S05.E13: Sister Act

[b2H]

One of the tools of an alcoholic is projection.

 

'If I'm so bad, you must be worse', whether true or not, deflects the discussion from the true alcoholic to the person trying to help and make the helper feel guilty.  Brandi is a master at this.  Kyle needs to cut Brandi out.  The next time there is an event that Kyle is hosting and Brandi shows up uninvited, get Security and have Brandi escorted out.  This story of the argument at the mixer was producer-driven,  Any rational person would've thrown the viper out and there would've been a different kind of drama, but not anything that would've been on camera.

[Umbelina]

Kyle worked herself up into a lather, even though Brandi behaved well, and was obviously not drunk, or even out of line.  She says several times that she just wants to leave, heck, even when they were going to the party (Kim's idea) she expresses reservations about going.  While there, Kyle screamed at her, made a huge scene, double fingered her sister, went around to just about everyone at the party complaining and whining both before and after the scene SHE caused.

 

What a selfish little bitch.

 

Meanwhile, gays guys going "Oh yeah!  Act the fools for us!  Be our entertainment!"  I would have loved it if Bravo simply had the wives in the background, and we could have just listened to the guys point and laugh and comment.

 

If Brandi has been Kyle's mouthpiece (and I think she has) then Lipsa is being Kyle's, saying the stuff Kyle learned the hard way not to say about Kim.

 

One sister being or acting like an asshole doesn't mean the other one isn't an asshole too though.  The Richards sisters are both a huge pile of suck, dancing on strings for our amusement.  The problem is?  It's just no longer amusing to me.

Edited February 8, 2015 by Umbelina

[zoeysmom]

Kyle worked herself up into a lather, even though Brandi behaved well, and was obviously not drunk, or even out of line.  She says several times that she just wants to leave, heck, even when they were going to the party (Kim's idea) she expresses reservations about going.  While there, Kyle screamed at her, made a huge scene, double fingered her sister, went around to just about everyone at the party complaining and whining both before and after the scene SHE caused.

 

What a selfish little bitch.

 

Meanwhile, gays guys going "Oh yeah!  Act the fools for us!  Be our entertainment!"  I would have loved it if Bravo simply had the wives in the background, and we could have just listened to the guys point and laugh and comment.

 

If Brandi has been Kyle's mouthpiece (and I think she has) then Lipsa is being Kyle's, saying the stuff Kyle learned the hard way not to say about Kim.

 

One sister being or acting like an asshole doesn't mean the other one isn't an asshole too though.  The Richards sisters are both a huge pile of suck, dancing on strings for our amusement.  The problem is?  It's just no longer amusing to me.

Brandi didn't behave well she just didn't sink to her usual low level of behavior. 

 

Brandi went knowing she was uninvited by Kyle, knowing she was on the outs with the other women, talking smack about Kyle on the way over.  Brandi had made public Kim's desperate call in the middle of the night.  Once Kyle approached her she refused to acknowledge any bad behavior on her part at Poker Night, threatened Kyle with violence, and made that stupid excuse of if she is somehow angered she is not responsible for her actions, and Brandi refused repeatedly to leave when asked, and kept hanging around Kim, which was the source of the conflict between the two sisters. 

 

I don't think Kyle should have said F-U to Kim and given her the double bird but it was somehow satisfying to see Kim maybe get the message that she was not at all supportive of her sister, despite her claims to the contrary the day before.

 

The saddest thing about Kim electing to bring Brandi is that she doesn't get it - Kim is given huge passes by the others just for being Kyle's sister.  Not once has there been any indication that Kim reached out to Eileen or Lisar and offered an apology for her incredibly poor behavior on Poker Night. Even if Kim could not remember her behavior she should assume after checking with her sister and Brandi she misbehaved. That should have been Kim's first stop, without the albatross around her neck that is Brandi.  And what was with Mark-wasn't he there to meet other men instead he seemed to just hang out with the ladies.  What a cling-on.

 

It would have been a great step forward had Kim returned pulled her sister aside and said,"we need to talk soon," instead of marching out in some sort of solidarity with Brandi.

[Found A Peanut]

One of the tools of an alcoholic is projection.

'If I'm so bad, you must be worse', whether true or not, deflects the discussion from the true alcoholic to the person trying to help and make the helper feel guilty. Brandi is a master at this. Kyle needs to cut Brandi out. The next time there is an event that Kyle is hosting and Brandi shows up uninvited, get Security and have Brandi escorted out. This story of the argument at the mixer was producer-driven, Any rational person would've thrown the viper out and there would've been a different kind of drama, but not anything that would've been on camera.

If the security at an event is provided by Bravo, would they do that? I'm supposing not unless there's actual physical violence. Otherwise, I think the Housewife is stuck with asking and hoping.

I don't blame Kyle for being caught flat-footed - I'm sure that was Kim's intent, or she would have texted ahead and risked having Kyle say no. But once Kyle either gathered her wits or borrowed some from friends, she should have totally either iced Brandi out or asked her to leave calmly and let Brandi look like the asshole if she refused. What she did at Lisar's party would have worked to perfection here, treating Brandi "...like a ghost floated through the party."

I'm still sympathetic to Kyle, though. I think her bonding session the day before with Kim telling her that no mere friendship could ever come between them set Kyle up to expect Kim was going to back her up. (Pick me! kiddingnotkidding)

Edited February 8, 2015 by Found A Peanut

[sistermagpie]

This is the fifth season.  Kyle having a drinking problem has never been brought up to my knowledge and the women on the show have been dissected to the max.  Does she enjoy a drink?  Sure.  Have we've seen most of the women a tad drunk?  Sure.  The only ones that have a problem is Kim and Brandi.

 

 

Yes, the only time Kyle's alleged drinking problem comes up is when Kim or Brandi's drinking problem is getting too much attention. Then suddenly both of them have noticed how much Kyle drinks.

 

Brandi didn't behave well she just didn't sink to her usual low level of behavior.

 

 

Yeah, I thought Brandi was behaving really badly--but it depends on how you define that. If her worst behavior is yelling and falling out of her clothes and falling over and sitting on peoples' laps and making racist remarks then yes, she was on good behavior. But that's how Brandi behaves when she's on the defensive and feels powerless. On this night Brandi had all the power and she knew it and was enjoying sticking it to Kyle and telling her how she was a bad sister and Brandi had replaced her with Kim etc. 

[imjagain]

If the security at an event is provided by Bravo, would they do that? I'm supposing not unless there's actual physical violence. Otherwise, I think the Housewife is stuck with asking and hoping.

I don't blame Kyle for being caught flat-footed - I'm sure that was Kim's intent, or she would have texted ahead and risked having Kyle say no. But once Kyle either gathered her wits or borrowed some from friends, she should have totally either iced Brandi out or asked her to leave calmly and let Brandi look like the asshole if she refused. What she did at Lisar's party would have worked to perfection here, treating Brandi "...like a ghost floated through the party."

I'm still sympathetic to Kyle, though. I think her bonding session the day before with Kim telling her that no mere friendship could ever come between them set Kyle up to expect Kim was going to back her up. (Pick me! kiddingnotkidding)

I had not thought of that. Great point. Kyle asked Brandi to leave, maybe that is all she could do. As security was Bravo and it wasn't at Kyle's home.

[Umbelina]

Or, Kyle could have acted like a grown up, greeted Brandi and her sister, and then attended to her other guests to ensure they were having a good time.

 

Kyle wanted to be the center of attention and the WRONGED PUT UPON VICTIM, and we actually watched her work herself up to that, and then go on the attack.

 

It's a Bravo party anyway.  She's been to this rodeo before, she knows Bravo (and Kim) wanted Brandi there.

[zoeysmom]

Yes, the only time Kyle's alleged drinking problem comes up is when Kim or Brandi's drinking problem is getting too much attention. Then suddenly both of them have noticed how much Kyle drinks.

 

 

Yeah, I thought Brandi was behaving really badly--but it depends on how you define that. If her worst behavior is yelling and falling out of her clothes and falling over and sitting on peoples' laps and making racist remarks then yes, she was on good behavior. But that's how Brandi behaves when she's on the defensive and feels powerless. On this night Brandi had all the power and she knew it and was enjoying sticking it to Kyle and telling her how she was a bad sister and Brandi had replaced her with Kim etc. 

So true about Kyle's drinking problem and something Kim has never asserted since Season 1. 

 

No matter how many prescription drugs Kim takes she could not have possibly thought it was a good idea to bring Brandi.  There had been about two weeks that had passed since Poker Night-maybe less depending if Kim spent 5 or 9 days in the hospital.  Brandi has Kyle's phone number she could have called her and suggest they talk.  Even Jennifer Brandi's friend had suggested she call Kyle.  This business of letting time pass only seems to apply when Brandi wants to avoid the conversation.  It is kind of sick that Brandi does see to get great satisfaction out of torturing Kyle with Kim.  After this past week's events (Conrad Hilton airline misbehavior)I wonder if Kathy Hilton is going to Brandi for support or if the family gates have been locked and there is no place for Brandi.  Maybe Brandi is just there for Kim to show support.

[sistermagpie]

Maybe Brandi is just there for Kim to show support.

 

 

It occurs to me that maybe one of the other appeals that Kim has for Brandi is that when Brandi was with Lisa her whole deal was that she was the child that Lisa and Ken took care of. She's spent a while trying to get Lisa to bring her back into that like a wayward child and Lisa still isn't doing it. Brandi's relationship with Kim is the opposite, where she is the grown up who's taking care of poor messed up Kim when her real parents (Kyle) have neglected her. Brandi's definitely enjoying her role as the alleged grown up in her relationship with Kim (what was it somebody else called her--the drunk girl protecting the other drunk girl at the part with all the serious authority that role always inspires)?

 

I don't think she's consciously thinking that she's sticking it to Lisa by showing her that she's the grown up now or anything, but it is kind of interesting. Especially since she was claiming that the problem with her relationship with Lisa was that Brandi just went after people that Lisa didn't like like an attack dog/sidekick and she wanted to be more of an equal. So now she's made herself the attack dog/sidekick for Kim.

[imjagain]

Or, Kyle could have acted like a grown up, greeted Brandi and her sister, and then attended to her other guests to ensure they were having a good time.

Kyle wanted to be the center of attention and the WRONGED PUT UPON VICTIM, and we actually watched her work herself up to that, and then go on the attack.

It's a Bravo party anyway. She's been to this rodeo before, she knows Bravo (and Kim) wanted Brandi there.

Well, yes of course. I agree that Kyle should have handled the situation better. I would have preferred she ignored Brandi after she greeted her. And been done with it.

I was specifically talking about security and that I had never thought about Bravo's security would not put out Brandi.

Edited February 8, 2015 by imjagain

[WireWrap]

Kyle worked herself up into a lather, even though Brandi behaved well, and was obviously not drunk, or even out of line.  She says several times that she just wants to leave, heck, even when they were going to the party (Kim's idea) she expresses reservations about going.  While there, Kyle screamed at her, made a huge scene, double fingered her sister, went around to just about everyone at the party complaining and whining both before and after the scene SHE caused.

 

What a selfish little bitch.

 

Meanwhile, gays guys going "Oh yeah!  Act the fools for us!  Be our entertainment!"  I would have loved it if Bravo simply had the wives in the background, and we could have just listened to the guys point and laugh and comment.

 

If Brandi has been Kyle's mouthpiece (and I think she has) then Lipsa is being Kyle's, saying the stuff Kyle learned the hard way not to say about Kim.

 

One sister being or acting like an asshole doesn't mean the other one isn't an asshole too though.  The Richards sisters are both a huge pile of suck, dancing on strings for our amusement.  The problem is?  It's just no longer amusing to me.

Kyle was wrong to confront Brandi at her party. Her apology started off as sincere and went to insincere rapidly, IMO, she was hoping that Brandi would apologize as well and then they could move on. That did not happen, Brandi feels that what she did was right, in her pickled brain, she did no wrong.....according to her, she never does anything wrong, everyone makes her do/say the things she does. All 3 HWs acted badly, all 3.

 

You may have a point here about Lisa R saying on camera the truth about Kim that Kyle can not risk saying. It worked last time even though it took a few years but eventually Kim did get some help. Maybe Kyle is hoping that Lisa R speaking the truth about Kim's continued drug use will once again force Kim into rehab. It is just as possible that Lisa R is doing this without permission or encouragement from Kyle just because she cares about seeing another human being killing themselves. She is as outspoken about Brandi's over consumption of alcohol as she is Kim's addictions.  I also think it is possible that production is encouraging her to call Kim and Brandi out instead of ignoring the elephants in the room. Whatever reason is the real reason Lisa R is calling them out, it is about time, IMO, it is overdue.

[Umbelina]

I have reservations about "calling Kim out" on camera.  I guess I just don't see it as helpful, or coming from a good place. 

 

I also don't think (and the video clip is up on Bravo) that Kyle's apology was real.  It was just a couple of words strung out before the attack began.  It was obvious she was going over there to fight, that's why we see two of her friends trying to tell her to chill.  She, in no way, went over to apologize, she went over to attack.  Which she did, while Brandi, for quite a while, simply stood there, took it, and replied calmly, when she could get a word in.

 

"I'm sorry for "touching" you (no Kyle, grabbing at her repeatedly and digging your fingers into her arms) BUT you blah blah blah and YOU blah blah blah (it's all YOUR fault that I "touched" you.)

[WireWrap]

I have reservations about "calling Kim out" on camera.  I guess I just don't see it as helpful, or coming from a good place. 

 

I also don't think (and the video clip is up on Bravo) that Kyle's apology was real.  It was just a couple of words strung out before the attack began.  It was obvious she was going over there to fight, that's why we see two of her friends trying to tell her to chill.  She, in no way, went over to apologize, she went over to attack.  Which she did, while Brandi, for quite a while, simply stood there, took it, and replied calmly, when she could get a word in.

 

"I'm sorry for "touching" you (no Kyle, grabbing at her repeatedly and digging your fingers into her arms) BUT you blah blah blah and YOU blah blah blah (it's all YOUR fault that I "touched" you.)

Kyle did not repeatedly grab Brandi and she did not dig her nails into her. Even Brandi accepted that she got scratched on Kyle's bracelet. Brandi did in fact grab both of Kyle's wrists over near the garage doors even though Kim has asked Brandi to step away from her and Kyle at that point. IMO, Kyle was looking for Brandi to apologize for physically getting between the sisters when she was not asked by Kim to do so. For some sick reason, Brandi is intent on getting between them and IMO, she is not doing it for Kim but for her own twisted reasons...she is looking for payback.

[Otherkate]

 

I don't think Kyle should have said F-U to Kim and given her the double bird but it was somehow satisfying to see Kim maybe get the message that she was not at all supportive of her sister, despite her claims to the contrary the day before.

 

 

Oh I think she should have. She should have done it years ago and then stuck to it, but she didn't and she won't stick to it now either. Unfortunately. No one ever gives Kim the f-u that she so greatly deserves. Kyle acted like an idiot and Brandi is a disgusting creature whose empty soul scares the living shit out of me, but I can't stand Kim most of all. Get help or get the fuck off my tv. 

[Found A Peanut]

Kyle was wrong to confront Brandi at her party. Her apology started off as sincere and went to insincere rapidly, IMO, she was hoping that Brandi would apologize as well and then they could move on. That did not happen, Brandi feels that what she did was right, in her pickled brain, she did no wrong.....according to her, she never does anything wrong, everyone makes her do/say the things she does. All 3 HWs acted badly, all 3.

I think when you grow up in a home where apologies are never genuinely accepted, where an unqualified apology is filed away as ammunition, an admission of wrongdoing to be pulled out in future arguments (starting...now!), that you never learn how to give a proper apology, one that isn't about jockeying for position in the ongoing hostilities. People can learn better as adults, but I think a lot of stress, certain people, or situations that are just too reminiscent can all cause you to backslide from your better self.

Um. Said a friend of mine once. This is not about me!

Edited February 8, 2015 by Found A Peanut

[WireWrap]

I think when you grow up in a home where apologies are never genuinely accepted, where an unqualified apology is filed away as ammunition, an admission of wrongdoing to be pulled out in future arguments (starting...now!), that you never learn how to give a proper apology, one that isn't about jockeying for position in the ongoing hostilities. People can learn better as adults, but I think a lot of stress, certain people, or situations that are just too reminiscent can all cause you to backslide from your better self.

Um. Said a friend of mine once. This is not about me!

I don't think it helps when Mommy Dearest pits sister against sister for her affection, time and approval their entire childhoods. Family can either bring out the best in a person or the worst in a person! And it can change minute to minute! LOL

[WireWrap]

I think Kyle has generally been weary of Brandi. She worked on being friendly with her after Game Night but she has never trusted her. She has never defended her and taken her in to the great extent that Lisa and Ken did.

I don't think Lisa's advice to ignore Brandi the way Lisa now does makes sense here. Brandi is not getting to Kyle. Brandi interfering with Kyles's co-dependent dysfunctional relationship with Kim is what is getting to Kyle. Kyle feels that Brandi is using Kim and will eventually hurt her so she believes she can't ignore Brandi.

No, Kyle believed Brandi and fell into the trap like most of them have at 1 point or another. While it is true that Kyle and Brandi were never friends like Lisa/Brandi,  they were closer than Kyle wants to admit now. There was a fair amount of socializing off camera/between seasons the last 2 years between Kyle, Brandi and Camille.

 

I also disagree, had Kyle ignored Brandi or at the least not reacted to her, it would have been better for Kyle. That is what Brandi is looking for, a reaction. As soon as Brandi gets another HW to react emotionally to her, she wins.

[zoeysmom]

Kyle was wrong to confront Brandi at her party. Her apology started off as sincere and went to insincere rapidly, IMO, she was hoping that Brandi would apologize as well and then they could move on. That did not happen, Brandi feels that what she did was right, in her pickled brain, she did no wrong.....according to her, she never does anything wrong, everyone makes her do/say the things she does. All 3 HWs acted badly, all 3.

 

You may have a point here about Lisa R saying on camera the truth about Kim that Kyle can not risk saying. It worked last time even though it took a few years but eventually Kim did get some help. Maybe Kyle is hoping that Lisa R speaking the truth about Kim's continued drug use will once again force Kim into rehab. It is just as possible that Lisa R is doing this without permission or encouragement from Kyle just because she cares about seeing another human being killing themselves. She is as outspoken about Brandi's over consumption of alcohol as she is Kim's addictions.  I also think it is possible that production is encouraging her to call Kim and Brandi out instead of ignoring the elephants in the room. Whatever reason is the real reason Lisa R is calling them out, it is about time, IMO, it is overdue.

I agree Kyle let Kim and Brandi get to her and as much as they should all fear Brandi losing her temper, it is pretty well established Kyle wants to get to the bottom of things and then claim to move on.

 

Lisar has every right to call Kim and Brandi out on camera.  She does not have a close relationship with either of them, they have both been unapologetically rude and in the case of Kim scary and made Lisar very uncomfortable.  Kim and Brandi made Lisar and Eileen feel very uncomfortable in their own home and work environments.  Kim embarrassed and humiliated her sister and Brandi humiliated and attacked Kyle. It is not AWKWARD, like moronic Kim tried to pass off it was downright rude and intimidating.  Brandi had an opportunity at Lisar's jewelry party to apologize-she chose not to.   Brandi did chose to be the first to arrive and get camera time so there was an opportunity even in passing to apologize. Didn't Eileen call out the elephant in the room and Brandi instead of saying I don't know if she is sober she tried to pass it off as pressure or anxiety.   If I were any of these women each time filming got cut short because of Kim or Brandi I would be howling in the producers' ears about getting them off the set and finishing the shoot.

 

I am waiting for the rest of the episode to see if Kim will admit to using in front of Eileen, Yolanda or the Lisas.  Otherwise it is Kyle being the bad guy talking about her relapsing sister and Kim's equalizer, Brandi.  I do think Kyle, more so than the rest, realizes how low Brandi and by association Kim, will go to create humiliation in the other women. Kyle fears continuing confrontation or mention by Lisar or Eileen is a recipe for a full on assault by Kim and Kim can be merciless and of course then forget after she does it. 

 

I don't think Kyle wants anyone talking about her sister's sobriety just for chit chat.  Kyle gets beat up by Brandi because in her talking heads she is answering questions Season 3 about questions about Kim's sobriety when she is stumbling around under the influence.  I do think Brandi will have to address her abuse of alcohol but it will be very unfair because she is single and has children.

[LotusFlower]

I have reservations about "calling Kim out" on camera. I guess I just don't see it as helpful, or coming from a good place.

This is why Lisa R. was right when she said the only issue is Kim's addiction. The addiction is the clusterfuck that everything is swarming around. It needs to be addressed head on, not hidden or enabled or supported. When Kim signed on for more seasons after rehab (and even before they started the show in the first place), Kyle should have said fine, I'm pulling for you, but I'm not going to cover for you if you fall. Kyle is documenting her life on this show as well as Kim, and she has the right to speak her truth. (They cast sisters for a reason, and the issues and gossip goes both ways). If that "truth" includes "calling Kim out," or expressing her concerns that her sister fell off the wagon, or is lying, or is embarrassing her, then so be it. That's the gamble Kim is taking when she takes the big pay check to appear on this show, and it's not fair to anyone, including and esp. Kyle, to ask them to lie for her.

Edited February 8, 2015 by LotusFlower

[b2H]

I had not thought of that. Great point. Kyle asked Brandi to leave, maybe that is all she could do. As security was Bravo and it wasn't at Kyle's home.

 

Then Security isn't security.  That's ridiculous.

[zoeysmom]

Kyle did not repeatedly grab Brandi and she did not dig her nails into her. Even Brandi accepted that she got scratched on Kyle's bracelet. Brandi did in fact grab both of Kyle's wrists over near the garage doors even though Kim has asked Brandi to step away from her and Kyle at that point. IMO, Kyle was looking for Brandi to apologize for physically getting between the sisters when she was not asked by Kim to do so. For some sick reason, Brandi is intent on getting between them and IMO, she is not doing it for Kim but for her own twisted reasons...she is looking for payback.

IU agree. Brandi posted the picture of the grab by Kyle on her right upper arm. Brandi's scratch occurred on her lower right arm because she turned around and grabbed Kyle to push her and that would have been when the scratch occurred.  Brandi swatted at Kyle let the pizza rip, and then grabbed her, pulled Kyle towards her and then pushed her.  So really Kyle's wounding Brandi was a defensive wound and had nothing to do with Kyle grabbing Brandi's upper arm.  Brandi sticking her arm up to block Kyle's forward movement is analogous to someone sticking their foot out and tripping someone.   The person with forward progress has no way to stop the contact so Brandi was in the wrong in that situation as well. 

 

I do not know how and when Brandi barfed up her versions of events to Kim but it really doesn't matter because after seeing the episode and the action by the garage all Kim could come up with is Kyle should have been worried about her not embarrassed by her.  It was clear there were two separate episodes where Brandi went back to disturb whatever progress Kim and Kyle were making privately.

[Umbelina]

Kyle did not repeatedly grab Brandi and she did not dig her nails into her. Even Brandi accepted that she got scratched on Kyle's bracelet. Brandi did in fact grab both of Kyle's wrists over near the garage doors even though Kim has asked Brandi to step away from her and Kyle at that point. IMO, Kyle was looking for Brandi to apologize for physically getting between the sisters when she was not asked by Kim to do so. For some sick reason, Brandi is intent on getting between them and IMO, she is not doing it for Kim but for her own twisted reasons...she is looking for payback.

 

I didn't say she dug her nails in, I said she dug her fingers in.  Looks like it to me...or, on closer look, it could be both. ;)

Edited February 8, 2015 by Umbelina

[WireWrap]

Then Security isn't security.  That's ridiculous.

Most events held outside a HWs home are filled with crew members posing as guests, be it at a restaurant, a bar, a hotel.....wherever they film, because other wise they must get signed releases in advance of filming. Filming with "friends" is different as they have the event scheduled in advance and get the friends signature well before filming starts. These events are not spur of the moment but are preplanned by production and the HWs before filming for the season starts. Security at an event/gathering is done by Bravo, not the establishment or the HW "hosting" the event.

[WireWrap]

 

I didn't say she dug her nails in, I said she dug her fingers in.  Looks like it to me...or, on closer look, it could be both. ;)

LOL, those man hands again, something both sister posses! Kyle grabbed Brandi's arm in an effort to get past her, not to harm her. Heck, she was not even looking at Brandi, she was concentrating on Kim. Also, Kyle's nails are very, very short and not likely to scratch anyone.

 

Just a side note, although Brandi is very thin she is not toned at all! Those are some flabby/weak arm muscles. LOL

[sistermagpie]

Just a side note, although Brandi is very thin she is not toned at all! Those are some flabby/weak arm muscles. LOL

 

 

Yeah, it looks more like just the squishing you get from gripping somebody's arm enough to hold it more than Kyle digging her fingers in to hurt Brandi. (Though if somebody was grabbing my arm it would probably make me angry even if they weren't digging their fingers in!)

[charming]

I understand Kyle's frustration. Brandi keeps screaming that Kyle wants Kim to fail. Kyle has NEVER been there for Kim. Kyle looks to Kim to deny that and stand up for her. Kim is mute. Even now, many months later, she will not defend Kyle. After Brandi has been blogging and giving interviews about how Kyle doesn't love her family, just the camera time, Kim refuses to say one thing nice about Kyle. She's a selfish and disgusting person playing both sides. She deserves Brandi as a "friend" at this point.

 

Good for Bravo airing the Kyle/Kim convo juxtaposed against the Brandi/Kim convo. It certainly shows why Kyle would be baffled about Kim's reactions when her dear friend Brandi starts hurling ugly accusations about her character.

[Umbelina]

Someone grabbed me like that, I think they'd be on their ass.  I am not a person who fights, ever, but I think my instincts would take over and they would be thrown off.

 

I don't care how Brandi got scratched, bracelet or fingernails, no one should put their hands on someone else.  Kim wanted to leave, let her leave.  Yes, Kim was baiting Kyle.  It was Kyle's choice to get physical, and she had the CHOICE of letting it go, and discussing it with Kim later.  Instead she got grabby.

 

It kind of reminded me of Kyle grabbing that woman she thought was getting too close to Mauricio at one of her white parties.

[FlyingEgret]

On a purely shallow note - I thought Brandi's hair looked great - it's about time her live-in hairstylist got it right...

[zoeysmom]

Someone grabbed me like that, I think they'd be on their ass.  I am not a person who fights, ever, but I think my instincts would take over and they would be thrown off.

 

I don't care how Brandi got scratched, bracelet or fingernails, no one should put their hands on someone else.  Kim wanted to leave, let her leave.  Yes, Kim was baiting Kyle.  It was Kyle's choice to get physical, and she had the CHOICE of letting it go, and discussing it with Kim later.  Instead she got grabby.

 

It kind of reminded me of Kyle grabbing that woman she thought was getting too close to Mauricio at one of her white parties.

Brandi did push her off.  So I guess you have that in common with Brandi.

 

Brandi should not have become Kim's bodyguard.  If Kim was well enough to toss out the conversation starter to Kyle she is well enough to be a big girl about it and say, "Kyle, I will call you tomorrow."  Instead Kim made it far, far more dramatic than it need be.  To me it was Kim being a prima donna and try to make her boorishly rude self far more important than she is. 

 

That woman out and out hit on Mauricio at her party, at her house. Time for her to leave.  I did think it definitely sent a message that Kyle does not appreciate someone hitting on her husband.  Next that year came the naked photographs sent to his phone.  I would have liked to see the expression on Kyle's face when he got those.

[imjagain]

Brandi did push her off. So I guess you have that in common with Brandi.

Brandi should not have become Kim's bodyguard. If Kim was well enough to toss out the conversation starter to Kyle she is well enough to be a big girl about it and say, "Kyle, I will call you tomorrow." Instead Kim made it far, far more dramatic than it need be. To me it was Kim being a prima donna and try to make her boorishly rude self far more important than she is.

That woman out and out hit on Mauricio at her party, at her house. Time for her to leave. I did think it definitely sent a message that Kyle does not appreciate someone hitting on her husband. Next that year came the naked photographs sent to his phone. I would have liked to see the expression on Kyle's face when he got those.

What? I had never heard of this lol.

[zoeysmom]

What? I had never heard of this lol.

During one of the Reunions Andy brought it up and Ken and Paul teased Mauricio.  All I can think of his Kyle's hair standing on end.

[imjagain]

During one of the Reunions Andy brought it up and Ken and Paul teased Mauricio. All I can think of his Kyle's hair standing on end.

Who sent him the pics?

Thanks, sorry I miss a lot stuff by reunion I'm pretty tired of all these women :)

[Found A Peanut]

I don't think it helps when Mommy Dearest pits sister against sister for her affection, time and approval their entire childhoods. Family can either bring out the best in a person or the worst in a person! And it can change minute to minute! LOL

Oh, absolutely. And I think Brandi has in common with the Richards sisters that they are all approaching apologies like an exchange of emotional hostages. If you give up your hostage and don't get back one in return, you lose. I thought that was exactly what was going on when Brandi "accepted" (not really) Kyle's (poorly done) apology. That's why Kyle could hardly finish saying she was sorry before laying out the reasons she should be getting an apology back - she needed Brandi to apologize or it wouldn't be fair, she'd be giving up power, an advantage, for nothing. And I thought Brandi looked pretty smug about getting without giving. Brandi knew what she was doing there - all three of these women were operating on that same screwed up wavelength. Look at how Kim never apologizes, she never gives up the advantage and thereby holds Kyle hostage. I just hope that in their personal relationships away from this mess, with their families, that all of them are in a better place.

[zoeysmom]

Who sent him the pics?

Thanks, sorry I miss a lot stuff by reunion I'm pretty tired of all these women :)

Maybe it was Brandi's audition tape.  Just kidding.

[WireWrap]

Someone grabbed me like that, I think they'd be on their ass.  I am not a person who fights, ever, but I think my instincts would take over and they would be thrown off.

 

I don't care how Brandi got scratched, bracelet or fingernails, no one should put their hands on someone else.  Kim wanted to leave, let her leave.  Yes, Kim was baiting Kyle.  It was Kyle's choice to get physical, and she had the CHOICE of letting it go, and discussing it with Kim later.  Instead she got grabby.

 

It kind of reminded me of Kyle grabbing that woman she thought was getting too close to Mauricio at one of her white parties.

Kyle was wrong to grab Brandi, as was Brandi from physical blocking Kyle on her own. Kim di not tell Brandi to keep Kyle away from her, Brandi took that on herself. All roads lead back to Kim manipulating both Kyle and Brandi yet no one seems to hold her accountable except for Lisa R. IMO, Kim was playing both Kyle and Brandi and loving every warped moment of it. She needs not only rehab but in patient psych care at this point. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, appealing about her at all IMO.

 

I would hope, Umbelina, that you would never physically put yourself between 2 sisters like Brandi did when there was no threat of a physical fight between them, you seem to level headed to put yourself in that position. There was absolutely no reason for Brandi to block Kyle from talking to/with Kim, none. She did it as a power move over Kyle, plain and simple, to dominate Kyle.

[Umbelina]

If I thought one sister was going to exploit another sister's problems for BRAVO?  I might.  But since I would never appear on a reality show, I seriously doubt that would ever happen.

 

You don't put your hands on someone unless:

you are prepared to fight them

you are fighting for your life, property, or safety

you are about to have sex or other various welcome hugging.

 

Period.

 

Oh, and Kyle doesn't get a pass because Brandi is taller.  Kyle is the one who took this to a physical level.

Edited February 8, 2015 by Umbelina

[jinjer]

You know I have been thinking about this whole, "Brandi wasn't invited to my party."

 

This is pretty rich coming from Kyle who was adamant in insisting that Lisa V knew that Faye was coming to Lisa's party a couple of season's ago. You can't call out production's secrets one season and then hide behind the fourth wall another.

 

First of all, by now I am convinced this was a Bravo party and not Kyle's.  From the theme, to the fact that only HWs and a few random people in the other room were there, to the fact that Kyle showed up late, to Eileen's sarcastic, "Welcome to YOUR party!" lol.  Brandi was coming hell or high water by production's design, and Kyle knew it was going to happen.  So her indignation at Brandi coming uninvited is rich given her defense of Faye two years ago.

 

I do think Kyle was surprised that Brandi showed up as Kim's escort.  I think Kyle was hoping that Brandi would show up without any ally.  

[motorcitymom65]

If I thought one sister was going to exploit another sister's problems for BRAVO?  I might.  But since I would never appear on a reality show, I seriously doubt that would ever happen.

 

You don't put your hands on someone unless:

you are prepared to fight them

you are fighting for your life, property, or safety

you are about to have sex or other various welcome hugging.

 

Period.

 

Oh, and Kyle doesn't get a pass because Brandi is taller.  Kyle is the one who took this to a physical level.

Is this written down somewhere? Sounds like just an opinion to me. Lots of stuff here wasn't black and white.

[Umbelina]

Is this written down somewhere? Sounds like just an opinion to me. Lots of stuff here wasn't black and white.

 

 

Do I need to put IMO on it? 

 

Yes, it's my opinion, and my experience, as is pretty much everything I post on message boards.

[jinjer]

Is this written down somewhere? Sounds like just an opinion to me. Lots of stuff here wasn't black and white.

Oh like the It's a Rule that you don't come between sisters? Lol.

[WireWrap]

If I thought one sister was going to exploit another sister's problems for BRAVO?  I might.  But since I would never appear on a reality show, I seriously doubt that would ever happen.

 

You don't put your hands on someone unless:

you are prepared to fight them

you are fighting for your life, property, or safety

you are about to have sex or other various welcome hugging.

 

Period.

 

Oh, and Kyle doesn't get a pass because Brandi is taller.  Kyle is the one who took this to a physical level.

I don't know, if my sister said something heated to me when I though everything was fine just seconds before, I too would try and talk to her. When I viewed the footage, I see Kyle grab Brandi's arm, an arm Brandi put there with the intent of physically blocking Kyle, as means to get past her, not to cause injury or to fight with her. She did not hit/slap Brandi, she just tried to hold her arm so that she could pass her. It was Brandi that then escalated it by spinning Kyle and physically pushing her back down the step. I do think Kyle was terrified about Kim's condition and that it escalated everything Kyle did.

You know I have been thinking about this whole, "Brandi wasn't invited to my party."

 

This is pretty rich coming from Kyle who was adamant in insisting that Lisa V knew that Faye was coming to Lisa's party a couple of season's ago. You can't call out production's secrets one season and then hide behind the fourth wall another.

 

First of all, by now I am convinced this was a Bravo party and not Kyle's.  From the theme, to the fact that only HWs and a few random people in the other room were there, to the fact that Kyle showed up late, to Eileen's sarcastic, "Welcome to YOUR party!" lol.  Brandi was coming hell or high water by production's design, and Kyle knew it was going to happen.  So her indignation at Brandi coming uninvited is rich given her defense of Faye two years ago.

 

I do think Kyle was surprised that Brandi showed up as Kim's escort.  I think Kyle was hoping that Brandi would show up without any ally.  

I also feel that the mixer was a producer party that they assigned Kyle to host, like the wine tasting. Most of the events held outside a HW's home are producer setups, not the HWs. The exceptions are family vacations like the Umanski's we saw this season even though they invited Yolanda. I am sure Bravo helped pay for that and that is why Kyle/Mauricio extended the invite. LOL

[Umbelina]

See, if my sister had addiction issues, and was acting strange while we were being filmed, I would want her out of there ASAP.  I'd probably grab a cab myself and go check on her, WITHOUT announcing any of my concerns to the group.  I'd make up something (hopefully something better than I left the stove on, I'd probably pretend I got a text from a friend and needed to go) and go check on her privately.  Since Brandi wasn't going to accompany her, I'd probably be glad Brandi was putting her in the car to go home. 

 

This is where I think Brandi may have a small point about editing.  I remember Kim looking to Brandi for help, and Brandi telling her something like "don't worry about it, I've got your back."  It seemed to me that Kim was requesting assistance from Brandi, we don't know what she may have said because of the cuts.  Kim takes her purse and begins to leave with Brandi following her, to put her in the car to go home, as Kim said she wanted to go home, not to accompany her.

 

If my sister then threw a snarky comment at me, "Thanks a LOT, Umbelina!"  I'd chalk it up to her condition, and ignore it, since I would be out of there soon to check on her AWAY from the cameras, with no one knowing. 

 

I think Kim may have made that comment after realizing Kyle was discussing the drive over with Lipsa, and anyone else that would listen, or Lipsa was sharing it with others in while Kyle listened.

[zoeysmom]

If I thought one sister was going to exploit another sister's problems for BRAVO?  I might.  But since I would never appear on a reality show, I seriously doubt that would ever happen.

 

You don't put your hands on someone unless:

you are prepared to fight them

you are fighting for your life, property, or safety

you are about to have sex or other various welcome hugging.

 

Period.

 

Oh, and Kyle doesn't get a pass because Brandi is taller.  Kyle is the one who took this to a physical level.

These women walk up to each other and grab the other's boobs.  Showing up or getting drunk and stoned while filming  is not being exploited it is more like the one who shows up that way is exploiting their co stars in hopes of extra camera time.

 

Discretion being better part of valor  is to stop your action and simply let it go.  What was to be gained from Brandi trying to keep Kyle from Kim (who knows why) Kim was not in any physical danger from her sister.  It was Brandi throwing up the block, so Brandi went there first.  So there was no reason for Brandi, to fight Kyle for her life property, safety or in the defense of another.  When the matter spilled out into the driveway the sisters were handling it until Brandi kept going in and making a problem and became physically aggressive with Kyle for no reason, and then tried to start a fight with her as she walked away.  Then it was Kim having to get in front of Brandi.

 

None of the physical touching rose to the level of felonious assault or anyone being in fear of their life or safety.  There were no slaps, hair pulling, strangling or punches or kicks. 

[Umbelina]

Why not let just Kim go? 

 

Brandi wasn't going with her, and she made that clear.  Kim was going home because she "wasn't feeling well."

 

If Kyle was so worried about Kim, she could have easily followed, without telling anyone, or continuing the gossip about her sister.  Instead, Kyle chose to make a scene, grab Brandi, and make Kim be on camera *when obviously, it would have been better for Kim to get OFF camera, as she was trying to do.  If she really needed to know what Kim meant by "thanks a LOT, Kim!" she could have asked her privately at home.

[WireWrap]

See, if my sister had addiction issues, and was acting strange while we were being filmed, I would want her out of there ASAP.  I'd probably grab a cab myself and go check on her, WITHOUT announcing any of my concerns to the group.  I'd make up something (hopefully something better than I left the stove on, I'd probably pretend I got a text from a friend and needed to go) and go check on her privately.  Since Brandi wasn't going to accompany her, I'd probably be glad Brandi was putting her in the car to go home. 

 

This is where I think Brandi may have a small point about editing.  I remember Kim looking to Brandi for help, and Brandi telling her something like "don't worry about it, I've got your back."  It seemed to me that Kim was requesting assistance from Brandi, we don't know what she may have said because of the cuts.  Kim takes her purse and begins to leave with Brandi following her, to put her in the car to go home, as Kim said she wanted to go home, not to accompany her.

 

If my sister then threw a snarky comment at me, "Thanks a LOT, Umbelina!"  I'd chalk it up to her condition, and ignore it, since I would be out of there soon to check on her AWAY from the cameras, with no one knowing. 

 

I think Kim may have made that comment after realizing Kyle was discussing the drive over with Lipsa, and anyone else that would listen, or Lipsa was sharing it with others in while Kyle listened.

When Kim walked back into the kitchen to say good bye, she overheard Kyle say she was embarrassed. Kyle was talking about not understanding how to play poker but Kim assumed she was talking about her to the other women. She then does the nasty "Thanks" to Kyle who in turn looks puzzled. Kim walks away and says something to Brandi along the lines, "I can't believe Kyle just said that". That is when Brandi tells Kim "not to worry, I got your back", even though she had NO IDEA what Kim was talking about. 

 

Kyle comes out of the kitchen asking Kim what she did wrong and Kim just keeps walking away. Kyle had no idea that Brandi was not planning to ride home with Kim, at no point does Brandi state this. I got the impression that she was planning to go home/ride with Kim. Brandi did not even give Kyle the chance to offer taking Kim home herself, she just refused to allow Kyle anywhere near Kim.

 

Kim did not accuse Lisa R of saying anything until they were in front of the garage doors outside, after Brandi grabbed both of Kyle's wrists, which she did after being told by Kim several times to step away and allow her and Kyle to talk.

[LotusFlower]

If my sister then threw a snarky comment at me, "Thanks a LOT, Umbelina!" I'd chalk it up to her condition, and ignore it, since I would be out of there soon to check on her AWAY from the cameras, with no one knowing.

This is emotional abuse and manipulation on the part of the sister. Not only should the sister (you, Kyke) learn how to not take this kind of abuse, you should also learn how to not run after her and follow-up this manipulation. And the worst part of this scenerio is the "keep it hidden...away from cameras...no one should know" aspect. Secrets are toxic. Secrets can kill. Look where it's gotten Kim. And Kyle's the worse for wear as well for having to participate in the cover up.

[WireWrap]

Why not let just Kim go? 

 

Brandi wasn't going with her, and she made that clear.  Kim was going home because she "wasn't feeling well."

 

If Kyle was so worried about Kim, she could have easily followed, without telling anyone, or continuing the gossip about her sister.  Instead, Kyle chose to make a scene, grab Brandi, and make Kim be on camera *when obviously, it would have been better for Kim to get OFF camera, as she was trying to do.  If she really needed to know what Kim meant by "thanks a LOT, Kim!" she could have asked her privately at home.

But Kyle did not get that chance, Brandi stopped her at every turn. Kyle was not talking about Kim or Brandi in the kitchen, she was talking about being embarrassed at not understanding how to play poker. It had nothing to do with Kim at all!

 

 Brandi never told anyone she was not leaving with Kim, no one. For all intent and purposes, it looked like she was going home with Kim.

 

You really do not think Kyle had reason to be worried about Kim?  You really do not think that after the nasty "thank you" she realized Kim was in worse condition than she first thought, because I do and I do not even like Kyle. LOL

[Umbelina]

Keeping it away from Bravo cameras is not the same as "keeping it secret."  It's dealing with it privately, with friends, family, doctors, not making sure your sister looks like an ass for people who watch Bravo.

 

I tried to rewatch the beginning of the fight, but BRAVO.com seriously sucks.  I wanted to count how many times Kyle grabs Brandi, and now I'd like to see if Brandi only said she was putting Kim in the car to the camera, or if she said it to Kyle too.  I thought she did.  She definitely didn't have her purse though, while Kim had hers as she was leaving.  It's possible she didn't bring one.

 

I'm not excusing either Kim or Brandi here, I simply believe that Kyle is equally at fault, and her behavior was just as bad.  As I've said before, they were all being assholes.

 

ETA

You really do not think Kyle had reason to be worried about Kim?  You really do not think that after the nasty "thank you" she realized Kim was in worse condition than she first thought, because I do and I do not even like Kyle. LOL

 

I specifically said she should have gone to check on Kim PRIVATELY, without making it a scene for a television show.  Of course she had a right to be worried, and I never implied she didn't.  I feel that she wanted it on camera, and wanted to look like "the good, concerned, worried sister of the bad, problem sister."

Edited February 8, 2015 by Umbelina

[WireWrap]

Keeping it away from Bravo cameras is not the same as "keeping it secret."  It's dealing with it privately, with friends, family, doctors, not making sure your sister looks like an ass for people who watch Bravo.

 

I tried to rewatch the beginning of the fight, but BRAVO.com seriously sucks.  I wanted to count how many times Kyle grabs Brandi, and now I'd like to see if Brandi only said she was putting Kim in the car to the camera, or if she said it to Kyle too.  I thought she did.  She definitely didn't have her purse though, while Kim had hers as she was leaving.  It's possible she didn't bring one.

 

I'm not excusing either Kim or Brandi here, I simply believe that Kyle is equally at fault, and her behavior was just as bad.  As I've said before, they were all being assholes.

There is fault enough to go around by all 3, true, VERY true but IMO, just mine, Brandi and Kim lead in the "who's at fault category". They played Kyle for all she had and both knew they were doing it, both Brandi and Kim feed off of doing that, sober or high/drunk off their asses!  They are experts at doing it.

[FozzyBear]

I can actually buy that Kyle and Kim drank similar amounts on many, many occasions. Mostly because I don't think Kim actually drinks all that much more than the average aging party girl. Think of it this way. Kim and Kyle and whoever go out and everybody has 3ish glasses of wine. Kyle hasn't taken any drugs and ate breakfast, lunch, and dinner. So after her 3rd or 4th glass she's drunk, but not out of control. Drunk like she's extra silly, shouldn't drive home, and will probably have a hang over, but she's aware of what's going on, is aware of the fact that she's been drinking and should act accordingly, and will remember the night in the morning. Well Kim, had a little nose candy pre-party complete with a few downers to even out and hasn't eaten since 1978 so by the time she's had her 3rd glass of wine (heck maybe even the 2nd) she's a full blown psycho mess. Life is unfair like that.

Edited February 8, 2015 by FozzyBear