All Episodes Talk: What's Up Doc?

[RedbirdNelly]

On 9/20/2020 at 6:47 AM, debraran said:

This scene from 3 minutes in on, always make me tear up. Benton and Carter at their best.

 '

agreed. I so love this scene. People are ready to give up on Carter, but not Benton

On 9/20/2020 at 9:13 AM, Growsonwalls said:

I also loved the storyline of Mark and his dad. Anthony Edwards and John Collum had amazing chemistry. It was just great writing and acting. John Collum exudes such decency that you just knew Mark's dad had to be a good guy underneath and he was.

 

loved this too. I loved how they gradually unfolded that relationship and you got to see the mistakes on both sides. It wasn't some "boom everything is perfect" in an hour resolution or some "Son good; dad all bad" scenario either. It was complex which made it more real--and then great acting on top of it.

[Kel Varnsen]

I watched Hell and High Water tonight. Great episode still but my engineer brain kept thinking that if Doug just cleared some of the branches, leaves and dirt from around that grate, it would have lowered the water level on the kid's side. Sure he would have been still stuck and hypothermic, but you would have at least eliminated the drowning as a risk.

[Driad]

"Hell and High Water" was the first episode of ER I saw. I had heard good things about the show but at that time I needed to get up early for work, so watching a 10 PM show was not wise.  I liked the episode but kept thinking "Isn't this show supposed to be set in a hospital?"

[debraran]

I know Carol's suicide had to be diminished once she became a regular on the show but Doug was always the reason to the staff although she said "a lot of things". I just saw when the big "surprise" of them being back together was announced by Carol and the staff isn't surprised and had bets going.  Doug proposes. Later he sees her mom to tell her and she calls Carol upset. As a mom of girls Carol's age now, I felt her pain when she said she didn't trust him, "I took care of you when he left last time". I can only imagine watching the man you felt was the last straw to your daughter's mental health, back with your daughter, doctor or not. Carol's mental health was always glossed over, a mistake by the writers who thought she was transient but I wish they explored how she got better more.

Watched one of the many Xmas episodes, I agree with other posts, they were one of the best, always a mix like real life, but left you moved. I had forgotten about the blind man and Benton and I like when time makes that happen. ; )

 

Edited September 22, 2020 by debraran

[RedbirdNelly]

I first started watching ER in season 2. I had heard the season 1 hype and just thought I was above it. Then I was taking a study break, flipped on the tv around 9:20 which happened to be on NBC and didn't stop watching (central time zone). I remember asking my friends whether I was supposed to like Benton or not. I couldn't quite tell at first--which is a sign of great writing and acting. Years later I managed to see all of season 1 while on maternity leave. TNT used to show 2 episodes a day. I'd sit down with my newborn and enjoy. Then while he screamed through each diaper change (he hated all of them), I'd call out things like "Sir! we're trying to help you!" or "we need to perform a diaperoptomy" my little ER jokes.

[CrazyInAlabama]

I think the turning point in Mark's relationship with his Dad was when Mark helped out in the base hospital ER after the helicopter crash, and the father tried to make the pilot feel better.    Then when Mark's mother said that she never wanted kids, and you could see from Mark's reaction that he knew it was the truth. 

[Dr.OO7]

The ER channel on YouTube has posted a slew of new clips in honor of the show's 26 birthday.

[WendyCR72]

On 9/19/2020 at 2:23 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

Dr. Hicks was great in this, and Kerry (Carrie?) was good too. 

It's Kerry, just so you know.  🙂 So you got it right!

[PepSinger]

A couple of weeks ago, Pop aired the episodes with Benton where he was supposed to attend his mother's birthday party; he switches shifts to spend a couple of days with her; then, he hasn't slept in over 24 hours, so Hicks forces him to lie down somewhere before touching another patient. I do not understand why Peter's family couldn't understand why he couldn't just take off on his mother's birthday. They act completely oblivious to the fact that residents have very little control over their schedules. I feel so bad for Peter that he then takes off for two days to spend time with his mother. I always wondered if his family even appreciated that? Yes, he acts like a dick with Hicks and definitely needed some sleep, but watching this as an older adult, I do feel bad for him. I think he really tried to be there for his mother as best he could.

[Bastet]

5 minutes ago, PepSinger said:

I do not understand why Peter's family couldn't understand why he couldn't just take off on his mother's birthday. They act completely oblivious to the fact that residents have very little control over their schedules.

Because they were completely oblivious to the schedule demands on a medical resident; that's not a role anyone in the family had ever previously inhabited.  Peter is already "getting above his raising" (which results in both pride and suspicion) and - even among those family members who support the overall process - missing his mom's birthday can be a really big deal. 

[debraran]

2 hours ago, Bastet said:

Because they were completely oblivious to the schedule demands on a medical resident; that's not a role anyone in the family had ever previously inhabited.  Peter is already "getting above his raising" (which results in both pride and suspicion) and - even among those family members who support the overall process - missing his mom's birthday can be a really big deal. 

I understand that but they could have learned. Their bubble wasn't that small. Even Carla was clueless, he'd get beeped and she'd act like "Go, I don't need you, just go, you lied about being there for me" For Pete's sake, many jobs don't have that flexibility. I agree with Eriq that they made them a bit too clueless. Carla either fought with him or they were having sex. He didn't dislike the Corday scenes so much as they made the ones with black women/family awful. They could have found him someone better than Cleo but that's a personal thing. I liked him with Jeanne but they made her HIV positive so that curtailed that even when she left her husband. It did bring more light to that disease and the laws though. Showing Dr Fischer chasing her and wanting to sleep with her was a bit much but I hope it made some realize back then you can't catch Hiv/Aids by breathing the same air.

[CrazyInAlabama]

I think when Carla was pregnant, they were showing why Peter and Carla would never happen, because they were ready to get rid of the actress.   

One of the saddest episodes for me was when Benton lost a patient, and they were explaining to the family, and then when his mother died the nursing home doctor used the same spiel to tell him.   

[readster]

7 hours ago, debraran said:

I understand that but they could have learned. Their bubble wasn't that small. Even Carla was clueless, he'd get beeped and she'd act like "Go, I don't need you, just go, you lied about being there for me" For Pete's sake, many jobs don't have that flexibility. I agree with Eriq that they made them a bit too clueless. Carla either fought with him or they were having sex. He didn't dislike the Corday scenes so much as they made the ones with black women/family awful. They could have found him someone better than Cleo but that's a personal thing. I liked him with Jeanne but they made her HIV positive so that curtailed that even when she left her husband. It did bring more light to that disease and the laws though. Showing Dr Fischer chasing her and wanting to sleep with her was a bit much but I hope it made some realize back then you can't catch Hiv/Aids by breathing the same air.

The sad thing is, even in 2020, people don't seem to realize that people can't just "shut off their schedules". I mean even these days doesn't matter if you are a woman or a man in the medical field. Is the: "You are always at work." Like it's a 9 to 5 job. Same with teaching, yes, granted you can "choose" when to work on things and not, but when you have teachers teaching full grade levels higher or lower grades. It isn't like 3 PM comes and its: "Yep, done with these people today." No, you have: grading, lesson plans, meetings (faculty and department). One on one. Same with police officers and public service. Granted their are shifts, but you can get called a moments notice. or even with Lawyers, unless they are running the firm and their hours, they can't just go: "Sorry, my better half wants me home for dinner, and it this will most likely cost me my job and in turn can't pay out bills, but I'm tired of being told I work too much."

[Dr.OO7]

5 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

I think when Carla was pregnant, they were showing why Peter and Carla would never happen, because they were ready to get rid of the actress.

I'm not clear what backstage hoopla went on, but I don't think it was until the 7th season that it happened, hence her being killed off at the beginning of the 8th season.

5 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

One of the saddest episodes for me was when Benton lost a patient, and they were explaining to the family, and then when his mother died the nursing home doctor used the same spiel to tell him. 

Isn't it ironic? When Peter gives the speech, it sounds caring and compassionate. When the other doctor says virtually the exact same thing, it sounds cold and detached.

[Kel Varnsen]

7 hours ago, readster said:

The sad thing is, even in 2020, people don't seem to realize that people can't just "shut off their schedules". I mean even these days doesn't matter if you are a woman or a man in the medical field. Is the: "You are always at work." Like it's a 9 to 5 job. Same with teaching, yes, granted you can "choose" when to work on things and not, but when you have teachers teaching full grade levels higher or lower grades. It isn't like 3 PM comes and its: "Yep, done with these people today." No, you have: grading, lesson plans, meetings (faculty and department). One on one. Same with police officers and public service. Granted their are shifts, but you can get called a moments notice. or even with Lawyers, unless they are running the firm and their hours, they can't just go: "Sorry, my better half wants me home for dinner, and it this will most likely cost me my job and in turn can't pay out bills, but I'm tired of being told I work too much."

The funny or maybe sad thing about Benton is his mom had dementia. They could have had her birthday party on a day that worked for everyone and she would have still probably been happy.

[doodlebug]

8 hours ago, readster said:

The sad thing is, even in 2020, people don't seem to realize that people can't just "shut off their schedules". I mean even these days doesn't matter if you are a woman or a man in the medical field. Is the: "You are always at work." Like it's a 9 to 5 job. Same with teaching, yes, granted you can "choose" when to work on things and not, but when you have teachers teaching full grade levels higher or lower grades. It isn't like 3 PM comes and its: "Yep, done with these people today." No, you have: grading, lesson plans, meetings (faculty and department). One on one. Same with police officers and public service. Granted their are shifts, but you can get called a moments notice. or even with Lawyers, unless they are running the firm and their hours, they can't just go: "Sorry, my better half wants me home for dinner, and it this will most likely cost me my job and in turn can't pay out bills, but I'm tired of being told I work too much."

That is why it was particularly odd that Carla didn't understand Peter's odd work hours.  When we met her, she was a successful restauranteur, running her own place, working hard to make the place a success.  The restaurant business is known for how much an owner has to put into it to get the business off the ground and get it in the black; there's no way Carla wasn't also working odd hours, getting called in to help when someone didn't show up or having to problem solve at all hours of the day and night.  She would not have been available to check someone's blood sugar and give them insulin 4 times a day and it was off that she expected Peter could.

[readster]

38 minutes ago, doodlebug said:

That is why it was particularly odd that Carla didn't understand Peter's odd work hours.  When we met her, she was a successful restauranteur, running her own place, working hard to make the place a success.  The restaurant business is known for how much an owner has to put into it to get the business off the ground and get it in the black; there's no way Carla wasn't also working odd hours, getting called in to help when someone didn't show up or having to problem solve at all hours of the day and night.  She would not have been available to check someone's blood sugar and give them insulin 4 times a day and it was off that she expected Peter could.

How about when she was so upset she didn't get to move to German with her "new husband". Saying: "Thanks for ruining my life." I wanted to go: "You loved your restaurant, what the hell was there to ruin?" 

[debraran]

7 hours ago, readster said:

How about when she was so upset she didn't get to move to German with her "new husband". Saying: "Thanks for ruining my life." I wanted to go: "You loved your restaurant, what the hell was there to ruin?" 

I just saw the one with Peter running to car to see Reese and realizing a guy was holding him. Kind of irked me because i know now she lied about the baby "of course being his" Peter was a good person and loved Reese anyway but the writers made his family a bit odd although I liked scenes with his brother. They had some really well written scenes, timeless in their ability to evoke emotion and make you feel part of this huge TV family but they gave some of the black actors a short shrift and they felt more one dimensional. So many people were clueless, not just one. Eriq was phenomenal though and brought the best he could to any scene.

I just saw Carter talking to Anna about the rapist he didn't waste blood on (they were short) and I thought that was also very well written. They made the characters so real, the conversations relatable and it's never preachy.

When I used to watch shows like Chicago Med (Oliver Platt deserves better)  it was like a soap opera, people yelling, sleeping together, batting oversized lashes, but horrible. ER spoiled me to expect more and I don't think that chemistry, especially the first 6 years, will ever be duplicated.

[Guest]

On 9/20/2020 at 3:28 PM, Bastet said:

Theirs is my favorite relationship of the show, and I love things like Benton being the one to give Carter his white coat but doing so by shoving it in a box and having someone take it to him and Benton responding to the token gift and story by pointing out the El doesn't use tokens anymore, but I also absolutely love this scene -- Peter kisses his head! 

I totally didn't cry at that scene at all when I watched it last week. Not even a little.  (I totally cried.)

[Hava]

Can someone help explain the Doug/Carol timeline for me? Season 1 begins with Carol attempting suicide, possibly due to the heartbreak caused by Doug. So, how long before that were they together? And how long were they together? Was it a serious, monogamous relationship? How did Doug break her heart? 

[doodlebug]

54 minutes ago, Hava said:

Can someone help explain the Doug/Carol timeline for me? Season 1 begins with Carol attempting suicide, possibly due to the heartbreak caused by Doug. So, how long before that were they together? And how long were they together? Was it a serious, monogamous relationship? How did Doug break her heart? 

We don't really know, except, in the pilot, we discover that Carol is dating an orthopedist and I think they may have even said they were engaged.  That couldn't have happened overnight, we have to figure the breakup with Doug was at least 6 months before that.  No idea how long they dated.

We know that Doug and Carol had sex on her kitchen floor on their first date.  As far as monogamous, probably not on Doug's part since we know the breakup was triggered by his behavior and we know he usually cheated on his girlfriends that we saw prior to his reunion with Carol at the end of the third season.  The presumption is that Carol thought it was a serious thing and that Doug cheated and that is what broke her heart.  All of it is speculation, though.

[debraran]

Carols mom alluded to Doug hurting her daughter and her “ helping Carol” so I assumed it was post attempted suicide she meant.  I think she felt with all the reasons, he was the last straw. Carol yelled at Doug when she admitted kissing that ( handsome ) paramedic and he was mad, a laundry list of women he cheated with. He said that was In the past. 
Doug told a woman he broke up with Carol months ago before they got back again.  Timeline as stated was always fuzzy.  

Edited September 24, 2020 by debraran

[Hava]

Thank you for your responses. The fuzziness is the reason I never got fully on board with the Carol/Doug relationship. I feel like so much of the buildup was based on their history, but without knowing their history, it was hard for me to care. 

[Bastet]

1 hour ago, doodlebug said:

We don't really know, except, in the pilot, we discover that Carol is dating an orthopedist and I think they may have even said they were engaged. 

Yes, he's referred to her as her fiancé.

[debraran]

1 hour ago, Bastet said:

Yes, he's referred to her as her fiancé.

Wasn't that Tag? I don't think she left one , took up with another so soon and decided to get married again. She only mentions Tag when discussing "having done the ring/wedding plans  before.  Someone commented that he stuck with her through recovery but I wondered then if she realized anyone else would feel like a replacement.

[Bastet]

12 minutes ago, debraran said:

Wasn't that Tag?

He's never named in the pilot.  Then Tag appears in the series, but he's a boyfriend, not a fiancé. 

But she can't have been engaged to one guy, broke him with him after the suicide attempt, and then already been seriously involved with Tag in such a compressed timeframe, so it has to be the same guy.

I'm sure it all comes down to the fact Carol was supposed to die in the pilot, so the unseen, unnamed fiancé was not given any thought -- they were setting up the coworkers' confusion over why she'd done it, given the good things in her life, and included a fiancé in that list.  In the series, he's cast, given a name, and retconned into a boyfriend. 

 

[doodlebug]

55 minutes ago, Bastet said:

He's never named in the pilot.  Then Tag appears in the series, but he's a boyfriend, not a fiancé. 

But she can't have been engaged to one guy, broke him with him after the suicide attempt, and then already been seriously involved with Tag in such a compressed timeframe, so it has to be the same guy.

I'm sure it all comes down to the fact Carol was supposed to die in the pilot, so the unseen, unnamed fiancé was not given any thought -- they were setting up the coworkers' confusion over why she'd done it, given the good things in her life, and included a fiancé in that list.  In the series, he's cast, given a name, and retconned into a boyfriend. 

 

It also wouldn't make sense for the writers to refer to Carol's fiance in the pilot as a former Big 10 football star and orthopedist and then have Tag come along with the exact same background story but be a different person.  TPTB backed off the fiance storyline in order to play up the Doug/Carol connection once she became a series regular IMO.

[Kel Varnsen]

The whole timeline for those first few episodes is weird. Because episode 2 is supposed to be 8 weeks since Carol's suicide attempt, but then for Carter he is still acting like he just got there not someone who has been there for 2 months.

Also my wife and I are watching season 2 now and it is weird seeing Ron Rifkin as Dr Vuclich. Mainly because before we started watching ER at night we rewatched all 5 seasons of Alias. I keep expecting Vuclich to pull some kind of Rambaldi artifact out of some patient's chest.

[Guest]

Okay, just because in one of my recent posts I said I find Kerri much more sympathetic now that I'm older and possibly wiser, but she's pissed me off with this handling of the Jing-Mei situation.  All about covering for herself when she knows she didn't have her pager.  

[RedbirdNelly]

3 hours ago, deaja said:

Okay, just because in one of my recent posts I said I find Kerri much more sympathetic now that I'm older and possibly wiser, but she's pissed me off with this handling of the Jing-Mei situation.  All about covering for herself when she knows she didn't have her pager.  

Yeah, Kerri has this way of doing things where you start to warm to her, start to feel like she's ok--I mean I'm a rule follower and in real life would like it if others did as well--but then she always pulls a jerk move that keeps you from really cheering for her

[Bastet]

4 hours ago, deaja said:

Okay, just because in one of my recent posts I said I find Kerri much more sympathetic now that I'm older and possibly wiser, but she's pissed me off with this handling of the Jing-Mei situation.  All about covering for herself when she knows she didn't have her pager.  

I'm often in Kerry's corner when others are not, but, yeah, she's awful there.  But I'm back to form when Chen comes back, because then she's the asshole (acting like she didn't do anything wrong, when all three of them screwed up).

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, Bastet said:

I'm often in Kerry's corner when others are not, but, yeah, she's awful there.  But I'm back to form when Chen comes back, because then she's the asshole (acting like she didn't do anything wrong, when all three of them screwed up).

Oh, I wasn't aware she comes back.  That might change my view. 

I'm guessing this is probably right around where I stopped watching for whatever reason during the original run because there are things I remember (like Malucci being fired and Carla dying) but then there have been a couple things I know I didn't see or things that are building up.

[debraran]

1 hour ago, deaja said:

Oh, I wasn't aware she comes back.  That might change my view. 

I'm guessing this is probably right around where I stopped watching for whatever reason during the original run because there are things I remember (like Malucci being fired and Carla dying) but then there have been a couple things I know I didn't see or things that are building up.

Yes, it gets blurry for me too because I started to watch less the last few seasons and would watch when it was hyped as a good one . Catching up during furlough for 2 months, I saw although end shows were not great, the gems in-between were good. Carrie was a jerk at times but she was "real". Not many people are one dimensional. Carter was usually good but not perfect. Carrie felt she fought for so long to be respected, she'd sell you out to stay there. She did have a conscience but like some, pushed it down on occasion. That was a big one.

[RedbirdNelly]

in general the show deserves credit for creating characters that were good but not perfect and making it believable. Other shows fail at that--it's either all good or bad or someone suddenly gets a personality transplant for purposes of plot at random times. ER did it better than any show I can think of right now. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

Yes, Deb Chen comes back when she proves (the waitress at the diner across the street remembers Kerri looking for her pager the night the man died) that Kerry lied, and wasn't available.    (doodlebug explains the Kerry situation, thank you for that).       Then after that Deb (now known by her real name of Jing-Mei) is around for a while, becomes involved with Pratt.   

   She was in Season 1, left to go into research, and came back in Season 6, in Season 7 she's pregnant and gives the baby up for adoption, because she knows her family will never accept a mixed race baby.  Season 8 is when the patient dies of Marfan syndrome.  Jing-Mei leaves, but comes back to be an attending, because she proved Kerry lied about being reachable, and Jing-Mei could have sued the hospital (also she wasn't made chief resident because of her time off on maternity leave back in Season 7). Her parents go to China to visit, and are in a car wreck where her mother dies, and the father comes back to the U.S. and is very ill, and Pratt and Deb/Jing-Mei, do a mercy killing, releasing the father from horrible pain, and a slow decline.  In season 11 is when her father dies, and she returns to China for his funeral, and is not coming back to the U.S. 

Edited September 27, 2020 by CrazyInAlabama

[doodlebug]

25 minutes ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

Yes, Deb Chen comes back when she proves (the waitress at the diner across the street remembers Kerri looking for her pager the night the man died) that Kerri lied, and wasn't available.    Was that when Kerry was meeting her bio. mother (Francis Fisher), and found out the woman was a raging homophobe?      Then after that Deb (now known by her real name of Jing-Mei is around for a while, becomes involved with Pratt.   

   She was in Season 1, left to go into research, and came back in Season 6, in Season 7 she's pregnant and gives the baby up for adoption, because she knows her family will never accept a mixed race baby.  Season 8 is when the patient dies of Marfan syndrome.  Jing-Mei leaves, but comes back to be an attending, because she proved Kerri lied about being reachable, and Jing-Mei could have sued the hospital (also she wasn't made chief resident because of her time off on maternity leave back in Season 7). Her parents go to China to visit, and are in a car wreck where her mother dies, and the father comes back to the U.S. and is very ill, and Pratt and Deb/Jing-Mei, do a mercy killing, releasing the father from horrible pain, and a slow decline.  In season 11 is when her father dies, and she returns to China for his funeral, and is not coming back to the U.S. 

The night Kerry lost her pager, she went to Doc's to talk to the private detective who was searching for her birth mother.  At some point, she fired him because he gave her a wrong name.  Kerry went to the lady's apartment and discovered she was dying and brought her to the ER and totally ignored her desire for a DNR in an effort to keep her alive long enough to talk to her, only to discover that the lady's blood type was incompatible with hers and she couldn't be her mother.

Kerry doesn't meet her birth mother until Season 11.  Played by Frances Fisher, Kerry's biomom comes to the ER posing as a patient in order to meet her.  Turns out her mom was a teen when she was born and didn't even know about Kerry's hip problem which Kerry often thought might be the reason she was given for adoption,  Her mother is also a conservative Christian and makes it clear that, while she wants a relationship with Kerry, she thinks she's a sinner headed for hell because she is gay.  Kerry walks away.

Edited September 26, 2020 by doodlebug

[Bastet]

Chen makes quite a habit of quitting (three times just from County), and the final time she does so with no notice and causes chaos on Christmas Eve when they were already understaffed and Susan had been cutting her breaks for weeks because of the situation with her dad.  But, while I was pretty over her by then, I felt sorry for her exhausted self wandering the ER trying to get someone to cover for her so she could take care of her dad.

And that episode ends with Pratt finally not being a dick (I so want to punch him when he's lecturing Jing-Mei about euthanasia!), even signing her dad's death certificate. 

[MinorL]

I’m watching Season 4, and are we supposed to be sympathetic to Jeannie’s accusations of discrimination? The way she was taking notes about Kerry stopping her from procedures when she came to work when she didn’t even have a job there was inappropriate. It was pretty clear that it wasn’t discrimination, but it made it seem like people who do allege discrimination are fabricating and that they have unethical lawyers. Jeannie’s affect was very strange, throughout, as well. I’m just not sure how the show wanted us to interpret it, but it made me not like Jeannie. 

[Bastet]

That was a frustrating storyline. 

We had the realism of Mark and Kerry attempting to hammer out a policy that complied with the various state and federal laws in that early stage of protection for HIV patients – one that existed almost exclusively on paper, as employees were routinely fired/laid off for pretextual reasons.

Which is indeed what happened to Jeanie, just as that patient warned her about.

There was first Mark’s odious behavior (violating state law and hospital policy by accessing her medical records) being rightly called out when he lectured Jeanie she should have told him about her HIV status and she schooled him with, “No, it’s better it happened this way – now you know about me, and I know a lot more about you.”

So she called him out, and Anspaugh was clearly shown as someone who was inventing a protocol to eliminate a position that, oh gee, based on seniority, just happened to be inhabited by the one staffer known to have HIV. 

But Kerry was nothing but supportive to Jeanie, yet Jeanie treated her like the same shit.  Kerry made the only decision she could make under Anspaugh’s mandate; HIS action was discriminatory, not hers, and she networked to find Jeanie another job, all while offering personal support.

I’m all in for Jeanie’s lawsuit (I'm a civil rights lawyer, and I'd have happily taken that case), but once she rightly got her job back, she never even bothered to acknowledge Kerry’s support and say implicating her among the others was just a necessary aspect of litigation.

And later when Jeanie decided she didn’t want to come to work anymore (because of some boring-ass husband and maybe a baby; I’ve forgotten a lot of that part?), she just didn’t, rather than giving Kerry proper notice.

[Hava]

I've been binging the shows as (mostly) a first-time viewer. The first episode of season 6 feels like an entirely different show! Something about the tone and the pacing feels off. And the characters don't feel like the ones I grew to love. Should I quit watching while I still have good memories of the show, or will it improve?

[WendyCR72]

23 minutes ago, Hava said:

I've been binging the shows as (mostly) a first-time viewer. The first episode of season 6 feels like an entirely different show! Something about the tone and the pacing feels off. And the characters don't feel like the ones I grew to love. Should I quit watching while I still have good memories of the show, or will it improve?

Season 6 is actually a great season. Trust me. If you feel the need to stop, wait for S7. THAT is when the tone AND lighting go south. (S7 is dark both metaphorically and physically.) Of course, you may feel differently if you keep going. But, for me, that is when the show started having one character eat the show and become a Mary Sue. (I'm looking at YOU, Abby!)

However, the show - after S6 -basically becomes uneven. Some parts are great! But the lows are pretty low. (Season 8 also sees Susan Lewis return, but with the shitty writing she got, she may as well have been a new character.)

One season I completely recommend is the final one, S15. Bunches of returns from the classic cast, and it was just a great wrap up. And Angela Bassett, for coming in so late, was a good addition.

[debraran]

4 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Season 6 is actually a great season. Trust me. If you feel the need to stop, wait for S7. THAT is when the tone AND lighting go south. (S7 is dark both metaphorically and physically.) Of course, you may feel differently if you keep going. But, for me, that is when the show started having one character eat the show and become a Mary Sue. (I'm looking at YOU, Abby!)

However, the show - after S6 -basically becomes uneven. Some parts are great! But the lows are pretty low. (Season 8 also sees Susan Lewis return, but with the shitty writing she got, she may as well have been a new character.)

One season I completely recommend is the final one, S15. Bunches of returns from the classic cast, and it was just a great wrap up. And Angela Bassett, for coming in so late, was a good addition.

I agree, I'm glad I re watched it and saw some good episodes, but God, I could have cut out Abby, the Luca and Samantha drove me nuts (and her son) That turned into a soap opera to me and not a good drama. They tried to incorporate sex into everything instead of it being a part of the show, it seemed forced. Why they tool with the best chemistry and writing, I don't know. MASH I don't feel (memory fades a bit) did that with their writing, not every episode has to be great, but don't lose the formula that works. Carter deserved better too toward the end but the final shows that bring them back is great, even Mark Greene. ; )  One nice thing about seeing it again is you can skip episodes or FF on HULU and it's okay. I'm so glad I get to watch it on that platform and not see what they put on TV.

 

Edited September 27, 2020 by debraran

[PepSinger]

Pop just aired an episode where Peter says that putting Reese in daycare is $450 a week, and that would be two-thirds of his take home pay. WHAT??? That can't be right?

[debraran]

18 hours ago, PepSinger said:

Pop just aired an episode where Peter says that putting Reese in daycare is $450 a week, and that would be two-thirds of his take home pay. WHAT??? That can't be right?

In 2015, documents said average 55,000 for residents and average 61,200 in 2019. Back then I'm sure it was much less. So that makes sense, he said "after taxes" and he has loans I'm sure.

Back in the mid 1990's my child's teacher was married to a urologist who was a hospital doctor and got around 80.000. That was less than a private practice doctor but he had everything (health insurance, malpractice) paid for and no mortgage, rent. Still not what most think doctor's make who aren't in high income specialties. I'm sure residents were much lower.

I think ER did their homework with that. I worked at Yale Hospital during the early 90's and most residents/interns that weren't rich (a few) lived very simply in cheap apartments and talked of making the "real money" later.

Our hospital daycare was way too expensive back then for anyone but doctor's and higher paid specialties but residents would have it tough. I hope that has changed, maybe a sliding scale but many were envious they had a place so close and the support staff had to go elsewhere.

Edited September 28, 2020 by debraran

[Kel Varnsen]

So has anyone ever figured out the layout of county general? I am almost finished season 2 and every few episodes there is a patient brought into the ER through the elevator with some line about how they came through the main hospital entrance. But the ER is on the ground floor with exits to the street on at least 2 different sides of the building (since there are doors to the outside on both sides of the admit desk). So how is there another entrance that requires you to take an elevator to the ground level ER?

[doodlebug]

12 hours ago, PepSinger said:

Pop just aired an episode where Peter says that putting Reese in daycare is $450 a week, and that would be two-thirds of his take home pay. WHAT??? That can't be right?

I made $17,000 in salary as an intern in 1982.  By the time I was Chief Resident in 1986, I was making a whopping $23,000.  My take home pay was about $620 every 2 weeks.  By the mid 90's, when Peter would've been training, it was probably in the range of $35,000-40,000. So, if anything, the take home pay he quotes sounds a little high.  Even today, the typical doctor in training is making around $60,000 a year.

BTW, when I got that contract and signed on the dotted line for 17 grand, I thought I would be on easy street as I'd been living on student loans of $5000 a year and a part time job as a med student.  It didn't really turn out that way, though.

I worked at a hospital that had a daycare for employees and most residents would've found it way too expensive.

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

So has anyone ever figured out the layout of county general? I am almost finished season 2 and every few episodes there is a patient brought into the ER through the elevator with some line about how they came through the main hospital entrance. But the ER is on the ground floor with exits to the street on at least 2 different sides of the building (since there are doors to the outside on both sides of the admit desk). So how is there another entrance that requires you to take an elevator to the ground level ER?

I worked in a hospital built on a street with a bit of a slope.  You could drive up to the ER and walk through the doors and the ER triage was right there.  But, when you walked out into the main hospital, you were on the second floor.  Someone coming in the main entrance on the first floor would have to take an elevator or stairs up to the second floor to get to the ER.  Ambulances pulled up to the ER at an entrance that was around the corner from the walk-in entrance, so there were entrances on 2 sides of that building, too.

Edited September 28, 2020 by doodlebug

[CrazyInAlabama]

The daycare required by a resident would be 24/7, especially a surgeon on call.     So finding a daycare in that situation would be tough outside the hospital.   

 

[doodlebug]

6 minutes ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

The daycare required by a resident would be 24/7, especially a surgeon on call.     So finding a daycare in that situation would be tough outside the hospital.   

 

It's tough inside the hospital, too.  I don't know of any hospital daycare facilities that are open 24/7.  Most residents have to arrange other care for their child outside of regular hours, even if they use the daycare.  The daycare where I used to work was open 6AM-6PM, so even nurses who worked 12 hour days would have to find someone to pick up their kids and watch them until their shift ended at 7:30 PM.

[debraran]

7 hours ago, doodlebug said:

It's tough inside the hospital, too.  I don't know of any hospital daycare facilities that are open 24/7.  Most residents have to arrange other care for their child outside of regular hours, even if they use the daycare.  The daycare where I used to work was open 6AM-6PM, so even nurses who worked 12 hour days would have to find someone to pick up their kids and watch them until their shift ended at 7:30 PM.

That's true, ours was pickup by 530 or 6 with penalties for late arrivals. (those could add up) Really why would anyone want to take care of children in the evening? It's not a home and the kids are tired.

We had a well known OB/Gyn in the newspaper in the 90's saying she was looking to start an at home babysitting group for when docs had to go in and couldn't stay home with a sick child. It was a whopping 10.00 an hour which was high back then and the sitter would stay at their home until they got back. I didn't hear about it for very long, whether it couldn't find sitters who wanted to catch what the kid had or most doctors had nanny's.

a PS Carter said he got paid 28,000 when asking for a loan when Gamma shut him off 

Edited September 29, 2020 by debraran

[doodlebug]

4 hours ago, debraran said:

That's true, ours was pickup by 530 or 6 with penalties for late arrivals. (those could add up) Really why would anyone want to take care of children in the evening? It's not a home and the kids are tired.

We had a well known OB/Gyn in the newspaper in the 90's saying she was looking to start an at home babysitting group for when docs had to go in and couldn't stay home with a sick child. It was a whopping 10.00 an hour which was high back then and the sitter would stay at their home until they got back. I didn't hear about it for very long, whether it couldn't find sitters who wanted to catch what the kid had or most doctors had nanny's.

a PS Carter said he got paid 28,000 when asking for a loan when Gamma shut him off 

I think that was in Season 4 when Carter was an ER intern.  So, my guesstimate that Benton was making around $35 grand as a fourth year surgical resident was probably close, but maybe a bit high.

BTW, I believe most hospitals have a going rate for all residents, no matter what their specialty.  At least mine did in the 80's and so did the rest of the hospitals where my friends did their training.  Where I worked, everyone got $17 grand as an intern, whether they were doing general medicine, surgery, ortho, OB/GYN.  The pay increased by a couple of thousand a year and topped out in the 3rd year.  Once you hit the third year, you got the annual cost of living increase, but were paid the same in your 4th or 5th if your residency lasted that long as all the 3rf years.