These Spoilers Suck: Bitter Speculation About SPN Spoilers

[gonzosgirrl]

5 hours ago, juppschmitz said:

Bait for Dean girls, that's all it is. 

Bait is the perfect word for it. A little scrap of something tasty and enticing that ultimately leaves you either gutted on the floor or tossed away as insignificant. 

Have I mentioned lately how much I loath Dabb*? 

Edited January 13, 2019 by gonzosgirrl

[trudysmom]

8 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Bait for Dean girls, that's all it is.

Well this Dean girl didn't take the bait, because I hate this MichaelDean story.  I'm sure I"ll hate whatever happens next with Sam just as much. 

[ILoveReading]

I'm not taking the bait either.  I'll watch the five minutes we get of Michael on you tube.

I'm wondering why they released so many synopsis so close together.  I dont' ever remember getting so many so close together before.   It's almost like they want to kill any excitement for the Michael story.  They did this at the start of the season too.   After ep two there was an article that said Dean wasn't secretly possessed and that there would be little follow up to his trauma. 

Now they release the following two episodes after this one making sure that we know nothing is really about Michael or Dean's trauma.

*This is not meant as bitch/jerk.  I'm refering to how they're treating the Michael storyline overall, not specifically to Dean or Jensen.

[Bobcatkitten]

Jensen had to be there otherwise why would he have been out in Vancouver on Saturday night. Would still be at home. 

[catrox14]

2 hours ago, trudysmom said:

Well this Dean girl didn't take the bait, because I hate this MichaelDean story.  I'm sure I"ll hate whatever happens next with Sam just as much. 

Do you hate it because it's Other than Dean? Or how it's been executed? Just curious.

[trudysmom]

T

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

how it's been executed?

The execution, not on Jensen's part, the writers. 

Maybe hate is too strong, it's not the worst storyline they have done. But I  hate the tease, the glimpse here and there of MichaelDean.  It could have been a great story, but they crapped all over it from the start.  I hate where the story could possibly take them, both possessed by archangels and in the end, they what? Kill each other?  One survives?  I just don't see a plausible way out of it. And I guess that's where I'm losing faith, because canon no longer counts for anything, we have the implausible over and over again.  If the show had been crapfest all along it wouldn't bother me, but they've taken it (us) to the absurd once too often and I have no faith that this story can end well.  By 'well' I mean both brothers alive, themselves (not possessed), hunting the new breed of monsters.  Even it that happens, they'll just spiral into another world-ending crisis that will either have them lying to each other and fighting, again, or shoving more NotBobby and MommieDearest down my throat. Or it'll become "The Mark Pelligrino Hour:  Sympathy for Lucifer."  Because that's all these writers know how to do. 

Sorry, rant over.  I know I'm way too invested. 

[catrox14]

14 minutes ago, trudysmom said:

T

The execution, not on Jensen's part, the writers. 

Maybe hate is too strong, it's not the worst storyline they have done. But I  hate the tease, the glimpse here and there of MichaelDean.  It could have been a great story, but they crapped all over it from the start.  I hate where the story could possibly take them, both possessed by archangels and in the end, they what? Kill each other?  One survives?  I just don't see a plausible way out of it. And I guess that's where I'm losing faith, because canon no longer counts for anything, we have the implausible over and over again.  If the show had been crapfest all along it wouldn't bother me, but they've taken it (us) to the absurd once too often and I have no faith that this story can end well.  By 'well' I mean both brothers alive, themselves (not possessed), hunting the new breed of monsters.  Even it that happens, they'll just spiral into another world-ending crisis that will either have them lying to each other and fighting, again, or shoving more NotBobby and MommieDearest down my throat. Or it'll become "The Mark Pelligrino Hour:  Sympathy for Lucifer."  Because that's all these writers know how to do. 

Sorry, rant over.  I know I'm way too invested. 

Sorry for having induced a rant! Thank you for answering!

[ILoveReading]

Picture from a guest star.  This is supposed to be the episode that Dean is in a bad spot/place physically.

Dean looks relatively unscathed there.  I really hope its not just another Dean kills himself to talk to someone that's dead scenario. 

This is also the episode where Dean has the big heart to heart with Cas. I hope it Cas resassuring Dean how much he's love and needed, because I find that relationship so one sided lately.

[Bobcatkitten]

If they were going to do Michael!Dean they needed to fully commit. They didn't do that. Half measures.

[ILoveReading]

35 minutes ago, Bobcatkitten said:

If they were going to do Michael!Dean they needed to fully commit. They didn't do that. Half measure

I wouldn't even call it a half measure.  There was no build up to Dean saying yes, one literal 10 second scene of Michael vs Dean, and then it was ignored until they needed it again for a cliff hanger.

Id call it a 1/10 measure, but even that is a stretch.

[ILoveReading]

This basically sums up the season.  They're talking about Michael but its a picture of Chief.

[gonzosgirrl]

24 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

This basically sums up the season.  They're talking about Michael but its a picture of Chief.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. But yeah, you're right- Dabbernatural in a nutshell.

[ILoveReading]

http://www.ksitetv.com/supernatural/supernatural-spoilers-damaged-goods-description/189241/nggallery/image/sn1411b_0026b/

In the continuing tradition of Dabb's SamNatural not a single photo of Dean.

[gonzosgirrl]

23 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

http://www.ksitetv.com/supernatural/supernatural-spoilers-damaged-goods-description/189241/nggallery/image/sn1411b_0026b/

In the continuing tradition of Dabb's SamNatural not a single photo of Dean.

What a fucking joke.

HOW DID WE GET HERE? – Dean (Jensen Ackles) spends some bonding time with Mary (guest star Samantha Smith) and Donna (guest star Briana Buckmaster). Nick (Mark Pellegrino) finally finds the answer he has been searching for. Sam (Jared Padalecki) is left to make an unimaginable choice.

Two pictures of Mary (and oh yes, with bags of groceries and beer - I feel a white-washing coming on), two of Pellegrino, and one of Sam. I guess Dean spends time bonding with them while hiding under the covers somewhere? FFS.

[gonzosgirrl]

What's hilarious is, if you Tweet the article via their link, the click bait thumbnail is an image of Dean and Sam, but he's nowhere to be found on the page.

Edited January 14, 2019 by gonzosgirrl

[Aeryn13]

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

This basically sums up the season.  They're talking about Michael but its a picture of Chief.

That`s chico of the cw_spn twitter handle, she`d rather be boiled alive than put a promo pic for Dean/Jensen.

[ILoveReading]

Isn't that a pic from the ep The Future?

I'm thinking Sam's impossible choice will be to say yes to Lucifer to prevent him from possessing Nick again.

[gonzosgirrl]

5 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

That`s chico of the cw_spn twitter handle, she`d rather be boiled alive than put a promo pic for Dean/Jensen.

I don't think Chico (Suzanne Gomez) runs the @cw_spn account, though I don't disagree with the rest of your point.

[Aeryn13]

Since we have Donna confronting Nick - probably for being a newly minted serial killer - and thus it`s likely the characters all intersect here (other than Dean who does god knows what after Chief does Chiefly things in 10), my current prediction for "unimaginable choice" would be "does he or does he not kill Nick?"

Lame, you say? Sure. But every since I read "is asked to do something unimaginable to his brother" in a Vampire Diaries synopsis couple years back and everyone spent weeks speculating because those characters were morally bankrupt as it was so what would be "unimaginable" for them and it turned out to be something so mundane that characters did to each other every single episode, when I see that now in episode summaries a voice in my head goes "that`s a trick, don`t fall for it".

And really nothing has changed. That stuff is still happening with episode summaries. They are written in terrible purple prose where it basically says stuff like "character A undergoes a harrowing physical event" when they mean character A sneezes.       

[trudysmom]

1 hour ago, gonzosgirrl said:

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

That`s chico of the cw_spn twitter handle, she`d rather be boiled alive than put a promo pic for Dean/Jensen.

I don't think Chico (Suzanne Gomez) runs the @cw_spn account, though I don't disagree with the rest of your point.

When I read Aeryn's post I thought she meant Mary, so I replied "Cause she knows he's prettier."  It still works though. :)

[BoxManLocke]

Wait so Donna's the one who's just going to end up apprehending Nick ?

 

Wow, out of all the cops in this country, that's super convenient !

 

I'm afraid Dabb's run in this show will leave me completely jaded to everything TV related. His continuous effort to shatter my suspension of disbelief is just admirable.

[juppschmitz]

10 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

Isn't that a pic from the ep The Future?

I'm thinking Sam's impossible choice will be to say yes to Lucifer to prevent him from possessing Nick again.

Oh yeah, because THAT worked so well before. Not. *massive eyeroll*

Well, the saying yes bit worked alright... A little too well, actually.

[AwesomO4000]

10 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

my current prediction for "unimaginable choice" would be "does he or does he not kill Nick?"

Yup, they would consider that an "unimaginable choice" while I think many of us here would say "ooh an excuse to kill him? Hand me a weapon."
 

Quote

 

Lame, you say? Sure. But every since I read "is asked to do something unimaginable to his brother" in a Vampire Diaries synopsis couple years back and everyone spent weeks speculating because those characters were morally bankrupt as it was so what would be "unimaginable" for them and it turned out to be something so mundane that characters did to each other every single episode, when I see that now in episode summaries a voice in my head goes "that`s a trick, don`t fall for it".

And really nothing has changed. That stuff is still happening with episode summaries. They are written in terrible purple prose where it basically says stuff like "character A undergoes a harrowing physical event" when they mean character A sneezes. 

 

Yeah, I pretty much take almost everything the promo monkeys say with a grain of salt... Nowadays (at least after Joss Whedon anyway) I don't generally entirely believe everything show writers say either, because after they put their spin on things, what actually happens often doesn't match what they say they are doing.

And then there was The Walking Dead... where I only wished the promo monkeys and writers hadn't been telling us the truth. (:: is still bitter ::)

[Bobcatkitten]

16 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

Isn't that a pic from the ep The Future?

I'm thinking Sam's impossible choice will be to say yes to Lucifer to prevent him from possessing Nick again.

Lucifer is dead though right? We have had no indication that he is somehow alive?

[ILoveReading]

56 minutes ago, Bobcatkitten said:

Lucifer is dead though right? We have had no indication that he is somehow alive?

 We saw Lucifer start to rise when Nick prayed to him. Given that the show is great at follow up, it doesn't matter if the empty keeper didn't notice.  That wasn't the storyline that week so its not worth mentioning.   The synopsis said something about him find out finding the answer to what he's been searching for. Nick wants to be possessed again.  Then for ep 12,he comes face to face with his past.   So I can't see what else that could mean, other than Lucifer rising.

Plus, if you've seen the cast/crew photo for this season Mark P is wearing his Lucifer leather jacket.  This show has an obsession with Lucifer/Mark P.  Add all this up and its obvious Lucifer is comingback.

16 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

my current prediction for "unimaginable choice" would be "does he or does he not kill Nick?"

if his is the choice, (and I hope its nothing more than this) than we know he chooses not to kill him or if he does he'll be back because Nick/Lucifer is in episode 12.  Unless its Nick vs Nick, Lucifer will need to be in another vessel, which wouldn't surprise me if it was Sam.

There is a new version of Sam, which I'm guessing is going to be prophet Sam

Edited January 15, 2019 by ILoveReading

[Bobcatkitten]

Hhhmm. I didn't know the thing we saw in the empty was definitively Lucifer. I thought it was the Empty Keeper who then went to heaven to get Jack. 

[catrox14]

5 hours ago, Bobcatkitten said:

Hhhmm. I didn't know the thing we saw in the empty was definitively Lucifer. I thought it was the Empty Keeper who then went to heaven to get Jack. 

I think both things happened.  I think the Empty Keeper rose and went after Jack, and that we didn't see it rise from the goo.  The red eyes in the head that we saw rise, implies Lucifer IMO given the writers decided Lucifer needed red eyes back in what s12 to let us know he was EVUL and they keep showing him with them.  I think the Empty Keeper and Lucifer are both going to be in play.

[gonzosgirrl]

 

No idea what this is about, but I'm gonna go ahead and assume I'll be bitter about it. Heh.

[BoxManLocke]

56 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

 

No idea what this is about, but I'm gonna go ahead and assume I'll be bitter about it. Heh.

 

I'm gonna go with renewal for season 15.

 

That would bring me no joy whatsoever but it's still better than anything that's episode related. Even if we got a potentially positive spoiler, PTB have lied so many times I wouldn't be able to trust it.

[Myrelle]

3 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

 

No idea what this is about, but I'm gonna go ahead and assume I'll be bitter about it. Heh.

 

2 hours ago, BoxManLocke said:

 

I'm gonna go with renewal for season 15.

 

That would bring me no joy whatsoever but it's still better than anything that's episode related. Even if we got a potentially positive spoiler, PTB have lied so many times I wouldn't be able to trust it.

Yeah, I'm thinking renewal, too.

And ITA with the bolded part, too. It's not even worth taking part in spec during any hiatus because of all the lies and half-truths we get via the so-called "spoilers".

This show has become nothing but a sad joke because of this aspect, IMO.

[Bobcatkitten]

What would be your dream announcement? 

 

Kripke returns? 

A movie? 

[ukgirl71]

Mark Pellegrino gets his own show, in a tv galaxy far, far away, and he asks for (and gets) his dream showrunner, Andrew Dabb?

[catrox14]

3

1 hour ago, ukgirl71 said:

Mark Pellegrino gets his own show, in a tv galaxy far, far away, and he asks for (and gets) his dream showrunner, Andrew Dabb?

Ben Edlund and Steve Yockey become showrunners and head writers.

[gonzosgirrl]

Knowing Gomez and her almost complete lack of interest in Supernatural and its fans, I think what would seem super-exciting for us (in her mind) and what we would consider awesome news are not the same thing at all. I'm thinking an S15 renewal, or at best (worst?) an announcement of a two season renewal with 16 being the last.

[ILoveReading]

Quote

But for Morgan, who’s been asked for years about returning, it has always been about bringing John back in the right way. “The relationships between these three men were so open, so if I was going to come back, it would be nice to have some closure, especially with Sammy,” Morgan says. And before the hour’s over, both boys will get a moment alone with Dad. “This episode gives Sam a chance to forgive,” Padalecki says. Ackles adds, “For Dean, the whole episode is a dream that he doesn’t want to wake up from. But he knows he has to.”

So Dabb is just ripping off What is and What Should Never Be.  He has to be the laziest showrunner in the history of television.

It sounds like my prediction was right.  Dean gets the fluff and the hero worship, Sam gets the meat and the closure. 

I bet Sam won't talk about how their childhood messed up Dean.

https://ew.com/tv/2019/01/16/supernatural-ew-cover-300-episodes/?utm_medium=social&utm_term=9B9740D8-19AF-11E9-B2A8-15D9FCA12A29&utm_content=link&utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_ew&utm_source=twitter.com

I can see the end of this ep ending with John telling Sam how proud he is of him and he'll tell Dean he did a great job of taking care of Sam.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

So Dabb is just ripping off What is and What Should Never Be.  He has to be the laziest showrunner in the history of television.

It sounds like my prediction was right.  Dean gets the fluff and the hero worship, Sam gets the meat and the closure. 

I bet Sam won't talk about how their childhood messed up Dean.

https://ew.com/tv/2019/01/16/supernatural-ew-cover-300-episodes/?utm_medium=social&utm_term=9B9740D8-19AF-11E9-B2A8-15D9FCA12A29&utm_content=link&utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_ew&utm_source=twitter.com

I can see the end of this ep ending with John telling Sam how proud he is of him and he'll tell Dean he did a great job of taking care of Sam.

Since this is supposed to come about due to Dean`s wish for closure, I reckon they will pay this off somehow. If that is good? Whole other question. 

And while I agree that Sam won`t give a speech to John like Dean gave to cold fish Mary, John is the person who does know what Dean`s childhood was like. He acknowledged it - and Dean`s sacrifices - in their final scene in IMTOD. I wanted something like that from the Ice Queen but she`ll never paid Dean a compliment and I`m not expecting one now. 

Their goodbyes are probably gonna be something that calls back to what they tell him about their lifes, something like "I couldn`t be more proud of the men you`ve become, you`ve saved the world bla bla".

Sam alone with John will probably get something like "I get it now why you... and I forgive you". 

Dean alone with John? I honestly don`t know. It doesnt sound antagonistic in any way so probably no recriminations. Then what? That`s why that spoiler about it originating with a wish from Dean (and an unconscious one at that - hey, is that gonna be like Amara gave him Mary because she thought she was doing him a favour? you could say it was a "want" of Dean, though never voiced to her in any way) has me stumped. What does he want out of it now? 

What I`m in no way, shape or form looking forward to is Mary being there. I may begrudge Sam (the character, not Sam Smith) a lot but certainly not time with John. It would be stupid if either brother didn`t have scenes with him but the Mary character is so completely ruined at that point, I resent her presence in the episode.   

Edited January 16, 2019 by Aeryn13

[ILoveReading]

Note the caption

 

10 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

What I`m in no way, shape or form looking forward to is Mary being there. I may begrudge Sam (the character, not Sam Smith) a lot but certainly not time with John. It would be stupid if either brother didn`t have scenes with him but the Mary character is so completely ruined at that point, I resent her presence in the episode.   

I wished they had given Sam that scene with Mary.  It makes more sense since it was all about him, and he's the one that needed closure with Mary more.  I never felt Dean really did and that he had any resentment toward Mary.  Jensen is great at the subtle things, and if I was supposed to be seeing that I think it would have been there in more of the scenes.

As long as Dean's scene is about Dean and actually addresses some of the issues than Sam can have all the closure he wants.  I want to see Jensen get his wish of him saying 'how dare you" take my childhood to John.

[gonzosgirrl]

Honestly, if John doesn't want to kill Mary himself after learning the truth about her - then it really is a fantasy. Seriously, their whole lives (and deaths) are on her. How can that just be ignored?

[ILoveReading]

https://ew.com/tv/2019/01/16/supernatural-jeffrey-dean-morgan-interview-john-winchester/?utm_content=link&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=70652472-19C1-11E9-ABB6-5313933C408C&utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_entertainmentweekly

Quote

The relationships between these three men were so open, so if I was going to come back, it would be nice to have some closure, especially with Sammy

Quote

There’s always been a need for closure with these characters and their father, especially with Jared’s character. Kid’s a disaster because of his father apparently. [Laughs] 

So only Sammy was messed up?

Let Sam have time with his father, but its Dean who John messed up more.  Sam he doted on.  Dean was the blunt instrument.

Edited January 16, 2019 by ILoveReading

[Aeryn13]

Quote

Honestly, if John doesn't want to kill Mary himself after learning the truth about her - then it really is a fantasy. Seriously, their whole lives (and deaths) are on her. How can that just be ignored?

I would get if he still loved her because no matter what she died and how she lied about it, it was still John`s choice to respond to it in the manner he did. However, in light of the Mary character becoming so unloveable and downright hateable - at least to me - I can`t stand any swooning/fawning over her. I was so happy to see that Ketch seemed to have transferred his crazy affections onto Dean somehow. Anyone but Mary for me.

Didn`t have this problem before they brought her back. When I learned about her deal in ITB and when they brought Amy Gumenick back later in Season 5?, I still liked the character. She seemed like a warm person. But the writer`s and Sam Smith`s obsession with being "anything but nightgown!Mary" has turned her into a block of ice. She didn`t have to be a 50s housewife and still could have been a warm person.    

Quote

As long as Dean's scene is about Dean and actually addresses some of the issues than Sam can have all the closure he wants.  I want to see Jensen get his wish of him saying 'how dare you" take my childhood to John.

That would be the kind of closure I would expect if Dean still yearned for closure. But since Jensen said for Dean it`s like a dream, he doesn`t want to wake up from, it sounds more like he is just happy. That everything else falls away. Which would make sense initially. You can be mad at someone all you want but if you got them back, happiness would probably overpower that at first. If John stayed longer, I`m sure resentments would creep up but he is obviously only around for a short while. 

So whatever they discuss I don`t see them doing it angrily. Jensen is usually a very good judge on how to play a scene. Like wasn`t the scene with Chuck initially supposed to be angry, the one where Dean calls him out? And Jensen played it more with sadness? I can see something like this happen.  

Edited January 16, 2019 by Aeryn13

[gonzosgirrl]

Yeah I get they want awwww shucks for the 300th and the John and Mary soap opera reunion, but it would be nice for this Dean fan if we got just a little of what Dean said/did about The Life of Sammy in Who We Are. That's never going to happen though, so...

[Aeryn13]

Quote

but it would be nice for this Dean fan if we got just a little of what Dean said/did about The Life of Sammy in Who We Are. That's never going to happen though, so...

I know. And yeah, I agree, never happening. I dread the "bonding" with Mary in episode 11. I mean, Mary being comforting and nice to Dean, telling him she is proud of him or something like that? As if.  Sam got this from her but she never acknowledges anything positive about Dean. And she`ll never be called out on her shit. 

At this point, I just want minimal scenes with her.

Btw, prediction, the bit of Sam crying from the new "Onward" promo? Dean is clearly next to him but you can`t really see his face but I`d guess he`ll have tears in his eyes, too. That is totally gonna be after the world reset and John has disappeared again. I would bet money on that.    

Edited January 16, 2019 by Aeryn13

[AwesomO4000]

42 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Let Sam have time with his father, but its Dean who John messed up more.  Sam he doted on.  Dean was the blunt instrument.

I have never much subscribed to the idea that John "doted" on Sam. John had reason to be concerned about Sam, because - as far as we know - he knew there was something odd about him from maybe the beginning. (His journal entry stating that he "learned the truth" from Missouri.) Obviously there was a malignant force associated with Sam, so that was going to be of concern. But whether that translated into any more affection for Sam, I don't necessarily agree with.

They both called him "Sir"and were both expected to follow orders. Dean was maybe a bit more messed up, because he subscribed to all of that treatment, but in my opinion, John didn't treat them all that differently than from the usual older sibling vs younger sibling stuff.

I think the proof that Sam got messed up almost as much is what happened in season 4 when Sam decided that maybe the way John treated them was right after all. At least Dean finally realized that it was messed up. Sam has flashes of it, but mostly thinks that John did the right thing now. Talk about messed up.

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

Sam alone with John will probably get something like "I get it now why you... and I forgive you". 

I also expect something like this, but if the writing stays with the basic theme / tone of the show, I expect that Sam is going to be the one apologizing to John or asking John for forgiveness for not realizing sooner that John was just trying to keep them safe and was just doing what was best for the family... fairly similar to "The Song Remains the Same." I will be extremely surprised if things stray too far from the usual, which has generally been that Sam was wrong or at the very least misguided for "abandoning the family,"  and that he learned his lesson and now understood that the more mature thing would have been to accept his responsibilities ("Afterschool Special") and have stayed. That has pretty much been the general theme of Sam's story since... Even the straying from that in season 8 was mainly done for Sam to learn this lesson all over again and state it more emphatically than ever in season 10. And now - in my opinion - this new "Sam as leader" thing is just more of an attempt to show that Sam has learned that he should have embraced this earlier, blah blah blah.

So I expect more of a Sam apology, or an "I wish I had listened to you sooner" kind of thing. I won't like it too much, because I think the Sam-blaming for him having tried to go to college and have a normal life has gone on long enough, but I expect that's more likely what we're going to get and I'll be pleasantly surprised if that's not what happens.

[ILoveReading]

1 minute ago, AwesomO4000 said:

I have never much subscribed to the idea that John "doted" on Sam. J

We know that John tried to keep Sam isolated from hunting.  We know that Sam was in a play, was a mathlete, and played soccor, so he had at least some semblance of a normal life.  I think canon supports Sam being the favored son.  We know that John was proud of him and checked up on him while he was at school.

Dean he couldn't even bother to return a phone call.

I don't think Sam had a story book child hood by any means, but at least he had both John and Dean, and Zanna looking out for him.  Dean really had no one growing up.

As a result of John's so called parenting, Dean grew up with no sense of identity outside of Sam. He had one job, protect Sam at any cost.  He grew up believing he didn't matter. 

So Mary's deal might have effected Sam more and even I believe Sam needed the confrontation with Mary more than Dean, just like I believe that John's partenting had a more profound effect on Dean. The show, IMO, is giving the wrong parent to the wrong brother.

[DeeDee79]

4 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

I can see the end of this ep ending with John telling Sam how proud he is of him and he'll tell Dean he did a great job of taking care of Sam.

*gag*

[devlin]

2 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

https://ew.com/tv/2019/01/16/supernatural-jeffrey-dean-morgan-interview-john-winchester/?utm_content=link&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=70652472-19C1-11E9-ABB6-5313933C408C&utm_campaign=entertainmentweekly_entertainmentweekly

So only Sammy was messed up?

Let Sam have time with his father, but its Dean who John messed up more.  Sam he doted on.  Dean was the blunt instrument.

 

I hate how the show ignores just how bad dean’s childhood was. He never got to be a child. Sam was protected, he was always put first by dean. Because of dean, sam was able to develop an identity and had enough self esteem to be able to follow his own needs. Dean’s upbringing has completely damaged him in regards to how he sees himself in relation to those around him, which is why we see him making the decisions he makes.

Edited January 16, 2019 by devlin

[trudysmom]

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

As a result of John's so called parenting, Dean grew up with no sense of identity outside of Sam. He had one job, protect Sam at any cost.  He grew up believing he didn't matter. 

You couldn't have said it any better.  That's Dean, absolutely.  As for those who hope Mary's time will be minimal, I agree even more.  She can go and stay far, far away.  I've tried to like her, but she's just so danged unlikeable.  Bitchy even.  I wish I could look forward to this episode, any upcoming episode, really with more excitement, but actually I feel more dread.  I'll still watch, I can't not watch, lol.  I've just lost hope that I'll see very much that I enjoy.

[devlin]

Wow. Watching the ew promo, Jensen talks about both brothers and their dad and how John gets to see both his boys as grown men. Jared talks about only sam getting to see his idol and coach and that he gets to see him making mistakes and that means that sam can forgive himself. WTF, that makes no sense and since when has John been sam’s idol and coach.

[MysteryGuest]

I still don't know how the return of John is going to be handled, but if both Sam and Dean get something out of it, then I guess I'm good with it.  I don't think either one of them wants John to come back so they can tell him off.  I just don't expect that to happen, and I personally don't think it needs to.  If John had been an alcoholic, or just an abusive asshole of a father, that would be one thing, but John was as much a victim of circumstances as Sam and Dean were. 

And I personally hate how they've tried to pin this all on Mary now.  Yes, it was her deal that set them on their path, but when watching her make that deal, I never once felt angry with her for her decision.  I think most of us would have made the same choice, under those circumstances.  The only one to blame for all of this is Yellow Eyes, IMO.  

I think it's pretty much a given that they're not going for humor for their 300th episode.  It sounds like it's going to be a sob fest.  I just hope they do a good job.

[devlin]

1 hour ago, MysteryGuest said:

I still don't know how the return of John is going to be handled, but if both Sam and Dean get something out of it, then I guess I'm good with it.  I don't think either one of them wants John to come back so they can tell him off.  I just don't expect that to happen, and I personally don't think it needs to.  If John had been an alcoholic, or just an abusive asshole of a father, that would be one thing, but John was as much a victim of circumstances as Sam and Dean were. 

And I personally hate how they've tried to pin this all on Mary now.  Yes, it was her deal that set them on their path, but when watching her make that deal, I never once felt angry with her for her decision.  I think most of us would have made the same choice, under those circumstances.  The only one to blame for all of this is Yellow Eyes, IMO.  

I think it's pretty much a given that they're not going for humor for their 300th episode.  It sounds like it's going to be a sob fest.  I just hope they do a good job.

I am not bothered by the deal. What annoys me the most about what they have done with Mary was she knew what was out there yet she did absolutely nothing to protect her family. She was apparently willing to go hunting and leave her one year old son at home unprotected with her husband without bothering to tell him what she was doing. Compare that to dean when he was living with Lisa and the precautions he took.