Family Ties: The Good, The Bad And The Ugly

[Dimity]

3 hours ago, AgathaC said:

I just hate it for Hubby because SS is making it very clear he prefers his mom and her house and only comes to our house because he has to. (50/50 custody split)

My cousin has this situation right now where her ex gets their daughter 3 days a week and she has her for four.  She's not happy with this as she basically spends at least a day deprogramming her daughter  because Dad has very different rules and values.  She has been trying to decide what is best - to keep to this arrangement or to try to work out an alternative.  Right now it's doable because she lives close to the ex and the school isn't an issue.  I don't know about your situation but she's thinking that she may have to let "Dad" have primary custody because no way will be ever concede it to her! and she is beginning to think the biggest problem is her daughter doesn't really feel she lives anywhere permanently 😔.

[AgathaC]

30 minutes ago, Dimity said:

My cousin has this situation right now where her ex gets their daughter 3 days a week and she has her for four.  She's not happy with this as she basically spends at least a day deprogramming her daughter  because Dad has very different rules and values.  She has been trying to decide what is best - to keep to this arrangement or to try to work out an alternative.  Right now it's doable because she lives close to the ex and the school isn't an issue.  I don't know about your situation but she's thinking that she may have to let "Dad" have primary custody because no way will be ever concede it to her! and she is beginning to think the biggest problem is her daughter doesn't really feel she lives anywhere permanently 😔.

I feel for anyone struggling with these issues! With us, it’s week on/week off. Hubby and Ex generally work together well, but their parenting styles are different. Hubby has rules (not many — no food in the bedroom, no electronics at night) and consequences. Ex and her parents spoil SS rotten (if he wants something, they buy it right away). She appeases SS in everything. She complains about his bad attitude and lying, but just shrugs “I’m just letting him be him.” Makes Hubby’s job that much harder.

Anyway, when one house is Disneyland and the other house has a few rules, not unusual the kid would prefer the fun house. In our case, I worry it may be too late for things to change much…

[Cloud9Shopper]

Finally get a second job to make some extra money and naturally that’s when my family starts demanding a ton of my time next month. All on Saturdays, of course. I have a full time job, but the issue is I didn’t take this second job just to never be able to work due to everyone wanting to go away and wanting me to pet sit. Or asking me to go birthday shopping and out to eat. Or making me travel for the day to go to a family gathering. 

I’m going to be asking my mom to get some extra pet sitting help because I’m NOT giving up this job. Especially not when she goes on a two-week cruise in January. 

[shapeshifter]

6 hours ago, Cloud9Shopper said:

Finally get a second job to make some extra money and naturally that’s when my family starts demanding a ton of my time next month. All on Saturdays, of course. I have a full time job, but the issue is I didn’t take this second job just to never be able to work due to everyone wanting to go away and wanting me to pet sit. Or asking me to go birthday shopping and out to eat. Or making me travel for the day to go to a family gathering. 

I’m going to be asking my mom to get some extra pet sitting help because I’m NOT giving up this job. Especially not when she goes on a two-week cruise in January. 

"Stick to your guns!" @Cloud9Shopper.
When Mom was in hospice for 2+ years, right after I was forced into early retirement I had opportunities to edit PhD dissertations etc., but it was by word-of-mouth, and after I gave up one job early-on so I could take my turn with Mom for a couple of weeks, the offers disappeared, since I had lost contacts through my former workplace. 

But your situation may be different.

I just wanted to encourage you to not give into family demands that will adversely affect your future. 

[supposebly]

8 hours ago, Cloud9Shopper said:

I have a full time job, but the issue is I didn’t take this second job just to never be able to work due to everyone wanting to go away and wanting me to pet sit.

I can only echo @shapeshifter. From so many posts, your family sounds less than supportive of you and your career, so I don't see why you should be. You've been saying so often you need more income to help with paying bills, so this is more important. There are enough professional pet sitters around that do a great job. They can find help elsewhere. It's your life. It's time they understood that.

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, supposebly said:

…There are enough professional pet sitters around that do a great job. They can find help elsewhere. It's your life. It's time they understood that.

And, if you are able, @Cloud9Shopper, say something like:
“Gosh. I'd like to help, but I have to work. You know. Bills to pay.”

But it can be difficult when communicating with family to not fall into the old habits of dysfunctional communication, cultivated in childhood. 

So. Maybe Least said, best said.

Edited May 16 by shapeshifter

[Cloud9Shopper]

Yeah. I really don’t get why my mom won’t even encourage my work endeavors just a little. It’s not like I’m asking her to pay my bills or constantly asking for loans, or doing anything immoral or illegal for work. She’s also never had to deal with a job market and hiring process like I do with multiple stages of interviews and ghosting and no clue as to what’s going wrong. 

I’m not even planning to keep the second job for the rest of my life or for the next 10 years or anything wild. It’s only until I get some debt paid off to have more breathing room and/or until I find a better paying full time job. Once that happens I’m going to drop it. Or maybe in six months I’ll see that it’s too much for me and I’ll quit out of my own volition. Who knows? But for now I like this, and yes it’s not easy, but many people before me have worked two jobs or did what they had to do to stay afloat and they survived. 

[EtheltoTillie]

What they all said, @Cloud9Shopper.  Congrats on getting that second job!  Stick to your guns. 

[emma675]

Congrats on the new job! I would keep it simple to "sorry I can't, I have work" so people can't argue with it. And I've found repeating the same reason, without deviation or additional details, over and over until they stop asking works best for those persistent people who want to argue.

[PRgal]

@Cloud9Shopper I can understand where you're coming from.  You know how I mentioned moons ago (?) on Primetimer that I was more or less forced to quit an amazing internship that I thought was a mix of both what I wanted (event planning/PR) and what my family wanted (a major financial institution)?  My dad said that it was because the job wouldn't get me anywhere (how would he know that?) and that since the interview and job I got was through a referral/connections, that not taking it would be a big mistake?  Well, it was.  And I was let go shortly after.  I think their HR could see how miserable I was.  I wasn't able to get the internship back since they A) already hired a replacent and B) you're only allowed to go through the program ONCE.  I'm surprised my parents are more supportive of my writing.  I think immigrant parents can be like this sometimes, due to culture clash, even coming from my well-integrated parents!

[meep.meep]

8 hours ago, emma675 said:

Congrats on the new job! I would keep it simple to "sorry I can't, I have work" so people can't argue with it. And I've found repeating the same reason, without deviation or additional details, over and over until they stop asking works best for those persistent people who want to argue.

The other one that works is "It's not possible."  Just repeat over and over - never get drawn into an argument.

Many of us have had, or have to work second jobs.  I was a single mother of two working two jobs to make ends meet.  It got better, I paid my debts, and eventually was able to stop working the second job.

[mostlylurking]

Hi everyone.  I need help.  I have a very tenuous relationship with my parents.  Lots of abandonment issues,  minimizing/diminishing of my feelings, gaslighting etc.  We speak maybe once a week and see each other maybe once a year.  But here’s the thing—I don’t trust them.  Something happened to me as a child but I don’t know what and I’ve let go of the idea that I ever will know exactly what happened.  But something did indeed happen.  I don’t know if it was some sort of abuse, or if I saw something I shouldn’t have seen.  I don’t know if my parents where even directly involved, but regardless I’ve asked them about it I’ve tried to talk to them about all of this multiple times in a non confrontational, non blaming way and it’s never gone well.  I am immediately shut down and told my childhood was perfect and end up getting blamed for actions I did as a child.  So as I said I’ve had to let go of the desire for any answers and just kept my relationship to them surface. 

I have a daughter.  Sometimes they are manipulative with her on the phone, making her feel bad or kind of coaxing reactions out of her.  Like they will ask if she wants them to come visit and she’ll be like “sure” and they take that far too seriously.  She’s six, like what else is she going to say?  Then they tell people that they love us so much, they never did anything wrong.  Needless to say she’s never spent any time alone with my parents and never will.  Lately it’s gotten to the point I don’t even want to talk to them over the phone.  Just thinking about our forced conversations each week give me anxiety.  The last piece is that they are super fake and people we have in common buy into their bs and feel sorry for them.  I know I shouldn’t care about this part, but I do.

Anyway, I want to cut off communication with them for a while.  I need some time to heal myself and not have the mental load of speaking to them each week.  How would you all approach this, given that any type of honesty on my part is met with defensiveness on their part?  And how would you deal with mutual friends who ask about what’s going on and tell me how sad they are, etc.?  I really  need help with this.  I want to enjoy my own family without this anxiety hanging over me night and day.  For the ones who read my novel, thank you so much.

[isalicat]

1 hour ago, mostlylurking said:

tion with them for a while.  I need some time to heal myself and not have the mental load of speaking to them each week.  How would you all approac

Clearly I am a total fail at quoting, but basically mostlylurking I would advise you to just do it - just don't call them (so don't initiate your regular contact) and if they reach out to you, either text or email (or if they don't do either, send them a snailmail letter) that you need some space right now and will get back to them when *you* are ready to do so. Always trust your instincts in situations like this and if you feel like your daughter is being used in some way that is not entirely healthy for her, you definitely need to protect her - its your first responsibility, besides that to yourself.

You might want to consider consulting with a therapist or spiritual advisor on how *you* go forward in the best way possible in terms of your past relationship and their denials and stonewalling. But in the meantime, what other people think is entirely and completely unimportant. Your parents and all the people that think they walk on water may flail about insisting its all in your head, or whatever - learn to ignore them and trust yourself. Your lived reality is not the less real because it not shared by everyone else! This community has your back!

[mostlylurking]

Thank you @isalicat!  I really appreciate you taking the time to read and respond. I don’t know why family has to be this way, but I know I’m not alone. 

[shapeshifter]

Has anyone ever wondered if their second grandbaby got switched at birth in the hospital because they look so different?
My daughter laughed at this and assured me her husband was with the baby the entire time (she had a C-section), but it was just a really weird feeling.
Here I was, holding this beautiful 5-month-old, looking at me adoringly, and wondering…

[Katrina Kate]

While I assume you are kidding, this is a humorous comment that lands only once, if at all.

Personal experience speaking here.

[ECM1231]

 

Has anyone ever wondered if their second grandbaby got switched at birth in the hospital because they look so different?
My daughter laughed at this and assured me her husband was with the baby the entire time (she had a C-section), but it was just a really weird feeling.
Here I was, holding this beautiful 5-month-old, looking at me adoringly, and wondering…

Too funny. My grandsons are  3 and 10 months old and look nothing alike. Both were C- sections and my son was present at each birth. My son and DIL are brunettes, as are all their family members, and their eldest son is blonde as can be. There's no mistaking that he's his Mama's, as he looks just like her. Grandson #2 is brunette but to me he doesn't resemble either parent, although he does have his dad's cleft in his chin. Both boys have their dad's gorgeous eyelashes. Grandson #1 appears to have a double set!

I'm pooped. My son's family came in for a family wedding a week ago Saturday. My DIL left on Wednesday with the baby to attend a family function back in Texas and returned Sunday. My son works remotely. My husband and I were in charge of babysitting the 3 year-old while my son was working. When they come from upstate to visit, they also bring the dog and the cat. They finally left at 7:30 pm last night. I welcomed the silence. 😂

[shapeshifter]

 

While I assume you are kidding,…

Actually, I was freaking out.

[Dimity]

 

They finally left at 7:30 pm last night. I welcomed the silence. 😂

@ECM1231 I hear you!  I spent most of the lockdowns during the pandemic longing to see my grandchildren and now that I can one thing I hadn't counted on was just as they are getting older, so am I.  I simply do not have the energy I had 5 years ago!  We had the two youngest ones over for the afternoon a few week-ends ago and after they left my husband and I both needed naps!

[PRgal]

@shapeshifter For a while after my son was born, I wondered if they transferred the wrong embryo.  He didn't look at all mixed, and I had a friend ask me if we used a non-Asian egg donor.  But now that my son is older, he most definitely looks mixed.  

[SoMuchTV]

9 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Has anyone ever wondered if their second grandbaby got switched at birth in the hospital because they look so different?

Y’all are reminding me of a long-ago episode of The Dick van Dyke show, where Rob and Laura Petrie were convinced that the brought the wrong baby home, in part because the newborn down the hall was born to the Peters family. They finally invited the other family over to share their concerns, and surprise! Mr and Mrs Peters are Black! (If anyone’s not aware, the Petries, like everyone else on tv at the time, were white.)

But more seriously, I’ve heard a couple of switched-at-birth stories recently, including one where just one twin of sets of twins were switched. 

All that was many years ago, though. Even in the 80s, when I started having babies, there were definitely procedures in place to avoid mixups. 

[EtheltoTillie]

My friends just had a baby, and the baby was in the room with the parents. An individual room not shared. They no longer have those nursery units where the rows of babies are behind glass. I don’t know how long this has been going on or if it’s in all hospitals. 

[shapeshifter]

20 minutes ago, SoMuchTV said:

All that was many years ago, though. Even in the 80s, when I started having babies, there were definitely procedures in place to avoid mixups. 

I had my kids in the 80s, but it was rural, so their procedures were more like the 60s.
But thanks. I also looked on Reddit. 
Now I know why my daughter laughed. She thought I was being ridiculous.

 

6 hours ago, PRgal said:

@shapeshifter For a while after my son was born, I wondered if they transferred the wrong embryo.  He didn't look at all mixed, and I had a friend ask me if we used a non-Asian egg donor.  But now that my son is older, he most definitely looks mixed.  

It was the difference in coloring, and the shape of his fingers and toes, and head, that were not just different from the 2-year-old sibling (who looks exactly like his father and nothing like my family) but also that the younger baby didn't look like my family or my ex's family. 
It was freaking me out because I adore him so much and he smiles at me a lot, and I was imagining them having to trade him to another family to get a baby who didn't know us. 😩
But I think he may just be a combination of my ex (my daughter's father), who I haven't seen in over 30 years and my Mom's family.
I wonder if anyone else has ever gone through this but was too embarrassed to say anything.

[Dimity]

32 minutes ago, EtheltoTillie said:

My friends just had a baby, and the baby was in the room with the parents. An individual room not shared. They no longer have those nursery units where the rows of babies are behind glass. I don’t know how long this has been going on or if it’s in all hospitals. 

I don't know how common it was but I had my children in the late '80s and they were in the room with me.  That was in the days though when you stayed in the hospital longer than 5 minutes after the birth which seems to be the most common thing now!!

[PRgal]

@shapeshifter:  to be honest, my friend was technically correct.  My son was from a donor embryo and the woman was of European heritage and the guy was Asian.  But still, she made it sound like my son wasn’t part Asian at all.  

[shapeshifter]

3 hours ago, PRgal said:

@shapeshifter:  to be honest, my friend was technically correct.  My son was from a donor embryo and the woman was of European heritage and the guy was Asian.  But still, she made it sound like my son wasn’t part Asian at all.  

My daughter is always admonishing me for saying anything about anyone’s appearance, and she’s not wrong, because it almost always winds up being hurtful or offensive if that person (or their Mom) hears. But I guess for a lot of us, it’s a lifelong habit reinforced by social media and celebrity and often our parents.🤷🏻‍♀️

[PRgal]

2 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

My daughter is always admonishing me for saying anything about anyone’s appearance, and she’s not wrong, because it almost always winds up being hurtful or offensive if that person (or their Mom) hears. But I guess for a lot of us, it’s a lifelong habit reinforced by social media and celebrity and often our parents.🤷🏻‍♀️

The appearance thing can also be very culturally affected.  Older generation immigrant Asians can be super-blunt (the cultures themselves can be, depending on region.  They could call you, say, fat, to your face.  Younger people are more likely to be polite about it).  The thing is, the friend who asked about my son is about 7 years my senior, making her solid Gen X.  And Canadian born/raised.  Then again, Chinese culture itself is very clannish and genetics (or at least the appearance of a child being genetically related) is pretty important.  

ETA:  This same woman was upset at me when I asked about a recipe - whether, for Chinese style almond cookies, whether subbing lard with butter or coconut oil was 1:1.

Edited June 12 by PRgal

[Cloud9Shopper]

I’m at a weird point with my grandmother where I appreciate how she tries to do nice things for me and am acknowledging she’s in her 90s and who knows how much time she has left so enjoy what I have now…and wishing she’d stop meddling in the way I want to keep my house. She has only seen it once but continues to be insistent on asking me if I need anything (I’ve been on my own for almost five years now; I don’t need really basic stuff like towels and pots and pans anymore, and if I do decide to get new stuff I want to pick it myself) and being like…oddly put off that I have a big china cabinet (it’s not mine; it was here when I moved in) and nothing is in it. I have no interest in entertaining people or having fine china or anything like that. I think that’s OK, as not everyone is an entertainer and I don’t want to host big 20 people gatherings the way my aunt does. But my grandmother cannot let this go that I have an empty cabinet and is insisting I “need” something in it and keeps asking me what else I want for the house.

I feel guilty about possibly hurting her feelings and telling her you know, I don’t need much else why don’t you get me money/a gift card instead and if something comes up I’ll go pick it out. Or saying hey I don’t really mind that I don’t have china I have no use for it. But at the same time…I wish she would just back off a bit. She has lovely intentions but I’m almost 40 and I really don’t want my family constantly interfering and making suggestions about how I should decorate and the way I choose to keep my house. They’re not even coming over that often, if at all; so I don’t see why they care what’s in the cabinets or keep insisting on buying me things. 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, Cloud9Shopper said:

I’m at a weird point with my grandmother where I appreciate how she tries to do nice things for me and am acknowledging she’s in her 90s and who knows how much time she has left so enjoy what I have now…and wishing she’d stop meddling in the way I want to keep my house. She has only seen it once but continues to be insistent on asking me if I need anything (I’ve been on my own for almost five years now; I don’t need really basic stuff like towels and pots and pans anymore, and if I do decide to get new stuff I want to pick it myself) and being like…oddly put off that I have a big china cabinet (it’s not mine; it was here when I moved in) and nothing is in it. I have no interest in entertaining people or having fine china or anything like that. I think that’s OK, as not everyone is an entertainer and I don’t want to host big 20 people gatherings the way my aunt does. But my grandmother cannot let this go that I have an empty cabinet and is insisting I “need” something in it and keeps asking me what else I want for the house.

I feel guilty about possibly hurting her feelings and telling her you know, I don’t need much else why don’t you get me money/a gift card instead and if something comes up I’ll go pick it out. Or saying hey I don’t really mind that I don’t have china I have no use for it. But at the same time…I wish she would just back off a bit. She has lovely intentions but I’m almost 40 and I really don’t want my family constantly interfering and making suggestions about how I should decorate and the way I choose to keep my house. They’re not even coming over that often, if at all; so I don’t see why they care what’s in the cabinets or keep insisting on buying me things. 

Does your grandmother have sets of dishes and collectibles? And does she still live in a house with extra rooms and storage areas?

Often older people try to gift (unload) stuff to younger family members when they downsize to a smaller home, but in her 90s, even if your grandmother did downsize or relocate 20+ years ago, she likely has a lot of stuff to which either she has sentimental attachments, or which she just sees as valuable. Gifting this stuff to you (or even giving you money to buy stuff) is in part a way of extending her existence beyond the inevitable end of her lifetime — which is a scary transition to be facing at any time. 

So.
You could humor her by accepting a small token from her.
Or maybe you could ask to hear stories about her life, and tell her you have shared the stories with others — or something like that. 

My Dad was known for his wonderful puns. I really do regret not writing any of them down, or, better yet, recording them.

Of course, within a few generations, most likely all of these photos and stories and dishes will be gone. But right now, likely your grandmother is just wanting to extend her existence a bit longer.

**********

And, maybe more importantly, she hopes her life had meaning and value.

Of course just like with the collectibles, even the most famous among us are eventually forgotten — even by descendants and Jeopardy! champions.

Edited June 15 by shapeshifter

[Dimity]

1 hour ago, shapeshifter said:

Gifting this stuff to you (or even giving you money to buy stuff) is in part a way of extending her existence beyond the inevitable end of her lifetime — which is a scary transition to be facing at any time. 

I am probably among the few people out there still using crocheted doilies and  tablecloths because these were things my grandmother made and there is no way I am discarding them.  Recently though I took them out of the drawer they were in and started using them because every time I see them now I remember her and it makes me happy.  My own children barely knew her so I am thinking when the time comes for them to go through my stuff they won't feel the attachment I do to these handmade items from an earlier generation which is too bad but inevitable I guess.

Edited June 15 by Dimity

[mostlylurking]

If she never comes over I would probably accept a gift from her and then donate it.  My parents are very materialistic and no matter how many times I told them we were fine and didn’t need more stuff, they would insist.  I stopped trying to stop them and just accepted the gifts and then donated them to our thrift shop.  

[chitowngirl]

An idea for displaying doilies…

[Gramto6]

19 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:

An idea for displaying doilies…

I like that!! I have doilies from my mom and grandmother that would be wonderful displayed like this!!  Something for me to think about doing....

[EtheltoTillie]

It’s not clear to me that Cloud9’s grandmother wants to give her stuff from her existing stash. It sounds like she wants to buy new stuff. @Cloud9Shopper which is it?  

[Dimity]

2 hours ago, chitowngirl said:

An idea for displaying doilies…

I really like that!  And I can see my daughter actually displaying them if we did something like that.  I have so many, I mean my grandmother was the type of woman who would have crocheted a toaster cosy if she'd thought of it!

[Cloud9Shopper]

3 hours ago, EtheltoTillie said:

It’s not clear to me that Cloud9’s grandmother wants to give her stuff from her existing stash. It sounds like she wants to buy new stuff. @Cloud9Shopper which is it?  

Yes that’s it. She wants to take me shopping to buy me things. I know she means well and enjoys the time together, but I’m just getting to a point where I’d rather do to my house what I see fit (and within the bounds of what my landlord would allow) and not have to worry about what everyone else thinks I need or should have. Sometimes I feel as if some members of my family never stopped seeing me as a child. (My grandmother also seems to not get why I want to quit my job because “you’re so good on the phone!” I try to explain to her that talking to her is much different than speaking with someone who may be screaming and/or crying on the other end, and you may get multiple calls like that per day.) 

It’s just a boundary thing, that’s all. I just want the respect for my choices and tastes that my other sisters get. 

[EtheltoTillie]

3 hours ago, Cloud9Shopper said:

Yes that’s it. She wants to take me shopping to buy me things. I know she means well and enjoys the time together, but I’m just getting to a point where I’d rather do to my house what I see fit (and within the bounds of what my landlord would allow) and not have to worry about what everyone else thinks I need or should have. Sometimes I feel as if some members of my family never stopped seeing me as a child. (My grandmother also seems to not get why I want to quit my job because “you’re so good on the phone!” I try to explain to her that talking to her is much different than speaking with someone who may be screaming and/or crying on the other end, and you may get multiple calls like that per day.) 

It’s just a boundary thing, that’s all. I just want the respect for my choices and tastes that my other sisters get. 

Perhaps they see you this way because you don’t do what they do.  You can reframe this in your own mind.  You will not convince them otherwise. They can’t control you. They don’t like that. 

Edited June 16 by EtheltoTillie

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, EtheltoTillie said:

Perhaps they see you this way because you don’t do what they do.  You can reframe this in your own mind.  You will not convince them otherwise. They can’t control you. They don’t like that. 

I was seen the same way by my family. My sister was the "successful" one. But eventually it became obvious to the casual observer that I was at least as "successful" as she was. Mom said I was a "late bloomer," but really, life is about the journey, and I don't regret the times I went "of the beaten path" to eventually arrive at a good place.

[PRgal]

My son has officially finished kindergarten.  Well, it will be official-official when his report card comes out next week but his last day of school was Friday. 

[BlueSkies]

I know I complained about my Mom not liking my grandmother a lot here.

 

But some of her complains about my grandma I'm starting to feel about my dad: set in his ways, doesn't seem much to value your input, constantly whining, etc...  

 

I'm finding him very energy killing to be around of late.  

[PRgal]

There’s a subreddit called /AsianParentStories and things you read there make my parents seem normal.  I often wonder how many of the stories they post are exaggerated or even fake.

[EtheltoTillie]

1 hour ago, PRgal said:

There’s a subreddit called /AsianParentStories and things you read there make my parents seem normal.  I often wonder how many of the stories they post are exaggerated or even fake.

Well, I took a look at it out of curiosity.  It is a lot!  But I have no doubt the stories are true, actually.  Many Jewish parents of my parents generation were also very controlling.  Many Italian families had a similar outlook requiring everyone to show up every week for some kind of dinner and centering life around a parental group.  These were the first generation immigrants one step removed from the shtetl.