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Spoiler Discussion Thread

Morrigan2575

By Morrigan2575
in Arrow

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Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

Me for all of last summer hiatus and 5A: Me after reading the WM interview from a few weeks back about Felicity's arc giving her a more profound understanding of Oliver: Me after r

BkWurm1
BkWurm1

I tend to think that trying to make KC a place on the show had a ripple effect that did hurt the show pretty badly.  She's what turned Quentin stupid and into a creepy stalker.  So that wipes off the

calliope1975
calliope1975

Challenge accepted.

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kismet

kismet

This is gonna sound weird but I really hope we find out why there are literally no flowers at the grave. It's really bugging me. I mean, does Laurel get outed as BC when she dies and people stay away? I really can't think of a reason why there wouldn't be flowers unless not many people were there.

 

Don't mind me, just thinking about random pointless crap today. LOL.

Maybe in lieu of flower donations she requested people make donations to a charitable cause. Though why the show would feel the need to tell us those details is beyond me. Then again they decide to tell us some random details at times while skipping over important details ~ so who knows what their masterplan is this time...

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)

Maybe in lieu of flower donations she requested people make donations to a charitable cause. Though why the show would feel the need to tell us those details is beyond me. Then again they decide to tell us some random details at times while skipping over important details ~ so who knows what their masterplan is this time...

Or maybe they took the portable arrangements to decorate the gathering after the funeral.  When my dad died our  house was filled with plants and bouquets and relatives were sent home with others. Only the large stands of flowers were left behind.

 

Edited cause spelling counts.

Edited by BkWurm1
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catrox14

catrox14

Or maybe they took the portable arrangements to decorate the gathering after the funeral.  When my dad died our  house was filled with plants and bouquets and reletives were sent home with others. Only the large stands of flowers were left behind.

 

That's what we did for my Mom's memorial service last year. I kept one set and gave out all the rest.  

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looptab

looptab

So, Stephen mentioned returning to a specific bow in s5. I think it's his old bow, bu it has to be during flashbacks, right? At some point Amanda Waller has got to give it back to him , and hopefully he should acquire the kind of ability he had in s1 - which he definitely didn't have when we saw him in Coast City in 401. :/

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

Brought over the specific quote to ponder.

-- SA said that he would like a new bow and that he actually needs a new bow. Then he said: "I think that there would be a very good reason in Season 5 to go back to a very particular type of bow. And you'll have to wait, you'll have to wait and see how that will unfold."

Hmm, to me it seems to imply present day stuff but the bow he had in season one was broken and the replacements seemed like an upgrade. Expensive, customized upgrades. Could he be in season 5 somewhere where he has to go back to a more basic model?

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looptab

looptab

(edited)

I don't know, what would the good reason for him to go back and using that kind of bow in present time be? Plus, can you imagine, no more shooting in the moon and flying away!

Edited by looptab
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)

It was his line about wanting a NEW bow that made me think present tense but maybe one thought just reminded him of the flashback bow returning in the flashbacks?

Edited by BkWurm1
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

SA said that he prefers a recurve bow (s1) to a compound bow (s2+) because the compound bow is so easy to shoot (so very competitive, he can show off with a recurve).

But he also complained how hard it was to hold it for a long period of time during takes with the bow drawn back.  He was sympathizing with the actor that played Diggle Jr. 

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Chaser

Chaser

KC posted a dubsmash with Tommy Cole. It looks like she went back to brunette.

Does anyone remember if EBR had to get permission to cut her hair last summer? I'm just curious.

Is it weird that I kind of miss the days of looking for clues that KC was leaving?

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Primal Slayer

Primal Slayer

It's a standard thing nowadays. Alyssa Milano had to get permission to get her pixie cut and Ginnifer Goodwin went one step further having it in her contract that she has control over her hair. What's odder is that Katie did it before she showed up to the con on Sunday which is probably why she was uber late.

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Angel12d

Angel12d

LOL why would you dye your hair the morning you're due to be at a con? I don't understand, Katie! Wyd.

OMG I'm talking about hair dye now. Post the promo pics already! We're scraping the barrel. LMAO.

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Chaser

Chaser

It's a standard thing nowadays. Alyssa Milano had to get permission to get her pixie cut and Ginnifer Goodwin went one step further having it in her contract that she has control over her hair. What's odder is that Katie did it before she showed up to the con on Sunday which is probably why she was uber late.

I would totally take the Ginnifer Goodwin approach. I didn't realize she had dyed her hair then. I thought she did it when she got to LA.

Yeah that's a little odd. Not just the timing but she probably didn't go to her normal hair stylist for it. I'm so loyal to my colorist that that would be nerve wrecking for me.

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Danny Franks

Danny Franks

I stopped watching Arrow after the season 3 premiere. With Laurel gone I might pick it up again. 

 

I had that thought too. But honestly, the whole show sounds like a complete mess, and I'm not sure I want to subject myself to that again. The writers seem to value cheap drama over anything of substance, and that's one of my bigger peeves with television writing. 

 

Killing yet another female character is problematic, in a whole different way, and the fact that it's Laurel this time shouldn't really get them off the hook for it.

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Chaser

Chaser

S4 is a huge improvement over S3. Even taking into consideration the Baby Mama Drama, every element has been better. As much as we complain about the show runners, they did listen and they did adjust.  

 

Killing Laurel is another course correct for me. S3 embraced the Comic and it took a lot away from the show I loved in S1/S2. Too me, Laurel's death is a huge sign that they are going back to a S1/S2 mentality of creating their own vision. Laurel feels a lot like a checkmark character. Someone they don't enjoy writing so they keep an episode check list. I'm excited to see what the show can do with the characters they do seem to enjoy putting in the work for.

 

I'm interested in seeing if any go the stunt problems get fixed. If there will be a noticeable improvement with one less body or if the stunts are just going to continue to suck.

 

Laurel is the only character really interacting with everyone. I'm looking forward to seeing Felicity and Diggle be friends again. I want to see a relationship develop with Felicity and Thea. More scenes with Diggle and Thea. I want Nyssa to come back and interact with Thea, Diggle, and Felicity.  With the 2nd billed actor gone, I'm hoping it frees up funds to get more recurring characters.

 

Killing Laurel isn't going to fix every problem with the show, but I'm hopefully its going to have a really positive effect. 

 

Seriously, if they would just kill off Malcolm too it would be a perfect season.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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Laurel is the only character really interacting with everyone. I'm looking forward to seeing Felicity and Diggle be friends again. I want to see a relationship develop with Felicity and Thea. More scenes with Diggle and Thea. I want Nyssa to come back and interact with Thea, Diggle, and Felicity.  With the 2nd billed actor gone, I'm hoping it frees up funds to get more recurring characters.

 

And now we know why.  They had to make Laurel integral to every member of Team Arrow in order to make the death have maximum impact on each character.

Laurel is Diggle's new BFF bonding over secrets and dead siblings coming back to life

Laurel is Thea's sister/roommante/mentor (never saw that one in show but we were told that)

Laurel is Oliver's relationship councilor

Laurel is Lance's daughter (never changed / nothing new)

 

The only TA member I didn't see them connecting Laurel to in S4 was Felicity, unless I missed it.

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hogwash

hogwash

Ray's gone. Laurel's on the way out. Malcolm is the only holdout from S03's suckfest. I hope he's not S05's main villain. He's no threat to Oliver and he's probably the biggest exception to Team Arrow's "no kill" rule. 

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Chaser

Chaser

(edited)

Ray's gone. Laurel's on the way out. Malcolm is the only holdout from S03's suckfest. I hope he's not S05's main villain. He's no threat to Oliver and he's probably the biggest exception to Team Arrow's "no kill" rule. 

SA made a comment about Oliver finding a balance between the Killer in S1 and the No-Kill Rule Oliver later adopted. I'm really really really hoping that Oliver killing Malcolm is the start of his balance.

Edited by Chaser
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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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But they did have LL be supportive of Felicity/Oliver. And even agree with Oliver how strong she is. Maybe its implied closeness.

Weren't both of those scenes with Oliver?  I counted those more towards Oliver than Felicity.   I was trying to find a scene with L/F similar to the L/D, L/T and L/O scenes we've had and I just couldn't come up with one but, i've missed a few episodes so it's probably there, somewhere

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Password

Password

Weren't both of those scenes with Oliver? I counted those more towards Oliver than Felicity. I was trying to find a scene with L/F similar to the L/D, L/T and L/O scenes we've had and I just couldn't come up with one but, i've missed a few episodes so it's probably there, somewhere

Nope there aren't any L/F moments at all. The only one I can think of is when Laurel asked Felicity what Thea meant about "not wearing it" in relation to the ring.

Other than that Laurel has had scenes with Oliver about Felicity though.

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ComicFan777

ComicFan777

I think the show established Laurel/Felicity "friendship" last season and it is just assumed that they are still close this season.  They probably wanted to focus on getting Laurel to be friends with everyone else before her death.

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tarotx

tarotx

Mama Smoak did say to Felicity that she had no idea that Lance was Felicity's friends dad. But there has been no Felicity/Laurel special moment but's that probably coming up now that they are both Oliver Queen exes. Though maybe it's another thing they learn not to force after season 3? If I'm remember correcting didn't KC and EBR said they try to show their friendship as best they can since there's nothing really in show about it.

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ComicFan777

ComicFan777

(edited)

I think the writers figured that it's believable that Felicity is close friends with everyone she knows and that she would be sad if anyone she knows dies, so why work for it.  The Laurel/Felicity scenes always seemed not genuine, so why remind us - it's better to just let us assume they are still friends.  Laurel did say in the crossover that everyone loves Felicity in her own backhanded way - good enough, Laurel loves Felicity like everyone else.

 

The writers had to remind us that Laurel and Thea are like "sisters" in order to make Laurel's death more poignant if she ends up saving Thea.  I'm sure they knew that they had a lot of work on their plate this season to make Laurel and Oliver be friends again to make that single tear Oliver shed at the grave be earned, so my guess is why most of their focus would be on Oliver.

Edited by ComicFan777
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bijoux

bijoux

Mama Smoak did say to Felicity that she had no idea that Lance was Felicity's friends dad.

It was on the heels of Laurel visiting Felicity at the hospital, so assuming they're friends makes sense.

I ran across the wedding photo on Twitter and remembered SA that it will be a heartbreaking scene. After this hiatus and that really low key break up, I want it to hurt GOOD.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

It was on the heels of Laurel visiting Felicity at the hospital, so assuming they're friends makes sense.

I ran across the wedding photo on Twitter and remembered SA that it will be a heartbreaking scene. After this hiatus and that really low key break up, I want it to hurt GOOD.

He said it was a 10 on a 1-10 heartbreak scale, but SA's opinion re what's good on this show is, shall we say, suspect.

 

So yeah, Oliver's as likely to say "Hey, so that whole Baby Mama thing...crazy, right?" as anything actually heartbreaking to live human beings with normal Earth feelings.

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looptab

looptab

He said it was a 10 on a 1-10 heartbreak scale, but SA's opinion re what's good on this show is, shall we say, suspect.

 

So yeah, Oliver's as likely to say "Hey, so that whole Baby Mama thing...crazy, right?" as anything actually heartbreaking to live human beings with normal Earth feelings.

LOL, now there's some part of me that wants him to say that. Like he's talking about the weather.

 

BTW, as @Primal Slayer noted in the BTS thread, now that KC went brunette, she won't be able to post old pics as new; she has scheduled a con overseas during  what would be the middle of the filming schedule for s5. She isn't even trying to hide it, at this point. I wonder why.

Someone upthread mentioned missing putting together clues, I guess at this point we would be at 99% even without the photos leak.

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kismet

kismet

And now we know why.  They had to make Laurel integral to every member of Team Arrow in order to make the death have maximum impact on each character.

Laurel is Diggle's new BFF bonding over secrets and dead siblings coming back to life

Laurel is Thea's sister/roommante/mentor (never saw that one in show but we were told that)

Laurel is Oliver's relationship councilor

Laurel is Lance's daughter (never changed / nothing new)

 

The only TA member I didn't see them connecting Laurel to in S4 was Felicity, unless I missed it.

Like others are saying, I think we were supposed to assume the F/L friendship was established in s3 and continues going strong even if they never show us or barely even tell us. Plus isn't LL so warm & friendly with a big heart that everyone just loves her??? (sorry, for the snark).

 

Also, FS's reaction in the limo could be the writers attempt to solidify that F/L were friends. Nothing like a little monday morning relationship quarterbacking.

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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

If I wanna go full conspiracy theory here, I'd say KC figured out during the Saturday at the con that everyone knows Laurel's in the grave. Then she shows up on Sunday not only 3 hours late, but with brown hair. That sounds like a "fuck it" to me.

 

I almost respect it, except for the 3 hours late part when people who paid money to see her are waiting.

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looptab

looptab

(edited)

I like this theory. There's definitely been a shift. BTW, I hadn't even noticed that she had brown hair on Sunday. When they posted those selfies they looked like usual to me, haha.

Edited by looptab
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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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Like others are saying, I think we were supposed to assume the F/L friendship was established in s3 and continues going strong even if they never show us or barely even tell us. Plus isn't LL so warm & friendly with a big heart that everyone just loves her??? (sorry, for the snark).

 

Also, FS's reaction in the limo could be the writers attempt to solidify that F/L were friends. Nothing like a little monday morning relationship quarterbacking.

I agree but, I would think they'd have included a scene or two in S4 just to remind people/have it hit home in 418.  

 

I guess they kind of did, now that I'm thinking about it.  You have the scene in 409 when Laurel calls the little girl a mini-Felicity and then there was a scene in the crossover, (I believe) where Laurel says the "that's why we love you" line to Felicity...not sure if she was being sarcastic or not.

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statsgirl

statsgirl

I'm pretty sure that at this point, we're meant to take Laurel and Felicity being BFFs.  Laurel was the one who comforted her when Oliver went Al Sa Him and next episode we're going to get Laurel supporting Felicity in the Olicity break-up.

 

Killing yet another female character is problematic, in a whole different way, and the fact that it's Laurel this time shouldn't really get them off the hook for it.

There was very little choice.  If they wanted to make the death have an impact again, as opposed to Malcolm, Slade and Sara all surviving, the only choices were Diggle, Felicity, Thea, Laurel or Quentin.  Anyone else, like BM, William or Donna, would have been a cop out.  Killing Lyla would have made Diggle a single dad.

 

Setting aside Felicity and Diggle, who they didn't want to lose, that just leaves Laurel, Thea or Quentin.  Laurel or Thea would make the most impact.  And Laurel would be a bookend to Tommy dying at the end of s1.

 

Or you could go with the conspiracy theory that they wanted to get rid of Laurel and this was killing two birds (groan) with one stone.

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