Spoilers, Speculation & All Things Media!

[CheshireCat]

BellyLaughter, on 16 Apr 2016 - 6:52 PM, said:BellyLaughter, on 16 Apr 2016 - 6:52 PM, said:

My question is why make a season ending that caters for an altered cast if you don't already know something ie Stana doesn't want to return??

Why not just make a cliffhanger assuming a return or a series ending assuming cancellation??

The extra ending makes me very suspicious that they already know something they are not telling us.

It truely sucks to be a Castle fan ATM

 

Because even if an actor is open to contract negotiations, it doesn't mean that they'll have a happy ending. At this point it sounds like SK is willing to go to the negotiation table or, at least, said she'll think about it but she won't be approached until after NF signs and everything else seems to be up in the open.

Edited April 17, 2016 by CheshireCat

[KaveDweller]

Also, Hawley talked before about liking cliffhangers so even if Stana is already on board for next season they could want it to look like she's not to get people to care more about what happens. Just like they wouldn't want to tell us if she's leaving to give people hope.

 

So what the showrunners say is essentially meaningless in terms of predicting the future.

[CastleSeason8]

Also, Hawley talked before about liking cliffhangers so even if Stana is already on board for next season they could want it to look like she's not to get people to care more about what happens. Just like they wouldn't want to tell us if she's leaving to give people hope.

So what the showrunners say is essentially meaningless in terms of predicting the future.

Lol what these showrunners say is always meaningless

[westwingfan]

Found this in the comments to the TV Line article

 

Leo says:
April 16, 2016 at 5:24 PM

Rumor around town is if ABC can sign the two leads, it’ll be for an eight episode final season 9.

 

if I haven't come across this "rumor" any where else does that mean that this person is the one starting the "rumor" ? LOL

[BellyLaughter]

I wouldn't mind a shortened final season with everyone onboard. If that's what it takes to get them to return.

They could even call it "Castle: The Final Chapter"

[KaveDweller]

Found this in the comments to the TV Line article

 

Leo says:

April 16, 2016 at 5:24 PM

Rumor around town is if ABC can sign the two leads, it’ll be for an eight episode final season 9.

 

if I haven't come across this "rumor" any where else does that mean that this person is the one starting the "rumor" ? LOL

 

Quick, someone post a different "rumor" in those comments and see if it gets repeated.  LOL.

 

It's probably crazy to take anything posted in TV Line's comments as accurate, but I kind of like the sound of that. Maybe if it's only 8 episodes the actors would require less time off and they could have more scenes together? I know that's probably wishful thinking.

[BlakesMomma]

Quick, someone post a different "rumor" in those comments and see if it gets repeated.  LOL.

 

 

 

You don't even have to bother posting over there.  Just post here that you read a "rumor" elsewhere and in 24 hours it's fact in some segments of the Castle fandom. That's the way it seems to work anymore.

 

I wouldn't mind a 9 episode final season if they use it to give us a great wrap up.  Maybe ABC will give half a season to Castle and the other half to Nashville.  LOL

[verdana]

It truely sucks to be a Castle fan ATM

 

Indeed it does, it's sucked all season for this fan and I fear that's not going to change much, even if we do get a S9.

 

I wouldn't mind a 9 episode final season if they use it to give us a great wrap up.

 

 

I don't have faith in a shorter season meaning the writing will tighten up and fans will get better quality interactions between the characters which is often the assumption because there's less filler, the same problems plaguing this season will carry on unless ABC push for changes to their contracts and I can't see them bothering to change anything if everyone knows it's for one final season, they'll limp along as they have been doing. 

 

Hawley traveled a similar road last year at this time, when as co-showrunner of The Following he set up a finale that ended with Kevin Bacon’s character venturing off to be a vigilante of sorts, as the Fox drama rode the renewal bubble. “But we can’t do that on Castle,” he says. “Castle‘s a different show, so it felt like to be fair to the fans, if we thought there was even a small chance we wouldn’t come back, we owed it to them to craft something” that offers closure.

 

 

When did Hawley give a toss about being "fair" to the fans? What a load of bullshit that statement is, how gracious of him to consider if Castle does end in May that he gives fans who have loved and followed this show, many since the pilot "something" and he couldn't even say the word "happy" or "positive" in terms of closure, he comes over as arrogant and clueless to me. The guy has shown precious little understanding about anything when it comes to the characters or what Castle is about which is saying something given he used to work on it. 

Edited April 17, 2016 by verdana

[BellyLaughter]

Indeed it does, it's sucked all season for this fan and I fear that's not going to change much, even if we do get a S9.

I don't have faith in a shorter season meaning the writing will tighten up and fans will get better quality interactions either the characters which is often the assumption because there's little filler to pad things out, the same problems plaguing this season will carry on unless ABC push for changes to their contracts and I can't see them bothering to change anything if everyone knows it's one final season.

When did Hawley give a toss about being "fair" to the fans? What a load of bullshit that statement is, how gracious of him to consider if Castle does end in May that he gives fans who have loved and followed this show, many since the pilot "something" and he couldn't even say the word "happy" or "positive" in terms of closure, he comes over as arrogant and clueless to me.

Preach! Condescending til the end Ol' Hawley Edited April 17, 2016 by BellyLaughter

[westwingfan]

In light of the most recent TV Line article about the finale I thought it might be helpful to remind ourselves what the showrunners have said previously.

 

Deadline Jan 10
Hawley said. “I think going out with a cliff hanger of sorts always helps you when you come back. When we came back this year, it had a conclusion last year, and I think ultimately it was a little harder for us to get out of the gate because people didn’t have anything driving them back.”
Still, Hawley and Winter will not leave fans hanging. “Everything that has been set up will come to a conclusion this season,” Winter said. That includes the LokSat mystery.
While they have their hands full with Season 8, Hawley and Winter have an idea where they want to go in Season 9, which is return to the show’s roots after a serialized eighth season.
“This season was a little bit of a transition, getting Castle into the PI office and setting that world up for him to give him that drive,” Hawley said. “We wanted to wrap up a lot of the threads of different conspiracies, Beckett’s mother’s murder, Castle’s missing time. We wanted by the end of Season 8 to have gotten through all those — hopefully in a compelling and satisfying way — so Season 9 can be more about the case of the week, going back to the fun of solving the case of the week and not have the luggage of past conspiracies.”

 

Entertainment Weekly Mar 4
When will Castle tell us more about LokSat? — Murphy
The show will “touch on it again a couple of times driving toward what’s going to be the finale,” says EP Alexi Hawley, who promises both a reveal and some frustration in the season-ender — especially if the show doesn’t get renewed. “Our hope is to get to a place where they do get to confront LokSat and get something satisfying,” he adds. “It would be great to have something of a cliff hanger.”

 

So they seemed to have planned to have the Loksat mystery completely resolved by the end of S8 but now they have allowed for some casualties along the way. It all points to Beckett taking another bullet, but with the satisfaction that she has finally got all the bad guys as her eyes slowly close just before the credits. Although Toks tweet about going out with a bang could suggest that the finale ends with some pyrotechnics that engulfs several characters which gives them more options, i.e. Hayley doesn't make it if Stana re-signs, or she does if Stana leaves.

I'm not sure how his cliff hanger will help him get out of the gate by driving people back if it is known that Stana has left the show, I'm assuming it would be widespread knowledge by September if that's the case. It could mean he stalls at the start.

Edited April 17, 2016 by westwingfan

[KaveDweller]

So they seemed to have planned to have the Loksat mystery completely resolved by the end of S8 but now they have allowed for some casualties along the way. It all points to Beckett taking another bullet, but with the satisfaction that she has finally got all the bad guys as her eyes slowly close just before the credits. Although Toks tweet about going out with a bang could suggest that the finale ends with some pyrotechnics that engulfs several characters which gives them more options, i.e. Hayley doesn't make it if Stana re-signs, or she does if Stana leaves.

I'm not sure how his cliff hanger will help him get out of the gate by driving people back if it is known that Stana has left the show, I'm assuming it would be widespread knowledge by September if that's the case. It could mean he stalls at the start.

 

Unless they changed their minds and aren't warpping up Loksat. But hopefully they know how hated the storyline is.

 

Maybe they are doing something where they catch Loksat and bring everyone down, and then Beckett gets hit by a bus or something else totally unrelated. I'd prefer if they didn't just have her be shot again and make it different from season 3. It kind of makes her look like an idiot if she just keeps getting shot by the same people.

 

But I agree, a dead Beckett doesn't really provide a great way for them coming back next year. If she survives it would, but not if she's really dead. The only way a see a continuation where she's dead is if they do a time jump. So a time jump isn't really a starting point like he's describing.

 

Ugh, I hate uncertainty.

[CastleSeason8]

Unless they changed their minds and aren't warpping up Loksat. But hopefully they know how hated the storyline is.

Maybe they are doing something where they catch Loksat and bring everyone down, and then Beckett gets hit by a bus or something else totally unrelated. I'd prefer if they didn't just have her be shot again and make it different from season 3. It kind of makes her look like an idiot if she just keeps getting shot by the same people.

But I agree, a dead Beckett doesn't really provide a great way for them coming back next year. If she survives it would, but not if she's really dead. The only way a see a continuation where she's dead is if they do a time jump. So a time jump isn't really a starting point like he's describing.

Ugh, I hate uncertainty.

Hardly a thing has happened as he has described. When he talks, it sounds like a storyline or arc, but ends up being one line or scene.

[BlakesMomma]

An explosion.  Whenever you want to end without knowing who will survive - an explosion.  Then come S9, you see who survives.  

[verdana]

An explosion is definitely the easiest way to cover all the bases, each season I predict (jokingly) the precinct gets blown up as a finale cliffhanger, this season looks like I may actually get my wish lol.

[CastleSeason8]

An explosion is definitely the easiest way to cover all the bases, each season I predict (jokingly) the precinct gets blown up as a finale cliffhanger, this season looks like I may actually get my wish lol.

Remember, they did find the script from Boom according to the call sheet that was briefly up on twitter. So explosion it may be

[CheshireCat]

BlakesMomma, on 17 Apr 2016 - 7:12 PM, said:

An explosion.  Whenever you want to end without knowing who will survive - an explosion.  Then come S9, you see who survives.  

 

That's what I'm thinking too, though mostly because of Toks' tweet (that Haley went out with a bang).

[BellyLaughter]

Lol I interpreted her tweet being about how she banged her head by accident during shooting a scene??

An explosion would be better than a shooting. And I am still clinging to the desperate hope that ABC won't renew Castle unless they can get both leads. It's my happy place right now.

I also noticed that The Catch matched Castles Live +3 ratings this week....if they actually matter??

[CheshireCat]

BellyLaughter, on 17 Apr 2016 - 8:32 PM, said:

Lol I interpreted her tweet being about how she banged her head by accident during shooting a scene??

 

I thought it was supposed to mean both - that she would go out with a bang, whatever that means, and literally did so, too, by banging her head shooting that (final) scene. ... So, who knows.

 

But yeah, I'm definitely all for ending the show if they can't get both leads on board!

[WendyCR72]

But yeah, I'm definitely all for ending the show if they can't get both leads on board!

 

Seems to be the prevailing sentiment over at TV Line, too. But considering the multiple endings thing ABC has going, I guess the network still thinks there's a little blood left in the stone.

[BellyLaughter]

The sentiment on TVLine is pretty strong.  Can't say I'm shocked.  It would be interesting to see if all the fans making threats to stop watching actually follow through.....

[CastleSeason8]

The sentiment on TVLine is pretty strong. Can't say I'm shocked. It would be interesting to see if all the fans making threats to stop watching actually follow through.....

Considering the good chunk they lost after the non wedding, my GUESS is that they will lose quite a few. Myself included

[BellyLaughter]

Considering the good chunk they lost after the non wedding, my GUESS is that they will lose quite a few. Myself included

Right there with you.

[CastleSeason8]

Right there with you.

Also, even tho fans have made threats to leave before and havent, i think this time is different. So many are hanging on by a thread and have just about had enough of this bull. They just may follow thru this time

[CheshireCat]

WendyCR72, on 17 Apr 2016 - 9:58 PM, said:

Seems to be the prevailing sentiment over at TV Line, too. But considering the multiple endings thing ABC has going, I guess the network still thinks there's a little blood left in the stone.

 

Considering that the showrunners said that ABC needs to tell them which ending to air, I'm not sure if ABC is the driving force behind those multiple endings. To me it sounds as if the showrunners wanted to accomodate for the possibility of either one of the leads not returning or both returning (one ending) and then they had the budget to film an ending accomodating the end of the show (second ending). And if ABC renews the show, then we'll get ending #1 which is a cliffhanger and if they don't, we'll get ending #2. However, I would interpret all the information we have as it's still up in the air if they renew with only one lead.

[CheshireCat]

How reliable is Deadline? http://deadline.com/2016/04/castle-stana-katic-exit-season-9-tamala-jones-out-1201739022/

[westwingfan]

How reliable is Deadline? http://deadline.com/2016/04/castle-stana-katic-exit-season-9-tamala-jones-out-1201739022/

I thought they are reliable, well that's it for me.

[Demented Daisy]

Delurking to say that SpoilerTV agrees.

 

http://www.spoilertv.com/2016/04/castle-season-9-stana-katic-and-tamala.html

[CheshireCat]

TV Line has picked up the story as well, but they're Deadline's "Sister site".

[evesix]

Deadline is probably THE most accurate. During castings, actors often refresh that site to see if a role has been filled and stuff.

 

What garbage this is to not even ask Stana! Castle is another show in a long list of shows this season to treat its female characters/leads like absolute trash.

 

I hope the show is cancelled.

Edited April 18, 2016 by evesix

[Sara2009]

It doesn't get more reliable than Deadline unfortunately.

I'm SHOCKED that Stana wasn't even asked to re-negotiate, though.

[Cyranetta]

All I can think in response to this latest bit of news is "What the effing hell!"

[scenicbyway]

How is the show even Castle without Beckett?  The entire premise of the show is Castle following Beckett around.  Who would watch a 9th season of just Castle, hanging out with Haley and Alexis or Ryan and Espo?  Why would it be fun to watch Castle cope with Beckett's death?  This is a huge miscalculation on the network's part.  If you want to keep Fillion on ABC, fine, find a new show for him, but it's ridiculous to keep Castle going without it's female lead.  If Stana wanted out (likely) or if it really was the network not asking her back, fine, but it's not the same show without Beckett.  I wonder if they think people will tune in to see Beckett come back from the dead, but the joke's on the audience (again) when she really is gone.

[CheshireCat]

scenicbyway, on 18 Apr 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

How is the show even Castle without Beckett?  The entire premise of the show is Castle following Beckett around.  Who would watch a 9th season of just Castle, hanging out with Haley and Alexis or Ryan and Espo?  Why would it be fun to watch Castle cope with Beckett's death?  This is a huge miscalculation on the network's part.  If you want to keep Fillion on ABC, fine, find a new show for him, but it's ridiculous to keep Castle going without it's female lead.  If Stana wanted out (likely) or if it really was the network not asking her back, fine, but it's not the same show without Beckett.  I wonder if they think people will tune in to see Beckett come back from the dead, but the joke's on the audience (again) when she really is gone.

 

Unfortunately, I heard that it's common practice to replace long-time characters with new ones for budget reasons. Usually it's recurring characters who get replaced, however, I find it entirely possible that ABC decided to not approach Katic. I wonder if the story was leaked so that they can test the response and make the decision of renewal based on that. I hope they decide to cancel in the end so we can get that series finale and not ending that's even more depressing than a show without Katic! Beckett dying is not something characters or fans deserve!

[Chado]

It was obvious she wasn't coming back for a while

[Emma]

Seriously? This show is nothing without both. Dumb move by ABC.

[GeorgieNY]

Since they knew since January, it would have been nice to have a few really great Caskett episodes end the season, and for Castle and Beckett to get a happy ending. The deadline poll is pretty damning for a Stana-less show.

[FlickerToAFlame]

This is bullshit, and I'm so angry, but I wonder if her need for so much vacation sealed the deal. Of course it's a double standard with NF who asked for similar, but he's the show's namesake. And, more importantly, a man.

ETA: I'm not blaming Stana at all, just trying to make some logic out of this. I'm so devastated for her, what a slap in the face to her. She doesn't deserve this.

Edited April 18, 2016 by FlickerToAFlame

[MaryM47]

Marlowe's response from tvline.com:

 

Castle creator and former showrunner Andrew W. Marlowe speaks for many with his first comment on the cast shake-up which has dropped series co-lead Stana Katic as well as Tamala Jones from any possible Season 9.

“Heartbroken,” Marlowe shared in a short, not sweet tweet on Monday morning. “There are no words.”

 

[CheshireCat]

FlickerToAFlame, on 18 Apr 2016 - 1:10 PM, said:

This is bullshit, and I'm so angry, but I wonder if her need for so much vacation sealed the deal. Of course it's a double standard with NF who asked for similar, but he's the show's namesake. And, more importantly, a man.

 

Actually, as far as I know, networks tend to give long-term actors less screen time because that way they can keep their salary the same but it translates into a raise because actors are doing less hours. But the money invested is the same and if you replace recurring characters with new ones and use the new ones more than you save money in the end. And while I wouldn't be surprised if Katic wanted the time off last October, I now have my doubts about the time around Christmas.

It also makes me wonder now if Hawley/Winter had something else planned but ABC ended up negotiating a deal with Katic which forced them to adjust what they had planned.

[TWP]

It's really hard to know what went down. It's not like ABC doesn't ever support women #shondaland . Maybe Stana made their lives difficult last time (too hard to work around her time off or whatever) and they said "sorry" this time. I'm not attacking Stana. I'm just saying it's not always about the network being horrible to women.

Stana was talking about a new show for cable. Maybe that's why they didn't even try and offer her a deal. They knew she wanted more than they were willing to pay. Or maybe she already knew then. Maybe she was adamant about a Season 8 ending, so they said bye.

I'll see what the new Castle show is. Maybe it'll be worthwhile. During the Season 5 timeframe I may have said WTF. Apathy about a TV show is a beautiful thing. During the last month, I lost 3 close friends or family members and two are really sick. Give me an escape from reality and I'll take it, no matter who the actors are. I certainly am not going to get outraged about it.

[MaryM47]

From The Hollywood Reporter (who obviously didn't do their homework re: the comment that C&B aren't yet married)

 

News that Katic would exit the drama ahead of season nine should come as little surprise. Sources tell THR that the actress, who negotiated a last-minute return for season eight, has been unhappy on the series and has had repeated clashes with lead Fillion. That led producers to split up the on-screen couple this season — drawing the ire of dedicated fans who had been waiting eight years for the couple to marry.

 

[FlickerToAFlame]

While I'm sure it wasn't NF's decision (and he shouldn't be blamed, but will be by the "passionate" fans), he could have strongly suggested it *if* the rumors they don't get along are true.

[Betweenthisandthat]

Just read about Stana and Tamala. I'm shocked. If they chose to leave that would be one thing, but if it's true they were dismissed, then the show deserves whatever backlash it gets. That's a horrible and dumb move by ABC if the Deadline reporting is accurate. I assume there's more going on that we may or may not find out later, but I feel badly for fans. And Tamala, I hope she was paid well because they never did much with her and then she's let go? This isn't good buzz going into a ninth season, if that happens.

Edited April 18, 2016 by Betweenthisandthat

[AntiBeeSpray]

From The Hollywood Reporter (who obviously didn't do their homework re: the comment that C&B aren't yet married)

 

Yea. Fans were ticked since the characters were married and then it happened. The split. Haven't watched the show since, myself. It's not worth the pain.

[FlickerToAFlame]

Ironic this is announced the day the show is to air an episode called Backstabber that features Stana's replacement.

[CheshireCat]

FlickerToAFlame, on 18 Apr 2016 - 1:49 PM, said:

Ironic this is announced the day the show is to air an episode called Backstabber that features Stana's replacement.

 

The title is certainly ironic. The timing, however, I think is no coincidence. (Is it mean of me to hope that the episode tonight won't even get a 5 million rating?)

[verdana]

Deadline are very reliable. So that's it.

 

Makes my decision even easier I had one foot out the door now I've got both.

 

What's intriguing me now is if they do get a shortened season 9 what the hell are they going to do? Make Castle a happy widower? Have Beckett turn into Mrs Columbo and be mentioned but never seen? 

 

I'm not surprised she's out but I am kind of shocked they never even bothered to negotiate with her.

 

Getting rid of Tamala is a no brainer lol. 

 

However, it does explain why Katic seemed rather zoned out this season, her not giving a fuck at times was so painfully obvious, for her sake I'm glad she's moving on to fresh new projects that will hopefully fire up her enthusiasm again. I realise that might not be a popular view but I'd rather see her doing something she enjoyed than coasting just taking home a pay cheque. I wish her all the very best in her career and life.

 

I know they'll be a meltdown on twitter and tumblr but I hope fans don't embarrass themselves sending abusive messages to cast and crew, it's not going to change anything, try and keep it classy. 

[turnitwayup]

Like I said in the ep thread, the forced Haley/Alexis bond plus Haley seeming to have more screen time with Castle's family that Beckett has all season gave me the vibe that Haley is gonna be Castle's new love interest after a Beckett death. A widowed Castle is so depressing for a show that was basically a rom com set in a procedural. More surprise they didn't even bother to negotiate with Stana. They should've got rid of Tamala last season with Penny since Lanie barely appears in most eps and you wouldn't believe she's suppose to be Beckett's bff. Even sadder is that when Marlowe was around, Caskett got their happy ending while everything is likely leading to Beckett being on one of the TV Line Scorecard deaths. Hollander's Woods is looking better and better as the series finale. It seems like the only Caskett happy ending was to do what Major Crimes has done to Brenda and Fitz. Transfer Beckett to command a different precinct, Castle appears once in a while, move Ryan and Espo as leads and change the name to The 12th or something.

 

Oh Susan being positive to get people to watch tonight's ep while Toks has no idea what's going on but what she read on Deadline. Nathan is suppose to live tweet the ep tonight and I'm expecting a lot of angry tweets aimed at him. Jon is sad about the exits and hope fans will come back to what ever "unknown incarnation of the show." He and Seamus hasn't been asked back yet. Sounds like everyone will probably find out online.

 

So possible PI Castle in LA could happen now. Widowed Castle is too depressed to stay in NYC due to Beckett's death so to move on by moving his PI office to LA for change. They would bring along Alexis since she's probably the cheapest of the main cast. Martha to recurring once in a while cast since she has her acting studio in NYC but comes out to visit family and random guest star roles for various tv shows. That would get rid of most of the cast and add new cheaper roles. Add in wacky hjinks with Meredith and you got a completely different show.

Edited April 18, 2016 by turnitwayup

[CheshireCat]

I'm sorry, but how can Huertas even mention an integrity of the show when Katic and Jones, apparently, didn't leave on their own but were basically fired for monetary reasons? That right there tells me that there is no integrity to be kept intact. 

If he wants to talk about integrity then the actors should decide collectively to not re-sign. I'm sure they can afford not to (and I'm sorry, but this 400 job argument doesn't fly with me either because a) if there's a shortened season then they'd be out of a job by Christmas anyway and b) if I look at Hollywood and LA then I would assume that the majority will either easily find a new job or will have earned enough to make do for a little while, otherwise Hollywood and LA would be crawling with homeless people because there are a ton of shows which end every season)

 

ETA: Is that tweet Huertas posted about he and Dever not having been asked either supposed to make light of it?

And that he found out online does suggest that ABC deliberately leaked the story.

Edited April 18, 2016 by CheshireCat

[schnauzergirl]

From what I've read, neither Beckett nor Lanie will be killed off, so there would no widower Castle.  While I will admit to finding Kate less and less likable this season, I'm sorry to have things end this way.

 

ETA: Apparently, the comment about not killing off Beckett or Lanie was made some months ago, and now there's an anonymous comment to the effect that now that might happen.

Edited April 18, 2016 by schnauzergirl