S05.E12: Drama Queens

[Umbelina]

I remember Kyle saying she was closer to her niece Paris than to Kathy, because they were closer in age. 

 

I have no idea if Kyle was "always there" for Kim's kids or not.  

[CaughtOnTape]

It's what thirteen year olds call BFF's, culminating in a real or imagined joint-suicide.

 

I love you.

 

This wins today.

[goofygirl]

Integrity? Character? KIM RICHARDS????

What in the world?  This is the same Kim Richards who can't REMEMBER what the heck DAY it is that she speaks with her sister.  The very same Kim Richards who told one person she was in the hospital 5 days, another person 8 days.  The  same Kim Richards who when questioned about the pain pill she took, told one person "the DOCTOR gave it to her" another person, "MONTY gave it to her" and come to find out (whether THIS is true who knows) that MONTY gave her a CANCER pain pill.

Liar, liar pants on fire Kim Richards wouldn't know either the meaning OR the behavior involved in Integrity OR character.  She's a full blown ADDICT and fairly narcissistic in my humble opinion.

[MatildaMoody]

While I definitely agree with you that Brandi will never be the last one standing with Kim, I don't necessarily agree that Kyle will always be there for her. Yes, they have a dysfunctional and somewhat co-dependent relationship, but I think Kyle will eventually get to her breaking point if things don't change. Why? Because it's long overdo, and because they've never had the "ride or die" type of sisterly bond or relationship.

Kyle may one day wise up and realize that she can't save Kim. But, their dynamic is familiar to both of them and they will always default back to that dynamic until they or Kyle gets help. My point was that with family (in most cases) no matter how close or not they are will always default back to whatever pattern is most familiar to them. That is why it is never a good idea to involve yourself as an outsider in that dynamic. The outsider has no power whatsoever to change the way the siblings are going to react to each other. Kim is in desperate need of someone who will enable her behavior, so Brandi is convenient to her. Kyle seems to have a need to try to save Kim from herself even if its just for the sake of being the "good sister". 

 

Brandi and her 6 month friendship with Kim is never going to be able to compete with 40 years of history and dysfunctional family dynamics. She has to know that this is going to blow up in her face no matter how she spins it for the audience. Maybe she is hoping for it to blow up in her face so that she can be the victim of both Kyle and Kim by the time the reunion wraps. Kim and Kyle have a definite pattern that they will continue to repeat until one of them breaks the cycle. 

[Satchels of gold]

Ive got to stop complaining about my sister. Her biggest crime is when my family is together being our big ole ball of dysfunction she will excuse herself and go read the big book ( the AA bible ) in plain view while the rest of us just sit there like gee was it something I said? In retrospect, I guess that's not so bad.

[runforcover]

One can only hope that such a conversation has taken place and that we've just never seen it but I wouldn't be surprised to find out that it hasn't.  It would be a big step forward for Kim if she were able to spit it out and really mean it and is probably something that Kyle longs to hear for the same reason.  I'd like to think that Bravo would share it with us if it had happened, given all the anxiety they put US through with this nonsense!, but impossible to tell. 

 

The other impression I've had is that Kim rarely seems to initiate the post-fighting convos.  On camera, it always looks like Kyle is the one to bring up the latest storm and try to make sense of it with Kim.  Another huge tell.  But, again, who knows?  One sees Kim saying whatever she's got to say once the other sister has gotten the ball rolling, quite often with an apology of her own.  This business of the shamed, anxiety-ridden, non-addicted person apologizing to the out and out user in their life as a way of getting some kind of reconciliation going is kind of typical, I suspect.  You can tell the addict is taking those first baby steps in recovery when this pattern gets reversed -- They initiate the dialogue.  They apologize ... (I should say we, really).  But you get the picture.  It becomes a proactive posture, a way of taking responsibility, instead of waiting and hiding and hoping the aggrieved just didn't notice how totally wasted one was the night before.  Or throwing the burden on the poor slob who completely lost it as a result of one's drunken shenanigans. 

 

I don't think I ever see that in Kim.  It's one the handful of reasons I find it hard to believe she's ever been sober for any length of time. 

 

Exactly, in lieu of any genuine apology, or responsibility, Kim lives in never-fully-articulated mid-apology.  She's at, like, level-ten shame, constantly.  It's no surprise that the only friends she can count are drunk.  Who else could stand all that amorphous and persistent self-loathing?  

 

The fundamental move, at least I have seen, with recovering addicts is that they abandon the whole apology structure and just fucking live.  I think this takes tremendous strength, yet any applause is a disservice to the process.  Tripping up is deeply unflattering and worsens with age, only because the feedback loops compound with time.  Kim strikes me as very, very broken.   But she also reminds me of how integral VANITY is to what is popularly read as a spiritual and existential leap.

[copacabana]

Matilda -- I agree with much of what you say.  And I do think that Brandi, who is smarter than either of the Richards, is working it so that both sisters blow and she can let loose with all the nuts she's gathered in her squirrelly pouch.  Brandi's ignorant and yucky but she's canny--the other two, not so much on the canny unless they're just doing as they're told. 

 

A sixth-month friendship can't really compete with a decades-long sibling thing in terms of affection,history, bonds, memories, etc etc but it is more than long enough to throw a grenade into the middle of it if one has been mining for gold.  So Brandi can't really replace Kyle in the short run but she can certainly inflict real casualties. That's the rub.  Not really caring and doing harm tend to go hand in hand and these two sisters are something out of Shakespeare in how messed up and mutually wounding they can be on any given day.  My theory is:  too much hair.  Haircuts for both of them.  As in down to the nub. 

[LotusFlower]

I am not sure what a ride or die relationship is. 

Meaning someone who's always there for you and defending you, no matter what. A "you hurt her, you hurt me" kind of attitude. I'm not saying it's a good thing - in fact, blind loyalty is usually a disservice to the friend/sister/whomever.

I do believe Kyle will always be there for her nieces and nephews. But I think she's close to her breaking point with Kim. It certainly wouldn't be the first relationship to fall victim to reality show crimes and misdemeanors.

[Umbelina]

We don't really know if Kim did real apologies.  I would think merely by filming that kind of thing, it would immediately be "NON-real."  That kind of thing would, and should, be handled off camera.

 

Kyle and Kim have issues going back decades.  I really don't think they will ever be healed.  Neither is very bright, both have victim mentalities and anger issues.  I think it would take real reflection on the way they were raised, and I don't think either sister wants to look very hard at that.

 

While I believe that Brandi has been there for Kim during those late night terrors or slips, she's not very bright either.  If she really believes Kim would, or SHOULD, choose her over Kyle, that's seriously stupid.  Now, if she thinks Kim should cut Kyle out of her life?  Who knows, that may be one way to finally sober up.  I've known other addicts who have had to do that, turn their back on toxic relationships in order to really get clean. 

 

One of the recappers talked about Kim possibly using Brandi to say all the things to Kyle she can't.  I think there is truth in that.  Kim is very manipulative (as is Kyle frankly, learned at mommy's knee?)  If that is true, and when/if Brandi finally gets that (again, she's not very bright) it should be glorious for us, because I feel like Kim's spilled a LOT of inside-Kyle/family dirt, and we all know Brandi will not hesitate to share that, should she get angry enough.

[zoeysmom]

Seriously.  Talk about fan labour.  I should sooooo be doing something else. Literally, writing.  And, writing about television, no-less. Time-wasting aside, you guys are saving my ass. Copa, your posts are a pleasure to read :)  

 

It's what thirteen year olds call BFF's, culminating in a real or imagined joint-suicide.

 

Brandi is defending some tired shit.

Now it makes sense.  I will forever think of that when I see Brandi referring to her BFFs and ride or die statements. 

[copacabana]

The real punishment for Kim will come when her own children have children, experience parenthood for themselves, and in an effort to not screw up their kids, come smack dab front and center full head on HELLO with their relationships with both their parents.  As in Kim and whoever their Kim-daddies happen to be.  That's what happened with me and happens with other countless millions not because we're special but just cuz.  I thought I'd come out denial before I gave birth at 39.  I didn't KNOW what coming out of denial meant at all in any real way beyond psycho-babble and basic survival until I had my own child.  And I didn't pursue knowing anything or making stuff better because I was strong and noble and in love with my life (Kim trademark).  Just the way it is if you're hardwired to be a parent yourself and don't want to keep passing it on.  If Kim survives all this and has even a fraction of brain function left, it will happen at her children's hands if it isn't happening already.  And that will take her straight back to HER mom and pop and whatever happened there.  Kyle will be a side item at that point if Kim ever makes it to that stage.

 

The irony is that I don't think that Kim has been able to do much for herself -- I think her mother used her, pimped her out, got her hooked on BS and told her to sell herself over and over again -- but old crazy Kim for whatever reason seems to have produced children who may have a clue -- even if they're not entirely well, all of them -- and they will probably both stick it to her big time and help her see.  If she makes it in terms of additional years. 

 

Big Kathy also did a real disservice to Kyle IF she really told her it was her job to look after Kim because, from Kyle's lips, we hear that "look after" in that fucked up household probably meant not just look after in the usual sisterly way but mop up, keep secrets, shut your trap and generally keep on taking care of Norma Desmond til the day she dies.  

 

I wonder if Kyle bringing Kim on to this show -- and I do believe than Kyle did just that -- had less to do with taking care of Kim in terms of getting her a paycheck, giving her a reason and opportunity to get back in the bz -- and more to do with Kyle wanting to liberate herself from this tacky ass low rent and completely dysfunctional promise made to her mother about a sister that her own mother basically destroyed. 

Edited February 6, 2015 by copacabana

[zoeysmom]

I remember Kyle saying she was closer to her niece Paris than to Kathy, because they were closer in age. 

 

I have no idea if Kyle was "always there" for Kim's kids or not.  

No she didn't.  She said she was close to Paris and she was like a baby doll.  Geez you might not think much of Kyle's intelligence but I am pretty sure she knows Kathy is 10 years older and Paris is 12 years younger than she is. 

 

Well Kim's kids have said it and if the endless pictures over the years of Kim's kids with Kyle on vacation in Aspen, at her house.  I think it is admirable that in spite of the differences between the sisters the cousins are always welcome in their aunts' lives.

[Umbelina]

Kyle definitely said that.  I don't remember if it was on the show or in a blog, or in an interview, or all three, but I know she said it.  I remember thinking it was because Paris was more famous, and Kyle wants to think of herself as young and hip.  I know their ages.

 

Are you close to your nieces, Paris and Nicki? As well as your other family?

Richards: Yes, I am, and I have always been. I was a little girl when they were born, so it's more like a sister relationship. They are the little sisters I never had. It's a lot of fun, we are all very close.

 

This one just popped up when I did a quick google.  She's said other things like it, including about partying with Paris, since they are "more like sisters."  I don't want to keep looking for the other quotes, but I know they are out there.  ;)

Edited February 6, 2015 by Umbelina

[runforcover]

The real punishment for Kim will come when her own children have children, experience parenthood for themselves, and in an effort to not screw up their kids, come smack dab front and center full head on HELLO with their relationships with both their parents.  As in Kim and whomever their Kim-daddies happen to be.  That's what happened with me and happens with other countless millions not because we're special but just cuz.  I thought I'd come out denial before I gave birth at 39.  I didn't KNOW what coming out of denial meant at all in any real way beyond psycho-babble and basic survival until I had my own child.  And I didn't pursue knowing anything or making stuff better because I was strong and noble and in love with my life (Kim trademark).  Just the way it is if you're hardwired to be a parent yourself and don't want to keep passing it on.  If Kim survives all this and has even a fraction of brain function left, it will happen at her children's hands if it isn't happening already.  And that will take her straight back to HER mom and pop and whatever happened there.  Kyle will be a side item at that point if Kim ever makes it to that stage.

 

 

 

 

Interesting.  I figure we will be trying in next year or so.  Maybe.  

 

In any case, thoughts of having kids with my DNA has made me nervous but hyper-aware to some shit I would ordinarily let slide.

While insisting there be a continent between myself and my mother, I am catching all kinds of crazy I don't want any kid of mine to have to endure, pick up or perpetually put down.  

 

I will tell you this.  No daughter of mine will be hanging out with my mother's eating disorder. Fuck that shit.

[Mozelle]

I remember Kyle saying she was closer to her niece Paris than to Kathy, because they were closer in age. 

 

I have no idea if Kyle was "always there" for Kim's kids or not.  

 

I believe that they were. I don't think that Whitney would have gone to Kyle to talk to Kim about letting Whitney move out of state a few years back if Whitney didn't see her aunt as a person who's been there for her and her siblings on a consistent basis. 

[Umbelina]

I got the idea that Kim's kids (except maybe the last one?) spent a lot of time living with their dads.  Maybe split custody?  Anyone know?

[grittypearl]

Why all the Kim hate?

 

Kim is my favorite one of the real housewives. Yes, she fucked up in the previous episode. So what. 

 

At the party she was 100% in the right to tell Kyle that she was disappointed in her. Kyle was just trying to use Kim to drum up drama for herself, as usual. Kim doesn't particiate in the fake fights. When she does fight they are real and they are heart breaking to watch. She brings some much needed actual reality to this show. She is the only one on this show who is actually a respectable human being. Yes, she is an addict, get over it. When she is sober she has more character and integrity then all of these other women put together.

 

Kyle was just mad because Kim has a friend. That women needs counseling. How she tries to constantly try to get between Kim and the other women, and then come in a "defend her sister" is not healthy. She wants to isolate Kim, when Kim is in a place where she is in desperate need of a community. She is fucking with her sister's sobriety for a little bit more camera time and it is gross. 

 

Kyle should have just been an adult and ignored Brandi. She just wanted attention and used her sister to get it. She can't stand that Kim has her own life right now so is trying to take her down.

Kim is doing an absolute bang-up job all her own fucking up her sobriety. It seems to take little to nothing for Kim to not only fall off the wagon, which I could give her some slack because addiction is an insidious disease, so it's often the matter of not if but when as far as relapsing; but she is the quintessence of being blameshifter extraordinaire.

 

And as far as her being an addict and "getting over it", my heart aches for her children. As well adjusted and stable as they seem, I am sure they have struggled/come to grips mountain high when it comes to "getting over it." And I certainly don't blame them if they haven't.

Edited February 6, 2015 by grittypearl

[motorcitymom65]

 

One of the recappers talked about Kim possibly using Brandi to say all the things to Kyle she can't.  I think there is truth in that.  Kim is very manipulative (as is Kyle frankly, learned at mommy's knee?)  If that is true, and when/if Brandi finally gets that (again, she's not very bright) it should be glorious for us, because I feel like Kim's spilled a LOT of inside-Kyle/family dirt, and we all know Brandi will not hesitate to share that, should she get angry enough.

Oh, I think that could happen easily. As the matter of fact, I am of the opinion that this is one of the real reasons Brandi got close to Kim. So that she could get some dirt, primarily on Kyle. Late night drunken phone calls often involve lots of secret-telling.

 

What I guess I don't get is what would be "glorious for us" in this reveal. To me it would be beyond dreadful should Brandi go there. It will be dreadful for Kyle and her family, or anyone that loves her, because lord only knows what Brandi will say. How could that be good? One thing I know for sure, it won't be good for Brandi. Because she is dumber than hair, she completely miscalculated this entire deal. She has been out there for months talking about how she was going to show the world who Kyle really was. She said on a couple of occasions that there was no way folks would not side with her. Since a good deal of folks hate Kyle, I could see her imaging this, but per usual she didn't understand that lots of people won't tolerate someone doing this to someone else, regardless of how they feel about that person. Even folks who dislike Kyle intensely are on her side in this, something that must be stunning to Brandi. Heck, go on the Vulture blog for confirmation. This has always been the biggest Kyle hate fest on the internet. No one over there likes Kyle. Not any of  the people that have written the recaps, and not 99% of the commentators. They still don't like her, but they are rooting for her in this situation like I cannot believe. 

[copacabana]

Interesting.  I figure we will be trying in next year or so.  Maybe.  

 

In any case, thoughts of having kids with my DNA has made me nervous but hyper-aware to some shit I would ordinarily let slide.

While insisting there be a continent between myself and my mother, I am catching all kinds of crazy I don't want any kid of mine to have to endure, pick up or perpetually put down.  

 

I will tell you this.  No daughter of mine will be hanging out with my mother's eating disorder. Fuck that shit.

 

Children are tough little monkeys and we know so much more than we did decades ago about all kinds of things.  If there is ever an issue, there's more often than not a way these days.  I think our parents and grandparents etc felt that way too when they looked to the past--like they had it going on and it was worth a shot. Eating disorders are in so many ways, I think, the worst, the most dangerous and the most damaging.  One can put down the bottle, not do the blow, struggle to not gamble and not screw strangers in alleyways.  Not eating is a whole other level of danger and agony.  That's why I'm glad the Hadid women all look healthy even though we get the fruit and nut talk all the time. I think those folks are eating and eating well off camera.

 

Not good to say but if it's true that there is a bipolar in the Richards sisters mix -- and I don't want to get into trouble here -- my money's on that kid getting through to her.  Bipolars are smart people and these days can get their stuff together.  I know.  I hope her children recognize that as screwed up as she is -- and as annoying as all her froggy love declarations are -- she does love them, probably was able to convey that love in her Kim way, and that she lives long enough to see them come to her and say, hey, let's have a chat. 

 

And I also hope that if some of this Kim crap goes too far, Bravo contract or no Bravo contract, her children intervene and take NBC central to task for the total exploitation of their poor, sick mother.  So, yeah, go Kyle, but, honestly, screw Kyle too.  For my money, the network has already gone too far. 

Edited February 6, 2015 by copacabana

[Granimal]

Andy Cohen is not the only gay person in the world, nor the only gay person watching RH. AC was merely the messenger for comments that a lot of viewers had regarding the "my gays" thing.  I'm happy that AC brought up the "my gays" thing because it got the message out there and got a nice response from the HWs. If AC has used un-PC language in the past, then hopefully someone will address that with him. I don't think that all gay men should be held accountable for what AC says, so the fact that Andy Cohen has said offensive things in the past doesn't make the RH saying offensive things any better or okay, IMO. At the end of the say (ha) its not a huge problem, but its a great example of someone taking responsibility for something that they did that unintentionally offended someone and I think that's great. I wish more of the HW issues would get resolved like this, but then there would be no show!

 

I read a great comment made at another site (linked to in this thread) about the "Tops & Bottoms" mixer and it said, "I guess that lesbians aren't the status symbol that gay men are in BH."

[Satchels of gold]

Kim is doing an absolute bang-up job all her own fucking up her sobriety. It seems to take little to nothing for Kim to not only fall off the wagon, which I could give her some slack because addiction is an insidious disease, so it's often the matter of not if but when as far as relapsing; but she is the quintessence of being blameshifter extraordinaire.

 

And as far as her being an addict and "getting over it", my heart aches for her children. As well adjusted and stable as they seem, I am sure they have struggled/come to grips mountain high when it comes to "getting over it." And I certainly don't blame them if they haven't.

In the words of the immortal Kim "don't! (Pause) fucking feel sorry for me!"

No worries Kim we don't.

[Umbelina]

Oh, I think that could happen easily. As the matter of fact, I am of the opinion that this is one of the real reasons Brandi got close to Kim. So that she could get some dirt, primarily on Kyle. Late night drunken phone calls often involve lots of secret-telling.

 

What I guess I don't get is what would be "glorious for us" in this reveal. To me it would be beyond dreadful should Brandi go there. It will be dreadful for Kyle and her family, or anyone that loves her, because lord only knows what Brandi will say. How could that be good? One thing I know for sure, it won't be good for Brandi. Because she is dumber than hair, she completely miscalculated this entire deal. She has been out there for months talking about how she was going to show the world who Kyle really was. She said on a couple of occasions that there was no way folks would not side with her. Since a good deal of folks hate Kyle, I could see her imaging this, but per usual she didn't understand that lots of people won't tolerate someone doing this to someone else, regardless of how they feel about that person. Even folks who dislike Kyle intensely are on her side in this, something that must be stunning to Brandi. Heck, go on the Vulture blog for confirmation. This has always been the biggest Kyle hate fest on the internet. No one over there likes Kyle. Not any of  the people that have written the recaps, and not 99% of the commentators. They still don't like her, but they are rooting for her in this situation like I cannot believe. 

Because I don't care about ANY of these women?

 

Because gossip is fun, especially about the inner workings of Big Kathy's spawn? 

 

Not all blogs are pro Kyle.  It's very easy to dislike them all fairly equally.  Kyle is an asshole.  Brandi is an asshole.  Kim is an asshole.  (etc.)  It's never been an either/or for me, especially since between them I doubt they could break 100 on an IQ test.

 

They are silly women, making silly decisions, filming on a silly show.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Umbelina

[Lakewood27]

I think Kenya stole Brandi's phone and tweeted that  . . .

I want to "like" this a thousand more times!!!

[motorcitymom65]

Because I don't care about ANY of these women?

 

Because gossip is fun, especially about the inner workings of Big Kathy's spawn? 

 

Not all blogs are pro Kyle.  It's very easy to dislike them all fairly equally.  Kyle is an asshole.  Brandi is an asshole.  Kim is an asshole.  (etc.)  It's never been an either/or for me, especially since between them I doubt they could break 100 on an IQ test.

 

They are silly women, making silly decisions, filming on a silly show.

I agree that not all blogs are pro Kyle, but the tide has most certainly changed. This girl was never defended anywhere by the vast majority of viewers since the S1 reveal.  Brandi has just got to be all kinds of stunned by this turn of events.

 

I guess there is just a line for me. I don't like Brandi, but I don't want for any of these ladies to reveal big secrets that might hurt her boys, if the purpose of doing so is just to lash out and hurt someone. There is always going to be collateral damage because these woman have decided to open themselves up for such scrutiny, and for the most part behave like asshats most of the time. If they decide to do things that will bring ridicule down on to their kids, it makes me dislike them all the more because i just don't understand why they would go that far, but it is their decision. On the other hand if someone gleefully does something to hurt a person's marriage or family, I just don't find anything funny or entertaining about that. 

Edited February 6, 2015 by motorcitymom65

[copacabana]

I'm off the go see the movie "Begin Again" for the 100th time.  See it, sisters and brothers, if you haven't already. SO good and fun and uplifting with a jagged little edge -- The PERFECT antidote to RHs of anything. 

 

Andy Cohen and his smelling salts crap about my gays is beyond my powers of comprehension.  My gays, a million years ago, was meant to signify that gay men had the support of celebrity women in this country and that our combined purchasing power could change things.  It did. I don't much like it either and thought it was manipulative from the get go but just because it's old and musty doesn't mean it didn't serve its purpose.  For Andy to pretend otherwise is just Andy being the asshole he is.  He thinks he's Warhol -- he's just Kelly Ripa's friend.  

 

And, TOTAL WORD, to everyone pointing out that we never see the gay sisters, our lesbians, mentioned in any of this.  We will always have Rosie but that's about it. 

 

Fuck Andy Cohen.  And what Andy Cohen thinks or feels.  I'd like to see him in court for real for whatever reason at any time. 

[runforcover]

Children are tough little monkeys and we know so much more than we did decades ago about all kinds of things.  If there is ever an issue, there's more often than not a way these days.  I think our parents and grandparents etc felt that way too when they looked to the past--like they had it going on and it was worth a shot. Eating disorders are in so many ways, I think, the worst, the most dangerous and the most damaging.  One can put down the bottle, not do the blow, struggle to not gamble and not screw strangers in alleyways.  Not eating is a whole other level of danger and agony.  That's why I'm glad the Hadid women all look healthy even though we get the fruit and nut talk all the time. I think those folks are eating and eating well off camera.

 

Not good to say but if it's true that there is a bipolar in the Richards sisters mix -- and I don't want to get into trouble here -- my money's on that kid getting through to her.  Bipolars are smart people and these days can get their stuff together.  I know.  I hope her children recognize that as screwed up as she is -- and as annoying as all her froggy love declarations are -- she does love them, probably was able to convey that love in her Kim way, and that she lives long enough to see them come to her and say, hey, let's have a chat. 

 

And I also hope that if some of this Kim crap goes too far, Bravo contract or no Bravo contract, her children intervene and take NBC central to task for the total exploitation of their poor, sick mother.  So, yeah, go Kyle, but, honestly, screw Kyle too.  For my money, the network has already gone too far. 

Oh, dude, I didn't know about the bipolar kid.  Where is that?  Yeah, BP will, for the most part, wake parents the fuck up - this I actually know :)  It requires everybody get their nonsense in line because, at least my generation of diagnosis, patients are usually not immediately compliant.  Ok, I don't actually know that but I've heard a lot of docs identify non-compliance as a soft sign.

 

I hope there is no BP kid because I don't see anybody's real needs waking Kim up.  I hope I'm wrong.  I really do.  Even this whole MOnty thing feels like bullshit.  ANother opportunity to ride the fake-emotional high of someone else's impending death.  It's pretty low.  Well, addiction is, at the very least.  The thing is that these women all have some fucked up relationship to drama.  They must.  If I do then SO DO THEY!  This makes an recovery from addiction uniquely complex.  If you use drugs to escape feelings, it's getting twisted when you use feelings to escape.

 

I do not see this playing out in any sustainable way on a television show. 

 

I find Yolanda intolerable.  I can't stand the whole machine.  With the transparent fridge, Sir Foster, the six almonds, the weird laws against women out-of-control that actually generate chaotic daughters.

 

As for Bravo,  they don't care.  It's not even a deliberate cynicism.  It's not that engaged.  I figure it's like sleep-walking and only waking up for eye-lifts, when someone's literally tugging. 

[copacabana]

Oh, dude, I didn't know about the bipolar kid.  Where is that?  Yeah, BP will, for the most part, wake parents the fuck up - this I actually know :)  It requires everybody get their nonsense in line because, at least my generation of diagnosis, patients are usually not immediately compliant.  Ok, I don't actually know that but I've heard a lot of docs identify non-compliance as a soft sign.

 

I hope there is no BP kid because I don't see anybody's real needs waking Kim up.  I hope I'm wrong.  I really do.  Even this whole MOnty thing feels like bullshit.  ANother opportunity to ride the fake-emotional high of someone else's impending death.  It's pretty low.  Well, addiction is, at the very least.  The thing is that these women all have some fucked up relationship to drama.  They must.  If I do then SO DO THEY!  This makes an recovery from addiction uniquely complex.  If you use drugs to escape feelings, it's getting twisted when you use feelings to escape.

 

I do not see this playing out in any sustainable way on a television show. 

 

I find Yolanda intolerable.  I can't stand the whole machine.  With the transparent fridge, Sir Foster, the six almonds, the weird laws against women out-of-control that actually generate chaotic daughters.

 

As for Bravo,  they don't care.  It's not even a deliberate cynicism.  It's not that engaged.  I figure it's like sleep-walking and only waking up for eye-lifts, when someone's literally tugging. 

Shouldn't have brought up the BP at all.  Really really dumb of me.  One myself -- always feel I should win the most messed up audience member ever award.  Just rumors.  I hate myself in the morning always over this show and this message board  I  throw in Yolanda just to give myself some cover.  Am totally over invested in all of this.  If anyone remember The New Radicals, Gregg Alexander did the music for Begin Again.  To give myself additional cover, Lost Stars could be the theme song for RHBHs if they were to go arty-classy or something.  So,  ssssshhhhh, shouldn't have said it on the BP front but it is kind of true and it would be cool if someone anyone ever were to bring Kim to her senses. 

 

And Bravo will care and will have to care next time one of these wenches or Mr. wenches bites it on their time.  Because they use, destroy, and revel. 

[runforcover]

Copa, wait!

(shhh)

It's forgotten.  

 

OK, Yolanda sucks, DISCUSS!

[Umbelina]

Jeez, I'm watching the mini marathon right now, when they get together (film together) do these women EVER talk about anything other than Brandi or Kim?

 

Bravo needs to pay Brandi and Kim more, since apparently they are the only storyline worth discussing among the others.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Umbelina

[zoeysmom]

Kyle definitely said that.  I don't remember if it was on the show or in a blog, or in an interview, or all three, but I know she said it.  I remember thinking it was because Paris was more famous, and Kyle wants to think of herself as young and hip.  I know their ages.

 

This one just popped up when I did a quick google.  She's said other things like it, including about partying with Paris, since they are "more like sisters."  I don't want to keep looking for the other quotes, but I know they are out there.  ;)

This says nothing about her being closer to Paris than her own sister, Kathy because of their ages and that is what I was referencing.  It said Paris is the little sister she never had.  You distorted it by saying something entirely different.  If you are looking for Paris quotes on the first season KIM-that would be the drunk blonde one, said she with Paris and the reporters wanted to talk to her not Paris, because she was so well known.  When Kyle had Farrah, Paris was seven years old.  I guess it is possible, not probable, that a 14 year old Paris, living in NYC would be running around with Kyle and "partying" or was Kyle doing this partying with Paris while married to Mauricio?

[Umbelina]

Again, that was one link.  I'm not distorting it, I remember Kyle specifically saying that she was closer to Paris than Kathy because of their ages.  That quote was just the one I found doing a quick google search. 

[copacabana]

Copa, wait!

(shhh)

It's forgotten.  

 

OK, Yolanda sucks, DISCUSS!

 

Girl, let's get our Valley of the Dolls on!  And keep it simmering.  Love you. You are too funny.  Hermetically sealed was epic. 

 

Yolanda is sucking on some might fine food when we're not around and all I can say is You GO girl.  Wish You Were Here 

Edited February 6, 2015 by copacabana

[Higgins]

I suggest Kim's next contract contain a sobriety clause and she be subject to drug testing three times a week during filming.  Wild guess here is that in order for Kim to be paid for filming while she was detoxing, she had to have a valid doctor's excuse saying she was unable to film.  That may be one of the reasons Kim can't remember how long she was in the hospital the doc may have written her for nine days excused and her actual hospital stay was significant less.

 

Bravo may be skating on thin ice saying they won't retain Kim because of her drug/alcohol history.  It has bee my experience that attorneys do everything to lessen their client's accountability-the client being Bravo.  As cruel as it sounds I think the accountability is solely on Kim and it is sad that her inability to stay sober is such a large part of the last few episodes.

Andy admits he uses drugs so why would he do that?

[copacabana]

Actually, I'm off to watch Something's Wrong with Aunt Dianne, which caughtontape, I believe, mentioned.  Have been dreading it for years but the comments here have me inching towards it.  So Lost Stars on YouTube followed by Aunt Dianne. 

[CaughtOnTape]

Again, that was one link.  I'm not distorting it, I remember Kyle specifically saying that she was closer to Paris than Kathy because of their ages.  That quote was just the one I found doing a quick google search. 

 

Perhaps then don't use it to illustrate the point you were trying to make about Kyle specifically stating she was closer to Paris than she was to Kathy like it was something Kyle should be ashamed of ever saying?

 

I'm interested to see Yolanda's response to Brandi when she brings up Bella's DUI.  

 

I actually don't care to see this year's reunion if we have to sit through all of them talking over each other while they go on the attack.

[SwordQueen]

Why all the Kim hate?

 

Kim is my favorite one of the real housewives. Yes, she fucked up in the previous episode. So what. 

 

At the party she was 100% in the right to tell Kyle that she was disappointed in her. Kyle was just trying to use Kim to drum up drama for herself, as usual. Kim doesn't particiate in the fake fights. When she does fight they are real and they are heart breaking to watch. She brings some much needed actual reality to this show. She is the only one on this show who is actually a respectable human being. Yes, she is an addict, get over it. When she is sober she has more character and integrity then all of these other women put together.

 

Kyle was just mad because Kim has a friend. That women needs counseling. How she tries to constantly try to get between Kim and the other women, and then come in a "defend her sister" is not healthy. She wants to isolate Kim, when Kim is in a place where she is in desperate need of a community. She is fucking with her sister's sobriety for a little bit more camera time and it is gross. 

 

Kyle should have just been an adult and ignored Brandi. She just wanted attention and used her sister to get it. She can't stand that Kim has her own life right now so is trying to take her down.

 

This is an interesting take on the tragedy that is addiction and mental illness, but I’m not sure what “getting over” a loved one’s illness it means, exactly.   Like acceptance verses denial?  I don’t know about the rest of Kim’s family, but Kyle seems to go back and forth with this one, which is pretty normal, I think.  She seems to be able to acknowledge that her sister is an addict but has often been shown to be in denial about how addicts behave and that she will never be able to “fix” Kim, no matter how much enabling or tough-love she provides. I disagree entirely that Kyle wants to isolate Kim.  But an addict cannot change themselves if they don't change their environment.  Keeping the same friends or making new ones who are also users is not conducive to recovery.  Brandi likes to hang out with drinkers and drug users, because she does the same.  I honestly do not believe that Kyle would have a problem if Kim became close friends with a stable, healthy, loving person, who truly wanted to see Kim become and stay sober.  Brandi has no stake in wanting Kim sober.  This is Kyle's family -- her sister, her nieces and nephew.  One can have issues with family members and still want them to succeed in life and certainly one can have issues with family members and not wish them death or be apathetic about it them suffering. 

 

Or do you mean that loved ones of addicts should just ignore and disengage?  I agree, to a point.  I mean, no one can fix or cure an addict and trying is going to backfire on everyone involved.  But it’s not easy to watch someone you love kill themselves.  It’s a lot more complicated than just “getting over” it.  I almost died from Anorexia several years back and I wouldn’t be here today if it weren’t for my parents (mostly my dad’s) help.  I had to leave my own home because my partner was encouraging my eating disorder and ignoring the reality of the situation for their own ego.  That environment was not healthy for me and being around enablers would have killed me.  Brandi is not helping Kim become healthy.  My family still has a tough time knowing when to reach out and monitor and when to let me be.  I have a tough time knowing when to ask for and/or accept help and when I need to work this out for myself, to whatever end. 

 

You say "when she is sober" and that is the point.  She isn't sober, so Addict Kim is who Kim *is* for the majority of the time or all of the time, not Sober Kim.  She will not be sober until she takes and accepts responsibility for herself and stop blaming others for her addiction.  And she will not become sober as long as she is hanging around people who are also not sober and when she is inviting substances into her home (Monty's plethora of medications).  It would take a damn strong, committed and otherwise stable person to be able to do it that way.  Kim clearly is not committed in that manner, nor stable enough.  This is not Kyle's doing.   

 

I'm not going to touch on her so-called integrity.  lol

[motorcitymom65]

Actually, I'm off to watch Something's Wrong with Aunt Dianne, which caughtontape, I believe, mentioned.  Have been dreading it for years but the comments here have me inching towards it.  So Lost Stars on YouTube followed by Aunt Dianne. 

It is so good. One of those things were you are emotionally exhausted after watching it. Just stunned really. You will find yourself thinking about it for days after watching it. 

[LotusFlower]

I'm interested to see Yolanda's response to Brandi when she brings up Bella's DUI.  

 

The scene is already up on Bravotv.com if you're interested. Some of us were already discussing it in the First Look thread. Yolanda doesn't really get angry, but she definitely answers back.

[motorcitymom65]

The scene is already up on Bravotv.com if you're interested. Some of us were already discussing it in the First Look thread. Yolanda doesn't really get angry, but she definitely answers back.

She keeps her control, but you can see that she is pissed.  

 

Brandi tweeted yesterday that she would never attack Yolanda. That she loves her. I wonder if that means they are in a good place right now? 

[sistermagpie]

Actually, I'm off to watch Something's Wrong with Aunt Dianne, which caughtontape, I believe, mentioned.  Have been dreading it for years but the comments here have me inching towards it.  So Lost Stars on YouTube followed by Aunt Dianne

 

.

 

I'm watching it right now-Thanks for the heads up! It really does show how determined people can be to find some other explanation that flies in the way of an actual toxicology report. Interesting the people who said that they had forgiven Dianne for what she did, but were more angered by the family continually trying to push this story that that the toxicology report was a lie.

Edited February 6, 2015 by sistermagpie

[LotusFlower]

Brandi tweeted yesterday that she would never attack Yolanda. That she loves her. I wonder if that means they are in a good place right now?

I wonder, too, but I never go by Brandi's tweets to gauge anything - she uses them as spin or damage control. I know they formed a genuine friendship, but I have a hard time understanding how she can look past the Mohammed comments, and now the low blow about Bella.

Have they filmed the reunion yet? I think we'll get a clue from that.

[WireWrap]

Jeez, I'm watching the mini marathon right now, when they get together (film together) do these women EVER talk about anything other than Brandi or Kim?

 

Bravo needs to pay Brandi and Kim more, since apparently they are the only storyline worth discussing among the others.

Well, those 2 are giving everyone something to talk about with their awful behavior. IMO, The other HWs deserve a raise because they have to put up with those 2 fools. LOL

[zoeysmom]

I agree that not all blogs are pro Kyle, but the tide has most certainly changed. This girl was never defended anywhere by the vast majority of viewers since the S1 reveal.  Brandi has just got to be all kinds of stunned by this turn of events.

 

I guess there is just a line for me. I don't like Brandi, but I don't want for any of these ladies to reveal big secrets that might hurt her boys, if the purpose of doing so is just to lash out and hurt someone. There is always going to be collateral damage because these woman have decided to open themselves up for such scrutiny, and for the most part behave like asshats most of the time. If they decide to do things that will bring ridicule down on to their kids, it makes me dislike them all the more because i just don't understand why they would go that far, but it is their decision. On the other hand if someone gleefully does something to hurt a person's marriage or family, I just don't find anything funny or entertaining about that. 

I don't think anyone has a desire to reveal anything intimate about Brandi that is directly related to her children-or condemn her parenting. I think the cast collectively does not like Brandi's misrepresentations about themselves or others.  If Brandi's children are hurt because say they read a story she is one of the most hated housewives, that is not on the cast or the producers.  If Brandi's children are hurt because she appears impaired on screen and drinks excessively and swears and fights, that is on Brandi.  The others have every right to react to her boorish behavior.   Brandi has finally smartened up and when she is asked about rumors of the demise of Eddie's marriages she acknowledges her children love LeAnn and that would not be good for them. 

 

Brandi writes way too much about her life which subjects her to scorn and ridicule-not to mention the father of her children and their grandparents.  If her children take offense to it there is a solution-get a day job and stay out of the spotlight.  She will always be the drunk RH with the tampon string hanging out caught on film.  Six months working in a  office as a file clerk and she will begin to fade into obscurity.  If her response to the cast criticism is to tattle and insult she will forever be a pariah.  Six weeks on Celebrity Apprentice that does not show her drunk doesn't erase the damage she has done to the others' feelings and reputations.

[runforcover]

Girl, let's get our Valley of the Dolls on!  And keep it simmering.  Love you. You are too funny.  Hermetically sealed was epic. 

 

Yolanda is sucking on some might fine food when we're not around and all I can say is You GO girl.  Wish You Were Here 

Aw, I would love that!  But I am likely 7 hrs ahead of you and also have no access to bravo marathons.  This is probably for the best.  Enjoy the debauchery. Mwah, you are fabulous.  

[Satchels of gold]

Actually, I'm off to watch Something's Wrong with Aunt Dianne, which caughtontape, I believe, mentioned. Have been dreading it for years but the comments here have me inching towards it. So Lost Stars on YouTube followed by Aunt Dianne.

It's really haunting. Thought about it for a loooooooong time afterward.

Eta: I'd you like it, I'm the one who recommended it, if you don't then caughtontape did.

Edited February 6, 2015 by nc socialworker

[copacabana]

This is an interesting take on the tragedy that is addiction and mental illness, but I’m not sure what “getting over” a loved one’s illness it means, exactly.   Like acceptance verses denial?  I don’t know about the rest of Kim’s family, but Kyle seems to go back and forth with this one, which is pretty normal, I think.  She seems to be able to acknowledge that her sister is an addict but has often been shown to be in denial about how addicts behave and that she will never be able to “fix” Kim, no matter how much enabling or tough-love she provides. I disagree entirely that Kyle wants to isolate Kim.  But an addict cannot change themselves if they don't change their environment.  Keeping the same friends or making new ones who are also users is not conducive to recovery.  Brandi likes to hang out with drinkers and drug users, because she does the same.  I honestly do not believe that Kyle would have a problem if Kim became close friends with a stable, healthy, loving person, who truly wanted to see Kim become and stay sober.  Brandi has no stake in wanting Kim sober.  This is Kyle's family -- her sister, her nieces and nephew.  One can have issues with family members and still want them to succeed in life and certainly one can have issues with family members and not wish them death or be apathetic about it them suffering. 

 

Or do you mean that loved ones of addicts should just ignore and disengage?  I agree, to a point.  I mean, no one can fix or cure an addict and trying is going to backfire on everyone involved.  But it’s not easy to watch someone you love kill themselves.  It’s a lot more complicated than just “getting over” it.  I almost died from Anorexia several years back and I wouldn’t be here today if it weren’t for my parents (mostly my dad’s) help.  I had to leave my own home because my partner was encouraging my eating disorder and ignoring the reality of the situation for their own ego.  That environment was not healthy for me and being around enablers would have killed me.  Brandi is not helping Kim become healthy.  My family still has a tough time knowing when to reach out and monitor and when to let me be.  I have a tough time knowing when to ask for and/or accept help and when I need to work this out for myself, to whatever end. 

 

You say "when she is sober" and that is the point.  She isn't sober, so Addict Kim is who Kim *is* for the majority of the time or all of the time, not Sober Kim.  She will not be sober until she takes and accepts responsibility for herself and stop blaming others for her addiction.  And she will not become sober as long as she is hanging around people who are also not sober and when she is inviting substances into her home (Monty's plethora of medications).  It would take a damn strong, committed and otherwise stable person to be able to do it that way.  Kim clearly is not committed in that manner, nor stable enough.  This is not Kyle's doing.   

 

I'm not going to touch on her so-called integrity.  lol

 

I'm so incredibly sorry, SwordQueen, to know that you went through this crucible -- I shudder to think of people going through the anorexia mill.  I consider eating disorders and recovery in them the supreme test.  Cannot even begin to imagine.  And I'm sure I said at least ten things wrong just in the first few sentences.  I'm so glad your father was there for you.  There are no rules to any of this kind of thing, ever.  Just folks talking.  And I love what you write here and in all your posts. 

 

I think it all depends on who is doing what to and for whom and there are no rules beyond getting a grip and getting well.  This show SO messes with me.  I've been able to get off some of the others and this one is next on my list within the next year.  Not saying this is you -- just me.  I've had a lot of issues since I was little.  My allegiance to Bravo is on a definite down swing.  Not in response to you at all to say that.  Just made me want to give you a hug.  And myself too kinda and more often that not I'm in kick myself mode.  

 

Family members, like your father can save a life ... Could be that Kyle ain't the girl to do that from what we've seen.  And really we don't know really.  We just know what they show us.         

[WireWrap]

The scene is already up on Bravotv.com if you're interested. Some of us were already discussing it in the First Look thread. Yolanda doesn't really get angry, but she definitely answers back.

IMO, Yolanda is furious at that comment, watch her face and hands! She backs off, gets control of herself and shuts Brandi off.

 

 

She keeps her control, but you can see that she is pissed.  

 

Brandi tweeted yesterday that she would never attack Yolanda. That she loves her. I wonder if that means they are in a good place right now? 

Brandi has mentioned Yolanda at the end of her blog each week and tweets these "love" messages 1 or 2 times a week. Something has changed between them though, on Yolanda's end, there are no tweets to Brandi from Yolanda anymore! IMO, Brandi is sending Yolanda a message, a reminder, to keep quiet or else! Just my gut feeling, no evidence, just my impression because it is apparent that something has changed between them not just on the show but in real life.

[copacabana]

Okay, now I'm really really off to see Aunt Diane.  Something I've been avoiding ever since it came out.  Am really off to see it. 

[zoeysmom]

Andy admits he uses drugs so why would he do that?

Andy does not write the contracts nor is he a party to them.  Kim no showing when she is paid to work or leaving early is on production.  The production company is the one that sets the schedules and is responsible with turning in a finished product.  This is not that foreign a concept-think Charlie Sheen he has riders in his contract tied to sobriety and showing up for work.

Edited February 6, 2015 by zoeysmom

[renatae]

Mmmmhmmm. I tend to believe Brandi was responsible for the whole thing and wanted to try and frame Lisa for it.

I don't even think the tabloids got packed. Brandi just claimed Lisa wanted her to pack them when she saw them at Brandi's place, but that Brandi didn't pack them. The whole brouhaha was just over the claim that Lisa supposedly wanted to bring them along to use them to torment Kyle. Not believing it and never did.