S01.E18: Chapter Eighteen

[Tara Ariano]

Jane accidentally ruins Rafael's chance of getting the hotel's liquor license reinstated; Rafael learns information about his birth mother; Rogelio's mother visits; Petra turns to Michael for help.

[Rhetorica]

Jane has been getting on my nerves, lately. I see her as selfish and self centered. She works at the hotel. She knows the ins and outs of the business, for Pete's Sake! Help him with the business; and stop being so anal retentive about supplies for the baby, the perfect parenting techniques, and the picture in your head about how this relationship is supposed to be.

I'm proud of Rogelio! I didn't know if he had it in him. Alba was so cute! I hope she finds a guy. Petra's in for and adventure, as is Michael.

[redsox7819]

Jane you had practically broken up with Raf last week and when he breaks up with you the world comes to an end? WFT!?!? You cannot have it both ways. Clearly, compromise is not in your vocabulary.

Edited April 14, 2015 by redsox7819

[jjjmoss]

Does anyone know/remember what month the pilot was set in?

 

I wanna view the general timeline of the show, since this episode was Easter.

[Irlandesa]

I think it was fair for Jane to be irritated that he hadn't turned off the phone during the birthing class but that he did it for the Falco brunch.  .  He does have Petra who could have covered things for a bit.

 

Which is not to say I don't get where his mind is.  He's doing what he thinks is best for his child.  Jane disagrees with that and lets him know she disapproves.  

 

I didn't quite get what the show is trying to do with his mother, though.  There has to be more to the story.  It doesn't sound like Rafael's father was ever proud of him or super close.  But now he is?  I get why he'd lose faith in his mother after learning she sold him for ten million but shouldn't he be upset with his father as well for essentially buying him?  I feel like the mother is wasted if this is all we get of her.  Although a mention of the affair did make me wonder if it will be revealed that Rafael isn't his father's son.

 

The fact that Edward was a priest was one of the best reveals this show has had in ages.  It's something the show built up to and was revealed so well.  And the fact that he said yes to Alba's invitation?  Even better.

[LaughingOne]

I like Jane and Raf together, but I gotta say I agree with him on the break-up. They both have a ton on their plate and a baby on the way, so I think they need to stop trying to force a relationship and focus on how to be good parents.

And man, I feel for Rafael. I mean, think of the last 8 months of his life - he finds out his sister impregnated some stranger with his baby, his wife cheats on him with his best friend, his best friend is murdered in his hotel, his dad is murdered by his drug-dealing stepmom, his sister runs away with said stepmom, his business is in jeopardy and he finds out his mom basically traded him for money. No wonder the dude has nothing left to give.

Anyway, I do think Jane should've told Michael about Andi. I get she was trying to be kind to him, but Andi seems a little scary and a lot shady.

Yeah Xo, don't tell Rogelio about the kiss. What could possibly go wrong?

[omgsowicked]

I feel like the mother is wasted if this is all we get of her.  Although a mention of the affair did make me wonder if it will be revealed that Rafael isn't his father's son.

 

Ooh, that could be a nice twist. Also, the half-brother might come into play, depending on how old he is.... and if Rafael's dad isn't his biological father, perhaps the half-brother is his full-brother. Lots of options there.

 

Unfortunately, the dramatic breakup and the Jafael-centric promo meant very little to me because I was too busy going, "what about Petra and Roman?!?!" LOL. I'm excited to see where this is going, especially since things have gotten rather slow in terms of the mystery.

 

Still, I have to give credit to the show, they keep revealing things right away rather than holding on for ages; Jane knows about Andi and Michael! Last week, I was wondering what Andi's angle was... now that Michael mentioned Andi's "stalking", I'm starting to think it's not just casual speech. Maybe Michael's life will be in danger due to her?

[lau1515]

Jane is not being selfish and unreasonable, she is simply seeing what the future of her child be with a workaholic father like Rafael. They are very different but initially it seemed like they wanted the same things. There was more of a shift in priorities on Rafael's part than on Jane's, Jane's ideal involved the family as a priority from the start whereas Rafael claims the same but his actions say otherwise. If anything, he is the one being irrational, he was ready to marry this woman and dedicate his life to her but when the pressure is too high he would rather opt out? Also, it isn't like Jane wouldn't hasn't been understanding of his personal problems, it is when they are work related and trump his personal life and preparations that she is justifiably upset. I understand he has been going through many grievances during a short span of time but it does not justify projecting them onto Jane. Jane had her doubts but she was sensible enough to wait on the marriage and her saying no to the proposal was a reflection of that, it does not mean she did not love him or that if he broke up with her it wouldn't be a big deal. Her world did come crashing down and it was particularly sad because despite her rational mind she let her heart take over and in the end she was heart broken. 

[Artsda]

Jane should have seen her future from the Franco's. Missed birthdays and the wife begging the husband to be there for the kid. Jane's already doing it now with just lamaze.

 

When they asked her to remember what made her fall for Rafael I really couldn't think of why other than he's hot. Especially since she seemed so much more happy with Michael in all the flashbacks. 

[Indi]

Meh! I would feel more for Rafael and his issues with his mother (or any other stuff, really) if the actor wasn't so flat and devoid of chemistry with eeveryone.
 
I am not really Team Michael, so I hope Jane doesn't go back to him, but I also hope her thing with Rafael is over for good. She is judgmental, something she told him from the beginning, and she has a lot of character development to go through, but Rafael is such a bore... The show needs to introduce a third love interest for Jane, someone she has chemistry with and who can challenge her.
 

If anything, he is the one being irrational, he was ready to marry this woman and dedicate his life to her but when the pressure is too high he would rather opt out? Also, it isn't like Jane wouldn't hasn't been understanding of his personal problems, it is when they are work related and trump his personal life and preparations that she is justifiably upset. I understand he has been going through many grievances during a short span of time but it does not justify projecting them onto Jane. Jane had her doubts but she was sensible enough to wait on the marriage and her saying no to the proposal was a reflection of that, it does not mean she did not love him or that if he broke up with her it wouldn't be a big deal.

All of this!

[possibilities]

RE the timeline: last week, Jane said her due date is June 1. Counting backward gives us the date when the show began.

[Rhetorica]

Jane is not being selfish and unreasonable, she is simply seeing what the future of her child be with a workaholic father like Rafael. They are very different but initially it seemed like they wanted the same things. There was more of a shift in priorities on Rafael's part than on Jane's, Jane's ideal involved the family as a priority from the start whereas Rafael claims the same but his actions say otherwise. If anything, he is the one being irrational, he was ready to marry this woman and dedicate his life to her but when the pressure is too high he would rather opt out? Also, it isn't like Jane wouldn't hasn't been understanding of his personal problems, it is when they are work related and trump his personal life and preparations that she is justifiably upset. I understand he has been going through many grievances during a short span of time but it does not justify projecting them onto Jane. Jane had her doubts but she was sensible enough to wait on the marriage and her saying no to the proposal was a reflection of that, it does not mean she did not love him or that if he broke up with her it wouldn't be a big deal. Her world did come crashing down and it was particularly sad because despite her rational mind she let her heart take over and in the end she was heart broken.

If Jane was a teacher or stay at home mom, I can see her fears of a workaholic dad. My point was that she can be a true partner to him because she knows the business. Even with a child, she can bring him/her to the hotel every day and hire a nanny to be there also when she and Rafael need to. I'm not absolving him from parenting, however. I just think she lacks empathy for him. This is just my opinion, probably because I don't like traditional roles in marriage. I think it should be, as I said, a true partnership where both help each other.

[LaughingOne]

What I like about JtV is that the show is pretty even-handed. It's not that Jane has to be right and Rafael has to be wrong in this scenario - both are some of each. Rafael gave Jane real reasons to doubt his devotion to their kid - the turning off the cell phone for the meeting but not Lamaze class was a big, red flag to me. So I get why she was mad and concerned about what it said about their future together. But Jane also tends to undervalue a lot of what Rafael is going through emotionally and how his insecurities re: family impact his behavior. In part, it's because he doesn't express his feelings well, but I also think it's because she tends to judge him a lot because he's different from her so he shuts down. Anyway, I like the even-handedness because nobody has to be the bad guy in their break-up. But I do think it's the right thing for both of them and their baby at the moment. They both need to shift where they're putting their emotional energy for now and baby should take priority. They can sort out whether they should be a couple when they're in a more stable place individually.

Edited April 14, 2015 by LaughingOne

[Thog]

Rogelio is an absolutely adorable mama's boy. Don't get me wrong, I did appreciate that he came around in the end and put (the fabulous) Rita Moreno on a plane, but his pouts and side glances made me giggle.

[Primetimer]

A visit from Rogelio's beloved mother dredges up some really old business.

Read the story

[Artsda]

 

So I get why she was mad and concerned about what it said about their future together. But Jane also tends to undervalue a lot of what Rafael is going through emotionally and how his insecurities re: family impact his behavior. In part, it's because he doesn't express his feelings well, but I also think it's because she tends to judge him a lot because he's different from her so he shuts down.

 

A lot of what he's going through is by his own doings though, losing the liquor license? All on him for being stupid, Petra never should have given in, she has more business sense than Rafael. Jane's jumping thought hoops, studying and kissing up to the commissioner to help Rafael all because of his own doings. While she misses out on Easter with her family and what she gets in return is Rafael barely attending lamaze classes, always leaving her to deal with it on her own while he prioritizes everything else ahead of her and the baby.

 

The relationship just seems more Jane giving in  to Rafael and Rafael always bailing on her or disappointing her. I think Jane's earned the right to judge him.

[LADreamr]

The relationship just seems more Jane giving in to Rafael and Rafael always bailing on her or disappointing her. I think Jane's earned the right to judge him.

Exactly. Jane's life has been turned upside down, much more than Rafael's has. His was always going to involve a new baby (albeit differently than the way it turned out), so he was always going to have to find a way to work out his business side. Jane's life has changed completely because of something she had no hand in, and she has been the one all the way along trying to make it ok, not only for herself and the baby, but pretty much for everyone else, too. I wish she would be a bit more self-serving. She was absolutely right to worry that she would have to raise his baby - the one he wanted in the first place, and which isn't even biologically hers - without his help, all the while making her own career goals that much harder to reach now.

Edited April 15, 2015 by LADreamr

[LaughingOne]

A lot of what he's going through is by his own doings though

 

Petra cheating on him with his best friend, his best friend being murdered, his stepmom being a drug dealer, his dad being murdered by his stepmom, his sister running off (possibly with murderous stepmom) and his mom trading him for $10 million - those are his own doing?  Rafael is by no means perfect, but neither is Jane.  Like I said above, Jane has every right to be upset about how he's not prioritizing getting ready for baby, but she could also be more empathetic to everything he's dealing with.  I'm glad the show doesn't feel the need to over-simplify their issues and turn it into a one-sided "she's right and he's wrong" deal.

Edited April 14, 2015 by LaughingOne

[Artsda]

 

Rafael is by no means perfect, but neither is Jane.  Like I said above, Jane has every right to be upset about how he's not prioritizing getting ready for baby, but she could also be more empathetic to everything he's dealing with.

Is he empathetic about anything she's dealing with? Is he involved in anything she's dealing with? Was he around for her to meet her grandmother for the first time ever this episode? It just proves, the one-sided point, that this relationship is all Jane giving in and nothing back from Rafael. She's got to be there for him, empathetic to him, but be ok to get nothing in return? Not exactly a balanced relationship.

 

None of those things, like Petra cheating is applying to his life right now. He moved on with Jane, he wanted to marry her an episode ago. If he's still dealing with that laundry list like Petra cheating then he shouldn't be proposing or even dating anyone.  Jane was there for him during the cheating/Alex/sister/father drama, being there to comfort him, talk to him. She even dropped the lawsuit, that she shouldn't have done.

 

How much does she have to do and get nothing back for it to be enough? The only thing he showed as his priority this episode was himself, the liquor license and business calls was worth turning the phone on or off for. The commissioner can say what she wants to Jane, but Jane has to suck it up, and lose her Easter to help him make nice. Which she did. This relationship can't be all Jane giving in and doing things for him, while she's left alone when she asks him to be somewhere or do something for her.

Edited April 14, 2015 by Artsda

[LaughingOne]

Is he empathetic about anything she's dealing with? Is he involved in anything she's dealing with? Was he around for her to meet her grandmother for the first time ever this episode? It just proves, the one-sided point, that this relationship is all Jane giving in and nothing back from Rafael. She's got to be there for him, empathetic to him, but be ok to get nothing in return? Not exactly a balanced relationship.

 

None of those things, like Petra cheating is applying to his life right now. He moved on with Jane, he wanted to marry her an episode ago. If he's still dealing with that laundry list like Petra cheating then he shouldn't be proposing or even dating anyone.  Jane was there for him during the cheating/Alex/sister/father drama, being there to comfort him, talk to him. She even dropped the lawsuit, that she shouldn't have done.

 

How much does she have to do and get nothing back for it to be enough? The only thing he showed as his priority this episode was himself, the liquor license and business calls was worth turning the phone on or off for. The commissioner can say what she wants to Jane, but Jane has to suck it up, and lose her Easter to help him make nice. Which she did. This relationship can't be all Jane giving in and doing things for him, while she's left alone when she asks him to be somewhere or do something for her.

 

Their relationship is more than just these last two episodes and in those prior episodes, there have been numerous times that Rafael has been empathetic and put her needs first.  It's been little things like agreeing to find out the baby's gender because that's what she wanted or telling her who was going to get fired when he shouldn't have because she was worried about her friends to big things like not telling her he'd basically lose the hotel if she would've won her lawsuit against his sister because he didn't want to influence her decision.  So no, I don't agree the relationship is all Jane giving in and doing things for him and getting nothing in return.  I've already acknowledged a couple of times that he hasn't prioritized Jane and getting ready for baby lately, and I think Jane's anger/concern is justified.  But I'm also not going to ignore the ways in which he has been empathetic and supportive at times too.  Just like even though I think Jane is sometimes too judgmental and quick to criticize, I'm also not going to ignore the times when she's been willing to compromise and accepting of Rafael's shortcomings.  I like that both Jane and Rafael, and all the other characters on this show for that matter, are flawed and real.  It makes it easier for me to enjoy the entire cast because nobody is just a cardboard villain or a Mary Sue.  I do wish we saw more of other characters' internal dialogue like how we usually get Jane's POV because it would make it easier to relate to their perspective.  But alas, you can't squeeze in everything during 42 minutes and she is our main character so it makes sense to focus on her POV the most.

[Lila82]

Three things:

1). Rogelio has a pillow with his face on it.  Rogelio for the win!

 

2). Jane needs zero love interests.  Rather, she should have the baby, lovingly raise her with Xo and Alba, co-parent with Rafael, and work on her communication skills before getting together with anyone.  That's been the main issue in her relationship with Rafael, not being there for each other or not, but actually sharing their feelings with each other. I get that Jane doesn't want to continuously have the same argument, but if it's that important to her, she needs to talk to Rafael rather than pretend everything is okay.  

 

3). I really like Petra and Michael together.  I'm going to need them to open their own PI agency, with Rogelio as their mascot, so Rafael and the hotel crap stop dragging them down.

[possibilities]

Rogelio's mother was rude as hell, and commanding them to break up was over the top, but the substance of what she was saying about their relationship was true. They have not talked about anything other than the moment, are both impulsive romantics, and may very well want different things. Her concerns are very realistic and for Rogelio to send her away was fine, but he and Xo really should be talking about the issues she brought up. They're not teenagers anymore, but they are acting like they are. I hardly think "the ripeness of her eggs" is the only concern; does Xo want to raise any more kids, or is she done with that stage of life? Relationships do break up over this issue and they really should consider what they're doing.

 

Likewise, Jane and Rafael did not consider the realities of what they have embarked on, and have been swept away in the romantic idea that being attracted to each other means they want the same things out of life or share the same ideas about how to parent. I think Jane was trying to communicate with Rafael, and he kept shutting her down, but that in itself is a relationship style-- she is about putting the relationship on equal footing with the rest of your life, which requires a lot of negotiation and focus and involvement, he is about doing your own thing and fitting the relationship into the rest of your life as time allows. He sees it as "providing" but Jane sees it as "being absent." It will never work for two people with such different values to form a partnership, so I'm glad he ended it.

 

I was surprised that Alba supported the romantic idea that if you just have faith, it will all be okay-- and that you should follow your heart and ignore your head. How does that square with her destroyed flower philosophy or her rage about Xo moving in with Rogelio?

[TVHappy9463]

Even Rogelio and all his glory couldn't save tonight's episode.  I do not like this whiny needy Jane. I need sassy Jane back, stat! and the previews for next week look just stupid! 

[LoneHaranguer]

 

The fact that Edward was a priest was one of the best reveals this show has had in ages.  It's something the show built up to and was revealed so well.  And the fact that he said yes to Alba's invitation?  Even better.

Have they actually established that the priest is Edward, as opposed to a twin brother?

[Lebanna]

The answer to the priest thing is that he's really Anglican or some kind of reformed alturnative Catholic and Jane just didn't notice. I mean, that would be pretty bizarre and unlikely but she had other things on her mind so maybe she wasn't paying attention.

Although I do love the telenovela standard sexy priest drawn to woman that he burns for but simply cannot touch... until three episodes later. I'd totally love to see that but with seniors. Why shouldn't they get epic romances too? Age is nothing. 'El amor en los tiempos del cólera', anyone?

Edited April 15, 2015 by Lebanna

[allboys]

She was absolutely right to worry that she would have to raise his baby - the one he wanted in the first place, and which isn't even biologically hers

 

I thought the baby was biologically Jane's.  Jane's egg. Isn't that why Petra has no claim on the baby?

[Irlandesa]

Exactly. Jane's life has been turned upside down, much more than Rafael's has. His was always going to involve a new baby (albeit differently than the way it turned out), so he was always going to have to find a way to work out his business side.

Rafael was not always going to have a new baby.  The sperm sample existed because he wanted to potentially have children and didn't want cancer treatments to completely rob him of that.  He was not a part of Petra's scheme. When we joined this show, he was contemplating divorce.  While he did tell Roman children was something he'd like, a baby at this point in time wasn't any more inevitable for him than it was for Jane. Both of their timelines for children were thrown off.

 

Is he empathetic about anything she's dealing with? Is he involved in anything she's dealing with?

I think he has.  As has been stated above, this relationship isn't two weeks old, it's likely almost 7 or 8 months old.  And during a lot of it he has been empathetic and encouraging. He studied facts about Jane's mother and grandmother before meeting them because he knew Jane was worried. ( Who does that?) He's calm in the face of his girlfriend thinking they're doomed because she doesn't know his favorite song. He's handled her tests.   

 

At one point, he was willing to lose his hotel so she could get justice.  Now the hotel become an obsession to him and yes, it's getting in the way of him being the best supporting partner he could be.  So what changed?  I think most of it goes back to having his father murdered by his stepmother, who then later may have run off with his sister.  Those are huge shocks to absorb and suddenly that feeling of thinking his father died seeing him as inadequate has taken over everything he does.

 

Unlike Jane, he has no one to really talk to other than possibly his ex-wife with whom he has quite a rocky relationship. Jane shared her doubts with her mother and her grandmother and they acted as a sounding board for her.  Rafael has no one to tell him he's acting irrationally after discovering yet another family member isn't going to be role model he likely needs.  The best person he has had to talk to has been Jane and much of what came out of his mouth has come out of hers. This was just the first time he was parroting it back to her.

 

That may they're not currently in a state for a relationship but this isn't just a tad bit of pressure that Rafael's going through.  I think it's pretty major.

 

I was surprised that Alba supported the romantic idea that if you just have faith, it will all be okay-- and that you should follow your heart and ignore your head. How does that square with her destroyed flower philosophy or her rage about Xo moving in with Rogelio?

I'm not sure how having faith in your partner is in anyway related to pre-marital sex.  Maybe it can be related but I just don't see these two thinks as obviously opposites.

 

Have they actually established that the priest is Edward, as opposed to a twin brother?

Another twin?  We already have Aaron and Roman.  A second set of twins would worry me.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Irlandesa

[LoneHaranguer]

How about if Edward was a triplet and they played it for humor, with Jane seeing one "moonlighting", and the other in an odd setting for a priest, like a bar?

[herbaltease]

Though I feel Jane is justified in her desire to have two hands-on parents as her ideal family, she has to be somewhat aware that co-parenting with Michael wouldn't have been much different.  There's a reason why the detectives on every version of 'Law and Order' are divorced and/or never married.  Jane's also under the somewhat unfair assumption that nanny = deprivation.  Eh.  Enrique Inglesias turned out okay. 

 

Not every person in Jane's unenviable position has been blessed with the kind of luck she's had: a rich sperm donor who's willing and able to give that kid top-notch everything.  IMO, a few of her biases with regards to Rafael's "kind" of upbringing is still clouding her judgement.

 

That being said: Rafael was tone-deaf in asking Jane to miss Easter with her family - especially the grandmother she just met - over a liquor license.  There have to be other ways to market the hotel.  He and Petra should've tried employing a bit more creativity.

[Lady Calypso]

I like the realistic aspect of Jane and Rafael's breakup. Everything is so emotionally charged in their relationship, and both have been moving too quickly and staying in their perfect bubble until they couldn't anymore. Jane may be going through a pregnancy, but so is Rafael, plus everything that's happened in his life. His father is dead, his sister is gone with Sin Rostro, and his mother has just reappeared in his life. Not to mention he has his ex wife working with him, and his hotel is going under. I think Jane says she understands, but she doesn't actually. She has too many doubts and she doesn't trust people like she should. It's not a bad thing, but it's affecting her relationships. I think their breakup is needed, because both need to slow things down and really get to know each other, as well as dealing with parenting first, like Rafael said. 

 

I think Jane's so used to working things out and having them ok that she can't deal with Rafael breaking up with her. But, the thing is, Jane did the same thing with Michael when a big problem got in the way. It turned out to be the best thing for them, but still. Maybe they'll be ok in the long run. But them both being single and not having to worry about relationship issues when both have other major things to deal with is going to help their relationship.

 

Oh, Petra's being taken away by Roman. That's either going to not be good, or it might work out. 

 

Andi's freaking creepy and I wonder if Michael calling her a 'light Facebook stalker' is going to be foreshadowing. 

 

Yeah, Xo, let's not tell Rogelio about your kiss with Marco. It's not like that secret isn't going to ever come out anytime soon. Right. Gah. On another note, did not like Rogelio's mother. Perhaps she is right, but I just hated her attitude so much. Realistic maybe, but I didn't like it at all. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Rogelio's mother was out of line to say that he and Xiomara should break up, but she wasn't wrong to bring up some pretty big issues that they need to address. Regardless of Xiomara's age (and hey, women can have children well into their 40s), is she at all interested in having another child? Not just biologically but is she interested in raising another child now that Jane is an adult? If not, then it doesn't matter how old she is. If she does want to have another kid, does she plan to do it in the next five years? Is she okay with adoption? Or having a surrogate? And is she interested in having Rogelio raise a child with her? I love Rogelio, but money aside, not every woman would see him as father material.

 

Similarly, Jane and Rafael have been happy and in love and talking about the future, but a lot of it has been hypothetical stuff for the future, not concrete things. As parents, they should discuss the specifics of childcare. Does Jane want to continue teaching after the baby is born? Does she want to stay home with the baby? If so, for how long? Until the baby is two? In elementary school? Old enough to drive? How often does Rafael expect to spend with the baby? Is he going to see him once a day during dinner? I know it sounds totally OCD to ask some of these questions, but if they have different answers to these questions, they should talk about it now so they can plan accordingly.

 

One thing I really disliked in this episode was that after she ran into Michael in the lobby, she told Rafael, "If you're made that Michael was at the hotel, I'm sorry." No, Jane, you should not be sorry and you should not apologize for that. Michael wasn't there to see her. She didn't ask him to meet her there. She had no reason whatsoever to be apologetic about that to Rafael.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

It really bothered me that the entire time Rafael and his mother talked, she kept referring to only him. Did she totally forget about Luisa or does Luisa have a different mother?

[Irlandesa]

Luisa has a different mother.