S02.E09: Yet Do I Marvel

[PrincessPurrsALot]

TBD

[Neurochick]

Zika?  Don't you have to go somewhere to contract that disease?

Why do producers assume that all light skinned black people have one white parent?  Ignorant.

[Dee]

Beautifully rendered yet terribly written episode.

[mrsbagnet]

Dear Robert, Do not give a woman a gift in a small box unless it's the Real Thing, and it's expected. I think dude got his feelings hurt a little because Nova was looking at that box like it was going to bite her.

Edited October 4, 2017 by mrsbagnet

[Keepitmoving]

Quote

Why do producers assume that all light skinned black people have one white parent?  Ignorant.

Well in this case, there is NO way I'm buying that AD is that ignorant, not AD who is behind this operation. This is just part of the story that Charlie's mother is white. I put trust in that talent of AD that in this case, she had to be white for whatever story she intends to tell. At least they got Sharon Lawrence, who I like, so I'm here for it. Her mother's aura definitely explains why Charlie is wound so tight and why Micah knows she's wound so tight so he didn't want to share the awful truth with her. Good job in terms of Davis co-parenting and schooling Micah. But Charlie did prepare viewers for her mother's personality when she was going to the therapy sessions earlier in the season, so I'm not surprised.What I was surprised about is that her mother was married to Earnest, yeah, Charlie referred to him as her ex-husband. Look writers, AD, please lay out what went down exactly, because I'm not clear on it. So was he ever married to RA and Nova's mother?  I know they have his last name, but he didn't have to be married to their mother for them both to agree that the children would take his last name. So basically, Nova and RA were born out of wedlock not Charlie, is that it? I need more specifics here. 

Also, I think Charlie's mother is related to those Landrys. 

What the hell is up with Darla's and her parents? I get that she may have been disowned when she went down the wrong path, but her reaction to Vi mentioning them, seems like there is more to it, like there is something deeper she's hiding. I mean what would be strange to Vi and Co. if Darla told them that her parents disowned her?  I mean Vi and the family cut her off too during that time, so why would she clam up like that would something so strange and shameful to share with them? I'm intrigued by this story.

Nova, Nova, Nova, you deserve happiness, I hope you find it. You're still pushing away, and by that I mean, not acknowledging that what'shisname is more than just "a stop by on his run" to you when RA and Blue stopped by. Well looks like Calvin is back from those previews.

I love this show, it's an excellent show, haven't been disappointed in general, at least not yet. 

Edited October 4, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Dee]

It's ironic that Charley has been working so hard to change her perfectionist control freak manner yet she's only ended up replicating the cycle with Micah.

[Keepitmoving]

31 minutes ago, Dee said:

It's ironic that Charley has been working so hard to change her perfectionist control freak manner yet she's only ended up replicating the cycle with Micah.

But that's what happens. It's like when some people say they won't parent like their parents did, but then they do because it's what they know. That's why therapy can be helpful, because even when the habit is bad for you, people still lean into that behavior and actually seek it out in their mates because it's familiar even if it's bad.

Speaking of Charlie and her mother, I loved their conversation about Charlie's two worlds and her Caucasian mother doing the best she could to make sure she was armed for those worlds. It was a good scene. 

Oh and I forgot about Aunt Vi and Hollywood, I do love that Hollywood is showing that he is in tune, or trying to be with his lady love. He knows something is off and sometimes things like this go over these men's heads. They just don't pay attention to details, it's not in their makeup to do so, that's why they're always the last to know. But he's paying attention, good for him.

Edited October 4, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Mozelle]

On 10/3/2017 at 10:21 PM, Neurochick said:

Zika?  Don't you have to go somewhere to contract that disease?

Why do producers assume that all light skinned black people have one white parent?  Ignorant.

I don't think that's the case here. Ava DuVernay, a light-skinned Black woman with two Black parents, wouldn't assume that all light-skinned Black people have one White parent. One of the show's casting directors is also a Black woman who has cast two of Ava's smaller films as well as Love & Basketball, Akeelah and the Bee, and a few Spike Lee movies. I think for whatever purposes of the story in Queen Sugar, Charley's mom is White intentionally and not out of some ignorance of how Black people come in different shades. 

Re: Zika, I remember reading maybe a year and a half ago how cases had popped up in Florida and around the Gulf region, such as Louisiana and Texas. 

Edited October 5, 2017 by Mozelle

[tennisgurl]

Oh Nova. She just tries so hard, but her attempts at helping can backfire so easily. I totally respect her trying to raise awareness, but she had to know if she started writing about a possible illness, people will start running around like chickens with their heads cut off. I hope she finds some real happiness soon. 

Ralph Angel was alright this week, but I keep waiting for his asshole tendencies to pop up again. As happy as I am for Blue, I just cant get behind this wedding to Darla, I just dont see it ending well. Also, sounds like there is something going on with Darla's parents, beyond being estranged due to her drug use. She seemed like she could hardly even stand to say their names, or acknowledge she has parents. 

It was nice meeting Charlies mom, and I like her so far. She has clearly been controlling and put a lot of pressure on Charlie, but she has done what she thought was right when it comes to raising Charlie, especially as a biracial woman, even if she isn't a great parent. 

[Dee]

Ralph Angel is trash.

[colorbars]

I was surprised Charley's mother was white, because I just assumed she was light skinned, but I do actually remember wondering about it back in the first few episodes of the show. I don't remember what it was specifically that made me wonder back then, but after discussing it with a friend, we both just thought she was light skinned, since I don't think the actress is biracial?

But either way, I'm sure it was a deliberate choice, because I trust this show not to just make an assumption like that. That conversation between them at the end, with Charley opening up about how she felt both in the south and back home, was a glimpse of that. I don't know if they'll expand on that more going forward, but I think it can make for some good scenes. Like they said there, there are certain things her mother just cannot understand, and maybe, if she's sticking around, it might come into play if they pursue something with Micah and the cop.

That being said, I was most surprised by the reveal that her mother and Ernest were married. I definitely had the impression that she was an affair he had at some point.

[mrsbagnet]

That marriage explains so much about Nova: the strained relationship with her dad, her feelings of rejection, her refusal to commit in a relationship. I can see why the changed will stung her so much.

[Keepitmoving]

57 minutes ago, mrsbagnet said:

That marriage explains so much about Nova: the strained relationship with her dad, her feelings of rejection, her refusal to commit in a relationship. I can see why the changed will stung her so much.

Yeah and the series of nameless white men of one night stands, except for Calvin. But again, he's married with kids. But I totally get the psychology of it all when it comes to Nova.

Poor Darla, shit, if she wants another chance at a good life, she might have to move out of that area, poor thing. Everyone has to face consequences for their poor choices, but the girl didn't kill, murder, nor steal from anyone (here's looking at your RA for that crime,) she deserves to eventually stop having to look in the rare view mirror of her life. 

Bye Ralph Angel. He has every right to feel some type a way about running into men that "Star" slept with for money. But his approach of scorning her, and making her feel dirty, yeah he was the turn off for me. And he still doesn't get that while she may have been selfish, she was also very sick, addiction is an illness. It doesn't absolve anyone of the choices they made to hurt others while struggling through said addiction, but it is an illness and more than just oh she was selfish.

This show is so darn good. 

Edited October 5, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Mozelle]

7 hours ago, colorbars said:

I was surprised Charley's mother was white, because I just assumed she was light skinned, but I do actually remember wondering about it back in the first few episodes of the show. I don't remember what it was specifically that made me wonder back then, but after discussing it with a friend, we both just thought she was light skinned, since I don't think the actress is biracial?

But either way, I'm sure it was a deliberate choice, because I trust this show not to just make an assumption like that. That conversation between them at the end, with Charley opening up about how she felt both in the south and back home, was a glimpse of that. I don't know if they'll expand on that more going forward, but I think it can make for some good scenes. Like they said there, there are certain things her mother just cannot understand, and maybe, if she's sticking around, it might come into play if they pursue something with Micah and the cop.

That being said, I was most surprised by the reveal that her mother and Ernest were married. I definitely had the impression that she was an affair he had at some point.

I was always of this thought as well, especially with the whole "Charley only spent summers with Ernest" part of the story. Nova and RA have the same mother, so with this revelation that Ernest married Lorna, am I to assume that after they divorced he went back to Nova's mom and (a) either re-married her or (b) had Ralph Angel with her, without getting married to her again?

[Clanstarling]

7 hours ago, colorbars said:

I was surprised Charley's mother was white, because I just assumed she was light skinned, but I do actually remember wondering about it back in the first few episodes of the show. I don't remember what it was specifically that made me wonder back then, but after discussing it with a friend, we both just thought she was light skinned, since I don't think the actress is biracial?

But either way, I'm sure it was a deliberate choice, because I trust this show not to just make an assumption like that. That conversation between them at the end, with Charley opening up about how she felt both in the south and back home, was a glimpse of that. I don't know if they'll expand on that more going forward, but I think it can make for some good scenes. Like they said there, there are certain things her mother just cannot understand, and maybe, if she's sticking around, it might come into play if they pursue something with Micah and the cop.

That being said, I was most surprised by the reveal that her mother and Ernest were married. I definitely had the impression that she was an affair he had at some point.

I could swear Charley's mother was referred to as white early in the series. So I wasn't surprised. On the other hand, if they haven't stated it before, it makes the tease of the camera focusing on the woman at a different table and then pulling back to Sharon Lawrence make more sense. I agree the marriage was the truly surprising part. 

2 hours ago, mrsbagnet said:

That marriage explains so much about Nova: the strained relationship with her dad, her feelings of rejection, her refusal to commit in a relationship. I can see why the changed will stung her so much.

And RA as well. It also explains the prickly relationships with Charley. 

[candall]

22 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

But that's what happens. It's like when some people say they won't parent like their parents did, but then they do because it's what they know. That's why therapy can be helpful, because even when the habit is bad for you, people still lean into that behavior and actually seek it out in their mates because it's familiar even if it's bad.

Years--decades--ago, I heard someone lecturing about unhealthy patterns that tragically tend to repeat in the next generation.  (I think the topic may have been child abuse, but I'm not sure.)  The phrase ". . . because that's what love feels like" thumped me right on the forehead and I never forgot it.  It's helped me understand behavior so many times.

 

Also, I like your observations about Charley and her mother.  I've never been the biggest fan of Sharon Lawrence--her characters are always so "arch"--but she was well-cast for Charley's mother.

 

I was really hoping there wouldn't be any vow made to Blue that Mommy and Daddy would be together forever.   Vi knows she'll most likely be able to measure that marriage in calendar pages.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Physically I'd say it was good casting but I still have a hard time seeing Sharon Lawrence as old enough to be Charley's mother. She's taken good care of herself.

I don't know about RA and Darla getting married. On the surface it seems like the right thing to do but neither of them seems sufficiently stable to me, especially RA.

Of course Hollywood needs a job but isn't working for the competition kind of a slap in the face to the Bordelons?

Quote

Also, I think Charlie's mother is related to those Landrys.  

Yep, I've been suspecting that for a while but I'm hoping the show doesn't go there. They've pretty much stayed away from the usual opera tropes. Plus, if Charley is part Landry wouldn't they all know it unless her mother's true lineage has been covered up in some way?

[Keepitmoving]

Quote

I don't know about RA and Darla getting married. On the surface it seems like the right thing to do but neither of them seems sufficiently stable to me, especially RA.

I don't think they will get married. The focused, delayed camera shot of the kitchen door swinging with that pretty bridal paper with their names on it said it all for me. I caught that lingering shot of their names on that door after she called her parents, was not a good sign. Good lord, all I want is for Darla not to fall off the horse again because of all this, this is too much stress, too much rejection and scorn. No good for her continued recovery. I'm going too be mad if she hits the streets again all strung out, too mad.

[colorbars]

3 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Yep, I've been suspecting that for a while but I'm hoping the show doesn't go there. They've pretty much stayed away from the usual opera tropes. Plus, if Charley is part Landry wouldn't they all know it unless her mother's true lineage has been covered up in some way?

I would think Vi would know, but I could see the others not. They didn't seem to know the full history of their family and the Landry's, so I could see them not knowing of that connection.

I hope they don't go there, though. I think there's more than enough material to explore with Charley's mother without resorting to that kind of soapy twist.

[mrsbagnet]

6 hours ago, Mozelle said:

Nova and RA have the same mother, so with this revelation that Ernest married Lorna, am I to assume that after they divorced he went back to Nova's mom and (a) either re-married her or (b) had Ralph Angel with her, without getting married to her again?

During the Big Fight over the will, Nova told Ralph Angel, "Daddy didn't commit to Mama until she was pregnant with you." So I think Ernest and Tru were dating and had Nova, he left them for Lorna, then divorced her, and came back to Tru. Once Tru was pregant with RA, then he married her.

[Dee]

Ernest is looking less and less appealing in death.

[Mozelle]

2 hours ago, Dee said:

Ernest is looking less and less appealing in death.

Lol. Most people do. I think we have a tendency to sanctify the dead rather than come to terms with the fact that when they were alive, they were massively flawed human beings who often acted selfishly.

[Arcadiasw]

11 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

I could swear Charley's mother was referred to as white early in the series. So I wasn't surprised. On the other hand, if they haven't stated it before, it makes the tease of the camera focusing on the woman at a different table and then pulling back to Sharon Lawrence make more sense. I agree the marriage was the truly surprising part. 

And RA as well. It also explains the prickly relationships with Charley. 

Nova being prickly to Charley would've been more understandable since she witnessed her mother's pain and probably heard more from Vi cursing Lorna more than Ernest. RA behavior feels more like jealously. 

[Keepitmoving]

I think Nova showed her anger toward Earnest when she left home and rarely visited. She may not roll her eyes at the mention of his name like she dies Lorna's but her actions tell me all I need to know about how she feels for him. She adored him and as far as she's concerned he rejected her in the worse way. Her anger has been directed at him via her choice of mates, basically staying clear of long term healthy relationships particularly with black men. Because the first black man she loved left her as a little girl to go be with his other little girl and her mother. Then had the nerve to commit only when his "golden son" was born.

Edited October 6, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Dee]

1 hour ago, Keepitmoving said:

basically staying clear of long term healthy relationships particularly with black men.

Nova hasn't seemed to have had long term healthy relationships with anyone.

[Drumpf1737]

On 10/5/2017 at 5:56 AM, Keepitmoving said:

Yeah and the series of nameless white men of one night stands

When did this happen? I saw one married white man that seemed to adore her and a black woman.

I feel like we, the audience, were told that Charley's mom was white. Or maybe my telegraph antenna is finely tuned but I always thought that was the basis for Nova's resentment of Charley.

[Keepitmoving]

There were about two to three white men who were not Calvin, who rolled in and out of her bed during the season premiere. They just showed them waking up in the morning then leaving with no conversation. The last one who left tried to talk to her while she was working in her garden,  he wanted to hook up again,but she wasn't having it.

And this was of course right off the season one finale where she and Calvin decided to go public with their relationship and she got assaulted by his fellow cop when he spit in her face.

Edited October 6, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Dee]

During Nova's post-Calvin/pre-Robert period she slept with (at least) three separate guys. Two white and one Black.

Edited October 6, 2017 by Dee

[Empress1]

I love Dawn-Lyen Gardner's natural hair. When she was walking with Remy in the rain and it was up in the slightly messy bun (a style I favor), I thought she looked so beautiful.

I was spoiled on Charley's mother, but I was surprised that Ernest and Lorna were actually married.

Blue remains one of the cutest children on television (all the child actors on This Is Us are also adorable). "Oh. AND, Auntie Nova! Mama and Pop are getting. Married!"

Vi looked gorgeous in that yellow dress with the angled bob wig. I'm very nervous about her health though.

[jhlipton]

On 10/4/2017 at 8:49 AM, Keepitmoving said:

Speaking of Charlie and her mother, I loved their conversation about Charlie's two worlds and her Caucasian mother doing the best she could to make sure she was armed for those worlds. It was a good scene.

I think this, as well as Lorna knowing she can't know what it's like to be black, is why she "had" to be white.  A biracial woman saying those things wouldn't have been as powerful (to me, anyway).

Edited October 11, 2017 by jhlipton