S12.E18: The Memory Remains

[MysteryGuest]

I don't know, I personally don't think any comparison to Mary was intentional.  Dean hooks up with waitresses all the time.  This woman doesn't look like Mary, IMO, she's just a blond.  That one scene with the same color coat I would say is merely coincidental.  I'm sticking with that theory because anything else is just too icky to think about.

Edited April 16, 2017 by MysteryGuest

[catrox14]

5 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I don't know, I personally don't think any comparison to Mary was intentional.  Dean hooks up with waitresses all the time.  This woman doesn't look like Mary, IMO, she's just a blond.  That one scene with the same color coat I would say is merely coincidental.  I'm sticking with that theory because anything else is just to icky to think about.

The waitress doesn't exactly LOOK like Mary but this is a resemblance. And the dress the waitress wears the next day is a total throwback 70's wraparound.

IMO, there are no coincidences with the wardrobe choices, set decoration, color choices etc, it's all done with a purpose. Jensen and another director both said that every single thing that goes on screen is chosen for a reason.

I don't think Dean wants to screw his mother, but IMO this was 100% intentional, but the question is why.

Edited April 16, 2017 by catrox14

[Diane]

8 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I don't know, I personally don't think any comparison to Mary was intentional.  Dean hooks up with waitresses all the time.  This woman doesn't look like Mary, IMO, she's just a blond.  That one scene with the same color coat I would say is merely coincidental.  I'm sticking with that theory because anything else is just too icky to think about.

I agree I don't think she looks like Mary and the coat is just the same color, very common brown. 

[MysteryGuest]

These writers can't get basic canon right, I can't see them remembering a coat that Mary wore in one scene from literally years ago.  I just don't see any reason at all for them to even hint at any such thing.  

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, Katy M said:

Did we ever actually see the whole of the monster, the actual monster, not Pete, or did we just see glimpses and flashes of his claws and whatnot?  If so, they did what I wish they would have done with the stinking dragons in Like a Virgin instead of turning them into people.  If people were trying to kill you and you could turn into a flying fire breathing animal, why would you assume your human form and fight fair?  Especially the second dragon that arrived on the scene.  OK, major tangent.

I agree, less is more with these things. I meant the God was pretty unimpressive in his actions and such, though. The way they shot the guy was actually very effectively creepy, IMO.

[tessathereaper]

On 4/14/2017 at 9:33 AM, Katy M said:

Then, on the other hand, those are supposed to be fictional books.  So, in a sense, nobody would be remembering them, because they wouldn't think they were real. 

Other people's religious books are fictional to people who don't believe in the religion.  We think of Greek myths as fictional but they were someone's religion.  We still know who Zeus is though.  Plenty of atheists thing of the Bible as fiction and so did plenty of pagans at the time it was all supposedly happening.  They'd have looked at the scrolls the early Christians were passing around as storybooks.  

And in fact the boys deal with that in their work.  They work in stories that most people think are just stories but they know are real.  They will be legends and people who need to know who they are, will know they were real and there will be other people who think they are just fictional characters.  

[catrox14]

9 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

These writers can't get basic canon right, I can't see them remembering a coat that Mary wore in one scene from literally years ago.  I just don't see any reason at all for them to even hint at any such thing.  

That wouldn't be entirely up to the writers. There are the wardrobe designers who are given instructions on how the cast is to be dressed.

It's fine if you don't think it's intentional. I think it is.

Edited April 16, 2017 by catrox14

[MysteryGuest]

2 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

That wouldn't be entirely up to the writers. There are the wardrobe designers who are given instructions on how the cast is to be dressed.

I suppose, but I just don't see why they would bother.  I don't think there was anything out of the ordinary about Dean's hookup.  He's left Sam to do the research many times while he's taken off with some woman.  He doesn't seem to be terribly discriminating in his choice of brunettes, blondes or redheads...he just likes women.  There's never been even a hint that Dean has some sort of Oedipus Complex, so it would be really farfetched, and gross for them to go there now.  Like I said, I'll stick with coincidence until they prove me wrong, and I sincerely hope they don't go there.

[tessathereaper]

29 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

The waitress doesn't exactly LOOK like Mary but this is a resemblance. And the dress the waitress wears the next day is a total throwback 70's wraparound.

IMO, there are no coincidences with the wardrobe choices, set decoration, color choices etc, it's all done with a purpose. Jensen and another director both said that every single thing that goes on screen is chosen for a reason.

I don't think Dean wants to screw his mother, but IMO this was 100% intentional, but the question is why.

Except she wasn't wearing any of that when Dean first saw her so that isn't why he was interested in her, so I don't think it was intentional.  

[MysteryGuest]

22 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

It's fine if you don't think it's intentional. I think it is.

I agree that there have seemingly been some weird "mother" themes this season, but I guess I'm just choosing to remain in denial that the show would go there with Dean and Mary.  There's no precedent for it, and it doesn't seem like a topic they would take on with one of their leads.  We can absolutely agree to disagree, though.

[catrox14]

8 minutes ago, tessathereaper said:

Except she wasn't wearing any of that when Dean first saw her so that isn't why he was interested in her, so I don't think it was intentional.

I didn't say he was sexually attracted to her because she was dressed like Mary.

I'm saying that IMO it is not a coincidence that the waitress was dressed similarly to Mary, with a similar hairstyle. NO I don't think it's because the show is saying Dean wants to fuck Mary, now nor in the past. If I thought the show was doing that I would say it. But I don't think that is the case.  It's just an interesting observation i.. you know, ...in an observationally interesting way. :) . 

[Diane]

2 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I didn't say he was sexually attracted to her because she was dressed like Mary.

I'm saying that IMO it is not a coincidence that the waitress was dressed similarly to Mary, with a similar hairstyle. NO I don't think it's because the show is saying Dean wants to fuck Mary, now nor in the past. If I thought the show was doing that I would say it. But I don't think that is the case.  It's just an interesting observation i.. you know, ...in an observationally interesting way. :) . 

Not the same hairstyle though Mary's was more of a feathered hairstyle of the times and the waitress was more updated. Obviously ymmv.

[catrox14]

Just now, Diane said:

Not the same hairstyle though Mary's was more of a feathered hairstyle of the times and the waitress was more updated. Obviously ymmv.

I said she had a similar hairstyle. I didn't say it was the same.

There have been similarities to Mary in many of the women Dean has been with. 

I think my initial shock was holy crap. I've thought more about it, and I think it's not a sexual thing but more of a comfort thing possibly.

[SueB]

While watching the 'Shaving People, Punting Things' video, I was struck by how red the side of Dean's face was.  I think he took a 'worse-than-usual' blow to the head when the guy hit him with the hammer.  

[Myrelle]

On ‎4‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 11:28 PM, catrox14 said:

Because I think the dude has a screw loose.  I think he can be cold and calculating when following orders or stalking someone to kill them. Essentially, I think he lacks impulse control about certain things.

Ketch was again intriguing to me. He's definitely got a screw loose IMO, too. He's got it bad for Mary, but Mary's not interested in him in the same way that she was interested in John; or with her progeny with John either, for that matter.

His face when he heard Dean diss him on the bug in the bunker said it all, and I have little doubt that Dean will be the first hunter that he'll be looking to "eliminate" because of Dean refusing to "assimilate" to the Brits' way.

Edited April 16, 2017 by Myrelle

[rue721]

I'm rewatching this right now, because the first time through, I was completely distracted by pretty much everything in the living room aside from the TV. Dinner, guitar, phone, etc etc etc.

Anyway, this is a pretty fun episode! I am developing a soft spot for Ketch despite myself. He is such a bizarre person. Cannot believe he casually brought up Sam's luxuriant mane -- hilarious. I didn't mind the jazzy 60's music in the BMOL scenes, I thought it was funny. Reminded me kind of Get Smart or something. The way that he looked at the photograph of Mary was also very intriguing. I did get a weird vibe from it, like he was really touched to see her in a picture with her little son. I can't tell what's up, though -- if he's got some weird thing for blond moms who "report" to him, or if he's got some Oedipal thing going on, or if he's just falling for Mary and that this was a picture of her with her (little) kid was just inconsequential, or what.

Loved Dean in this one. "Always the rich ones. What, are they like, 'croquet's alright, but you know what would be great? Murder.'"

I do think there was some setup for Dean being overconfident, though. He said they didn't need a plan because the Colt can blast anything, and then when Sam didn't want him to go into the house alone in case there was a god in there, he was just like, "I'm cool." He's probably going to shoot something with the Colt and it's not going to kill it or he's going to kill the wrong thing with it. God forbid he tries to shoot something or someone that Cas is trying to protect, could the bullet kill an angel?

IMO it is weird that Dean was practically salivating over that waitress and that the show took so much time over that hookup -- without ever actually introducing the waitress as a character with dialogue or anything. I mean usually the show doesn't JUST present these hookups as eye candy, the girl gets a funny line or gives some exposition or something. I wonder why the show wanted to highlight Dean being SO attracted to her (on essentially looks alone)? Maybe just to show that Dean is in a good mood, I dunno. In any case, I liked it, the hookup was a lighthearted little thing to add to the episode.

Anyway, I actually liked the MotW, didn't find it that lame. The visuals were creepy as hell, at least! And I liked the story of this family keeping a starving, bound god in its basement in order to become rich and powerful -- especially since their version of "rich and powerful" was so limited.

The whole episode LOOKED great IMO, which I love. I loved how dark and rich everything looked.

Speaking of the episode more holistically, how awesome was it how the bad guy KEPT saying stuff that hit a little too close to home with the Winchesters? Talking about how he's the hero, he always gets the crap, he's just "hunting people, killing them, the family business." (hahahahaha). I really enjoyed this episode's sense of humor.

Oh and also -- I found Sam's half-eaten omelette distractingly weird. Why were the remains of the omelette in pieces?! Was he just hacking at it wildly while he was trying to eat it? And that gigantic dude couldn't finish an egg-white omelette? How did he grow so tall eating so poorly? And then he's on Dean's case later for eating lunch at the lunchcounter! Is Sam not eating? Reminds me -- when my coworker and I were going out for lunch on Friday, we asked our boss if she wanted us to get her anything. We were like, "would you like a salad, soup, something more substantial, like a sandwich?" Our boss goes, "oh, no, something light! I had a sandwich yesterday!" LOL Ok then. Anyway, I'm just being goofy. Although I WAS actually distracted by that omelette. ;)

[rue721]

I hope that it becomes a running joke on the show for a little while that carving their initials into the top of the library table was a really impractical idea. That place is supposedly for research, but imagine trying to write on the table now. Your pen would constantly slide right into one of the carved letters and jab right through your paper. And god forbid you ever use a pencil, either, because eraser shavings would be drawn into those carvings like months to a flame, and good luck ever getting them out again! ;)

Very sweet scene, though. I don't mind ending on a little schlock when the episode has otherwise earned it by being a little arch and clever (and dark) all throughout the rest of the episode. And how sweet the Winchesters were at the end also highlighted how extremely chilling and strange Ketch's last scene was.

I really didn't think I would ever become intrigued by Ketch, but this fixation he has on the Winchesters, especially/including Mary, is beginning to intrigue me anyway. Plus, I think the actor is doing wonderfully. He always brings it with the face acting, and he's always bringing a little something extra to all his scenes and to the character in general IMO.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

Thinking about this episode more today: I wonder what the criteria is on this show for being considered a 'god'?  Just being immortal?  Is that all Moloch had?  I guess he (it?) was able to 'grant' wealth or good fortune in some way - it was next expounded upon how - but the literal blood sacrifice was gross, so I wonder about the 'god' status.  And yes, I know there are/were plenty of ancient 'gods' for whom blood sacrifices were regularly made.  Maybe it's just me, but it's just strange to think about in this day and age.  Times have changed!

Also, it was really cool to see Sam shoot #TheRealGoatDude.  I'm so happy he got to do that.  Really, really, really, really, really, really, really happy.  :)  

Did I mention how happy I was that Sam wasn't hit on the head and tied up this episode?  :D

[SueB]

I thought Moloch fit 'Pagan god' status.  He gave prosperity in return for an annual blood sacrifice (akin to Scarecrow).  Then apparently he does die from hunger but the Colt got him.  I liked that the faux Bill was made somewhat in the likeness of Moloch (who clearly had horns).  

1 hour ago, rue721 said:

I'm rewatching this right now, because the first time through, I was completely distracted by pretty much everything in the living room aside from the TV. Dinner, guitar, phone, etc etc etc.

Anyway, this is a pretty fun episode! I am developing a soft spot for Ketch despite myself. He is such a bizarre person. Cannot believe he casually brought up Sam's luxuriant mane -- hilarious. I didn't mind the jazzy 60's music in the BMOL scenes, I thought it was funny. Reminded me kind of Get Smart or something. The way that he looked at the photograph of Mary was also very intriguing. I did get a weird vibe from it, like he was really touched to see her in a picture with her little son. I can't tell what's up, though -- if he's got some weird thing for blond moms who "report" to him, or if he's got some Oedipal thing going on, or if he's just falling for Mary and that this was a picture of her with her (little) kid was just inconsequential, or what.

Loved Dean in this one. "Always the rich ones. What, are they like, 'croquet's alright, but you know what would be great? Murder.'"

I do think there was some setup for Dean being overconfident, though. He said they didn't need a plan because the Colt can blast anything, and then when Sam didn't want him to go into the house alone in case there was a god in there, he was just like, "I'm cool." He's probably going to shoot something with the Colt and it's not going to kill it or he's going to kill the wrong thing with it. God forbid he tries to shoot something or someone that Cas is trying to protect, could the bullet kill an angel?

IMO it is weird that Dean was practically salivating over that waitress and that the show took so much time over that hookup -- without ever actually introducing the waitress as a character with dialogue or anything. I mean usually the show doesn't JUST present these hookups as eye candy, the girl gets a funny line or gives some exposition or something. I wonder why the show wanted to highlight Dean being SO attracted to her (on essentially looks alone)? Maybe just to show that Dean is in a good mood, I dunno. In any case, I liked it, the hookup was a lighthearted little thing to add to the episode.

Anyway, I actually liked the MotW, didn't find it that lame. The visuals were creepy as hell, at least! And I liked the story of this family keeping a starving, bound god in its basement in order to become rich and powerful -- especially since their version of "rich and powerful" was so limited.

The whole episode LOOKED great IMO, which I love. I loved how dark and rich everything looked.

Speaking of the episode more holistically, how awesome was it how the bad guy KEPT saying stuff that hit a little too close to home with the Winchesters? Talking about how he's the hero, he always gets the crap, he's just "hunting people, killing them, the family business." (hahahahaha). I really enjoyed this episode's sense of humor.

Oh and also -- I found Sam's half-eaten omelette distractingly weird. Why were the remains of the omelette in pieces?! Was he just hacking at it wildly while he was trying to eat it? And that gigantic dude couldn't finish an egg-white omelette? How did he grow so tall eating so poorly? And then he's on Dean's case later for eating lunch at the lunchcounter! Is Sam not eating? Reminds me -- when my coworker and I were going out for lunch on Friday, we asked our boss if she wanted us to get her anything. We were like, "would you like a salad, soup, something more substantial, like a sandwich?" Our boss goes, "oh, no, something light! I had a sandwich yesterday!" LOL Ok then. Anyway, I'm just being goofy. Although I WAS actually distracted by that omelette. ;)

I mentioned earlier that the waitress is likely the Dean equivalent of 'comfort food'. He's not happy about Mary, doesn't like the BMoL douchebags, Cas is MIA... he needs a distraction...oh look.. comely blonde who's giving him the eye... just what the doctor ordered.. And in the blink of an eye he's telling Sammy to not wait up.  I took the cheesy pickup line to be essentially saying that if she's interested, Dean doesn't have to work too hard to get a 'date'. 

Edited April 16, 2017 by SueB

[Aeryn13]

Quote

I do think there was some setup for Dean being overconfident, though. 

I didn`t understand that at all. They had the Colt previously and he wasn`t like that. And he certainly can`t be proud of his non-existant hunting skills lately so why would he feel even confident?    

Really don`t understand why Dean would be supposedly in a good mood right now. They apparently don`t talk to Mary at all anymore, other than maybe work-related stuff, he references "reporting" to the BMOL like they are now obedient little dogs and he can`t do the work he normally takes pride in. I think normal Dean would be in a funk. That he currently isn`t is more the valium!version IMO. 

Quote

Did I mention how happy I was that Sam wasn't hit on the head and tied up this episode?  :D

He hasn`t been tied up and knocked out in ages. That`s how he got to make 4 major kills in the last 7 episodes.  

[ILoveReading]

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

Really don`t understand why Dean would be supposedly in a good mood right now. They apparently don`t talk to Mary at all anymore, other than maybe work-related stuff, he references "reporting" to the BMOL like they are now obedient little dogs and he can`t do the work he normally takes pride in. I think normal Dean would be in a funk. That he currently isn`t is more the valium!version IMO. 

I'm just going to head canon he wasn't engaged in the hunt because he doesn't want to be working for the Brits.  But he can't walk away because he wouldn't leave Sam out there alone.  (Although Dean who seems to have lost all this skills.   He's more of a hindrance than a help these day).

Dean doesn't seem particular happy go lucky, or unburdened.  He seems very much like some just going through the motions.  ValiumDean is a good description.  As I said I don't know if its Dean whose disengaged or Jensen.

[MysteryGuest]

I'm sure Dean's not thrilled working for the BMOL, but it's a hunt, so he's normally onboard for that.  I'm not sure over-confident is the right word, but he did seem especially pleased about having the Colt back. When they had it before, it held a completely different meaning.  They had limited bullets, and the sole objective was to use it to take out Lucifer.  Now they know more about it, they can make their own bullets, and it pretty much works on anything they might come up against in these run of the mill hunts.  I don't think it's out of character for Dean to be a bit cocky.

As for the kills and who gets knocked out and tied up, it's always going to be one or the other of Sam or Dean.  Their hunting proficiency fluctuates based on the plot.  It does seem like Sam's had a string of important kills in recent weeks, and I have no idea if that's deliberate and leading up to something, or if it's just Sam's turn.  I suppose the writers could literally have them take turns getting kills every other week, but then that would become obvious, too.  I think it's something that just ebbs and flows, and I have to believe that Dean will get his share of important kills, going forward.  He's not being written off the show, and I doubt that they're trying to insinuate that he's washed up as a hunter, so I'm not going to worry about it too much.  I'm much more concerned about the amount of time Sam and Dean are actually onscreen, which is why I enjoyed this episode so much.  It felt like we got a bit more than in some episodes this season.

[DittyDotDot]

8 hours ago, rue721 said:

I hope that it becomes a running joke on the show for a little while that carving their initials into the top of the library table was a really impractical idea. That place is supposedly for research, but imagine trying to write on the table now. Your pen would constantly slide right into one of the carved letters and jab right through your paper. And god forbid you ever use a pencil, either, because eraser shavings would be drawn into those carvings like months to a flame, and good luck ever getting them out again! ;)

I know, like I said, not the top of the table boys!!! I'd love it to become a runner, though. They haven't had a good runner in years, IMO.

8 hours ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

Thinking about this episode more today: I wonder what the criteria is on this show for being considered a 'god'?  Just being immortal?  Is that all Moloch had?  I guess he (it?) was able to 'grant' wealth or good fortune in some way - it was next expounded upon how - but the literal blood sacrifice was gross, so I wonder about the 'god' status.  And yes, I know there are/were plenty of ancient 'gods' for whom blood sacrifices were regularly made.  Maybe it's just me, but it's just strange to think about in this day and age.  Times have changed!

I think they're defined as gods by having followers who believe in them as a god and sacrifice to them, more than anything. Having powers and being immortal probably doesn't hurt either, but by that definition, Rowena would be a god, right? ;) 

7 hours ago, SueB said:

I mentioned earlier that the waitress is likely the Dean equivalent of 'comfort food'. He's not happy about Mary, doesn't like the BMoL douchebags, Cas is MIA... he needs a distraction...oh look.. comely blonde who's giving him the eye... just what the doctor ordered.. And in the blink of an eye he's telling Sammy to not wait up.  I took the cheesy pickup line to be essentially saying that if she's interested, Dean doesn't have to work too hard to get a 'date'. 

See, I think the waitress and the food is showing that Dean is happy right now and finding pleasure in the little things in life. Even though not everything is sunshine, overall, he has the things he's always wanted most: his mom is alive; Sam is good; he's hunting; and their biggest crisis right now isn't because they broke the world and now have the responsibility to pick up the pieces. There's nothing hanging over Dean's head right now and I think he's just taking advantage of the reprieve. Of course, nothing is ever that simple, but I think it's being purposely done to lull us--and Dean--into a false sense of security for when the big bomb drops at the end of the season.

Edited April 16, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[MysteryGuest]

I'm not sure if Dean is happy or not right now.  I just think this is pretty much their life.  There's always some on-going crisis...the Nephilim, Cas being MIA, but they also think they've gotten rid of Lucifer, so I'm sure they think they're a bit ahead of the game.  Obviously, the other shoe is going to drop soon, and that's all going to change.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

and I doubt that they're trying to insinuate that he's washed up as a hunter

I think that is just how it comes across as a by-product. I can`t say in seriousness that Dean was hunting in this episode. He has been in the business too long that I would buy that as an attempt at hunting from him. The hook-up with the weird scene earlier seemed to be the only interest he had. Maybe he has no interest in hunting right now as a BMOL dog?

Edited April 16, 2017 by Aeryn13

[rue721]

3 hours ago, DittyDotDot said:

Even though not everything is sunshine, overall, he has the things he's always wanted most: his mom is alive; Sam is good; he's hunting; and their biggest crisis right now isn't because they broke the world and now have the responsibility to pick up the pieces. There's nothing hanging over Dean's head right now and I think he's just taking advantage of the reprieve.

I think that's all true, and maybe Dean also likes just getting cases assigned to him and not having to constantly scout them out. Maybe he likes working within a bureaucracy (the BMOL). It takes some of the pressure off of him personally.

In retrospect IMO that actually seems pretty in-character, because he's always been good at fitting himself into a larger system, with lots of moving parts and higher ups to report to. That's what he was doing back in the day with stuff like Hollywood Babylon and he was even pretty happy in Zachariah's fake corporate world.

[catrox14]

3 hours ago, DittyDotDot said:

See, I think the waitress and the food is showing that Dean is happy right now and finding pleasure in the little things in life. Even though not everything is sunshine, overall, he has the things he's always wanted most: his mom is alive; Sam is good; he's hunting; and their biggest crisis right now isn't because they broke the world and now have the responsibility to pick up the pieces. There's nothing hanging over Dean's head right now and I think he's just taking advantage of the reprieve. Of course, nothing is ever that simple, but I think it's being purposely done to lull us--and Dean--into a false sense of security for when the big bomb drops at the end of the season

MO, Dean hooking up was a moment of respite from  the emotional wringer he's been going through for, well, 3 years non stop. I don't he is remotely happyIMO, Dean has been miserable since Marys resurrection and even before that. II mean, look at  what Deans been through since Purgatory :

• made a highly dubious decision to let an angel possess Sam to save Sams life and lying about it which fractured their relationship
• took on the Mark  because of his guilt for saving Sam by angel and Kevin's death.
• killed humans under the influence of the Mark
• was murdered  by Metatron and  turned into a demon by the Mark
• killed more humans as a demon (bad shitty deserved to be killed but humans nonetheless)
• the emotional fallout from Charlies murder and
• almost  killed Cas and Sam because of the  Mark even after being cured of being a demon
• still controlled by Amara even after the Mark was removed
• had to go back Hell to save Sam;
• almost killed by Lucifer wearing Cas' face
• Chuck attempting to invalidate Deans valid issues with his treatment of humanity and the Winchesters in general
• being unable to kill Amara;
• literally thisclose to being obliterated as a soul bomb to save the world
• Mary being resurrected but doesn't want to be within spitting distance of him;
• being thrown into a black site prison for 6 weeks which apparently was worse than Hell  which made him to decide to make a deal to die rather than survive  alone for however  long it took for Cas and Mary to find them.. 
• Learned Sam was lying to him for weeks after learning  Marys lying for months about working with the group that tortured Sam
• was more or less emotionally manipulated working for this group he loathes a
•  last phone  call with Cas, Dean pinged something was off with him and now Cas has been incommunicado for a long ass time. Dean  even resorted to checking police reports for arrests and /or deaths.

 

 

I thought there was a foreshadowing  comment by the Sheriff when he

Quote

Did you talk to his old man? Can't.

Not really.
Guy stroked out a couple years ago.
Breathes through a tube.
Guess who gets to take care of him? Can you imagine having to spoon-feed the guy that wailed on you for all those years? Everybody's got a breaking point.
If Jarrod did blow town, I wouldn't blame him.

 

I think this aligns with Dean taking care of his family in some way shape or form for his entire life. No I don't think Sam is the abusive stroke victim and no, I don't think Dean is going to kill his family but I think he  might opt out on the doing business  with the BMOL. and split with Sam and Mary and go his separate way.

I think it might also be foreshadowing Cas splitting from his family by going against them one final otime..

My biggest worry is this foreshadows Cas splitting from the Winchesters forever:( over whatever has kept him incommunicado for weeks.

Edited April 16, 2017 by catrox14

[Aeryn13]

Quote

In retrospect IMO that actually seems pretty in-character, because he's always been good at fitting himself into a larger system, with lots of moving parts and higher ups to report to. 

In this very episode he expressed his distaste with Ketch, the BMOL and having to "report" to Ketch. I admit the character is pretty pathetic right now but I don`t think just as pathetic as being a happy little BMOL drone.

[MysteryGuest]

I don't think Dean's happy at all to be working "for" the BMOL, especially now that he's supposed to be reporting to Ketch.  That was pretty evident on both his and Sam's faces.  I'm not thrilled with their seeming lack of suspicion where the BMOL are concerned, but I guess they see them as a bunch of obedient lap dogs, so maybe they're not surprised Mick would take off and not inform them.  

Obviously, for the purposes of this BMOL storyline, both Sam and Dean have been dumbed down a bit.  There have been plenty of less than subtle signs over the course of this season that these are some pretty bad people, but they've just not picked up on it.  Other than a general mistrust due to their introduction to them, I think they kind of take them at face value right now.  They bought that Lady Toni was a rogue agent, and through Mick they've now seen what their MO is.  But so far at least, they're not alarmed by it.  Under normal circumstances they would be, but since this is a big story arc, they can't afford to have them catch on too soon for the big ending.

It's no different than Crowley being an idiot and thinking he can control Lucifer again.  How many times does he have to be made a fool of before he will lock him back in the Cage for good?  Sam, Dean, Cas and Crowley are repeatedly shown as bumbling to allow the bad guys to get the upper hand and to move the plot along.  It's frustrating, but I don't see it changing.

[DittyDotDot]

40 minutes ago, rue721 said:

I think that's all true, and maybe Dean also likes just getting cases assigned to him and not having to constantly scout them out. Maybe he likes working within a bureaucracy (the BMOL). It takes some of the pressure off of him personally.

In retrospect IMO that actually seems pretty in-character, because he's always been good at fitting himself into a larger system, with lots of moving parts and higher ups to report to. That's what he was doing back in the day with stuff like Hollywood Babylon and he was even pretty happy in Zachariah's fake corporate world.

To be clear, I don't think Dean is happy working with the BMoL. Not at all. I just don't think it's weighing on him either. I think he sees them as small potatoes right now in comparison to the other things that are currently going right for him. Right now, things are quiet and no one he loves is having a crisis that he knows about, so he's kinda reveling in the weight being taken off his shoulders. Of course it won't last, but it's nice to see Dean have a little fun after so many seasons of him being weighed down for every little thing the universe has thrown at them.

Edited April 16, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[Aeryn13]

Quote

Sam, Dean, Cas and Crowley are repeatedly shown as bumbling to allow the bad guys to get the upper hand and to move the plot along.  It's frustrating, but I don't see it changing.

Thing is, at least Lucifer is shown to be somewhat smart and capable so while Crowley does look stupid, it isn`t as bad in comparism. Meanwhile the BMOL are themselves dumber than dirt. They are currently under orders to kill the brothers which they could have easily done in this very episode. They could have laid in wait and killed them after they returned from the hunt. They could kill them in their sleep. It is not necessary to bug someone`s house first to kill them.

And what, was Ketch surprised at the end that they think he is an asshole and don`t like the BMOL? Like, that was not obvious?

[rue721]

8 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I don't think Dean's happy at all to be working "for" the BMOL, especially now that he's supposed to be reporting to Ketch.  That was pretty evident on both his and Sam's faces.

They might think Ketch and the BMOL are creepy and all, but I do think they like having a lightened workload.

What with the Colt and the BMOL just assigning them cases, they're on Easy Street, relatively speaking. IMO Dean was pretty explicit about being appreciative/happy about that. No need to hunt down esoteric weapons or spells or scout out cases, etc. So he can take a time out for a lunch hour, a hookup, etc.

The main thing that I did find off-putting about Dean being so into the Colt is that if he's that happy to have it on hand, then it makes me wonder why he didn't either try to hunt down the Colt before or reverse engineer it. If Samuel Colt could come up with it before, then I always figured that Dean had a shot at creating his own Colt, I guess. Especially now that it turns out that Sam knows how to create magic bullets for it. (Obviously Dean's version would be "the Winchester" lol). But in general, I have a bee in my bonnet about wanting to see Dean create gadgets, because I think it's fun when they show him tinkering (with the car, or with whatever) and repurposing stuff. So YMMV.

[MysteryGuest]

3 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

Meanwhile the BMOL are themselves dumber than dirt. They are currently under orders to kill the brothers which they could have easily done in this very episode. They could have laid in wait and killed them after they returned from the hunt. They could kill them in their sleep. It is not necessary to bug someone`s house first to kill them.

Based on what Ketch said, they were trying to glean as much information from Sam and Dean as they could about other hunters, associates, etc.  Yes, they've been told to take down the Winchesters, but they've been told to basically take down all the American hunters, so they're just getting some intel first.  

6 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

Thing is, at least Lucifer is shown to be somewhat smart and capable

That's just it...the bad guys are always shown to be smarter and more capable, at least at first.  And to do that, our boys have to look less smart and less capable...sometimes ridiculously so.  

[catrox14]

2 hours ago, DittyDotDot said:

Yeah, I don't understand why they haven't tried to make a new Colt either. I mean, it seems they understand how it works, so... ?

I'd totally love Dean to start tinkering and making some weapons. It could add some much-needed levity to the show while also making the boys smart and competent. But, what do I know.

I don't even normally comment on these things because I think it all comes down to perception--and quite frankly, I don't care who gets the kills--but IMO, Dean was pretty damn badass in this episode in comparison to Sam. Sam got knocked out and got his ass saved by the sheriff while Dean went mano-a-mano with a god and mostly held his own in the fight. Sam may have pulled the trigger, but IMO it was pretty lame in comparison. But, hey, what do I know.

 

I went back to watch this scene a few times because I thought, I must have missed the mano-a-mano between Dean and Moloch and IMO there was no mano-a-mano.

The scene had a lot of back and forth cuts between Sam and the Sheriff v Pet and Dean vs Moloch but confrontations were happening simultaneously.

I'm gonna list Dean stuff first: 

Once Dean freed himself from the shrink wrap binding, he found a meat hook to use as a weapon.

Dean and Moloch skulked around the meat playing cat and mouse. Dean took 3 swings at nothing because Moloch was either evading Dean or Dean just took a chance at where he thought he was and missed.   Either way it was 3 swings at nothing. 

Dean took a 4th swing and got the meat hook stuck in a side of beef as Moloch was closing in on him.  Dean barely got the hook out of the meat and landed ONE blow into Moloch which did nothing but piss off Moloch who proceeded to slam Dean's  head into the wall which put Dean down for the count. He couldn't fight back if he wanted because he was too woozy. Moloch was stepping in to finish off Dean when Sam burst in and shot him with the Colt.

 

As that was happening, Sam and the sheriff were looking for Dean: 

Pete got the drop on Sam and hit Sam's hand with a hammer knocking his gun out of his hand.  I can't tell if Pete hit Sam in the head with the hammer or not because if he did that should have killed Sam or at least knocked him out cold or stunned him to the point that he should have been down for the count for at least 5 minutes.

Barring Sam having an invisible helmet that protected his head from an actual hammer blow, my theory is that maybe he was never hit in the head due to him turning his head to avoid getting hit directly by the hammer and Pete nailed him on his shoulder and the force plus Sam's evasion move threw Sam off balance which caused Sam to slam into the pallets.

Anyway, the sheriff tackled Pete as soon as he hit Sam. They had their chat about life and then Pete got the advantage on the sheriff. Pete stepped back and pulled the Colt from his pants and was going to shoot the Sheriff when Sam shoots him.

Sam picks up the Colt from Pete's hand, runs to the locker, shoots the lock off the freezer with his regular gun  and then shoots Moloch with the Colt.

Edited April 16, 2017 by catrox14

[ILoveReading]

7 hours ago, DittyDotDot said:

he has the things he's always wanted most:

I'm not really sure he doesn't have that, though.  Mary was his most cherished memory from his childhood.  So while he might have been thrilled to have her back its mostly been a negative experience for him.   He found out everything he believed was false and she wasn't the mom he thought she was and she also rejected him.  Given Dean's abandonment issues that probably had to hurt the most. 

This is probably just a production inconsistency, but I went back and checked the scene where Amara finds the photo.   She found it chest of what looked like important things, kind of like the one we saw Sam had during Into The Mystic.  It was in a frame.  When Ketch found it, it was just in a drawer with cough drops and other photos.   No frame. 

It also seems like Dean has stopped making an effort with Mary.  Sam asks him if he's heard from her lately, which also means she's not keeping in touch with them. 

As for Sam, in The Raid when Dean told him to pick a side, I believe what Dean was really saying was "pick my side" but Sam chose Britain.  Then lied to Dean for weeks about.  Dean's face at the end of ep 15 didn't really covey he was thrilled.  He probably knew he had to go along to keep the peace, because he knew Sam wouldn't listen to what he had to say.  Sam's enthusiasm for everything BMoL's in ep 16 probably just reinforced that thinking. 

As for the hunt, he really doesn't have that either.  I'm sure he doesn't mind being handed a case but right how he's the BMoL's lap dog along with Sam.  They aren't doing anything on their own anymore and their reporting in like good little soliders.  Other then John, Dean's always struck me as a leader, no a follower.  So I don't see him liking working for the Brits and being at their beck and call.

As for the hunts themselves he's become more of hindrance than an asset.  If he doesn't get lost on the way there, he's either dropping his weapon or getting beat up by monsters he should be able to take out easily.   It would be better for all at this point if he stayed home.

So, in theory Dean may seem to have it all, but he really seems to have nothing at this point. 

[MysteryGuest]

My guess is that Dean has very mixed feelings about Mary.  I'm sure he's very happy that she's alive, but disappointed and hurt by her seeming inability to connect with her sons.  I just have no idea what sort of relationship they have with her, if any.  She came clean about working with the BMOL, and they appeared to make peace with all of it, but I don't know if she ever spends any time with them.  She hunts with Ketch and Sam and Dean hunt by themselves.  That's weird to me.  You'd think that after getting them both onboard with her idea to work with the BMOL and rid the world of monsters, she'd be fine with working with her sons, but I guess not.

19 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

As for the hunt, he really doesn't have that either.  I'm sure he doesn't mind being handed a case but right how he's the BMoL's lap dog along with Sam.

I wouldn't call them lapdogs.  I think they still feel that they're using the intel the BMOL has to offer, and taking out monsters, but that they can end that relationship at any time.  I'm guessing that having to report to Ketch is going to get under their skin pretty quickly.

[DeeDee79]

I just watched today and I'm kinda lukewarm on the episode. I'm a Dean-girl but it didn't bother me that Sam got the kill. The monster wasn't on the level of most of the threats that they encounter on hunts and Dean didn't seemed to be dumbed down just taken off guard. I also enjoyed seeing him have a little fun when he left with the waitress but his obvious panting over her was a little over the top. They're both attractive guys and it's hard for me to believe that Dean would be so awestruck over a cute waitress returning his interest. I can't muster any interest over the Kelly/Hellspawn/Lucifer storyline and I was glad to get a break from it this week.  It's a shame that Crowley is a part of the Lucifer plot because I miss seeing him and Rowena popping up with the guys. In regards to creepy Ketch there had better be a scene with Dean immediately realizing that the picture of his mom is missing and the boys subsequently realizing someone has been in the bunker. I don't want the season to end like it began with the BMOL having the upper hand over them and I don't want to see them lose the bunker because I like them having a home base.

28 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I'm guessing that having to report to Ketch is going to get under their skin pretty quickly.

Especially since Mick was more personable and Ketch's relationship with their mother will surely be revealed sooner rather than later. I can't imagine that either of them will take it well.

[catrox14]

54 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

This is probably just a production inconsistency, but I went back and checked the scene where Amara finds the photo.   She found it chest of what looked like important things, kind of like the one we saw Sam had during Into The Mystic.  It was in a frame.  When Ketch found it, it was just in a drawer with cough drops and other photos.   No frame. 

I think Dean took Mary's picture out of the frame the night he got drunk and was sitting on the kitchen floor looking at his pictures. I think Dean put in the drawer on purpose because it no longer means what it did before.  That said, I still think he'd know immediately that someone was in his room if it went missing.

ETA: I think it was really weird that Dean and Sam didn't question why Ketch had Mick's phone. Like why wouldn't Mick have taken it with him when he left town?

[catrox14]

36 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I wouldn't call them lapdogs.  I think they still feel that they're using the intel the BMOL has to offer, and taking out monsters, but that they can end that relationship at any time.  I'm guessing that having to report to Ketch is going to get under their skin pretty quickly.

Here's what I don't get.  How CAN they end the relationship since they already know about "The Code". . Surely they don't think the Code is something good if they had to talk Mick out of killing Eileen. I mean that's a freaking plot hole at the moment that makes the boys look like bigger dolts than they already do. Also, why aren't they calling Mary and saying OKAY WTF is this Code!?

Whatever happened to their constant wariness of things that don't sound right to them? 
 

[DeeDee79]

5 hours ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

I'm a little tired of the 'Sam hit on the head and tied to a tiny chair' trope - even as visually funny it is to see big ol' Sam tied to a probably normal sized chair that just looks small in comparison.

It would be nice if they used a different method to take one out of the action so that the other can be the savior of the week. At this point they should have some serious brain damage!

[SueB]

FINALLY got to rewatch -- what with a holiday weekend and travel, just no time before now.

Upon rewatch thoughts:
- I REALLY liked the perspective of a small "factory" town that they showed. It's NOT a pretty picture. In fact, it's a dying economic model and seeing how rundown the town was, was kinda painful.  I'm glad they didn't shy away from it or make it seem like "the noble poor".  Honestly, I felt MUCH more empathy for the Jared (the character), then Darrin.  But BOTH are somewhat victims of growing up in a single-factory town that is on the decline.  Jared's old man was an child-beating asshole and poor Jared was stuck caring for his abuser. Darrin clearly retreated into booze and weed to 'escape' his circumstance.  The whole thing was realistic but depressing.  But I'm glad they went for the realism.  And I thought that realism was a good backstory for why Pete turned his own personal soapopera into a desperate attempt to be the town hero. Nothing but a god was going to make that factory profitable (based on what Pete said).  
- Sheriff Bishop, OTOH, was more of an interesting character than I expected.  First I thought he was such a douchebag. He himself was escaping into his hobby and seemed so apathetic to the town. But he really was a SHITTY businessman if he couldn't sell off property and at least modernize the plant.  It came as a surprise that he was doing the right thing by the town to at least try to keep the factory open and not killing people.  But, it almost felt like he just didn't have the intellect to do more than slowly stem the economic hemorrhaging.  
- I thought the god was pretty interesting.  They said an ancestor bound it but even starving it for 20 years didn't kill the thing.  You really needed the Colt (or possibly some special piece of wood blessed by some random blood ritual). Both Pete and the Sheriff were so out of their league when trying to deal with this thing.  I also liked the half-glimpse approach rather than full-on CGI creature.  The horns & claws were suitably scary -- that's a good approach to horror IMO rather than show the thing.
- I paid more attention to Dean's hookup this time.  I'm not sure what about her caught Dean's eye but he was seriously on the prowl as soon as he got a whiff of her.  Maybe it's the waitress angle.  Regardless, he seemed pretty content the next morning.  Good for him.
- There was some EXCELLENT dialog in this episode. "Beef is cow, pork is pig and Soylent Green is people." Hee.  The bit about rich people & murder. The crack about Dynasty.  Dean, in particular, got some winners.
- I REALLY liked Sam's take on their legacy: it's the people they've saved and they've left the world a better place.  But it doesn't hurt to carve your name into the furniture. (Although my inner librarian was horrified).  Really boys?  Couldn't we have carved into a pillar?  
- They made a big deal about how injured Dean was from the fall.  I thought that played pretty realistic.  That was a worse-than-usual concussion.  They had to use some CW smelling-salts to make him capable of doing anything after that drop.  I liked the cat & mouse tension in the cooler although I didn't like Dean inadvertently putting the hook into the beef.  Still, pretty bold move to grab the nearest meat hook and start swinging at a god.  
- The BMoL dudes got their cooties on the bunker.  They have to die now.  Especially Ketch.
- I really think Ketch looking at Mary's photo is because he's picking up on the supernatural anti-aging (which it's not, it's just that she was dead for 30 years, but that probably isn't going to work for the "old men" either).

When I compare this to some of last years' one-offs, I have to agree that this was a slower pace. Much more S1 like.  I think they are in the position of having to literally slow-down the show a bit to reset our 'dyanmic range' for episodes.  You can't just keep upping the pace. S11 was pretty EPIC, even the one-offs. I'm thinking of The Vessel (with an entire SUBMARINE!), Red Meat, and the Safe House. I think that intensity is hard to maintain.  

Still, I like going back to the Americana roots of the show.  I wish our characters had commented a bit more on it but I generally really liked a lot of the different elements.  I wasn't breathless but I was still very entertained.    

 

ETA:  Did anyone else notice the white board?

This is "USA - Phase 1 of Project V".  Where V is the roman number 5.  Is USA the first phase of a global cleansing of monsters effort?

Edited April 17, 2017 by SueB

[catrox14]

7 minutes ago, SueB said:

I paid more attention to Dean's hookup this time.  I'm not sure what about her caught Dean's eye but he was seriously on the prowl as soon as he got a whiff of her.  Maybe it's the waitress angle.  Regardless, he seemed pretty content the next morning.  Good for him.

Maybe she smelled like bacon :)

[DittyDotDot]

9 minutes ago, SueB said:

I REALLY liked the perspective of a small "factory" town that they showed. It's NOT a pretty picture. In fact, it's a dying economic model and seeing how rundown the town was, was kinda painful.  I'm glad they didn't shy away from it or make it seem like "the noble poor".  Honestly, I felt MUCH more empathy for the Jared (the character), then Darrin.  But BOTH are somewhat victims of growing up in a single-factory town that is on the decline.  Jared's old man was an child-beating asshole and poor Jared was stuck caring for his abuser. Darrin clearly retreated into booze and weed to 'escape' his circumstance.  The whole thing was realistic but depressing.  But I'm glad they went for the realism.  And I thought that realism was a good backstory for why Pete turned his own personal soapopera into a desperate attempt to be the town hero. Nothing but a god was going to make that factory profitable (based on what Pete said).

I agree, the whole look and feel of the episode was just spot on. I also thought their casting was really good for this episode and helped me see them as realistic small-towners instead of CW models.

13 minutes ago, SueB said:

Sheriff Bishop, OTOH, was more of an interesting character than I expected.  First I thought he was such a douchebag. He himself was escaping into his hobby and seemed so apathetic to the town. But he really was a SHITTY businessman if he couldn't sell off property and at least modernize the plant.  It came as a surprise that he was doing the right thing by the town to at least try to keep the factory open and not killing people.  But, it almost felt like he just didn't have the intellect to do more than slowly stem the economic hemorrhaging.

I loved his accent! The actor did a really good job with this character. I wouldn't mind seeing him again at some point.

14 minutes ago, SueB said:

I paid more attention to Dean's hookup this time.  I'm not sure what about her caught Dean's eye but he was seriously on the prowl as soon as he got a whiff of her.  Maybe it's the waitress angle.  Regardless, he seemed pretty content the next morning.  Good for him.

I thought she kinda gave him the smile and come-hither look when she was filling up his coffee cup. It seemed like that's when Dean's focus shifted anyway.

17 minutes ago, SueB said:

There was some EXCELLENT dialog in this episode. "Beef is cow, pork is pig and Soylent Green is people." Hee.  The bit about rich people & murder. The crack about Dynasty.  Dean, in particular, got some winners.

I know, right?! I laughed so damn hard at the rich people and murder stuff. So. Hard.

[catrox14]

30 minutes ago, SueB said:

FINALLY got to rewatch -- what with a holiday weekend and travel, just no time before now.

Upon rewatch thoughts:
- I REALLY liked the perspective of a small "factory" town that they showed. It's NOT a pretty picture. In fact, it's a dying economic model and seeing how rundown the town was, was kinda painful.  I'm glad they didn't shy away from it or make it seem like "the noble poor".  Honestly, I felt MUCH more empathy for the Jared (the character), then Darrin.  But BOTH are somewhat victims of growing up in a single-factory town that is on the decline.  Jared's old man was an child-beating asshole and poor Jared was stuck caring for his abuser. Darrin clearly retreated into booze and weed to 'escape' his circumstance.  The whole thing was realistic but depressing.  But I'm glad they went for the realism.  And I thought that realism was a good backstory for why Pete turned his own personal soapopera into a desperate attempt to be the town hero. Nothing but a god was going to make that factory profitable (based on what Pete said).  
- Sheriff Bishop, OTOH, was more of an interesting character than I expected.  First I thought he was such a douchebag. He himself was escaping into his hobby and seemed so apathetic to the town. But he really was a SHITTY businessman if he couldn't sell off property and at least modernize the plant.  It came as a surprise that he was doing the right thing by the town to at least try to keep the factory open and not killing people.  But, it almost felt like he just didn't have the intellect to do more than slowly stem the economic hemorrhaging.  
- I thought the god was pretty interesting.  They said an ancestor bound it but even starving it for 20 years didn't kill the thing.  You really needed the Colt (or possibly some special piece of wood blessed by some random blood ritual). Both Pete and the Sheriff were so out of their league when trying to deal with this thing.  I also liked the half-glimpse approach rather than full-on CGI creature.  The horns & claws were suitably scary -- that's a good approach to horror IMO rather than show the thing.
- I paid more attention to Dean's hookup this time.  I'm not sure what about her caught Dean's eye but he was seriously on the prowl as soon as he got a whiff of her.  Maybe it's the waitress angle.  Regardless, he seemed pretty content the next morning.  Good for him.
- There was some EXCELLENT dialog in this episode. "Beef is cow, pork is pig and Soylent Green is people." Hee.  The bit about rich people & murder. The crack about Dynasty.  Dean, in particular, got some winners.
- I REALLY liked Sam's take on their legacy: it's the people they've saved and they've left the world a better place.  But it doesn't hurt to carve your name into the furniture. (Although my inner librarian was horrified).  Really boys?  Couldn't we have carved into a pillar?  
- They made a big deal about how injured Dean was from the fall.  I thought that played pretty realistic.  That was a worse-than-usual concussion.  They had to use some CW smelling-salts to make him capable of doing anything after that drop.  I liked the cat & mouse tension in the cooler although I didn't like Dean inadvertently putting the hook into the beef.  Still, pretty bold move to grab the nearest meat hook and start swinging at a god.  
- The BMoL dudes got their cooties on the bunker.  They have to die now.  Especially Ketch.
- I really think Ketch looking at Mary's photo is because he's picking up on the supernatural anti-aging (which it's not, it's just that she was dead for 30 years, but that probably isn't going to work for the "old men" either).

When I compare this to some of last years' one-offs, I have to agree that this was a slower pace. Much more S1 like.  I think they are in the position of having to literally slow-down the show a bit to reset our 'dyanmic range' for episodes.  You can't just keep upping the pace. S11 was pretty EPIC, even the one-offs. I'm thinking of The Vessel (with an entire SUBMARINE!), Red Meat, and the Safe House. I think that intensity is hard to maintain.  

Still, I like going back to the Americana roots of the show.  I wish our characters had commented a bit more on it but I generally really liked a lot of the different elements.  I wasn't breathless but I was still very entertained.    

 

ETA:  Did anyone else notice the white board?

This is "USA - Phase 1 of Project V".  Where V is the roman number 5.  Is USA the first phase of a global cleansing of monsters effort?

Oh good catch. I figured that would be their end game anyway.

[DittyDotDot]

59 minutes ago, SueB said:

ETA:  Did anyone else notice the white board?

This is "USA - Phase 1 of Project V".  Where V is the roman number 5.  Is USA the first phase of a global cleansing of monsters effort?

Is this from this episode? I'm trying to remember when we saw this whiteboard.

[catrox14]

It's in the BMoLOL. I think it must have been in the scene when they were all packing up to leave for the bunker.

[DittyDotDot]

10 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

It's in the BMoLOL. I think it must have been in the scene when they were all packing up to leave for the bunker.

I understand it's the BMoL lair, I must have missed them packing up. I thought the first we saw the Brits was outside the bunker?

[catrox14]

3 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

I understand it's the BMoL lair, I must have missed them packing up. I thought the first we saw the Brits was outside the bunker?

They showed them packing up to get ready to leave. Ketch came in wearing his kevlar and they were getting their gear together.

[SueB]

9 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

I understand it's the BMoL lair, I must have missed them packing up. I thought the first we saw the Brits was outside the bunker?

Ketch sent a text "as Mick", to check status. When Sam said they are still working on it, Ketch essentially said "let's go" and they packed up. 

[DittyDotDot]

1 minute ago, SueB said:

Ketch sent a text "as Mick", to check status. When Sam said they are still working on it, Ketch essentially said "let's go" and they packed up. 

Yeah, I remember the text, but not the packing. Thanks.