S34: Zeke Smith

[himela]

Maybe Zeke was right not wanting to reveal he's trans and only be identified as Zeke. It seems everything that he did or was throughout 1.5 seasons are forgotten and now he is just that trans dude who was brought back by the production to create drama.

[ByaNose]

1 hour ago, himela said:

Maybe Zeke was right not wanting to reveal he's trans and only be identified as Zeke. It seems everything that he did or was throughout 1.5 seasons are forgotten and now he is just that trans dude who was brought back by the production to create drama.

Thus him wanting to keep it a secret. If he had wanted people to know he would have mentioned it in his pre game interviews. Those are usually kept until after the game has ended but before it airs. He didn't and I can understand it. He just wanted to be this guy name Zeke Smith and wanted to play Survivor. He said he hasn't told anyone his two seasons. I'm not sure if it was just in the game he didn't tell his first season or if he told some (Hannan?) after the game. It doesn't matter in the end. He didn't tell anyone in Game Changers and that was his choice.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, himela said:

Maybe Zeke was right not wanting to reveal he's trans and only be identified as Zeke. It seems everything that he did or was throughout 1.5 seasons are forgotten and now he is just that trans dude who was brought back by the production to create drama.

I'm not sure how "maybe it's partly why he was brought back" got turned into "everything he did was forgotten and he is nothing but a trans dude now".  

I'm sure it wasn't all of his identity to casting but it was a part of it.  He said in the press he applied and was called in two hours.   I don't recall any applicant ever having any sort of response like that.  

[peachmangosteen]

I mean Zeke just isn't that great of a player imo. Plus I'm not personally a fan of the way he plays or his personality in general so I'm not a fan. I kinda liked him for the first few eps of MvGX, but then he got cocky and nasty and his speeches became increasingly off-putting so I was over him. 

I did choose him for my fantasy team though because based on MvGX I thought he'd get me some points and he has helped me some so I do thank him for that!

[LadyChatts]

So Zeke almost won me over tonight, because I thought maybe he had learned about playing too hard, too fast.  Apparently not.  I think, like last season, he's desperate to form some legacy and wants to do anything and everything.  He really screwed himself tonight.  He's definitely out of the loop with Brad's side, alienated from the other side, and no one seems to care what he has to say.

[ByaNose]

I really thought he would at least stick with Andrea. He turned on Andrea for no apparent reason. I could see later on but it seems too early. Andrea seemed to take it personally, too.  He's playing hard and fast. 

[Vyk]

11 minutes ago, ByaNose said:

I really thought he would at least stick with Andrea. He turned on Andrea for no apparent reason. I could see later on but it seems too early. Andrea seemed to take it personally, too.  He's playing hard and fast. 

Zeke's sudden turn reminded me of Joel doing the same to his own alliance in Micronesia.  Mikey B. made a perfectly reasonable strategy for the main alliance to cause a split vote to blindside the Airai Oldies, but Joel, out of just wanting to be the one in charge, instead organized a blindside against Mikey B. and his closest ally, Mary, having the latter voted out.  Zeke basically wanted to turn on Andrea and Cirie for the same dumb reason.  While it didn't bite Joel in the ass, it certainly bit Zeke in his.

I still like Zeke, if not love him, for not worshipping the ground David walked on and making him cry last season.  But I'm reminded again that he's just not a good player.

[LadyChatts]

1 hour ago, Vyk said:

Zeke's sudden turn reminded me of Joel doing the same to his own alliance in Micronesia.  Mikey B. made a perfectly reasonable strategy for the main alliance to cause a split vote to blindside the Airai Oldies, but Joel, out of just wanting to be the one in charge, instead organized a blindside against Mikey B. and his closest ally, Mary, having the latter voted out.  Zeke basically wanted to turn on Andrea and Cirie for the same dumb reason.  While it didn't bite Joel in the ass, it certainly bit Zeke in his.

I still like Zeke, if not love him, for not worshipping the ground David walked on and making him cry last season.  But I'm reminded again that he's just not a good player.

I'd say it did backfire on Joel later on, since he wound up on a swapped tribe with Chet and Tracy, and got blindsided.  But you are right, sometimes people are so desperate to be in control, they don't really think through what they're doing.  I bet Joel thought he'd totally have Tracy/Kathy/Chet under his thumb. 

I will say that I agree with Zeke on Brad trying to pretend he's Mr. Nice Guy.  I wonder, if Zeke's name was thrown out there, if Tai would risk saving him with his idol.  Tai seems to really like him.

Edited April 20, 2017 by LadyChatts

[enlightenedbum]

Sometimes staying loyal is the right move!  I hate this idea that you need "BIG MOVES" to win at Survivor.  No, you need the jury to want to give you a million dollars.  If you're the person in the main alliance everybody likes, you win.  Just boot Cirie at 4 and suck up to everyone else as you boot them.  Idiot.

[kikaha]

Like last season, Zeke is trying to do too much.  He is trying to drive the action, when he should (IMO) play it cool.  He throws out intellectual-sounding responses to Jeff's questions, that again make him stand out, in a bad way, to the other players.  

He did make the 2nd hour more interesting, but I think he hurt his chances to win, maybe fatally so. 

[enlightenedbum]

Yeah, he's done.  Nobody trusts him enough to put him in the loop, which is a bad, bad place to be.

[legaleagle53]

1 minute ago, enlightenedbum said:

Yeah, he's done.  Nobody trusts him enough to put him in the loop, which is a bad, bad place to be.

So Jeff Varner was right about Zeke, but he just went about the wrong way to prove it.

[Vyk]

1 minute ago, legaleagle53 said:

So Jeff Varner was right about Zeke, but he just went about the wrong way to prove it.

Pretty much.  He should've just publicized his intentions of protecting Ozzy for a shield to use later on, and either one of them would've been toast instead of Jeff.

Edited April 20, 2017 by Vyk

[simplyme]

8 hours ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

I'm sure it wasn't all of his identity to casting but it was a part of it.  He said in the press he applied and was called in two hours.   I don't recall any applicant ever having any sort of response like that.  

Except he didn't tell them he was transgender until the late phases of his interviews. Also, since he probably has medications that he has to take and I imagine there are medical interviews, etc before one goes on Survivor, I don't think he could truly not tell them at all.

In MvsGX, I felt Zeke was fairly charismatic and well-spoken and either naturally unusual or knew how to create a character to stand out. Whether that's good or bad is a matter of preference, but I can easily see casting being interested in him without needing the extra hook. 

At least I always knew who he was, right from episode one. In Caramoan I had a lot of trouble telling the difference between the four blonde women on the fans tribe until they were whittled down.

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, simplyme said:

Except he didn't tell them he was transgender until the late phases of his interviews. Also, since he probably has medications that he has to take and I imagine there are medical interviews, etc before one goes on Survivor, I don't think he could truly not tell them at all.

So why not just tell them on the audition tape?  I have trouble believing he didn't, and got called in two hours.  Did he even say that anywhere?  All I heard was Jeff found out after he'd been cast rather than before.  

[LadyChatts]

I'm wondering if Brad and company will tell Zeke that they really do trust him, and only left him out of the loop on the Ozzy vote to see if he'd vote for Aubry, who they told him to.  He's pretty naive if he falls for that.

[KimberStormer]

As you all know I agree with Zeke when he says better to regret a move than to regret not making a move...but I don't really see where this move got him.  He had an alliance and he decided to blow it up with the mysterious expectation that he could rebuild something from the scattered pieces...but the other alliance was still intact, so how could that work?  I'm trying to figure out what he thought his path to the win was.

[peachmangosteen]

Yea, I'm with him on the 'better to regret a move than to regret not making a move,' but I'm also a proponent of the 'big moves aren't always necessary' and this was a big, completely unnecessary move. It was literally just about him being butthurt he wasn't the leader of his alliance. So hilarious! I'm glad he screwed himself because I don't like him, but damn my fantasy team sucks lol. 

Edited April 20, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[ljenkins782]

11 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

As you all know I agree with Zeke when he says better to regret a move than to regret not making a move...but I don't really see where this move got him.  He had an alliance and he decided to blow it up with the mysterious expectation that he could rebuild something from the scattered pieces...but the other alliance was still intact, so how could that work?  I'm trying to figure out what he thought his path to the win was.

Right??? He, Andrea and Cirie could have been a pretty badass alliance strategy-wise, I don't know why he chose to blow that up. I was so hoping Andrea would be able to pull off getting rid of Brad or Sierra, but Zeke effed it all up. 

[simplyme]

16 hours ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

So why not just tell them on the audition tape?  I have trouble believing he didn't, and got called in two hours.  Did he even say that anywhere?  All I heard was Jeff found out after he'd been cast rather than before.  

Okay. Found it. From Zeke's Hollywood Reporter guest column :

 "I applied. I didn't discuss my trans status in my initial video because I wanted the show to desire me as a game player and an eccentric storyteller, not as "The First Trans SurvivorPlayer." They did. Casting called back two hours later, and I began to panic."

And from an EW interview with Probst :

"My story with Zeke goes like this. I met Zeke in casting and loved him. I still have my original notes from that meeting. He was very engaging, gifted in his ability to manipulate with his words, and he wore this crazy Hawaiian shirt and had poofy hair. We knew we were doing Millennials vs. Gen X as a theme and we wanted him on the Millennials tribe immediately. It wasn’t until after he left that I was told he was transgender. From that point forward we agreed that if his story was to be told, he would be the one to decide when, where, and how."

From those two quotes, I got the impression that Zeke's appeal was primarily Zeke.

[ByaNose]

And, Zeke & Andrea were friends pre game. I can understand wanting to go after her but why now? Obviously, she want too thrilled with it either. 

[LadyChatts]

Not that I care to see Zeke back a third time, but I wonder if he'd realize making moves too quick, too soon, for the sake of making them isn't the best strategy.  I'm all for people doing just that in the game, as long as it made sense.  Zeke seemed to be on nobody's radar to suddenly being public enemy #1 with half of the camp, and the other half not caring about working with him.  I'd love to hear what he thinks watching that back.

As for Zeke getting on the show-I can see why they'd go for him.  Geeky super fan who talks about making big moves and probably knows every definition in the new school Survivor handbook (and old school).  Given the comparisons Probst gave him, he must have gave one heck of an interview.

[peachmangosteen]

1 hour ago, ljenkins782 said:

He, Andrea and Cirie could have been a pretty badass alliance strategy-wise, I don't know why he chose to blow that up.

He stated why himself on the show and it basically boiled down to being pissed he wasn't top dog in his alliance. LOL.

Edited April 20, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[vibeology]

22 hours ago, simplyme said:

From those two quotes, I got the impression that Zeke's appeal was primarily Zeke.

Agreed and I think it makes sense. I do back and forth on whether I like the guy, but I never forget him. He is a casting directors dream. He comes with a built in character (one that I'm sure Zeke himself crafted as part of the goal of getting cast on the show), is easily identified in the crowd and fills a few slots this show likes to check off. (brainy guy, guy who might not be in the best shape, if he told them he was gay in his initial video the show does like to include some diversity there and has since the beginning.) The goal is to cast characters and Zeke is one without needing too much prodding from producers to get there.

And as for why he'd be invited back, I also see it. The show wanted a few people from the most recent season and probably wanted to lock up that cast early so they couldn't wait for the final three. Plus you've got all the same reasons to cast him again and now that they've seen him play they can look at his gameplay and see if there's potential for a story there. With Zeke I think there is. He knows the game very well but doesn't always play it well which makes for a good storyline and creates conflict. What reality show producer doesn't like conflict? Plus he's a smart talker who gives them good material to work with.

[himela]

Zeke is engaged to Hannah? Ok, I may have no idea of what I'm talking about, but... isn't Zeke gay?

[Nashville]

5 minutes ago, himela said:

Zeke is engaged to Hannah? Ok, I may have no idea of what I'm talking about, but... isn't Zeke gay?

Uh... yes.  :D 

[himela]

Wasn't last season's scene with Brett about Zeke not being the only gay the highlight of the season? What is going on?

[LadyChatts]

Zeke and Hannah are really good friends, and I'm assuming it's a joke.

[KimberStormer]

These millenial hipster kids and their ironies!

[ByaNose]

So this week he gets chewed out by Andrea and trying to work with Sarah. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. For some reason, he voted for Aubrey. I'm not sure if he was told by everyone else to do that or he was throwing a hinky vote. In turn, he is almost voted out by the girls. I guess he's on the bottom of both alliances now. I think..........................

Edited April 24, 2017 by ByaNose

[LadyChatts]

He was told by Debbie (or someone on that side) that they were voting Aubrey.

[ByaNose]

14 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

He was told by Debbie (or someone on that side) that they were voting Aubrey.

So he is technically on the bottom of both alliances. LOL!!!

[Nashville]

16 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

He was told by Debbie (or someone on that side) that they were voting Aubrey.

To expand:

1. Zeke was one of the original agreed-upon targets last week.
2. Someone (Sierra, maybe?) asked whose name should be thrown out if Zeke asked which way the TC vote was planned.
3. Debbie volunteered Aubrey's name.

So - lacking any information to the contrary, Zeke most likely went along with the last "plan" he was told.

[LadyChatts]

18 minutes ago, ByaNose said:

So he is technically on the bottom of both alliances. LOL!!!

Pretty much.  He was fine if he'd just kept his mouth shut and stuck with Cirie's group, but he had to be top dog and blab to the other side.  In Debbie's TH during the RC she openly said she didn't care about working with a Zeke but was going to pretend she was interested.  Heck, I think Sierra's the one who went back and told Cirie what Zeke said (about Cirie's plan to vote her off).  

[Wings]

13 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

Pretty much.  He was fine if he'd just kept his mouth shut and stuck with Cirie's group, but he had to be top dog and blab to the other side.  In Debbie's TH during the RC she openly said she didn't care about working with a Zeke but was going to pretend she was interested.  Heck, I think Sierra's the one who went back and told Cirie what Zeke said (about Cirie's plan to vote her off).  

And by the looks of the preview he is continuing on his path to destruction. 

[JenTen1585]

I love Zeke on this show!  He's not a perfect strategist ... he moves too big and too quick, and doesn't always read people correctly.  He did it last season and he just messed up again last week.  But he's not afraid to make big moves and I think he fits in perfectly with the other players this season, who are very similar ... not really great strategists or at least not perfect strategists but PLAYERS, none the less, who love the game and are willing to be bold!  I agree with his premise that you don't want to sit next to Andrea and Cirie at the end ... it's his timing that was wrong.  He should have coasted with them a while longer till the other side needed him, and just slowly worked to get in good with Debbie and others.  But why I really love Zeke on this show is that he is entertaining to watch - great narrator, fun, nice guy in general and interesting, true lover of the game, bold!  He's a great casting choice!    

[ByaNose]

3 hours ago, JenTen1585 said:

I love Zeke on this show!  He's not a perfect strategist ... he moves too big and too quick, and doesn't always read people correctly.  He did it last season and he just messed up again last week.  But he's not afraid to make big moves and I think he fits in perfectly with the other players this season, who are very similar ... not really great strategists or at least not perfect strategists but PLAYERS, none the less, who love the game and are willing to be bold!  I agree with his premise that you don't want to sit next to Andrea and Cirie at the end ... it's his timing that was wrong.  He should have coasted with them a while longer till the other side needed him, and just slowly worked to get in good with Debbie and others.  But why I really love Zeke on this show is that he is entertaining to watch - great narrator, fun, nice guy in general and interesting, true lover of the game, bold!  He's a great casting choice!    

Yeah, Zeke should have waited about 2 more Tribal Councils before flipping/going his own way. He also burned some britches with Andrea & Cirie. If he got to the end there are two potential votes he doesn't get. His plan wasn't bad but his timing was. 

[LadyChatts]

I agree that it's all about timing.  But that's the thing that's so frustrating to me about Zeke.  I think he might be able to actually pull moves off, he just is so eager to do so, that he doesn't think about the consequences.  I can't tell if he's looking to be a character, make some legacy that's referenced years later, or is really trying to be some master strategist and make moves.  Which goes along with the legacy, but twice now he's misread the room and struck too soon.  He may want to make a big move now instead of regretting it later that he didn't (which I'm all for), but judging from this past week the TC was a shock on many fronts to him.  And yet, he probably won't learn.  Despite the fact that the guy he wanted as a shield is gone, an alliance that he actually had is betrayed, and the alliance he thought he had didn't want him in the first place.  So it's not only he has bad timing because of his eagerness, but he also can't read a room.  I wouldn't want to sit next to Andrea or Cirie in the end, either, but this was not the time.

Edited April 25, 2017 by LadyChatts

[ByaNose]

52 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

I agree that it's all about timing.  But that's the thing that's so frustrating to me about Zeke.  I think he might be able to actually pull moves off, he just is so eager to do so, that he doesn't think about the consequences.  I can't tell if he's looking to be a character, make some legacy that's referenced years later, or is really trying to be some master strategist and make moves.  Which goes along with the legacy, but twice know he's misread the room and struck to soon.  He may want to make a big move now instead of regretting it later that he didn't (which I'm all for), but judging from this past week the TC was a shock on many fronts to him.  And yet, he probably won't learn.  Despite the fact that the guy he wanted as a shield is gone, an alliance that he actually had is betrayed, and the alliance he thought he had didn't want him in the first place.  So it's not only he has bad timing because of his eagerness, but he also can't read a room.  I wouldn't want to sit next to Andrea or Cirie in the end, either, but this was not the time.

I hadn't even thought about the alliance he thought he had & didn't even want him. Zeke willing gave information to Sierra thinking she didn't know what she was doing or who she was right with. Obviously, he was told to vote one and now he knows he was lied to and that he sold out his real alliance. It will be interesting to see if he can wiggle out or this or not. In theory, Brad & Sierra are bigger targets and people should be gunning for them but they are in the majority alliance. I think Zeke is caught in the middle. I guess whomever needs him more will string him along.

[enoughcats]

1 hour ago, ByaNose said:

. He also burned some britches with Andrea & Cirie.

 I hope you meant bridges and not b.itches.

[simplyme]

2 hours ago, ByaNose said:

He also burned some britches with Andrea & Cirie.

 

57 minutes ago, enoughcats said:

 I hope you meant bridges and not b.itches.

Well, Zeke was caught lying, and britches are pants, so...

[ByaNose]

48 minutes ago, simplyme said:

 

Well, Zeke was caught lying, and britches are pants, so...

What he said. LOL!!! Yup! He was lying and burnt some bridges but autocorrect said britches. 

[Vyk]

10 hours ago, JenTen1585 said:

I love Zeke on this show!  He's not a perfect strategist ... he moves too big and too quick, and doesn't always read people correctly.

That's . . . kind of his problem, though.  Zeke is so desperate to make big moves, he moves too quickly.  Nothing wrong with wanting to make a big move, but you've gotta weigh the costs vs. benefits first, and then properly gauge the timing.  Zeke did neither.  He thought it was more beneficial to work with an alliance that didn't even want or even need him, and it cost him the alliance who trusted him.  And he moved way too soon in doing so.

I like Zeke, too, but if this is his gameplay, he isn't winning this season by a longshot.  

[ByaNose]

8 hours ago, Vyk said:

That's . . . kind of his problem, though.  Zeke is so desperate to make big moves, he moves too quickly.  Nothing wrong with wanting to make a big move, but you've gotta weigh the costs vs. benefits first, and then properly gauge the timing.  Zeke did neither.  He thought it was more beneficial to work with an alliance that didn't even want or even need him, and it cost him the alliance who trusted him.  And he moved way too soon in doing so.

I like Zeke, too, but if this is his gameplay, he isn't winning this season by a longshot.  

I wonder what it was like when got home the 2nd time after playing back to back. Did he think he played a better or worse game? Of course, this still depends on how far he goes this time. Last time, he was 11th voted out, 5th jury member on Day 33. I'm thinking pretty much the same. I don't think he makes the Final 3 but I also don't think he'll be the 3rd jury member either. Right now, we have Hali & Ozzy. Will he be next?
 

[enlightenedbum]

Zeke as a poker player would say that if you don't make a spectacularly ridiculous bluff you can't win a tournament.  It's all about BIG MOVES.  Which is Probst bullshit and not actual strategy.

[Nashville]

"Big Moves" and "Smart Moves" aren't necessarily mutually exclusive - but if you try hard enough, you can make them that way.  :>

[LadyChatts]

I'm curious if Zeke, who wanted to get out a bigger target like Andrea or Cirie, questioned why Debbie told him to vote Aubry.  Did he think that was part of the big move-Andrea and Cirie would be shaking in their boots, thinking they were getting voted off, maybe flush out an idol (since I don't think anyone knows who has the idols), but they'd blindside them with an Aubry vote?

[peachmangosteen]

1 hour ago, LadyChatts said:

I'm curious if Zeke, who wanted to get out a bigger target like Andrea or Cirie, questioned why Debbie told him to vote Aubry.  Did he think that was part of the big move-Andrea and Cirie would be shaking in their boots, thinking they were getting voted off, maybe flush out an idol (since I don't think anyone knows who has the idols), but they'd blindside them with an Aubry vote?

I just assume that he realized no one was really biting on getting rid of Cirie/Andrea so he just did what he thought everyone was doing.

[LadyChatts]

I really want to root for Zeke, but he makes it hard.  Andrea was dead on that the other alliance was using him.  They couldn't even trust him to say who they were really voting for.  Hopefully he ate some humble pie when he realized they kept talking about "the 6", and he wasn't in it.  I would love to know what he thinks watching back.  The best thing Zeke does in this game seems to be to sabotage himself, but he doesn't even know it.  Let's see if this week is a turning point, but hopefully he doesn't get power crazed because one move that wasn't really his got pulled off correctly.

I'm surprised he and Andrea dislike each other so much.  I thought they were friends outside of the game.

[Nalan]

23 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

I really want to root for Zeke, but he makes it hard.  Andrea was dead on that the other alliance was using him.  They couldn't even trust him to say who they were really voting for.  Hopefully he ate some humble pie when he realized they kept talking about "the 6", and he wasn't in it.

Judging by his expressions, I don't think he did.