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Spoilers with Speculation

ElleryAnne

By ElleryAnne
in Teen Wolf [V]

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ahisma

ahisma

Not a fan of the way of the way they've handled the Malia story or Malia/Stiles, but I have to admit I felt bad for her when she asked, "What's happening to us?" She would be safer as a coyote in the woods! (Once they cleared her stepdad's traps.)

Chris! Sheriff! Melissa! Melissa siccing Scott on bad guys!

Also, in all three seconds we saw, I liked the new lacrosse boy who enjoyed the shirtless view. Join the club, honey! Can't wait for more Coach.

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Minneapple
Minneapple

Oh hell no. You know, I can forgive a lot if the characters are likeable and the plotlines make some kind of sense. But don't pretend like your fans are stupid. At least give them SOME credit.

ahisma
ahisma

From HollywoodLife: ‘Teen Wolf’ Actress Shelley Hennig: Malia ‘Finds Her Mate’ In Stiles G.D. it, Jeff Davis! So there's no explanation for obvious questions the audience is asking, people in the

Gwen-Stacys
Gwen-Stacys

Okay...just throwing this out there: does anyone else think that Peter is somehow stealing Derek's powers? In one of the sneak peaks, Derek makes a remark about how much stronger Peter seems....it cou

ahisma

ahisma

I know, right? Peter, look in the mirror! :D

I did like: "We also wanted to get back into the fun of our show. We inject a great deal more humor into this season. So much of Season 3 was like a horror movie."

There was humor in 3B, especially Kira and her dad, but it will be interesting to see if 4 keeps the humor going throughout, not just in the first eps then horror the rest of the way.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

From TVGuide's Megabuzz:

http://www.tvguide.com/News/Mega-Buzz-Revenge-Sleepy-Hollow-Spoilers-1082851.aspx

What's coming up on Teen Wolf this season? — Mitch

When the show returns, the gang goes south of the border to find Derek. Little do they know, Derek is actually with Kate, whom Scott & Co. will be shocked to discover is still alive. But the real surprise waiting for the gang has nothing to do with Kate! Let's just say Derek has changed in a very peculiar way.

ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

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Some promo/cast interview stuff about S4:  http://www.mtv.com/shows/teen_wolf/whats-new-in-season-4/1052561/video/#id=1728201

 

Man, I forget how young Tyler P. looked back in S1.

 

 

Derek is actually with Kate

 

 

But surely not as a couple, right?  I mean, that's got to be either that she kidnapped him or drugged him or something.  Anything else would be squicky beyond all reason.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

From Matt's Inside Line on TVLine:

http://tvline.com/2014/06/12/once-upon-a-time-season-4-spoilers-emma-hook-guilt/

I like the idea of Lydia being a banshee on Teen Wolf, but are we ever going to find out what she did in the woods when she went missing at the start of Season 2? –Erica

Season 2? Sorry, but I think we both know Teen Wolf isn’t big on going back and revisiting old story lines, especially from the Jackson era. But if you like the idea of Lydia being a banshee, you’ll love Season 4. In the June 23 premiere alone, Ms. Martin comes in contact with someone who knows more about her powers than she does — and who forces her to predict an imminent death.

Edited by Starfish35
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Atony

Atony

The new opening credits for Teen Wolf

 

http://www.eonline.com/news/551364/teen-wolf-watch-season-4-s-epic-new-opening-sequence-don-t-worry-there-s-still-shirtless-guys

 

Similar to the old one and works well, I am just quite surprised Malia is in them.  Kira/Arden Cho was a big part of last season and earned her place but did not realize how hard Jeff Davis is pushing that Malia is now going to be a main part of the gang.  Isaac was never even in the main credits.

ahisma

ahisma

I'm really glad they replaced the Scott levitation clip, and I think Stiles' new clip really suits him. It's maybe a little strange they didn't replace Derek and Lydia's, but it gives continuity and, tbh, Tyler H is hot like burning in that shot and I will happily drool over it for as many seasons as they want to run it! I also really like that there are as many women in the credits as men, finally. Although I would have put Kira before Malia; I hope this doesn't mean Kira will be marginalized.

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superdeluxe

superdeluxe

The new opening credits for Teen Wolf

 

http://www.eonline.com/news/551364/teen-wolf-watch-season-4-s-epic-new-opening-sequence-don-t-worry-there-s-still-shirtless-guys

 

Similar to the old one and works well, I am just quite surprised Malia is in them.  Kira/Arden Cho was a big part of last season and earned her place but did not realize how hard Jeff Davis is pushing that Malia is now going to be a main part of the gang.  Isaac was never even in the main credits.

 

They are going all out to make Malia happen.

ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

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Tyler H is hot like burning in that shot and I will happily drool over it for as many seasons as they want to run it!

 

 

I'm right there with you on that. 

 

I also love the update to Scott's and Stiles' parts in the credits, but a part of me mourns that Stiles' jeep has been bumped in favor of the admittedly cool photo connection string.  But at least Dylan's face can be seen now, so that's a plus.  

 

The cactus in the last part is odd since Beacon Hills isn't a desert southwest town, but I guess that's because the beginning of the season includes some scenes in Mexico.  

 

They are going all out to make Malia happen.

 

 

I'm afraid they might, and it concerns me a bit.  I've always found that this show creates characters I love, and I think part of the reason for that is that none of them are shoved to the forefront with the intent of forcing the audience to love them.  I'm not against Malia so far (though I hate the idea of Stiles/Malia, which yes, I know is going to happen).  But I don't want to feel like they're telling me to like her.  And if she gets a lot of scenes and other characters end up marginalized as a result, I won't like her at all.

 

That said, she's stunning in those opening credits.

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ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

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Oh, I have such mixed feelings on Kate coming back.  On the one hand, I'm glad for a storyline that'll keep Chris Argent around.  My concern with Kate is that they may try to redeem her, and I don't think she's redeemable.  But I'll give her a chance, because the berserkers storyline could be good.  And hopefully she's dead again at the end of the season.

 

And I would prefer if Jeff Davis etal didn't keep telling me how great and interesting Malia is.  If she's all that, I'll decide it for myself.  All of his talking her up isn't going to make me more likely to love her.  I'm giving her a chance, but the more I hear about how great she'll be, the more I cringe.

 

In spite of that, I'm looking forward to Monday!

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ahisma

ahisma

Kate totally needs to be dead at the end of the season!

Jeff blew it with Malia already with sending an uncontrolled were girl back to her unsuspecting dad/stepdad with no help from the pack, Malia's violence/sexytimes towards Stiles in the asylum, and then showing her in high school as if she had had any kind of education or socialization since she was a traumatized little girl. She. Makes. No. Sense.

But it sounds like from this interview that the DTR spoiler previously is about Malia/Stiles. *sigh*

I'm with you, ElleryAnne—the more the show runners are in love with a character the less I tend to like them. It always turns into "tell" not "show."

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superdeluxe

superdeluxe

Jeff blew it with Malia already with sending an uncontrolled were girl back to her unsuspecting dad/stepdad with no help from the pack, Malia's violence/sexytimes towards Stiles in the asylum, and then showing her in high school as if she had had any kind of education or socialization since she was a traumatized little girl. She. Makes. No. Sense.

But it sounds like from this interview that the DTR spoiler previously is about Malia/Stiles. *sigh*

I'm with you, ElleryAnne—the more the show runners are in love with a character the less I tend to like them. It always turns into "tell" not "show."

 

Totally agree.  Especially the bold part.  She just makes no sense.  They are breaking their necks to make sure that people like her.  Why?  Why are they so invested in this character?  Is there a plan for a spin-off for her or something?  I don't know.  It's crazy how hard they are pushing this character.

 

And yes, the more the show runners are in love with a character, the less I tend to like them.  I won't give them a chance.  I'm not going to give this Malia a chance.  Which is messed up because she's probably going to be sharing a ton of scenes with Stiles and I only watch this show for Dylan O'Brien so...

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Atony

Atony

It's not that I have anything against Malia, but my feelings are exactly what Jeff Davis admitted himself.  She was briefly a part of last season (and I agree that a lot of how she was written didn't make a lot of sense), and now she is very suddenly a main character of the show with no build up. 

 

I have nothing against her and I hope she will add something to show, but it isn't a smart way to introduce a character.  And again as he said, they did such a good job introducing Kira they have to know the proper way to introduce a character.  (But then, this is the same show that gave us Cora, a character that was embarrassingly nonsensical).

ahisma

ahisma

From HollywoodLife: ‘Teen Wolf’ Actress Shelley Hennig: Malia ‘Finds Her Mate’ In Stiles

Coyotes are very faithful and loyal animals, and she finds her mate. Apparently, coyotes find their mate, and they mate for life, because they are loyal. So, she found her partner, and it’s Stiles, and luckily he reciprocates; with that, she becomes loyal to the pack, because it’s important to Stiles....

Given how much your character is going to be going through, are we going to be learning about some of the mythology surrounding Malia? Like, how are you a coyote when Peter is a werewolf? Will all of that stuff be explained?

“I think that’s going to be for Season 5. [Laughs]“

So, are we going to learn why Malia is in high school when she skipped grades 4-10? Is she a genius? Will Stiles tutor her?

“I think it’s one of those TV things that you kind of don’t pay attention to. [Laughs] ...

Does [Derek] see her as a little sister? Does he embrace her as a family member?

“At that point, he doesn’t know that they are related, so that will be a question for Tyler.”

G.D. it, Jeff Davis! So there's no explanation for obvious questions the audience is asking, people in the pack are being left out of the loop on information, still, even though they've all become closer, and now we have some Twilight-level imprinting bullshit.

Like, really, there's nothing problematic about having a guy suddenly being glommed onto by a feral girl? ("Oh, it's okay because he likes her." Lazy storytelling, and creepy as hell.) And like it's not problematic that the way a female character gets integrated into the pack is because she comes attached to Her Man? Fail in every direction. I knew this was coming, and why I don't believe, "Oh, you'll love her!"

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ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

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*sigh*  I haven't been crazy about Malia until now, but I've had nothing against the actress, who seems competent enough.  But I hope laughing off questions and concerns about her character isn't typical of her.  

 

And "Mate?"  Really?  Shipping aside, it's disturbing to think someone will become someone's mate for life based on what little time these two have spent together so far, and under the circumstances in which they did.  At best, it's juvenile puppy-love that makes the character look bad and is a rather dubious model of a teenaged girl.  At worst, it's creepy and stalkerish.  If they wanted to make her loyal to the pack, there are better ways to do it.

 

The more I see about Malia, the more I get flashbacks to Lana Lang, Thirteen, and Gwen Cooper.  The showrunners on their respective shows kept trying to make everyone love those characters by showing how perfect they were and how beloved they were by all of the other characters, regardless of what they did.  It didn't work with any of those characters, and I don't think it's going to work here.  And it's a shame, because Malia could be an interesting character if they just back off and let her simmer in the background while they slow-build the necessary connections and history for her.  JD admitted he knows the problem is the quick way they're introducing her; I don't know why he doesn't see that he has an opportunity to fix that.  But having the actress do interviews where she calls her character Stiles' "mate" and talks about how wonderful she is?  That's not going to work.  Did they learn nothing from the Itchy and Scratchy and Poochie show?

 

 

Fail in every direction.

 

 

It really is looking that way, isn't it?   

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ahisma

ahisma

The more I see about Malia, the more I get flashbacks to Lana Lang, Thirteen, and Gwen Cooper.

Yes! Lana Lang is the model for "she's so wonderful!" PTB bullshit. Ugh. Stargate Atlantis writers pulled it with Jennifer Keller, too, hooking her up with the audience-popular nerdy guy, just because. I would much, much rather have consistent character and story than romance.

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Yitzhak

Yitzhak

I get the impression that in S4 the Stiles/Malia ship will mostly be played for laughs. They couldn't play it that way in 3x20 because Stiles's storyline was so dark. But I think in S4 they'll be reverting back to Stiles's being the funny one and making Malia funny too as a way to encourage fans to warm up to her. I actually like the idea of Stiles having an awkward comic relationship with a feral werewolf girl. I think fans take their ships way too seriously on this show. 

 

And despite all this "mate" business (which again, I think will be played for humor), I don't think it means Stiles/Malia will be an instant endgame couple. In my experience the quicker writers put couples together the quicker they plan to have them breaking up.   

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ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

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I think fans take their ships way too seriously on this show.

 

 

I won't get too deeply into it here because it's probably a discussion for a separate thread, but I don't believe the concerns that some people have about Malia are because we're "taking [our] ships way too seriously".  I've heard others dismiss any and all criticisms of a character on the assumption that it must be shipper-bias, but I find it offensive and unfair to do so.  Personally, my feelings about Malia are due to issues in how she was introduced, how poorly she seems to be written so far, and the growing sense that she's being pushed to the foreground with the expectation that the fans must love her.  And at least some of the other comments in this topic would indicate that I'm not the only one who feels that way.  I don't think there's a lot of "omg!ihateher!stydia/sterek5eva!!!111!!" going on here.

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Gwen-Stacys

Gwen-Stacys

I won't get too deeply into it here because it's probably a discussion for a separate thread, but I don't believe the concerns that some people have about Malia are because we're "taking [our] ships way too seriously".  I've heard others dismiss any and all criticisms of a character on the assumption that it must be shipper-bias, but I find it offensive and unfair to do so.  Personally, my feelings about Malia are due to issues in how she was introduced, how poorly she seems to be written so far, and the growing sense that she's being pushed to the foreground with the expectation that the fans must love her.  And at least some of the other comments in this topic would indicate that I'm not the only one who feels that way.  I don't think there's a lot of "omg!ihateher!stydia/sterek5eva!!!111!!" going on here.

I think a lot of people automatically jump to the conclusion of shipper bias because 8 times out of 10 it is shipper bias when it comes to Malia (on tumblr, at least). From what I've seen and read so far, Malia's story isn't being written any worse than anyone else's so far. Watching Teen Wolf over the years, I've kind of accepted the fact that this isn't (really) "quality" television in that their won't be dropped plotlines, plotlines that make me side-eye my tv, or characters suddenly getting pushed to the forefront *cough*thetwins*cough. I'll take the rest of my thoughts on Malia and her storyline to her thread.

 

Maybe Shelley's getting a lot of mention/media attention because Jeff and Co are happy to have her. Of the younger actors on the show, doesn't she have the most non-fan voted accolades? She is a pretty decent actress (her and JPK were the best things acting wise on TSC) and she has years of good will built up with me (my babysitter and my grandmother were huge Days of Our Lives fans). I'm more than willing to give her and Malia a chance.

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FurryFury

FurryFury

I don't have any shipper bias, because I don't ship anything on the show (I do, however, have a rather negative impression of Sterek because of those vocal shippers feeling like they're entitled to seeing a relationship that only ever existed in their own heads). But I find Malia and Stiles/Malia utterly nonsensical and forced. Malia isn't explored as a character at all. She really does feel like yet another attempt to give Stiles a love interest after Erica and Cora. The sex scene in the asylum episode (which was itself a giant asspull seemingly shoehorned into the season because JD had found it cool, not because of any narrative necessity) made me cringe. It was completely out of character for Stiles. And Shelly's comments are just facepalm-worthy, ugh. 

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ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

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I think a lot of people automatically jump to the conclusion of shipper bias because 8 times out of 10 it is shipper bias when it comes to Malia (on tumblr, at least).

 

 

I can't speak for anyone on tumblr since I don't spend much time on it, but most of the people I know who hate Malia are not shipper-biased.  But they recognize the bad writing.  I'm sure it depends on the crowd in any given place, but the generalization is still offensive.

 

 

Maybe Shelley's getting a lot of mention/media attention because Jeff and Co are happy to have her.

 

 

Oh, I'm sure he's happy to have her.  I just hope he's not so happy to have her that it blinds him to any issues surrounding her, her character, or her storyline.

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greenbean

greenbean

(edited)

I just don't see what's so troubling about her character. Interesting that people are bringing up Lana Lang. I thought the hate there was ridiculous, especially when it began to focus on Kristin herself.

 

I think Shelly's comments were pretty funny. She's not taking herself or the show too seriously. And why should she. It's a teen drama on MTV. It'll be fun to have her at the cons imo.

Edited by greenbean
ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

  • Author
Interesting that people are bringing up Lana Lang. I thought the hate there was ridiculous, especially when it began to focus on Kristin herself.

 

 

It shouldn't focus on the actress herself.  But the hate towards characters that are repreatedly propped up at the expense of other characters and plot continuity is understandable, IMO.  I'm hoping Malia doesn't turn out to be one of those characters, but the spoilers and interviews give me pause.

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galax-arena

galax-arena

I don't really find Malia's character troubling. It's just that a) I couldn't care less about Stiles' love life and 2) I couldn't care less about the Hales. Malia is tied to both. I did really like Shelley on The Secret Circle, so I'm hoping there's more to her character than just being caught in Stiles' or the Hales' orbit. Maybe her relationship with Stiles will be more on the periphery as she tries to navigate her return to the human world and involvement in the pack, for example.

 

Anyway, moving on, I read an interview with Ryan Kelley (Deputy Parrish). The following part stuck out at me:

Q: What can we expect from you as Deputy Parrish on this new season of “Teen Wolf”?

 

A: While I can’t talk about a lot of this now, but on ‘Teen Wolf,’ a lot about my character really will be revealed and will come out. Last season I did like six or seven episodes and my character was just getting into the mix of things. This season you’ll learn a lot about who is and where he comes from. The crazy thing about the show, we’re kept in the dark almost as much as the audience. Except for the scenes and specific episode we’re shooting on a given week — we’re not given any information on where it all could be heading. That makes it exciting for us too.


I don't think that's the best way to go about it. No wonder some of the cast members' acting choices look weird.
ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

  • Author
The crazy thing about the show, we’re kept in the dark almost as much as the audience. Except for the scenes and specific episode we’re shooting on a given week — we’re not given any information on where it all could be heading.

 

 

I've heard about that being done on other shows, as well - sometimes to good effect and sometimes not.  IA, in general it seems like a bad idea, because it limits what the actor can bring to the show.

 

I AM really curious about Deputy Parrish, though.  We got just enough of him last season to know there's something going on with him, but barely a tease.  

galax-arena

galax-arena

(edited)
I've heard about that being done on other shows, as well - sometimes to good effect and sometimes not.  IA, in general it seems like a bad idea, because it limits what the actor can bring to the show.

I think it depends on the sort of show and storylines we're talking about. I can see not telling an actor about some major surprise event that's going to happen. But for a show like Teen Wolf, that seems to want to build up some sort of ongoing arc/mythology, and that likes having all these ~mysterious characters with unstated motivations and purposes lurking around, it's really not the best idea, IMO. Didn't it turn out that Haley Webb had no idea until the last minute that Jennifer was the Darach? That's the sort of thing that you might want to clue the actor in on. What if Deputy Parrish ends up being the mysterious Benefactor? LMAO.

 

What I'm curious about is whether Jeff Davis keeps his actors in the dark because he's worried about spoilers or because he just makes shit up as he goes.

Edited by galax-arena
Yitzhak

Yitzhak

she's being pushed to the foreground with the expectation that the fans must love her.

 

 

Yeah, but...you could say the same thing about the Liam character who we know will have a big role this season. That's another new character Jeff seems keen for fans to love, yet I haven't seen the same resistance and animosity directed at Liam's upcoming role. And for the record, I don't think Malia was well-written in the 'Echo House' episode either, but that seemed like more of a preview than a proper introduction to Malia's character. I suspect to see a big improvement in her characterization in S4. But it seems like a lot of fans aren't open to Malia's character being written better in future and winning us over. And the underlying reason for that seems to be because it's confirmed that she's going to be Stiles's love interest.     

ElleryAnne

ElleryAnne

  • Author
(edited)
What I'm curious about is whether Jeff Davis keeps his actors in the dark because he's worried about spoilers or because he just makes shit up as he goes.

 

 

Probably some of each, and more of the latter?  I wonder, if he told them what kind of plans he had for their character, whether fewer actors would bail from his show?  It seems like every season he spends time setting up characters only to have the actors decide they'd rather work elsewhere.  Maybe the "elsewhere" includes working where they're able to know more about their characters so they can better prepare to play them.

 

 

you could say the same thing about the Liam character who we know will have a big role this season. That's another new character Jeff seems keen for fans to love, yet I haven't seen the same resistance and animosity directed at Liam's upcoming role.

 

 

But I can't say that, really.  We've seen hardly anything about Liam compared to what we've seen and heard about Malia.  Part of that, of course, is that she was introduced (however badly) last season.  But part of that is due to the the level of building-up that Jeff Davis (and/or his press people) choose to do for each of those characters.  We don't know much about Liam other than that he's being brought into the show.  I know he'll be a lacrosse player, and I'm guessing that Scott and his friends will meet him and at that point we'll know whether they do/don't like him, and how much he's involved in their lives, etc.  But we're being told that Malia is going to be central, and that she's going to consider herself to be Stiles' mate as well as being Peter's daughter.  They've dropped her into the show in a major way, and they're trying hard to sell her.  I don't see much hard-sell for who Liam is going to be, other than just another kid.  The big push from the PTB has just been to make Malia the new special snowflake.  If I'm wrong, please let me know because I really would like to know more about Liam or the others.  We know there are supposedly three guys (including Liam) as well as a new teacher, but I've seen hardly anything about any of them.

 

But it seems like a lot of fans aren't open to Malia's character being written better in future and winning us over. And the underlying reason for that seems to be because it's confirmed that she's going to be Stiles's love interest.

 

 

Personally, I've said more than once that I'm definitely open to seeing if she improves in the future.  (And once more - people can and do have valid reasons for opinions about her that aren't shipper-based.)

Edited by ElleryAnne
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greenbean

greenbean

(edited)

What I'm curious about is whether Jeff Davis keeps his actors in the dark because he's worried about spoilers or because he just makes shit up as he goes.

I think it's the latter, Jeff making it up. Didn't Dylan also say Jeff tells them things about their character and story, that he keeps from the other actors? So Scott/Posey will know stuff about a given scene or their friendship, that Stiles/Dylan doesn't. It sounded interesting, but I don't think Jeff has the skills to pull it off.

Edited by greenbean
superdeluxe

superdeluxe

(edited)
And Shelly's comments are just facepalm-worthy, ugh.

 

She sure is feeling herself.  Calling her fans "Little Coyotes"; the latest comments she's made in this TVLine interview (what's with TVLine being all over Teen Wolf?  Has it always been like that?); she kind of needs to stop talking.  I remember her from Days of Our Lives.  I didn't think she was great then and I still don't.  I also don't recall her running her mouth like she is now.

Edited by superdeluxe
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