S02.E05: Bodies of Water

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

In the present, Cassie and Jennifer Goines run from the 12 Monkeys; in 2044, Cole and Ramse face off against Deacon.

 

Promo:

 

Edited May 10, 2016 by ElectricBoogaloo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Clips:

 

Edited May 17, 2016 by ElectricBoogaloo

[kat165]

I liked this ep a lot. I particularly enjoyed the developing friendship between Cassie & Jennifer.

Also liked how Cole picked up that bottle of whiskey to bring back to 2044 at the end.

Curious to see what if anything Jennifer does about her own death date.

Next wk looks comedic as they'll be in 1975 & the clip we're shown looks like they're going to be riffing off 70's cops shows - always good for a laugh.

[bethy]

Hmm. I might kind of love Deacon all, sure you tried to kill me, but we're cool. I really liked Ramse's and Cole's reaction to Deacon's saying the knife was his brother's. You could see that hit Ramse, especially. Plus, I always love protective-Ramse and that was out in force when Deacon moved toward Cole in the planning room. 

Also enjoyed the tentative friendship developing between Cassie and Jennifer. It's interesting that they're using that relationship to start the thaw in Cassie rather than her relationship with Cole. I like it. Though I'm somewhat worried about what the significance of full immersion is for Cassie. 

Is Aaron actually the witness, I wonder.

I continue to dig Michael Hogan.

[Bort]

I liked how we saw that Olivia didn't actually LIKE her job, she just wanted to kill Cassie and be done with it. 

But I really like that Jennifer took her out. I'd had about enough of her monotonous Red Forest acid trips.

[kat165]

I don't think Aaron is the Witness. I think that hallucination just played with her head.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

• So... is The Witness who your mind's eye shows you while hopped on the red-leaf-tea (ie, Aaron to Cassie) or is Aaron THE {ETC} Witness?
• Olivia deserved that stabbing, for not disarming Jennifer before getting in close to her.  Pallid Man is running the show (sorry, cycle) now.
• Jennifer being crazy is genetic, but got the added bonus of being a Primary special out of it.
• Wonder if Cassie & Jennifer will stay "besties" from here (2016) to 2044.
• Somehow, I don't quite believe how 'chill' Deacon is with getting all beat and cut up.  I see problems down the road.
• I'm really starting to think that Cassie and Deacon are not in a 'relationship'.  It looks that way from outside glimpses, but I think we'll find out he's just nice, respectful, and cares for her because of the meds and trained her for the 'new' world.

Did have to smirk a bit at the little dick-measuring-contest when Cole said something as Cassie was getting ready to be sent to 2016, then Deacon stepped forward to add his own, and Cole came forward ahead of him again to have the last word(s) - & then Jones had to tell them to step back from the machine.  lol

Edited May 17, 2016 by iRarelyWatchTV36

[kat165]

Are the Witness and the Messenger the same entity?

iRarely, I agree with most of your post, especially about Deacon and Cassie's relationship. I've never gotten romantic vibes from them, but friendship and respect. Or about Deacon being ok now with Cole & Ramse. He's not; watch your backs, guys.

hehe, that dick measuring was hilarious. Lots of good scenes in this ep.

[thuganomics85]

Cassie and Jennifer!  I probably could have watch an entire episode of them just driving to the family house.  Those two together never fail to entertain me.  I feel like I say this with almost all of the cast, but I really love how Amanda Schull and Emily Hampshire play off one another.  Looking forward to seeing where their relationship goes next.  Will they slowly becoming friendlier, or will they end up being at odds, again?

Olivia really should have known better then to let Jennifer get anywhere close to her with that knife.  Of all the people on this show, Jennifer is the one you can never predict, and I know Olivia thinks highly of herself, but she really should have known that talking her way out of this one wouldn't be easy.  Too bad it's probably going to be a short lived victory for Jennifer, Cassie, etc., because now The Witness is going to let the Pallid Man run the show.  Tom Noonan continues to creep me the fuck out on this show.

I know Deacon is a complete and utter asshole, but I felt slightly bad when Cole and Ramse crossed him.  And then laughed when he somehow managed to survive and stroll back in.  I do think he is being somewhat sincere in that he doesn't take it personally, but I wouldn't be surprised if he tries to extract some kind of revenge on the guys later on.  But he seems like someone who will wait for the best opportunity.  For now, Deacon needs them.

Michael Hogan's character seems to be slowly getting Jones to warm up to him.

Judging from that map Jennifer found, looks like she will die sometime in September 2044.  Uh oh!

Cassie seeing a vision of Aaron as the Witness was unexpected.  Don't think he's actually the Witness, but maybe each person sees the Witness as a different person from their life or something.

Liked seeing more of Cole/Ramse's bickering friendship again, like Cole bitching about how he can feel Ramse breathing on his neck.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

Found it a bit interesting that 'These Arms of Mine' was highlighted in large letters on that "Wisdom of the Witness" map thingy.  Hasn't it been figured out that TAoM is the 'relationship theme' of Cassie/Cole from S1?

 

Wonder what day it is in 2044 now.  When Cassie came back the first time, she said it was August 2nd.  I see our intrepid travelers changing the course of the 'will of the Witness' again and preventing 2044!Jennifer's death on that date... or at least I hope so, I am so not ready to lose EH's portrayal of Jennifer - either century's version of her - before next season, certainly.

Edited May 17, 2016 by iRarelyWatchTV36

[snarktini]

They're headed to 1975? The origins of the TAB can!

Deacon walking back in was epic. I totally wanted him gone, but now maybe not.

Loving Michael Hogan.

That's all I got right now.

[solea]

Deacon is like a cockroach. Can't be killed. Which I'm cool with as Todd Stashwick makes any show better. Even the already really, really good shows. ;)

[justmehere]

Loved Jennifer's "Mary Tyler Moore Show " montage (a la Joan Jett), and then the fact that she played the song over the speakers, suggesting that it's her own choice of theme song -- not just a production thing. My heart really went out to her, trying so hard to keep sane with her meds but unable to stop the visions of her mother.

Also loved her movie quote of the week: "Human sacrifice, dogs and cats, living together, it's mass hysteria" (Ghostbusters)

Like others, I greatly enjoyed the partnership and bonding between Jennifer and Cassie. -- I hope that Jennifer's death is somehow averted in 2044.

Seeing Aaron as the possible witness flipped me out. Whether he actually is or not, where/when is the witness, is he a primary too, and does he foresee all the time shifts and changes or is he actually a crappy witness?

Liked the meta comment from the tall/pallid man about the difficulty in keeping track of all the time changes but it being rewarding when you do. --Somehow it's scarier that he's in charge now, but Olivia isn't dead yet. Both creep me right out.

Great episode; it flew by.

[AudienceofOne]

That episode was actually kind of awesome. I had to jump online to try to find the writer because it was so much better than other episodes of this show. Apparently it was Kristen Reidel who did a lot of writing for Nikita.

The "hey, it's Time Jesus" comment was gold. And it wasn't the only one-liner in this that I loved.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Poor Jennifer. Almost being drowned by your own mother sucks, even if you aren't already having visions of creepy stuff. I already felt sorry for her before that. She was on meds and seemed to be adjusting to normal life when Cassie popped up and wanted the crazy version of her to find more primaries. 

Deacon walking back in all beat up and covered in blood earned a daaaaaamn from me. 

Woooooo for Jennifer stabbing Olivia. That's what you get for letting Jennifer within arm's length when she has a weapon. I guess the flip side is that now the Pallid Man is in charge and that might be event worse. 

Loved that Cole's reaction to seeing Jennifer in 2044 was to jokingly say, "You don't call, you don't write." Also cute to see that Jennifer's reaction was her old crazy laugh. It also cracks me up whenever Jennifer pulls an 80s movie reference on 2044 people and they have absolutely no reaction (aside from a mild WTF look on their faces).

It was kind of sad so see that medicated Jennifer in 2016 was hanging around the Emerson in the hopes of seeing him again. And she was so focused on Cole that she completely missed that Don liked her!

[bethy]

I agree that Deacon should not be trusted and won't be at all surprised if he betrays Cole and Ramse later on. But I do think his "Respect" was genuine. He's got his own sense of honor maybe. And I like the speculation that his relationship with Cassie isn't actually romantic. I wonder how she earned his respect other than possibly providing him with meds.

Did we know Jennifer's mom had tried to drown her? That broke my heart for her.

[tiredofwork]

Have to admit that having missed several episodes last year and also this year has me lost.  It has evolved into the concept of the 12 Monkey's movie and TV show combined with TV Sleepy Hollow. 

Every time I saw the previews of Jennifer in that scene going into the diner, I thought she was saying "we need sex"  Now last night I hear it is "we need snacks".  I tell you the best parts is when she is doing crazy though.  I did like the scene when Cole saw her in the tent and said.., "you don't call, don't write" and that gave her poor tortured soul a laugh.  I do like he always seems to be able to bring her some joy.

Having missed so many episodes, I am absolutely ignorant of this Deacon dude and his role.  The actor and how he plays the part reminds me of someone I think he may be channeling.., I'm not sure, but it might be Javier Bardiem (sp?) in Skyfall or the actor that plays the off/on Zombie, Blaine in IZombie.

[MissLucas]

That was a great episode. Not only did we get some answers (where the hell the 'daughter'-theme is coming from) but also some humor. I don't think I ever laughed so much in an episode of this show. Loved Cole being annoyed by Ramse invading his personal space, and Ramse trying to be a supportive cupid, 'Time Jesus' was epic, the one thing Cole and Cassie are on the same side was of course that Jennifer is the worst (said in the same exasperated voice facing Time Jesus), then the little testosterone-poisoning going on when Cassie splintered.

I don't think Deacon and Cassie are romantic - it's much more complicated. I was relieved to see him return safe and only slightly worse for wear. His demise would have greatly complicated Cole's attempts to get back into Cassie's good graces. And he certainly brings some humor. And crazy killer or not - he does have a code.

The acting was superb, the look on Cassie's face when she realized what Jennifer's mother had tried to do... Amanda Schull played Cassandra slowly coming around to appreciate what Jennifer is going through so subtle and intense. Emily Hampshire gave a great performance jumping from the unhinged Jennifer we know to a more sane version who managed to be at least to some degree in control. 'It's not easy being crazy' was heart-breaking.

Glad Olivia's gone and that her attempts to manipulate Jennifer via her mom-issues finally backfired.

[shapeshifter]

Finally watched, and I think everyone upthread covered all the good stuff: "you don't write; you don't call" and "Time Jesus." Heh.

My only complaint was too much violence, bordering on gratuitous, because even though it served to move the plot along, maybe they could have done it with a little more "peace, love, and happiness." 

I really do appreciate the new Jennifer/Cassie gal pal development--and not just because it means Ramse and Cole will still have time for their friendship too, although that is a bonus.

So Cassie gave Cole a whisky sour peace offering, but she wouldn't confess to him that she drank the Koolaid.

Edited May 18, 2016 by shapeshifter

[Just Here]

Best episode of the season so far. After the set-up of the first few episodes, this episode seemed to be full of pay-offs.

And, unless I missed something, I don't think Olivia is dead yet, just paralyzed.

[kat165]

I kind of hope Olivia isn't dead yet. I kind of like the actress.

[supposebly]

Oh, I hope Olivia is dead. I find her incredibly annoying.

Overall, much better than the previous one. Very little of the "time takes time" crap.

Funny banter, more insight into Jennifer and Cassie was less annoying.

I can run with the tea is some mind-expanding something or other that allows people to access the witness? Who or whatever that is. I just cannot deal with the nonsense they spouted last episode.

I'm glad Deacon will stick around because I adore Todd Stashwick. And that development makes a lot of sense. Ramse and Cole were right to get rid of him. The constant tension was not going to improve things but it makes sense for Deacon to bury the hatchet after that. He has an odd code but it works for him.

Edited May 18, 2016 by supposebly

[ZoqFotPik]

5 hours ago, Just Here said:

And, unless I missed something, I don't think Olivia is dead yet, just paralyzed.

During his conversation with The Witness, The Pallid Man (has he been named) says she is wounded, so I agree she is paralyzed not dead yet. It depends on if Pallid helps her or not.

5 hours ago, kat165 said:

I kind of hope Olivia isn't dead yet. I kind of like the actress.

I really like her voice. 

6 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

So Cassie gave Cole a whisky sour peace offering, but she wouldn't confess to him that she drank the Koolaid.

I think it was more about seeing Aaron. That is probably still a touchy subject between the two.

[wanderingstar]

I do not believe for one minute that Deacon will let bygones be bygones with Cole and Ramse. He's just going to wait for the right moment to retaliate. That said, I am glad he's not dead - and I never thought I'd say that!

The Jennifer/Cassie team-up was great, and another reminder of what great character interactions this show has.

If Olivia isn't dead, at least maybe she'll be quiet for a while. I am tired of her.

They're going back to my birth year next episode. Woot!

Edited May 18, 2016 by Gillian Rosh

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I think Deacon was sincere when he said he respected Cole and Ramse for trying to take him out, especially because it was clear how contemptuous he felt about the way Cole left the West 7. That doesn't mean he won't hold a grudge though!

Inside the episode:

[kat165]

I cannot get that Joan Jett song out of my head.