S07.E02: Bedlam

[superman1204]

8 hours ago, Peanut6711 said:

I think Liam was actually trying to cut on Ezra even in that literary reference statement. He mentions the book Lolita, which is about an older man and preteen girl. The book has always been controversial but it's more known in popular culture by the term "Loilita" becoming a reference to young, seductive, possibly even trashy girls. So by Liam bringing it into the conversation I suspect he was trying to say that Ezra thinks his book (and his life, no doubt) is some epic romance with Aria or Nicole (at this point I think he's merged the girls into one and we'll probably see that confusion play out when Nicole turns up alive) but it really reads as trashy or creepy smut, to which he's concerned about Aria's role in it. So score another point for Liam.

Right, I remember the creepy nature of the book being brought up before on here (or maybe it was all the way back on Television Without Pity).  I never even heard of the book before it came up on the show so I just had one quick question.  Is the creepiness of the relationship considered the main point of the relationship in the book or at least is that the widely held interpretation?  I am just asking because I know there are books like Phantom of the Opera were some people think of it as this epic romance, but anyone with a degree in English considers the book a trashy romance novel, just a really old one.  If its more like Phantom then who knows how the writers want the reference to be looked at. 

[Lii]

15 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Oh, Ezra. I know you're allegedly new at all of this, but even you should know better than to take a flower arrangement into the house before reading the card or checking for miscellaneous body parts hidden inside.

I can't decide if Hanna truly believes that she and Caleb kissed because she was afraid and he made her feel safe or if she was trying to give him an out and let things go back to the way they were so that it didn't ruin their relationships with Spencer.

Thank fuck that Emily started getting suspicious of Elliot. Between Liam reading Ezra for filth and Spencer pointing out the conflict of interest in Ali's husband being her doctor, I felt like there were finally some adults on this show. Even though we'd already seen both of those scenes in the sneak peeks, I still laughed and laughed when I saw them again during the episode.

Notice that last season when the girls barged in and accused Ezra of possibly murdering Charlotte, he yelled at them to get out. But when Liam basically tells him, "You are a disgusting predatory pervert who took advantage of a young girl," Ezra's reaction is to blink and respond politely without ever raising his voice.

I'm glad that Emily and Spencer noticed that Hanna was about to spiral but I wish they had done something, anything, besides just confirm it with each other.

Heh, I think you just answered your own question right there. Apparently Aria's type is creepy manipulative statutory rapist/stalker.

Even her random side piece Andrew. In fact, didn't Karate Jake originate because he kept lurking in her bushes?  And then there was "I'm a creeper but also a cop" guy from last season. Am I missing any? 

[RedInk]

25 minutes ago, superman1204 said:

Right, I remember the creepy nature of the book being brought up before on here (or maybe it was all the way back on Television Without Pity).  I never even heard of the book before it came up on the show so I just had one quick question.  Is the creepiness of the relationship considered the main point of the relationship in the book or at least is that the widely held interpretation?  I am just asking because I know there are books like Phantom of the Opera were some people think of it as this epic romance, but anyone with a degree in English considers the book a trashy romance novel, just a really old one.  If its more like Phantom then who knows how the writers want the reference to be looked at. 

Well, for what it's worth, Lolita's considered a literary classic. And Humbert, the predatory character, is despicable, but it's written in 1st person, so of course he excuses himself. Another similarity ;)

Forgot to add that the author is name-checked in "Don't Stand So Close to Me" ("...that book by Nabokov"), which has also appeared in the series. So there's your student/teacher parallel.

At this point, enough with the lazy references. And I do think that although Humbert is gross, most people just associate the book with a racy age-inappropriate relationship, not with a pedophile, and the writers are probably counting on that.

Edited June 29, 2016 by RedInk

[WhosThatGirl]

12 minutes ago, superman1204 said:

Right, I remember the creepy nature of the book being brought up before on here (or maybe it was all the way back on Television Without Pity).  I never even heard of the book before it came up on the show so I just had one quick question.  Is the creepiness of the relationship considered the main point of the relationship in the book or at least is that the widely held interpretation?  I am just asking because I know there are books like Phantom of the Opera were some people think of it as this epic romance, but anyone with a degree in English considers the book a trashy romance novel, just a really old one.  If its more like Phantom then who knows how the writers want the reference to be looked at. 

I don't know much about the book but Alis secret identity was a reference to the book as well. 

[RachelKM]

Just now, RedInk said:

Well, for what it's worth, Lolita's considered a literary classic. And Humbert, the predatory character, is despicable, but it's written in 1st person, so of course he excuses himself. Another similarity ;)

I'd add, that despite the unreliable narrator, the book is pretty straight forward in presenting Humbert Humbert (yes that's his name)  as a pathetic pedophile obsessed with what he terms "Nymphets", girls pre and just pubescent.  At the start of the book he frequents prostitutes who are, or at least appear, prepubescent.  And he agrees to marry Lola's mother for the sole purpose of gaining access to 12 year-old Lola (whom he called Lolita).  

[mercfan3]

Lolita is written in first person, so he is the "hero" of the story, and he makes excuses for himself. But it's disturbing. And I remember finding the girl annoying at one point and then she said "remember that time you raped me." And it was just a holy crap moment, where the book snaps you into the reality of the situation. (And it just got darker from there)

I didn't think it romanticized the situation at all though. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

 I would love for Hanna, Spencer, and Caleb to return to their former awesome selves. Those three were long my favorites and I loved the relationships between them. Hanna and Spencer were frrequently my favorite Liars both together and interdependently.  I really liked Haleb and Caleb was by far the best boyfriend on the show.  And I loved Spencer and Caleb as friends.  I liked them together romantically too, but I wasn't looking for that pairing to happen (granted, I'm not a particularly avid shipper).

ITA - I need the writer to find a reset button so that the three of them and each of their relationships can go back to being awesome. I'd be willing to settle for the three of them having a brief conversation where they say, "Look, guys, this was a complicated and confusing situation for all of us. We all love each other and don't want to hurt each other so let's just be honest about how we feel and move forward from there." <cue threesome - just kidding!>  If they can all acknowledge that they've behaved questionably but want to fix things, then I'd be fine with them going back to their awesome selves.

Quote

If only the girls were smart enough to, you know, call Jason to check if Rollins really got his approval for not allowing anyone to visit Alison. But no, they had to look for help from Mary who they think is up to no good.

As soon as Elliot said that Jason had approved of his idea not to let anyone see Alison, I expected Spencer to whip out her phone and call the guy who is both her brother and Ali's brother and ask if he had even spoken to Wrollins. I seriously doubt that he would approve of a plan like this, especially considering that Ali said Jason didn't approve of her relationship with Wrollins in the first place because he was Charlotte's doctor (am I just making this up? I swear this came up in 6B).

I wasn't really a Buffy/Angel shipper but at the same time, the difference in age wasn't a huge issue for me either. So yeah, maybe if I were 12 I would find Ezra/Aria acceptable (even though I can't imagine myself at that age ever thinking that dating your teacher was hot). For me, the problem with Aria and Erza was so many things beginning with the age difference and then continuing into everything else so when it turned out he had sought a high school student to get material about a missing girl so he could write a book and then continued to stalk her and make her go buy chickpeas, I was like nope, there is no redeeming this character EVER.

As for Aria justifying their whole relationship by saying it made her into who she is today, maybe she would have been an even better version of herself if she hadn't wasted so much time angsting over their secret relationship. Or hey, maybe being stalked by A is what really made her into the person she is today so she should be thanking Mona and Charlotte.

Quote

Hanna:  Can I borrow your pen?
Lucas:  Why?
Hanna:  To sign these papers
Lucas:  Oh, these documents can't be signed in ink. [hands her a knife and a quill, O! Fortuna plays in the background while lightning crashes outside the window].

Haha, that's perfect! To be honest, while I think that Lucas does like Hanna, I still don't trust him. I wish that Hanna had at least had someone, ANYONE, look through that contract before she signed it. You know there's some clause in there that says she has to marry him in six months or some other insane shit.

I think it's flattering whenever someone says they believe in you and they want to support your dream so part of me thinks that this opportunity could be really good for her career and her self-esteem. But it's Lucas, who has always been obsessed with Hanna, so I'm convinced that no good will come of this.

Quote

Right, I remember the creepy nature of the book being brought up before on here (or maybe it was all the way back on Television Without Pity).  I never even heard of the book before it came up on the show so I just had one quick question.  Is the creepiness of the relationship considered the main point of the relationship in the book or at least is that the widely held interpretation?  I am just asking because I know there are books like Phantom of the Opera were some people think of it as this epic romance, but anyone with a degree in English considers the book a trashy romance novel, just a really old one.  If its more like Phantom then who knows how the writers want the reference to be looked at.

I don't know anyone who has read Lolita and thought it was romantic. It was creepy as hell the way the main character married a woman he didn't even like just so he could be near her daughter. Then he took advantage of the situation when Lolita's mother died (she found his diary and learned that he was obsessed with her daughter, confronted him about it, but was hit by a car before she could tell anyone else), telling Lolita that her mother was in the hospital (when she was actually dead) and then roofies her so he can rape her. They drive around the country and he keep her from running away or telling the police that they have been having sex by saying that she will become a ward of the state and be poor. Sometimes he bribes her with food or money. And before all this happens, he talks about how he would go to the park and pretend to read so he could watch young girls, hired young looking prostitutes, and made plans to molest a different 12 year old girl so he makes it pretty clear that he has a type and that he's predatory so I would shudder to think that anyone would view this book as a romance.

Edited June 30, 2016 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Lii]

You know, my dad was 14 years older than my mom and her high school teacher and while that inappropriate power dynamic most certainly did make her into what she is today, it wasn't in a good way nor did it end well for any of us. Fuck off, Aria. Be happy it ended where it did, in the age of readily available birth control. I hate that relationship on such a visceral level, you have no idea. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Lii, I am so sorry. That is one of the many reasons that I HATE the show romanticizing a relationship that has so many age/power issues. The last thing we need is for anyone watching the show to think that having sex with your teacher is dreamy or romantic or even acceptable. There's a reason that the statutory laws exist (and a reason that many states include a clause that says if the younger person is under 18 and the older person is in a position of authority, like, say, A TEACHER, it's still considered statutory rape even if the younger person is of the legal age of consent).

[Lii]

@ElectricBoogaloo Yeah, the grossest part is that at the time it wasn't all that weird of a thing, and he had a happy and successful high school teaching career for like thirty years after, at the same school. Anyways, point being, 40ish years later and Twitter still ships it, yay progress. I guess at least criminal law no longer ships it, so, maybe we won there, somehow? I feel like it would be really nice if TV maybe either stopped with the questionable consent stuff in general or took responsibility for following through on these kinds of stories by showing the consequences. Looking at you, Grimm. 

[ottoDbusdriver]

And that's it -- Hanna is back and that's it.  At least they found her some pants.

And after all the "excitement" of the 24 hour search for Hanna, this episode is duller than dirt. 

Caleb says Hanna is like an aircraft carrier -- is that a hefty Hanna reference ?

Hanna freaks out like the construction workers tore down the place where she met her fiancee (whose name I can't remember) just to spite Hanna.  Ummm, no.

Edited June 30, 2016 by ottoDbusdriver

[Mabinogia]

11 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

As for Aria justifying their whole relationship by saying it made her into who she is today, maybe she would have been an even better version of herself if she hadn't wasted so much time angsting over their secret relationship. Or hey, maybe being stalked by A is what really made her into the person she is today so she should be thanking Mona and Charlotte.

Seriously, she could have spent high school going on double dates with her friends, not having to hide who she is dating from everyone. She could have tried dating more, met different types of guys learned different sides of herself from each. And yes, it's not dating her teacher that made her who she is, it's speding her formative years being stalked and not knowing why, almost killed, etc. So thank you Mona, thank you Charlotte. They deserve just as much, if not more credit than Ezra.

[mac123x]

2 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

And yes, it's not dating her teacher that made her who she is, it's speding her formative years being stalked and not knowing why, almost killed, etc. So thank you Mona, thank you Charlotte. They deserve just as much, if not more credit than Ezra.

I could buy this story line if it were coming just from Aria, since she's the victim of his abuse and might still be in denial, but it's baffling that none of her friends really protest against Ezra's inclusion.  After they found out that he was writing a book, was spying on her, and knew she was a teenager and intentionally seduced her to get close to them all, they should have shunned him, permanently. 

 

We've had a few instances of it, like last season when Aria said, "that was back in high school" and Emily retorted "not for him" but generally they just accept that Ezra is part of the group. 

 

They sort of dealt with the "older man hitting on a high school girl is inappropriate, and here are some of the realistic consequences" when they did the two-episode arc of Zach hitting on Hanna.  I used to think that was the writers saying "yeah, our other adult/teen relationships on this show are pretty gross too" but apparently the target audience (and the marketing department) didn't get the message.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Ask The Incredibly Evil Doctor Who Is Ruining Everything On Pretty Little Liars

Pretty sure it’s not cool to treat your wife’s mental illness, but okay.

[dmc]

On 6/29/2016 at 0:18 AM, WhosThatGirl said:

Well, the girls didn't really serve her up. Caleb did. He took the red jacket in that quick second. I'm sure everyone else was going to debate over it, but Caleb took it and Spencer's phone and didn't inform the others. 

Eh. This show is..kind of bugging me. As I said, I hate.. everyone on it, pretty much now. I'm only watching because I'm pretty sure if this isn't the last season, then it's probably the last season with the main cast members because I think they are over it as well and ready to move on and I won't be watching with a new set. 

I mean, as per the breakups, Caleb is looking like a jerk I agree, but honestly, no one has looked good to me because of that relationship. They managed to ruin all three, Spencer, Hanna, and Caleb. To me anyway. 

I completely agree. This relationship is making all three look bad

[mac123x]

From the cAbernet and A podcast (they really don't like Ezria):

 

Sue:  The only people I want together are Aria and Ezra, to be honest, just because they deserve each other.

Kelly:  I just kinda what them both to be killed in a mudslide or something.

I blurt laughed.

[mercfan3]

aww, see I think Aria is awesome when she doesn't have Ezra around. 

[WhosThatGirl]

17 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Seriously, she could have spent high school going on double dates with her friends, not having to hide who she is dating from everyone. She could have tried dating more, met different types of guys learned different sides of herself from each. And yes, it's not dating her teacher that made her who she is, it's speding her formative years being stalked and not knowing why, almost killed, etc. So thank you Mona, thank you Charlotte. They deserve just as much, if not more credit than Ezra.

This! Most of her time with Ezra was spent in his apartment.. watching movies. And sadly, the times she was with Ezra I think stunted her a bit too. Supposedly, Ezra liked Aria because she was so mature and insightful for her age or whatever-ugh, to all that, it's gross but whatever- but to me, the more time she spent with Ezra, isolated from her peers to me caused her to believe she was better than them. I remember a scene at a party where Hanna called her out on this and how Aria probably felt like things like this probably felt like baby-sitting and while Aria said no, I'm sure she believed that. And let's not forget her essay to college, there was so much truth in that. Aria can play it off as being a good writer, but she pretty much stated everything you just wrote: she could have been going out on dates with her friends, and experiencing more. And I agree, being stalked changed her more, not sitting around in an apartment watching movies and taking paper bag pictures with her teacher boyfriend did this. 

I enjoyed Aria when she dated other guys, but yes, when the show starts pairing her romantically with Ezra, it makes me hate her. And she can't focus on anything but Ezra. I think this is telling from the show. When Aria was dating Jake, she was still able to deal with A craziness, in fact that season brought her in more, she tracked down Cece's old roommate when she was supposed to be watching Jake boxing or something, but now that she's romantically paired with Ezra again, she can't focus on the mystery. Last episode, she barley handled sitting in a bar for longer than 5 minutes because the song that played when she first "met" Ezra was playing and she had to find him. And this episode, she wasn't thinking about AD or whatever at all, it was all about breaking up with Liam so she could be with Ezra again. I feel like whenever she is with Ezra, she is hardly in the mystery. Sometimes A will dangle the carrot of people finding out about her and Ezra, but that ship sailed quite some time ago with that being a threat. Hell, where was A during the Santa boxer's picture? I know A took a holiday but still.. 

[Lii]

Remember that time when Piper from Charmed was all like Ezra Daughterfucking Fitz,  I will WRECK you, and then karma punished her for her sins by sending her offscreen,  never to be seen again except that one time when she needed to get locked in a basement? Good times. 

[WhosThatGirl]

6 hours ago, Lii said:

Remember that time when Piper from Charmed was all like Ezra Daughterfucking Fitz,  I will WRECK you, and then karma punished her for her sins by sending her offscreen,  never to be seen again except that one time when she needed to get locked in a basement? Good times. 

Eh, but then also Piper did come aboard the Ezra train. I seem to recall during the start of the girls senior year, she was going to dinner with Ezra and Aria. Ugh. And I know we all have issues with Bryon, but damn, I cheer everytime he has to deal with Ezra. You can tell him he wants to hit him. And I'm always like just DO IT BRYON!

[Lii]

I forget, did Ezra attend their remarriage? Because it seems like the kind of thing the show would just do. 

Remember when Ezra quit his job because Ezria? Except then Byron hooked him up with a job at Hollis, like as a thanks for always banging my daughter / in lieu of babysitting money gift? That was a thing on the show and not just in my head, right? 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

IIRC Ezra didn't attend the wedding but he showed up afterward and then he and Aria sat in the yard. I think they had a fight earlier that day. Was that right after they accused him of maybe killing Charlotte and he yelled at them? I can't remember all the dramatic disagreements Aria and Ezra have had anymore.

[WhosThatGirl]

4 hours ago, Lii said:

I forget, did Ezra attend their remarriage? Because it seems like the kind of thing the show would just do. 

Remember when Ezra quit his job because Ezria? Except then Byron hooked him up with a job at Hollis, like as a thanks for always banging my daughter / in lieu of babysitting money gift? That was a thing on the show and not just in my head, right? 

Actually Bryon got him a job at Hollis before he found out about him and Aria and then after he found out he tried to get him a job in another state for a charter school, he did help Ezra get a job back at the high school but only because Aria and Ezra were breaking up because of Ezra's not child anyway and Aria pretty much told Ezra I can't be a step parent. And that's when she started to date Jake. Then things sort of get confusing because obviously Ezra and Aria got back together and neither Ella nor Bryon batted an eye even though when Bryon got him the job at the high school again he was all, "if he's your teacher again you can't date" so whatever. Im pretty sure Bryon still hates him.

Edited July 2, 2016 by WhosThatGirl

[SadieT]

Aria’s parents not reporting Ezra for the statutory rape of their daughter and then just sort of throwing their hands up and begrudgingly accepting him as Aria’s boyfriend is honestly the craziest thing this show has ever done. And this is a show where people occasionally rise from the dead and regularly wear incredibly lifelike masks of other peoples’ faces. 

[Lii]

13 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Actually Bryon got him a job at Hollis before he found out about him and Aria and then after he found out he tried to get him a job in another state for a charter school, he did help Ezra get a job back at the high school but only because Aria and Ezra were breaking up because of Ezra's not child anyway and Aria pretty much told Ezra I can't be a step parent. And that's when she started to date Jake. Then things sort of get confusing because obviously Ezra and Aria got back together and neither Ella nor Bryon batted an eye even though when Bryon got him the job at the high school again he was all, "if he's your teacher again you can't date" so whatever. Im pretty sure Bryon still hates him.

For a guy who hates Ezra he certainly has hooked him up with quite a few jobs, though. Even before the show threw up its hands about the whole thing. 

Is it okay to feel bad for Byron in all of this?  He tried hard to make Ezria go away. Ella did too, but Byron punched Ezra that one time, so... I mean I know he's a cheating creeper in his own right, but he's a cheating creeper against Ezria, so, props, bro. 

[WhosThatGirl]

56 minutes ago, Lii said:

For a guy who hates Ezra he certainly has hooked him up with quite a few jobs, though. Even before the show threw up its hands about the whole thing. 

Is it okay to feel bad for Byron in all of this?  He tried hard to make Ezria go away. Ella did too, but Byron punched Ezra that one time, so... I mean I know he's a cheating creeper in his own right, but he's a cheating creeper against Ezria, so, props, bro. 

I always like Bryon a little bit more for his Ezra hate. What makes me mad is that Ella was so against Ezra and Aria too, in fact, I assumed the show was going to do a bait and switch with Bryon finally being the one to come around because of his past infidelity but no Ella did and I'm always like, "ELLA, NO!", like to the fact where the show always made sort of aw shucks moments to Bryon's discomfort like, Ezra was always like, "I have to drop you a block away even though your dad knows about us but is so uncomfortable and so I can't walk you to your dad" or Ella and Aria would make fun of the face he made when talking about Ezra. Like..really? How should Bryon react? 

[Lii]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I always like Bryon a little bit more for his Ezra hate. What makes me mad is that Ella was so against Ezra and Aria too, in fact, I assumed the show was going to do a bait and switch with Bryon finally being the one to come around because of his past infidelity but no Ella did and I'm always like, "ELLA, NO!", like to the fact where the show always made sort of aw shucks moments to Bryon's discomfort like, Ezra was always like, "I have to drop you a block away even though your dad knows about us but is so uncomfortable and so I can't walk you to your dad" or Ella and Aria would make fun of the face he made when talking about Ezra. Like..really? How should Bryon react? 

I KNOW, RIGHT?  In the books, Ezra is a disgusting predatory creeper who gets ran out of town on a rail for it with his career in shambles pretty early on. DAMMIT MARLENE. 

[WhosThatGirl]

2 hours ago, Lii said:

I KNOW, RIGHT?  In the books, Ezra is a disgusting predatory creeper who gets ran out of town on a rail for it with his career in shambles pretty early on. DAMMIT MARLENE. 

The books had it right with Ezra. Sometimes I do wish the books perspective on certain aspects- also from my memory,

Spoiler

didn't Ezra also hook up with an exchange student as well as Aria?

{I spoiled that for people who haven't read the books}, also the books had more Noel Kahn. AND I ALWAYS NEED MORE NOEL KAHN. And I'm just going to say it, IH doesn't do anything for me on the front of where I see him as leading man potential. The only time I enjoyed his acting on this show was when he was EzrA. That was beyond fun to watch and I think he enjoyed that more than what he normally does. Like this episode, his big scene where Liam said, "so..you were Aria's teacher and you were dating her, your a creepy creeper creep, aren't you?" and Ezra was like.. "what...are you talking about?  No, no" and stuttering like an idiot. Like.. no, thanks. I do not want. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

The books had it right with Ezra. Sometimes I do wish the books perspective on certain aspects- also from my memory,

didn't Ezra also hook up with an exchange student as well as Aria?

I think that Noel Kahn was the one who

hooked up with an exchange student in the books. Wasn't that when Aria got super jealous and Noel said there was nothing going on and then later the exchange student flat out told Aria she was going to steal Noel Kahn from her?

[WhosThatGirl]

8 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 

 

I think that Noel Kahn was the one who

  Hide contents

hooked up with an exchange student in the books. Wasn't that when Aria got super jealous and Noel said there was nothing going on and then later the exchange student flat out told Aria she was going to steal Noel Kahn from her?

Part of that rings a bell but

Spoiler

I remember a scene where Aria got back with Ezra again and then when she walked out of some coffee shop, I swear Ezra was making out with the exchange student. I think the exchange student was also flirting with Ezra too and talking about how much Ezra's book meant to her. I also think after that, Noel and Aria got together again.

I haven't read the books in quite a while but certain things stand out. Like how Ezra really is creepy creepster as he should be and Noel is actually not. The show got that wrong..for reasons. I've never thought a teacher-relationship was hot- even in my teen years, don't get me wrong, I liked Buffy/Angel but that felt different somehow, I can't explain it. And in Dawsons Creek, I always remember the teacher and Pacey's relationship being wrong too and not hot at all. Certain aspects of the show work better, in the books the girls still, at least to me, seem far apart once they reunite, on the show they have a better bond. In the books it all reads different. Same with Hanna and Ashley's relationship. 

Edited July 3, 2016 by WhosThatGirl

[mac123x]

On 7/2/2016 at 0:32 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

IIRC Ezra didn't attend the wedding but he showed up afterward and then he and Aria sat in the yard. I think they had a fight earlier that day. Was that right after they accused him of maybe killing Charlotte and he yelled at them? I can't remember all the dramatic disagreements Aria and Ezra have had anymore.

That was Liam.

23 hours ago, Lii said:

Byron punched Ezra that one time, so...

That was Magic Mike, though he did it because he could tell Byron was about to punch Ezra and Mike didn't want Byron to get arrested.

[WhosThatGirl]

The thing is, with Liam and Ezra's confrontation, it all fell flat. The show wants us to think Liam is a jealous jackass who is now realizing Aria and Ezra were a couple while Aria was his student and now seem to be rekindling their romance, which is why Aria dumped him and now he is transferring his feelings onto the book, but, the things he is saying aren't wrong. It's the same way I felt when Bryon confronted Ezra in his apartment and said that even if Ezra was a person Aria leaned on when her family was going through problems, the relationship was wrong because Aria was 16 and Ezra's student. The fact that the show tried to make it a "parents just don't understand" moment fell flat to me. Just like Liam being jealous falls flat here. And Aria's speech falls on empty ears too. I still stand by that while Aria dated Ezra, she didn't grow or change because I think dating her teacher gave her a sense of entitlement that she was above dating high-schoolers and all that nonsense that comes with being 16 and thinking you know all there is to know about everything. I was there too at one point in high-school but then you hang out with people your own age and you become humbled. I don't think Aria ever got that chance with Ezra because she didn't have to. Whatever. I just.. the show tries and fails with this couple, almost every time. 

I still wish EzrA had been a thing. I do wonder if it was ever going to be a real thing but then reveal episode happened and Marlene got all nervous because..shippers. I still think TobyIsA was actually real for a second but then the reveal happened and they changed it. Because otherwise why was KA doing those odd things where he would stare menacing glares at the camera to us behind the liar's backs? But otherwise that's the only time Ezra was fun to me. Now he just sits around and writes a book with Aria that was about his dead girlfriend but is clearly now about Aria. 

[fitzcarraldo]

Ezra being above their mystery for so long, when he later was revealed to know about it the entire time, is too much for me. It makes Aria very unlikeable that Ezria is all that matters. Spencer and the others are threatened with lives of their loved ones but the Ezria drama never even goes there. It could have been good if they kept up the thread that A/Mona had something to fear from him because he was a fellow threat. Why doesnt Liam learn of his Alison book? It got turned in, right? Maybe he has friends in that publishing house and Ezras true grossness could all come out. I wish!

[Lii]

In the books, the girls are all kind of awful people, to differing extents. In fact, I might be remembering wrong, but I think Aria is actually the least offensive of them, in terms of shitty personalities and continually poor decision-making. The show really did make the girls way more palatable as main characters. I do wish some of the side characters and love interests from the books had been brought in and developed, though. Only some. Like a lot of the Hanna and Aria stuff, and ZERO of the Emily stuff. It's been years since I read them, though, and I don't remember a lot other than Hanna chapters being just like every other word some brand name of the clothing she was wearing, and Emily being the WORST. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Ha, it just goes to show how much interest and attention span for this show have waned since I can't even remember it was Liam, not Ezra, who showed up at the wedding!

I don't remember everything from the books but I think you are correct that Aria was one of the less annoying characters in the book. What I mostly remember about her from the books was her blatant stupidity when

she was on the lam in Europe but didn't think to change her hair, use a fake name when checking into a hotel, or even wear a hat or sunglasses out in public. That's just Fugitive 101!

4 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

The thing is, with Liam and Ezra's confrontation, it all fell flat. The show wants us to think Liam is a jealous jackass who is now realizing Aria and Ezra were a couple while Aria was his student and now seem to be rekindling their romance, which is why Aria dumped him and now he is transferring his feelings onto the book, but, the things he is saying aren't wrong. It's the same way I felt when Bryon confronted Ezra in his apartment and said that even if Ezra was a person Aria leaned on when her family was going through problems, the relationship was wrong because Aria was 16 and Ezra's student. The fact that the show tried to make it a "parents just don't understand" moment fell flat to me. Just like Liam being jealous falls flat here. And Aria's speech falls on empty ears too. I still stand by that while Aria dated Ezra, she didn't grow or change because I think dating her teacher gave her a sense of entitlement that she was above dating high-schoolers and all that nonsense that comes with being 16 and thinking you know all there is to know about everything. I was there too at one point in high-school but then you hang out with people your own age and you become humbled. I don't think Aria ever got that chance with Ezra because she didn't have to. Whatever. I just.. the show tries and fails with this couple, almost every time. 

I still wish EzrA had been a thing. I do wonder if it was ever going to be a real thing but then reveal episode happened and Marlene got all nervous because..shippers. I still think TobyIsA was actually real for a second but then the reveal happened and they changed it. Because otherwise why was KA doing those odd things where he would stare menacing glares at the camera to us behind the liar's backs? But otherwise that's the only time Ezra was fun to me. Now he just sits around and writes a book with Aria that was about his dead girlfriend but is clearly now about Aria. 

Yes to all of this! I hate how they're framing Liam's truth telling as jealous ex-boyfriend trying to get under Ezra's skin. Right now he is the only one who sees Aria and Ezra's relationship for what it was - creepy, predatory, inappropriate, and gross. Just imagine what Liam would have to say if he knew about all the spy cams and hoodies and chickpeas.

[WhosThatGirl]

At times, I think the show wants us to forget that Ezra was stalking the girls at one point. The last time I remember hearing anything referenced to it was 5A and by the end of 5A, Ezra was having Thanksgiving dinner with Aria and family. 

[Lady Calypso]

Yeah, the Ezra stuff really annoys me. They never got to follow through and stick with Byron and Ella's dislike toward Ezra. Then again, they're barely on the show as it is. The one thing that I do like about Mike when it comes to Ezra is that even though he hasn't outright hated Ezra, he is less on Team Ezra and more on Team Aria. Plus, he's never actually gotten buddy-buddy with Ezra and has just treated him civilly, at best. 

Now, though, I'm on Team Liam because he's Team Anti Ezra. I don't know if it'll stick, but for now, I will take what I can get. Whoever isn't buddy-buddy with Ezra is alright in my book.

[mercfan3]

I still think the show has been trying to tell it's viewers for years that Ezra is awful, but always has a fallback in case it doesn't work. And it never does and the shippers are too important to the show for the writers to break them up for good. 

Edited July 4, 2016 by mercfan3

[CraftyHazel]

Ezria is just plain gross.  Marlene pandering to shippers is every bit as gross.  She doesn't mind writing repetitive drivel, storylines that make no sense, secret twins, transgender cousin/siblings, incest, sexual predator/English teacher/pseudo-A/crap authors, and so on, possibly pissing off 90% of the population at one time or another, but she won't break up the one couple above all that deserves to be broken up, because the shippers might cry.  And this comes from a woman who admittedly has a Hanna/Caleb avi and fervently wishes they'd never broken up.  

[Mabinogia]

Marlene really is just writing her own fanfic at this point, isn't she? I mean, nothing they are writing anymore makes any bit of sense. It's just pandering to whatever her current whim is, like a fanfic writer. That or she is pulling off the biggest punking in media since Orson Wells convinced half the country that Martians had invaded New Jersey. Ezzzria's got to be a joke, right? This show, the whole thing, has got to be a joke, right?

Marlene really is just writing her own fanfic at this point, isn't she? I mean, nothing they are writing anymore makes any bit of sense. It's just pandering to whatever her current whim is, like a fanfic writer. That or she is pulling off the biggest punking in media since Orson Wells convinced half the country that Martians had invaded New Jersey. Ezzzria's got to be a joke, right? This show, the whole thing, has got to be a joke, right?

[Chairperson Meow]

I finally got to watch the episode.   A few thoughts :

-  The actress playing Mary Drake/Jessica D looks really pretty as Mary Drake.  I don't know.   It's a very low key goth soccer mom glam Rosewood look that works.   I like it.  Or I'm still a bit buzzed.

-  I still think this story would be a million times better with Wren in place of NotWren.  Spencer would be flirting with him now to get answers or whatever, Haleb would be back, Wren is way easier to look at, and the actor can actually act.  Also, it would've made sense.  I dgaf about this bland bowl of tapioca pudding.  

- Where is Jason?  No one has heard from him in forever, but they take a jar of mayo's word for his opinion?  I need Jason back.   Gah.   

-  Poor Sasha.  She just gets the worst wardrobe.   The same yellow top, then mom sweaters, now a sweaty hospital gown.   

-  And in conclusion,  Liam, you da real MVP.   Not since Andrew got drunk and yelled at all of them has the truth been told so epically.   So, clearly he will be sacrificed at the altar of Ezria.   

[Cornhusker12]

I feel like there needs to be a running chronological list of all of Mr. Fitz's (I feel like calling him Ezra just makes him seem like a natural part of the group so I call him by his official teacher name to remind everyone he's a freak) gross history because it has all been shoved under the rug. I can't seem to keep it all straight anymore haha.

1. Heard about Alison's disappearance
2. Decided to write a book about her
3. Stalked her friends to try to get more intel
4. Seduced one of them to get deeper into their world, again seemingly for intel for his book
5. Became their teacher
6. Became Aria's boyfriend
etc.
etc.
etc.........

[fitzcarraldo]

7. Did nothing to help teen girls terrorized by two stalkers.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

8. While stalking them himself

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 hours ago, huskerj12 said:

I feel like there needs to be a running chronological list of all of Mr. Fitz's (I feel like calling him Ezra just makes him seem like a natural part of the group so I call him by his official teacher name to remind everyone he's a freak) gross history because it has all been shoved under the rug. I can't seem to keep it all straight anymore haha.

For the record, I, too, prefer calling him Mr. Fitz in my head because it reminds me that (1) he shortened his last name because he was annoyed with his parents (2) he was their teacher for two years and never should have been part of their peer group.

It totally cracked me up last season when Hanna started referring to the PLL's parents by their first names and Emily was totally horrified because I was taught to call my friends' parents Mr. and Mrs. Lastname, but also because to me it pointed out that they have been calling Mr. Fitz "Ezra" for YEARS now. I actually loved in the early seasons when the girls had discussions and Aria kept saying "Ezra" but everyone else kept saying "Mr. Fitz" because it showed that hello, he's your teacher!

But the shallow reason that I end up referring to him as Ezra on the forum is that following the rules about making a name that ends in a Z or an S possessive always makes me feel conflicted. I know that for a one syllable name like Fitz or Chris, you have the option of just adding an apostrophe (Chris' dad) or an apostrophe with an S (Chris's dad) but I hate both so I resort to Ezra so that I can just say "Ezra's creepy premeditated inappropriate illegal relationship."

[Mabinogia]

On Tuesday, July 05, 2016 at 8:32 PM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I actually loved in the early seasons when the girls had discussions and Aria kept saying "Ezra" but everyone else kept saying "Mr. Fitz" because it showed that hello, he's your teacher!

I really miss that. And the look on Aria's face when they would. Like, why are you calling my boyfriend Mr...oh, right, he's our teacher. I kept waiting for her to call him Ezra in class.

And I'd forgotten what a tool he was that he couldn't deal with being Mr. Fitzgerald so he shortened his name because, well, he's a tool.

I think, since they clearly have no plan anyway, that TIIC should hold a contests, poll us all on who A should be, and whoever the popular choice is, that is who they should make A. I mean, they pretty much just shoot darts at a list of names now anyway so why not let us decide. I'd be curious who wins.

[Jack Shaftoe]

Quote

I kept waiting for her to call him Ezra in class.

She did - in 1.18 when they were discussing a play that was going to be staged at the school. And of course, Aria being Aria thought no one had noticed.

[mac123x]

Finally finished the Bro's podcast.  They brought up a point but didn't discuss it much:  what was Wrollins intending to do with Ali when he was driving her through the dark Pennsylvania night?  I'm guessing he was going to fake a suicide-by-drowning then change his identity and get the hell out of dodge.  Any competent police force (so not Tanner nor the Rosewood PD) would wonder how the hell she got out of Wilby and drove to that lake.

 

Also, if the PLLs are going to cover this up, what are they going to do with Lucas's car?  Park it in his garage and hope he never notices the shattered windshield and Wrollins-shaped dent in the hood?  Maybe they'll get it repaired by Patty at the asks-no-questions body shop where Emily found the whistle-tipped truck.

[insubordination]

On 30/6/2016 at 11:05 AM, Lii said:

You know, my dad was 14 years older than my mom and her high school teacher and while that inappropriate power dynamic most certainly did make her into what she is today, it wasn't in a good way nor did it end well for any of us. Fuck off, Aria. Be happy it ended where it did, in the age of readily available birth control. I hate that relationship on such a visceral level, you have no idea. 

A bit late on this, but me too. My father was my mother's high school mathematics teacher. He kindly 'waited' for three years until she was 17 and finished high school and got permission to marry her.   It did not turn out well for her/them.  That's also why I don't find Ezria anything other that stomach-churning.