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Celebrating 25 Years Of The West Wing

Sleepy Hollow in the Media

maraleia

By maraleia
in Sleepy Hollow [V]

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Three

Three

Once I heard about Betsy I'd wondered if they intended to have him hook up each season with a different historically-relevant ex. Someone may have thought that type of thing was charming, but...Nope!

 

I wonder about this. There were a couple of instances in early season 3 that made me go what-was-that-about? Once, in Abbie's unbelievably massive office an assistant of some sort came in and was star-struck by Crane, although neither Crane nor Abbie noted it. I put it down to an over-enthusiastic extra making the most of every moment. Then I think there was another occasion where another assistant was dazzled by Crane. They're shooting for Crane: Lady Killer as well as those other great titles people came up with.

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jenrising
jenrising
cynic
cynic

Oh, I have no doubt that Beharie wanted to leave. My issue is the laying of blame at Beharie for wanting to leave without considering why she wanted to leave. It was pretty clear two and a half years

Badsamaritan
Badsamaritan

I don't believe a word from FOX. Look how they treated Orlando Jones, by far their biggest cheerleader. And the fact that he has still been supporting Nicole tells me he knows what the fuck really hap

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archiesmom

archiesmom

(edited)

Three  Don't get me started on Metzner. I'm sure you've heard about the interview he gave where he basically admitted to salivating over how good Lyndie looked in a dress when she walked into the bar where all the cast was. He said he just knew he had to get her character out of her combat gear and into something sexier and have her let her hair down. Blech. From his twitter pics he also seems to have a fetish for ladies in tight outfits and samurai gear. In hindsight, Katrina with a katana strapped to her back, (that she never used) makes sense. Blech again. He did tweet about Nicole but it was in a tweet about something else. The BTS pic was from season one, I'm sure of it.

I need to take hard look at myself and why I gave anything this creature was involved with the time of my day.

 

As for Crane carrying the show, I think if they renew they may have fair ratings but once the premiere wears off and people realize there's something missing, it won't be good. Abbie has always been the POV for the audience. Regular viewers may not discuss it the way we do but they will feel it.

 

BOBBYSGURL I'm so glad you posted that clip. Len Wiseman couldn't believe they got Nicole. If that doesn't say everything I don't know what else to say. She really was making a name for herself at the time. I bet she was so excited and nervous to be signed on to be a lead in a new pilot. The thing is, everything after the middle of the first season probably made her raise her eyebrows. I can't imagine how she was feeling. Her contemporaries from Julliard include Danielle Brooks and Samira Wiley who are getting accolades  for their acting in OINTB (a show that celebrates diversity)and she was slowly being relegated to sidekick who rolls her eyes at nonsense on a show that has crappy writing. Seriously, look back at season two threads, someone counted her eye rolls and it was in the 20's in one episode.

I will never hold anything against her for wanting better in her professional life and  I've been side-eyeing that person who wanted to drop that blind item in here the other day. 

Things have become more clear to me about this season since that Variety article. It was  said she was unhappy and wanted off the show. The show didn't dispute her. She was supposed to be gone after the mid-season finale. IMO, everything went downhill after that. I think they got  scared about ratings. I think this is the only way she was allowed to wear her natural hair (which seemed to be an issue with the producers ) and the reason things were so disjointed. Before they filmed that mid-season episode she was active on twitter; went dragon con seemingly in good spirits. I even recall a BTS video where she was joking around with Tom.  I think she was done after that though. She probably thought she was free to pursue other opportunities and they were like nope we need you for the rest of the season. Not only did they keep her on, they used their viewers for everything they were worth. I'm waiting for the hit stories about Nicole from "unnamed sources" laying blame on her for their lackluster season. Did you notice in her statement on twitter "Abbie Mills has done all she was meant to" was in quotes? She knows the difference between her words and others

 

As for FOX and the original producers, I don't know everything that happened but Len Wiseman is still making pilots for them and Orci still seems to hold them in high regard. It may have just been FOX wanting them for other things and they left Goffman to take over. Didn't Orci  continue to write the Star Trek movies?  Are they produced under FOX? The only one who seems weird to me is Iscove. He's out there tweeting about izombie mentioning Sleepy Hollow and how much Liv would love Ichabod. 

 

 

 

ETA: I think it's hilarious that the writers and the official twitter are only able to retweet random fans here and there. Not one critic or recapper think their "bold move" was anything to celebrate, in fact most of them are asking the same things we are. Why would your lead actress want to leave? Why did this season suck so bad?

Edited by archiesmom
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phoenics

phoenics

(edited)

One of the POC on the writing team, continues to protest too much.

That racism wasn't a factor in what happened.

Leigh Dana Jackson, self proclaimed Fan Police.

SMDH...

That MFer needs to just shut the hell up. He's married to a white woman* and clearly has bought into the negative/stereotypical tropes about black women - I guess he thinks Jenny/Joeny was enough? No you asshole. And just because you are black doesn't mean you GET IT. What you let them do to the Abbie character PROVES you don't get it.

Shut the hell up.

*Not all black men married to white women are trash like LDJ - many of them DO get it. Like Eric La Salle. He got it. LDJ does not.

Edited by phoenics
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C76

C76

One of the POC on the writing team, continues to protest too much.

That racism wasn't a factor in what happened.

Leigh Dana Jackson, self proclaimed Fan Police.

SMDH...

 

I looked at his feed just now and nearly lost half of my life. I also almost jumped in. But #NotTodaySatan--I have a zillion things to do. 

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calibabe

calibabe

This confirms what someone else said here a few days ago. NB was sought after FIRST, then TM was brought in. In what universe does that translate into NB was the dispensable one.

The initial premise was TWO Witnesses brought together through time and space to fight The Apocalypse. That was the cake. The chemistry between the actors was the icing on top.

 

Actually the role was not written with anyone specific in mind. Per NB she wasn't looking for a tv series but she read with the mindset that " "I read [sleepy Hollow] and figured, 'Let's do the audition and we'll see. They're not going to cast me.'" -  http://www.emmys.com/news/features/their-dreams-sleepy-hollow

 

Its a pretty good article about how they conceived the entire series and then found both NB and TM. The article also stated that while the part wasn't originally written for an African American actress that once NB read for the role, their search was over. 

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vanarnd1

vanarnd1

Choosing their fixers

If you are TPTB, you choose your showrunners and writers to reflect your view of the show. Goffmann was brought in because he reflected TPTB direction: let’s whiten this thing up. Diversity? Pfft! His arrogance was to think that if he pushed on through with his dream-girl, everything would be as it should. That was a colossal failure. So they tried again. We got CC who superficially spouted and presented enough to keep the fans thinking he is fixing it, give him time. That was certainly me.   This year we were fed a whole lot of BS.  I almost consider him worse than Goffmann now. Words that come to mind: disingenuous, sly, manipulative, insincere. He didn’t have an obvious infatuation (a la KW), but the plan to dismantle what SH was, was there. It was some grade A manipulation of the viewers.

You select writers that are on the same page. The ones that don’t fit and don’t agree disappear. In the end there’s only simpatico writers in the echo chamber. You can all keep patting yourself on the back as to how your vision is superior and will be AWESOME. The fans you have now are merely disposable fodder for your vision for the fans who will come. Who’s going to be watching when you get rid of us? The disconnect is staggering.

 

 

The one thing you have to give credit to Goffman for is that he was honest about what his intentions were. In all of his interviews he kept building up Katrina and ignoring Abbie so it was easy to tell what his plan was. Like you said Campbell was willing to mislead the fans in an attempt to maintain ratings. I think he knew for most of season 3 that he was going to get rid of Abbie but didn't mind making up BS about a Ichabbie "slow burn" to get us interested in the second half of the season. And his finale post mortem was just insulting with the "Abbie served her purpose" stuff, and then trying to backtrack and act as if there was more to it than that. Saying sacrifice is not unique to Abbie even though she has done this a million times. And trying to get us to believe that it would ever be Ichabod doing the same thing, he is incredibly disingenuous and not someone I would trust at this point. It is sad that a show with so much potential had two terrible show runners back to back.

 

Like you said the disconnect between the fans and TPTB was just so massive. They viewed Abbie as expendable, while so many viewed her as essential. I don't know how you take over a show and than just think you can ignore your viewers and do whatever you want and the show won't suffer. I just feel so bad for Nicole because she was so enthusiastic about her role early on only to have it ruined by people who don't have a fraction of the talent she does. If only the original people who cast Nicole had stayed on board because they seemed to realize the importance of the character. This is the worst I have ever felt about a TV show.

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MrsRafaelBarba

MrsRafaelBarba

I looked at his feed just now and nearly lost half of my life. I also almost jumped in. But #NotTodaySatan--I have a zillion things to do.

Two words...

Willfully Obtuse.

But tries to come across like he's Conscious and Woke.

RME....

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Yolapukka

Yolapukka

(edited)

 

Saying sacrifice is not unique to Abbie even though she has done this a million times. And trying to get us to believe that it would ever be Ichabod doing the same thing, he is incredibly disingenuous and not someone I would trust at this point.

 

Actually I do think he means that Ichabod could be sacrifed. It seemed like a fairly blatant statement that he considers anyone in front of the cameras to be replaceable. Crane will be safe for the foreseeable future if the show is renewed but there will be no guarantees to him or anyone else. I think those who've compared it to Dr. Who have hit the nail on the head. 

 

 I think the crack about sacrifice not being unique to Abbie was yet another way to tear her down. Nothing unique about her, nothing special, she doesn't even get to have a life that's about herself, it's all about someone else's journey.

Edited by yuggapukka
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Julia

Julia

You know, it's funny. The showrunners of Person of Interest said the same thing after they killed Carter. A small army has been shooting automatic weapons at her replacements for about a year now, and they're still around.

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MizArk

MizArk

(edited)

I'm not sure what you're trying to say about Person of Interest, Julia? I think Carter has been sorely missed in that show (which has just been officially cancelled), but there was never any proclamation at the beginning of the series that Reese and Carter were the only two who could defeat the forces of evil, as SH set up with The (Equally Important) Witnesses. If anything, Reese and Harold are the main relationship in that show. I still don't think it ever got back the heart that Carter brought to the series -- which the declining ratings probably testified to. SH was different from any other random-character-killing because it was explicitly stated at the beginning that the two were always destined to be together, that both were needed and that neither could succeed without the other -- and then, "Oh, never mind. Forget what you think you heard, this is what we wanted you to hear ... " Even with POI, there was some shady media going on afterward, with TPTB saying it was always planned and that TH knew from the start that her role was limited, when we found out later that wasn't exactly true (much like Orlando on SH, to stay on topic as much as possible).

Edited by MizArk
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Julia

Julia

(edited)

I'm not sure what you're trying to say about Person of Interest, Julia? I think Carter has been sorely missed in that show (which has just been officially cancelled), but there was never any proclamation at the beginning of the series that Reese and Carter were the only two who could defeat the forces of evil, as SH set up with The (Equally Important) Witnesses. If anything, Reese and Harold are the main relationship in that show. I still don't think it ever got back the heart that Carter brought to the series -- which the declining ratings probably testified to. SH was different from any other random-character-killing because it was explicitly stated at the beginning that the two were always destined to be together, that both were needed and that neither could succeed without the other -- and then, "Oh, never mind. Forget what you think you heard, this is what we wanted you to hear ... " Even with POI, there was some shady media going on afterward, with TPTB saying it was always planned and that TH knew from the start that her role was limited, when we found out later that wasn't exactly true (much like Orlando on SH, to stay on topic as much as possible).

 

What I'm getting at is that after Carter was killed, we were told that it was all their fearlessness as storytellers who were willing to mow their beloved characters down like dandelions facing a rototiller. Somehow, though, they were willing to let the show die rather than let anything happen to Root, a character who's so popular that they declined to have a Q score generated for her.

 

tl;dr: I don't believe them. And I don't believe the people who made this show either. I think those characters died because they didn't fit into the formulaic, dumb show the writers wanted to write.

Edited by Julia
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phoenics

phoenics

I laugh and cackle about PoI every time I see Empire's ratings - especially in S1. That show treats Taraji like gold. When I heard about their cancellation I laughed long and hard.

The problem really is that it's not just CBS. It's not just Fox. It's all of them. Eventually ABC might even tire of their little "diversity" project and go back to the status quo. I have no confidence that this is a shift in mindset on that channel. I hope it is, but eh. When i see more people of color behind the camera rather than flash in the pans, then I'll believe things have changed.

Even when the demographics of the country change, if the demographics of the power brokers in Hollywood and the USA don't change, then that won't help - until country demographics force change by simply turning off the tv. Completely.

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C76

C76

(edited)

Hopefully this SH situation along with recent developments* might push change into the forefront faster than any of us thinks.

 

*Two white female actors were announced this week as playing Asian characters in movies. 

Edited by C76
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Three

Three

 

This is the worst I have ever felt about a TV show.

 

Me too. I've never had a reaction like this before. Plenty of shows have made creative decisions I haven't liked, but I'll just put them in the "stupid show/stupid decision" or "okay, don't like it, but it makes sense" files in my head and move on. But I can't watch this now, even episodes I enjoy, it makes me too sad.  I think part of the reason I am analyzing this to death is to try and distance myself from how upset I am.

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C76

C76

Amen Brother/Sister. Amen.

Sister! ;)

 

I'm going to start watching S2 and S3 from the top. People have complained about a lot of different things, and some of them got on my nerves. (Oddly, not Katrina or Hawley.)  I need to pinpoint for myself exactly where the show went wrong. 

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phoenics

phoenics

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/doc-strange-whitewashing-shell-884385

  

 

Between those movies^ and Sleepy Hollow, along with Gods of Egypt and other BS...I'm pretty sure the public has had enough.

CODSCAMMIT!!!

This is the worst I have ever felt about a TV show.

I have had other tv shows really hurt my soul - like when they killed Bobby on Dallas - or the Roswell debacle - but this is the first time it actually felt intensely personal. Like the network (and Metzner, who wrote that filth) singled out and targeted me as a black woman and tried to destroy me, my hope and my happiness with the writing. I have never ever felt like that before.

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C76

C76

"...the series makes money for Fox internationally, so getting to four seasons would be financially beneficial for the company. While Sleepy Hollow is on the bubble, there had been positive signs, and I hear the studio has been doing contingent staffing moves to be prepared in case the series is renewed."

 

 

From the author's lips, to God's ears. That's EXACTLY what I wanted to hear.

 

Link:

 

http://deadline.com/2016/04/canceled-or-renewed-castle-nashville-criminal-minds-csi-cyber-sleepy-hollow-mysteries-of-laura-bubble-1201738298/

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phoenics

phoenics

This one was linked to the article you posted, MizArk... it made my chest hurt (meaning it really captured all that went wrong)...

http://www.headoverfeels.com/2016/04/11/what-is-there-for-me-in-a-world-without-you-the-sad-implosion-of-sleepy-hollow/

This blurb doesn't make me feel better - I think I feel worse. I think the staffing changes are all about removing everyone except Crane and going with their "reboot" idea. Nothing's changed here since that awful finale and tone deaf killing of Abbie.

Even if the show managed to get it right this time - NB is gone. What's the point.

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C76

C76

(edited)

http://deadline.com/2016/04/canceled-or-renewed-castle-nashville-criminal-minds-csi-cyber-sleepy-hollow-mysteries-of-laura-bubble-1201738298/

This blurb doesn't make me feel better - I think I feel worse. I think the staffing changes are all about removing everyone except Crane and going with their "reboot" idea. Nothing's changed here since that awful finale and tone deaf killing of Abbie.

Even if the show managed to get it right this time - NB is gone. What's the point.

 

To me, when someone in the business refers to "staffing" changes at a show, they're talking about things behind the scenes. Mileage varies and all that, but if the author meant the actors, I think she would have referred to the cast.

 

NB is gone, yes. But we don't know that there's a reason she can't come back. Especially if certain people in production are no longer with the show.

 

I know I'm too optimistic for some people--and at times even myself!--but honestly...The problems at SH aren't a mystery. ;) They're blatantly obvious and have been discussed in great detail for the past week by fans and critics alike. I think the original Powers That Be have picked up on that, and then some. (I say that as I remember Roberto Orci's tweet and looked at his feed.) The way I see things, this is no different than a valued employee leaving an office because one of the new bosses is a jackass. People get wooed back all the time after folks get "transferred". 

 

We'll see what happens, but I'm not ready to give up. 

Edited by C76
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Enero

Enero

I don't think there's any chance of the show getting anything right, at this point. That ship sailed when they killed off everything and everyone that made the show interesting i.e. Irving, the Horseman, Moloch, Abbie, even Pandora and Joe.

I think when they mentioned "staffing moves" they meant BTS staff i.e. writers, directors etc. they may be also tentatively scouting filming locales in GA (if they plan to stay in GA). If they're renewed they won't start actually filming until August or September, I think. But I'd think they'd still need to begin some preliminary preparations for renewal and thus filming now.

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DJG1122

DJG1122

CODSCAMMIT!!!

this is the first time it actually felt intensely personal. Like the network (and Metzner, who wrote that filth) singled out and targeted me

This. So much this.

 

And I LOVE Codscammit and Codspammit! Added to my vocabulary today.

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vanarnd1

vanarnd1

The staffing move that should have been done was firing Campbell during the mid-season finale and putting someone credible in charge who could have worked things out behind the scenes and gotten Nicole back on board. Anything at this point is too late IMO.

 

Like a lot of people have been saying, I have no idea what TPTB are expecting. The audience had shrunk a lot already during the season and it feels like almost anyone who was watching the show is really upset at the finale and is questionable to tune in next season. Who knows maybe syndication will drag it along but they better get ready to deal with CW level ratings.

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arjumand

arjumand

To me, when someone in the business refers to "staffing" changes at a show, they're talking about things behind the scenes. Mileage varies and all that, but if the author meant the actors, I think she would have referred to the cast.

 

NB is gone, yes. But we don't know that there's a reason she can't come back. Especially if certain people in production are no longer with the show.

 

I know I'm too optimistic for some people--and at times even myself!--but honestly...The problems at SH aren't a mystery. ;) They're blatantly obvious and have been discussed in great detail for the past week by fans and critics alike. I think the original Powers That Be have picked up on that, and then some. (I say that as I remember Roberto Orci's tweet and looked at his feed.) The way I see things, this is no different than a valued employee leaving an office because one of the new bosses is a jackass. People get wooed back all the time after folks get "transferred". 

 

We'll see what happens, but I'm not ready to give up. 

 

I'm in two minds about this.

 

On the one hand, I've had experience with a beloved show being cancelled and after spending months railing at 'the suits' and subscribing to all sorts of theories about audience hating bean-counters who're only interested in the bottom line, finding out the truth - that the main show-runner, the show's god, so to speak, would not have been involved in the new season (I'm talking about Joss Whedon), and after seeing the creative decline that occurred during the other seasons (of Buffy and Angel) where Joss was busy elsewhere, the executives decided, sensibly enough, that it wouldn't make sense to drag the show out, and it went out fighting.

 

In another case, I read about the Star Trek movie Insurrection, where the script kept coming back with notes from 'the suits', saying that there was no reason for the audience to sympathize with the so-called good guy aliens, because they were behaving inherently selfishly.

 

What I'm saying is maybe there are executives at Fox who can see what we see, and recognize that the comparatively high rating of the finale was only the result of a bait-and-switch tactic which won't work twice.

 

And ever since I sat down to watch a run of the mill episode of Dallas, only to have my mind blown when Pamela Ewing wakes up, goes to the bathroom, and finds her husband Bobby taking a leisurely shower (after he's been dead for a season), I clutch at the "it was all a dream" straws with all my might.

 

Don't get me wrong - I hate the trope. I forbid my students from using it in their narrative work. And in a show like Sleepy Hollow, there's a much easier way of fixing things, even something as final as death - which IMO was a bullshit death. I just read a good fixit on AO3: Sometimes You Just Might Find You Get What You Need

(I've been reading a lot of Sleepy Hollow fanfic recently).

 

But then there's the other hand. And I'm essentially a pessimist. I just don't know.

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netlyon2

netlyon2

(edited)

And in a show like Sleepy Hollow, there's a much easier way of fixing things, even something as final as death - which IMO was a bullshit death. 

Oooh, pick me; I've got one!  The crossover with "Bones" did nothing to get me interested in that show, but it did inspire some new headcanon.  After slaying the dragon and saving the world in his own series, Angel got his shansu and became human, but the Powers that Be warned him to stay away from supernatural fights.  He tried living a life of leisure, but grew so bored that he decided to fight more mundane battles, changed his name to Seeley (?) Booth, and joined the FBI.  During his time there, he met August Corbin, who tempted him to return to the supernatural battles.  He gave what help he could, even trying to look out for Corbin's protege when she needed a consult.  It's always bugged him, though, that he didn't help more; maybe Corbin would still be alive.  Now, he's going to find out that Abbie died and that will be the last straw.  He'll contact a certain red-headed witch he knows (but one who can actually DO magic!) and get a resurrection spell performed.  They'll even remember to dig up the grave before performing the spell, this time.  When Abbie comes back to life, she'll be a bit disoriented and have to work through her pain at being pulled out of Heaaaaa-ven, but she'll attack life with renewed purpose and the episode will end with the Ichabbie kiss that many of us want and all of us deserve.  Done!

 

(Look, don't judge me.  If they can crib from Buffy to screw up my show, then I can do the same to fix it.  *sob*)

 

Enough of my weirdness, I actually popped in because Tumblr has been throwing a lot of Beharie and Mison quotes, GIFs, and clips at me today.  I wanted to share a couple of things that they've said about their chemistry:

 

Nicole (source:  Digital Spy)

[Q] Fans are so invested in 'Ichabbie' – what is it about yourself and Tom Mison that clicked?

[A] "I don't know, I really can't say! My best guess is that we listen similarly. I have noticed that we'll be in a space, not even in character and we're taking in the same information and the same thing sparks our interest, we'll look at each other.

"Maybe that's what the chemistry is; when people listen similarly or hear certain triggers affect them in similar ways. I think we're stimulated similarly. We might be in a room with ten people, all hearing the same thing but I'll look over and Tom will be looking as well!"

 

Tom (source:  Collider)

[Q] What’s it like to play the banter between Ichabod and Abbie, and do you personally ever want to see it go further?

[A] MISON:  It’s such a joy to play. It’s so nice when you’re part of a pair.  We have to rely on each other an awful lot, as Nicole and Tom, as much as Ichabod and Abbie.  You’re going to have days when you come in feeling under the weather and you’re struggling to get yourself in.  It’s so nice to have someone on the other side, just raising your game all of the time, and I hope she feels the same from me.  It’s just fun to play with Nicole.  We throw ideas in.  We seem to agree on everything, which is very, very fortunate.  We both come from the background where the scene is more important than the individual actor, and we are both striving to get the best out of the scene, rather than to show ourselves off.  I think that’s where the magic lies.  It’s a real treat.  All I can say about it is that it’s great.

 

Stupid, stupid showrunners!

 

From the same article, there's another bit from Tom that might give some insight into his current negotiations (keeping in mind that this article was before the Season 3 renewal was announced):

[Q] Will you return to the theatre, anytime soon?

[A] MISON:  Oh, man, I’d love to.  This has been the longest that I’ve been without doing a play.  I think it’s been two and a bit years, and I miss it terribly.  I wish I had time.  The proposed hiatus is so brief that there’s actually been lots of lovely offers of work that I’ve had to turn down, in case we get the green light for a Season 3, which goes against every fiber of my being, as an actor, and it pains me.  But, if we do go to a third season, then the hiatus will be too short to do anything.  It’s tragic and it kills me, but at least I’ll get to put those boots on again.

 

Edited by netlyon2
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blugirlami21

blugirlami21

(edited)

I wish I had your optimism c76. I really wish I did. If this hadn't already happened after season two, I probably would. But this is exactly what happened after the ratings tanked in season two after Goffman tried to make the show Katrina Hollow.

The network "stepped in" gave us Tempus Fugit and tried to start fresh by going to back to what made the show work. I thought that meant Abbie and Ichabod but judging from this season and that finale, they didn't.

This situation wouldn't be so bad if they hadn't strung us along with promises of more screen time for NB and Ichabbie but they lied to us for months. Apparently Nicole has wanted to leave since the end of season 2 and who can blame her?

I don't think she's coming back no matter what they do and from the blase way they talk about her "bold" exit from the series they wouldn't ask. There's also no way that Fox wasn't aware of what was going to happen so obviously they're ok with how it played out as well. I'm just glad it's blowing up in their faces.

I bet that if recentering the show around Ichabod and Katrina had actually worked, the network wouldn't have stepped in and done anything.

Edited by blugirlami21
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catrox14

catrox14

Unless the staffing changes amount to Nicole Beharie returning as Abbie Mills the way she was before..it's pointless.  I love Tom Mison but it's not Sleepy Hollow anymore.  They need to just dump the premise, change the name, cut Tom's hair, change his wardrobe and the name of the character....and I might watch.  But don't dare try to tell me it's Sleepy Hollow because they killed it with Abbie. 

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benteen

benteen

The staffing move that should have been done was firing Campbell during the mid-season finale and putting someone credible in charge who could have worked things out behind the scenes and gotten Nicole back on board. Anything at this point is too late IMO.

 

Like a lot of people have been saying, I have no idea what TPTB are expecting. The audience had shrunk a lot already during the season and it feels like almost anyone who was watching the show is really upset at the finale and is questionable to tune in next season. Who knows maybe syndication will drag it along but they better get ready to deal with CW level ratings.

 

They have CW-level ratings now.  I think they'll be down to low-rated FX shows next like Louie (despite the critical acclaim, Louie pulled in a really low rating).  The only thing that is keeping this show alive is that Fox doesn't have much content, which is an indictment of Fox.

 

Fox misinterpreting the "higher" ratings for the SH finale wouldn't surprise me because that's exactly the sort of thing that networks do.

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C76

C76

(edited)

netlyon2, those quotes...I was looking at some NB/TM interviews last night thinking,"How could anyone want to break that up? What were they thinking?!?"

 

arjumand, it's funny. I've jokingly mentioned Bobby Ewing as a way for TPTB to fix this situation before. I agree with you though. They don't have to go that far. Like another person mentioned on these boards, I'm an old-school soap opera viewer. Unless the character's body is in pieces in front of me, their "death" doesn't count.

 

What I'm saying is maybe there are executives at Fox who can see what we see, and recognize that the comparatively high rating of the finale was only the result of a bait-and-switch tactic which won't work twice.

 

 

Unless the staffing changes amount to Nicole Beharie returning as Abbie Mills the way she was before..it's pointless.  I love Tom Mison but it's not Sleepy Hollow anymore.  They need to just dump the premise, change the name, cut Tom's hair, change his wardrobe and the name of the character....and I might watch.  But don't dare try to tell me it's Sleepy Hollow because they killed it with Abbie. 

 

I completely agree with both of the bolded sections above. (For some reason I can't make a space between those quotes on my screen, so I'll number my specific responses.)

 

1. There are articles all over the place referencing what's happened on SH and other shows. Hollywood has been screwing up big time, due to the fact that they don't seem to understand that fans don't just blindly support a show. We hate being lied to. The system has been naive and counting on our stupidity for way too long. 

 

2. One reason I'm thinking positively about this situation involves a passage from the article I posted.

 

Fox has Sleepy Hollow, which recently ended its third season with a shocking finale that saw one of its leads die. While nowhere near the ratings highs of the first season, Sleepy Hollow has a following, logs solid DVR gains, and, because of the famous underlying property, the series makes money for Fox internationally, so getting to four seasons would be financially beneficial for the company. While Sleepy Hollow is on the bubble, there had been positive signs, and I hear the studio has been doing contingent staffing moves to be prepared in case the series is renewed.

 

 

 

For the sake of my point, I'll put aside compassionate reasons: At the end of the day, behind the scenes, SH is a business. In its current state, Nikki Beharie's absence will affect their bottom line. If TPTB are able to get her back I hope they give her a raise. A BIG one. 

 

As for the timing of her return, I'm patient. Perhaps TPTB can send Crane on a quest to find her. 

Edited by C76
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jhlipton

jhlipton

Nicole (source:  Digital Spy)

 

Also from this source:

 

What have you made of the fan reaction to season two so far? Some fans wanted to see more from Abbie (and even had a hashtag #abbiemillsdeservesbetter).

"That's been a tricky situation because we're trying to build an ensemble cast and develop a lot of different characters and stories and we have to branch out into that world.

 

What a "diva"!!! [/sarcasm]

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Three

Three

I am really glad she has another gig lined up, don't get me wrong here, and it sounds like the remake could be interesting and timely. But from my faulty recall, and if they don't stray too far from the original, the casting options for her in Jacob's ladder are wife or girlfriend. Hopefully moving forward she gets roles that put her front and center.

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archiesmom

archiesmom

(edited)

I am really glad she has another gig lined up, don't get me wrong here, and it sounds like the remake could be interesting and timely. But from my faulty recall, and if they don't stray too far from the original, the casting options for her in Jacob's ladder are wife or girlfriend. Hopefully moving forward she gets roles that put her front and center.

Well, deadline did say re-imagining and not straight remake. I guess that could mean anything but changing genders of the lead wouldn't be unimaginable if they changed the time frame of the story. 

 

 

 

ETA: After reading the Variety article, you're probably right. Ahh, hoping it's still something good.

Edited by archiesmom
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Three

Three

(edited)

Well, deadline did say re-imagining and not straight remake. I guess that could mean anything but changing genders of the lead wouldn't be unimaginable if they changed the time frame of the story. 

 

Fingers crossed it is a role worthy of her talent.

Edited by Three
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AnnaMayWong

AnnaMayWong

Been side eyeing this heffa for a minute.

After she said Ichabbie shouldn't be together.

Plus she's BFFs with Katia Winter.

My glances have been rather sharp with her, also.

Her responses about this debacle while on THE TALKING DEAD (FTWD) have ...

⬆Well, methinks more than a wee bit o' JEALOUSY and some cozyin' up is taking place. I truly truly hate thinking THIS much less voicing THIS, however...

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Julia

Julia

(edited)

Just, _*Michael Ealy*_. First Common Law broke my heart, then Almost Human broke my heart, and I don't really watch ensemble romantic comedies or serial killer stories, but now, I actually get to see him finish something.

 

Also, those are two very pretty humans. Just saying.

Edited by Julia
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