Spoilers & Speculation: Running Hot & Cold

[Starfish35]

No, I don't want that either. But I want to see how it's handled first. There's quite a bit of speculation that he's Chronos. That would be a twist. If he's not, how does he end up coming back? I don't know. I just want to see how they do it first.

[nksarmi]

From his interviews, I don't get the feeling the actor who plays Mick is going anywhere and honestly, I'm starting to like Kendra.  I actually really like Stein and Jax, but I would be ok if they both returned to Flash (however, that oddly feels like a demotion to go from main characters to reoccurring).

 

In regards to the DC character, I thought of Booster Gold as well, but I wasn't sure how "beloved" he really is.  It seems like he is hugely popular among comic book fans but since he isn't someone non-comic book fans would recognize - I kind of wonder if he counts.  But honestly, who would people who aren't hardcore comic book fans know?  And would any of those characters fit into the time travel concept of the show?

 

I Googled time travel stories - maybe they could be using the Armageddon 2001 concept? There is a Waverider in that comic. And while I think Hawk and Dove were once designated for Titans - since that show was nixed - maybe they can use them?  Would Dove be "beloved"?  With Hawk being the villain?

 

I can't believe they would get permission to do the Return of Bruce Wayne story if Gotham has been renewed.  Though that would definitely qualify as "beloved" character.  Still seems very unlikely.  I guess they could use the concept with a different character like Green Lantern (they keep saying they have plans for that character).

[BkWurm1]

From what I understand, Booster Gold would qualify as a fan favorite. That's pretty close to beloved.

I wonder if it's possible Rip could get his HEA and then turn the ship over to someone else. I REALLY hope not but that would be a twist I don't see coming. Maybe Darvil only signed up for one year? Again, really hope not since he's my second fav.

[nksarmi]

I really do love Rip so I hope not, but I could see it happening - especially if it is Booster Gold they use.

[BkWurm1]

So saw from Casper Crump (VS) that the cast had their wrap party. Ciara Renee (Kendra) posted a quote about letting go of control and hashtagged #LivingBeautifully #WithUncertaintyAndChange #TheArtofLettingGo #SayingGoodbye

#ChangeIsTheOnlyConstant

Anyone else get the impression that Kendra will NOT be around next season?

[Sakura12]

I'd be fine with that. I just hope they bring in another woman or two. While I love Sara, I don't want her to be the only female. 

 

I don't know if CC is talking about the wrap party. CL posted about Fraterday working and hasn't said anything about being finished shooting. I would think she'd post something about that. 

Edited March 20, 2016 by Sakura12

[FurryFury]

I'm sure they'll add another female, my money's on Vixen.

 

I'd love for there to be more female bad guys, too. Valentina Vostok was probably the most memorable villain on the show thus far, more of that.

Edited March 20, 2016 by FurryFury

[Lokiberry]

So saw from Casper Crump (VS) that the cast had their wrap party. Ciara Renee (Kendra) posted a quote about letting go of control and hashtagged #LivingBeautifully #WithUncertaintyAndChange #TheArtofLettingGo #SayingGoodbye

#ChangeIsTheOnlyConstant

Anyone else get the impression that Kendra will NOT be around next season?

Oh yeah, with all that? She totally not coming back. And well, she's the weakest link. I only started getting interested in her once they paired her up with Ray; and I think that just means I like Ray more than I originally thought. They can easily bring in another female character, either Vixen or Zatanna (what IS Naya Rivera doing these days anyway?).

[KirkB]

From a narrative point of view, Kendra's only reason for being on the team is that she's the only one who can kill Savage. Once he's dead, there really isn't any reason for her to hang around. Plus if she dies taking down Savage she can always reincarnate and be with Carter again.

[Sakura12]

I suppose CR could've been told she wouldn't be coming back for the next season.  Kendra's only purpose was to take down Savage for good. When they do that they don't really need her. She doesn't add anything to the team and she didn't really make much of an impression on the audience. 

 

The ones that have seem to be Sara, Cold and Rip. I'd be fine with those three staying and getting new heroes to fill up the team. Ray, Jax and Stein are okay, but it really seems like the budget isn't around for them to do much for the team. If Vixen is coming on than they'll need to cut the cost for her CGI expense. 

[Starfish35]

Yeah, and I thought the CGI was pretty bad in her Arrow episode. It's one of the reasons I'm not crazy about the idea of her joining the team. The special effects for her powers just looked really cheesy to me.

Edited March 20, 2016 by Starfish35

[Sakura12]

I didn't see MEK's Vixen episode. She was terrible on The 4400. Although from what I heard people liked her on Arrow. 

 

However a beloved comic character is supposed to show up in the finale to lead into the second season. It's really hard to determine who people consider beloved. We know they are not getting any of the DC varsity team. So who is a beloved secondary hero? 

[Starfish35]

I don't think she's any better than CR, personally. That said, I don't think CR is a terrible actress either, but she is kinda the cast weak link though I hate to say it. MEK....she wasn't terrible? But some of her lines came out really corny sounding, and I had a hard time deciding whether that was her, or the dialogue.

But the worst part definitely was her powers. The CGI for them was so so bad. Especially when she was flying or leaping. I just cringe at the idea of having that every week.

[festivus]

I'd like another woman but not Vixen. I thought the actress was terrible. I wouldn't mind getting Snart's sister Lisa. I didn't care that much for the actress on TTP but I liked her on The Flash. I also wouldn't say no to them figuring out how to get Connor Hawke. It's a time travel show. It could be done.

[FurryFury]

I didn't see MEK's Vixen episode. She was terrible on The 4400.

 

Oh yeah, I remember her character. I think she was a total Mary Sue, though, plus, it was ages ago, enough for the actress to get better. So if people liked her on Arrow, I'm all for her joining the team.

 

. I wouldn't mind getting Snart's sister Lisa.

 

Me too, but unfortunately, she was cast in some show already (although maybe it's just a pilot).

 

I don't really want Connor Hawke, he was fairly generic, to be honest. I don't think he could be that interesting on his own, without all the Arrow stuff around him.

[festivus]

Well maybe without that timeline he would still exist but be some other character. I don't read the comics but I looked it up and Connor Hawke is Oliver's son. So he could still be Diggle's son and just be something else. Sorry, just thinking out loud, I liked the actor.

[nksarmi]

Ok I just pieced together what character we were talking about from 4400 (I didn't watch it all) but yea, she is WAY better as Vixen.  However, I don't know if that post means for sure that Kendra isn't coming back or if it means they aren't sure if they are bringing her back.  As things stand, the show is renewed, but we know little else.  Will they do another limited run (I kind of hope so) or a full season?  Who will be back?  What will the story be?  Etc.....

 

And assuming Kendra does NOT die, she can live on in the Flarrowverse, but not as a regular.  Though I have to say I'd rather they kill the poor girl than try to pair her up with Cisco again.  She works for me with Ray, but I think a lot of the dislike of the character likely came from how badly she and Cisco worked.  Anyway, the EPs could be telling her something like "We'd like to have you back, but not for the whole season" or "We need to see how the audience responds to such and such before we decide what path Kendra will take next season" etc....

 

I mean while "living with uncertainty" could refer to not knowing what her next job is going to be it seems a lot more likely that it means she doesn't actually know if/how much they will need her next season so she doesn't know what kind of other work she should pursue yet. Then again, "the art of letting go" could mean she is fired.  Or it could be related to a real-life break up or friendship ending.  Shrug.

 

Personally, I'll still watch if she isn't in season two but I was starting to like her.  I'm hoping for at least three women as part of the team next season so if she DOES go, I hope they bring in at least two more female characters.

Edited March 21, 2016 by nksarmi

[Sakura12]

If they don't get rid of Firestorm or Atom, I can't see them adding another heavily CGI'd character to the budget with them still around. They are already depending on Sara to do most of the heavy lifting (not that I mind, since it's showing how awesome Sara is) but it looks dumb that they are not using their powered characters to get out of situations. 

 

They are better off adding Zatanna, magic is much easier to CGI or another martial arts character like Lady Blackhawk. Although if they want to keep it with established characters, Dr. Light or the new female speedster that's being introduced on the Flash could work.  However I'm expecting another dude because that's how these shows work. 

[BkWurm1]

Vixen wouldn't be that bad since the animal spirit stuff would be more like layering in an image to the shot than true CGI. Then give her some fake boulders to lift and stick some goons on pulleys to have them fly away when she "throws" them.  More technical stunts than spendy computer stuff.  I'd be happy to see Tatsu/Katanna as well. She would have a similar skill set as Sara but be a vastly different personality. 

[Sakura12]

Some pics from "Left Behind"

 

I guess 1950's Sara uses a kopis sword(?) and wears the regular league outfit. While 2010ish Sara used a bo staff and had her own outfit. 

 

 

 

 

The rest are here. http://www.spoilertv.com/2016/03/legends-of-tomorrow-episode-109-left.html

Edited March 23, 2016 by MarkHB

[Starfish35]

Here's another source:

http://tvline.com/gallery/dcs-legends-of-tomorrow-season-1-photos/

[kismet]

From a narrative point of view, Kendra's only reason for being on the team is that she's the only one who can kill Savage. Once he's dead, there really isn't any reason for her to hang around. Plus if she dies taking down Savage she can always reincarnate and be with Carter again.

Plus now that they have jammed the gas petal on her relationship with RP, her death or removal from the team will also motivate him.

Personally I hate the relationship and think its unnecessary but I could see the writers using it. People seem to think BR is talented at playing avenging/grieving men. I don't see it, but h characters always seem to have dead or unavailable love partners.

[kismet]

If they don't get rid of Firestorm or Atom, I can't see them adding another heavily CGI'd character to the budget with them still around. They are already depending on Sara to do most of the heavy lifting (not that I mind, since it's showing how awesome Sara is) but it looks dumb that they are not using their powered characters to get out of situations. 

 

They are better off adding Zatanna, magic is much easier to CGI or another martial arts character like Lady Blackhawk. Although if they want to keep it with established characters, Dr. Light or the new female speedster that's being introduced on the Flash could work.  However I'm expecting another dude because that's how these shows work.

I agree that I can't see them adding another CGI heavy hero. They already enough trouble using the ones they have now, which I think is a complete budget issue.

Personally, I thought the CGI, the acting and the back story of Vixen was way to weak to bring on as a regular character.

I don't remember much about Zatanna, so I have no opinion.

If it wasn't for their back story (which limits romantic pairings) I wonder if they might consider bring Katrina Law on as Nyssa since her other pilot fell through and she is a hands on combat hero/misfit. I was surprised that they threw in and on-ship couple so soon, so perhaps the writers don't mind there being awkward tensions in the waverider.

I do think its vital that Kendra be replaced with a female. And for budget purposes her "powers" should not be too CGI reliant.

[tarotx]

Katrina Law is in the Training day Pilot and that show has to really suck for it to not be picked up imo...

[nksarmi]

I would love to see Tatsu/Katanna added to the team, but I don't see them pairing her with anyone romantically in a believable way.  Still, this show doesn't need loads of romance so I'd love to see her brought in.

 

Vixen has the benefit of being established, being a character of color, and romantically she might be the right age/personality to be paired with Jax (I didn't really see it between Jax and Kendra).

 

I really don't know how much of a cast change they will do.  VS is gone, so he has to be replaced, but that does nothing for the team makeup.  The interviews with the actor who plays Mick make it sound like he might even be back.  And we know they are bringing in an iconic character that might be Booster Gold (not sure if they could give us a female character there instead).  If Kendra dies or chooses to not go on the next mission, I guess the best we might be able to hope for is a woman to replace her.  Still I'd really like at least three women on team.  Maybe they will at least give us some female heroes in the past as they time travel. 

[tarotx]

I do want Kendra to be gone and for her to be replaced by a female. I think it could be cool to bring in someone like Constantine's Zed (though not her). A girl with a troubled past who has versions more so than battle skills. It'll be like Kendra in a way but it'll be less stuck in her own history. 

[Starfish35]

It might be heresy, but I don't want Katrina Law on this show. If they bring her on, there will be pressure to make Nyssara the endgame pairing for Sara, and I personally don't want that. I do want Nyssa and Sara to meet again, and to have some sort of resolution, but I've never believed Sara was quite as in love with Nyssa as Nyssa was with her. She loved her, yes, but I'm not convinced Nyssa was the love of her life.

I do think Kendra needs to be replaced with a female character, and two new female characters would be fantastic. But I guess Vixen's Arrow episode just gave me a lot of reservations about her being on this show.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Starfish35

[BkWurm1]

I do think Kendra needs to be replaced with a female character, and two new female characters would be fantastic. But I guess Vixen's Arrow episode just gave me a lot of reservations about her being on this show.

 

I think Vixen could be added well to the existing mix of characters.  Her not really being a part of the fold was one of the problems with her Arrow episode that and she was there to fight magic with magic which made little sense since a magic necklace is on a different level than dude that commands the force via his magic bowl..  On LoT she wouldn't be left so much on her own and she could use her powers without it being just about it being a magically equipped as well. 

[Starfish35]

No, I just wasn't terribly impressed by the actress, and I was rather appalled by the CGI. That scene where she called on the power of the leopard (or whatever it was) and leaped over Damien Dahrk to grab his totem - that scene stood out to me as particularly bad. I guess I'm just not excited about having that kind of thing on LoT every week. *shrug* I know mileage varies though.

I actually think she had some decent interactions with the rest of the cast. It was the part where she was using her powers that I had issues with.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Starfish35

[kismet]

It might be heresy, but I don't want Katrina Law on this show. If they bring her on, there will be pressure to make Nyssara the endgame pairing for Sara, and I personally don't want that. I do want Nyssa and Sara to meet again, and to have some sort of resolution, but I've never believed Sara was quite as in love with Nyssa as Nyssa was with her. She loved her, yes, but I'm not convinced Nyssa was the love of her life.

I do think Kendra needs to be replaced with a female character, and two new female characters would be fantastic. But I guess Vixen's Arrow episode just gave me a lot of reservations about her being on this show.

I must admit this was my hesitation in speculating that Nyssa might be brought in... I really don't want another romantic pairing or endgame scenario. And it's really hard to have Nyssa on the show and without somehow having to address Nyssara.

 

I just thought she is a already formed female character with fighting skills, so it would be easy to slip her into the story, especially considering she is a person without a home & family now.

 

I really loved Tatsu, but she seems to content to be left alone in solitude on her mountain, that I can't imagine anyone convincing her to travel through time to save the world.

 

But if Kendra goes, they need to replace her with a female. If they choose to farm from Flarrowverse female characters - out of the current available Flarrowverse females I would rank them as Nyssa > Cupid > Tatsu > Snart's sister > McKenna > Vixen. But if they wanted to bring in new females, I would be very open to those options.

[Sakura12]

I'm still going to throw my vote for Lady Blackhawk. One of her comic stories was being taken to the future. Plus it would be interesting to have a character on board a spaceship that's from the 1940's. Someone who's never used the internet or a cell phone or knows that the US went into space. Time Travel would be more awe inspiring to her than it is to the characters from 2016 that's seen pictures from space. While they were still impressed it would just seem like the next step to them.

 

Someone further back in time would work too. Everyone being from the same time kind of takes the fun out of it than someone that's never seen a computer. 

[Starfish35]

I actually think, regardless of my personal preferences on the subject, that Vixen very likely will be joining the show next season. Didn't the CW president cast a rather strong hint that direction? I think most of the feedback for her in that episode was positive (mine not withstanding). So I'll be a little surprised if she isn't on the show. And while I didn't personally care for it much, the CGI for her powers is probably less expensive than Kendra's wings.

Lady Blackhawk sounds like she might be an interesting character too. I don't know anything about her except what I've read on Wikipedia, but having someone from a different time period would be fun.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Starfish35

[Delphi]

Not only is Zinda am intriguing choice. It's also good for the budget. She has her combat training and a pair of pistols. Pretty cheap to do compared to Zatanna. Who I adore but fear she might be a bit too powerful to be able to effectively use in terms of both budget and story.

[Starfish35]

Not only is Zinda am intriguing choice. It's also good for the budget. She has her combat training and a pair of pistols.

I like that idea.

It makes me wonder though. If they bring on more than one new cast member, who else is going to go to make room? The cast is already packed.

[Sakura12]

Zinda would work the best with the budget. However if they do use her they need to cast someone with martial arts training or at least some stunt fight training. The fact that we can see Caity doing the fighting is what makes Sara much more badass. 

[BkWurm1]

Maybe Firestorm goes home.  Stein does have a wife and Jax a mother that they'd presumably want to go back to be with. 

[nksarmi]

Given Sakura's arguments about adding characters from other times, I don't think I want an already established Flarrowverse character.  But if I had to rank them, it would be as follows....

 

-Dr. Light.  I don't think Flash will give up the possibility of bringing Linda back, but she'd be my first choice.

-Golden Glider.  It provides a family vibe for the ship and makes Snart even more interesting. I ship her with Cisco, but that's minor to having her around flirting with everyone from Stein to Sara.

-Huntress. Ok yes, she's a little nuts, but it'd be fun to see her and Sara at odds until they settled down into a partnership and it would feed my Birds of Prey desires.

-Vixen.  I think she could fit in well and I didn't mind her CGI that much. Plus maybe she would give them a good reason to visit her ancestor's time and show us Africa (if only it's better than the Egyptian flashbacks).

 

People have given good reasons for why not Nyssa (though I do love her), I'm just glad Katana has made it out of the Suicide Squad trimming still alive - not sure I want to push our luck there, and I don't want Cupid.

 

I'd go for Lady Blackhawk for sure.  And with the scraping of Titans - I wouldn't be surprised if we could see Hawk and Dove next season.  I think they might be as popular or "beloved" as Booster Gold.

Maybe Firestorm goes home.  Stein does have a wife and Jax a mother that they'd presumably want to go back to be with. 

 

I love Stein, but I think for his character it would make a sense to not go on another mission.  I just keep debating what that means - will they fully incorporate him into Flash or would the actor prefer to only work "part-time."  On the other hand, I like that there is an older member of this cast so I'm not sure I want to give him up.

[Trini]

Wow, they are really having a hard time letting go of that Nanda Parbat set.

[BkWurm1]

The magic hot tub is warm and bubbly. Maybe the crew gets to take turns relaxing. 

[nksarmi]

The magic hot tub is warm and bubbly. Maybe the crew gets to take turns relaxing. 

 

Now I want to see backstage pictures of the Flarrowverse cast chilling in swimsuits in the LP.

[Sakura12]

CL said she wished the LP was warmer.

[tarotx]

Marc Guggenheim ‏@mguggenheim  5h5 hours ago
The first season finale of DC'S LEGENDS OF TOMORROW is in production. @philklemmer

 

[Sakura12]

They should've titled it "Wait for it" 

[FurryFury]

This was exactly my thought!

[KirkB]

Given those who have been onscreen so far, my money is on Vixen. I also wasn't bothered by her CGI, though I rarely am unless it is so terrible I simply can't bear looking at it. But I agree with those of you who mentioned this might be problematic, considering they seem to be going out of their way to avoid using it for Ray or Firestorm unless they have to.

 

Lady Blackhawk is not one I am familiar with, but after reading up on the character I think she would be an interesting choice.

 

As much as I like Katrina Law I don't see her coming on the show mainly because they are clearly not interested in pursuing Sara/Nyssa and I am also inclined to think Sara didn't love Nyssa nearly as much as Nyssa loved her.

 

I would love to see Lisa/Golden Glider come on board to try and show up her brother.

 

Zatanna and Huntress are possible, the latter especially if they want to keep the mix of heroes and villains thing. Huntress and Sara could make for some interesting scenes, though like Vixen Zatanna might be a little CGI heavy.

 

Maybe Dove? She's not as well known so they might have some leeway.

 

Fire and Ice would be interesting but again, CGI.

Edited March 24, 2016 by KirkB

[Sakura12]

I think Sara loves Nyssa but she's not in love with her anymore. I would also rather Sara meet someone new. 

 

I would be interested to see Sara and The Huntress again, they do have a small history so it would interesting to see them interact again. 

 

Wasn't the Legion of Superheroes supposed to show up on one of the Berlantiverse shows? Supergirl makes the most sense because Kara was part of the group in the comics. However since the LoT crew is traveling through time, they have a good chance of meeting some of them as well. 

[KirkB]

Even though the Flash is going to meet her I imagine Supergirl is off limits. She obviously can't join the team, since she has her own show (on another network) and while Cold and Sara and the others may not matter to the timeline I highly doubt the same could be said of Kara.

 

The Legion though, that could be interesting. They're from the future but not from Earth, so Rip could know of them and they wouldn't be affected by Savage taking over. They might not be able to recruit any of them but it might be fun to see some of them interacting with Rip's dysfunctional bunch.

Edited March 25, 2016 by KirkB

[ottoDbusdriver]

Even though the Flash is going to meet her I imagine Supergirl is off limits. She obviously can't join the team, since she has her own show (on another network) and while Cold and Sara and the others may not matter to the timeline I highly doubt the same could be said of Kara.

 

Plus there's the issue that Kara doesn't know how to travel between parallel worlds ... yet ... let alone get back so she can't visit Earth 2 or Earth Prime (the Flarrowverse).  Does that make Supergirl's planet Earth-3 in the DCU ?

[Sakura12]

LoT Sizzle Reel for the last half of the season. It looks like younger Sara, Big Atom, Jonah Hex, Jewel Staite, Felicity in a wheelchair, Talia al Ghul? Nyssa? Wild West and the Future. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJgrSZzS7JQ

 

Some tweets.

 

The #LegendsOfTomorrow team will be apart for a two year time gap after some were left behind in the '50s. #WonderCon

Chris E. Hayner ‏@ChrisHayner  7m

 

So they are sticking with the two years, that's interesting. Sara will only be one year older since missed a year of her life when she died. 

 

Chris E. Hayner ‏@ChrisHayner  4m4 minutes ago

In episode 15, Sara is taking control of the Waverider. "Rip Hunter better watch out, cause Captain Canary is coming." #LegendsOfTomorrow

https://twitter.com/ChrisHayner/status/714196750999752704

 

I hope Sara says "I'm the Captain now"

 

Chris E. Hayner ‏@ChrisHayner  31m31 minutes ago

Jewel Staite will play someone with #ties to Ray," @mguggenheim teases. #LegendsOfTomorrow #WonderCon/

 

I guess Ray has kids or he has siblings. 

 

Chris E. Hayner ‏@ChrisHayner  31m31 minutes ago

The show is going to past Star City. Pre-Gambit Sarah and Lance with hair. #LegendsOfTomorrow #WonderCon #arrow

Edited March 27, 2016 by Sakura12

[CabotCove]

The team doesn't have a speedster, Flash has lots of them.