Social Media and Behind the Scenes: AKA Everything Else Not "News and Media"

[apinknightmare]

I don't find the Twitter silence so strange - he continually harps on how much he hates it. He's Facebook's biggest fanboy though; his silence on there and the deleting of The Flash promo and no post of the Arrow promo are what I find kind of strange. 

Edited December 4, 2015 by apinknightmare

[AyChihuahua]

He went silent before this episode though, didn't he? I thought I remembered something about people complaining that he didn't tweet or promote 4x06 at all.

That's why I was wondering a little bit whether he'd found out something about upcoming episodes that made him not happy. But of course that's sheer speculation on my part.

From what he's said, I think he really likes working with EBR.  He's said that the two of them are very protective of this mature, healthy relationship that they built (how'd that work out for you, dude?).  And I think that in the episodes they're filming around now, they're broken up.  Oliver's been dumped.  He's probably super mopey (AGAIN) and Felicity's probably giving him eye daggers (AGAIN) and they're not touching or coming near each other (AGAIN) and they're probably having far fewer scenes together (AGAIN). 

 

He also has to have enjoyed all the kudos about how great O/F have been this year.  So I wouldn't be at all surprised if he's not loving the episodes he's currently involved with/coming up, because they're probably depressing and miserable (AGAIN).

Edited December 4, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[looptab]

I think the video with GG was a private message to someone that he didn't mean to post publicly.

Oh, ok, I didn't know that. :)

Then it has to be refusal of any comment, haha.

[AyChihuahua]

I don't find the Twitter silence so strange - he continually harps on how much he hates it. He's Facebook's biggest fanboy though; his silence on there and the deleting of The Flash promo and no post of the Arrow promo are what I find kind of strange. 

What are you thinking?  He was saying 6-9 were THE BESTEST EVAH, so are you thinking he's mad at the reception?  Because 7 most mostly well-liked and 7 was (shockingly) well received.  Or are you thinking he doesn't like what he's working on now, and he's more or less pouting?  (Hey, more power to him, I wish he'd make the studio choose bw him post-current contract and Guggie, personally.)

[apinknightmare]

What are you thinking?  He was saying 6-9 were THE BESTEST EVAH, so are you thinking he's mad at the reception?  Because 7 most mostly well-liked and 7 was (shockingly) well received.  Or are you thinking he doesn't like what he's working on now, and he's more or less pouting?  (Hey, more power to him, I wish he'd make the studio choose bw him post-current contract and Guggie, personally.)

 

I don't think he's pouting. I think he's pretty good at anticipating fan reaction, and pays more attention to fandom than we probably realize. I think he knows he's going to get a shitload of complaints and criticisms in his comments if he posts, and is probably staying away from it for that reason. 

[AyChihuahua]

I don't think he's pouting. I think he's pretty good at anticipating fan reaction, and pays more attention to fandom than we probably realize. I think he knows he's going to get a shitload of complaints and criticisms in his comments if he posts, and is probably staying away from it for that reason. 

So you think it's about this episode, basically, rather than whatever he's on now?

[kes0704]

Maybe evil story Steve is a little surprised by the criticism from both the fans and reviewers. Staying away for a bit is probably the smartest thing for him to do because anything he says is likely to make it even worse, and we know how he likes to double down on the dumb comments when backed into a corner.

I can't wait to see what happens at his next HVFF panel. Quite a few people on Twitter are now just waiting for the moment that they can get in front of him to ask WTF happened to his character. Could be very interesting.

Edited December 4, 2015 by kes0704

[dtissagirl]

I can't wait to see what happens at his next HVFF panel. Quite a few people on Twitter are now just waiting for the moment that they can get in front of him to ask WTF happened to his character. Could be very interesting.

And it's happening right after 410 airs, right? That's gonna be FUN, considering Steve's face can't lie.

[wonderwall]

If anyone is going to HVFF in either Rosemont or Secaucus, do any of you want to ask Stephen why he feels that Oliver lied to Felicity about the kid and whether or not that regressed his character if no one else does? :p

Edited December 4, 2015 by wonderwall

[Chaser]

Can someone ask for a list of the episodes BM appears, the Kid appears and either one is mentioned?

I would like to know which ones to avoid.

[kes0704]

I think you're going to be skipping a lot of episodes for ever more unless they go with the soapiest of soap tropes and send BM and kid "to their rooms" never to be seen or heard from again :)

[Morrigan2575]

If anyone is going to HVFF in either Rosemont or Secaucus, do any of you want to ask Stephen why he feels that Oliver lied to Felicity about the kid and whether or not that regressed his character if no one else does? :p

If I go to Secaucus I'll try to ask that question

[calliope1975]

I think you're going to be skipping a lot of episodes for ever more unless they go with the soapiest of soap tropes and send BM and kid "to their rooms" never to be seen or heard from again :)

 

I will accept a complete erasure of BM and kid. Just do some more time travel or something. Have Zantanna arrive, zap BM and kid out of existence and erase everyone's memory. I don't care. I will send MG flowers and chocolate. Just make it go away.

 

Since that's not happening, I'm either going to quit watching (healthy) or buy more wine (probable.) 

[wonderwall]

If I go to Secaucus I'll try to ask that question

I will love you 5ever if you do :)

[lemotomato]

Since putting out worst case scenarios out into the universe is all the rage now, maybe SA is quiet because he found out who's in the grave and he's upset about who it is.

[statsgirl]

It's plausible -- he didn't like it when his friend Colin was going to leave the show.

Edited December 4, 2015 by statsgirl

[lemotomato]

They're probably breaking episode 15 right now, right? I actually think this season's big death is going to happen during spring sweeps, since it's supposed to be one of the regular characters. 415 should be the last episode before they take their mini break in March.

[jay741982]

Knowing these fuckhead writers the death is probably Dig or Felicity. They are dumb enough to have Oliver regress and give in to stupid demands of BM I definitely won't put it past them to kill off one of the most popular Non Oliver Characters

[NumberCruncher]

Man, you guys are depressing. See what you've reduced us to, writers!!! I'm not going to stress out yet about who's in the grave just yet, nor am I going to freak out about an Oliver/BM arc, but I'm NGL--my enthusiasm has been dampened about this season.

I think trying to guess the motives as to SA's social media absence is probably futile at this point. The true test will be how he handles the fan questions at the HVFF events. Remember, this is the man who has zero poker face. That will tell all. It he appears less-than-thrilled, then we'll know it's time to panic.

[lemotomato]

I was actually willing to give the show a couple episodes to see how it all plays out before freaking out, but since everyone (not just here, but on all social media) is determined to be all "This is the worst!"/"No, THIS is going to be the worst!", then ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

Edited December 5, 2015 by lemotomato

[Morrigan2575]

The final page for 408

[statsgirl]

So nothing?  It's almost as bad as Shakespeare in the lack of direction but that William had an excuse. Where is GBS when you need him?

 

I hope someone asks SA what Oliver was thinking there.

[AyChihuahua]

I was actually willing to give the show a couple episodes to see how it all plays out before freaking out, but since everyone (not just here, but on all social media) is determined to be all "This is the worst!"/"No, THIS is going to be the worst!", then ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

That's because of spoilers.  

They're probably breaking episode 15 right now, right? I actually think this season's big death is going to happen during spring sweeps, since it's supposed to be one of the regular characters. 415 should be the last episode before they take their mini break in March.

They'll have to tell the person earlier than breaking the episode, though.  So if they're breaking 15 now, I'd think they have had to tell whoever it is at least a month or so ago, and SA would know then, too.  Depending on who's fired, everyone will know.  And I don't mean that as a rip, because I honestly can't imagine not only having to show up to work but having to emote positive emotions, etc., after having been fired.

 

I'm still positive it's not Felicity.  I guess it COULD be Digg?  Although I still think it's Quentin, this would be the first time outside of The Bad Seed-style kids that I'd root for the double death of a kid and his BM.  (I don't think it's the kid, bc I think Oliver would be devastated, even though he barely knows him.  Oliver is ALL ABOUT family.) 

So nothing?  It's almost as bad as Shakespeare in the lack of direction but that William had an excuse. Where is GBS when you need him?

 

I hope someone asks SA what Oliver was thinking there.

I think it's just compartmentalizing.  He does it so well it's nearly psychotic.  

Edited December 5, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[kismet]

I forgot SA said he came up with this take on Baby Mama or had input or whatevs. If so, I wonder if it changed from what he suggested or he's surprised by the fairly universal negative reaction to it even by those who otherwise liked the episode. (Come on, it's not that he's surprised right? He's not stupid.)

The thing is BM and a surprise kid are not a bad idea. He can get to do the father thing and not have a full time kid dragging the show down. It can show how far OQ has grown from his younger days. Taking responsibility. Showing growth. Providing a legacy.

 

BM just took a horrible turn with the lying & the emotional manipulation. The initial idea was great the execution was horrible. I think SA forgot when he suggested it that the writers have a tendency to do the worst option when it comes to bringing dramatic elements like that on the screen. In another set of showrunners this story probably would have been amazing ~ or at least not this bad.

 

I take SA social media silence as sorta a mini-protest and good for him. That boy has a shippers heart, this must be killing him. Plus he is very protective of Oliver & this lying development is just horrible for his character. His don't judge it before you see it comment from a few weeks ago, I think was kinda trolly & obnoxious. Maybe it was just a firing shot to quell the anger that he knew would come. Then again he acted out that face in the Cuddle scene of Ugh - which honestly was probably the most disturbing development of the storyline.

[statsgirl]

If the theory that Oliver lied because he was too afraid of losing Felicity (rather than because it's his go-to mode), it makes sense for SA to keep out of social media so he doesn't have to give away that plot twist.

[kismet]

Here is an honest question ~ is commenting on Social Media going to fundamentally change the writers' stupidity? They want apathy, even rage tweets give them attention. I kinda just want to send one message and then radio silence. But yet, if we don't tell them what we don't like, how can we expect anything to change?

 

So obnoxious. I thought I was not going have to be faced with this dilemma again this year.

[BkWurm1]

If anyone is going to HVFF in either Rosemont or Secaucus, do any of you want to ask Stephen why he feels that Oliver lied to Felicity about the kid and whether or not that regressed his character if no one else does? :p

If they ask why he feels Oliver lied to Felicity, he'll wiggle out of it and say he's afraid to risk being with his son.  What they need to ask instead is why would Oliver think he had to keep his promise to the mother when there is no way she could have found out if he told Felicity?  Why would the man perfectly fine with lies to people that don't know the truth about him suddenly feel he has to be honest with a woman that lied to him for ten years?  Why would he risk his son's safety by not having his team know about the kid on the off chance that something could happen to him or that someone out there might know and let it slip to DD?  WHY?!!!

If the theory that Oliver lied because he was too afraid of losing Felicity (rather than because it's his go-to mode), it makes sense for SA to keep out of social media so he doesn't have to give away that plot twist.

I think the part we were supposed to wait on before judgment is finding out the condition the mother insisted upon...except once again, there's no reason in the world for him actually honoring that when it comes to telling Felicity. 

[apinknightmare]

Why would he risk his son's safety by not having his team know about the kid on the off chance that something could happen to him or that someone out there might know and let it slip to DD?  WHY?!!!

 

This is for sure gonna happen by the way. I don't know how Damien Darhk is going to find out about the kid, but he's gonna. Which leads me back to really not understanding how this storyline is going to play out because what parent in their right mind would want to subject this kid to that? Oliver shouldn't, and his mother shouldn't. But I don't think that the lesson here is supposed to be that Oliver shouldn't ever have children, so...wtf. 

[AyChihuahua]

This is for sure gonna happen by the way. I don't know how Damien Darhk is going to find out about the kid, but he's gonna. Which leads me back to really not understanding how this storyline is going to play out because what parent in their right mind would want to subject this kid to that? Oliver shouldn't, and his mother shouldn't. But I don't think that the lesson here is supposed to be that Oliver shouldn't ever have children, so...wtf. 

At least if they were their kids they would be physically with them and usually pretty well-protected.  As much as drama allows, anyway.  Spawn just lives with BM.  I am sure Barry would keep an eye on them, but the rest of the protectors are three hours away (or however far CC is from SC this week).

[wonderwall]

If they ask why he feels Oliver lied to Felicity, he'll wiggle out of it and say he's afraid to risk being with his son.  What they need to ask instead is why would Oliver think he had to keep his promise to the mother when there is no way she could have found out if he told Felicity?  Why would the man perfectly fine with lies to people that don't know the truth about him suddenly feel he has to be honest with a woman that lied to him for ten years?  Why would he risk his son's safety by not having his team know about the kid on the off chance that something could happen to him or that someone out there might know and let it slip to DD?  WHY?!!!

@Morrigan2575 this is a WAY better question :p 

[looptab]

Well, was that script page disappointing. :/

[wonderwall]

Something to look forward to

 

[AyChihuahua]

Something to look forward to

 

That's the second pic we've seen of Mama Smoak dressed relatively conservatively.  Kind of interesting.  I am sure Quentin isn't the kind of guy who controls his gf's outfits, so it's kind of cute, I think, that she's dressing down a bit more now that she is seemingly in a happy relationship.

 

Also, EBR is sitting.  WHEELCHAIR.  (Half kidding, although I do think it's a very good possibility.)

[Belinea]

I just thought it was a BTS pic in which they are wearing their own clothes. But maybe it is an actual scene pic. We will see... :-)

 

But I can now and forever say that I hate the wheelchair speculation. I utterly loathe it! Just say no to the wheelchair...

Edited December 5, 2015 by Belinea

[kismet]

It sorta looks like CRs own clothes.

[Chaser]

CR said they were filming on the IG pic.

[tv echo]

If anyone cares...

 

Arrow | Stunts: Bam Bam's Ballet of Death | The CW
Published on Dec 4, 2015, by The CW Television Network

[quarks]

Putting this in the Behind the Scenes thread because it's a writing issue, though it's also a Relationship issue. 

 

Something I think we've discussed here before (or possibly back in the TWOP boards, or both) is the frustration of seeing just how frequently an episode of Arrow can be massively improved with just small tweaks to the dialogue.  This episode provided a near perfect example of this, since many fan complaints could have been addressed with just a few tweaks - while still keeping the central conflict:

 

Samantha: Oliver, you're running for Mayor of Star City right now. And I don't know if you've noticed, but those mayors haven't lived long, and the kids of the candidate get kidnapped. I can't allow you to tell anyone about this.  Even if you think the people you're telling can keep it a secret, I can't take that risk.

See? Samantha now has a perfectly valid reason for this otherwise outrageous request. Suddenly, she looks like a sympathetic mother again desperate to keep her kid alive, instead of a woman making ridiculous demands, seemingly partly out of a revenge vendetta. Also, she's now given the audience a reason to think that just maybe Oliver shouldn't talk to Team Arrow about this - what if Thea talks?  What if Diggle tells Lyla, who tells someone at ARGUS - where Darhk has spies? 

Barry: Oliver, whenever I go back in time and try to correct anything, the new timeline is always worse. Much worse.  Let me give you some examples from the first season of Flash.

Oliver: What could be worse than everyone ending up dead? I'll change everything if it means keeping the people of Central City alive  my friends alive. And I'll pay any price for that. Any price. Willingly. You said in the first timeline Felicity knows. Ok, in this timeline, she won't know.

See? Ludicrous yet sorta valid reason. And then we could all yell at him for not listening to Barry's warning that the timeline will now be WORSE, and get all filled with dread about what could be worse than everyone in Central City dying. (HBO cancelling Game of Thrones after this season? Godiva Chocolate going out of business? I'll let you guys figure out other terrors.)

 

Felicity: Ok, first off, Oliver, we're fighting an immortal here. Maybe deal with your DNA issues later. Second, Oliver, can we all remember what happened when you didn't tell Thea the truth? When you didn't tell me and John the truth?  I thought you were breaking this habit.   Look, clearly I'm willing to put up with a lot from you! You've killed people! You go WEEKS without getting on the salmon ladder without your shirt on!  You keep talking to Malcolm and you've apparently shown him a secret dark entrance to our nice big Arrow Cave! AND you haven't given me a code name yet!  What I'm saying is, although yes, I know I told you just a couple of episodes ago that we're good and solid and all that, we're walking a fine line here and if I find out something big, it's OVER and you'll have to hire Cisco or Curtis to do your computer stuff. I recommend Curtis. He already has problems remembering that he's married when you're around. On second thought, bring in Cisco. I'll head over to Team Flash and Caitlin and I can do more bonding and maybe have a girl on girl scene if Flash thinks ratings are falling.

 

....ok, maybe Felicity wouldn't actually have said all that much.

 

None of these tweaks would have changed the major issue, but I think they would have made everyone more sympathetic, or at least understandable. 

[kismet]

BM being unsympathetic with her ultimatum is part of the writers get out of jail free card. If she is reasonable in her ultimatums then it doesn't provide the out the writers need.

As dumb as this writing is, I think it was actually thought out - which is sad.

[SmallScreenDiva]

One tweak in the last scene with Oliver and Felicity would have made it more palatable to me. The script Marc released said "Oliver draws her into an embrace." Except the finished product look more like it was Felicity embracing him because of their positions (they actually were embracing each other). If it was Oliver embracing her, then I could see it as him offering her comfort. Instead it came across as Oliver drawing comfort from her ... when he's the lying liar who lies.

Edited December 5, 2015 by SmallScreenDiva

[apinknightmare]

How is it any better if he's comforting her after lying?

[slayer2]

As does Nyssa on Oliver but we see how that always plays out.

 

Did you see this? https://www.cybersmile.org/news/the-cybersmile-foundation-announces-katie-cassidy-as-an-official-ambassador Fucking awesome!! Leave it to KC to turn an extremely negative experience into a positive one. What a champ. From the Cybersmile twitter account https://twitter.com/CybersmileHQ

Edited December 5, 2015 by slayer2

[slayer2]

Honestly, I don't think MG cares one bit about the angry messages that he receives on twitter/tumblr.  IMO, the only things that are going to get a reaction out of him are 1.) Silence when he's expecting a big reaction from some stupid shit that has gone down on the show or 2.) A significant drop in the ratings.  Pretty sure neither of those things are going to happen, even with last night's asinine developments.  The fans are too loyal and they continue to watch, even when the show is an utter crapfest (see season 3).   

 

Why would he be getting angry messages? All the reviews I've read from IGN to Forbes were well in favour of both episodes. Although there is some (well-deserved) backlash for the white-washing of Pharaohs.

[wonderwall]

Why would he be getting angry messages? All the reviews I've read from IGN to Forbes were well in favour of both episodes. Although there is some (well-deserved) backlash for the white-washing of Pharaohs.

 

IGN/Forbes aren't the only two sites that do reviews/recaps :p

[slayer2]

IGN/Forbes aren't the only two sites that do reviews/recaps :p

 

 

As I'm not an idiot I'm acutely aware of that. The sites that I read reviews at were positive which is why I asked why MG would be receiving backlash.

[apinknightmare]

As I'm not an idiot I'm acutely aware of that. The sites that I read reviews at were positive which is why I asked why MG would be receiving backlash.

 

A lot of major online reviews were positive toward the episode as a whole, negative toward the idiotic, contrived secret child storyline and subsequent nonsensical lying - which is something MG definitely got backlash for, considering he felt the need to post a pissy tweet about it.

[slayer2]

A lot of major online reviews were positive toward the episode as a whole, negative toward the idiotic, contrived secret child storyline and subsequent nonsensical lying - which is something MG definitely got backlash for, considering he felt the need to post a pissy tweet about it.

 

Ah! Thanks! He is pretty pissy and it was an entirely stupid plot point seemingly created to add unnecessary drama.

[wonderwall]

As I'm not an idiot I'm acutely aware of that. The sites that I read reviews at were positive which is why I asked why MG would be receiving backlash.

Didn't say you were. But a lot of the reviews I read were really negative towards the baby mama storyline. If you look through these pages you'll see. TVLine especially have been outspoken about this, Hitfix (Alan Sepinwall thinks that this is a crummy storyline -- and I know for a fact Marc reads his reviews), among other reviews. 

[AyChihuahua]

There has not been a single review that has been positive about the Baby Mama storyline.  I challenge anyone to find a review from any reputable site that liked that storyline.  

 

ETA:  Here is one that is somewhat positive:

 

http://whatculture.com/tv/arrow-season-4-12-questions-were-asking-after-legends-of-yesterday.php/10

 

The next slide seems more resigned than anything, with the whole it's-the-CW-so-there-has-to-be-relationship-drama line.  Interestingly the overall review is rather negative about the LoT stuff, which was the point of the crossover, really.

Edited December 6, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[joanne3482]

Ok. I just had to move a ridiculous number of posts to the relationship thread. If you can't find your post that's probably where it is, unless your post contained spoilers. Then your post is in the spoiler discussion thread.

 

Remember this is the place about social media (like pictures of Digg's abs on Instagram), or cons (like Charlotte Ross appearing on a panel) or background stuff like Stephen working out or a writer's tweet about his/her process. Thanks!