S08.E03: Monsters

[Nashville]

4 hours ago, Gobi said:

One would think that the issue of prisoners would have come up in their battle planning. They were probably too busy working on their pep speeches.

Hey now - those things don’t just write themselves, yaknow.

[AngelaHunter]

21 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

That said, the look on Rick's face every time Daryl kills a Savior, who isn't an immediate threat, gives me pause.  Rick, of all people, has to know that he can't afford to take prisoners.

Yeah, and that look from someone who shot dead the cop lying on the street with his hands tied, after Rick "Kill them All" Grimes hit him with his car.

[peach]

14 hours ago, Nashville said:

Hey now - those things don’t just write themselves, yaknow.

Right.  And they had to coordinate who was going to talk when, and where to stand and everything.  Presentation matters.

40 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

Yeah, and that look from someone who shot dead the cop lying on the street with his hands tied, after Rick "Kill them All" Grimes hit him with his car.

I miss that Rick.  How many seasons ago was that?  I guess that was the time DARYL had to get wishy washy, and then Beth got killed.  Years later we have to watch Jesus learn this same stupid lesson.  Wonder who will die so he can. 

[peach]

19 hours ago, Gobi said:

One would think that the issue of prisoners would have come up in their battle planning. They were probably too busy working on their pep speeches.

 

14 hours ago, Nashville said:

Hey now - those things don’t just write themselves, yaknow.

This along with King Ezekiel is why this show has really begun to feel like it's made by theater kids putting on a play in the back yard. 

[jackjill89]

I like Ezekiel and his "fake it till you make it" mindset.  It seems like kiddy theatre because that's where he's drawing his references. I wish we knew more about The Hilltop people. All we know is that they are kind of earthy-crunchy and Gregory sucks. I want to know more about the people there. Also, as much as I hate the garbage people, how did they become so weird? How in the world did someone like Jadis become the leader? Why is their speech so stilted? The way the different groups have handled the apocalypse is interesting to me. 

[BasilSeal]

On 08 November 2017 at 6:18 PM, iMonrey said:

It had a point - but unfortunately, it was a stupid one. The accusation that Rick is no different than Negan is absurd. You know how I can tell? Rick isn't going to take the hostages from this compound, line them up on their knees, and bash two of their heads in with a baseball bat just to make the others behave. He's not going to smile and laugh and lean back and hoot and holler and say things like "Damn! That is just gross as hell!" and get off on bashing someone's head in. Because he's not a deranged, sociopathic masochist. He's done terrible things to survive or protect his people but he doesn't get off on it the way Negan does. 

Yes, that's the point, but as you say it doesn't quite work. The show consistently beats us over the head with the theme that in order to survive in this world, you must do terrible things yourself. Clearly bringing back Morales is to show equivalence between him and rick, (another hint was the gun Daryl takes from a dead saviour  with a similar number of kills to rick's kill total notched on the barrel) However Morales doesn't seem too fussed that his new boss stoved his old friend Glenn's head in with a baseball bat for shits and giggles, and for all the morally compromised things team fucknut have done, they haven't quite got round to killing people for fun just yet.

However, Negan only killed two of his surrendered prisoners, Tara and a fair few others want to kill all of theirs, and the majority of posters on here seem to agree with her. Just saying like.

It's really just standard TWD clumsy/ contradictory writing, they want to show that not all the saviours are bad psychopaths who kill for laughs, which might work better had they not spent a fair part of the last season portraying the saviours as  bad psychopaths who killed for laughs

[peach]

44 minutes ago, BasilSeal said:

However, Negan only killed two of his surrendered prisoners, Tara and a fair few others want to kill all of theirs, and the majority of posters on here seem to agree with her. Just saying like.

Negan doesn't kill his prisoners because he's making them slaves.  Dead people can't grow food or forage supplies.  The living remain his prisoners, basically, for life.   Rick's people are killing them to permanently win their own freedom and go on their way.





 

[peach]

1 hour ago, jackjill89 said:

I like Ezekiel and his "fake it till you make it" mindset.  It seems like kiddy theatre because that's where he's drawing his references. I wish we knew more about The Hilltop people. All we know is that they are kind of earthy-crunchy and Gregory sucks. I want to know more about the people there. Also, as much as I hate the garbage people, how did they become so weird? How in the world did someone like Jadis become the leader? Why is their speech so stilted? The way the different groups have handled the apocalypse is interesting to me. 

The grandstanding speeches on the back of a truck, followed by random shootouts (pew pew!!) and no apparent plan for what to do about survivors, etc, is what seems like kids in the backyard.  The Shakespearean flourishes are just the sprinkles on top.  And, uh, the tiger.  lol

I totally agree about the Hilltop people.  They have wasted sooooo much time on worthless Alexandrians, while the Hilltop is just a collection of fuzzy faces in the distance that follow the new gal because Jesus says they do.

[BasilSeal]

9 minutes ago, peach said:

Negan doesn't kill his prisoners because he's making them slaves.  Dead people can't grow food or forage supplies.  The living remain his prisoners, basically, for life.   Rick's people are killing them to permanently win their own freedom and go on their way.

Rick's people are fighting a war for that reason, and killing people in a war is morally different from killing prisoners who have surrendered. Negan only kills some of his prisoners because he wants the others to become his slaves, this is correct, but (some of) team Rick want to kill all their prisoners because they present a logistical problem. These are both pragmatic choices and both are morally wrong.

Rick's group and the other members of his alliance of communities have no choice but to fight and kill the saviours in order to win their freedom, but they do have a choice whether to kill the prisoners. Yes, I know, in the world of TWD it's highly likely the stringy haired guy will break out and kill one of the good guys or do something that puts the whole enterprise in jeopardy, but it still doesn't make killing them right.

The writing of the show tends to see saw between different moral perspectives and often undermines it's part time theme that most people are capable of redemption, when morgan imprisons the wolf with the bad teeth rather than just killing him, though it all goes predictably wrong, wolfie does eventually change and saves Merrit Weaver's character a the expense of being bitten himself. So there is a bit of hope for humanity hidden in there sometimes.

[Mu Shu]

On 11/8/2017 at 8:48 PM, AngelaHunter said:

See, that's one of the many, many problems. There's this big scene with sobbing, torment and all that, and we don't know who the hell it is out there! I had no idea. Maybe it was Eric, but how would we know with that extreme long shot? Oh, where are the people who wrote Merle's turn and death with such un-sugary poignance I'm sure I'm not the only one who teared up a bit,  and no trite farewell speeches, last gasps or crystalline tears? That was good writing, but it's just a distant memory. To be fair, the guy who played Eric (sorry, no idea of the actor's name) is no Michael Rooker, but still, are the writers getting their ideas from "TV Tropes"?

We used to discuss this show but now it seems coming here to mock it is more fun than watching it.

Merle’s death was great.  

Who is Eric again?  The bland husband of the Justin Timberlake look a like?

Didnt even get a mercy put down.  That’s how insignificant Eric was. 

[AngelaHunter]

16 minutes ago, peach said:

the Hilltop is just a collection of fuzzy faces in the distance that follow the new gal because Jesus says they do.

Right. You'd think there'd be a few people in Hilltop, unless they're all mindless sheeples, who might say, "Who is this woman and why is she taking charge?" She sits outside the gate and spends hours digging up one blueberry bush with a teaspoon (so it seemed) to demonstrate how to survive or something? Why would they obey Jesus? What has he ever done except a little Kung Fu and ride on the roof of a truck into the Sanctuary for, well, apparently no reason at all. Does he have some mysterious powers yet to be revealed?

[peach]

13 minutes ago, BasilSeal said:

killing people in a war is morally different from killing prisoners who have surrendered 

There shouldn't even BE any prisoners. They went there to kill people in a war and take the outpost.  That was the plan, but Jesus unilaterally decided to try to GET THEM to surrender when he shouldn't have.  They went there to kill the enemy and take the outpost.  The other groups are fighting like hell.  They aren't stopping and asking them to surrender.  

And there are two kinds of surrender.  There is surrendering the battle to avoid death and then becoming a POW, and there is final surrender that you will never fight again.  Surrendering the will to fight anymore.   So instead of just fighting a clean battle they already agreed to, Mr Compassion has now given them a moral dilemma over whether they should kill dangerous enemy POW's.  In the apocalypse with a trace of civilization left.  They have no jails, camps, they have nothing.  They have two trailers back where their families live, and not enough food. 

Either fight a war or don't.

[Ohwell]

As weaselly as Gregory was/is, the Hilltoppers seemed to be doing fine under his leadership before Maggie and CDB came along.  Was Jesus jealous and planned an overthrow of Gregory and decided to use Maggie to do it?  What does Jesus really want?

[peach]

10 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

As weaselly as Gregory was/is, the Hilltoppers seemed to be doing fine under his leadership before Maggie and CDB came along.  Was Jesus jealous and planned an overthrow of Gregory and decided to use Maggie to do it?  What does Jesus really want?

Now that I think about it, when CDB met the Hilltoppers, Negan had just demanded they cut off Gregory's head.  Maybe Jesus wants to always stay #2 and let Maggie be the next one beheaded.   Maybe Jesus and the Hilltop had a little meeting, and said let's put this new gal "in charge" and then if Negan gets pissed he'll kill her instead of one of us.    lol  Just kidding, that's too complex.

[raven]

35 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

As weaselly as Gregory was/is, the Hilltoppers seemed to be doing fine under his leadership before Maggie and CDB came along.  Was Jesus jealous and planned an overthrow of Gregory and decided to use Maggie to do it?  What does Jesus really want?

I thought Negan killed one or two of the Hilltoppers right before Rick's crew arrived because their "take" was short.  I could be wrong, it's all a blur.  Hilltop did have to give food or whatever to Negan's crew so I'm guessing they weren't too happy about that.  Then Negan's crew did a stealth attack with a burning car I think? and zombies and Maggie ran the car over with the tractor while Gregory cowered.  Someone can correct these details for me but I'm pretty sure the basics are correct.

So I think the Hilltoppers gravitated towards Maggie because she led them to protect themselves and they have hope of getting out from under Negan's thumb.

I don't think Jesus is a leader; he's more like Darryl, a good number two man.

[nodorothyparker]

Hilltop had been subject to the same baseball bat to the head of one of its own and I want to say too that a second person had either been killed or taken because they were claiming their "share" was short, leading to the demand for Gregory's head when we met them.  Yet despite seeming to need Maggie to teach them how to transplant a single blueberry bush, they were doing well enough under Gregory to feed themselves, siphon off the Saviors' cut, and still have plenty left over to hire Rick and the gang to go a murderin' for them.  Contrast that with Rick's crew, which showed at up at the Hilltop barely bothering to disguise their intent that they were taking food home with them one way or the other because people can eat only so many canned beet and acorn cookies.  And we already know that Alexandria didn't emerge from their initial dealings with Negan unscathed either.

The Hilltoppers as a whole haven't been developed enough to really give us much sense of them, but they've struck me as people who mostly would have been content to be left alone to farm.  We've been told more than once that they weren't fighters before any of this happened, and that Gregory just "became" their leader apparently without being able to fight either.  We mostly have to take Jesus's word for it that they're all gravitating to Maggie in the same way we have to take his word for it that she's the leader he says she is because they've showed precious little of it beyond a few nameless extras following her to stand behind the A-Team style scrap metal barricade to shoot out Negan's windows.

[BasilSeal]

2 hours ago, peach said:

There shouldn't even BE any prisoners. They went there to kill people in a war and take the outpost.  That was the plan, but Jesus unilaterally decided to try to GET THEM to surrender when he shouldn't have.  They went there to kill the enemy and take the outpost.  The other groups are fighting like hell.  They aren't stopping and asking them to surrender.  

And there are two kinds of surrender.  There is surrendering the battle to avoid death and then becoming a POW, and there is final surrender that you will never fight again.  Surrendering the will to fight anymore.   So instead of just fighting a clean battle they already agreed to, Mr Compassion has now given them a moral dilemma over whether they should kill dangerous enemy POW's.  In the apocalypse with a trace of civilization left.  They have no jails, camps, they have nothing.  They have two trailers back where their families live, and not enough food. 

Either fight a war or don't.

so to summarise, you think they should execute the prisoners because to do anything else would be a bit of a faff.

It's obvious that the prisoners pose a risk and tie up resources and people, clearly from a pragmatic point of view killing them is the most efficient course of action in the short term, don't pretend there's any moral justification for such an action though, you're advocating murder.

[BasilSeal]

2 hours ago, raven said:

I thought Negan killed one or two of the Hilltoppers right before Rick's crew arrived because their "take" was short.  I could be wrong, it's all a blur.  Hilltop did have to give food or whatever to Negan's crew so I'm guessing they weren't too happy about that.  Then Negan's crew did a stealth attack with a burning car I think? and zombies and Maggie ran the car over with the tractor while Gregory cowered.  Someone can correct these details for me but I'm pretty sure the basics are correct.

you're essentially correct with that, as i recall they said that negan had killed a young boy at the hilltop to make his point the first time he turned up, and the hilltoppers gravitated towards Maggie as leader because she did some proactive stuff like driving the tractor over the car whilst all Gregory ever did was act weasely.

why no one thought of using the tractor to smash into Negan's compound is a mystery though, a machine that size on twin wheels, you could set it going on the hand throttle, jump out  and it would plough through the perimeter fence and smash straight through the walls, game over.

3 hours ago, Mu Shu said:

Didnt even get a mercy put down.  That’s how insignificant Eric was. 

Yeah, but dead Eric will surely turn up again at an inopportune moment to put Aaron off doing something important, that's how things go on the walking dead.

[nodorothyparker]

I don't even care that much whether they take prisoners or not.  I care that it was basically decided on the fly because it was apparently Jesus's turn to hold the pacifist stick without running it by anyone else, leading into his knock down drag out fight with Morgan while their string of prisoners was standing right there.  I care that for all of Rick's multi-phase "master plan" the subject of what to do with Saviors who surrendered seemingly never came up, meaning that no provisions have been made for them at all.

[SnarkyTart]

3 hours ago, raven said:

I don't think Jesus is a leader; he's more like Darryl, a good number two man.

I think he's Negan's number two man.  Maybe he's even Negan's own son, which would also explain his name. 

[AngelaHunter]

21 minutes ago, BasilSeal said:

Yeah, but dead Eric will surely turn up again at an inopportune moment to put Aaron off doing something important, that's how things go on the walking dead.

Please, no! Not another trippy, fucked up, flash-back, wannabe-artistic mess (and this time with a character everyone forgets exists until he's onscreen front and center) that the writers do so incredibly poorly hoping to induce heart-rending  Sad Violin moments but it's just cringe-worthy. Teenaged boys do not do "nuanced" very well.

 

29 minutes ago, BasilSeal said:

why no one thought of using the tractor to smash into Negan's compound is a mystery though, a machine that size on twin wheels, you could set it going on the hand throttle, jump out  and it would plough through the perimeter fence and smash straight through the walls, game over.

A mystery indeed, but why do that? Rick had Negan standing still in his rifle sights, with all the time in the world to snuff him out, but decided, "Nah. Changed my mind. I know he was going to kill Cworl, but let him live to rant about dicks and balls and piss for another pointless season. We need the money."

29 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

it was apparently Jesus's turn to hold the pacifist stick

Makes me envision a sort of Olympic moment - a passing of the "Pacifist Torch." Morgan ("Now I too will Kill 'em All!) holds it out and Jesus runs up, grabs it, and bravely carries on. "My turn!" Did Jesus have an epiphany, or maybe a message from Above, after he orchestrated the outpost slaughter of sleeping victims?

[BasilSeal]

43 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

A mystery indeed, but why do that? Rick had Negan standing still in his rifle sights, with all the time in the world to snuff him out, but decided, "Nah. Changed my mind. I know he was going to kill Cworl, but let him live to rant about dicks and balls and piss for another pointless season. We need the money."

Oh, you mean when Negan very sportingly wandered out onto the balcony like the Queen waving to the crowd after a royal wedding, with all his key lieutenants, in clear view of his mortal enemies who are only a few yards away with dozens of automatic weapons pointed at him?

What else could our heroes do but let him drone on about some boring shit for 10 minutes before letting him run back inside unscathed and then shoot his windows out with 5,000 rounds? 

Presumably just shooting the dull twunt as soon as he stuck his annoying head out of the door was too simple. Or maybe they were mesmerised by that weird hopping from one foot to the other whilst leaning over he does in lieu of actually acting. 

I'd just filed that under 'shit that makes no sense' along with all the other stuff like the bullet proof tiger, why they've suddenly gone back to the infinite ammo setting after being so short of bullets they were thinking of getting mullet man to knock up some home made ones and 'does sticking a rusty corrugated sheet on your car door really make it bullet proof?'

[jackjill89]

5 hours ago, Ohwell said:

As weaselly as Gregory was/is, the Hilltoppers seemed to be doing fine under his leadership before Maggie and CDB came along.  Was Jesus jealous and planned an overthrow of Gregory and decided to use Maggie to do it?  What does Jesus really want?

EVERY group that the CDB encounters seems to be doing quite fine until CDB comes along and tell them how they don't know anything and they're going to die. Then, they do. 

[AngelaHunter]

14 minutes ago, jackjill89 said:

EVERY group that the CDB encounters seems to be doing quite fine until CDB comes along

Even animals, especially horses, seemed to be whiling away the apocalypse quite happily until CDB shows up. Goodbye, horses.  And don't even mention the pigs.:(

58 minutes ago, BasilSeal said:

Oh, you mean when Negan very sportingly wandered out onto the balcony like the Queen waving to the crowd after a royal wedding, with all his key lieutenants, in clear view of his mortal enemies who are only a few yards away with dozens of automatic weapons pointed at him?

The only answer I can think of is that Negan has some magical deflector shield, knows that Rick cannot harm him and that any attempt to do so will send the shots wild, harmlessly breaking windows and expending ammunition. There's nothing else that makes any sense to me. The writers can't be hacks to this degree, can they? Can they??

Did they sit there, saying, "Okay, okay - guys, this is it! The Big Showdown, the climax after Rick telling Negan, "I"m going to kill you" with all the "not today, not tomorrow" usual stuff and not just once, right, but like, TWICE! Ohh, so badass! So then, like, let's show Rick's crew gearing up for a mighty war, like D-Day or something. Yeah, maybe I'm not too sure what happened there, but it must have been freakin' cool. Anyway, the armoured cars, the tons of weapons... what? Where did all those guns come from, you ask? Oh, man, don't kill my buzz! I'll think of something - later. So then  - Rick and Negan talk at each other! A lot! Negan leans back and smirks! Rick starts a countdown and - ta da! - shoots out all Negan's windows! Fuckin' awesome! Fans will be pissin' their pants. High fives!"

Sorry, but I can imagine no other scenario where anyone connected with this show would think they'd done a great job.

[ShadowSixx]

5 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

Please, no! Not another trippy, fucked up, flash-back, wannabe-artistic mess (and this time with a character everyone forgets exists until he's onscreen front and center) that the writers do so incredibly poorly hoping to induce heart-rending  Sad Violin moments but it's just cringe-worthy. Teenaged boys do not do "nuanced" very well.

 

Yeah, they're probably gonna have Aaron go out and search for Eric to put him down just like Spencer did with Deanna. The best thing to do is put the person down before they turn, especially a loved one. What is keeping them alive gonna do?

[ShadowSixx]

23 hours ago, peach said:

I miss that Rick.  How many seasons ago was that?  I guess that was the time DARYL had to get wishy washy, and then Beth got killed.  Years later we have to watch Jesus learn this same stupid lesson.  Wonder who will die so he can. 

At this point it's probably Maggie who has to die in order for him to get it but we know Maggie more than likely isn't going anywhere anytime soon. Jesus doesn't seem to be close to anyone on Hilltop so any Hilltop deaths wouldn't be worth it. There is Enid, it might have to be her in order for him to get it.

[AngelaHunter]

15 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

It's obvious that the prisoners pose a risk and tie up resources and people, clearly from a pragmatic point of view killing them is the most efficient course of action in the short term, don't pretend there's any moral justification for such an action though, you're advocating murder.

I dunno... after the cold-blooded, mass-murder of the sleeping Saviors, killing them when they're awake hardly seems any worse. I don't think Jesus really thought this through before he decided to bring home a gang of Neganites and keep them - where? The logistics of it all do not compute.

 

13 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

I'd just filed that under 'shit that makes no sense' along with all the other stuff like the bullet proof tiger, why they've suddenly gone back to the infinite ammo setting after being so short of bullets they were thinking of getting mullet man to knock up some home made ones and 'does sticking a rusty corrugated sheet on your car door really make it bullet proof?'

"Shit That Makes No Sense" file - "SMNS" for short since it must be used often -  must be bulging by now.

[peach]

20 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

so to summarise, you think they should execute the prisoners because to do anything else would be a bit of a faff.

It's obvious that the prisoners pose a risk and tie up resources and people, clearly from a pragmatic point of view killing them is the most efficient course of action in the short term, don't pretend there's any moral justification for such an action though, you're advocating murder.

LOL.  Starving to death and/or my family being murdered and women taken away to Negan's harem = "a bit of faff" 

[Mu Shu]

On 11/11/2017 at 3:40 PM, peach said:

There shouldn't even BE any prisoners. They went there to kill people in a war and take the outpost.  That was the plan, but Jesus unilaterally decided to try to GET THEM to surrender when he shouldn't have.  They went there to kill the enemy and take the outpost.  The other groups are fighting like hell.  They aren't stopping and asking them to surrender.  

And there are two kinds of surrender.  There is surrendering the battle to avoid death and then becoming a POW, and there is final surrender that you will never fight again.  Surrendering the will to fight anymore.   So instead of just fighting a clean battle they already agreed to, Mr Compassion has now given them a moral dilemma over whether they should kill dangerous enemy POW's.  In the apocalypse with a trace of civilization left.  They have no jails, camps, they have nothing.  They have two trailers back where their families live, and not enough food. 

Either fight a war or don't.

It seems like these morons are taking their  POWs to live in the same compound as civilians, including children.  Jesus decided that the POWs are more important than children.   

The POWs of course will escape and wreak havoc.  Jesus is a moron.  

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, peach said:

LOL.  Starving to death and/or my family being murdered and women taken away to Negan's harem = "a bit of faff" 

A kerfuffle? A major kerfuffle!

Quote

 Jesus decided that the POWs are more important than children.

Sure. Morgan decided that Wolves were more important than the lives of his benefactors.

Edited November 12, 2017 by AngelaHunter

[Nashville]

52 minutes ago, AngelaHunter said:

A kerfuffle? A major kerfuffle!

Major Kerfuffle, sir?  <saluting>

Edited November 12, 2017 by Nashville

[Mu Shu]

On 11/11/2017 at 1:38 PM, jackjill89 said:

I like Ezekiel and his "fake it till you make it" mindset.  It seems like kiddy theatre because that's where he's drawing his references. I wish we knew more about The Hilltop people. All we know is that they are kind of earthy-crunchy and Gregory sucks. I want to know more about the people there. Also, as much as I hate the garbage people, how did they become so weird? How in the world did someone like Jadis become the leader? Why is their speech so stilted? The way the different groups have handled the apocalypse is interesting to me. 

I originally loathed the Idea of the character, but the actor is very charming and sells it.   Bad wig and all, I dig Zeke. 

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, Mu Shu said:

I originally loathed the Idea of the character, but the actor is very charming and sells it.   Bad wig and all, I dig Zeke. 

Pretty much the same here.  Despite the rap being laid on Zeke by Negan Dahmer (which was nothing more than ND’s self-serving projection on how/why ND would be in a similar situation), I don’t think EZ had any intentions of running a con on anybody, long or otherwise.  

I’ve always suspected Ezekiel (and Shiva) wandered into a situation where a group with relatively good prospects was on the verge of collapsing due to a vacuum at the top of the preexisting power structure; the original leader got bit or otherwise died, and nobody else was willing to step into those shoes and take responsibility for leading the group.  And Zeke simply stepped in with his big hair and bigger histrionics to keep a good thing from going to shit.

[Raven1707]

The Cable Live +3 ratings are in for Episode 803, "Monsters":

“The Walking Dead’s” Nov. 5 episode was down a little week to week in the same-day ratings. It made up that deficit, however, with three days of DVR and on-demand viewing.

The AMC show is the clear leader among both adults 18-49 and total viewers in the Live +3 ratings for Oct. 30-Nov. 5. Its 5.6 rating in the 18-49 demographic is even with the previous week’s mark.

In viewers, “The Walking Dead” passed “Monday Night Football” to take over the top spot with 12.09 million. That’s a little behind the 12.25 million for the previous week. [12.086 million viewers]

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/dvr-ratings/cable-live-3-ratings-for-oct-30-nov-5-2017/

Here are the Live + Same Day and Live +3 ratings for Season 8 so far:

10-22-17 “Mercy” 11.439 million; 15.047 million
10-29-17 “The Damned” 8.923 million; 12.247 million
11-05-17 “Monsters” 8.519 million; 12.086 million

[peach]

On 11/12/2017 at 3:06 PM, AngelaHunter said:

A kerfuffle? A major kerfuffle!

A major kerfluffle, indeed!  Negan killing Glenn was just a spot of bother.

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, peach said:

A major kerfluffle, indeed!  Negan killing Glenn was just a spot of bother.

I know it’s 6 spots to a snit, and 4 snits to a tiff - but how many tiffs in a kerfluffle?  ;>

Edited November 14, 2017 by Nashville

[Raven1707]

The Cable Live +7 ratings are in for Episode 803, "Monsters":

Per usual, “The Walking Dead” was the biggest total gainer in both adults 18-49 (+2.2) and viewers (+4.77 million). [6.0 rating and 13.007 million viewers]

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/dvr-ratings/cable-live-7-ratings-for-oct-30-nov-5-2017/

Here are the Live + Same Day, Live + 3, and Live +7 ratings for the first 3 episodes of Season 8:

10-22-17 “Mercy” 11.439 million; 15.047 million; 15.736 million
10-29-17 “The Damned” 8.923 million; 12.247 million; 13.096 million
11-05-17 “Monsters” 8.519 million; 12.086 million; 13.007 million

[Primetimer]

Rick's plan to take down Negan was going great, and then all of a sudden, it wasn't.

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