Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Starfish35]

I think we will be seeing Sara's flashbacks when she was rescued by Nyssa and maybe Ra's al Ghul will be introduced in this episode. I really don't want to think about Sara dying and I don't think she will be dying any time soon.

I hope you're right, but I could see them mixing flashbacks from her being rescued and training with the present day, telling the beginning and ending of her story at the same time.

Unfortunately it just makes too much sense to me in a miserable sort of way. But hopefully maybe at ComicCon they'll announce that Caity will be recurring throughout season three or something like that, and so we can stop worrying. :)

[KirkB]

Scene: Rooftop: Oliver is surprised to see Sara. "Hey, what brings you back to Starling?"

Sara: "It's cold in Nanda Parbat. I came to get my jacket from Laurel."

Laurel arrives. "Sara, hey!"

Nyssa darts her, and after Laurel is out starts to take the jacket off.

Sara: "Nys, I was kidding."

 

Seriously though, while I do think they will probably kill Sara if the intention is to turn Laurel into the Canary, I doubt either of those things is going to happen right at the beginning of the season. Most likely SARA will be an episode focused on, well, Sara and her time in the League, though I question whether we will actually see Ra's or not. @Orion makes a good point about killing Nyssa, while I would hate to lose KL it would give Sara some major pain (instead of Oliver for a change) and be a good excuse for Ra's to show up.

[statsgirl]

I think we will be seeing Sara's flashbacks when she was rescued by Nyssa and maybe Ra's al Ghul will be introduced in this episode. I really don't want to think about Sara dying and I don't think she will be dying any time soon. Her flashbacks will just be starting. 

This makes sense to me. The opening episode of the season is Oliver and manpain heavy -- trying to get QC back and failing, meeting Ray Palmer who now runs it, Thea missing for five months, and whatever blocks his date with Felicity.  Then the second episode is about that popular character Sara and her flashbacks to how she became the Canary.  Then back to Oliver again, and maybe Sara in Starling City fighting with him for some reason.  It's true they could kill her off later in the season, which I would hate, for some plot contrivance but that's speculation based on the name Dinah Laurel Lance and I can't imagine a reason for it right now. 

 

Also, I miss Oliver's Wicked Witch of the West eyepaint so much.

 

He was really cute with it on. I wonder if they put him into a mask as part of the comics! story or if he developed a reaction to the paint as Virigina Hey did on Farscape.

To be honest, I have my issues with this Ray Palmer development that have absolutely nothing to do with Olicity but everything to do with the show and its now established pattern of using Felicity's popularity to attach new characters to in order to launch more spin offs. I want her to date and have a life outside of Team Arrow and Oliver but why can't it just be a normal guy who's not actually a superhero/vigilante in his own right? 

It's really a compliment to EBR that they use her character to get the audience to like new characters on the show (unlike...er...). I don't think it's possible for her to date a normal guy because there are no normal guys on this show.  The closest were Tommy, who was Oliver's boyhood friend, and Roy, who dated Thea and then became mirakuru'd.  If she were dating a normal guy, they wouldn't put him on screen, and probably wouldn't talk about him other than in casual passing because the show is All About Oliver.  We haven't even got Felicity's own backstory much less a story of who or why she's dating.

[geepi]

How long before round 2 of the Lance sisters/ollie story of epic love ?

[Password]

I want her to date and have a life outside of Team Arrow and Oliver but why can't it just be a normal guy who's not actually a superhero/vigilante in his own right?

I think it would be impossible to maintain a relationship without the LI knowing about her activities. She said herself she spends much of her time with Oliver so having a bf who also fights crime and may assist Oliver may be easier. She'd never have to cancel dates and run off or neglect her bf.

To be honest after the date reveal I'm very curious how they'll handle Felicity and Ray getting together. Will she just get fed up with his "because of the life" line or will she not see his feelings.

Whilst I don't think they'll kill Sara right at the beginning of the series I am internally groaning that there'll be an entire episode of her. I already nearly died of over exposure last season so I'm not particularly happy about this development.

She's cool in doses but please stick to Arrow. If BC is as big and important a character as she seems allow her her own show. Don't infringe on my Oliver Queen time because that's not why I watch the show.

Edited July 16, 2014 by ArrowLimbo

[Velocity23]

Caity Lotz back in her Canary costume! posted today by James Bamford

 

[BkWurm1]

To be honest after the date reveal I'm very curious how they'll handle Felicity and Ray getting together. Will she just get fed up with his "because of the life" line or will she not see his feelings.

 

Yeah, I'm curious too.  I'm also not sure which scenario I'd prefer - the fed up or clueless?  Clueless is easier to accept but I'd understand the fed up and probably respect her for trying to move forward. 

[Password]

I would be with her on the fed up because I'm fed up. If she knows he likes her likes her I imagine they'd have a talk, he'd say he can't yet and she'd accept that because Felicity is a mature adult.

I don't think she was actively waiting on him so I can see her moving on after such a revelation. It's just nice to know you're not the only fool in love in the situation.

[At Leisure]

I've never gotten the feeling that Felicity is hung up on or waiting for Oliver to come around. True that she was upset about Isabel but I strongly believe that can be only because Isabel was a meanie.

I mean Felicity seemed pretty gung ho about having a thing with Barry. Also she never showed any jealousy over Oliver/Sara. And since Oliver never confirmed his feelings on the Island, nor is he (I'm assuming) likely to do so during the five month break. So I'm thinking Felicity has no expectations from Oliver and is ready to move on to taller dudes with shrinking abilities.

I for one would hate for her to sit around and wait while Oliver gets his game on elsewhere. Why should he be the one to decide where, when and how the relationship is to begin? Also if he doesn't allow her to see his true feelings (which I think the EPs are going with) then she has every right to date Ray.

I say bring it on. This will help both of them grow. Oliver will learn beyond a doubt what Felicity means to him and Felicity will realize that though Oliver might not be the be all and end all of her being...he still matters the most.

Strangely enough...I think I'm more invested in Oliver/Felicity chemistry/ lingering looks/ angst than the actual relationship. I'm scared that if not done properly,it might ruin the best onscreen dynamics ever.

[geepi]

I am very much afraid they will ruin the O/F chemistry/SL with their BC obsession. Can't they have a BC spin off so we can have the Arrow show back ?

[Velocity23]

I just hope they don't start heavy on the Lance family again. I Will be having deja-vu to season 2 and i was already annoyed with it then. 

[FurryFury]

I am very much afraid they will ruin the O/F chemistry/SL with their BC obsession. Can't they have a BC spin off so we can have the Arrow show back ?

 

By all means, go for it. I'd definitely prefer to watch Sarah kick ass and take names while Oliver continues to drown in his manpain and Felicity dates a classic Romantic False Lead but inevitably realizes Oliver's the guy for her. And if not Birds of Prey, let's then just take Sarah, Deadshot, Helena, maybe even Slade as well and make a Suicide Squad (with Amanda Waller recast or her mother or aunt of something). I'd watch the hell out of it.

[apinknightmare]

Given that this is the summary for ep 2: Season 3’s second episode will find Oliver hunting down a vicious killer and mercenary who is wanted for murder in seven countries and now is targeting victims who are associated with a specific company, I'm guessing Sara's the vicious killer and mercenary?

 

Or the killer is someone associated with the LoA, and Sara refuses to participate and then she gets offed.

 

Hopefully we'll get more info on her number of appearances at Comic-Con, OR hopefully we see her show up again in BTS pics after ep 2 is finished filming.

[abhi]

It could be Katana, killing all the people responsible for killing her family (or maybe its an organization ). And maybe that company is not Queen Consolidated but some other company and Katana is in some way related to LOA.

[Morrigan2575]

You guys really think that they hired her back as series regular and I think it's safe to say she's a S3 series regular at this point (have to keep it quiet, it's a secret, oh we can officially announce she's back, yay! oh look here's a picture of her on set for 301) only to kill her off in 302?  

 

I honestly don't think I can take another season of OMG they're going to kill Sara offf....any minute now she's going to die...for Laurel.  If they wanted her dead to start Laurel's journey they would have killed her in S2, IMO.

 

"That's our hope," executive producer Greg Berlanti tells me. "Our hope is to get some crossovers going sooner rather than later with all the shows."

 

What shows other than Flash is he talking about? iZombie? (mid season replacement) new spin-off announcement? He can't be talking about Constantine and Gotham, neither would fit with Flash or Arrow's universe.

 

I was thinking about this on my drive in to work and I don't think it pertains to the willpower drug or a fake date or anything like that.

 

Berlanti told TVLine that rather than standing alone as a brief blurb within a larger logline, there’s better context” for the proposition in question.  But yes, it is happening.

 

“They’re real characters to us, and they had that conversation on the beach, and they had that conversation in the house to help capture Slade,” Berlanti reminds. “So the question you have to ask is: Does Oliver have real, genuine emotions for her? And how aware is he of that? And how aware does he make her of that? That is an active part of the season this year.”

 

I think he's referring to the fact that it's not just a throw away aspect of the episode, that it's going to factor into the season long arc of Oliver determining how much of his humanity he wants to get back.
 

Edited July 16, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[Happy Harpy]

Felicity dates a classic Romantic False Lead but inevitably realizes Oliver's the guy for her.

Which is why I don't want Felicity to date Ray. Those will they-won't they stalling tactics are sterile imo: They lead nowhere and on the opposite, often mean regression for the characters involved.  They have ruined many TV relationships, or at least made them lose a great part of their charm (Castle/Beckett, Bones/Booth, YMMV). I don't want Oliver/Felicity, a very enjoyable -and important, re:TA- relationship even in a platonic way, to be affected by this curse. I don't know how the "date" will be dealt with, but hopefully it won't be a mere redux of the fake ILY, which would be imo a very inauspicious sign for the future of this storyline.

Felicity has been presented, imo and despite EBR being a gorgeous young woman, like the girl who guys don't notice at first, or/and who doesn't notice that guys like her ("for once, a guy's interested in me"); so I could see her:

1) being oblivious of Oliver's feelings until he confesses them flat out, for real. I don't wish some more manpain on him, I don't especially want to see him pine for Felicity (or Felicity to pine for him; here I agree with , I don't think she did so far). But I want him to spit it out at one point. Imo, after the fake ILY, he owes this to her.

2) being oblivious of Ray's feelings, too.  And I don't want Ray to fall in love at first sight with her, but to develop feelings for her because she's awesome. If they have to go the LI's route, which I still hope they won't (this storyline fizzling, Isabel-like).

If it doesn't turn to pissing contest and stays at the stage of awkwardness/tension, I'd be OK with Ray falling for Felicity, and Oliver noticing. It would be one of the catalysts for him in coming to terms with his feelings/the life I lead thing/the diverse loss he suffered, and part of his character's growth in general. In the meanwhile Felicity, independent woman, would focus on her job, on her vigilante activities, and be busy with a backstory about her family/past, in other words, have storylines where she exists as her own character and not as a male character's love interest or as a kind of trophy between two male characters.

 

If they kill Sara off, in the words of another super hero show, the EP are with all due respect galactically stupid. Not only, after Moira and Tommy, it will deprive Arrow of an interesting character with many possible storylines and connexions, not only it will deprive the viewers of a character that was widely embraced as the BC and generally well-liked, but on top of it, imo Laurel will be victim of even more backlash. There's no way, still imo, that people won't think that Sara was killed off "for her". And if KC can't help another, litteral this time, "cat that ate the Canary" smile, like she did in the season finale...Ouch.

Moreover, I think it would send quite a negative message to, it seems, a good chunk of the audience. It would mean that TPTB are able, and willing, to sacrifice anything in order to have Laurel as the BC, and probably as the female lead and Oliver's end game (because otherwise, why not simply keep her in another capacity?). It would mean that no one and nothing is safe, no matter how popular they are or how well they works for the show.

I wonder how many people, and not only die-hard Sara fans, would take it as a signal to give up.

So if indeed "Sara" as a title seems a bad omen, I can't believe that they will make such a mistake.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Happy Harpy

[apinknightmare]

You guys really think that they hired her back as series regular and I think it's safe to say she's a S3 series regular at this point (have to keep it quiet, it's a secret, oh we can officially announce she's back, yay! oh look here's a picture of her on set for 301) only to kill her off in 302?

I honestly don't think I can take another season of OMG they're going to kill Sara offf....any minute now she's going to die...for Laurel. If they wanted her dead to start Laurel's journey they would have killed her in S2, IMO.

I was thinking about this on my drive in to work and I don't think it pertains to the willpower drug or a fake date or anything like that.

I think he's referring to the fact that it's not just a throw away aspect of the episode, that it's going to factor into the season long arc of Oliver determining how much of his humanity he wants to get back.

I really hope you're right on both accounts.

[Lisasstar]

So episode 3x02 is Titled 'Sara' . Perhaps it is because Sara will be no more because....Laurel dies and Sara takes her name as tribute becoming Dinah Laurel Lance/Black Canary. And will be called Dinah.

Too Much to hope for?

Edited July 16, 2014 by Lisasstar

[Sakura12]

There's a lot of things they should've and could've done to start Laurel's journey, and they have failed epically on every turn so I do not trust these writers with anything when it comes to the precious. 

 

But I do hope they know that killing Sara for Laurel will not gain Laurel any new fans. Which is why I think they are going to be destroying Sara's character first then kill her. So I don't think she'll die in 3.02 but it will add more to her downfall to prop Laurel up, then she'll die either mid-season or in the S3 finale as a villain. 

[Sunshine]

If the big bad vicious killer wanted in seven countries is Ra's the company whose employees are being targeted could be Merlyn Global which is headquartered in Starling City.  Although it is in receivership because of Malcolm's death, Ra's knows he is alive thanks to Moira.  At the end of S2, Malcolm certainly seemed like he had access to wealth so perhaps he has some inside help?.  Sara's backstory might be their way of showing the general audience (those who don't read comic books) what it means to become a member of the LOA and just who Ra's is.  Sara's reasoning for coming back to SC could simply be to protect her family should they get in Ra's way.  Each time she has come to SC that has been her motivation, protecting her dad and Laurel, not SC.  She did help defeat Slade and his army but she always stated her motivation as protecting her family.

 

Sara's reappearance might also be how Oliver discovers Malcolm is still alive and thus becomes even more worried over Thea being MIA. 

 

I don't know if they are making CL a regular or not but they could make her a regular and somewhere later in the season simply have her leave SC to try to make a new life for herself elsewhere.  Perhaps she takes Sin with her.  (BTK is supposed to be back for S3). They sent Slade to jail at the end of S2 after making him a regular.   If she is in SC the full season, I would think she would also help with some of Laurel's training.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Sunshine

[Starfish35]

You guys really think that they hired her back as series regular and I think it's safe to say she's a S3 series regular at this point (have to keep it quiet, it's a secret, oh we can officially announce she's back, yay! oh look here's a picture of her on set for 301) only to kill her off in 302?

Well, no, if they really have made her a series regular, I don't think they'd kill her off - of course not. But I'm not as convinced she's really going to be a regular. If she is, I still don't understand why they wouldn't have announced that at upfronts like they did with Barrowman. I mean, I'd be happy if she was, but....I just don't know what to think right now. But yes, if they come out at ComicCon and announce her as a regular, then I would think she's safe for the season anyway.

Given that this is the summary for ep 2: Season 3’s second episode will find Oliver hunting down a vicious killer and mercenary who is wanted for murder in seven countries and now is targeting victims who are associated with a specific company, I'm guessing Sara's the vicious killer and mercenary?

Oh please no. :(

I could see it though. She's gone back to the killing and lost more of her soul. Oliver tries to get through to her, and the episode is about the struggle between the killer she's become and who she really is.

Or maybe the killer is Nyssa? That would be a way to set up Ra's as the Big Bad of the season, if Nyssa somehow dies in all of this.

ETA: I like Sunshine's ideas - that Sara comes back for help stopping Ra's, and/or to give Oliver information about Malcolm.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Starfish35

[HighwayFlower]

The only thing I want Laurel training for is finding the quickest way out of town.

I want to be happy about Sara coming back, but I'm too scared it's all about destroying her for Laurel.

[KirkB]

   You guys really think that they hired her back as series regular and I think it's safe to say she's a S3 series regular at this point (have to keep it quiet, it's a secret, oh we can officially announce she's back, yay! oh look here's a picture of her on set for 301) only to kill her off in 302?

 

   You don't think they'd kill off a series regular? Ask Tommy about that. Or Moira.

   I'm not saying they are going to kill off Sara, and even if they do I doubt it would be in the first couple of episodes. It would probably be later in the season, maybe even in the finale.

[BkWurm1]

Or maybe Sara and Nyssa are in town to target the vicious killer and Arrow is getting in their way?

[KirkB]

That would be my guess. Sara and Nyssa were probably sent to kill the person and Oliver has to stop them.

[Sakura12]

I would hate it if Sara was the one training Laurel only so she could die and the way behind skill level Laurel takes her place as Black Canary. The BC is supposed to be better than Oliver at hand to hand combat and since this show is called Arrow I expect we'll never see that but they at least made Sara, Oliver's equal in fighting prowess. 

 

As a woman I really don't want to see a female who is a formidable super hero in her own right be a sidekick to Green Arrow. With Sara they avoided that, with Laurel they can't. 

 

With the "Sara" episode I really think it's about introducing Ra's al Ghul over just being about Sara. Sara is our way to meet the Demon and his League. We'll see what kind of training Sara received and probably when she fell in love with Nyssa. They already used the LOA title and they can't very well call it Ra's al Ghul or The Demon without giving away that we will be meeting him or most likely meeting a shadow of a man that will eventually be Ra's when they cast him. 

Edited July 16, 2014 by Sakura12

[MsSchadenfreude]

I like Sara well enough, but I feel like I got plenty of her and all of the Lances' story in season 2.  Having a whole episode devoted to Sara doesn't thrill me.  That said, I don't want them killing Sara to further some kind of journey for Laurel either.  Frankly, I'd just rather the show focus a little less of the Lance sisters and a little more on some other characters for awhile.

[formerlyfreedom]

Hey, folks, we have asked you to stop speculating on Laurel as BC for the time being in the Notes from the Mods topic. You've got it covered pretty thoroughly, so until there is anything solid from the show, let's just move on from that topic. Thanks.

[tv echo]

I too am afraid that they are bringing Sara back just to kill her off.  In any event, the return of Sara to Starling City means more Laurel on my TV screen.

 

More reporting on the spoiler of Caity Lotz returning in the Season 3 premiere ("The Calm"):
http://screencrush.com/arrow-season-3-spoilers-black-canary-caity-lotz-premiere/

Edited July 16, 2014 by tv echo

[Sakura12]

They really have to see how excited people are for Sara being in S3 over the groaning any mention of Laurel receives. Which is maybe why they are not mentioning her at all in any articles. There are really on two choices for the EP's of this show, own it or drop it. 

[Morrigan2575]

You don't think they'd kill off a series regular? Ask Tommy about that. Or Moira.

   I'm not saying they are going to kill off Sara, and even if they do I doubt it would be in the first couple of episodes. It would probably be later in the season, maybe even in the finale.

 

I NEVER said they wouldn't kill off a series regular.  What I said was Do you really think they'd bring Sara back in S3, make her a series regular and kill her off in the FIRST 2 episodes of S3?  Here's a better question if her ultimate fate is only to die to further Laurel (not Oliver's journey).   Why not killer her off in S2...why even bring her back in S3?  

 

Well, no, if they really have made her a series regular, I don't think they'd kill her off - of course not. But I'm not as convinced she's really going to be a regular. If she is, I still don't understand why they wouldn't have announced that at upfronts like they did with Barrowman. I mean, I'd be happy if she was, but....I just don't know what to think right now. But yes, if they come out at ComicCon and announce her as a regular, then I would think she's safe for the season anyway.

 

 

Can you think of an Upfronts Press Release that actually mentions non-series regulars?  I can't.  

 

As to why wait...they were still negotiating the details of her contract?  It seemed fairly obvious that everyone behind the scenes knew CL was coming back in S3.  SA mentioned it at the Denver Con, CL mentioned that it was a secret and she couldn't talk about it at both Chilie and Denver Con, Katrina Law talked about going back for Arrow filming at a recent con, AK tweeted Brandon Routh and CL about needing her back for S3...when they were filming their movie.

 

Can I say with 100% certainty that's she's a series regular?  Nope, not until they announce that detail.  However, it certainly seems like a 90% probability that CL will either be a series regular or major recurring character...given that the original casting notice for "Lisa" mentioned possible series regular...my thoughts are geared in that direction.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[dtissagirl]

Someone mentioned upthread that it would be just like these writers to make an episode that is both the start and end of Sara as Canary -- with flashbacks to the LoA and then killing her in the present. That got me thinking that maybe she's not dead by the end of the episode, but she's renouncing being "Canary" and deciding to be called something else. [uGH.]

[statsgirl]

Given that this is the summary for ep 2: Season 3’s second episode will find Oliver hunting down a vicious killer and mercenary who is wanted for murder in seven countries and now is targeting victims who are associated with a specific company, I'm guessing Sara's the vicious killer and mercenary?

I think Sara is also going to be hunting him/her and that's how she gets back to Starling City.  Since Oliver has cut down on his time with the notebook (s1 mission) and general Starling City criminals (s2 mission) he's free to join her for old times sake, since the bad guy is a bad guy after all.  I don't think he'd try to stop her getting the guy since he is a killer and this isn't Oliver business.

 

I think he's referring to the fact that it's not just a throw away aspect of the episode, that it's going to factor into the season long arc of Oliver determining how much of his humanity he wants to get back.

That's what I think too, that making the decision that he deserves to have a life again is this season's arc.  (I'd like it if they would parallel that with Sara feeling that she can have a life again too instead of punishment to atone.)    So whatever is going to happen with Felicity is going to take all season. Or at least it would on another show. This one, it may only take till Christmas.

 

But in order for Oliver/Felicity to work in the end, Felicity can't know that he has feelings for her because then Felicity looks like a jerk for going with Ray.  "If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with" even though the one you love loves you back is going to turn people off both Oliver and Felicity.

 

 

If they kill Sara off, in the words of another super hero show, the EP are with all due respect galactically stupid.

Sadly, they are known to killing off characters who still have lots of potential (Tommy, Moira) rather than ones I think should be sacrificed.  But Sara is a Lance and she's the very popular Black Canary, and I think audience reaction would be not just regret as it was for Tommy and Moira but active rebellion.  Tommy's death made Oliver stop killing, Moira's death helped turn him into a hero ... I don't see what Sara's death would accomplish for him.

Edited July 16, 2014 by statsgirl

[Morrigan2575]

Someone mentioned upthread that it would be just like these writers to make an episode that is both the start and end of Sara as Canary -- with flashbacks to the LoA and then killing her in the present. That got me thinking that maybe she's not dead by the end of the episode, but she's renouncing being "Canary" and deciding to be called something else. [uGH.]

Sadly, that is a distinct possibility but I don't see her dropping Canary for another name. If anything, I can see them redefining her as White or Jade Canary...but unless they're actually planning on making someone else Canary in S3 and filling the same role on the team that Sara/Canary is filling; I really don't see that happening either.

However, I'm going to sit over here in either stupid denial or deluded optimism...I just don't see them killing Sara off and I refuse to spend another year living in fear of that happening

Edited July 16, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[FurryFury]

Tommy's death made Oliver stop killing, Moira's death helped turn him into a hero ... I don't see what Sara's death would accomplish for him.

 

Well, if they kill Sara off, it won't be for Oliver. We all know who it will be for *cough*

[MsSchadenfreude]

 

But in order for Oliver/Felicity to work in the end, Felicity can't know that he has feelings for her because then Felicity looks like a jerk for going with Ray.  "If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with" even though the one you love loves you back is going to turn people off both Oliver and Felicity.

 

Hmm, I don't about that.  Depending on how the spoilers play out, I don't think Felicity moving on makes her a jerk at all.  If Oliver tells her he may have "more than friends" feelings for her, but he is doesn't see any future for the two of them because reasons, then I would much rather see Felicity try to move on to other potential relationships with Ray or someone else instead of waiting around for Oliver to get over his issues, assuming he ever does and wants a relationship after all. And, if Felicity/Ray have a relationship, why does it have to be some epic love connection.  What's wrong with two people who like each other (assuming Felicity likes Ray) deciding to go out and see where it leads.    

[Starfish35]

Hmm, I don't about that.  Depending on how the spoilers play out, I don't think Felicity moving on makes her a jerk at all.  If Oliver tells her he may have "more than friends" feelings for her, but he is doesn't see any future for the two of them because reasons, then I would much rather see Felicity try to move on to other potential relationships with Ray or someone else instead of waiting around for Oliver to get over his issues, assuming he ever does and wants a relationship after all.

I agree. I don't see anything wrong with Felicity moving on if Oliver tells her they can't be together. Is she supposed to wait for him the rest of her life?

[Morrigan2575]

This post from ihearttvsnark.tumblr.com seems to cover my thoughts on Sara's fate

http://ihearttvsnark.tumblr.com/post/91948987945/am-i-the-only-one-that-thinks-its-really-ominous

Throughout last season, I never believed they were going to kill Sara off because of the simple fact that it was their decision to bring the character back from the dead in the first place. And since the writers said they’d considered making her Ravanger (Ravager? I don’t even remember), they obviously always planned on telling more of her story one way or another.

I still don’t think they have any intention of killing her. They wrote her out in the season finale and easily could have left her with the league offscreen for as long as they wanted to, but instead, they’re bringing her back in the season premiere and naming the second episode after her. The writers obviously love the character - and there’s nothing wrong with that. They created her so of course they want to use the character as much as possible.

Now, I do admit I thought off/on in S2 that she might be killed off but mostly I leaned towards the no column. Edited July 16, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[Starfish35]

Here's the thing. I was one of the biggest proponents of the Sara is staying theory last season, up until the bitter end. But unfortunately developments in other aspects of the show that we're not allowed to talk about right now have made me much more pessimistic about Sara's fate on the show, whether in this particular episode or later down the road. *shrugs* I'm sorry - I would like to be optimistic - but optimism and this show haven't gone together for me since the season finale.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Starfish35

[Sakura12]

I think they are bringing Sara back and having Oliver ask Felicity out on a date to get the viewers back they upset in the finale. The Olicity date and an episode titled "Sara" that brings back another fan favorite in Nyssa will get fans to at least tune in for those episodes then they will do what they want and hope by then everyone sticks around for it. 

[statsgirl]

I agree. I don't see anything wrong with Felicity moving on if Oliver tells her they can't be together. Is she supposed to wait for him the rest of her life?

No, certainly not the rest of her life.  But this idea that he can't be with anyone he really cares about is b.s. and she should know that especially after he was just with Sara (and if Felicity doesn't already know it. Diggle will be happy to tell her).  So she should at least hold on for a couple of months to see if he gets his head out of his ass.  Then, if he's still being stubborn, she can move on.

 

Ray comes on in the first episode of the season as the person who now runs Oliver's company and is booked on for 14 episodes.    Presumably he's a good guy but Felicity just being his friend is already problematic because she should have some loyalty to Oliver even if it's only in a best friends kind of way.  Immediately dating him when she knows Oliver reciprocates her feelings makes her seem shallow at best and deliberately hurtful at worst (Oliver pushes me away, I'll show him!).  The way this show burns through storylines, even if Ray's episodes are spread out through the whole season, a 'dating Felicity' one will start early.

 

If Oliver gives Felicity the "I can't be with" line and she starts dating Ray soon after that, it's going to be like Laurel, who really wanted Oliver, and then Tommy treated her well and she dated him, and then she found out Oliver was available and she flipped to sleeping with him right away.  It was like for Laurel, Tommy was just a place holder till she got the guy she really wanted.  I don't want Felicity to be like that.  

 

For me it's the timing.

[apinknightmare]

I think they are bringing Sara back and having Oliver ask Felicity out on a date to get the viewers back they upset in the finale. The Olicity date and an episode titled "Sara" that brings back another fan favorite in Nyssa will get fans to at least tune in for those episodes then they will do what they want and hope by then everyone sticks around for it.

I don't know about the Sara ep, but I don't think the O/F date is a move to get people to tune in. If that pairing is a season-long arc like Greg Berlanti says it is, it's more than just a stunt to appease fans. I mean, they knew the 'fake' I love you was going to upset people, and they did it anyway. It's been the most talked-about part if the finale over hiatus. People were going to tune in anyway.

[DrSpaceman10]

Is anyone else tired of the Lance Sisters? I can't believe they're having another Sara-centric episode (after 2x04, 2x05, 2x13...) so soon and even worse calling it "Sara". It would be one thing if all of the other neglected characters (ie: Felicity, Roy, Thea, Diggle) had gotten proper development of their (back)stories, but they  haven't.

 

I'm pissed off that Felicity still hasn't been given a centric episode or a real backstory (Time of Disastrous Pod People doesn't count MGuggenheim). We even know more about Sin's family than Felicity's. If the EPs were so obsessed with Black Canary, then maybe they should have done a Black Canary spin off instead of The Flash.

[Password]

For me it's the timing.

 

I agree. But for some reason I trust them with this particular situation. Felicity is too precious to the show to take a dump on her character. I don't think there's anything wrong with her moving on because Oliver delivers his lines again. She's never, IMO, been actively waiting for him. If he gives her the same spiel, and she knows it's a lie because he was with Sara, why should she place her life on hold for him? I don't think Felicity is shallow enough to do what Laurel did because she's got a serious head on her shoulders, that she uses. If Ray is someone she likes, why not? For me it's just the whole dating the boss leaves a sour taste in the mouth, but if someone else makes her happy, why wait for Oliver to pull his head out of his behind?

 

We make the assumption that to Felicity Oliver is that forever kind of love, but how is she to know? I would think Ray is meant to either help her see there are other dudes that can make her happy, or that Oliver will always be the yard stick.

 

It really depends on how ep 1 pans out I think.

Is anyone else tired of the Lance Sisters? I can't believe they're having another Sara-centric episode (after 2x04, 2x05, 2x13...) so soon and even worse calling it "Sara". It would be one thing if all of the other neglected characters (ie: Felicity, Roy, Thea, Diggle) had gotten proper development of their (back)stories, but they  haven't.

 

I'm pissed off that Felicity still hasn't been given a centric episode or a real backstory (Time of Disastrous Pod People doesn't count MGuggenheim). We even know more about Sin's family than Felicity's. If the EPs were so obsessed with Black Canary, then maybe they should have done a Black Canary spin off instead of The Flash.

 

Totes with you on this entire comment. Felicity hasn't received ANYTHING in the way Sara has. Enough now show, I want Felicity's story too.

[HighwayFlower]

I'm sick of Laurel, but I love Sara and am very interested in her LOA history. I can understand how it takes away from other characters though and would be happy to see her in a BOP spin off with only occasional Arrow visits.

[DrSpaceman10]

I'm sick of Laurel, but I love Sara and am very interested in her LOA history. I can understand how it takes away from other characters though and would be happy to see her in a BOP spin off with only occasional Arrow visits.

 

I would also like to see Sara's LOA history, but only after the other neglected characters have been "serviced". The EPs need to get their priorities in order, at this point it seems to even be infringing on Oliver's story.

[Password]

I would also like to see Sara's LOA history, but only after the other neglected characters have been "serviced". The EPs need to get their priorities in order, at this point it seems to even be infringing on Oliver's story.

 

That's how I felt at one point too. It was no longer Arrow but BC and Sara was the lead of the show.

[Starfish35]

Totes with you on this entire comment. Felicity hasn't received ANYTHING in the way Sara has. Enough now show, I want Felicity's story too.

I reserve judgement on this until I see why Sara's back and for how long (I don't think it's unreasonable to devote an episode to her if she is getting killed off, for instance). I like Sara and i think there's room for both her and Felicity on the show should the writers choose to keep her. I'm more worried right now about her just surviving. And considering we've had more Felicity related spoilers so far than for pretty much anyone else, I'm not yet worried about her getting short changed this season.

[HighwayFlower]

They did say there were holding off on Felicity's past on purpose so they could give it better attention in S3, so I don't think she will be sidelined for Sara. Maybe it was the decision to hold off what they had planned that caused her to be more in the background. They didn't have a back up plan for her.

[Morrigan2575]

They did say there were holding off on Felicity's past on purpose so they could give it better attention in S3, so I don't think she will be sidelined for Sara. Maybe it was the decision to hold off what they had planned that caused her to be more in the background. They didn't have a back up plan for her.

 

That's actually an interesting thought and one I don't think has ever been brought up or discussed before.