#BlackLove - General Discussion

[Tara Ariano]

Quote

In the series premiere, five unique, independent black women try to find love in New York City.

[ethalfrida]

One of them is Monet from MAFS...

[Primetimer]

Married At First Sight alumna Monet and several of her friends try to work on themselves in order to develop better romantic relationships. Will you fall for it?

Read the story

[ethalfrida]

I am a big Monet fan. Period.

 

Looking forward to viewing.

[girlplease]

Me too! I always thought she got a bad rap.

I didn't catch the whole episode, but it looks...kind of promising?

[ethalfrida]

Actually, Girlplease (like your name), I found a couple of the ladies a lttle on the producer-generated side. The odd fake boobies and the gender preference confusion was same old, same old. Monet was interesting but it her personality to be so. I will probably watch it but it is not what I expected. What about you?

[Empress1]

I didn't watch Married at First Sight so I don't know who Monet is, and these women do seem shoehorned together, particularly the youngest one - she doesn't seem to be actually friends with the others. I'm the target demographic though (single black educated professional 30something woman, no longer in NYC but lived and dated there for a decade) and my TiVo knows me well, so it recorded this.

 

I like that the show appears to actually address race. I do feel like dating as a black woman is tough, particularly if you're an educated professional like these women seem to be, and you want a man who's also an educated professional. There just aren't that many. Black women outnumber black men in college and grad school. I am taking a dating break (I've been through a lot, including heartbreak, in a short time and need to spend some time putting myself back together), but one of the frustrating things I saw when I was online dating was that it was pretty common for men - including black men - to say that they were willing to date all races EXCEPT black women. On Match.com you can check off boxes for the races you're willing to date, and I would frequently see all the races checked except black women. OKCupid published a blog on race and dating, and they found that black women and Asian men got the fewest responses. So I hope the show gets into the idea of interracial dating (I think I saw a few non-black men in the women's dates in the preview, and one of the men who sent over a round of drinks was white). I'm open to it and have done it (I've always had a rainbow coalition of friends) but I know a number of black women who only date black men. I also liked that the young one (I don't know all their names yet) asked if a white woman would be asked about her preferences for dating older men with money (I think she would; white women are called gold diggers all the time).

 

I set the TiVo to record the next episode, so we'll see!

[girlplease]

Actually, Girlplease (like your name), I found a couple of the ladies a lttle on the producer-generated side. The odd fake boobies and the gender preference confusion was same old, same old. Monet was interesting but it her personality to be so. I will probably watch it but it is not what I expected. What about you?

 

There definitely seemed to be some manufactured drama (especially when they were badgering the youngest one about dating older men), but it's refreshing enough to see professional 30something black women on my TV, so I'll stick with it for a while and see where it goes.

[Fabaire]

I really like Monet too and she looks fantastic.

 

The only one of the group that I'm a little puzzled by is the youngest one (who incidentally had a "sugar baby" Tumblr awhile back.) She seems like and odd inclusion given that the show is about mature women and relationships but I guess maybe that cast her for her conflict potential.  She's a beautiful girl but those boobies need a little rest post surgery before being trotted around on display.

[Neurochick]

I am going to watch this show later today, but I hope the address something that nobody seems to want to take on.  Shows like these make black women feel like they're the ones doing something wrong, when that's not the case.  The problem is that we live in a racist, white supremacist society with a skewed view of femininity.  Now this has always been the case, but decades ago the media wasn't in your face 24/7 and the Internet didn't exist as it does now.  

 

All a person has to do is turn on the TV and see what this country sees as feminine, long straight hair, size double zero, "classic" read white features, light eyes, you get the picture.  THAT explains the OkCupid "study."  At the same time Asian men aren't seen in the media, as being sexy, as having swag.  This isn't true, but this is what the media shoves down our throat.  

 

Here's an example, I live in NYC.  Let's take local news.  I don't think there's a single black anchorwoman who is wearing her natural hair on TV.

 

I also believe it's rare to see a black woman in a commercial rocking her natural hair.  Contrast that with the old Soul Train commercials in the 1970's, heck watch old episodes of Soul Train from the 70's.  Some of those black women wore extensions, but not all.

 

My point is that in the past few decades, the image of black women has been beaten to the ground and IMO it makes it harder for men to find black women attractive, not because of anything black women have done, but what the media has done.

[ralph]

i'm so glad someone FINALLY talked some sense into Monet. I love that girl, she's awesome in everyway, but she really needs to stop saying how she wants a "traditional man" with "traditional values" because she DOES NOT. She got one, and she hated him. Even at the MAFS reunion the experts explained to her that that's what she got and that she should take her marriage to Vaughn as a learning experience and see that "traditiona" is not what she wants, she said she understood...and years later she's still saying the same thing

[Neurochick]

I don't like the woman dating coach. She badgered the young woman because she wanted a man who had money? WTF is wrong with that? What does she want the woman to do, date homeless guys?

Why do white, female therapists want black women to date down? Are they afraid black women will steal "their" men?

Edited December 13, 2015 by Neurochick

[ralph]

I don't like the woman dating coach. She badgered the young woman because she wanted a man who had money? WTF is wrong with that? What does she want the woman to do, date homeless guys?

Why do white, female therapists want black women to date down? Are they afraid black women will steal "their" men?

i thought that female therapist was black. atleast partially

[Empress1]

I don't like the woman dating coach. She badgered the young woman because she wanted a man who had money? WTF is wrong with that? What does she want the woman to do, date homeless guys?

Why do white, female therapists want black women to date down? Are they afraid black women will steal "their" men?

I don't think this is unique to white female therapists. I think black women are encouraged to marry black, and if that means dating a man with less education or money, so be it. And I think it's very encouraged by the black community - "your own kind isn't good enough?" that sort of thing.

 

I do agree about dating men with at least some money - I mean, I'm not trying to land a baller (I'm not suited for that life at ALL) but I had a long relationship with a broke dude (starving artist), and I won't do that again. Another friend of mine was with a guy for four years and he didn't work at all during that time (first year he was finishing law school, the next three he was trying and failing to pass the bar and get a job; he's since relocated halfway across the country and gotten a job in an unrelated field) and the next guy she dated had a good job. She was like "It's so nice not to have to pay for everything!" But I more thought the therapist was trying to get her to see that there are levels - like, would that woman date a teacher or an accountant that she has a ton in common with? Because it seems like (at least at first glance) that she goes for the superficial, which might be fine for now since she's not looking for something serious, but eventually she'll want to look deeper.

Edited December 14, 2015 by Empress1

[qtpye]

I wish Monet would stop using the word "traditional man".  I like Monet and want her to find love, but she is saying traditional, when she means "established".  She wants a man who is at least as successful as she is, career wise, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Edited December 15, 2015 by qtpye

[Tara Ariano]

The women begin making strides in finding love.

[still hoping]

 I flipped through some of this it has the housewife fake feel...like some of these "friends" were totally cast for the "part" (shaved head,big boobs bi gal LOL)

 

I always liked Monet and it would be nice to see her find a nice guy so will check back

[Neurochick]

I don't think this is unique to white female therapists. I think black women are encouraged to marry black, and if that means dating a man with less education or money, so be it. And I think it's very encouraged by the black community - "your own kind isn't good enough?" that sort of thing.

 

 

This is very true and very sad and it makes zero sense.  Black women are encouraged to marry black; however it seems that black men didn't get that memo.  So if black men marry interracially at a higher rate than black women, where does that leave black women?

[announcergirl]

On second and third thoughts, I think the therapists asking her about why she was fixated on a man with money -though it sounded odd when she announced it repeatedly coming from her, for some odd reason - I do feel it was legitimate to question would the therapist had asked a non-black woman that question. All races of people except black people have been taught, trained, ingrained even, to search for a man who makes them financially secure. Black women are taught to find a man that will work or who has potential. These are broad generalizations based only on what I have heard or seen and not fact, so please don't be offended: Asian women are told to go for wealthy white men. White women to go for wealthy white men. Even Hispanic and Latino women to go for wealthy white men and no one blinks an eye. I feel some kind of way about this line of questioning. And, that therapist did not look non-white to me, but I will look again, in fairness.

[Neurochick]

On second and third thoughts, I think the therapists asking her about why she was fixated on a man with money -though it sounded odd when she announced it repeatedly coming from her, for some odd reason - I do feel it was legitimate to question would the therapist had asked a non-black woman that question. All races of people except black people have been taught, trained, ingrained even, to search for a man who makes them financially secure. Black women are taught to find a man that will work or who has potential. These are broad generalizations based only on what I have heard or seen and not fact, so please don't be offended: Asian women are told to go for wealthy white men. White women to go for wealthy white men. Even Hispanic and Latino women to go for wealthy white men and no one blinks an eye. I feel some kind of way about this line of questioning. And, that therapist did not look non-white to me, but I will look again, in fairness.

 

Yes, that's exactly what I was getting at.  Black women have been taught to look for "starter men."  I have worked with women of different races for over thirty years and I've NEVER heard one of those women say that was okay.  In fact one of them told me I'd be a fool to look for a starter man, because I have mine.  Black women have been taught to put yourself last, because, we got to save the race and all that stuff.  

 

That's why the therapist pissed me off with her questions.  

 

The therapist looks black-ish to me because she looks like a lot of my relatives.  

Edited December 17, 2015 by Neurochick

[Empress1]

I loved the floral clutch Monet was carrying with her yellow outfit. She has cute taste.

 

It was nice to see some things moving forward. I still haven't learned all their names, but the one who is newly exclusive seems happy with her guy. The one dating the Irish guy seems happy too, and he was very sweet to her - there was a moment where she kind of leaned into him and he kissed her on the forehead that I thought was very cute.

 

I don't know why, but there's something that bothers me when people say "I can't see myself getting divorced." No one gets married to get divorced, but half of people end up that way, and divorce doesn't always mean failure.

 

I can do lots of social things alone. I've been to concerts, plays, standup comedy alone, I go to the movies alone all the time, I've traveled alone, gone out for meals alone. And I've gone to bars alone but it feels weird (unless I was traveling), so I could empathize with the divorcing one about that. I think part of it is that I'm not actually trying to pick up at a bar; it just means I want a drink I don't have in the house, and to get out of the house. I do wonder if she's actually ready for dating - she was married for six years and she's only been divorced for 7 months. I briefly dated a guy who had been divorced less than a year (he'd been married 13 years) and he swore up and down that he was ready to date, but he so was not. There was no chance of reconciliation (she was having an affair, which was a "shut it down" deal breaker for him) but he so clearly had not fully grieved the relationship. He and I wouldn't have worked out anyway - we weren't compatible - but there were a few times where I thought, OK, you are still working through some things. Which was fine - to be expected! I wonder if that's true for her. She certainly wouldn't throw herself a divorce party.

[announcergirl]

Ok the female counselor is definitely black. My bad

[announcergirl]

 I do wonder if she's actually ready for dating - she was married for six years and she's only been divorced for 7 months. I briefly dated a guy who had been divorced less than a year (he'd been married 13 years) and he swore up and down that he was ready to date, but he so was not.

 

Just an aside: I totally feel you on this one and agree that it is tricky to date someone recently out of a relationship. Sometimes they lie about their readiness, and sometimes they don't even know they aren't ready, yet.

 

I can say, for myself, sometimes though, people checked out years before. So on paper it looks like a long union, but emotionally it was over a long time ago. They were married, but single.

[Pepper Mostly]

I really enjoyed this episode! Yeah, at times it was a long ad for trendy spots in NYC--what did we see, the charm shop, the restaurant where Monet and her friend met up, the ice cream place, the bar the divorcing woman (sorry, can't remember anyone's name yet!) went to, the boutique with the cute dresses.....I liked Monet in MMFS and I like her here. I like all the women and I'm looking forward to seeing how things go for them! One thing that stood out to me was how pretty they all looked in their colorful dresses--at the therapists' meeting, and again at the ice cream shop, and at Monet's party. All of these ladies are fabulous dressers! I look forward to seeing what they're rocking!

[Empress1]

Just an aside: I totally feel you on this one and agree that it is tricky to date someone recently out of a relationship. Sometimes they lie about their readiness, and sometimes they don't even know they aren't ready, yet.

 

I can say, for myself, sometimes though, people checked out years before. So on paper it looks like a long union, but emotionally it was over a long time ago. They were married, but single.

Oh, I went out a few times with a guy who was in the act of divorcing, like "I have a hearing on Tuesday" in the act, and he was definitely ready to move on. His marriage ending was more of a slow fade, grow apart sort of thing compounded by the fact that he worked "pretty much all the time," in his words. (His work schedule was why we only went out a few times; he was a self-made success, which was very admirable, but there was basically no balance in his life. Nice guy though.) With the first guy, he found out his wife was cheating and was basically like "Welp, I'm out" that day. I'm exaggerating but only a little - he found out she was cheating, put together an exit plan, and she came home one day and found him gone. And the way he told the story made it clear that he had some shit to work through.

 

ANYWAY. From the woman on the show's demeanor, it seems like she is still grieving the end of her marriage. I do think this workshop is a good idea for her because it will help her figure out more concretely what she wants, and I liked her self-awareness that she needs to have or be working on having her shit together if she's going to be advising others. And she definitely seems like she needs her hands held a little bit when she dips her toes into the dating pool, and I think Jack Daniels the therapist, who I quite like (I definitely like him more than the woman therapist) is good for that. But I just wonder if she'll emerge from the end of this in another serious relationship, or if she'll emerge single but with a stronger sense of her dating self. I think the latter would be just as successful as the former. 

[girlplease]

I think what I really like about this show is that these are grown ass successful ladies who just haven't quite got the relationship stuff figured out yet. Yes, they have their quirks, but none of them seem like a mess - like the people you'd usually see on a dating show. They're very relatable - the type of people you meet and think "wow, why are they single?" Even Jae is starting to grow on me - yes, she's got lots to learn, but in this episode she seemed a little more mature for her age. 

 

And my goodness, yes, they are great dressers! I'm coveting all of their accessories, too - isn't that what Monet does, something in the fashion world involving accessories? Thought I read that somewhere...

Edited December 18, 2015 by girlplease

[qtpye]

Monet knows how to dress in a way that makes her body look fab.  In the now defunct Blood, Sweat, and Heels they had this lady who wore really nice clothes, but they were all wrong for her body type.  Monet was giving me life in some of her outfits.  I really hope the young one is not just there as a plant to cause trouble...she seemed more sincere this episode and her explanation for dating older men made sense.  I am just glad it is not daddy issues like Jaimie from Married at First Sight (at least not yet).

[Empress1]

What I like about this show is that so many of my and my friends' dating experiences are depicted here, except for the "getting married on a blind date" thing.

 

Jae's story about falling in love with a man who disappeared and turned back up married happened to one of my best friends - she was seeing a guy, he went back to his home country, and when he came back he was married. With her it was a cultural thing - he basically acquiesced to an arranged marriage over there. She knew he was going, she just wasn't expecting him to come back married. She was like "Um, well, OK, good luck then."

 

And I can relate to Laree too because I tend to be pretty guarded. I'm working on it - I was much more open in my last relationship - but it's something I have to make a concerted effort to do. I like that she's giving Carl a chance.

 

Dr. Jack Daniels’ face when Tanesha (I’m learning their names!) talked about training a man had me cracking up. He had this great "Girl, what?" look on his face.

 

I have been to the Museum of Sex. I ain’t ‘shamed. Tanesha seemed pretty overdressed though – she was in a cocktail dress with cutouts, Monet was in jeans and a t-shirt, and Jae was in a casual summer dress with Chucks.

 

Cynthia's date was very cute, but that date did not go well. Good for her for getting out there and I hope that doesn't discourage her.

[ralph]

I'm loving Cynthia and Laree.

Cyn's so pretty and I love that she's sassy and funny and a little bad ass, but at the same time a little kitten.

Laree is gorgeous, I love her hair and her sense of humor. The guy who breaks through her was walls will be very lucky.

I couldn't stop laughing when Tennesha's controlling nature kicked in and she wouldn't even let poor Errol cut a damn strawberry.

And maybe women are the exception to Jae's age rule because Nnekka looks about her age.

[ridethemaverick]

I liked Cynthia's date. He couldn't stop smiling once he laid eyes on her. Also, I love to joke and crack on folks so he would have been right up my alley. I think she just wasn't ready to do the first date volley thing but she'll get back into the swing of things eventually.

Tenesha. Lordt. Bless her heart, she'll get there too. I know one thing, being raised independent can go both ways. You can end up a control freak, or you can end up like me, who was so happy to have some relief that I let my husband do everything, wrong and all LOL.

Carl and La are sweet.

I'm really enjoying this show.

[Vivigirl10]

I watched a marathon of the show and just loved it.  These are ladies you want to hang out with:  fun, intelligent, insightful/introspective, motivated, funny...but all imperfect and that's what makes them interesting.  Jae kind of doesn't fit in but that doesn't ruin the bunch.

 

Love, love, love, their clothes!  I'd watch for the fashion inspiration alone.

[venusnv80]

What I love most about this show is the fact that these are MY friends. These are the type of women I know and relate to. Those women on these other reality shows...nope!

[girlplease]

Yes! I really, really like all of these women and am rooting for all of them. That NEVER happens on reality tv!

 

I wish Tennesha could unclench just a little bit more. She'll get there, I think. She's going to be a great partner when she does.

 

I don't get the impression that La is really into her boyfriend all that much. I think she likes him and enjoys spending time with him, but there's no love there.

 

Monet is so charming and funny. I want to be friends with her!

[crgirl412]

I didn't realize the show started yet!!  I have to watch the earlier episodes!  I've loved Monet since MAFS so I know that the quality of the women would be high!  I relate well to them since I am single, never-married and have had a very difficult times getting over people so I don't date a lot.  I am looking forward to watching!!

[Empress1]

I seem to be the only person watching this show, but [shrug].

 

I could really relate to this topic. I have been told I'm "too independent" by men before. When Monet was saying she was raised to always be able to take care of herself, I nodded in agreement. (And I firmly believe that everyone should have, as a professor of mine called it, a "fuck you fund.") My mother has a career. Her mother got divorced and built a career for herself, including going back to school (she was married in her late teens). My dad's mother was also married in her late teens but she stayed married to my grandfather until her death. She raised two boys and then started a career in her forties. And what I'm learning about myself is that I truly don't need a man to take care of me financially, but I want a man to take care of my feelings and emotions - and one who is supportive of my professional efforts. And that's hard to find.

 

Tennesha. GIRL. With those tomatoes though? Chill. Out. But I have to say, I thought Errol (who I love) handled her brilliantly. (At that party, it seemed clear to me that Jae just met all those women whenever they cast the show. The rest of them seem to be actual friends.) But I could also relate to her not liking to ask people for things. I HATE asking people for things. I have had a version of that conversation, where the other person (not just a guy, I hate asking friends and family too) was like "... That's it? Of course I'll do [mundane, not that deep task.]"

 

Cynthia, wait until you get your first dick pic via online dating. It's going to happen.

 

I felt bad for Antonio getting friend zoned but if Monet's not feeling it, she's not. (He's cute though.)

[ridethemaverick]

I can't relate at all. I've always been independent too, because that's what adults do. I never had a problem in relationships, maybe because I didn't wear it like a badge of honor or act like I was special because of it.

That's what I see from some of the ladies on this show. I mean Jae and Laree are independent but I don't see that with them. Monet, Tenesha, and Cynthia? I see that coming from a mile away. If I see it, I know men are seeing it.

Monet could have finessed that brushoff a little better lol, but oh well.

I don't care for Nneka and I don't know why.

Errol and tenesha are adorable.

[girlplease]

Aw, I'm still watching, Empress1! I found the episode really relatable too - also raised to take care of myself and to focus on my career (my dad always says "make sure you've got some 'fuck you' money in the bank" - ha!). What I wasn't taught is how to be vulnerable, that I don't have to do everything myself. I read somewhere that when you have a very independent personality like that, you're actually denying others the enjoyment of doing something kind, and it makes it harder for them to get close to you. People like to help!

Tennesha, honey. I was hoping she'd give Errol a more...manly task in getting ready for the party? Helping move some furniture or something. Instead she's critiquing his pepper slicing technique. OK then. I still think they're cute together.

I don't see Monet as desperate, necessarily? Maybe she gives off a different energy in person, but she just seems bubbly and outgoing to me. Poor Antonio, didn't see it coming (and she was pretty oblivious that he was into her).

So Jae clearly didn't know the rest of the women beforehand - but I thought Monet or Tennesha also mentioned something about "getting to know the others" through the workshop? They all seem pretty comfortable together so it seemed like an odd comment.

[IvyDancer]

I can't relate at all. I've always been independent too, because that's what adults do. I never had a problem in relationships, maybe because I didn't wear it like a badge of honor or act like I was special because of it.

That's what I see from some of the ladies on this show. I mean Jae and Laree are independent but I don't see that with them. Monet, Tenesha, and Cynthia? I see that coming from a mile away. If I see it, I know men are seeing it.

Monet could have finessed that brushoff a little better lol, but oh well.

I don't care for Nneka and I don't know why.

Errol and tenesha are adorable.

 

I agree with your post. As blunt and harsh as my comment will be, I think Monet could use a bit of polishing. I cringed when she flat out told her date that she wasn't attracted to him. I give her credit for being honest, but I couldn't imagine having to handle a comment like that if it were directed towards me. I think Monet and Cynthia are a bit too loud and proud to be independent, if that makes sense. I don't necessarily think that they need to be needy, but they should try to be a bit more welcoming and accommodating. I can't really see a man who would date them and envision something long term since they come off as abrasive. 

 

The girl that was dating the other girl - they were so cute! I loved that they dressed alike! And then it seemed to fall apart as their meal continued. Again, I respect her preferences but her friend looked so disappointed when the girl revealed her feelings about a relationship. Again, credit for being honest so early on though. 

 

I think Errol is perfect for Tenesha and I hope she learns to relax and enjoy the ride. I love watching their relationship develop though and hope that they have found continued happiness together.

Edited January 7, 2016 by IvyDancer

[ralph]

broke my heart when Monet was friendzoning Antonio. she thinks the lack of chemistry was mutual...but naw, dude was gushing over her. he's so cute though. i'll take him if she won't. and she was terrible at letting him down easy. she really rubbed the "friend" thing in and just assumed that he felt the same way  can't believe the guy she would rather have. the dude had the hugest yellowest teeth, the weirdest features and an even weirder since of humor. oh...and the IRONY of Monet talking about taking the pressure of wanting a family off her dating life, when she's already finding fault in a man on the first date because hes "too busy to start a family"

 

shame on them for lying to Cynthia. yes girl, dirty picture requests are like 75% of online dating. and shame on Monet for leaving her at the bar with those dudes. i would've died.

 

I think Errol's gay.

 

looks like the end of Jae and Nneka. She doesn't seem too "dating other people" thing.

 

like Monet, but yeah, she's sending desperate vibes even through the tv screen. i'm a man and i'm picking up on it.

 

Since Monet was in Cynthia's wedding and they've both referenced their pasts together and the generally seem close to each other, I think of all the women they've known each other longer and most likely the only "real friends". I think Tennesha is reasonly close to the circle, with LaRee a little close to them as well...but Jae is obviously newer to the group and was probably a casual friend that the show put into their lives a little more.

 

I didn't know you could say coochie on tv

Edited January 7, 2016 by ralph

[Empress1]

Aw, I'm still watching, Empress1! I found the episode really relatable too - also raised to take care of myself and to focus on my career (my dad always says "make sure you've got some 'fuck you' money in the bank" - ha!). What I wasn't taught is how to be vulnerable, that I don't have to do everything myself. I read somewhere that when you have a very independent personality like that, you're actually denying others the enjoyment of doing something kind, and it makes it harder for them to get close to you. People like to help!

I got checked on this in my most recent relationship. The guy was like "It makes me happy to do stuff for you, please let me." He also pointed out that I like to help other people, so why wouldn't people like to help me? And I think Errol said something like this to Tennesha on their picnic, that he liked to plan stuff and take her out and her controlling that undermines it. (He was nicer about it than that, if I remember right.)

[Neurochick]

Here's the thing about being independent.  The main reason so many women are independent is because we can't be sure that the man is always going to be there.  If half of the marriages in the US end in divorce, you have to know how to take care of yourself, just in case the man splits.  For black women is this more true, because there are very few black men today who are a) doing well in life (no prison time, no babymamas, and have real jobs) and b) actually want to date AND MARRY black women.  More black men marry women of other races than black women (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/06/12/interracial-marriage-who-is-marrying-out/), so that means there are less black men for these women to date and marry, if they want to date and marry black men.   And IMO that's the reason for so many black women being called "too independent" or whatever else is said.

[ridethemaverick]

What does too independent mean?

I'm black, a woman, and independent (because adult). I dont understand why that is that preventing relationships for some women.

I just don't buy it. It's not the independence. It's gotta be the way these women are relating to men.

[Neurochick]

What does too independent mean?

I'm black, a woman, and independent (because adult). I dont understand why that is that preventing relationships for some women.

I just don't buy it. It's not the independence. It's gotta be the way these women are relating to men.

 

I think independent is the wrong word, because adults should be independent.  

 

But, if you're in a relationship and don't allow the other person to do anything for you; you always have to drive, you always have to make the decisions, you always have to pay, etc.  That's not really being independent, that's being controlling.  

[girlplease]

I also think that men can be boggled a bit by successful, together women because it somewhat restricts their opportunities to show off their own success, to treat, to get that feel-good sensation of "being the man".  As Empress noted above, if you aren't particularly looking for the economic support, but want the emotional connection, it's hard to deny one and still get the other - men aren't taught to value the emotional support as much as being the financial provider. 

 

It can be hard to reconcile that "ok, gotta hustle, no one's gonna take care of me but me" upbringing with "ok, now I have to be a delicate flower and let someone else pay the tab/open the door/hail the cab". If you were taught that you could not rely on men, it's hard to deprogram that to allow yourself to rely on them in the small but meaningful ways that create trust and connection.

 

Cynthia is just plain not ready to date yet, and probably shouldn't throw herself out there for a while. She will find fault with every man who crosses her path....until she's ready.

Edited January 7, 2016 by girlplease

[Empress1]

What does too independent mean?

I'm black, a woman, and independent (because adult). I dont understand why that is that preventing relationships for some women.

I just don't buy it. It's not the independence. It's gotta be the way these women are relating to men.

I feel the same way - I once said to a friend, "So I'm supposed to default on my student loans because some dude might feel some type of way about it?" But I do think that many men like to feel needed and default to economic need, or "stuff around the house" need. With someone like Tennesha, her control issues are real if she nitpicks every guy (or friend - if I were at her place and she was critiquing the way I cut tomatoes, I'd call her on it) like that, and if she hesitates before asking people for stuff and controls the way they do the stuff she eventually asks them for, I can see why a man would be like, well, what do you need me for?

 

Cynthia is just plain not ready to date yet, and probably shouldn't throw herself out there for a while. She will find fault with every man who crosses her path....until she's ready.

 

Totally agree that Cynthia isn't ready to date. She seems like she's in the phase where she recognizes that the relationship is over (I think Dr. Jack Daniels asked her if there was any hope of reconciliation and she said no) but she's still grieving it. I think this workshop will be good for her to figure out what she wants in terms of dating/a partner so that when she IS ready she'll make good choices, but I don't think she's ready right now. Although I do think having a support system in the form of the other women and the two psychologists is helpful for her navigating online dating for the first time. It can be a minefield. (One of my best friends and I are both fairly newly single - me more newly than she - and we're like, "oh my GOD, we have to go online again? UGH." There are good guys on there - I met the last two guys I've dated online, and she met the guy before the most recent guy online and she was with him for four years - but there are a lot of creeps. Trading online horror stories can be fun though!)

 

What did people think of Monet's blind date, the white Wall Street guy?

[qtpye]

I also think that men can be boggled a bit by successful, together women because it somewhat restricts their opportunities to show off their own success, to treat, to get that feel-good sensation of "being the man".  As Empress noted above, if you aren't particularly looking for the economic support, but want the emotional connection, it's hard to deny one and still get the other - men aren't taught to value the emotional support as much as being the financial provider.

 

 

I was talking to an older black gentlemen who has been married to the same beautiful black woman since the seventies.  He said that women today (he did not say just black women) did not know how to be wives.  I asked him what did he mean.  He said that a man wanted to be taken care of and catered to.  He said men had fragile egos (more fragile then most women) would not communicate their needs, but expected a woman to always make them feel "manly".

 

I told him that that was to be expected when men were the main breadwinners, however, today many women earn either as much or just totally out earn their husbands.  Husbands and wives should take care of each other, but there is no way a modern woman has the time to cater her husband the way some of our grandmothers did.

 

When Monet was married to Vaughn he mentioned that his mother did all the cooking, cleaning, child rearing, and brought home more money then his father (or something to that effect, I do not remember exactly what he said so I could be wrong).  I mean what the heck did his father do for his mother?

[girlplease]

What did people think of Monet's blind date, the white Wall Street guy?

 

Meh. (I'm like Cynthia, I can't fake it. Ha!)

[Neurochick]

I was talking to an older black gentlemen who has been married to the same beautiful black woman since the seventies.  He said that women today (he did not say just black women) did not know how to be wives.  I asked him what did he mean.  He said that a man wanted to be taken care of and catered to.  He said men had fragile egos (more fragile then most women) would not communicate their needs, but expected a woman to always make them feel "manly".

 

I told him that that was to be expected when men were the main breadwinners, however, today many women earn either as much or just totally out earn their husbands.  Husbands and wives should take care of each other, but there is no way a modern woman has the time to cater her husband the way some of our grandmothers did.

 

When Monet was married to Vaughn he mentioned that his mother did all the cooking, cleaning, child rearing, and brought home more money then his father (or something to that effect, I do not remember exactly what he said so I could be wrong).  I mean what the heck did his father do for his mother?

 

And that is the problem right there.  Men like that want women to cater to them, but forget that they too have a part to play.

Edited January 8, 2016 by Neurochick

[qtpye]

I remember I was talking to a man who was complaining that his wife did not know how to iron his shirts properly.  His wife has a demanding career of her own and she is raising two children under the age of five ( know he did very little to help).  I asked him why did he not do it himself and he looked at me like I sprouted two heads.

 

I am not saying all men are like this or trying to be man hating.  However, the whole motto of a woman being able to bring home the bacon and fry it up in a pan, but not ever make a man forget he's a man, puts a lot on our shoulders.

 

Also, as Neurochick pointed out, in some places like Atlanta, black men just have the numbers on their side.  They do not have to compromise...so why should they?  Maybe, it will be different on this show since these ladies are in New York.

 

I am glad Monet broke it off with that guy.  I like the dude, but I am glad she is not wasting her time with a guy she is just not "feelin it" with, just to be with somebody.

 

I am also glad they are showing how other races can appreciate beautiful black women and black women should let them.

[Neurochick]

I think all the women on this show, as well as other black women, should read this.  http://bougieblackgirl.com/you-deserve-better-70-things-every-black-woman-must-do-now-to-live-the-life-she-wants/