Darren Criss/Blaine Anderson

[Sara2009]

Oh I don't agree with what you're saying as to Blaine's actions, but, for example, say at the "Break Up" (5.03: the FIRST one LOL) , when Blaine is telling Kurt he's been with someone

else and explaining that Kurt wasn't there when

Blaine felt lonely. The hurt and devastation and

betrayal that Kurt feels is palpable the way Chris

plays the scene. IN the episode you can see

Kurt's growing fear that something is not quite

right and there is a building internal terror there.

Blaine's confession falls flat and I attribute some of that to Darren's acting choices. His bad acting makes a WTF action by the character even worse because we are suppose to feel that Blaine is horrified over what he's done ( the OTT breakdown singing "Teenage Age Dream" sort of

sets it up) but when he has to deliver THE

ACTUAL LINES, it's just not good. Blaine

comes across as whiny and self involved,

because Darren can't convey that the depths of

what Blaine is suppose to feel. That is crucial

because Chris is showing us how blown away

Kurt is and his (Blaine's ) actions already are so

bad, so the actor, fairly or not, has to try to

salvage *something* for his character.

That scene is suppose to be "the money shot" as far as acting.

There is nothing in his line delivery, and the character actually sounds more shallow and petulant when I know the writers are going for

that what he's done is tearing him apart and he's

oh so sorry and still loves Kure more than

anything else. It's distracting but it's because

Darren can't pull conflicting emotions in one

scene, not the way Naya, Jayma, Cory, Chris

and Lea can.

That is why I can't entirely blame all the fault of the character's failure on the writers and not the actor somewhat on ocassions.

If we're talking over all and not just in " The Break-up," I'd add Dot, Matt, and Jane to that list too.

[truthaboutluv]

That is why I can't entirely blame all the fault of the character's failure on the writers and not the actor somewhat on ocassions.

 

 

And I never did. As I said, there are plenty of scenes I and others I'm sure can point out to Darren's acting falling flat. My point has always been about the actor being blamed for the character in general being a fail and not a fully realized character. That's what I disagree with - that fundamentally the failing of Blaine was on Darren because in my opinion, no, it was largely the fault of the writers. As for the break up scene well YMMV because as I noted in my previous post, I actually didn't think he was that awful in that scene which once again comes back to why comments on acting is so subjective.

 

And for the record, I never thought Cory's acting in the Quinn storyline was bad. My point is that I hated the character during that period which far as I know, based on what the writers were saying, I wasn't exactly supposed to.  While I don't think we were meant to necessarily root for them, per Ryan Murphy, we were supposed to view this as a person always having some feelings for their first love. So I guess I was supposed to understand and feel for Finn and I didn't. I just plain hated him during that storyline. And my point for mentioning that was to show that no, sometimes even the best acting, cannot rise above really, really bad writing. 

[fakeempress]

 

His bad acting makes a WTF action by the character even worse....That is why I can't entirely blame all the fault of the character's failure on the writers and not the actor somewhat on ocassions.

I think this is basically the point of diversion for some of the posters, who don't see the acting as an aspect contributing to the failure of the character, or see no problem there at all. To be clear, I think there is no arguing that the writing failed the character badly, it was the biggest factor. However - since we can't seem to escape comparisons - every actor has had to deal with WTF writing choices for their characters, but as noted for Cory, his acting didn't fail Finn even then - people hated Finn but didn't hate or have problems with how Cory was playing him. Or --as far as the breakup WTF writing and motivation goes, Kurt got the same WTF writing in 601, when he broke up with Blaine and then decided he wanted him back, Chris had to act that and the feelings the writers gave him, and he did so successfully there imo - because if the writing doesn't provide believable motivation, that doesn't necessarily mean there can't be believable acting.  

 

 

My point has always been about the actor being blamed for the character in general being a fail and not a fully realized character. That's what I disagree with

Was that here, or somewhere else, because I don't see much disagreement here that the writing is the biggest fail. 

Edited February 13, 2015 by fakeempress

[SevenStars]

Oh I don't disagree with what you're saying as to Blaine's actions, but, for example, say at the "Break Up" (5.03: the FIRST one LOL) , when Blaine is telling Kurt he's been with someone else and explaining that Kurt wasn't there when Blaine felt lonely. The hurt and devastation and betrayal that Kurt feels is palpable the way Chris plays the scene. IN the episode you can see Kurt's growing fear that something is not quite right and there is a building internal terror there.

Blaine's confession falls flat and I attribute some of that to Darren's acting choices. His bad acting makes a WTF action by the character even worse because we are suppose to feel that Blaine is horrified over what he's done ( the OTT breakdown singing "Teenage Age Dream" sort of sets it up) but when he has to deliver THE ACTUAL LINES, it's just not good. Blaine comes across as whiny and self involved, because Darren can't convey that the depths of what Blaine is suppose to feel. That is crucial because Chris is showing us how blown away Kurt is and his (Blaine's ) actions already are so bad, so the actor, fairly or not, has to try to salvage *something* for his character.

That scene is suppose to be "the money shot" as far as acting.

There is nothing in his line delivery, and the character actually sounds more shallow and petulant when I know the writers are going for that what he's done is tearing him apart and he's oh so sorry and still loves Kurt more than anything else. It's distracting but it's because Darren can't pull conflicting emotions in one scene, not the way Naya, Jayma, Cory, Chris and Lea can.

 

 

I agree, especially since loving Kurt was/is the core of Blaine, which means Darren had the best motivation for that scene. That should have been the best time for Darren to really show this core. Like showing how much the cheating is destroying him from the inside out because of what he did to the man he loves. That he could barely understand why he did what did knowing how much he love Kurt. That the cheating felt like he was not only betraying Kurt but also everything that he stand for because the #1 one thing that he held onto was his love for Kurt and his action belied that truth. 

 

To me that scene was set-up to be all about Darren because of the fact that loving Kurt was his character's core. Chris should have been seen as playing a supporting role in this scene, which was Blaine trying to come to grip with how much his action betray the core of his character. But instead, Chris played his scenes so well that it ended-up being about Kurt hurting and Blaine not really taking responsibility for his own action.

[Hana Chan]

I think that the biggest problem with Darren's acting, besides not really knowing who his character is (both his fault and the writers'), is that he has absolutely no sense of nuance and now to moderate his reactions in a scene. It's always 150% even at times when it needs to be toned down or dialed back. That doesn't imply intensity or emotional honesty, to me. It just makes his character look shallow and impulsive since he shows the same amount of emotional in scenes where his character logically should be more measured.

 

For example (one that has been cited previously) is his performance of Against All Odds. This is coming on the heels of his break up with Kurt and after repeated pronouncements that he loves Kurt and wants him back. But he's also crushing on Sam. Now I'll agree that the song choice (which is not Darren's fault) was a huge miscue because it implied a great deal more emotion than Blaine should realistically feeling towards Sam. Especially when you would expect some level of conflict between those feelings. Instead it felt like Blaine didn't remember that Kurt existed unless someone reminded him that he's supposed to be in love with Kurt. And this has to be chalked up to acting choices because of how he played that scene. At the instant that Tina asked if his song was about Kurt, it should have been a big lightbulb moment for Blaine, when he would realize what he was doing and throw all those confused, conflicted feelings into sharp relief. A pause of a second before answering that he did mean it to be about Kurt would at least hint that he was now considering Kurt in the equation. Instead, we got an instantaneous answer that implied that Kurt wasn't a consideration at all and was just convenient cover at the moment. I don't know if Darren intended the scene to play out that way, but because of how he played the scene that was how it felt.

 

Another example would be Big Brother, when Blaine's conflict with Cooper never really evolved. It was understandable that it might be based in a child's resentment towards his older sibling who took attention away from him, but it never felt like it evolved beyond that. And it made Blaine appear infantile as a result - that a young man who was nearly an adult was still hung up on his big brother taking his toys.

 

There is no question that Darren didn't have good writing to support him for much of his time, but even when he was deliberately given scenes to flesh out Blaine and give his character more substance that he failed to take advantage of those moments. And he didn't use the freedom of not having so much about Blaine clearly spelled out to instill the true to life qualities that the better actors on the show managed to find in their characters. There is a concept in Japanese art where they consider the space between objects to be as important as the object itself. This is an idea that Cory, Lea, Chris and others in the cast fully grasp and it allowed them to really grow their characters even when faced with bad writing. Darren doesn't and in all honestly, I don't know how even the best writing would have helped him all that much.

Edited February 13, 2015 by Hana Chan

[Casual Viewing]

I think that the biggest problem with Darren's acting, besides not really knowing who his character is (both his fault and the writers'), is that he has absolutely no sense of nuance and now to moderate his reactions in a scene. It's always 150% even at times when it needs to be toned down or dialed back. That doesn't imply intensity or emotional honesty, to me. It just makes his character look shallow and impulsive since he shows the same amount of emotional in scenes where his character logically should be more measured...

 

 

There is no question that Darren didn't have good writing to support him for much of his time, but even when he was deliberately given scenes to flesh out Blaine and give his character more substance that he failed to take advantage of those moments. And he didn't use the freedom of not having so much about Blaine clearly spelled out to instill the true to life qualities that the better actors on the show managed to find in their characters. There is a concept in Japanese art where they consider the space between objects to be as important as the object itself. This is an idea that Cory, Lea, Chris and others in the cast fully grasp and it allowed them to really grow their characters even when faced with bad writing. Darren doesn't and in all honestly, I don't know how even the best writing would have helped him all that much.

 

    Darren has the hurt puppy look down pat, but he does indeed lack nuance in his delivery of lines.  I feel like I'm watching someone in a junior high play when he is acting. When I see a someone who is a good actor, they inhabit the character, A good actor never lets you see the "acting" part of the work. 

 

I'm glad you brought out the importance of the space between objects concept.  It is very true in performing whether it be singing, playing an instrument or in acting. There are some singers I just can't stand (cough, Michael Bolton, cough) because they don't know how to do anything but emote throughout the song at the same level on intensity.  True emotion can be portrayed in the quietest, most subtle ways or phrasing, it doesn't have to all out all the time.  

 

[mercfan3]

Yea, I think there's just agreeing/disagreeing on what good acting is, and what people look for in an actor actress. In general, I see Darren as a good actor. I think he's perfectly capable of being nuanced (like, in yesterday's episode with Karofsky, and in the subtle hints he shows at still wanting Kurt.). And he's particularly good at acting with his eyes. I think he's just making acting choices that some dislike. Like, earlier in the thread someone said that they didn't think Blaine was supposed to be a dramatic character. Personally I, and clearly Darren, thinks that Blaine has been a dramatic character since he became young and needy. 

 

Now don't get me wrong, I don't think he's amazing. (I don't think any of the kids are amazing. ) But good. Could have a career. Could do what any director asks of him. 

 

I just think some are stating their opinions like they are facts. 

Edited February 15, 2015 by mercfan3

[fakeempress]

 

Could do what any director asks of him.

This I can say only of people like Daniel Day-Lewis and Meryl Streep. 

[Camera One]

I've never noticed his acting as being particularly worse than anyone else until I went on these boards.  I think everyone is pretty much serviceable, and there is nothing approaching Emmy-worthy in any of these performances given the raw material. 

[caracas1914]

I think if a director wanted him to do "subtle" he would be in deep shit.

[mercfan3]

This I can say only of people like Daniel Day-Lewis and Meryl Streep. 

 

I disagree. I think serviceable actors and actresses do what directors want them to do. 

 

I think Meryl Streep, Daniel Day-Lewis etc.. take it further. Make you feel deeper. 

 

Most bad and good acting can typically be blamed or credited on directors anyway..because the actor/actress is doing what is asked of them.  (Show Girls is probably the biggest example of this. Elizabeth Barkley did EXACTLY what was asked of her by Verhoeven.) 

 

edit: Also, I don't know why people keep saying he can't do subtle. I know sometimes Darren chooses to be over dramatic when many would have preferred Blaine to be subtle. But he does subtle plenty..hell, just last episode in his conversation with Karofsky...and the entire season where he has been conflicted on his emotions for Kurt and Karofsky (which apparently, some missed..so clearly he was being subtle.) 

 

Honestly, I think it goes back to this odd hatred of Darren Criss. Which is odd, considering other people in this cast. 

Edited February 15, 2015 by mercfan3

[caracas1914]

See you lose me when you start talking "hatred".

Of all the cast I probably love Jenna the most and my opining she's a shitty actress is far from "hatred."

I loved Cory and My thinking he was a shitty dancer is far from hatred.

But whatevs...

[truthaboutluv]

In fairness, wasn't Cory's being a shitty dancer an established fact...as in it was even written into the show and stated that Finn was a crappy dancer. Sorry, off topic. Carry on...

Edited February 15, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[mercfan3]

See you lose me when you start talking "hatred".

Of all the cast I probably love Jenna the most and my opining she's a shitty actress is far from "hatred."

I loved Cory and My thinking he was a shitty dancer is far from hatred.

But whatevs...

 

It doesn't have to apply to everyone. But there's a weird sort of vitriol that gets thrown at Darren that just isn't shown to anyone else in the cast except for Lea. (And only to a lesser extent.) Just read some of the comments in the thread... 

[caracas1914]

Point taken, but it's just when talk veers to "odd hatred" of Darren as if he's the only one who gets criticized for his body of work.

Like Lea and company don't get "odd hatred".

Now in the TWP forum the recapper Damian has this obsessive need to throw invectives the Kurt character's way, but I just attributed that to a individual who had issues.

I just don't get how opiniong someone is not a strong actor is "hatred".

Edited February 15, 2015 by caracas1914

[fakeempress]

 

I disagree. I think serviceable actors and actresses do what directors want them to do.

Judging from the many times this or that actor didn't do what he was supposed to do in a scene or a whole episode/movie/TV series, and how I have given up on shows/movies because the acting was dreadful - I don't think so.

 

I will watch anything with DDL and MS just because I'm guaranteed they know what they're doing, even if their director doesn't (there have been such cases).

 

 

But there's a weird sort of vitriol that gets thrown at Darren that just isn't shown to anyone else in the cast except for Lea.

There is "hatred", there is critique, and there is stanning. I consider my posts about Darren in the second category. 

[mercfan3]

Point taken, but it's just when talk veers to "odd hatred" of Darren as if he's the only one who gets criticized for his body of work.

Like Lea and company don't get "odd hatred".

Now in the TWP forum the recapper Damian has this obsessive need to throw invectives the Kurt character's way, but I just attributed that to a individual who had issues.

I just don't get how opiniong someone is not a strong actor is "hatred".

 

I think there's a difference between "he's not a strong actor" and "He's the worst actor ever." 

 

And sure, every character/actor/actress on this show has had vitriol thrown their way..but not the extreme amount and extent that Darren Criss has. He seems to be a very polarizing figure, and it's just really odd. Mediocre to good singer. Mediocre to good actor. (Not noticeably any different than anyone else in the cast.) Seems to be a very nice guy. You'd think he would be more irrelevant to people. 

 

Personally, I'm upfront about being a fan of Darren Criss. Mostly because I think he's funny and good looking. That'll get me. (Also,  because his interpretation of Harry Potter is absolutely brilliant.) But truthfully, the first time I heard him sing, I thought Glee really needed someone like him. A guy that could carry the lead, in ways that Artie, Finn, Chord, and Kurt couldn't. In general, I understand his acting choices, and I think he's pretty good at showing a range of emotions. My only complaint with him is that I think he can leave a character and come out as himself at times. (A good example would be the "not sexually" line from The Hurt Locker II) I notice this a bit because Darren has a sense of humor..or style about his line readings, that I don't think the Blaine character has. (It's a sort of..dryness to him.) 

 

But I also think things like "Darren Can't be subtle" is silly. I could point to a ton of times Darren has been subtle. I think he chooses to be overdramatic with Blaine because that's how he's decided the character is going to be. (In the second half of the series.) And I don't think he's been given emotionally deep rolls because he's always been Kurt's teenage dream..and that's the extent of his character. (Well, now he's Kurt's psycho teenage dream.) 

 

Truthfully, I think people take Glee far too seriously. Like, sure..in real life Blaine is a crappy person. On the show..he's an amusing overdramatic sometimes funny most of the time crazy prop. And I think Darren does a pretty good job with that. 

Edited February 15, 2015 by mercfan3

[fakeempress]

 

I think there's a difference between "he's not a strong actor" and "He's the worst actor ever."

 

Can you quote the posts which label him as the worst actor ever?

 

And can you qualify this "extreme amount and extent of vitriol" that has been thrown Darren's way here? Because I'm not seeing it unless you include any non-laudatory critique. For the record, this isn't a fan board.

Edited February 15, 2015 by fakeempress

[caracas1914]

Obviously you're a fan, which I get you would notice negativity abou his work.

As more of a fan of Lea and Chris, I notice more the heaps of vitriol they get.

Trying to "quantify" who gets more is Sysphean task IMO.

ETA: I think Darren is one of the weaker actors on Glee, but not necessarily worse than Jenna, Chord or even Dianna. Now Amber is the one I think has improved the most in 6 years, relatively speaking.

Edited February 15, 2015 by caracas1914

[fakeempress]

Full disclosure: I will also say Jenna is the worst among the (semi) regular cast as an actor. I like her singing, and she seems a nice person. So no, I don't think Darren is the worst ever either.

Edited February 15, 2015 by fakeempress

[caracas1914]

Per Jenna....You hater!!!!!!

[MizStaken]

Yeah I never have understood why there seems to be so much vitriol thrown at Darren. I have never found his acting to be subpar, the writing, on the other hand . . ..

But it does seem that people who watch the show either love him or hate him with very few in the middle.

If anything, I often feel embarrassed for him, considering all the stupid things they have made him do, but he seems to be a good sport about those things.

[caracas1914]

Sure, if you never found his acting subpar, one could rationalize any criticisms of his acting is "hatred".

Now I will say I did like Darren for the most part (with a flew glaring exceptions) how he portrayed Blaine in Season 2. But even then there were criticisms of his dramatic acting, notably in "BITOA" and "Silly Love Songs", but again, mileage and all.

[truthaboutluv]

I am one of those in the middle - I don't love or hate him but that's true for me with the whole cast. As for the fandom vitriol, I think you can make a case for everyone getting it at some point but it does seem like the actors who portray the more prominent characters get the harshest brunt of it. Again, I'm sure everyone got some hate at some time and if you look hard enough you can find examples for everyone, but from the times I dipped my toe in fandom, the nastiest things I ever saw were definitely about Lea, Darren, Chris and Naya.

 

But again that was just my observation, not saying it is a fact. And I will say that for me personally, one of the most offensive things I've read about any of the cast, were the comments about Darren obviously sleeping with Ryan Murphy. I found those comments not just offensive but the way it was often expressed, incredibly crass. 

 

That said, I'm definitely not ready to scream "hater" if someone simply doesn't think any of the actors aren't very good and express that. Yes, some state it as fact but really I think everyone's sort of guilty of that at some point or another where you just believe something so strongly, it gets stated like it's a fact. But I think, or I would hope anyway, that most realize that everyone is just expressing an opinion. And as I've said, particularly when it comes to art, it's far too subjective for anyone to be absolutely right in their opinion.

Edited February 15, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[mercfan3]

Can you quote the posts which label him as the worst actor ever?

 

And can you qualify this "extreme amount and extent of vitriol" that has been thrown Darren's way here? Because I'm not seeing it unless you include any non-laudatory critique. For the record, this isn't a fan board.

 

Once again, just read the thread. And no, it's not just criticism. 

 

But it goes further than that. Darren gets a ton outside of this forum. (Which I was including when saying that.) I would say Lea is a strong number 2. But, seriously..it's actually striking to me. I would have thought Naya, Lea, and Dianna would have been the target of that. Mostly because people tend to find confident beautiful women as unlikable. And Darren is just so...boy next doorish. LIke I said..I would have thought that he'd either have his fans or be irrelevant. Like Chord. He's not the type of person that is typically polarizing. So it's surprising to me that he is. 

 

Now, I think some of it is associating poor Darren with Blaine. Which probably happens. And obviously some people don't like that his character got placed front and center and others didn't. (Although I'd argue that characters like Puck got far less screen time, but far more development..) But I also think there's more too it than that, but I won't get too into it. 

 

edit: Also, in terms of vitriol. I think Chris and Amber get..what can best be described as bigoted vitriol thrown at them. I mean, it's not striking to me, because it's unfortunately expected. But I think a lot of times the hate they get is because Chris is gay and Amber is a bigger black woman. Things that aren't obviously true of Lea and Darren. 

Edited February 15, 2015 by mercfan3

[Camera One]

Unfortunately, there is a lot of negativity about many characters on this show, not just Blaine but many others as well.  It makes the show not very interesting to discuss.  Negativity is probably a better word than hatred, since what is wearing is the multitude of negative comments.  The Jenna criticism would not be interpreted the same way because that character is rarely the topic of discussion.  

 

Blaine is likely resented for taking up a lot of screentime and songs from the original characters.  Meanwhile, Rachel is an original but still gets weekly negative comments for taking up screentime or being the focus of the storyline.  It really doesn't matter what episode it is, the comments are pretty much the same.  With some really bad shows, the fun is in discussing and making fun of the writing and commiserating about characters that everyone agrees deserve better, but with this show, the characters are polarizing.  

Edited February 15, 2015 by Camera One

[Danielle87]

I never really understood the complaints about Blaine taking songs, because really does Blaine really "take" screentime/songs from other characters like that? I mean, he has way less songs this season and certain characters still aren't getting solos, like Kurt, Will, etc. I've always said if RIB wanted to give certain characters screentime and songs, they would, I don't think the character of Blaine really has ever made that big of a difference with who they want to give focus on. Maybe there would be 1 extra Rachel solo per episode, but other than that I don't see where the difference would be, they'd give focus to who they want and ignore who they don't want.

 

As for the vitriol thrown at Darren, like someone pointed out before, the Glee fanbase is very young so it makes sense that some people are going to throw hate the actors way due to immaturity. I've said it kind reminds me of Backstreet Boys vs NSYNC fandom wars when I was a pre-teen, so hopefully all the actors realize this and try not to take it too personally.

[fakeempress]

Once again, just read the thread. And no, it's not just criticism. 

 

But it goes further than that. Darren gets a ton outside of this forum. (Which I was including when saying that.) I would say Lea is a strong number 2. But, seriously..it's actually striking to me. I would have thought Naya, Lea, and Dianna would have been the target of that. Mostly because people tend to find confident beautiful women as unlikable. And Darren is just so...boy next doorish. LIke I said..I would have thought that he'd either have his fans or be irrelevant. Like Chord. He's not the type of person that is typically polarizing. So it's surprising to me that he is. 

 

Now, I think some of it is associating poor Darren with Blaine. Which probably happens. And obviously some people don't like that his character got placed front and center and others didn't. (Although I'd argue that characters like Puck got far less screen time, but far more development..) But I also think there's more too it than that, but I won't get too into it. 

 

edit: Also, in terms of vitriol. I think Chris and Amber get..what can best be described as bigoted vitriol thrown at them. I mean, it's not striking to me, because it's unfortunately expected. But I think a lot of times the hate they get is because Chris is gay and Amber is a bigger black woman. Things that aren't obviously true of Lea and Darren. 

 

I've read this forum, and I'm not seeing what you say you see.That's why I'd like you to quote 1) the posts which say Darren's "the worst actor ever" since you mentioned their existence; 2) the posts which constitute "hatred" and "vitriol", not to be confused with unfavourable critique.I am concerned with opinions stated on this forum. I can't know which other sites you mean, unless you give links or quotes. And generally, there is a Fandom thread for such discussions. 

 

About the Darren hatred in general, I will say that I've seen instances of it elsewhere. I have also seen extremely vocal and unabashed adulation from his stans camp.Some Darren stans are absolute assholes about Chris, and vice versa. But I will say that hatred is a weak word for what I've seen Chris subjected to by a combination of Darren stans /Klainers/tinhatters on twitter and  IG. So let's not start a contest about who's got most and worst hated cause Darren won't be winning it. Chris gets bullied every single day by the stans and tinhatters I mentioned (same goes for Darren's girlfriend), it's not just by gaybashers who I think are now the minority among his bullies on social media . You should check Chris's @mentions on Darren's birthday a few days ago, it was ugly, and has been a tradition for a few years, since he started to be tinhatted with Darren. 

Edited February 15, 2015 by fakeempress

[phoenixrising]

I'd bet Darren gets similar hatred from people who don't like him as Chris does (and I've seen some go waaaaay too far in attacking Darren, but I'd say the same for Lea, Naya, and others too). And I think the hatred that Darren gets likely comes from the amount of screen time he's given, and his character's association with Kurt, who is one of the better liked characters, and Chris a better liked cast member imo (and I'm not a Stan of either, which sadly I have to include because when I've criticized Chris's acting choices in the past I've been accused of being a tinhatter which, no).

I think a good amount of it too is backlash. I wasn't deep in fandom at the time, but most people I saw around seemed to really love him until season 4. I felt like he became more devisive at that point.

Personally, I wouldn't say Darren is a subtle actor. He's had acting moments I've liked, and he's had ones I've hated (the one that really comes to mind was his stuff with Sue in Feud. Aaaaargh I hated that).

Having watched his Starkid stuff, I'd say I enjoy him more in those. One, because college aged kids writing parody musicals are better writers than RIB, and two, I think he gelled better in that environment than on Glee. Since they were a group of friends, they could write to his strengths, whereas I don't think glee typically does.

[caracas1914]

All the actors get vitriol and negative comments. It's trying to quantify who gets more is when it becomes an endless loop, as well as trying to quantify who gets the most praise.

Edited February 15, 2015 by caracas1914

[Higgs]

All the actors get vitriol and negative comments. It's trying to quantify who gets more is when it becomes an endless loop, as well as trying to quantify who gets the most praise.

It's not the number of comments that matters, it's the number of commenters who voice a particular view, often over and over again. Check it out on that basis, and check out the correlations between their views on Blaine and their views on other performers, and the pattern will quickly emerge in all its glory. Blaine can't act and Lea can't dance, don't you know. (Actually, the latter claim is true, but no music industry professional in the entire world, especially including Lea Michele, gives a shit.)

Commenters are a minuscule fraction of the entire audience, and not representative of it. Furthermore, the internet has its own sociology, and sometimes a particular forum develops a critical mass psychology that drives out all but a handful of faithful insurgents such as myself. In all opinions, consider the source.

Edited February 15, 2015 by Higgs

[Myrna123]

It's not the number of comments that matters, it's the number of commenters who voice a particular view, often over and over again. Check it out on that basis, and check out the correlations between their views on Blaine and their views on other performers, and the pattern will quickly emerge in all its glory. Blaine can't act and Lea can't dance, don't you know. (Actually, the latter claim is true, but no music industry professional in the entire world, especially including Lea Michele, gives a shit.)

The same is true in reverse, though. I know which posters think Lea is the most amazing, superlative, wonderful, unmatched human being ever to grace the universe with her most holy presence. And they post about it again and again and again in the same way I know which posters don't think Darren Criss is the second coming. This is a fan forum. Posting opinions is what it's for, and there are about 25 of us here who are still watching Glee and torturing ourselves by thinking about the show and the people who make it. There's a lot of repetition about everything.

[shantown]

I never really understood the complaints about Blaine taking songs, because really does Blaine really "take" screentime/songs from other characters like that? I mean, he has way less songs this season and certain characters still aren't getting solos, like Kurt, Will, etc.

I think the best example of this is "Big Brother" - after the episode where Quinn is in a terrible car wreck, it would have been nice for immediate follow-up. Or at least focused follow-up. Instead the majority of the next episode is spent on Blaine singing 3 of the 5 songs in the episode and whining about his older brother taking his toys when they were kids. It was just so out of touch with what I think a lot of people were expecting/wanting to see.

 

And somewhere online there was a list of solos for each character, posted around the end of season 4. At that point Blaine had already taken over as having sung the most solos on the show, and was in the top 3 for duets and group leads. It just showed how much they had (over)used him in the short time he had been on the show. I think that's where a lot of the hate comes from. The show really was on Blaine-jukebox overload for a long time.

 

While he doesn't have as many solos this season, they are still inserting him in every scene, even when it doesn't make sense. For example, Blaine being there as an angel during Brittany's song. Or any of the random times he is in the McKinley choir room when he is supposedly still working at Dalton.

[mercfan3]

I've read this forum, and I'm not seeing what you say you see.That's why I'd like you to quote 1) the posts which say Darren's "the worst actor ever" since you mentioned their existence; 2) the posts which constitute "hatred" and "vitriol", not to be confused with unfavourable critique.I am concerned with opinions stated on this forum. I can't know which other sites you mean, unless you give links or quotes. And generally, there is a Fandom thread for such discussions. 

 

About the Darren hatred in general, I will say that I've seen instances of it elsewhere. I have also seen extremely vocal and unabashed adulation from his stans camp.Some Darren stans are absolute assholes about Chris, and vice versa. But I will say that hatred is a weak word for what I've seen Chris subjected to by a combination of Darren stans /Klainers/tinhatters on twitter and  IG. So let's not start a contest about who's got most and worst hated cause Darren won't be winning it. Chris gets bullied every single day by the stans and tinhatters I mentioned (same goes for Darren's girlfriend), it's not just by gaybashers who I think are now the minority among his bullies on social media . You should check Chris's @mentions on Darren's birthday a few days ago, it was ugly, and has been a tradition for a few years, since he started to be tinhatted with Darren. 

 

Honestly, I think you are kidding yourself, or seeing what you want to see. 

 

Here's an example. Someone commented about Darren "bashing" Lea. interesting choice of words, don't you think? Darren..the same guy that consistently calls Lea a superstar. The same guy whose two closest friends on set are Chord and Lea. Darren, the guy who..god bless him..is consistently positive about all things Glee. He "bashed" Lea. Or, did he simply mention that it is taking him longer to come out with an album than Lea, because he's choosing to write his material. (Because Darren is a singer/songwriter, and Lea is a fantastic singer..and who the hell cares who writes her music.) But the fact that someone would use the word "bash" suggests some strong feelings towards Darren, doesn't it? Perhaps a tendency to always interpret the worst from him? 

 

Then, there's the fact that Darren consistently gets the most criticism for his acting. And it's silly. He's not ever going to win an oscar..but he's not even close to being the worst actor/actress on the show, and some of the people that are worse, are absolutely beloved. (Dianna, for example.) Him and his character are consistently criticized for things that other characters/cast members do..and no one criticizes them. (For example, Blaine is a serial cheater. Okay. Sure. But that makes him a bigger asshole than Finn, Santana, Kurt, Quinn..all people who have cheated?) Or Darren is OTT. When the response is "as is Lea" it's, "well, Rachel is supposed to be OTT, Blaine isn't." Really, Blaine..the guy who literally won the "New Rachel" award in the episode "The New Rachel." The guy who they literally gave ALL of Rachel's negative qualities to (manipulative, insecure, control freak, impulsive, selfish, whiny..). That character isn't supposed to be OTT? 

 

Obviously, this is a fan forum for Glee..of either people taking the show far too seriously or just hate watching. People can say what they want. I'm not trying to police anyone. I'm just saying that I think a good portion of the criticism thrown at Darren is because people don't like him for one reason or another, not necessarily because of his talent. I'm allowed my opinion too. 

[Ceeg]

Obviously, this is a fan forum for Glee..of either people taking the show far too seriously or just hate watching. People can say what they want. I'm not trying to police anyone. I'm just saying that I think a good portion of the criticism thrown at Darren is because people don't like him for one reason or another, not necessarily because of his talent. I'm allowed my opinion too. 

 

I think your inability to take criticism of Darren's acting/singing and your labeling it as hate based on personal feelings toward Darren, not because people genuinely don't think he's anything more than average, is the exact same thing (only on the opposite end of the spectrum) as people who actually DO only criticize Darren bc they hate him. A bias is a bias, whether it's love or hate. But trying to quantify "a good portion" of people criticizing Darren as "haters" is ridiculous and condescending and also suggests that people posting here have no ability to see and judge talent, based on what we see on screen.

 

As for the rest, I responded in the Fandoms Thread, since it's less about Darren specifically, and more about his fandom.

[truthaboutluv]

I think the best example of this is "Big Brother" - after the episode where Quinn is in a terrible car wreck, it would have been nice for immediate follow-up. Or at least focused follow-up. Instead the majority of the next episode is spent on Blaine singing 3 of the 5 songs in the episode and whining about his older brother taking his toys when they were kids. It was just so out of touch with what I think a lot of people were expecting/wanting to see.

 

And somewhere online there was a list of solos for each character, posted around the end of season 4. At that point Blaine had already taken over as having sung the most solos on the show, and was in the top 3 for duets and group leads. It just showed how much they had (over)used him in the short time he had been on the show. I think that's where a lot of the hate comes from. The show really was on Blaine-jukebox overload for a long time.

 

While he doesn't have as many solos this season, they are still inserting him in every scene, even when it doesn't make sense. For example, Blaine being there as an angel during Brittany's song. Or any of the random times he is in the McKinley choir room when he is supposedly still working at Dalton.

 

But that's something that speaks to the poor writing and poor judgement of the writers which I think is what the poster is saying. That it's silly to hate the actor or even character for "taking songs" from other characters when really that's on the producers and writers of the show. And about the Big Brother storyline, well the show followed up Finn's death with "A Katy and A Gaga" episode. The writers/producers of the show in many ways are tone deaf - tone deaf to their viewers, audience, the characters they created, etc. 

 

As for the song count, I remember seeing something like that and I as recall, he wasn't first, that was Rachel and I think he was actually third behind Santana. Because I guess since many like the character and actress, people didn't seem to notice or care that as Santana became more pronounced as a character, Naya sang a lot. She was on a number of group numbers and had quite a few solo songs and hey, I have no problem with it either but I never remembered it being much of an issue.

 

The other thing that always got thrown about Blaine's character that ultimately got repeated as fact, is how many solos he got and attention versus other characters. But the fact is, Blaine in New Direction actually did not get much competition shine versus Rachel and even Finn. For much of Season 3, Finn was still the de-facto lead singer of New Directions. Blaine had as much presence as everyone else in their Sectional performance where Quinn and Tina had complete solos, he sang on a group number for Regionals and he was fairly invisible for Nationals.

 

Granted I only saw a handful of episodes in Season 4 but it seemed like Sam was the star of their Nationals performance and didn't Blaine end up having a duet with Marley for Regionals only because Ryder, angry about the whole Catfish/Unique thing quit the group? And yet to this day it's repeated ad nauseum and taken as fact that Blaine practically took over New Directions when he came and sang all the time. 

[Ceeg]

From the ONTD_Glee song total tally from Season 4:

 

Songs Ordered by Totals
---------------------------

1. Blaine: 8 solos; 14 duets; 10 Group Lead = 32 songs total.
2. Marley: 4 solos; 12 duets; 15 Group Lead = 31 songs total.
3. Rachel: 6 solos; 13 duets; 4 Group Lead = 23 songs total.
4. Sam: 2 solos; 11 duets; 10 Group Lead = 23 songs total.
5. Jake: 4 solos; 9 duets; 10 Group Lead = 23 songs total.
6. Ryder: 3 solos; 8 duets; 10 Group Lead = 21 songs total.
7. Brittany: 2 solos; 7 duets; 8 Group Lead = 17 songs total.
8. Unique: 0 solos; 8 duets; 6 Group Lead = 14 songs total.
9. Kurt: 2 solos; 6 duets; 5 Group Lead = 13 songs total.
10. Santana: 4 solos; 3 duets; 5 Group Lead = 12 songs total.

[truthaboutluv]

That was from Season 4. I wasn't talking about one season. I was referring to a list I saw of total solos and performances - I don't know if Season 1 was added but I know Season 2 and 3 was included. I remember it specifically because I was surprised because with how much I'd heard how Blaine sang more than anyone else, I expected him to be number one. Also, my larger point was about the competition performances of which I still maintain that for how much I read that Blaine got ALL solos and attention, he actually didn't have much presence in New Directions competition performances in both Season 3 and Season 4. 

Edited February 15, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[Ceeg]

From Season 3:

 

Rachel: 8 solos; 18 duets; 10 Group Lead = 36 songs total.
Santana: 2 solos; 18 duets; 14 Group Lead = 34 songs total.
Merslaydes: 5 solos; 14 duets; 9 Group Lead = 28 songs total.
Blaine: 8 solos; 9 duets; 8 Group Lead = 25 songs total.
Finn: 2 solos; 8 duets; 12 Group Lead = 22 songs total.
Kurt: 5 solos; 7 duets; 9 Group Lead = 21 songs total.
Artie: 3 solos; 6 duets; 9 Group Lead = 18 songs total.
Puck: 4 solos; 6 duets; 6 Group Lead = 16 songs total
Quinn: 1 solos; 5 duets; 6 Group Lead = 12 songs total.
Tina: 1 solos; 4 duets; 7 Group Lead = 12 songs total.
Sam: 2 solos; 4 duets; 4 Group Lead = 10 songs total.

 

 

So, more solos than everyone else (tied with Rachel), and 4th in overall song count.

[truthaboutluv]

Ah so I didn't imagine that and I thought I remembered seeing Mercedes' name...

[shantown]

My problem with Darren is threefold:

1) The writing for Blaine - this is not completely Darren's fault, that falls at the feet of RIB. However, where other characters have been able to create subtle background moments or spaces filling in their characters, Darren just plays it strictly on the page, with seemingly no attempt to create consistency or background or motivations for the character. He is, ironically, a puppet.

 

2) The Darren/Blaine/Klaine fans - again, not completely Darren's fault. But he certainly doesn't even call them out when they repeatedly and intensely harass Darren's coworkers, the friends/family/partners or those coworkers, or other fans. He riles them up whenever possible, and the last thing many of these "stans" need is more fuel for their fire.

 

3) Darren himself - the phrase "he'd attend the opening of an envelope" applies here. There's nothing bad about trying to stay in the public eye, but when he regularly inserts himself in situations, pictures, movements only for the publicity, it becomes annoying. Jumping in front of people on the red carpet, doing personal publicity at events recognizing others, etc, it's all part of a "look at me, look at me" persona that is just irksome to many people.

Edited February 15, 2015 by shantown

[truthaboutluv]

With regards to the first point, I've already stated my feelings on that whole deal so it is what it is. The other stuff - not touching it. It's veering very much into personal opinion and feelings of the actors outside of the show and frankly, as I've said before, I don't love or hate any of the Glee cast-members. Coupled with that, I don't pay attention to any of their media, I don't follow any of them on social media, etc. (I think I follow Chris on twitter because I did a long time ago back in Season 2 I think but he tweets so infrequently, I see no point in unfollowing him). Any opinions I have is as it relates to the show and their performances...period. 

[Higgs]

I wonder what explains the enormous asymmetry in the correlation of support for one Glee character to crossover criticism of another, not only in the statistical disparities but in the threads where it occurs. (Study it for causality in a sufficient number of shows across multiple dramatic genres, and there could be a Sociology/Gender Studies/Psychology Ph.D. thesis, and maybe even a book, in it.)

[caracas1914]

i do know all criticism of Lea is unwarranted.

JUST KIDDING!

[Myrna123]

I wonder what explains the enormous asymmetry in the correlation of support for one Glee character to crossover criticism of another, not only in the statistical disparities but in the threads where it occurs. (Study it for causality in a sufficient number of shows across multiple dramatic genres, and there could be a Sociology/Gender Studies/Psychology Ph.D. thesis, and maybe even a book, in it.)

That's easy--your sample population is 35 to 50 anonymous internet posters so the results of your statistical analysis are insignificant and unusable.

[Higgs]

An open letter to all of AADarren Criss' fans who have had the tenacity and courage to stick it out against the slings and arrows of undeserved outrage:

While I cannot share your enthusiasm for young Mr. Criss (no surprise to all those who know that I believe no one on the planet has any worthwhile performing talent whatsoever, save Lea Michele), I come as a friend and ally. To begin, I must ask you all to:

Get up now. I want all of you to get up out of your chairs. I want you to get up right now and go to the window, open it, and stick your head out and yell, "I'm as mad as hell, and I'm not going to take this anymore!!"

I can wait. ... There. It feels better, doesn't it? Now let's do an opinion-free (mostly) reality check.

When it comes to acting, the greatest failure on Glee, based on an objective analysis of posts by the commentariat, was the abject inability of Chris Colfer, in a season finale with everything on the line to set up the rest of the series, regarding what is now the main romantic relationship on the show, to convince his own fans about his character's unambiguous feelings towards your man's character, one "Blaine Anderson", as I am told he is named.

Now, on to the art of singing. Oh, sure, I resent that so many solos were given to Darren (what Lea stan doesn't?), and of course I wish her only partner in heterosexual duets had been Matt, but fair is fair. On 2/28, Lea, Darren, Chord, Becca, and Alex will perform at the Family Equality Council's 11th Annual Los Angeles Awards Dinner, a venue that one would imagine would be a natural for Chris. But, unlike virtually all the others in the Glee cast, Chris has NEVER performed at ANY outside event, whereas Darren has done so on multiple occasions, was on a TV special honoring Sondheim, starred in a Broadway musical, and did a concert tour. The only public singing Chris has done since Glee began was on the tour, where his rendition of IWTHYH, no longer supported by the miracles of studio electronics and stripped of the emotional prop of a comatose father, fell flatter than his notes and garnered by far the worst reviews by professional critics at major newspapers. (If anyone asks, I will be more, much more, than glad to post them.)

So hold up your heads Darrenites, stand tall and proud, and speak not softly with a big stick, and you'll never walk alone (can't wait, Matty) as long as I'm around (Jon and Lea).

[Myrna123]

The only public singing Chris has done since Glee began was on the tour, where his rendition of IWTHYH, no longer supported by the miracles of studio electronics and stripped of the emotional prop of a comatose father, fell flatter than his notes and garnered by far the worst reviews by professional critics at major newspapers. (If anyone asks, I will be more, much more, than glad to post them.)

You spend your free time collecting Chris Colfer's bad reviews? Wow.

[caracas1914]

You spend your free time collecting Chris Colfer's bad reviews? Wow.

 

Well that "explains the enormous asymmetry in the correlation of support for one Glee character to crossover criticism of another,"

 

Just saying.

[Hana Chan]

We'll see how many performance opportunities come Darren's way once Glee ends. Because I haven't heard of any of these opportunities translate (until now) into credible job prospects after Glee. In fact, Darren remains conspicuous as one of the few cast members without anything lined up.

[Hana Chan]

Just to add something here... I would expect that Darren, who very much wants a career as a singer/recording artist to jump at every singing performance opportunity that his management team can buy him into. That didn't help him though - Columbia still shelved his album and right now his prospects of getting them to change their minds are pretty slim at best.

 

Chris has not expressed any interest in recording an album (since he sees himself as an actor and writer far more than a singer) so while I very much enjoy his voice (and am glad that his next acting job will allow him to sing), I'm not exactly shedding tears that he isn't singing at this upcoming event. Chris is well known for his philanthropy regarding LBGTQ causes. Trying to tear down his accomplishments for no other reason except to try to make Darren look better in comparison is pretty pointless and stupid. Trying to match Darren against an Emmy nominated, Golden Globe and PCA winning actor isn't going to help their arguments.

Edited February 15, 2015 by Hana Chan