OUAT vs. Other Fairy Tales: Compare & Contrast

[InsertWordHere]

24 minutes ago, Camera One said:

If lead star Jennifer Morrison, who plays Emma Swan in the series, were to be asked who to include in the next season line-up, she would definitely choose Mary Poppins.

"I think the problem is that the characters I lean toward and liked from childhood are very happy, loving characters, which don't really bring a lot of conflict. I'm not sure if my wish list is going to get fulfilled," she told Parade.

Mary Poppins is clearly the Black Fairy so I'm not sure JMo would get her wish even if they included her.

[KingOfHearts]

I've been watching a series on YouTube called, "The Buffy Guide". Each episode is a deep analysis of either a Buffy or Angel episode, and I really do recommend it. It reminds me of some of the posts here on PTV about OUAT. I thought this line from it was relevant:

Quote

There are characters through the seasons seeking redemption who have done irredeemable things. Often, our willingness as viewers to forgive them is based mostly on the degree to which we like them, not on whether they've earned that forgiveness.

That is probably why Regina's redemption is such a tough sell. She's not likable because she is a hypocrite who puts other people down. 

[Shanna Marie]

53 minutes ago, Camera One said:

If lead star Jennifer Morrison, who plays Emma Swan in the series, were to be asked who to include in the next season line-up, she would definitely choose Mary Poppins.

"I think the problem is that the characters I lean toward and liked from childhood are very happy, loving characters, which don't really bring a lot of conflict. I'm not sure if my wish list is going to get fulfilled," she told Parade.

She must be familiar with Mary Poppins only from the Disney movie (which the author famously loathed). Book Mary wasn't evil, but she wasn't what I'd call happy and loving. Book Mary would cut a bitch. She suffered no fools, took no prisoners, and was kind of crabby. She was good for the children, but it was a tough love, and she could be pretty nasty to adults who deserved it.

[InsertWordHere]

Book Mary sounds like the Doctor, which is appropriate because I've always suspected that Mary Poppins was a Time Lady.

[Camera One]

I agree she wasn't happy and loving in the books, but I don't think the animated movie was that big of a stretch.

Here's another interesting article about Alan Menken's new songs in the Beauty and the Beast movie among other topics such as doing remakes.  I think one of his comments in here about audience reaction is good, and sort of relates to the reliance on audience validation that Adam and recent showrunners seem to have.

INTERVIEWER: Are you someone who checks how people are reacting online to a new clip with your music, like Emma Watson singing the overture?

MENKEN: If someone points it out to me. For a while now, I try to ignore the hoopla, because if you buy into that, you have to buy into the criticism. All you can do is put your work out there and move on; you just never know what will come. When Newsies first came out, it just crash-landed with a thud; it won a Razzie for worst song of the year and I felt such embarrassment. Fast-forward and it's a hit on Broadway and I win a Tony for the score! I feel sorry for people who hang on to their triumphs or get obsessed with their failures. It's just such a waste of energy.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Camera One

[Spartan Girl]

I just saw Beauty and the Beast and it was great! Belle had a spine! Maurice wasn't a jerk! The Beast wasn't a a power hungry sociopath! Gaston was...Gaston!

Suck it, Rumbelle!

[Shanna Marie]

I just watched Tangled Before Ever After, and yeah, I think I'm okay if they cancel Once because I can get my CaptainSwan jollies there. We've got a magic princess who didn't get to have her parents until she was grown, parents who tend to be overprotective because of that, and the charming rogue with a sad backstory who's utterly supportive and trying to be better. I kind of like the lady in waiting as a character if she was in a different story (loved the weapons collection), but I'm a little worried that we've got a potential Regina here -- not the evil bit, but the part where the writers are so excited about Strong!Female!Friendships! that they end up doing more of the series about her and Rapunzel, with Eugene on the sidelines. Maybe I'm just overly sensitive to the vibe after Regina, but seriously, Rapunzel spends more time with this chick we've never heard of before, who she has to have known less time than she's known Eugene, and suddenly she's the one who knows Rapunzel best, snarks at Eugene, and is good at everything. Otherwise, I do like that with this they're getting past the instalove problem of most Disney movies, so the adventures of the original movie were just the start of things, and now we'll get to see the development of the relationship over the long term in series form.

Oh, and is this the only Disney princess movie other than Sleeping Beauty in which the princess has both parents still alive? This is the only one in which the birth mom is still alive, and now she gets to be an actual character, with lines and everything. She seems like she'll be pretty cool. I guess there's Merida, but she's Pixar and not a fairy tale character, so does she count as one of the Disney fairy tale princesses?

[Camera One]

I guess there's Merida, but she's Pixar and not a fairy tale character, so does she count as one of the Disney fairy tale princesses?

She does in Disneyland.  First Pixar Character to get the honor.

[Curio]

50 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

I kind of like the lady in waiting as a character if she was in a different story (loved the weapons collection), but I'm a little worried that we've got a potential Regina here -- not the evil bit, but the part where the writers are so excited about Strong!Female!Friendships! that they end up doing more of the series about her and Rapunzel, with Eugene on the sidelines. Maybe I'm just overly sensitive to the vibe after Regina, but seriously, Rapunzel spends more time with this chick we've never heard of before, who she has to have known less time than she's known Eugene, and suddenly she's the one who knows Rapunzel best, snarks at Eugene, and is good at everything.

 

 

Heh, I totally had the same thought. I want to like her, but Regina has apparently given me television-watching PTSD. I think it's the insta-friendship Rapunzel and Cassandra somehow formed off screen that immediately made me think of the random 4A to 4B jump with Emma and Regina. Like, we've never seen these characters interact before, and all of a sudden this chick is afraid she'll never see Rapunzel again? She's been her lady in waiting for only a few months now?

But I think the series will definitely give Rapunzel/Eugene the time it deserves. Unlike OUAT, I think the writers realize how much the success of Tangled is because of that fun, adventurous, romantic, funny rapport between those two. It also goes to show that a television show is a lot more enjoyable to watch when there are plenty of lighthearted and romantic moments. I don't know why OUAT is obsessed with pain and drama as if that's the only thing that's "interesting."

Edited March 17, 2017 by Curio

[Camera One]

1 minute ago, Curio said:

I don't know why OUAT is obsessed with pain and drama as if that's the only thing that's "interesting."

A&E have deluded themselves into thinking they're great dramatic writers.

[Shanna Marie]

I'll second the love for the new Beauty and the Beast. I just saw it, and it was lovely. I was really impressed with the music, even being a bit of a singing snob. I might even have liked Dan Stevens' version of "Evermore" better than Josh Groban's. Ewan McGregor was having way too much fun. I wonder how much of Lumiere was motion capture. I know they did full motion capture for the Beast, and there were quite a few times when Cousin Matthew (from Downton Abbey) really came through, even in all the CGI, but it was harder to tell if the household items were just CGI animation or if they did motion capture on the actors.

I did like how they fixed the setup so it made a bit more sense and gave the Beast more of a backstory than just not letting a stranger in. And, in spite of the lyrics about Belle being the most beautiful girl in town, I thought she was more girl-next-door pretty, which works, so he's not learning to get past his obsession with looks by falling in love with the most beautiful girl. She was a different kind of beautiful than the artificial beauty he'd prized before. I feel like the dance scene has now been redeemed from the travesty Once made of it.

[Camera One]

Here's hoping everyone who is falling in love with "Beauty and the Beast" all over again will come back to "Once Upon a Time" to see the continuation of Beauty and the Beast's epic love story!

Edited March 17, 2017 by Camera One

[InsertWordHere]

There was a moment in Beauty and the Beast when I was actually worried they were going to give Gaston a sad backstory to justify his villainy. I was pleasantly surprised when they turned that trope on its head and in some ways made Gaston even worse than he was in the animated film. Luke Evans' Gaston was the standout for me in terms of the fully human characters and The Mob Song remains my favorite scene/song in both the animated and live action versions. Dan Stevens (Matthew and Mary 4eva!) and Ewan McGregor were also really great, but I am biased because I have always loved both. While I also love Emma Thompson and Ian McKellen, I don't think they really stood out in this film. To be fair, they had big shoes to fill. I absolutely loved all of the additional touches they gave to the cursed castle dwellers and that was probably my favorite part of the live action version. Maurice also came across wonderfully in this movie. It's even harder to accept OUaT's characters as being remotely similar to the ones I just had the pleasure of viewing.    

Edited March 18, 2017 by InsertWordHere

[pezgirl7]

2 hours ago, InsertWordHere said:

There was a moment in Beauty and the Beast when I was actually worried they were going to give Gaston a sad backstory to justify his villainy. I was pleasantly surprised when they turned that trope on its head and in some ways made Gaston even worse than he was in the animated film.

Well, according to Luke, Gaston has been in the army since he was 16, and suffers from PTSD. But yea, that doesn't excuse his actions at all. Once his evil side starts to show, he just goes full-on! I also saw the film tonight, and I LOVED it! The music sounded so much better when it was with the visuals, which were stunning. I can't wait to see it again on Tuesday!

[InsertWordHere]

48 minutes ago, pezgirl7 said:

Well, according to Luke, Gaston has been in the army since he was 16, and suffers from PTSD. 

That's actually what I was referencing. 

Spoiler

At first, it seemed like they were going to use the trauma from the war to excuse his actions, but instead it came off more to me like the war was his "happy place."

[Camera One]

I borrowed "Zootopia" but the Bluray wouldn't work on my computer, so I ended up watching "The Black Cauldron" for the first time.  It was alright, but not too engaging.  I'm surprised The Dark One mythology on "Once" didn't involve The Black Cauldron.  The Dark One resembled The Horned One a little, as well as the Witches who couldn't resist a bargain.  

[Spartan Girl]

Yes, thank you Disney for making Gaston full blown evil. Some people were a little taken aback

how he left Maurice to be eaten by wolves so Belle would be alone and therefore have to marry him

but really, was it that much of a stretch from trying to extort her by throwing him into the asylum?  Both were equally despicable, so it stayed in character for me.

But I did like how Dan Stevens' Beast was a fellow book lover. It kind of gave him more to build on with Belle, and his funniest scene was how he made fun of her for liking sappy romance stories. And while his sad background was yet another "parents suck" story, but like I said before it explains his actions without excusing them. It also gave an added depth to his relationship with the servants. People complain that it wasn't fair that they got cursed too, but it was always my headcanon that their enabling of him shaped who he became, so the revelation that

they didn't stop his father from beating him

was pretty close to that theory. Like Mrs. Potts said, "doing nothing" doesn't mean the same as "doing nothing wrong".

[Shanna Marie]

5 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

But I did like how Dan Stevens' Beast was a fellow book lover. It kind of gave him more to build on with Belle, and his funniest scene was how he made fun of her for liking sappy romance stories.

It was in the humor when you could really see Dan Stevens behind all the CGI. Those were definitely his expressions. I, too, loved him being a fellow book lover. Him being illiterate never made a lot of sense in the Broadway version. It felt like a social issue being shoehorned into the story to make a point. Someone from that class, living in a castle with a massive library, being illiterate? It only works if he was cursed as a child, which opens a whole new can of worms. But him also being a book lover makes the relationship make more sense. They really are finding common ground, and she has more in common with him than with the villagers.

And I liked the additional detail about the curse, and the fact that the enchantress didn't just curse and run but was part of the story. It made it look less like vengeance and more like she was actually trying to help, like it was tough love and she wanted the curse to be broken because it would mean things improved, rather than like she hoped it wouldn't be broken.

I think the enchanted servants make a huge difference between this version and what they do with Rumple. With the servants' devotion to the Beast, you get the feeling that he is worthy of love because someone does care about him, and the fact that they get away with so much suggests that his bark really is worse than his bite, and maybe he's fond of them, too. Belle could see their interactions and realize that she wasn't getting the whole picture about him. With Rumple, we saw him mute a servant, didn't we see him kill one (or was that the same one?), and then there was Belle, forced to work as a servant, so she wasn't just a guest. There was no one else to suggest to her that he might be capable of kindness. Her proof of his "goodness" was him stopping short of flaying a man.

[KingOfHearts]

It's unclear if Rumple's servant was mute by his power or if she was already. He killed her offscreen because she heard about the Dagger. "Even mutes can draw a picture."

[Camera One]

I'm 30 minutes into "Tomorrowland" and it is so boring.  I remember when we speculated "Once" might send the characters there.  Well, maybe it will get better.  1 and a half hours left to go... so much for a production from a "writer of "Lost".

[Souris]

2 hours ago, Camera One said:

I'm 30 minutes into "Tomorrowland" and it is so boring.  I remember when we speculated "Once" might send the characters there.  Well, maybe it will get better.  1 and a half hours left to go... so much for a production from a "writer of "Lost".

At this point, maybe we should run screaming from all productions from a "writer of Lost."

[maryle]

I watched the new tangled and I found it cuter, funnier than Once.

I totally saw the waste potential Once lost with cs while I watched the tangled ever after. 

And thank Cassandra remind me more of loyal Mulan than Regina. 

[Camera One]

I just finished "Tomorrowland"... what a bore.  There were some interesting visuals, and there were a few moments when there seemed to be momentum, but blech.  There was some mumbo-jumbo stuff about *hope* at the end that sounded really deep but made zero sense.  

[daxx]

Just saw Beauty and the Beast, I loved it so much! Go see it!

 

Although disturbingly I was far more attracted to Gaston than the prince, appearance wise at least. The Gaston character had the best voice as well. I know, shallow...

[AmeliaBedelia]

57 minutes ago, daxx said:

Just saw Beauty and the Beast, I loved it so much! Go see it!

 

Although disturbingly I was far more attracted to Gaston than the prince, appearance wise at least. The Gaston character had the best voice as well. I know, shallow...

I loved it too. I was impressed by Gaston. He looked like he was lifted straight out of the animated movie in a way the other characters did not.

[pezgirl7]

1 hour ago, daxx said:

Although disturbingly I was far more attracted to Gaston than the prince, appearance wise at least. The Gaston character had the best voice as well. I know, shallow...

You're not alone. That seems to be the consensus from a lot of women! Why would you want the beast when you can have Gaston? He just needed a little love and guidance. ;) I thought it was kind of ironic how Belle told Gaston that no one could change that much, when the Beast did just that!

[Camera One]

I guess I may have to make an exception and actually go to the theatre for the first time in forever.

No one thought of Poor Wumple once during the movie?  

Edited March 19, 2017 by Camera One

[pezgirl7]

26 minutes ago, Camera One said:

I guess I may have to make an exception and actually go to the theatre for the first time in forever.

No one thought of Poor Wumple once during the movie?  

LOL I actually didn't think of OUAT at all, and I also didn't really think of the original movie, which might be strange. Not once was I comparing the new film to the original. I saw someone on twitter say it was essentially just a remake of the 1991 film, and I wanted to respond with 'What movie were you watching?!'.

[InsertWordHere]

23 minutes ago, Camera One said:

I guess I might have to make an exception and actually go to the theatre for the first time in forever.

No one thought of Poor Wumple once during the movie?  

I legitimately forgot OUaT's versions of Belle, "Beast," Gaston, or Maurice existed during this movie. So that was nice. It's like a palate cleanser. Even compared to the animated version, I thought Beast, Maurice, and Gaston were improved upon. Animated Belle is still best Belle though. 

Go see it! I'm going again on Wednesday :)

11 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

And I liked the additional detail about the curse, and the fact that the enchantress didn't just curse and run but was part of the story. It made it look less like vengeance and more like she was actually trying to help, like it was tough love and she wanted the curse to be broken because it would mean things improved, rather than like she hoped it wouldn't be broken.

I really liked what they did with the Enchantress.

Spoiler

I even have some theories about what she was doing being the town spinster. I also liked that the townspeople had loved ones in the castle too, especially poor Mr. Potts, who like Neville Longbottom, couldn't remember what he had forgotten. I'm not sure how I feel about Mrs. Cogsworth though.  

[Spartan Girl]

7 hours ago, Camera One said:

I guess I may have to make an exception and actually go to the theatre for the first time in forever.

No one thought of Poor Wumple once during the movie?  

Nope. 

Lets face facts: OUAT didn't give us a real Beauty and the Beast. They just gave Rump a love interest that happened to be named Belle and filled the story with a bunch of Easter eggs from the movie (the cup, the rose, the dance) to pander to the Beauty and the Beast fans.

[Camera One]

There are still so many literary characters "Once" hasn't gotten to yet.  I'm quite interested in the new Netflix "Anne" series (based on "Anne of Green Gables") which is premiering tonight (earlier than internationally) in Canada on our national broadcaster.  Apparently, it will be a "darker" take on the story and the headwriter (who wrote for "Breaking Bad") will be introducing new stories she imagined as she "read between the lines" of the novel.  The trailer looks pretty good, though, so I have hope that they won't twist the source material too far.

I've said this before, but all the orphans from literature would be fun to feature in a single episode with Emma.  

[InsertWordHere]

Although it's not my favorite storyline, I preferred the whole "sending your clone off to another universe to be with your love interest" when Doctor Who did it. It lacks punch when the love interest is from said universe and not the prime universe. Farscape still has the best clone with all the original's memories story of all time. OUaT's doesn't even compare. 

[KingOfHearts]

I finally got to watch the live action Beauty and the Beast. It was one of the prettiest films I've ever seen. The production quality was obscenely high, and that alone made it such an enjoyable experience. The MVP was LaFou. I love what they did for his character. Gaston was also a delight as a villain. It's surprisingly a really funny movie. I was laughing throughout at its subtle humor. The musical numbers had me, a guy, fangirling. I want more Alan Menken musicals!

Spoilers below.

As for criticisms... there's very little reason for the adaptation to exist. They don't add enough layers to warrant an entire reimagined film. They give Belle and the Beast backstories, but imo they aren't necessary. The audience could extrapolate the details already. The writers give Beast daddy issues, and an explanation for Belle's lack of a mother. It doesn't make the characters deeper, though. Not much time is spent on the backstories anyway. The worldbuilding is slightly more complicated with a teleportation book, the enchantress living in the village for no reason, the enchanted objects losing their personalities after the petals fell, etc. It feels like the writers expected the audience to have watched the animated version. There isn't very much exposition about the rose and the mirror. They just get inserted in there for plot.

They overcompensate to make sure no critic would shout "Stockholm Syndrome". Belle has as much personality as a slab of wheat toast. Her animated counterpart had more character. Traditionally, Disney princesses were simply archetypes. The same is true here, albeit Belle is more of a modernized one. She's that independent, strong female lead A&E are always attempting to emulate with their characters. She never gets to react to anything like a human would. Her poker face is always on so she maintains the appearance of "strength". I don't think animated Belle was weak at all, yet she got to be upset and scared. That wasn't frailty, but a natural reaction to a scary situation.

Overall, it's a bit too cartoony. Especially with Gaston and the servants. The film wants to be taken seriously, but it doesn't translate all that well. A lot of it works so much better in animation. If there's to be a live action Beauty and the Beast, it should probably adapt the fairy tale, rather than the Disney version. 

I prefer the animated film still, to be honest. 

Edited March 30, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Mathius]

10 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

I prefer the animated film still, to be honest. 

I would be surprised if I ever heard someone say otherwise.  The animated film is a masterpiece, this one is just OK.

Edited March 30, 2017 by Mathius

[pezgirl7]

7 hours ago, Mathius said:

I would be surprised if I ever heard someone say otherwise.  The animated film is a masterpiece, this one is just OK.

Well get ready to be surprised! I think I prefer the new movie to the animated version. I need to see it a few more times though before I can say definitively.

[Curio]

7 hours ago, Mathius said:

I would be surprised if I ever heard someone say otherwise.  The animated film is a masterpiece, this one is just OK.

This is how I feel about the upcoming The Lion King movie. If you aren't going to have Hans Zimmer's masterpiece score exactly as it was from the original movie, what's the point? The music is what drives that movie and makes it a classic. If you take away the music, all you have is a bunch of lions imitating Hamlet.

[Spartan Girl]

Honestly, there were some things I thought the new one did better, but there were also things I thought the original did better.

Just FYI we now have a forum for Tangled. It's a bit empty at the moment so come on over!

Edited April 1, 2017 by Spartan Girl

[Camera One]

I was thinking about the possible cancellation of "Once" and despite how bad this season is, it's still one of the two shows right now that I actually watch the same day as it airs.  All other shows I wait a few days or even several weeks, as long as they stay on the network website.  

I suppose a huge part of it is just being able to go on here and read what everyone else says and then discuss what travesty has been put on screen this week. Unfortunately, both shows I watch are on Sunday nights, but I tend to watch "Once" first before the other one, since by the time it airs in my time zone, the threads are already a-buzzing.  

As poorly written as it is, "Once" really fires the imagination... it's sort of reminiscent of how kids or nerdy teenagers discuss imaginary worlds and there is multitude of possibilities since this show has a multiverse that is so deeply developed in popular culture already.  

That analysis part for me is a huge draw as well, but it makes me wonder why I prefer it on this show (despite the spotty worldbuilding), but some shows I'm not interested in analyzing at all.

[Dianthus]

On ‎3‎/‎16‎/‎2017 at 11:03 AM, KingOfHearts said:

I've been watching a series on YouTube called, "The Buffy Guide". Each episode is a deep analysis of either a Buffy or Angel episode, and I really do recommend it. It reminds me of some of the posts here on PTV about OUAT. I thought this line from it was relevant:

That is probably why Regina's redemption is such a tough sell. She's not likable because she is a hypocrite who puts other people down. 

I'm a huge fan of Spike, but I think part of the reason his redemption journey resonates so strongly with me is because we actually got to watch it happen. A bunch of little changes added up to the point where he realized he couldn't stay the way he was. There's something to it that reminds me of any group (PoC, women) who've fought for recognition against prevailing stereotypes.

Angel was (mostly) already redeemed by the time he became a regular, and most of his redemption after falling off the wagon was off screen too. It does seemstrange sometimes that I love this one formerly evil character, but hate the other one so much. Still, Whedon's a better writer too, which makes a huge difference.

[oncebluethrone]

I watched the new Beauty and the Beast yesterday and thought it was really good. I think I enjoyed it as much as the original, but I'll have to see it a few more times to be sure.

Spoiler

I really liked how this version fixed some of the plot holes of the original such as how the people in the village forgot about the castle and it's residents.  I thought all the musical numbers were done really well and the score was amazing. Comparing the songs in this one to the original, I would have to say that that the main songs were better in the original for the most part, however, I liked this version of Gaston better. I loved the cinematography and the set design and thought the costumes were spectacular. I didn't mind that Belle's dress wasn't as big as the original, which bothered some people. I also liked the new version of Gaston in how he was a more rounded character and was more villainous. I thought Emma's performance of Belle was done really well.

When thinking of Once's version of Beauty and the Beast, I really wish they would have stuck more with the 1991 version of the story instead of twisting it so much that you can hardly call it Beauty and the Beast anymore.  The only part of the movie they really brought into the show was Belle in that her character in the movie and on the show are pretty much the same. I think Belle and Rumplestiltskin's story would have been better if Rumple's character was closer to the Prince than the Beast and if characters such as Maurice and Gaston were used better.  I also would have liked to see Le Fou on Once and some of the objects such as Mrs. Potts and Cogsworth.

[Camera One]

I watched "Moana" on DVD.  It was alright... the characters were generally likeable but I didn't find the movie all that engaging and I stopped several times before continuing.  That was the same thing I felt about "Frozen", though this movie is a little better.  

The animation was beautiful and it was interesting to see into Polynesian culture, though the approach felt a little like "Pocahontas".  It did seem like a mishmash of a variety of movies, especially with the songs. Moana's main song reminded me of Mulan's song about disappointing her father and every protagonist song about venturing "out there".  The moving tattoos reminded me of "Hercules".  Moana's grandmother reminded me of Simba's father.  

I'm not sure there's much for "Once" to mine with this one.  Maybe we find out in Season 8 that Hook was the one who stole The Heart of the Island.  I laughed when the Fire Monster was actually the Goddess without a heart and she realized who she really was with the heart.  There was also The Realm of the Monsters, which was neither here nor there.   Maybe Belle chose a coconut over saving Moana.

I wasn't hugely fond of "Frozen" until "Once" adapted it, so maybe this could be the case with "Moana".  Knowing A&E, Moana would be the new Merida.

Edited April 3, 2017 by Camera One

[Rumsy4]

5 hours ago, Camera One said:

Knowing A&E, Moana would be the new Merida.

She changed Hook when he was 16. This was a missing moment between Brothers Jones and Good Form when she taught Killian how to fall in love with the ocean after a lifetime of indentured servitude.

[Camera One]

8 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

She changed Hook when he was 16. This was a missing moment between Brothers Jones and Good Form when she taught Killian how to fall in love with the ocean after a lifetime of indentured servitude.

That's it.  You are hired for the Writers' Room.  

But now in present-day, Moana blames Hook for the death of her island, and she ties him up and threatens him... because now SHE has a magic fish hook for a hand.

Edited April 3, 2017 by Camera One

[Spartan Girl]

12 hours ago, oncebluethrone said:

I watched the new Beauty and the Beast yesterday and thought it was really good. I think I enjoyed it as much as the original, but I'll have to see it a few more times to be sure.

  Hide contents

I really liked how this version fixed some of the plot holes of the original such as how the people in the village forgot about the castle and it's residents.  I thought all the musical numbers were done really well and the score was amazing. Comparing the songs in this one to the original, I would have to say that that the main songs were better in the original for the most part, however, I liked this version of Gaston better. I loved the cinematography and the set design and thought the costumes were spectacular. I didn't mind that Belle's dress wasn't as big as the original, which bothered some people. I also liked the new version of Gaston in how he was a more rounded character and was more villainous. I thought Emma's performance of Belle was done really well.

When thinking of Once's version of Beauty and the Beast, I really wish they would have stuck more with the 1991 version of the story instead of twisting it so much that you can hardly call it Beauty and the Beast anymore.  The only part of the movie they really brought into the show was Belle in that her character in the movie and on the show are pretty much the same. I think Belle and Rumplestiltskin's story would have been better if Rumple's character was closer to the Prince than the Beast and if characters such as Maurice and Gaston were used better.  I also would have liked to see Le Fou on Once and some of the objects such as Mrs. Potts and Cogsworth.

I don't think the OUAT is much like the Disney Belle anymore. Disney Belle had more integrity (and spine).

[Guest]

I was watching the Walking Dead season finale and realized that the last couple years that story structure is very similar to OUAT.

Half or full season arcs with character centrics and a bunch of pretending to do stuff while actually doing nothing so the big moments or twists can happen in the premieres and finales.

Has any show ever sustained this structure without declining in quality?

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

Has any show ever sustained this structure without declining in quality?

I've seen similar shows do it without declining for much longer periods than OUAT could. OUAT stopped working in S4, while something like Lost or BTVS didn't really fall until S6.

Edited April 4, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Trini]

Wasn't Smallville fairly good at premieres and finales, and not-so-good with in between? (I stopped watching around season 5, I think) They went for 10 seasons.

[Camera One]

I quit "Smallville" after Season 6.  That show was a bit different in that it was more villain-of-the-week with a season-long arc that culminated near the end of the season.  The finales tended to be every character in mortal danger.  

Similar problems would include how repetitious the storylines became.  Lex was pretty much Rumple with the constant back-and-forth between good and evil.  They had no idea what to do with "boring" characters like love interest Lana and best friend Pete, both of which got destroyed and tossed (as did the parents).  I never warmed to Lois, so I decided to quit.

[daxx]

I loved Lois so I really enjoyed the last few seasons once they got rid of the on again off again with Lana.

[superloislane]

Smallville was the first fandom I was really into. The show could have good premieres and finales but it's main problem was a good, promising first half and then a disappointing second half which never lived up to what it could be. The show got creatively better when they got rid of Lana who was thee wooorst! Seriously one of the worst written characters ever. I also LOVED Lois who got so much better written and was finally given a place in the show from season 8 on and that helped the show a lot.