to a point and that's that this season I don't feel like she's been in a position where she could just stand strong and support him while he worked through his issues since his issue is his refusal to be in any kind of a personal relationship with her.  Even his friendship has been fleeting, only a handful of moments all season. 

 

If he'd even let them go back to what they used to have, I think Felicity could have as you say chipped away at him pushing her away but he shut that door and iced her out, offering vows of love but refusing to even treat her like anything more than another tool for the Arrow to utilize.  (Except when she was in danger and when they were in Central City where everyone is legally required to smile some of the time)  It just doesn't feel like IMO that she was in a place where she had any say in the matter to dig her heels in and fight.   

[wonderwall]

So I've been thinking about this for a bit... I feel as though Felicity has lost her 'fan favorite' status on the show as more and more people have been against her and her motivations this season. I guess this is because she's opposed to Oliver since episode 2. While it's kind of sad that more people started to hate her even though she's pretty much one of the only few characters on the show that is making sense, I wonder if this will affect her future status on the show? 

 

More and more people have been saying that her character is 'useless' and 'expendable' (which imo I don't understand. Felicity has a unique skill that no one on the show can replace unless they bring in another genius on the same caliber as Felicity), and I wonder if the writers feel that too? I think Felicity is safe for season 4, but I think she might be in trouble for season 5 onwards. Hmm. 

 

I kind of hate that Felicity's screentime is mostly with Ray now, which is why I feel like a lot of people think she's become useless. She's helping a non-entity and a character that means nothing to the show's narrative. So basically this season, because Felicity has been associated with a non-entity, she herself has become a non-entity. *sigh* At the same time though, I can't imagine the team working properly without her. If the team actually fought crime this season, I'm sure she would've been useful... Hell, even Laurel has been more in the centerfold than Felicity had since the show returned in January which makes watching the show all the more painful now. :/ 

 

I really hope season 4 fixes this. Anyways. I want to ask you guys, do you guys think Felicity has lost her 'fan favorite' status? And do you think this will affect her status on the show in the future? 

[wingster55]

Not to offend..but if she has...shows the fickleness of the general fandom imo. 

[wonderwall]

Not to offend..but if she has...shows the fickleness of the general fandom imo. 

The Arrow fandom is truly bipolar. 

Edited March 4, 2015 by wonderwall

[wingster55]

I don't think it just applies to Arrow though...

[wonderwall]

I don't think it just applies to Arrow though...

 

Agreed. I gotta say though, Arrow isn't as bad as other fandoms like Supernatural or The Walking Dead or even The Flash. Damn those fandoms... I walked in and walked right back out. 

[Chaser]

I think her popularity has taken a bit of a hit. She is at the center of a love triangle, odds with a popular lead and is being pulled away from the Team. I don't care how popular a character is, that is a really hard sell. Especially, when it doesn't really feel organic. On paper it all makes sense, but on screen its harder to buy.

 

However, I would still consider her a "fan favorite." She still trends regularly, the show is still using her to sell. Its funny, I think in a way the Ray hook-up was a good thing for Felicity. I saw people who were getting mad at Felicity, turn it to the writers and Ray for trying to make this happen.

 

I have no doubt that once Oliver and Felicity are on the same page again, Felicity's popularity is going to go back up. Olicity is also a huge factor. The show runners and the CW do not want to lose that free publicity. As long as its a force, Felicity's individual popularity won't come into play as much.

 

Agreed. I gotta say though, Arrow isn't as bad as other fandoms like Supernatural or The Walking Dead or even The Flash. Damn those fandoms... I walked in and walked right back out. 

I had to get out of the Supernatural fandom and I won't go near The Flash. It's an advertisement for Payday. All the nut bars.

 

Edited to Edit. Computer flipped out on me.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 4, 2015 by 10Eleven12

[CabotCove]

So I've been thinking about this for a bit... I feel as though Felicity has lost her 'fan favorite' status on the show as more and more people have been against her and her motivations this season. I guess this is because she's opposed to Oliver since episode 2. While it's kind of sad that more people started to hate her even though she's pretty much one of the only few characters on the show that is making sense, I wonder if this will affect her future status on the show?

 

I dont think so, Emily Bett Rickards is pretty awesome, I doubt the showrunners want to lose her. They also know that there will be at least two other superhero shows that would be itching to take her on board if they, so make such a bad decision. 

 

I kind of hate that Felicity's screentime is mostly with Ray now, which is why I feel like a lot of people think she's become useless. She's helping a non-entity and a character that means nothing to the show's narrative. So basically this season, because Felicity has been associated with a non-entity, she herself has become a non-entity.

 

Disagree, some people were eventually and inevitably going to turn on Felicity. Its sexism/misogyny 101, it has happened before and  it will happen again. Not saying thats the whole story but there is an element to it. Its no coincidence that as soon as a female character starts strongly opposing a male usually a lead or not being there for him at every whim: the war begins. I dont think she will ever stop being a "fan favourite", most people in fandom can recognize a good thing when they see it, but she will likely have more backlash that before. She has been and will be hated for having emotions, flaws, opinions, well its just not realistic  that she would not have any of these throughout the series' run.

 

No there is no way I want the writers to "fix" Felicity to become a one dimensional and an idealized version, just so she can remain in some people's good books and retain her full popularity. The Arrow writers maybe a lot of things but I dont foresee them betraying Emily/Felicity by resetting the character, so yeah I do think some of the hate and backlash is inevitable. Do I think that they are also some valid concerns about Felicity's writing that are said out of love, yeah definately. Im not opposed to them fixing that, which doesnt sacrifice or betrayal the character and her growth arc.

Edited March 4, 2015 by Conell

[MsSchadenfreude]

 

Disagree, some people were eventually and inevitably going to turn on Felicity . Its sexism/misogyny 101, it has happened before and  it will happen again. Not saying thats the whole story but there is an element to it. Its no coincidence that as soon as a female character starts strongly opposing a male or not being there for him at every whim: the war begins. I dont think she will ever stop being a "fan favourite", most people n fandom can recognize a good thing when they see it, but she will likely have more backlash that before.

 

I agree most female characters get this eventually, but I also think there is too much emphasis put on this supposed huge backlash.  Yes, some people are fed up with Felicity, but that was always there it just seems more widespread now because Felicity is doing more than hanging in the lair supporting the team.  No character is universally liked so Felicity getting some blowback doesn't mean she is expendable.  Even if everyone online suddenly hated Felicity (which they clearly don't) approximately 3 million people watch this show every week, viewers who go online (myself included obviously) are not as big of a deal as people try to make them.

[looptab]

I agree most female characters get this eventually, but I also think there is too much emphasis put on this supposed huge backlash.  Yes, some people are fed up with Felicity, but that was always there it just seems more widespread now because Felicity is doing more than hanging in the lair supporting the team.  No character is universally liked so Felicity getting some blowback doesn't mean she is expendable.  Even if everyone online suddenly hated Felicity (which they clearly don't) approximately 3 million people watch this show every week, viewers who go online (myself included obviously) are not as big of a deal as people try to make them.

I agree. She is also doing some choices that are "questionable" in the eyes of some fans. 

 

The thing is, there are very few people who feel the need to comment an article just to praise the show/an episode. Most people will comment on something when they feel the need to complain, IMO. So it looks like there is more backlash towards her character because there is more room for it this year.

The show has also focused more on storylines that don't require her expertise, as of now, resulting in her being less useful and involved than usual in terms of TA missions, beside  what has been said about her being at odds with Oliver and away with Palmer. 

 

However, as far as I can tell, from reading comments around the internet, Felicity's detractors can be divided in these categories:

 

 

1- Those who have always cared little about/been annoyed by her;

 

2- Those who think the romance is taking up too much of the show, or that the show should just be about costumed heroes kicking butts;

 

3- Those who preferred her merely as the comic relief and want her relegated back to that status:

 

4-Those who were her fans but can't accept/understand her behaviour lately;

 

5- Those who have always hated her that now have the opportunity to come out and play.

 

 I was sad, too, reading a bunch of comments saying that they hope she goes with Ray at the end of the season. But. then again, everyone has their favourite, everyone is entitled to their opinion. I know I'd like to see *another character* far far away from the show. :)

At the end of the day I console myself with the knowledge that those who love her are still waaay more than those who don't. :D

Edited March 4, 2015 by looptab

[statsgirl]

The EPs thought Felicity/EBR was bullet-proof and so they could use her to advance plot and forget about writing her to character. They were wrong.

 

Part of the problem is that one of the reasons people loved Felicity is because she brought humor and light to that very dour Arrow cave. This season she's cried more that every other character on the show put together, and with he exception of the cross-over eps, when she has had a funny, it's been a malapropism with Ray.  I didn't think those were funny because I was cringing at the whole set up and fortifying myself for when the lunge happened. Not fun.

 

They've also taken away the enjoyable parts of her relationship with Oliver for his identity crisis and manpain.  I think the increase in "thank goodness Olicity is dead" posts can be attributed to the fact that Olicity is no fun any more either.

 

One of the things that bothers me about Felicity this season is that we never hear her side of anything.  Oliver has Diggle to talk to, Diggle has Lyla and Oliver, and Felicity has no one close to her to talk to because she's always being used to prop Laurel and Ray.  MG apparently thinks that a scene with Felicity and Laurel is as good as one with Felicity talking to Diggle.

 

I have no doubt that once Oliver and Felicity are on the same page again, Felicity's popularity is going to go back up. Olicity is also a huge factor. The show runners and the CW do not want to lose that free publicity. As long as its a force, Felicity's individual popularity won't come into play as much.

This.  It wouldn't (won't?) take much to get her back to her fan favorite status again, and if the EPs are paying attention, they'll do that next season or if we're lucky, by the end of this one.

[Angel12d]

I do think Felicity has taken a hit this season and that's because of poor writing and the EP's thinking she's invincible. She's not. However, I honestly think most of the problems will be solved when she's allowed to be friends with Oliver again, and when they get rid of Ray. Purposefully keeping her apart from Oliver and the growing distance from the team has not felt organic in the slightest and that's where most of my issues have come from.