S13.E01: Undo

[DearEvette]

Dead Denny is a topic I think we can all agree on. LOL.

[Joana]

IMO Gizzie was even worse. At least with Ghost Denny I can sorta see how it might have looked romantic/interesting/dramatic/whatever in Shonda's head, but it was simply impossible to transfer it on screen. Gizzie is on the other hand simply inexplicable, unless you see it as her revenge on Heigl and Knight. 

[Chas411]

Haha I was actually going to say Gizzie on my last post but couldn't face bringing it up. 

 

Gizzie Sucked - I stopped watching the for 4 seasons after it.

[WhosThatGirl]

I think even Heigl and Knight hated Gizzie, as I believe that was the season she pulled herself out of Emmy consideration. 

[Court]

I blocked out Gizzie until y'all posted. 

[timimouse]

4 hours ago, Chas411 said:

Realistically a viewer either likes a character or doesn't. The people who like Jo will enjoy her finally having a storyline and see past the retcon of an abusive ex whereas people who don't like her won't see past it and will still find a way to blame her for violent actions.

Respectfully, I disagree. Personally, I cannot STAND Jo. Really wish she was the one to leave instead of Leah. I also agree that I think her retcon is poorly written (as I did for Maggie's entire existence for that matter). But I understand these things happen in these shows, especially when you're looking at more than 4 seasons, so I will look past it. I, however, don't blame Jo for Alex's behaviour. I think we've seen enough of Alex to know that he does have a very violent temper. I thought he had matured, but when sh*t hit the fan, he reverted back to his old ways. Granted, Jo met him during his "grown up" days and maybe she didn't really see that side to him until now. I won't blame her for pulling away from him -- if she really is dealing with an abusive husband in her past, with Alex's outburst on DeLuca's face, that's a huge red flag for her. So I do think it will be interesting to see where they take this story. I love Alex but I actually want to see him pay for his actions because in this case he was WRONG.

[Pinecone]

I like to retcon Gizzie as the start of Izzie's cancer spreading to her brain, but it was probably Shonda's Revenge. 

Edited September 26, 2016 by Pinecone
Typo

[thewhiteowl]

Pretty good opener. I was right, I don't have much empathy for Alex. Or Jo, although battered women have reactions that are odd to those that haven't been. if it weren't so overused, I would understand that Jo couldn't just spit it out because a battered woman can't. However they use it so much on this show, I mean the inability to just say something that the trauma of a battered woman in particular, is lost. OTOH Jo is not so traumatized that she hasn't defended herself in the past and not only got involved with Alex but pressured him for a commitment. So it's difficult to understand for me where her level of comfort lies. 

Poor Deluca. I think Alex was lying to Mer when he said he thought Jo was being raped. I think that was covering his ass. He saw a guy in bed with "his" woman and beat the shit out of him. Not noble but a common desire for men in that situation. 

Loved the lack of Owen. Maggie grates. I didn't hate Bailey or Ben, that's new and nice. 

Mere is still an idiot.

[WhosThatGirl]

I don't blame Jo for Alex's behavior.  That is on him. I don't like Jo very much either and I agree with a few others that her new backstory is a retcon and doesn't fit in with her character for the past seasons. She has wanted more from Alex than just living together, someone pointed that scene out where she confronted him about Izzie and the cancer and the etc. She also got very upset when Mer returned after Derek died and was needing him around more, she didn't want that. But Alex could have used his words or punched DeLuca once and walked away. He could have screamed and yelled and walked away.  Even just hitting DeLuca once, but Alex kept going back to hit him more.  Like I said, I like to think Jo tried to intervene but Alex was seeing red and wasn't hearing any of it.. I do wonder who called the ambulance. Jo or Alex. 

I don't know. I'm just angry that this is the storyline they're going with for Alex. I don't think it's a good one. I would love for him to get more stories, but I really hate this. 

I liked Ben this episode too. Which by the end of last season, he was a character I disliked, due to him acting first and not wanting to deal with consequences. I remember thinking he was in the wrong. 

Catherine is annoying. Debbie Allen herself is fine, but I really dislike Catherine. I can't believe April didn't freak out more when she woke up to find Catherine holding her baby. Catherine is the one who tried to get Jackson to sue April. Did Catherine even say sorry for this? Worst Grandma ever, actually.

[Chas411]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

also got very upset when Mer returned after Derek died and was needing him around more, she didn't want that. B

She wasnt upset because Mer needed him, she was upset because Mer was always rude and dismissive of her and Alex would never stick up for her.

[TVForever]

On 9/23/2016 at 3:04 PM, izabella said:

I think Alex was jealous when he saw them on the bed and wanted to beat up De Lucca only for that reason.  Yes, he didn't think; he just acted.  But all he was acting on was his jealous rage at Jo's giggling and the sight of them on the bed.  Good thing he didn't have Jo's gun handy in that moment.

I'm with you. The need to believe DeLuca was taking advantage came from Alex having to justify to himself what he had done. When he walked into that apartment, all he saw was DeLuca and Jo on the bed. In the moment, he was punishing DeLuca for being with "his woman".

Edited September 26, 2016 by TVForever

[Nobodysfan]

12 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Catherine is annoying. Debbie Allen herself is fine, but I really dislike Catherine. I can't believe April didn't freak out more when she woke up to find Catherine holding her baby. Catherine is the one who tried to get Jackson to sue April. Did Catherine even say sorry for this? Worst Grandma ever, actually.

She is just so grating about the way she speaks and behaves. I can´t even say.

I am not sure if it is the character herself or the way Allen portrays her, awful. I dislike Catherine a lot. And that sick love she has for Jackson, sick.

Though I do find Debbie Allen a talented director.

Edited September 26, 2016 by Nobodysfan

[flickers]

5 hours ago, TVForever said:

I'm with you. The need to believe DeLuca was taking advantage came from Alex having to justify to himself what he had done. When he walked into that apartment, all he saw was DeLuca and Jo on the bed. In the moment, he was punishing DeLuca for being with "his woman".

Is that because Alex really is justifying his actions and lying to himself, though, or because the writers don't actually remember what happened in last season's finale?

[mojito]

...and throw away the key!

[taanja]

On ‎9‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 0:09 PM, Deanie87 said:

I realize that this isn't the case for everyone, but the reason why she lied makes a difference to me.  She isn't doing it to be malicious and she isn't doing it just to lead him on.  She feels like its what she needs to do to survive.  Thankfully, I have no first hand experience with domestic violence so I don't know if it can be similar to Witness Protection or something along those lines.  Maybe she got help from some kind of agency and was told to never, ever reveal her secret, or maybe she is just understandably paranoid and is willing to lie because of it, even if it means losing Alex.  Maybe she feels like knowing Alex the way that she does that telling him would only put both of them in danger, and his reaction to DeLuca supports that, IMO.  Whether all of this is actually true or just her being paranoid doesn't really matter me as much as the fact that SHE honestly believes that this is her only option.  The challenge the writers have now is to tell this story from the point of view of an abuse survivor and make it clear that she was doing what she felt she had to do.  It will be especially tough because they allowed Jo and Alex to completely stagnate for two years and umpteen marriage discussions, however many timejumps, and also because its blatantly obvious that the secret husband was something that Shonda just pulled out of her ass in the last few months and very little thought was given to how all of this was going to work.  I can only hope that they have given it some thought now.  This storyline is just starting and my hope is that Jo's perspective will be given and maybe make the lie more palatable for some and make her story more than just that she is lying bitch who did Alex wrong for nothing more than selfish reasons and kicks.  Obviously it won't work for some people and she will remain nothing more than a lying bitch in their eyes, but I guess we'll see.

Also, Alex doesn't know about the husband yet, so the only reason that he went beserk is because he is a violent guy with anger issues.  It is his fault and his fault alone, and its actually getting kind of tiresome to see how many people blame Jo for Alex's crime.

Wait. What? Am I misremembering... didn't Jo tell Alex about her being married at the end of last season? and that's why he left in a rage and she went out drinking?
*** Disclaimer---I don't blame Jo for Alex's behavior-- that's on him-- I blame her for lying and lying and lying... years upon years... but I swear I remember a scene from either last years finale or the ep before where Jo finally tells Alex why she can't marry him... ????

Edited September 29, 2016 by taanja
adding more

[Chas411]

No she just told him she couldn't marry him

[Court]

She told Alex she couldn't marry him and couldn't tell him why. Alex left for the wedding. She went drinking and very easily told Deluca why she couldn't marry Alex.

[Chas411]

I don't think it was that casual but ok 

[Maukie99]

I think it's good that Meredith has cleared up against Nathan for Maggie, because we see it all the Meredith Nathan likes and has feelings for him. Now they just have to say that Nathan and give him a chance, he will in any case continue to advertise in upcoming episodes to it, because he has really in love with her. So there will be no Nathan and Maggie Date.

[LeGrandElephant]

On 9/23/2016 at 10:20 AM, Joana said:

A lot of nonsense has happened on this show over the years, but at least we could say that it wasn't as bad as cutting the LVAD wire. Well, this IS just as bad. And it was 100% unnecessary. Alex didn't have to beat DeLuca up within an inch of his life. DeLuca's eyesight and career did not have to be in danger. A "regular", bar brawl kinda beating would have made for just as an intriguing storyline and would have been infinitely more believable. This was a total overkill, especially since you just know that Alex is not going to jail or losing his job and that DeLuca will be just fine, and that within a few episodes everything will be forgotten. 

I’m years behind on this, but yes, this would have been so much better. And furthermore, if they want us to believe that Alex was righteously protecting Jo, why not set it up so she was crying when he walked in (drunk crying about him, of course, but he could misinterpret it to think she was crying about DeLuca being on top of her and too drunk to defend herself). If they set it up so it really looked like Jo was being hurt/raped, and if also the beating was less over the top, they could have had the same plot and it would have been so much better and more realistic. If he hurt DeLuca’s hand they could even have all the “he won’t be able to be a surgeon” moaning (but then of course his hand would heal and be ok later).  And in real life one or two punches can do very serious damage. 

Edited May 10, 2019 by LeGrandElephant