Hopes and Fears: How Will We Survive This Island? (Speculation WITHOUT Spoilers)

[Morrigan2575]

12 minutes ago, way2interested said:

My beef just comes from an overall lack of kind of emotional umphh in a way. The only times I felt were kind of really memorable moments were Oliver and Felicity's convo in 502, stuff from the 100th episode, and Oliver killing Billy. 

I think that mostly comes from the show being so plot driven that they're not allowing characters to interact on an emotional level.

We get some of them, like in 509 we had the scenes where people react to Evelyn but, mostly it's the noobs which don't have the connections required to resonate with the audience (at least me). 

The only one that hit me in 509 was when Rene/Wild Dog actually comforts Felicity over her guilt with recruiting Evelyn.

They could have had a good one with Olicity over Billy but they wouldn't let that develop/breathe and then we got everyone loves Oliver which was jarring since no one really comforted Felicity

Edited January 18, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[Bort]

Moved a whooooole bunch of off topic posts. If you're looking for where they went, they're either in the Happiness thread or were removed for being flat out off topic (talking about Dementors). Please stick to the topic at hand: speculation without spoilers. There are plenty of other threads to digress in, do so in one of those.

[lexicon]

@kariyaki sorry about the lack of spoiler tags and thanks for the helping hand. I'm hard core judging myself for the mess up here

 

[BunsenBurner]

I hope that Felicity has been training on the sly for the last couple of years because she had to have some way to vent her frustration and her fears without anyone noticing. She knew in her heart that if she showed any emotions  other than normal run of the mill, for them, of how she actually felt Oliver would remove her from the team. Working with Oliver and Diggle was the adrenalin rush that she missed when she had gone off with Oliver in the porsche. She needed this and she couldn't tell them what she was doing.  Once Havenrock took place she needed to train even more and she just got better and better. The psychological trauma was not good but the harder she trained the better she felt.  I don't want her to become the Canary ever but I think she needs to let them know that she is well trained and can do what needs to be done to take care of herself.  

Edited January 25, 2017 by BunsenBurner
couldn't spell porsche

[BkWurm1]

I think this makes a certain amount of sense, after all, the show has been clear that Oliver's pecs and muscles don't come from nowhere so it's silly to insist that Felicity's very toned and in shape body came just from her sitting at her computer 24/7.  That said, personality wise, Felicity seems more inclined when extra stressed to turn into that woman that doesn't bathe and has cheese doodles her hair while she dives deep for days into the rabbit hole than someone that hits the weight machines.  

But yeah, I really want to be told that she at least has still been getting self defense lessons.  And time on the gun range since she's had to use them before as well.  

[bijoux]

19 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I think this makes a certain amount of sense, after all, the show has been clear that Oliver's pecs and muscles don't come from nowhere so it's silly to insist that Felicity's very toned and in shape body came just from her sitting at her computer 24/7.  That said, personality wise, Felicity seems more inclined when extra stressed to turn into that woman that doesn't bathe and has cheese doodles her hair while she dives deep for days into the rabbit hole than someone that hits the weight machines.  

But yeah, I really want to be told that she at least has still been getting self defense lessons.  And time on the gun range since she's had to use them before as well.  

And offensive driving. :)

[BkWurm1]

On 1/24/2017 at 9:20 PM, BunsenBurner said:

 

I hope that Felicity has been training on the sly for the last couple of years because she had to have some way to vent her frustration and her fears without anyone noticing.

 

Well it's now canon she will train when upset, lol.  

[Starfish35]

Anyone think this might be Thea's last season?  I'm just starting to wonder if they might be getting ready to write her out.

[MariaHill]

1 minute ago, Starfish35 said:

Anyone think this might be Thea's last season?  I'm just starting to wonder if they might be getting ready to write her out.

I feel like they already have, to be honest. 

[thegirlsleuth]

1 minute ago, Starfish35 said:

Anyone think this might be Thea's last season?  I'm just starting to wonder if they might be getting ready to write her out.

I do. I feel like her and Lance have one foot out the door. I know they originally had a five year plan and so I wonder if Willa, Paul, and David's contracts are up.   I can't imagine them letting David go, but Willa and Paul are possibilities.

[BkWurm1]

13 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

Anyone think this might be Thea's last season?  I'm just starting to wonder if they might be getting ready to write her out.

I so get this from how she's been marginalized this year, but when the show runners talked about their motivation for killing Laurel, they stressed that Thea is Oliver's only remaining family and therefore how important she was to Oliver's story.  If Willa wants to go, maybe this is Thea's last season, but I don't think the show runners would want her to go, even if this season they really don't have much of have a storyline for her.

Quentin Lance is the one I worry about.   

[insomniadreams88]

13 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

Anyone think this might be Thea's last season?  I'm just starting to wonder if they might be getting ready to write her out.

I wouldn't be surprised if it is. But I hope if it is, she gets as happy an ending as possible on this show.

Same with Lance. 

Edited January 31, 2017 by insomniadreams88

[kismet]

13 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

Anyone think this might be Thea's last season?  I'm just starting to wonder if they might be getting ready to write her out.

Let's write out one of the only 2 female regulars and keep all the unnecessary male newbies. Sounds about right in these writers' minds. (FTR- personally disagree)

Even if they bring on a new BC or keep Talia or Reporter Chick, I don't see in this modern TV world why that means we need to get rid of another female to make room for the new female. 

That being said, in keeping with their alternating gender pattern of who they kill/get rid of at the end seasons, I'm inclined to think it will be a male character. (S1 Tommy; s2 Moira; s3 Roy; s4 Laurel). My bet is on Curtis. Which IMO is another flawed choice and I say that as someone who does not like the character.

Personally Quentin is always on this list because of his age & diminished role, but honestly they barely include him in the writing - what would losing him bring to the narrative?

[Sunshine]

I think Thea and Lance could be gone this year. Don't contracts become more expensive each year?  Budgets probably get cut again next year. WB/DC wants masks.  If Thea goes maybe she gets written out by connecting with Roy.  They could even do that without bringing Colton back.  

[ComicFan777]

...maybe Lance will quit drinking for good and goes to Vegas this summer to win Donna back and we hear about them being happily married in Vegas next year...it leaves his story open-ended so he can come back whenever...

[Starfish35]

Two female regulars per show seems to be the new normal.  I'm not saying they would push WH out if they bring

Juliana Harkevy

on as a regular next year, but...that said, I wouldn't be surprised to lose her either.  Although I don't think they'll kill her off.  I see her just leaving, allowing for the occasional guest appearance.  Same for Lance, actually.  In both cases they'd be killing the last remaining family of Oliver and Sara.

Edited January 31, 2017 by Starfish35

[bijoux]

Sara would still have Dinah.

[Starfish35]

Hahaha oh wow.  I completely forgot about Dinah. *facepalm*

[BkWurm1]

Quote

That being said, in keeping with their alternating gender pattern of who they kill/get rid of at the end seasons, I'm inclined to think it will be a male character. (S1 Tommy; s2 Moira; s3 Roy; s4 Laurel). My bet is on Curtis. Which IMO is another flawed choice and I say that as someone who does not like the character.

I kind of feel that no one will die this year from the team or the regulars.  The bus is still an option and I'm almost certain Rory will be on it (because I don't get to have nice things which is also why I'm certain Rene isn't going away).  I think Curtis is safe since they just introduced his tech side to fighting on the team.  Sending him out now means they can have fighting, fighting, ooh cool gadget! fighting,fighting.  The gimicks might get me to pay attention to more than if the bad guy runs off at the end or not.  

I kind of feel that Lance is safe because if they were going to write him out, I have to think they would have come up with something better than falling off the wagon for his final season, but then maybe they had to use him so they just gave him busy work.  But then again, hasn't Sara had enough tragedy in her life?  Though I'd have a lot of fun with him moving into the Waverider and hanging on Legends.  

Edited January 31, 2017 by BkWurm1

[kismet]

I do think whoever gets written out this season will not be killed. I think they will just be relocating.

[bijoux]

3 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

Hahaha oh wow.  I completely forgot about Dinah. *facepalm*

I think Sara and Lance have as well, so no big deal.

[Starfish35]

I don't see them killing off Curtis.  Among other reasons, they wouldn't want to risk the backlash for killing off their only gay character.  

4 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

 Though I'd have a lot of fun with him moving into the Waverider and hanging on Legends.  

Lol yes I could see that being a lot of fun.

Edited January 31, 2017 by Starfish35

[kismet]

I have no desire to see any Arrow cast offs from this season join the Legends team. I don't think Curtis would mesh well with the Legends. I also can't imagine him leaving Paul behind to travel through time.

My rationale as to why Curtis would be the regular let go is that he has not brought in viewers since his promotion. Narratively leaving with Paul would be a nice ending. As for him being a gay character, having him choose his husband over the mission would be promoting gay relationships. As for the tech he brings to the field, they could always give that back to FS. And they could still have the gadgets, just have Curtis create them offscreen, a little name dropping without paying a salary.

Edited January 31, 2017 by kismet

[Starfish35]

Well if we're going to continue to talk about LoT, we should probably go to Mind Your Surroundings.  But I wasn't really serious about Quentin - although his dry commentary would be immensely entertaining, I don't really see a regular role for him on the ship.  But I admit I'd take Curtis over bland-as-bread Nate.  But as in everything, mileage varies.  

[BkWurm1]

4 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

 But I wasn't really serious about Quentin - although his dry commentary would be immensely entertaining, I don't really see a regular role for him on the ship.

No, I'm not serious about it either, though I do like how Sara and he interact and if I can't get Sara on Arrow to do it, then sure, send him for a visit.   

[Trini]

I don't know if they'll give Dinah a 'costume' costume, but I have a feeling she won't be wearing a mask.

[ohjoy]

Is it sad that the most disappointing thing to me about the current flashbacks is that I feel like we're not going to get adequate backstory explanation on the abundance of hair/beard Oliver had by the time he was "rescued" from the island? He just doesn't have a whole lot of time left in Russia that would explain that beard!

[statsgirl]

I think that in the last episode this season, Oliver retunrs to Lian Yu with a mysterious package under his arm along with the chest containing his new bow and green leathers. He opens the package and ...... it's a fake beard and a long haired wig.

[BkWurm1]

Discovers a few drops of mirikuru left over and when he accidentally rubs it on his face, POOF!  The beard appears.  Two minutes later, he's rescued.  

[kismet]

I'll be so angry if the long beard & mustache are a wig/prosthetics. Just bullshit. Of course, I do fear that is exactly what is going to happen.

[BkWurm1]

2 hours ago, kismet said:

I'll be so angry if the long beard & mustache are a wig/prosthetics. Just bullshit. Of course, I do fear that is exactly what is going to happen.

I'm of the opposite feeling.  It's the only logical explanation left unless there really is some super serum for growing hair (which is too absurd)  There's just not enough time left for him to actually grow it out.    What other option do we have?  I'm bracing myself for him to have a couple months of alone time and the audience just expected to accept his crazy follicle growth.  

[bijoux]

They coulld always explain that all the events in the flashback didn't take place parallely with the present and that he actually leaves Russia after year three of his exile or something, so he's left with enough time to battle the elements and practice his skills on Lian Yu 

[BkWurm1]

9 hours ago, bijoux said:

They coulld always explain that all the events in the flashback didn't take place parallely with the present and that he actually leaves Russia after year three of his exile or something, so he's left with enough time to battle the elements and practice his skills on Lian Yu 

Given how few weeks we actually were shown on screen with his flashbacks, that could be a reality, but it's kind of late into the game to change the rules and reveal that the flashbacks actually weren't running a five year parallel to the present as promised.

[Starfish35]

That's true.

Although LoT made an error when they had Sara tell Ra's to send Nyssa to find her in October 2008 (it should have been 2009), so I guess if you wanted to, you could make an argument for it. Lol.

[kismet]

12 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

I'm of the opposite feeling.  It's the only logical explanation left unless there really is some super serum for growing hair (which is too absurd)  There's just not enough time left for him to actually grow it out.    What other option do we have?  I'm bracing myself for him to have a couple months of alone time and the audience just expected to accept his crazy follicle growth.  

I get the logic of it all. And I do appreciate a logical answer. Trust me I'd rather prefer wigs to super follicle serum.

But 5 years ago, I invested in a story about a spoiled cast away who learned to survive, become a skilled fighter and grew a beard and long hair as part of that journey.  And I've been rather patient with the flashbacks (looking at you s4), but to have it all be a strategic guise that he just went to his local Party City, booked a trip back to the least deserted island ever, and double down on the lie. Well that just feels a little frustrating for me. I guess I've lost a lot of things to this show, but I was hoping that I could at least have the beard & wig be real.

I could get on board if they did some weird tweaking to the timeline, that somehow changes the length of the flashbacks. Personally, s4 seemed way too short in content to be an actual year. It could have been only a few weeks, Russia only a few months. Heck, even s3 could have been shortened. So the amount of time is still 5 years, but it was not evenly distributed among the seasons & the plot lines. The last flashbacks that felt like they were the same actual length as present day were s1 & s2. That would be more preferable to me than costumes. At least that's genuine and doesn't feel like a purposeful duping of the audience.

Edited February 14, 2017 by kismet

[kismet]

My newest fear for Arrow is that the writers will become embolden by the Gun Violence/Control episode to take on and tackle complex social/political topics in poorly written, trite, cliched and heavy handed episodes that don't actual do anything substantial for the topic. After an hour, we know nothing more than we did before the start of the episode. Guns & Drugs can be bad and Governing is hard. Perhaps OQ said it best, it's complicated or complex... You see I can't even remember what OQ said in that press conference. And the law/bill/proposal at the end, is just tying a bow on thin air.

They give lipservice and talking points. I mean the checkboxes might as well have had neon signs around them. But they don't actually have the opportunity to full explore or tackle the topics. Well, they do have the time, but it would distract from their for plot slot machine that pumps out stories week after week. I have seen them tackle LL's "alcoholism", FS's "paralysis" and Thea's "drug problem". And every male character's man paining and guilty conscience over "bad" stuff. IMO, they fell far short of the opportunity almost every time with eerie consistency in their failure. They just don't have the skill to do justice to these complex topics. 

The show should stick to what it is good at. Telling interesting stories about interesting characters that solve a weekly or season long capers, peppered with some fun action scenes. Leave the social / political topics to shows that have the caliber and gravitas to actually succeed in presenting a coherent & poignant message. Nobody was looking to Arrow to solve or even address Gun Violence/Control. And my bet is that no one will be turning to Arrow to solve/address it anytime soon after that episode.

Edited February 16, 2017 by kismet
Because I still don't know if they were tackling gun control or gun violence or is there a difference in their opinion?

[Starfish35]

Speculation on who the series regulars will be for season six: (bringing over from spoiler thread because it's not really spoiler related)

Season One: 7

• Stephen Amell
• Katie Cassidy
• David Ramsey
• Paul Blackthorne
• Willa Holland
• Susanna Thompson
• Colin Donnell

Season Two: 9

• Stephen Amell
• Katie Cassidy
• David Ramsey
• Susanna Thompson
• Willa Holland
• Paul Blackthorne
• Emily Bett Rickards
• Colton Haynes
• Manu Bennett

Season Three: 8

• Stephen Amell
• Katie Cassidy
• David Ramsey
• Willa Holland
• Emily Bett Rickards
• Paul Blackthorne
• Colton Haynes
• John Barrowman

Season Four: 6?

• Stephen Amell
• Katie Cassidy
• David Ramsey
• Willa Holland
• Emily Bett Rickards
• Paul Blackthorne
• ....I can't remember if there was someone else.

Season Five: 7?

• Stephen Amell
• David Ramsey
• Willa Holland
• Emily Bett Rickards
• Paul Blackthorne
• Echo Kellum
• Josh Segarra?

Season Six: (speculative)

• Stephen Amell
• David Ramsey
• Emily Bett Rickards
• - ?
• - ?
• - ?
• - ?

Who do you think will be sticking around for season six? 

[kismet]

I think it will be nu-Canary, Wild Dog & Echo. I see regular contracts for them all. I think Wild Dog is their new KC, the character they (or TPTB) love and will force on the audience whether we like him or not.

I foresee a tragic ending for Susan this season, it will bookend their Alternative LIs mission this year. Now we can have a summer of grieving for OQ & FS.

If DA is not the bad, I predict he'll get a recurring contract. I think overall he is well received and frankly they need a DA, no sense in recasting what is working.

I think Willa Holland will be put on a recurring contract. I don't think they will kill her. But I do believe that she will not be a regular character. If she does maintain a regular contract it will be because it was already in place by the lawyers. I don't see her being in 23 eps, even if she is a "regular".

I think Paul Blackthorne will maintain whatever contract he has going. It seems to work for him and it works for the show.

[Starfish35]

I didn't think about them keeping DA Chase around.  I guess that's a possibility.  

The discussion about WD's daughter has me leaning toward him not returning, the more I think about it (though I'm not strongly convinced either way).

I will put my bets on Dinah being a regular though.  

I don't think they would kill either Thea or Quentin, but I could see Thea leaving and being just a recurring guest star.  

I think Echo Kellum will stay, although I'm not sure where they're headed with his storyline.

[kismet]

49 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

The discussion about WD's daughter has me leaning toward him not returning, the more I think about it (though I'm not strongly convinced either way). 

I think Echo Kellum will stay, although I'm not sure where they're headed with his storyline.

They are probably not sure either :)

I think Wild Dog's daughter is something to make the audience like him. It will be used as PR stunt and then she will get the William or Akio treatment, I'm leaning more towards William. She will not be used as a way for him off the show, that would be too logical.

I don't think they want to get rid of Wild Dog because he is the one character that can be overtly mean & "honest". He provides a way for them to have a little bite to their show. Snarky (esp mean snarky) does not look good on the other characters. Sweet snarky works on some, but sadly I don't think the writers want that type of snark. But WD can say anything and it doesn't increase the negativity towards him and if it does I don't believe they care.

[Starfish35]

I'm not sure whether they don't care.   They do have a tendency to try to correct things that were complained about in the previous season, although they often go too far or miss the point entirely.  Like their whole "no drama" thing this season.   

This season I think the main thing that has been complained about is the newbies, and no one more so than WD.  So I wouldn't be surprised to see him make an exit at the end of the season to care for his daughter.  I also wouldn't be shocked if he stayed.  I'm just not nearly as convinced of the certainty of that happening.

[AyChihuahua]

40 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

This season I think the main thing that has been complained about is the newbies, and no one more so than WD.  So I wouldn't be surprised to see him make an exit at the end of the season to care for his daughter.  I also wouldn't be shocked if he stayed.  I'm just not nearly as convinced of the certainty of that happening.

I find absolutely everything about this show impossible to determine at this point, bc anything can be either for a quasi-decent reason, or bc the showrunners are, IMO, genuinely stupid and/or stubborn. Literally anything that happens in the show can have a logical meaning, an illogical meaning, or zero meaning. 

[thegirlsleuth]

1 hour ago, Starfish35 said:

I'm not sure whether they don't care.   They do have a tendency to try to correct things that were complained about in the previous season, although they often go too far or miss the point entirely.  Like their whole "no drama" thing this season.   

This season I think the main thing that has been complained about is the newbies, and no one more so than WD.  So I wouldn't be surprised to see him make an exit at the end of the season to care for his daughter.  I also wouldn't be shocked if he stayed.  I'm just not nearly as convinced of the certainty of that happening.

There's a saying I like that might be appropriate for the Arrow writers which is:  "Ninety percent of my problems today are the solutions to the problems I had yesterday."  The do have a tendency to overcorrect so I guess next season will be a lot of heartfelt conversations and romance everywhere.  Of course it will probably not be any of the romances we want.  

[statsgirl]

I think they'd like to keep both Tinah and Wild Dog but if audience reaction  to him doesn't get better, I don't see them keeping him.  It's not just that ratings keep dropping because it's a CW show, they may not care that much but the buzz on social media these days is pretty negative.  Getting rid of Rene would help.

It's interesting to see who was a regular in earlier season and what roles they played.  Season 1, 2 were on Team Arrow (3 if you count EBR who was a good as), and 5 weren't.  S2 4 on Team Arrow and 5 not. s3 6 on team Arrow and 2 not;  s4 five on Team Arrow and one not.

S5 has has Oliver, Diggle, Felicity, Curtis officially on Team Arrow plus Thea and Quentin who are on unofficially, plus an additional 5 recurring characters who are on Team Arrow.  The only regular character who isn't on the Team is Chase, who is also a vigilante in his own right.  Unlike s1 where there was Verdant and the O/L/T triangle, and s2 when there was the QC plot and Laure's addiction arc and Moira running for mayor and s3 with the PT storyline and  Ra's & the LoA (which was about Oliver himself rather than the Arrow).  Even s4 had a lot of action in HIVE places.

I understand that the big story this season is about getting new members of the team plus Oliver dealing with his season 1 decisions but it's very claustrophobic.  My hope for next season is to get a storyline and characters who aren't part of Team Arrow and don't spend all their time in the bunker or on Team Arrow stuff.

[Guest]

With all the preaching about how they suddenly can't make a GA show without BC, I thought it was obvious that Tina will be a regular next season. Seemed like a done deal to me. 

I'm not sure about the others. I think Rene might be here to stay too, simply because they've pushed him so hard. Actually saying that, Tina and Rene both had flashbacks for their characters so yeah, I'd say they're both here to stay. 

They really should get rid of Curtis though. I don't think he adds anything tbh.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Guest

[BkWurm1]

11 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

With all the preaching about how they suddenly can't make a GA show without BC, I thought it was obvious that Tina will be a regular next season. Seemed like a done deal to me. 

I'm not sure about the others. I think Rene might be here to stay too, simply because they've pushed him so hard. Actually saying that, Tina and Rene both had flashbacks for their characters so yeah, I'd say they're both here to stay. 

They really should get rid of Curtis though. I don't think he adds anything tbh.

I think Tina is a lock to be a regular reoccurring character, but might not be an absolute when it comes to being in all the episodes all the time.  So a regular of some degree and probably full time but maybe not.  

If Wild Dog does go away, I'd expect a similar type character to be brought in to fill his shoes.   

[Starfish35]

I could see a potential Season Six lineup going like this:

• Stephen Amell
• David Ramsey
• Emily Bett Rickards
• Echo Kellum
• Juliana Harkavy
• Paul Blackthorne
• new character

[Sunshine]

7 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I think Tina is a lock to be a regular reoccurring character, but might not be an absolute when it comes to being in all the episodes all the time.  So a regular of some degree and probably full time but maybe not.  

If Wild Dog does go away, I'd expect a similar type character to be brought in to fill his shoes.   

Yeah, he's very similar to Roy/Arsenal who appears to be Green Arrow's main sidekick based on my limited knowledge.  

 It's possible that they both become regulars but not necessarily 23 episode regulars.  The same could apply to Mr. Terrific.  Might depend on how many new superheroes have to be introduced.    

[statsgirl]

I hope not everyone stays.  Even if Thea is gone, a Team Arrow of Oliver/Diggle/Felicity/Curtis/Dinah/Rene is far too crowded for these writers.  They couldn't even manage to write for five members in seasons 3 and 4.

Edited February 20, 2017 by statsgirl

[Proteus]

It makes me sad that WH is likely leaving. But I'm trying to just accept it now and move on.