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Spoilers With Speculation

SueB

By SueB
in Supernatural

ohjoy
Message added by ohjoy

Please keep your speculation and comments on the end of Supernatural in the Supernatural Ending topic. Use this topic here or the Bitter Speculation topic for discussion of the upcoming season only. As always, keep Bitch vs. Jerk discussion in its own topic.

Thank you.

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Diane

Diane

(edited)

Who's hand do we think is coming up like Jensen's did in Lazarus Rising? It looks to small to be Dean's or Sam's. 

Edited by Diane
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PeterKahlke
PeterKahlke

NEXT ON SUPERNATURAL Sam and Dean search for the yellow-eyed thing that killed their mom.

devlin
devlin

I don’t care who JA is going to be playing. I could seriously watch this guy read the phone book and be completely enthralled. I am just looking forward to some powerhouse acting full of nuances by wh

gonzosgirrl
gonzosgirrl

So, so over it. You're a big boy - if you don't agree, put up or shut your judgey piehole.

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

So the obvious cliffhanger is the "you?" guy. I would say John but no way they would have kept JDM a secret. And the guy didn`t seem to have the time for a cameo. Let alone for a storyline that surely goes on next Season. Next guess, Adam/Michael.

I`m now pretty convinced Dean doesn`t participate on the attack on the BMOL complex. Which sucks balls. Apparently he spends a lot of this ep in the mindscape world. And obviously he gets hurt in it because when they start he has no bruises but later has them. Cas appears to heal them in probably the Finale. 

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Idahoforspn

Idahoforspn

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

Since Lady Deadeyes is still handcuffed in that picture with Dean, yup, apparently they "beam" him into Mary`s brain. That`s how the mini!Dean comes in. And then what? Ketch comes in and is about to kill him and just then Mary wakes up? Don`t really care about this.

I`m seriously dismayed to not see any pictures of Dean in the attack on the BMOL complex. Apparently this is when Dabb said "the boys will have to act as generals for the American hunters". It will fucking suck so hard if Dean is not a part of that. I wànt him to show his fucking strength in leadership, inspiration and action. THIS is where the bread is buttered for me in this episode. If Dean doesn`t even partake in it, fuck that.

Ditto

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catrox14

catrox14

7 minutes ago, Diane said:

Who's hand do we think is coming up like Jensen's did in Lazarus Rising? It looks to small to be Dean's or Sam's. 

 IMO that's Crowley's hand. Smaller and stubbier than Dean, Sam or Cas' hand. I'll bet he'll be crawling out of the grave that the minions put him in.

And I'm just gonna say it now.

I AM REALLY UNHAPPY that ANOTHER ICONIC Dean moment is being used with another character no matter who it is. Just screw them for that.  

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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

Since Lady Deadeyes is still handcuffed in that picture with Dean, yup, apparently they "beam" him into Mary`s brain. That`s how the mini!Dean comes in. And then what? Ketch comes in and is about to kill him and just then Mary wakes up? Don`t really care about this.

I`m seriously dismayed to not see any pictures of Dean in the attack on the BMOL complex. Apparently this is when Dabb said "the boys will have to act as generals for the American hunters". It will fucking suck so hard if Dean is not a part of that. I wànt him to show his fucking strength in leadership, inspiration and action. THIS is where the bread is buttered for me in this episode. If Dean doesn`t even partake in it, fuck that.

Based on the pictures it looks like they might split up.  Dean stays behind to save Mary and Sam takes over the raid.  Dean's the leader of team free will and I'll be equally disappointed if we don't get so see that.

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gonzosgirrl

gonzosgirrl

25 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Jensen's face is too much.

He is amazing.

8 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

 IMO that's Crowley's hand. Smaller and stubbier than Dean, Sam or Cas' hand. I'll bet he'll be crawling out of the grave that the minions put him in.

And I'm just gonna say it now.

I AM REALLY UNHAPPY that ANOTHER ICONIC Dean moment is being used with another character no matter who it is. Just screw them for that.  

This to the nth degree. Seriously, screw them.

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

Quote

the pictures it looks like they might split up.  Dean stays behind to save Mary and Sam takes over the raid. 

Yup. Which, bah. I want him in that raid. Seriously, screw Mary. 

Who, btw, is gonna be in the faded-out-wherever-world. It`s in one of the really fast clips in the new promo.

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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

(edited)
11 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

 IMO that's Crowley's hand. Smaller and stubbier than Dean, Sam or Cas' hand. I'll bet he'll be crawling out of the grave that the minions put him in.

And I'm just gonna say it now.

I AM REALLY UNHAPPY that ANOTHER ICONIC Dean moment is being used with another character no matter who it is. Just screw them for that.  

Me too.  Unless its Dean, but I doubt it.

Quote

Yup. Which, bah. I want him in that raid. Seriously, screw Mary. 

I'd rather Dean be in the raid too.  Mary isn't worth the effort, IMO

Edited by ILoveReading
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Idahoforspn

Idahoforspn

14 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

 IMO that's Crowley's hand. Smaller and stubbier than Dean, Sam or Cas' hand. I'll bet he'll be crawling out of the grave that the minions put him in.

And I'm just gonna say it now.

I AM REALLY UNHAPPY that ANOTHER ICONIC Dean moment is being used with another character no matter who it is. Just screw them for that.  

Should we actually expect any better. Nope!

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)
28 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

So the obvious cliffhanger is the "you?" guy. I would say John but no way they would have kept JDM a secret. And the guy didn`t seem to have the time for a cameo. Let alone for a storyline that surely goes on next Season. Next guess, Adam/Michael.

I dunno. I'm thinking it very well could be JDM's John.  Maybe he's been in that dimension all along. I think they could have kept that a secret with all the attention paid to JDM being on the Walking Dead no one will think he could make an appearance.

I'm looking at the person with the greenish coat and the weapon that is similar but not quite the same as what Dean is holding.

SWERVE: This is another alternate future like THE END and the person holding the gun is Future!Dean who didn't die and he didn't say yes and he's still fighting the battle trying to kill Samifer.

BIGGEST SWERVE: It's Michael!Dean holding the gun on Cas and he's been fighting the war against Samifer in the future. So we get both Michael!Dean and Samifer after all.

ANOTHER SWERVE:  It's Sproutifer in the future. All grown up and fighting a war in this alternate dimension/future. Maybe all this will be more of Cas getting visions of the future via Sproutifer  and he has to decide whether or not to go ahead and save the spawn. 

Edited by catrox14
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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

I wonder if everything that happened in the bunker at the end of this episode will turn out to be false and part of some elaborate mind screw based on those pictures? I find it hard to believe Mary broke and turned as quickly as they presented it. It could be Lady Toni and Ketch have them in some elaborate dreamscape in the bunker they eventually break free from?

As to who "you" is, couple possibilities: John, as previously stated. Even if JDM was unavailable, Matt Cohen might've been. But, judging by the way Cass said "you" I think it likely is some version of Dean. 

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

Cas would know what John looks like so the "you" could fit but his tone of voice implies familiarity, yes. That is why my second guess would be Michael. 

A version of Dean would be cool - and they could save this Season if that was the real Dean, at least that would be an explanation for it - but there is just no set-up for it and I flat-out don`t believe they would give the character something cool.  

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Wayward Son

Wayward Son

1 minute ago, catrox14 said:

Is this Dean?t I'm not sure

tumblr_inline_opuupsjF3G1ruxmjy_500.png&

THANK YOU! I've been staring at it wondering the same thing, but I felt too nervous to ask in case I sounded stupid. 

 

-waits for someone with a useful reply- 

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

(edited)

I flipped the pic on its head and it doesn`t look like him. My best guess would be one of the hunters in the raid. 

The figure in the promo that is walking through the mist, it`s hard to tell how they are build. Are they tall? It could be a version of Sam and that`s why Jared was excited about the Finale. Are they walking bowlegged? I don`t think so. The build is hard to make out.

And who is it in that scene where someone walks in with what appears to be bone sticking out of their leg? Dean? Sam? 

Edited by Aeryn13
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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

(edited)
15 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

Cas would know what John looks like so the "you" could fit but his tone of voice implies familiarity, yes. That is why my second guess would be Michael. 

A version of Dean would be cool - and they could save this Season if that was the real Dean, at least that would be an explanation for it - but there is just no set-up for it and I flat-out don`t believe they would give the character something cool.  

That would go a long way to redeeming the season but I don't think they'd go there.  It would make Sam look dumb for not realizing that he spent the whole season with a replicant.

JP said at a con that he was shocked they went there and he's excited for it.  So I'm guessing its Adam.

That pic doesn't look like Dean.  The hair doesn't look right.

Edited by ILoveReading
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Wynne88

Wynne88

Quote

Based on the pictures it looks like they might split up.  Dean stays behind to save Mary and Sam takes over the raid.  Dean's the leader of team free will and I'll be equally disappointed if we don't get so see that.

Didn't the previews show Dean firing an automatic rifle?  

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

(edited)
Quote

Didn't the previews show Dean firing an automatic rifle? 

Yes but that is clearly in the "other" world where Sam and Mary and Cas also are. That appears to be in the Finale whereas the raid is in the penultimate episode. If they are galvanizing American hunters, I wanted Dean to take at least an equal part. 

Edited by Aeryn13
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catrox14

catrox14

Does that look like Cesar to you guys? It's not Jesse for sure. His hair seems a little too long for Cesar unless he grew it out. 

SPN don't you dare kill Jesse or Cesar!  #SaveJesseandCesar

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)

I'm thinking the hunter with the gash in their leg could be Claire or Alex.

The more I'm thinking about it, the more I agree with the folks who think Dean has volunteered to be head tripped. I think he's being told he can actually get into Mary's head and help get her out of her messed up head space, but to do that he has to go through Mary's death all over again. I dunno, it's all magic and drugs. Who the hell knows what is going on!

46 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

And who is it in that scene where someone walks in with what appears to be bone sticking out of their leg? Dean? Sam? 

Edited by catrox14
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Idahoforspn

Idahoforspn

2 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

I think the blood-covered guy is one of these hunters in the picture:

http://images.spoilertv.com/supernatural/Season 12/Promotional Episode Photos/Episode 12.22 - Who We Are/supernatural-season-12-photos-1214.jpg.php

And see Sam is singularly leading this little posse into battle. The WinchesterS will act like generals my ass. 

Stupid Mary keeping Dean stupidly sidelined. And I bet she will kill Ketch. 

Yes. I am so sick of this. Pedowitz better step in this summer if he wants anybody watching next year. It may be too late next year to bring many people back though. I am so angry at Dabb.

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)
17 minutes ago, Geordiegirl1967 said:

It think it's Cas 

The other pictures I think made it clear that guy looks nothing like Castiel IMO.

15 minutes ago, Mick Lady said:

Hold it, does Luci look like he's in Heaven? Looks a lot like the room the boys were in.

What's with the hair?

That wasn't Heaven per se in s4 and s5 it was the  Green Room (the waiting area Zachariah made in the airport in Van Nuys).

I thought that right away but talked myself out of it. I'm gonna find some pics of the Green Room to compare and contrast. But right now I don't think it is. 

I think that sadly, is a lock of Rowena's hair, and he found her and is probably using her for his own reasons and will likely break her neck again.

Edited by catrox14
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SueB

SueB

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(edited)

I did a "shot by shot" of the "2 in 1" promo.  I slowed it down to .25 speed and played it on my HD 24 in screen.  I'll list the shots w/ my commentary in italics

1. old house door -- the one Kelly is in?
2. Dean slices his hand for spell -- his watch is evident in multiple shots later
3. Crowley's hand reaching out of his grave -- personally, I find this a 'standard' shot used in many TV genre TV shows (Buffy, Being Human, etc... ) not some "property of Dean Winchester" shot.  
4. Mystery Figure w/ guns:

wrSp6W9.jpg

thoughts: Later we see him shooting a gun REMARKABLY similar to Dean's. OTOH, where's the bowlegs?  Also, does this person have a slight paunch?  My first instinct is JDM. But he's so very skinny these days.  Still, JDM wants Jensen to direct him.  Jensen is directing in S13 -- likely the 3rd episode (as always) and we could still be in the Other World at that point.  So... JDM could be in as many as 4 episodes and Jensen gets to direct him.  But... it's a stretch.  Alternatively, there could be some temporal phenomenon going on and this is Dean after years in the Other World (again..... the shoulder to hip ratio is definitely NOT Sam and doesn't really look Jensen).  Bobby?  I know Bobby may have been sent elsewhere two years ago.  But Jim Beaver is either trolling us hard or that is not Bobby.  So... I'm going 1) JDM, 2) Bobby, 3) young John, 4) Dean, or 5) "other".
5. Lawrence House staircase -- likely in the past
6. Dean w/ cutup leg -- bowlegs evident
7. Someone washing off a grisly looking claw device 
8. Dean wired up in the Bunker for a mind trip. Note, bunker lights are fully ON.
9. Baby crib in what looks like a 1960's living room - did Cas hide Kelly in the past?
10. Cas by pristine lake
11. BMoL red shirts grabbing guns in their compound
12. Black & White picture of Lucifer coming out of Crowley's early lair (the New York asylum)
13. Cas reaching up with a finger to touch someone at the old house by the lake
14. Kelly, pregnant, in comfy bed
15. Luci swirling a lock of Rowena's hair in a fancy room w/ blood on the chair -- it sure implies he got her
16. Somebody depressing a detonator switch
17. Mystery Man walking
18. Ketch calling either Sam or Dean's phone -- looks like they are in the motel room based on placemat
19. Dean crying
20. Sam closing his eyes (with emotion) in BMoL compound, Jody in background
21. More Mystery Man walking, this time towards a prone Cas
22. Satellite photo of a city with a spot marked in the center
23. Kelly painting baby's room
24. Mystery Man walking towards prone Cas, firing over Cas' head at some other target -- gun looks just like the one Dean uses in the promo
25. Other World Sam with shocked face
24. Bloody footprint on wood floor
25. Other World Dean with shocked face
25.5 Cas kissing Kelly's forehead (she's in bed, he's standing)
26. Dean's hand w/ Enochian brass knuckles
27. Dean pointing to blueprint along the curved wall (perhaps under the telescope level)?
28. Hand-cuffed Lady Toni w/ancient MoL gear attached to modern tablet
29. Dead-looking bloody dude -- I agree it's a random hunter
30. 4 spires in Other World w/ rocks and three dead dude -- one non-human sitting, two prone
31. Jody's picture on a cell phone w/ her Sioux Falls location
32. Lucifer looking at someone
33. Sam and Dean, looking tired and sweaty, sitting on the ground next to a curved wall with a relatively shallow portion smashed out. Laterns and emergency power evident. Empty bottle of scotch. -- Looks like "smash our way out doesn't work".
34. BMoL conference room
35. Jodi's truck moving quickly
36. Cas looks out of old house window
37. Bloody Dean face -- he looks satisfied
38. Ketch goes flying in MoL Bunker, across the table, the lights are on like normal.
39. Ketch w/ snub gun, bleeding
40. Ketch appears injured in upper arm/shoulder, in continuation of fight.
41. Electronic evesdropping display
42. Jody at BMoL compound
43. Spell bowl lights up
44. Ketch's phone says "Lester's down. Who's next."
45. Mary's face showing shock in Other World
46. Kelly in bed.
47. Cas touching Dean w/ two fingers & glowing thing is happening in old house
48. Sam looks stunned (in old house)
49. Cas says "you" to Mystery Man in Other World

Comments based on all sources (this promo, regular promo, pictures, and BTS):

Scene locations: 
- MoL Bunker w/out power, motel, MoL Bunker WITH power, BMoL compound
- Old house, Other World

Action sequences:
- Looks like it's Dean vs Ketch & I think Dean wins
- Sam seems to be at the BMoL compound
- Dean seems to be recovering Mary
- The boys & Lady Toni use a spell to get out of the Bunker
- They boys are in a motel room plotting
- The boys & Mary are recovered and in the Bunker talking about Lucifer
- Cas & Kelly have some quiet moments at the Lake House
- Sam, Dean and I think Lucifer show up at the Lake House -- I'm struggling with the two different cribs (one in a 60's living room, one in nephilim baby's bedroom... neither are Sams')
- Otherworld has two sequences -- one w/ Luci, Cas, Sam, Dean & Mary and the other w/ Cas and Mystery Man

Theories:
- We aren't in Kansas anymore in Otherworld. Doesn't look Oz but it looks different (future, different realm, don't know)
- There may be temporal thing going on -- and/or a time shift

Edited by SueB
#5 got dropped. Missed 25.5
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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

My first thought was that the broken leg person was Dean.  There is a glimpse of the feet and its looks like Dean's red boots. 

Why would Dean trust Lady Toni to mess around in his head?  Why would she agree to help and not turn him while he's under.  It's not like Mary would give  damn.

Whether the writers realize or not it also shows just how little attachment Mary has to her grown sons.  The fact that Dean has to appear in her head as little Dean in order to get through her programming tells me she probably only sees grown Sam and Dean as her sons in name only.  Its why none of this "I'm doing it for my boys, they mean everything to me, doesn't work."

Because they don't really if she was brainwashed so easily and her grown sons don't trigger any feelings for her.

But I'm guessing that Ketch is about to stab Dean when Mary "wakes up" and kills Ketch and saves Dean, completing her redemption arc.  Then Dean and Mary hightail it to the cornfield the men of letters bunker where The Raid is all finished when they get there, then Cas will show up and set up the bridge into the season finale.

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SueB

SueB

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3 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

1. My first thought was that the broken leg person was Dean.  There is a glimpse of the feet and its looks like Dean's red boots.  

2. Why would Dean trust Lady Toni to mess around in his head?  Why would she agree to help and not turn him while he's under.  It's not like Mary would give  damn.

3. Whether the writers realize or not it also shows just how little attachment Mary has to her grown sons.  The fact that Dean has to appear in her head as little Dean in order to get through her programming tells me she probably only sees grown Sam and Dean as her sons in name only.  Its why none of this "I'm doing it for my boys, they mean everything to me, doesn't work."

4. Because they don't really if she was brainwashed so easily and her grown sons don't trigger any feelings for her.

5. But I'm guessing that Ketch is about to stab Dean when Mary "wakes up" and kills Ketch and saves Dean, completing her redemption arc.  Then Dean and Mary hightail it to the cornfield the men of letters bunker where The Raid is all finished when they get there, then Cas will show up and set up the bridge into the season finale.

1. Agree
2. It's normal lighting in the bunker.  Time has passed.  Maybe they have a reason.
3. Mary may have retreated to that location in her head as her safe space. Only little Dean can pull her out.  In that safe space she wouldn't yet know big Sam and Dean.
4. In all the other times when Dean has pulled someone 'possessed' (or equivalent) out of their fugue, they were literally in the process of KILLING Dean.  In this case, she was only holding a gun on him.  Her actions may not have been enough to cause the emotional conflict that actually attempting to kill him would.
5. It's pretty evident it's Ketch vs Dean in the shot by shot analysis (see above). 

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tessathereaper

tessathereaper

(edited)
3 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

Based on the pictures it looks like they might split up.  Dean stays behind to save Mary and Sam takes over the raid.  Dean's the leader of team free will and I'll be equally disappointed if we don't get so see that.

I am really getting very very tired of them sidelining Dean.  Forget about getting, I am tired and annoyed and they really need to stop thinking it's OK to sideline him like this constantly.  Maybe we should be writing Pedowitz or something because this is getting utterly ridiculous at this point.

Edited by tessathereaper
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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

1 minute ago, SueB said:


5. It's pretty evident it's Ketch vs Dean in the shot by shot analysis (see above). 

I'll believe its Dean when I see it happen on screen.  Given the way this season is written, the confrontation being with Mary makes more sense. 

Since I don't give a damn about Mary, I'd rather they flipped and Sam bring Mary out and Dean go be badass at the BMoL's headquaters,

The whole sequence with Mary, is just more highlighting everything they did wrong with her this season.  Which is the relationship is so one sided with Dean doing all the work.

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Idahoforspn

Idahoforspn

I just had an awesome thought. If Dean does use the grenade launcher in Baby's trunk to get out, he has to take out a huge chunk of garage wall to get Baby out. How fun. Yes, I'm ready for that!!

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ZennyKenny

ZennyKenny

6 hours ago, catrox14 said:

The remaining promo pics.  FTR, I posted them in the order they appear on the slideshow on TV Addict.

Ok let me see if I can decipher the plot from these photos:

So a betrayed and scorned Lady Toni and the Winchesters escape, steal back Mary (against her will), take her back to the bunker where Lady T helps Dean get into Mary's mind to unbrainwash her. A pissed Ketch breaks back into the bunker where they have another showdown.

But then Jodi's all like "surprise Bitch, it's season finale time!" But Sam's all "not yet; let me and my hair walk all suave-like through this sexily-lit hallway first. But then you and other hunter come in behind me. Trust me, it will be more intimidating for the BMoL." And then they kill NotUmbridge offscreen because really who cares.

So then Mary's A-OK again and she's like "boys, we should talk". Dean's all "why", to which Mary replies "because it's a 2-hour season finale. Sam, stop giving me the puppy-dog eyes, you know we have to pad for time and wait for Lucifer's phone call".

Lucy calls, prompting Cas to go "....shit, I'm in this series, aren't I?" and contact the Winchesters. The 3 Amigos go out to meet Lucifer, clearly unimpressed with his new outfit. But he's Lucifer; he doesn't care. So he proudly displays it for them anyway. But later Cas is like "damn... that outfit was hot!" and re-thinks his decision to always wear that same old trenchcoat (this will officially be the cliffhanger, btw)

Meanwhile Mary is on Kelly-sitting duty because wimins bonding over babies amirite guys?

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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

2 minutes ago, ZennyKenny said:

Ok let me see if I can decipher the plot from these photos:

So a betrayed and scorned Lady Toni and the Winchesters escape, steal back Mary (against her will), take her back to the bunker where Lady T helps Dean get into Mary's mind to unbrainwash her. A pissed Ketch breaks back into the bunker where they have another showdown.

But then Jodi's all like "surprise Bitch, it's season finale time!" But Sam's all "not yet; let me and my hair walk all suave-like through this sexily-lit hallway first. But then you and other hunter come in behind me. Trust me, it will be more intimidating for the BMoL." And then they kill NotUmbridge offscreen because really who cares.

So then Mary's A-OK again and she's like "boys, we should talk". Dean's all "why", to which Mary replies "because it's a 2-hour season finale. Sam, stop giving me the puppy-dog eyes, you know we have to pad for time and wait for Lucifer's phone call".

Lucy calls, prompting Cas to go "....shit, I'm in this series, aren't I?" and contact the Winchesters. The 3 Amigos go out to meet Lucifer, clearly unimpressed with his new outfit. But he's Lucifer; he doesn't care. So he proudly displays it for them anyway. But later Cas is like "damn... that outfit was hot!" and re-thinks his decision to always wear that same old trenchcoat (this will officially be the cliffhanger, btw)

Meanwhile Mary is on Kelly-sitting duty because wimins bonding over babies amirite guys?

Sounds about right

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Idahoforspn

Idahoforspn

3 minutes ago, ZennyKenny said:

Ok let me see if I can decipher the plot from these photos:

So a betrayed and scorned Lady Toni and the Winchesters escape, steal back Mary (against her will), take her back to the bunker where Lady T helps Dean get into Mary's mind to unbrainwash her. A pissed Ketch breaks back into the bunker where they have another showdown.

But then Jodi's all like "surprise Bitch, it's season finale time!" But Sam's all "not yet; let me and my hair walk all suave-like through this sexily-lit hallway first. But then you and other hunter come in behind me. Trust me, it will be more intimidating for the BMoL." And then they kill NotUmbridge offscreen because really who cares.

So then Mary's A-OK again and she's like "boys, we should talk". Dean's all "why", to which Mary replies "because it's a 2-hour season finale. Sam, stop giving me the puppy-dog eyes, you know we have to pad for time and wait for Lucifer's phone call".

Lucy calls, prompting Cas to go "....shit, I'm in this series, aren't I?" and contact the Winchesters. The 3 Amigos go out to meet Lucifer, clearly unimpressed with his new outfit. But he's Lucifer; he doesn't care. So he proudly displays it for them anyway. But later Cas is like "damn... that outfit was hot!" and re-thinks his decision to always wear that same old trenchcoat (this will officially be the cliffhanger, btw)

Meanwhile Mary is on Kelly-sitting duty because wimins bonding over babies amirite guys?

That is priceless.

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Mick Lady

Mick Lady

52 minutes ago, SueB said:

I did a "shot by shot" of the "2 in 1" promo.  I slowed it down to .25 speed and played it on my HD 24 in screen.  I'll list the shots w/ my commentary in italics

1. old house door -- the one Kelly is in?
2. Dean slices his hand for spell -- his watch is evident in multiple shots later
3. Crowley's hand reaching out of his grave -- personally, I find this a 'standard' shot used in many TV genre TV shows (Buffy, Being Human, etc... ) not some "property of Dean Winchester" shot.  
4. Mystery Figure w/ guns:

wrSp6W9.jpg

thoughts: Later we see him shooting a gun REMARKABLY similar to Dean's. OTOH, where's the bowlegs?  Also, does this person have a slight paunch?  My first instinct is JDM. But he's so very skinny these days.  Still, JDM wants Jensen to direct him.  Jensen is directing in S13 -- likely the 3rd episode (as always) and we could still be in the Other World at that point.  So... JDM could be in as many as 4 episodes and Jensen gets to direct him.  But... it's a stretch.  Alternatively, there could be some temporal phenomenon going on and this is Dean after years in the Other World (again..... the shoulder to hip ratio is definitely NOT Sam and doesn't really look Jensen).  Bobby?  I know Bobby may have been sent elsewhere two years ago.  But Jim Beaver is either trolling us hard or that is not Bobby.  So... I'm going 1) JDM, 2) Bobby, 3) young John, 4) Dean, or 5) "other".
5. Lawrence House staircase -- likely in the past
6. Dean w/ cutup leg -- bowlegs evident
7. Someone washing off a grisly looking claw device 
8. Dean wired up in the Bunker for a mind trip. Note, bunker lights are fully ON.
9. Baby crib in what looks like a 1960's living room - did Cas hide Kelly in the past?
10. Cas by pristine lake
11. BMoL red shirts grabbing guns in their compound
12. Black & White picture of Lucifer coming out of Crowley's early lair (the New York asylum)
13. Cas reaching up with a finger to touch someone at the old house by the lake
14. Kelly, pregnant, in comfy bed
15. Luci swirling a lock of Rowena's hair in a fancy room w/ blood on the chair -- it sure implies he got her
16. Somebody depressing a detonator switch
17. Mystery Man walking
18. Ketch calling either Sam or Dean's phone -- looks like they are in the motel room based on placemat
19. Dean crying
20. Sam closing his eyes (with emotion) in BMoL compound, Jody in background
21. More Mystery Man walking, this time towards a prone Cas
22. Satellite photo of a city with a spot marked in the center
23. Kelly painting baby's room
24. Mystery Man walking towards prone Cas, firing over Cas' head at some other target -- gun looks just like the one Dean uses in the promo
25. Other World Sam with shocked face
24. Bloody footprint on wood floor
25. Other World Dean with shocked face
26. Dean's hand w/ Enochian brass knuckles
27. Dean pointing to blueprint along the curved wall (perhaps under the telescope level)?
28. Hand-cuffed Lady Toni w/ancient MoL gear attached to modern tablet
29. Dead-looking bloody dude -- I agree it's a random hunter
30. 4 spires in Other World w/ rocks and three dead dude -- one non-human sitting, two prone
31. Jody's picture on a cell phone w/ her Sioux Falls location
32. Lucifer looking at someone
33. Sam and Dean, looking tired and sweaty, sitting on the ground next to a curved wall with a relatively shallow portion smashed out. Laterns and emergency power evident. Empty bottle of scotch. -- Looks like "smash our way out doesn't work".
34. BMoL conference room
35. Jodi's truck moving quickly
36. Cas looks out of old house window
37. Bloody Dean face -- he looks satisfied
38. Ketch goes flying in MoL Bunker, across the table, the lights are on like normal.
39. Ketch w/ snub gun, bleeding
40. Ketch appears injured in upper arm/shoulder, in continuation of fight.
41. Electronic evesdropping display
42. Jody at BMoL compound
43. Spell bowl lights up
44. Ketch's phone says "Lester's down. Who's next."
45. Mary's face showing shock in Other World
46. Kelly in bed.
47. Cas touching Dean w/ two fingers & glowing thing is happening in old house
48. Sam looks stunned (in old house)
49. Cas says "you" to Mystery Man in Other World

Comments based on all sources (this promo, regular promo, pictures, and BTS):

Scene locations: 
- MoL Bunker w/out power, motel, MoL Bunker WITH power, BMoL compound
- Old house, Other World

Action sequences:
- Looks like it's Dean vs Ketch & I think Dean wins
- Sam seems to be at the BMoL compound
- Dean seems to be recovering Mary
- The boys & Lady Toni use a spell to get out of the Bunker
- They boys are in a motel room plotting
- The boys & Mary are recovered and in the Bunker talking about Lucifer
- Cas & Kelly have some quiet moments at the Lake House
- Sam, Dean and I think Lucifer show up at the Lake House -- I'm struggling with the two different cribs (one in a 60's living room, one in nephilim baby's bedroom... neither are Sams')
- Otherworld has two sequences -- one w/ Luci, Cas, Sam, Dean & Mary and the other w/ Cas and Mystery Man

Theories:
- We aren't in Kansas anymore in Otherworld. Doesn't look Oz but it looks different (future, different realm, don't know)
- There may be temporal thing going on -- and/or a time shift

Great post SueB! Thank you so much for taking the time, I really appreciated it!

Chuck, I hope that's not Rowena's hair! I've become very fond of her, but if Luci does kill her, he's right, I would hate him!

The "Mystery Figure" has got me stumped. That pot belly doesn't fit anyone we know, yet.

#19, the "Single Man Tear" Breaks my heart. I hope to Chuck it's Mary, and not Cas that he's mourning.

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Mick Lady

Mick Lady

1 hour ago, SueB said:

- Sam, Dean and I think Lucifer show up at the Lake House -- I'm struggling with the two different cribs (one in a 60's living room, one in nephilim baby's bedroom... neither are Sams')

Are you sure of this Sue? I trust your judgment but I thought one was Sam's.

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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

8 minutes ago, Mick Lady said:

The "Mystery Figure" has got me stumped. That pot belly doesn't fit anyone we know, yet.

Sue B could be right that its Bobby.  Jim B has a pot belly.  If that is The Empty its very possible Bobby was sent there after the events of Inside Man.  I don't think its Dean due to the lack of the bow legs. 

There is a picture of a person about .43 seconds in (im not good at screen capping).  At first I thought it was Lucifer but its possible its the mystery guy.

I'm hopping its not Bobby, because I think he's stories done.  They struggled with what to do with Mary, Cas, Crowley and Dean this year and adding another character to the mix is not going to do them any favors

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Bergamot

Bergamot

8 minutes ago, Mick Lady said:

The "Mystery Figure" has got me stumped. That pot belly doesn't fit anyone we know, yet.

I think it is Bobby. The longer I look at that picture, the more convinced I am. 

jim-beaver-supernatural.jpg

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ohjoy
Message added by ohjoy

Please keep your speculation and comments on the end of Supernatural in the Supernatural Ending topic. Use this topic here or the Bitter Speculation topic for discussion of the upcoming season only. As always, keep Bitch vs. Jerk discussion in its own topic.

Thank you.

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