Little House On The Prairie - General Discussion

[Blergh]

17 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I missed the very first part of, The Voice of Tinker Jones.

But I just have to ask, why did Charles side with Harriet and her husband Nels when they wanted to add the Oleson's bell to the church?  Who in their right mind would side with the Oleson's when it came to anything?  Did Charles think it would end with a plaque?  There would have been more demands.

Tinker Jones put in all of his time and hard work into making the bell, and the adults didn't offer him a dime.  Yes, the children helped, by "acquiring" the metal for melting and also helped in the bell making process.   But still, Tinker Jones deserved something.

I agree that it seemed to make little sense for Charles to side with Harriet on this one. However, since she WAS the storekeeper and he may not have thought it was worth them getting all their supplies in Mankato, it could be that (for once) Charles thought it was more practical to side with Harriet on this. Also, perhaps he may have thought if the Olesons' donated the bell outright, he and the other struggling farmers would have been off the hook to raise funds for it- and a plaque would have been a small price for it.

Of course, the only positive reason to have possibly sided with Mr. Kennedy would have been that he was the father of Mary's pal Christy Kennedy who she declared 'was going to be her best friend' on the girls' first day of school but would only appear in ten episodes in the first two seasons  before vanishing altogether. Melissa Sue Anderson actually said  in her autobio that the performer(Tracie Savage) WAS her best friend on the set but why she quickly wound up being a background character before disappearing altogether went unaddressed. 

Yes, I like the storyline of the children taking matters in their own hands after the adults split the town over this feud AND Tinker Jones making a bell everyone loved (and I agree it's sad that they never used that character played by the talented Chuck McCann again). Of course, if one listens to the bell used at the end of that episode it has a much different pitch than the one used for the rest of the series. In fact, it's somewhat closer to a Russian church bell than the US Midwestern barn dinner bell the viewers are familiar with. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

Also featuring a young Sean Penn! 

[Blergh]

34 minutes ago, Superclam said:

Also featuring a young Sean Penn! 

As a background kid who behaved well. Of course, the fact this episode was directed by the performer's father Leo may have been a contributing factor to him not being a jerk onscreen-a rare episode NOT directed by ML himself.

[Mr. Sparkle]

So help me, "May We Make Them Proud" is starting now. I don't know if I have the strength! 

The pipe is already ominously smoking in the box of rags they left it in. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

CLOSE THE DOOR AND TAKE THE BABY!! CLOSE THE DOOR AND TAKE THE BABY!! 

 

[Mr. Sparkle]

Yeah, NOW Adam wants to go back for the baby. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

That lullaby scene is freaking chilling AF!! 

 

Doc Baker has remarkable detective skills for a country doctor. Able to determine the cause of the fire in 3 minutes. "A pipe. Someone just threw it away for some reason." You can totally tell that from a basement full of cinders. 

[Zella]

1 minute ago, Superclam said:

Doc Baker has remarkable detective skills for a country doctor. Able to determine the cause of the fire in 3 minutes. "A pipe. Someone just threw it away for some reason." You can totally tell that from a basement full of cinders. 

In an alternate universe, Doc Baker would have starred in CSI: Walnut Grove as the Gil Grissom-esque character. 

[CountryGirl]

2 hours ago, Superclam said:

CLOSE THE DOOR AND TAKE THE BABY!! CLOSE THE DOOR AND TAKE THE BABY!! 

 

I cannot watch this two-parter, especially part one. It just makes me rage too much. 

[Snow Apple]

3 hours ago, Superclam said:

Also featuring a young Sean Penn!

Here's a story that Alison has about Sean Penn. Hope the link works.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/little-house-star-alison-arngrim-explains-the-great-debt-she-owes-sean-penn-155942827.html

[jird]

20 minutes ago, Snow Apple said:

Here's a story that Alison has about Sean Penn. Hope the link works.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/little-house-star-alison-arngrim-explains-the-great-debt-she-owes-sean-penn-155942827.html

He was in Money Crop, too???

2 hours ago, Superclam said:

CLOSE THE DOOR AND TAKE THE BABY!! CLOSE THE DOOR AND TAKE THE BABY!! 

 

NO ONE WOULD LEAVE THE BABY. NO ONE.

[Katy M]

2 hours ago, Superclam said:

That lullaby scene is freaking chilling AF!! 

 

Doc Baker has remarkable detective skills for a country doctor. Able to determine the cause of the fire in 3 minutes. "A pipe. Someone just threw it away for some reason." You can totally tell that from a basement full of cinders. 

Albert confessed it, but due to doctor patient confidentiality he had to just pretend he knew:)

[Mr. Sparkle]

25 minutes ago, Katy M said:

Albert confessed it, but due to doctor patient confidentiality he had to just pretend he knew:)

This was well after Albert's tell-tale heart was ticking. Doc went down the next day (into the basement that wasn't really smoking and was largely cleared of debris, miraculously) to instantly determine the cause of the fire. 

[Katy M]

40 minutes ago, Superclam said:

This was well after Albert's tell-tale heart was ticking. Doc went down the next day (into the basement that wasn't really smoking and was largely cleared of debris, miraculously) to instantly determine the cause of the fire. 

I put the smiley face to say I was kidding.

[Mr. Sparkle]

3 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I put the smiley face to say I was kidding.

Lol, I thought you just missed a parentheses. 

[Egg McMuffin]

There is no mother who would have leave someone else to take her baby out of danger if she was able to do it herself. Mary’s maternal instincts would have kicked in and her son would have been her highest priority.

Also, Alice should have smashed the window (preferably not using the baby to do it) and tossed the baby to Hester Sue.

The whole thing is just completely ridiculous. At least write it so that Mary could not physically reach the baby to begin with so there’s a valid reason for Baby Kendall to be trapped. Or just not do that gruesome story. If they really wanted to get rid of Alice (no objections here) then they could have used Little House’s accidental death of choice - a stagecoach accident, complete with bloody hand of death.

Edited July 21, 2021 by Kyle

[jird]

I forgot how much I love Harriet Oleson in Money Crop. She is really nice to the pregnant lady whose husband is missing, and kicks the mean guys off the mercantile steps with her broom. Nels is surprisingly indifferent.

[Mr. Sparkle]

32 minutes ago, jird said:

I forgot how much I love Harriet Oleson in Money Crop. She is really nice to the pregnant lady whose husband is missing, and kicks the mean guys off the mercantile steps with her broom. Nels is surprisingly indifferent.

That's such an odd episode, and one I didn't see during my original run in the 80s. Of course, we never see that couple again. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

2 hours ago, Kyle said:

There is no mother who would have leave someone else to take her baby out of danger if she was able to do it herself. Mary’s maternal instincts would have kicked in and her son would have been her highest priority.

Also, Mary and Adam are sitting outside safe, and THEN they notice the baby isn't with them. I hate to play the "as a parent" card, but as a parent, that's just not how it works. 

But like we've all pointed out, it's just bad/lazy writing to get to that situation. 

[debraran]

44 minutes ago, Superclam said:

Also, Mary and Adam are sitting outside safe, and THEN they notice the baby isn't with them. I hate to play the "as a parent" card, but as a parent, that's just not how it works. 

But like we've all pointed out, it's just bad/lazy writing to get to that situation. 

Michael wrote that but he had done much better. Again, maybe as an actor in Hollywood he learned to compartmentalize well but that was shown in 1980, he was divorcing Lynn, which was done in 1982 I think and married in 1983. Tabloids were rampant with junk. I rarely bought them but the headlines were enough. He lost endorsements then, including Kodak I think.

I don't know if it effected his work but sometimes you had to shake your head. He knew children, he knew parenting, he knew what he wrote went against every instinct parents have human or animal. Was the end result that important? IDK, but it could have been way more believable.

Edited July 22, 2021 by debraran

[Mr. Sparkle]

47 minutes ago, debraran said:

Michael wrote that but he had done much better. Again, maybe as an actor in Hollywood he learned to compartmentalize well but that was shown in 1980, he was divorcing Lynn, which was done in 1982 I think and married in 1983. Tabloids were rampant with junk. I rarely bought them but the headlines were enough. He lost endorsements then, including Kodak I think.

Makes some sense, as the quality started to steadily decline after Season 5, which would be about that time. 

[Egg McMuffin]

Or maybe he was just burned out. I was on another board and someone was asking about series stars who get “executive producer” titles. We discussed how most of the time, it’s just a vanity credit, and the star isn’t really the showrunner. Landon is one of the very few exceptions - he was the series star and the showrunner and head writer and often the director. That’s gotta take its toll after awhile. I’m hard pressed to think of anyone else who had that breadth of responsibility. Maybe Pamela Adlon on “Better Things”, but even she isn’t producing 22 hours of material every season.

[Zella]

I'm sure Landon was burnt out, but it seems like he was more burnt out with the show than the workload since he immediately hopped into the same setup with Highway to Heaven. 

I do agree the level of creative control he exerted does seem a bit unusual. I've been watching Justified for the first time lately, and that's a show that is mentioned as a bit of an exception to the "in name only" executive producer title for Tim Olyphant since, by all accounts, he was very involved in the show's production and creative development.

A lot of commentary on the show mentions how frequently ideas he had that were used but, unlike Landon, he is never credited as a writer or director on any episode. But there seems to have been a real spirit of collaboration on that set in general that I don't think Landon would have ever allowed. 

[debraran]

7 hours ago, Zella said:

I'm sure Landon was burnt out, but it seems like he was more burnt out with the show than the workload since he immediately hopped into the same setup with Highway to Heaven. 

I do agree the level of creative control he exerted does seem a bit unusual. I've been watching Justified for the first time lately, and that's a show that is mentioned as a bit of an exception to the "in name only" executive producer title for Tim Olyphant since, by all accounts, he was very involved in the show's production and creative development.

A lot of commentary on the show mentions how frequently ideas he had that were used but, unlike Landon, he is never credited as a writer or director on any episode. But there seems to have been a real spirit of collaboration on that set in general that I don't think Landon would have ever allowed. 

Yes, Landon had an ego and he did like a lot of control. Any bad feedback he got on movies or shows was about that. That's why also LHOP actors were happy and surprised if he let them change something, they only would ask once as "Alice" did with Katherines' prompting. . (Katherine did more, she just didn't care) lol ☺️

He did write a lot but not all and many were directed and written by others. He reused scripts or wrote some "borrowed" by others. (as did other shows) Directing I feel was his passion or just being on set to oversee.

Most of my favs were not written by him, although he had talent. Pretty much the first season wasn't written by Mr Landon, I loved Wisdom of Solomon, I'll be Waving As You Drive Away" For my Lady, Handyman, etc.  He did do "Richest Man in Walnut Grove" which was touching and that feeling was lost later.

I also agree he wanted a clean slate, to move on to other projects and not let anyone else keep LHOP or allow spinoffs. It was tired by then and the scripts awful with a few good ones sprinkled in.  I can't watch ones after Nellie leaves and Nancy comes and Laura is an adult acting like a child at times. I would watch the morphine ones to just see some "old crew" back in Walnut Grove but he destroyed it with new family and no core members left way before it blew up

 

[Blergh]

17 hours ago, Kyle said:

There is no mother who would have leave someone else to take her baby out of danger if she was able to do it herself. Mary’s maternal instincts would have kicked in and her son would have been her highest priority.

Also, Alice should have smashed the window (preferably not using the baby to do it) and tossed the baby to Hester Sue.

The whole thing is just completely ridiculous. At least write it so that Mary could not physically reach the baby to begin with so there’s a valid reason for Baby Kendall to be trapped. Or just not do that gruesome story. If they really wanted to get rid of Alice (no objections here) then they could have used Little House’s accidental death of choice - a stagecoach accident, complete with bloody hand of death.

Or maybe just have had her die from an ailment but the death NOT be depicted- only Doc Baker telling Jonathan 'I'm sorry, Jonathan' then the aftermath.  Also, one can't help but wonder how dangerous it had to have been  to film that whole burning school sequence. 

One question that never got cleared up was where was Hester-Sue supposed to be sleeping in the weeks after the fire. Adam and Mary got to stay in Nellie's Hotel and the students seemed to have been boarded out  to local families  (though none were at Casa Ingalls) but they never said exactly where Hester-Sue was during that time except that she seemed to have stayed close by. 

[Egg McMuffin]

Maybe Hester Sue was in the “ROOMS” above the post office, where Miss Beadle used to live.

[jird]

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

I was not happy when Half Pint traded her horse to Nels for a stove to give to her mom for Christmas.   That pony deserved a better fate than becoming the property of Nellie Oleson.

I am surprised that Nels didn't check with Charles first, to make sure that it was okay for Half Pint to give up her pony.   Yes, it would have ruined the story, but Nels comes off as a complete jerk by not checking with Charles first.  He took advantage of Half Pint.

I don't think he took advantage of her, especially because he'd only offered her $5 earlier. Charles said in front of Nels earlier that it was Laura's horse and it was up to her whether to sell or not. I agree that it seems weird he wouldn't have double-checked with Charles, but I chalk that up to the time, and perhaps Nels thinking that "country folk" do things differently. 

[Zella]

Didn't Laura also swear him to secrecy? I felt like Nels was extending to her the same discretion he would a customer rather than a kid. It didn't read to me as if he was taking advantage. The Ingalls need to get better at coordinating surprise gifts behind each other's backs, though. Lol

[Egg McMuffin]

2 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I was not happy when Half Pint traded her horse to Nels for a stove to give to her mom for Christmas.   That pony deserved a better fate than becoming the property of Nellie Oleson.

Well, the horse died a few episodes later, so I guess we can debate whether or not that was a worse fate than becoming the property of Nellie. I can’t remember if that happened in the episode with Pa’s depressed, recently-widowed father, or the one with Ma’s depressed, recently-widowed father.

[Zella]

4 minutes ago, Kyle said:

Pa’s depressed, recently-widowed father,

It was Pa's dad! 

[debraran]

3 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I was not happy when Half Pint traded her horse to Nels for a stove to give to her mom for Christmas.   That pony deserved a better fate than becoming the property of Nellie Oleson.

I am surprised that Nels didn't check with Charles first, to make sure that it was okay for Half Pint to give up her pony.   Yes, it would have ruined the story, but Nels comes off as a complete jerk by not checking with Charles first.  He took advantage of Half Pint.

I agree. Despite what Charles said who lets a five-year-old even in the 1800s make a decision about such an expensive gift? Not only could it be a silly thing but horses weren’t like dogs and she didn’t have the maturity to really understand. It made a cute story though.  I could never give a horse to a mean girl on a lame promise though just because I  couldn’t think of a gift. Laura almost did it again with the puppy when she was angry at her father about the Sanderson kids

Edited July 22, 2021 by debraran

[Katy M]

1 hour ago, debraran said:

I agree. Despite what Charles said who lets a five-year-old even in the 1800s make a decision about such an expensive gift? Not only could it be a silly thing but horses weren’t like dogs and she didn’t have the maturity to really understand. It made a cute story though.  I could never give a horse to a mean girl on a lame promise though just because I  couldn’t think of a gift. Laura almost did it again with the puppy when she was angry at her father about the Sanderson kids

I hope she wasn't 5 because she got married less than 6 years later.

[BigBingerBro]

She was around 10  (IRL)

Edited July 23, 2021 by BigBingerBro

[debraran]

7 hours ago, BigBingerBro said:

She was around 10  (IRL)

Yes probably around 7 on show, Michael liked to keep her younger as long as possible. Poor Carrie was always about 5

Edited July 23, 2021 by debraran

[jason88cubs]

On 7/22/2021 at 10:42 AM, Kyle said:

Maybe Hester Sue was in the “ROOMS” above the post office, where Miss Beadle used to live.

miss beadle actually had her own place

[Blergh]

23 hours ago, debraran said:

I agree. Despite what Charles said who lets a five-year-old even in the 1800s make a decision about such an expensive gift? Not only could it be a silly thing but horses weren’t like dogs and she didn’t have the maturity to really understand. It made a cute story though.  I could never give a horse to a mean girl on a lame promise though just because I  couldn’t think of a gift. Laura almost did it again with the puppy when she was angry at her father about the Sanderson kids

Not to mention, despite the fact that Charles had given Laura Bunny as a present, since Laura was a minor child living under his roof (and he was the family property owner), I don't think Laura could have truly been legally entitled to give or trade the horse to another person (not even Nellie) without Charles's express permission. Hence, I think Nels at the very least should have insisted to Laura that he'd have to clear any possible trade with Charles before he could  to allow it (and Charles could have [and, in fact, SHOULD have ] vetoed it especially since he knew that Laura loved Bunny AND even he couldn't deny that Nellie had shown she was a mean child who wouldn't have been above being mean to animals. Even as late as them delivering the stove, Charles should have piped up that the horse was NOT Laura's to give away and that he himself would pay for the stove in installments as he had originally intended.  Let's not forget that Bunny wasn't just Laura's pet/friend but also a possible replacement for either Pet or Pam if one or both of the Ingalls' horses ever became lame or died. 

[Rose Quartz]

On 7/22/2021 at 6:18 PM, icemiser69 said:

After living with Nellie for awhile, I wouldn't have been shocked if the pony did himself in and went hooves up. 

All kidding aside, I haven't seen that episode yet, so I didn't know what happened to the horse until you mentioned it.  That said, that is good to know,   I don't like watching depressing animal stories.  

There's a cute two parter where Laura gets Bunny back from Nellie and then they compete against each other in a big race, so keep an eye out for those episodes.  I was horse crazy as a kid and really liked that storyline so I was very upset when they killed off Bunny a few episodes later.  😒

[Snow Apple]

Towards the end of Sweet Sixteen, Almanzo was talking to Eliza Jane about Laura. Eliza asked "What did she do" in a curious way, but when he said Laura didn't do anything, Eliza asked "What did *you* do?!" and her tone was like "you're my brother but I will kill you."

 Eliza Jane was such an awesome character.

Edited July 24, 2021 by Snow Apple

[Egg McMuffin]

On 7/23/2021 at 10:49 PM, Rose Quartz said:

There's a cute two parter where Laura gets Bunny back from Nellie and then they compete against each other in a big race, so keep an eye out for those episodes.  I was horse crazy as a kid and really liked that storyline so I was very upset when they killed off Bunny a few episodes later.  😒

Bunny was very difficult on set. Wanted organic carrots and raw sugar and things like that.

[Egg McMuffin]

On 7/23/2021 at 2:09 PM, jason88cubs said:

miss beadle actually had her own place

I was watching The Troublemaker (the one with the dreaded Mr. Applewood) and when Charles knocks on her door, he comes right into a room with her bed in it. So in that episode, at least, she seems to have a rented room rather than a whole house.

Edited July 25, 2021 by Kyle

[Brn2bwild]

I've been watching batches of episodes on Peacock, including the first half of Season 5.  I think they ended the Winoka storyline too soon.  I wanted to see more of Mrs. Oleson as a barmaid and the Olesons in general dealing with no longer being the richest family in town.  

[Egg McMuffin]

Totally agreed. I always wondered why they wrapped it up so quickly. They had the two part episode where they moved to Winoka, followed by two regular hour long episodes in Winoka. And then a two parter where they decide to go home. But the second part of that one is 90 min, so both parts didn’t usually air as part of the daily syndication package. When we were watching it reruns, they were suddenly back in WG with no explanation at all.

I think they could have gotten a whole season out of Winoka stories. And it would have made the return to WG so much more impactful.

[Brn2bwild]

13 minutes ago, Kyle said:

Totally agreed. I always wondered why they wrapped it up so quickly. They had the two part episode where they moved to Winoka, followed by two regular hour long episodes in Winoka. And then a two parter where they decide to go home. But the second part of that one is 90 min, so both parts didn’t usually air as part of the daily syndication package. When we were watching it reruns, they were suddenly back in WG with no explanation at all.

I think they could have gotten a whole season out of Winoka stories. And it would have made the return to WG so much more impactful.

That would have been interesting.  Especially if they came back and found that the town was running fine because new people had moved in, including the Wilders.

[Zella]

14 minutes ago, Brn2bwild said:

 Especially if they came back and found that the town was running fine because new people had moved in, including the Wilders.

"Charles, we discovered that the town actually runs better when your bare chest and breakable ribs aren't here. You need to leave again to ensure things keep running smoothly. Sorry. Not sorry."

[Brn2bwild]

1 minute ago, Zella said:

"Charles, we discovered that the town actually runs better when your bare chest and breakable ribs aren't here. You need to leave again to ensure things keep running smoothly. Sorry. Not sorry."

LOL!  That could have been a really good storyline.  The Ingalls family returns and finds they've been "replaced" as the go-to family, so to speak.  The Wilders are the new stars of the town, and Charles has to get used to not being Saint Charles the All Knowing, and find his place among the new set.  Meanwhile Laura has to adjust to Albert (ugh, yes he'd still be there) as well as slowly develop affection for her father's "rival," Almanzo Wilder.

[Egg McMuffin]

1 hour ago, Brn2bwild said:

That would have been interesting.  Especially if they came back and found that the town was running fine because new people had moved in, including the Wilders.

Or maybe the town is populated with faded carbon copies of those who left. Like John and Sarah Carter, with their daughters Cassandra and Jenny. And the new store owners have an even more evil daughter, Nancy!

[Zella]

3 minutes ago, Kyle said:

Or maybe the town is populated with faded carbon copies of those who left. Like John and Sarah Carter, with their daughters Cassandra and Jenny. And the new store owners have an even more evil daughter, Nancy!

Honestly that would make more sense than some of the later episodes. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

And there's an orangutan for some reason. And said orangutan is SMART ENOUGH TO GET A CHILD OUT OF A BURNING HOUSE!!! 

[CheshireCat]

On 7/21/2021 at 12:03 PM, Superclam said:

So help me, "May We Make Them Proud" is starting now. I don't know if I have the strength!

I've only watched it once, as a pre-teen or young teenager and I've never forgotten that scene of Alice Garvey standing at the window with the baby in her arms. Granted, I had a scare with fire as a toddler (my hair caught on fire due to a candle) and have always had a very healthy respect of fire. Still, I find the inclusion of that scene unnecessarily cruel and horrific.

[debraran]

4 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

I've only watched it once, as a pre-teen or young teenager and I've never forgotten that scene of Alice Garvey standing at the window with the baby in her arms. Granted, I had a scare with fire as a toddler (my hair caught on fire due to a candle) and have always had a very healthy respect of fire. Still, I find the inclusion of that scene unnecessarily cruel and horrific.

Probably not a "jump the shark" moment, I'm sure other things were worse, but I remember the show going off and my mom's landline phone ringing and relatives saying "Did you see that??" He got that immediate reaction for ratings and tuning in next week, but the hating it was there too. The only thing that was better was you saw it once, you saw it again in rerun maybe but you couldn't stream it, I don't think they even had VCR's then. You missed the goofs which can be fun but you also didn't torture yourself with return visits.

The writing was just off, the directing. It was horrific because they already showed enough fire suicides or attempted (Charles dad) but how they had Mary lose another child because she was blind was pathetic. Just have her infertile, would be more believable. Then Caroline thinks it's odd she doesn't want to go to her child's funeral, maybe never saw catatonic before, and that lullaby! Having Albert carry the weight of his actions and then immediate forgiveness was nice but still odd since 2 deaths had people reeling. I understand fully why MSA said "enough!" She was never going to be happy. I would have loved a spinoff with her and Adam and Nellie and Percival in NYC. ;)

I know I haven't smoked since I was 16 but always had a healthy fear of candles. This show made it worse even though we had smoke detectors now.