All Episodes Talk

[chessiegal]

Does anyone watch Frasier on DVD? A channel dropped a show I was watching this summer before I could get all the episodes recorded. I bought the series on DVD, and the edits/cuts in the syndicated show are subtle to glaring. Just wondered if Frasier is the same.

[Ms Blue Jay]

I only watch Frasier on DVD.  I've seen them millions of times.  I never watch it on syndication anymore so I don't know the difference.

I think I've tried on CMT, but that was back in the day, maybe 5 years ago.  

[Ms Blue Jay]

Niles's cockatoo is almost as annoying as Ross Geller's pet monkey.

On 11/16/2021 at 10:14 PM, jird said:

I have been singing, "If you've got a problem, if you're feeling low" to myself because it is stuck in my head and I had to try to explain what it was when my husband heard me.

All you gotta do is ask.  All you gotta do is aaaaaaaaaaask.

[Ailianna]

Baby (the cockatoo) had a much worse end than the monkey though. I mean, I'm glad she wasn't around longer, but the monkey at least didn't die.

[Ms Blue Jay]

Daphne's earring!  So irresponsible, she already knew that they were loose but continued to wear them around the food anyway.

[Ms Blue Jay]

Niles:  Don't you DARE call me "irrational" you know how crazy that makes me!

[Ms Blue Jay]

Another good Martin moment.  He picks out Frasier's stalker from a huge crowd of women in red dresses, even after Frasier goes through the trouble of hiring a bodyguard and goes insane with paranoia, etc.

I wanted to mention the Season 1 episode where Lilith comes back, but it was jampacked with so many clever lines I didn't even know where to start.

Remember when Lilith calls into Frasier's radio show?

Frasier: Well, Seattle, we have a celebrity of sorts on the line. This is my ex-wife, Lilith.
Lilith: What do you mean by "celebrity?"
Frasier:  Oh theyy knowwww youuuu.

And Roz laughing hysterically in her booth!  This is one of Roz's best episodes.  She takes so much pleasure in driving Frasier crazy.

Holy crap, for the Niles-Roz lovers, from the "Fool me Once" episode:

Niles:  Frasier, your briefcase had the same inferior leather.
Roz:  I GAVE him that briefcase!
Niles (giggles and lightly chucks Roz on the shoulder):  I know.

Ooooh boy!  Niles and Roz really have chemistry sometimes! 

Edited November 27, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Ms Blue Jay]

How do you guys feel about Simon?  Love?  Hate?  Gertrude?

It's funny, when I was younger I thought, why would they cast this Italian guy from the U.S. (I was obviously stereotyping him as someone from Brooklyn or something, LOL) as somebody British?  LOL Anthony is Australian which I didn't realize at the time.

I watched all of Without a Trace at some point and enjoyed it.  I'm also a fan of "So I Married An Axe Murderer".  Anthony definitely has range because I think I forget that's all the same actor.

Edited November 29, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[WearyTraveler]

2 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

How do you guys feel about Simon?  Love?  Hate?  Gertrude?

It's funny, when I was younger I thought, why would they cast this Italian guy from the U.S. (I was obviously stereotyping him as someone from Brooklyn or something, LOL) as somebody British?  LOL Anthony is Australian which I didn't realize at the time.

I watched all of Without a Trace at some point and enjoyed it.  I'm also a fan of "So I Married An Axe Murderer".  Anthony definitely has range because I think I forget that's all the same actor.

I hated Simon. I thought they took it too far. I watched almost all of Without a Trace, and Anthony fine in it. Must have been a director/script thing with Simon.

I liked Gertrude as the annoying mother. But also thought she had overstayed her welcome

[tessaray]

Didn't someone at the network want to spin off Simon with his own show? I'm profoundly grateful that never happened. I disliked most of Daphne's relatives, though her father was slightly amusing. Or maybe I  just didn't mind the actor.

[SusanM]

Disliked all Daphne's family intensely and now I just skip any episode that any of them are in.  I'm probably missing a few gems but life is too short.

Had a Frasier moment today - found an empty bag of potato chips in the garbage this morning that wasn't there last night.  My husband told me he woke up at 3am couldn't get back to sleep and decided 'to hell with the diet'.  First words out of my mouth were "Bebe slipped" - said, hopefully, in exactly the same way the fabulous Harriet Sansom Harris delivered that line!

[Athena]

I didn't like any of Daphne's family and Simon and Gertrude overstayed their welcome. I think the actors were fine. The drama not so much. They should have kept those storylines short to a couple of eps max. I didn't mind the Daphne story lines of her insecurity being with Niles which I think added to the development of the characters and the relationship. Her family didn't add much to Daphne's character.

[Annber03]

I wasn't familiar with any of the actors who played Daphne's family until I saw them on "Frasier", and even now I still don't know that I've seen much of anything they've been in outside that show.

But I didn't mind them. I agree a little of them went a long way and there were episodes where they were better utilized than others, and I would certainly be overwhelmed by them in real life :p.

But they had their entertaining moments. I did like how Simon constantly drove Frasier crazy, and the odd friendship he developed with Martin :D. 

[andromeda331]

I liked Simon in the first couple episodes I like that he drove Frasier crazy and his friendship with Martin. But I agree he overstayed his welcome. I hated the rest of her family especially her mother. She was a horrible woman. I did always like hearing stories about her brother Billy though.

[Ms Blue Jay]

It would have been really nice if we could actually meet Billy and if we could actually meet Daphne's favourite brother, Stephen.

They all were running around at the wedding but we never got extended meetings with them and Google says we finally meet Stephen at the finale.  

[peacheslatour]

Quote

But I didn't mind them. I agree a little of them went a long way and there were episodes where they were better utilized than others, and I would certainly be overwhelmed by them in real life :p.

This. I cringed every time I saw Simon. He was too out of control and overbearing. Even Roz had a hard time dealing with him.

Edited November 30, 2021 by peacheslatour

[Annber03]

33 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Even Roz had a hard time dealing with him.

"Simon? There's a guy who lives in the park across from me, he wears a cat suit and meows at people. If he's busy, maybe I'll call you." 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I've always written off Seasons 8-10 before but I'm watching Season 8 now and I'm surprised that I'm kind of enjoying myself.  Maybe it's the desperation of having finished the other seasons.

[Annber03]

Yeah, I think the latter seasons had their strong runs and episodes, too. There's some episodes in season 8 I really like, definitely - "Frasier's Edge" and "Daphne Returns" being a couple examples. 

[Irlandesa]

7 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I've always written off Seasons 8-10 before but I'm watching Season 8 now and I'm surprised that I'm kind of enjoying myself.  Maybe it's the desperation of having finished the other seasons.

I had that experience too for a while that I thought there was a big drop off.  But when I eventually started watching the seasons in reruns, it wasn't the kind of drop off where the show went from hilarious to barely entertaining.  I didn't like the stories as much but the laughs were still good.

[Ms Blue Jay]

8 hours ago, Annber03 said:

Yeah, I think the latter seasons had their strong runs and episodes, too. There's some episodes in season 8 I really like, definitely - "Frasier's Edge" and "Daphne Returns" being a couple examples. 

Daphne returns - and in the same vein Room Full of Heroes - were episodes that I used to look forward to watching.  But now I think I'm in this headspace where I don't even want to watch the dramatic episodes.  Same with Visions of Daphne.  They're all episodes where Niles is taken to task.  They all used to be part of my favourites but I don't think I'm in the mood.

I find myself enjoying some of the Season 8 episodes like Motor Skills and Hooping Cranes, episodes with a much lighter tone.  Frasier and Niles are so funny being the bad kids in the class.  The whiplash change in their acting is marvelous.  I've always liked The New Friend and Mary Christmas.

Edited December 2, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Annber03]

4 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Daphne returns - and in the same vein Room Full of Heroes - were episodes that I used to look forward to watching.  But now I think I'm in this headspace where I don't even want to watch the dramatic episodes.  Same with Visions of Daphne.  They're all episodes where Niles is taken to task.  They all used to be part of my favourites but I don't think I'm in the mood.

I get that. "Visions of Daphne" is one of my favorite episodes of the series, because I think everyone captures the drama of it all so perfectly, and Pierce captures Niles' absolute heartbreak especially well in that one. But it's not a happy episode to watch, no. And "Room Full of Heroes" is interesting in terms of what it reveals about the Cranes' relationship with each other, and it's fun to see everyone in their Halloween costumes as well. But yeah, it ends on kind of an odd, awkward, down note. 

Quote

I find myself enjoying some of the Season 8 episodes like Motor Skills and Hooping Cranes, episodes with a much lighter tone.  Frasier and Niles are so funny being the bad kids in the class.  The whiplash change in their acting is marvelous.  I've always liked The New Friend and Mary Christmas.

I love when the teacher sees them trying to pass a note back and forth, takes it, looks at it, and goes, "...does anyone here speak French?" :p. And then Niles and Frasier both slowly raise their hands. 

"The New Friend" is fun because of how Roz and Frasier both keep trying to sneak around with that other guy. Isn't that the same one where Niles keeps overhearing them both changing their plans, once so Frasier and Roz can go out together, then to each try and make time with the guy, and it just keeps going back and forth for a time.

And then Frasier tells Niles that he may actually be free to do something with him that night and Niles simply goes, "No, you're not." XD. 

[peacheslatour]

6 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I get that. "Visions of Daphne" is one of my favorite episodes of the series, because I think everyone captures the drama of it all so perfectly, and Pierce captures Niles' absolute heartbreak especially well in that one. But it's not a happy episode to watch, no. And "Room Full of Heroes" is interesting in terms of what it reveals about the Cranes' relationship with each other, and it's fun to see everyone in their Halloween costumes as well. But yeah, it ends on kind of an odd, awkward, down note. 

I love when the teacher sees them trying to pass a note back and forth, takes it, looks at it, and goes, "...does anyone here speak French?" :p. And then Niles and Frasier both slowly raise their hands. 

"The New Friend" is fun because of how Roz and Frasier both keep trying to sneak around with that other guy. Isn't that the same one where Niles keeps overhearing them both changing their plans, once so Frasier and Roz can go out together, then to each try and make time with the guy, and it just keeps going back and forth for a time.

And then Frasier tells Niles that he may actually be free to do something with him that night and Niles simply goes, "No, you're not." XD. 

You can really tell the writers studied French farce in some of these. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

7 hours ago, Annber03 said:

I get that. "Visions of Daphne" is one of my favorite episodes of the series, because I think everyone captures the drama of it all so perfectly, and Pierce captures Niles' absolute heartbreak especially well in that one. But it's not a happy episode to watch, no.

Thanks for getting it.  I used to love watching VOD too but I think I'm in this easy going, happy holiday mode and seriously, these old Frasier episodes have been putting me in the best mood every night.  

The thing about Daphne's psychic ability.  Clearly Frasier and Niles consider themselves men of science (and their mother was a scientist) and they don't believe in Daphne's ability.  Yet, Daphne has had visions that were 100% true.  (She saw where Eddie was when he was lost.  She had visions of the man that she was meant to be with with a dragon, and Niles was with that dragon statue from Roz, apologies if I'm getting the details wrong).  So I guess, the show wants us to believe that she IS psychic?

Edited December 3, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Annber03]

4 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Thanks for getting it.  I used to love watching VOD too but I think I'm in this easy going, happy holiday mode and seriously, these old Frasier episodes have been putting me in the best mood every night.  

The thing about Daphne's psychic ability.  Clearly Frasier and Niles consider themselves men of science (and their mother was a scientist) and they don't believe in Daphne's ability.  Yet, Daphne has had visions that were 100% true.  (She saw where Eddie was when he was lost.  She had visions of the man that he was meant to be with with a dragon, and Niles was with that dragon statue from Roz, apologies if I'm getting the details wrong).  So I guess, the show wants us to believe that she IS psychic?

Sometimes you need something light, especially at a time of year that can be stressful enough already :).

There was that one episode where Daphne took that test to see if she was psychic, only to not wind up getting the official results. Based off the examples you gave, at the very least, she clearly had some kind of a...sixth sense, as it were, that she seemed attuned to, and she was more likely to listen to her gut/intuition/dreams. The fact those visions and dreams were so specific does seem to imply the show wanted us to think Daphne actually did have psychic abilities, but I can see where someone would (try to) argue those visions and dreams coming true was mere coincidence, too. I think for the most part the show wanted to leave it all ambiguous, but yeah, those moments do seem to lean more towards a definitive answer on that debate. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Why did Wendie Malick wear that horrible wig when she played Ronnie?  I could never warm up to the character.  I'm rewatching her first episode and oh my lord, it is so so so bad.  It doesn't even look like it's on the right way.  And the colour!

Edited December 3, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Ms Blue Jay]

If you want another episode where Martin outsmarts Frasier, look no further than "Retirement is Murder" when Frasier thinks he's cracked Martin's unsolved case. 😉

[andromeda331]

9 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

If you want another episode where Martin outsmarts Frasier, look no further than "Retirement is Murder" when Frasier thinks he's cracked Martin's unsolved case. 😉

I love how Frasier never stopped to think about his monkey is a murder theory sounded crazy.

[Ms Blue Jay]

Niles and Daphne thought it made sense too.  I feel so bad for Frasier in this ep, lol.  

[Annber03]

2 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I feel so bad for Frasier in this ep, lol.  

When he makes the Clarence Darrow joke at the end and everyone just stares at him...:p. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Tell me Frasier, what was the monkey's motive?

[Queena]

On 10/27/2021 at 1:47 AM, Ms Blue Jay said:

Quoting myself, I'm watching this again and I never noticed Frasier's facial reaction to this.  I'm LOSING MY MIND laughing.

Why does Niles know SO much about Jewish culture?  Why is he taking SO much joy at pretending to be Jewish?  LOL

Faye telling Niles to "send the elevator back up" for her is SO odd.  I've never heard of such a thing.  She can't press the button herself?  Are elevators different in fancier buildings?  

Martin knew the Christmas tree was in the powder room, so when Mrs. Moskowitz wanted to use the powder room, he should have intervened, but he just stood there.

The only other time I've ever heard that phrase is when I would visit family living in the high-rise projects in Chicago. The elevators were so slow, the buttons didn't work on certain floors, and the elevator sometimes didn't stop on certain floors unless the button was pressed while in the elevator. 

 

Mrs. Moskowitz is one of my favorite episodes. 

 

Horrible times. Horrible times. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

So, I totally forgot that Martin MADE OUT WITH ROZ.  The episode is "I'm Listening" in Season 11 and apparently it's an episode I never watch.

Quote

Ronee: Okay, go ahead. But you better make it good, because I have a finely tuned crap-ometer.
Martin: There is no Sheila. Her name's Roz. She's Frasier's secretary. I just pretended we were together.

Why the hell would Martin call Roz Frasier's secretary?  That was soooooooooooo weird.  And it was the last season of the show!  It was 2003.  Just one of the oddest details that makes no sense.

Edited December 11, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[peacheslatour]

Quote

Why the hell would Martin call Roz Frasier's secretary?  That was soooooooooooo weird.  And it was the last season of the show!  It was 2003.  Just one of the oddest details that makes no sense.

She was his producer! Jeez.

[Ms Blue Jay]

3 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

She was his producer! Jeez.

And for 11 years at that point.  It's so, so weird.  Like Ronnie is too stupid to understand that, so Martin had to dumb it down, or Martin is too old to understand what a producer is?  So weird.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[SusanM]

I'm so disappointed.  A station I get started showing Frasier again from the start of the series - and I've been enjoying it so much.  Anyway they've jumped from the middle of season 2 to season 9 (Niles and Daphne are together and we're seeing her awful family show up).  What the hell??

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 hours ago, SusannahM said:

I'm so disappointed.  A station I get started showing Frasier again from the start of the series - and I've been enjoying it so much.  Anyway they've jumped from the middle of season 2 to season 9 (Niles and Daphne are together and we're seeing her awful family show up).  What the hell??

I can't freaking stand when they do that.  I know that this is not on the topic of Frasier but my HBO channel here in Canada played the entirety of Sex and the City - which I was watching - then at episode 604 (the last season) they randomly just decided to stop.   ??????????????????????  With 16 episodes left! I was livid!  

Edited December 13, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[andromeda331]

2 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I can't freaking stand when they do that.  I know that this is not on the topic of Frasier but my HBO channel here in Canada played the entirety of Sex and the City - which I watched - then at episode 604 (the last season) they randomly just decided to stop.   ??????????????????????  With 16 episodes left! I was livid!  

I can't either. Lifetime did that with Castle right before they switched to Christmas movies. Castle got halfway through season five and then they started over with season one.  Play the seasons through networks.

[Annber03]

That would happen to me when I'd be watching "Criminal Minds" marathons on certain channels. They'd start off showing episodes from one season, then show a couple from another, then go to another season or go back to the one they started with. It bugs me, too. I imagine there's some particular network-related reason behind that kind of episode/season-hopping, but yeah, it's tough when you want to just watch it all in order.

3 hours ago, SusannahM said:

I'm so disappointed.  A station I get started showing Frasier again from the start of the series - and I've been enjoying it so much.  Anyway they've jumped from the middle of season 2 to season 9 (Niles and Daphne are together and we're seeing her awful family show up).  What the hell??

That'd be especially frustrating because they've just skipped past some of the show's best seasons! 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I own a lot of stuff on DVD but there's just SOMETHING about having your favourite shows to tune into on cable everyday.  It let me watch two episodes a day and let me space it out so I could fit it into my regular schedule.  So I totally get it.  Networks don't realize how much people enjoy this or depend on this.  Even sitcoms have storylines and arcs that we care about.

[SusanM]

1 hour ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Even sitcoms have storylines and arcs that we care about.

And can you imagine someone who's never seen Frasier tuning in and getting hooked, watching through to the second season where Niles is still married to Maris and has his unrequited crush on Daphne and the next DAY they watch the show and suddenly Daphne is living with Niles and they're all older and, except for Frasier still striking out with every woman he meets, it's all changed.  I'd feel pretty cheated - after I stopped feeling confused!

[Ms Blue Jay]

Okay, that makes me really mad.  LOL.  Frasier is such a good show and networks should not be doing it so dirty.

37 minutes ago, SusannahM said:

and, except for Frasier still striking out with every woman he meets, it's all changed. 

LOL!!!!!

[peacheslatour]

14 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Okay, that makes me really mad.  LOL.  Frasier is such a good show and networks should not be doing it so dirty.

LOL!!!!!

It's kind of sad to see a middle aged man thinking every woman he goes out with is going to be THE ONE and being disappointed every time.

[Ms Blue Jay]

It's too hard for me to watch those episodes where Frasier gets his hopes dashed too much.  

- Can't Buy Me Love - the auction episode, with the beautiful model with the bratty daughter
- Four for the Seesaw - (the one with Megan Mullally) Frasier encourages Niles to just have a fun affair to get over his divorce - but he encourages Niles too much and in earshot of the women
- Frasier's Imaginary Friend - The one with Sela Ward, the supermodel zoologist.  His family doesn't believe in her so he takes a picture of her to prove that she's real and of course, she finds out.
- Three Dates and a Break up - Sherry ruins THREE of Frasier's dates.

These are very well crafted episodes.  I think the first episode is especially a classic.  But I never want to revisit them because I hate how Frasier never gets what he wants.

Going back to "Can't Buy me Love" for a sec.  I can't stand how the woman leaves the date and walks out on him.  What did Frasier do that was so bad exactly?  He's a psychologist and he took a child at her word.  He wanted to protect the child and help her.  And for that, the model walks out on him?  Please.

Three Dates and a Breakup - the sexy jazzy mood setting music that Frasier uses for all 3 dates is so funny.  I actually desperately wanted to find it but I think they said that one of their music writers just created it for the show and it was not released.

Edited December 13, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[peacheslatour]

Quote

- Frasier's Imaginary Friend - The one with Sela Ward, the supermodel zoologist.  His family doesn't believe in her so he takes a picture of her to prove that she's real and of course, she finds out.
 

While she's sleeping. That would have creeped me out too.

[Annber03]

1 minute ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

- Four for the Seesaw - (the one with Megan Mullally) Frasier encourages Niles to just have a fun affair to get over his divorce - but he encourages Niles too much and in earshot of the women

Heh, yeah, Frasier and Niles blew that one up all on their own. Two great women who were genuinely interested in them, and with whom they had some things in common...and Niles can't get over his weird back and forth with Maris. I could understand his reservations because of the fact they're separated at that time, because dating while in that kind of limbo could be awkward. But since she was seeing other people herself, well...

And Frasier was right about how it would've been good for them to just enjoy themselves for a weekend without analyzing everything to death...but he said it in the most "foot in mouth" sort of way ever. 

I do get a kick out of that one, though, because Megan Mullally plays Niles' date, and that has me imagining what it'd be like if Niles went on a date with Karen Walker :p. That would be a disaster of hilariously epic proportions :D. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 minute ago, peacheslatour said:

While she's sleeping. That would have creeped me out too.

I know that it's not right what he did.  I know that.  But, his family drove him crazy.  They were awful.  It was like being gaslit. I understand his desperation.  And he was only going to show his family - NOT sell it to the tabloids like she was afraid of.  Of course, I understand HER being upset too, because she didn't know all of this.

Just now, Annber03 said:

Heh, yeah, Frasier and Niles blew that one up all on their own. Two great women who were genuinely interested in them, and with whom they had some things in common...and Niles can't get over his weird back and forth with Maris. I could understand his reservations because of the fact they're separated at that time, because dating while in that kind of limbo could be awkward. But since she was seeing other people herself, well...

Niles was never interested in Megan Mullally.  Frasier just wanted to get laid and was pushing Niles in the process.  I agree that Frasier screwed that up himself, but dammit, I want Frasier to get what he wants sometimes!

He's been disappointed so many times in his life that when he actually does have a good relationship - Cassandra, Faye, that weird artist woman who howled at the moon - he takes it upon himself to screw it up because he can't be happy.  It's really sad.

1 minute ago, Annber03 said:

I do get a kick out of that one, though, because Megan Mullally plays Niles' date, and that has me imagining what it'd be like if Niles went on a date with Karen Walker :p. That would be a disaster of hilariously epic proportions :D. 

I'm sure that Maris and Karen Walker have a LOT in common.  The only difference is that Karen has amazing breasts 😉. And she's the golddigger whereas with Maris, Maris is the gold!

[peacheslatour]

Quote

Heh, yeah, Frasier and Niles blew that one up all on their own. Two great women who were genuinely interested in them, and with whom they had some things in common...and Niles can't get over his weird back and forth with Maris. I could understand his reservations because of the fact they're separated at that time, because dating while in that kind of limbo could be awkward. But since she was seeing other people herself, well...

They were kitchen designers! They were perfect.

[Annber03]

4 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I know that it's not right what he did.  I know that.  But, his family drove him crazy.  They were awful.  It was like being gaslit. I understand his desperation.  And he was only going to show his family - NOT sell it to the tabloids like she was afraid of.  Of course, I understand HER being upset too, because she didn't know all of this.

I like the story in that episode about when Frasier was a kid and pretended he was corresponding with Leonard Bernstein. And Niles is going on about how they figured out it was a fake because "Bernstein" mentioned the wrong play in the letters and all that, and Martin says, "The sloppy kid handwriting was also a clue." XD. 

But yeah, I can see why his family would've been a bit worried/skeptical at first given he'd been in a dating slump, but he had also been known to date some gorgeous women with some really unusual/important jobs before, so... 

Quote

 

Niles was never interested in Megan Mullally.  Frasier just wanted to get laid and was pushing Niles in the process.  I agree that Frasier screwed that up himself, but dammit, I want Frasier to get what he wants sometimes!

He's been disappointed so many times in his life that when he actually does have a good relationship - Cassandra, Faye, that weird artist woman who howled at the moon - he takes it upon himself to screw it up because he can't be happy. It's really sad.

 

True, Frasier pushing so hard didn't help matters, no. 

They've even discussed that at points on the show, his constant need to sabotage his relationships because he can't be happy, and is afraid to be alone. He just has a really hard time turning off his brain and letting himself enjoy things. 

The thing with that artist, too, was that it was supposed to be a purely casual fling from the get-go, which made his reaction to that one even more frustrating. She wasn't looking for anything more serious, she just wanted to have fun. But again, he can't let himself just do that. 

Quote

I'm sure that Maris and Karen Walker have a LOT in common.  The only difference is that Karen has amazing breasts 😉. And she's the golddigger whereas with Maris, Maris is the gold!

Oh, god, now I'm imagining Karen and Maris chatting it up :D. They would totally have some weird frenemies sort of thing - she'd mock Maris' weight and unusual eating/drinking habits, and then they'd turn around and gossip about all the rich people in Seattle together. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 minute ago, Annber03 said:

The thing with that artist, too, was that it was supposed to be a purely casual fling from the get-go, which made his reaction to that one even more frustrating. She wasn't looking for anything more serious, she just wanted to have fun. But again, he can't let himself just do that. 

Frasier acts like such a horndog all the time.  Look how he is with Regan, etc. He just wants a beautiful woman to have fun with.  He finds someone he's COMPLETELY attracted to that doesn't want strings and he agonizes and agonizes that they have nothing in common.  I don't even know if I could be friends with someone complaining about something like this.

2 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

But yeah, I can see why his family would've been a bit worried/skeptical at first given he'd been in a dating slump, but he had also been known to date some gorgeous women with some really unusual/important jobs before, so... 

You're reminding me of more storylines

Sam the lawyer - he screws this up at first, but when Sam's touched that he really wants to be with her, he has to confess to her he was just using her for her lifestyle.  What is wrong with him?  Why not try to actually like SAM and have a relationship with her?

Teri Hatcher (I love this episode) - he doesn't want to be with her because he can't stop trying to "fix" her.  Why couldn't they just relax and be with each other?  I know several therapists who have husbands.  They were attracted to some element of that person (even if it's damage or neurosis or whatever you want to call it), but they make it work!