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Molly also said:

 

@MollyQuinn93: @castlefan1012 Alexis will definitely support her dad, but she is smart enough to know there is something larger afoot.

 

Regarding the long winter hiatus, I sure hope they end on a good note with the fall finale. I guess it will be episode 8.09, since it's likely Hanning's episode will open sweeps. 

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@MollyQuinn93: @castlefan1012 Alexis will definitely support her dad, but she is smart enough to know there is something larger afoot.

 

As opposed to her father, who is kind of dim. Good thing Alexis inherited her brains from her mother?

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I don't understand how anyone is supposed to buy this? Their leading man signed on for a season which as far as anyone knew would take place without their leading lady, and they've started up the season with Castle being saintly about the fact that Beckett is clearly mentally ill which will keep them apart despite the fact that he loves her totes muchly except yada yada yada and once again there's a really good reason that Castle is acting like a greeter at a low-rent convention instead of a man in love. 

 

I kind of gave up on this in season 3. I've come back since, but only when I've read something tantalizing and I hoped things had changed, and they never had.

 

I expect Nathan Fillion will make a lot of references to Joss Whedon moving forward, because that's pretty much his shot at dignity right there.

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As opposed to her father, who is kind of dim. Good thing Alexis inherited her brains from her mother?

 

Um, Castle's pretty damn smart.  He's a bestselling author and he's extremely observant.  Alexis' mom is kind of a bimbo.

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Um, Castle's pretty damn smart.  He's a bestselling author and he's extremely observant.  Alexis' mom is kind of a bimbo.

 

yeah, that's kind of my point. These days, Alexis runs rings around Castle without breaking a sweat or chipping a nail, because apparently Castle has to be a kittywhipped doofus for people to love him. Back when this was still a well-written show? Not so much.

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Interesting that the Headhunters follow up episode (aka Slaughter) will be the fall season finale according the TV Line interview.

Right there with you, I thought the first episode was one of the worst until Squab and Quail, FBOFW but Baldwin never pleases me even though I like NF and they are close to me he is a bit of a douche.  I have put Castle on the DVR routine and now watching another show live on Mondays.  Maybe they could rename the series for Alexi H to Back in Time, he forgets he is the one that left, we were here to see the characters and story grow and now he puts us back to S 3-4 NOT

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Interesting that the Headhunters follow up episode (aka Slaughter) will be the fall season finale according the TV Line interview.

 

That kind of surprised me too, because Hawley said something "fun" happens that relates back to Locksat...is Slaughter connected to him too? Maybe everyone Caskett has ever interacted with is connected to this guy.

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I had been banking on 8.09 as the fall finale because I really can't imagine "Cool Boys" focusing on Castle and Slaughter as the send-off episode to the hiatus. Unless Slaughter is there to reveal something heretofore unknown about Castle's time away. 

 

It's funny; on tumblr people seem to be predicting a reunion or a pregnancy as the big shift. I'm a bit more wary and think they might shift to Castle's time away at that point. Castlecentric drama, this time, to balance out the scales again. 

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There may also be some weeks of no new episodes coming up, making the mysterious 8x07 the fall finale.

 

In the TV Line tidbit about the Winter finale it says 8.08 is the fall finale. Originally I would have said 8.09. But if it is indeed only 8, then 8.06 will now air in the Sweeps.

Edited by Nadine
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I had been banking on 8.09 as the fall finale because I really can't imagine "Cool Boys" focusing on Castle and Slaughter as the send-off episode to the hiatus. Unless Slaughter is there to reveal something heretofore unknown about Castle's time away. 

 

It's funny; on tumblr people seem to be predicting a reunion or a pregnancy as the big shift. I'm a bit more wary and think they might shift to Castle's time away at that point. Castlecentric drama, this time, to balance out the scales again. 

 

I agree with this. Sadly it seems we've moved away from the great love story to two backstabbing people who deserve each other.

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I had been banking on 8.09 as the fall finale because I really can't imagine "Cool Boys" focusing on Castle and Slaughter as the send-off episode to the hiatus. Unless Slaughter is there to reveal something heretofore unknown about Castle's time away. 

 

It's funny; on tumblr people seem to be predicting a reunion or a pregnancy as the big shift. I'm a bit more wary and think they might shift to Castle's time away at that point. Castlecentric drama, this time, to balance out the scales again. 

Fans having hopes that come the fall finale they're going to be kissing and making up I believe are way off the mark, it's more likely that events in this episode provide a launching point for yet more secrets to come our that move the story (despite the supposed fun of the cases) into a more serious trajectory once again for 2016.  I wouldn't be at all surprised if their split did drag out for most of the season. 

 

I must say I'm not looking forward to the Slaughter episodes, I disliked Headhunters (which Hawley wrote) and I have no wish to see Baldwin back. 

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I AM sorta excited.

As much as I desire an infinity of Castle episodes, I was not looking forward to continued succession of increasingly implausible Case-of-the-Weeks punctuated by cozy Caskett moments. Looks like the cases will indeed become more implausible—hardly avoidable after 8 years—but Castle and Beckett will have a strained relationship which will exercise their emotions and potential for growth. I hope to see not just petulance but rage, not only uncertainty but real ambivalence, not mere dejection but despair.

Much as I'd like to see some genuine emotional depth and growth to come out of this situation and their exchanges during this period, I somehow doubt we're going to get it. I can't see TPTB going there to really sell the seriousness of their situation when they're busy in interviews playing up just how much fun both of them are continuing to have fooling around solving cases, fans would be getting whiplash with the emotional turnaround. They'll probably fudge it with a few pained looks every so often and the odd plea from Castle to come back. One thing they do seem to want to amp up based on what I've seen to date is the violence and action.  

Edited by verdana
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Promotional stills from PhDead. That center still. Whiplash, indeed.

Yeah that's exactly what I'm talking about, which is why to enjoy this arc I'm going have to pretend 8.02 never happened in a way to make sense of their new (or should I say old?) dynamic. 

 

Here are some more and fans of a sensitive disposition should take care with the first one.

https://twitter.com/a_contrario7/status/649083804586496001

 

https://twitter.com/a_contrario7/status/649082937141514240

Edited by verdana
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At least in The Final Frontier she was hanging out with friends hoping Castle will not see or embarrass her, but now she's willing to go undercover at a party with her dad watching her like a hawk dressed like a Victoria Secret model. Let me guess, Haley will encourage that. If it wasn't for the ending of the last ep, you would thing this is a partial Cuffed redux in those stills.

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At least in The Final Frontier she was hanging out with friends hoping Castle will not see or embarrass her, but now she's willing to go undercover at a party with her dad watching her like a hawk dressed like a Victoria Secret model. Let me guess, Haley will encourage that. If it wasn't for the ending of the last ep, you would thing this is a partial Cuffed redux in those stills.

It's quite a turnaround isn't it from those days. But then she's all grown up now so parading around in panties, lace stockings, slip and angel wings it par for the course. I doubt dad will be watching her like a hawk either, he's probably too busy enjoying himself. Oh yeah her "mentor" will have helped her with that, after all she did teach her about how to manipulate men a few weeks ago.

Edited by verdana
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That center still. Whiplash, indeed.

 

Oh, indeed.  How they make it so it doesn't seem like Beckett is toying with Castle's heart, leaving him one minute and touchy feely the next, will be interesting to see.  Maybe it's part of Castle's game plan to win her back.  Fun as it may be to watch, their issues go far deeper than seducing each other.  That's never been their problem.  

 

As for Alexis, don't see this as too different from that sci fic convention costume.  When Luke dresses her up, he's going either for sexy/slutty costumes, or 40 year old virgin in regular clothes.  And I imagine there are plenty of college girls who dress like that or less at parties.  We're going to see Alexis in just a lacy black bra next, like Beckett, 'cause she's all grown up, you know. ;)

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I would never characterise Castle as dim.  It may not be to everyone's taste when he's goofy or whipped by his women, mother, wife and daughter included, or even the boys, and it can be tiresome when he's always bested by Beckett and Alexis, but he's definitely characterised as a smart guy, and everyone around him knows he's smart.  Castle's always been proud of how smart Beckett and Alexis are, and that's a cool thing about him.

 

I find too many times the audience have to find out things about the characters and have their motivations explained during interviews or in tweets from cast and crew when they should be clearly happening on screen. I wish I had been able to enjoy this great relationship that Beckett has had with Alexis over the years.

 

Beckett and Alexis needed their privacy too! ;)

 

Since assumptions about bts issues are so prevalent, should we also assume bts issues are to blame for lack of Alexis/Beckett screen time? ;)

Edited by madmaverick
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Oh, indeed. How they make it so it doesn't seem like Beckett is toying with Castle's heart, leaving him one minute and touchy feely the next, will be interesting to see. Maybe it's part of Castle's game plan to win her back. Fun as it may be to watch, their issues go far deeper than seducing each other. That's never been their problem.

Agreed they have major issues no question that will require more than another bling bangle (wonder what the engraving would be this time, no more secrets?) and a few enraptured looks to resolve. They've obviously set things up for Castle to persistently chase her in the coming weeks but given she moved out and left HIM out of choice they need to be careful.

When they have these tender looking moments it mustn't come over as if she's giving Castle false hope. I honestly don't see how they can keep this going for more than a few months because how many times can he keep following Kate about asking her to come back and she says no before he looks like a semi stalker? May be they'll be more subtle than that but recreating the WTWT dynamic using a separation like this to do it is fraught with pitfalls. What looks sweet and charming to some fans is unappealing and even insulting to others.

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Maybe it's as simple as Beckett WANTING to stay away from Castle but not being able to. As contrived as this whole situation is, Beckett clearly still loves him, and the break-up isn't meant as a permanent thing on her end.

I guess I'm just in a wait and see mode. I'm not going to go in expecting to hate this story line without giving it a chance at least.

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Maybe it's as simple as Beckett WANTING to stay away from Castle but not being able to. As contrived as this whole situation is, Beckett clearly still loves him, and the break-up isn't meant as a permanent thing on her end.

I guess I'm just in a wait and see mode. I'm not going to go in expecting to hate this story line without giving it a chance at least.

It's a fair point, but I hate the idea that Castle feels like he even has to win her back, like he has done something which requires that course of action. The interviews have all told us it's coming, and it's just something I can't give a chance. It makes no sense to me at all.

 

I completely understand it's the 'easiest' way to resort back to the generic Castle humor episodes between the angst of Beckett chasing the BIG BAD, but both characters deserve to be treated properly. Castle chasing her again (in my opinion) is just....embarrassing.

 

I would rather see him angry and Beckett's mixed signals cause him confusion/hesitation which lend itself to Beckett having to proof herself, over say....the puppy dog doormat attitude of well 'I guess I'll just have to show her again how well we work together on cases'. It's played out, and boring. We've seen it all before.

 

It makes Castle look like an idiot, makes him look like an annoyance to the 12th/cases and he deserves better than that. It also (like Verdana said) can make Beckett look even worse by showing her giving Castle mixed signals to a man she willingly left behind to pursue a case.

 

There's such a balance required to not destroy either character in this scenario, and the writers have never proven they can handle that type of precision.

Edited by Chado
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My thing is that we don't actually KNOW how either character is going to come off yet. We don't know that Castle will look pathetic. I know the writers have been inconsistent in the past, but I'm still willing to see a few episodes of this new dynamic before passing judgment.

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My thing is that we don't actually KNOW how either character is going to come off yet. We don't know that Castle will look pathetic. I know the writers have been inconsistent in the past, but I'm still willing to see a few episodes of this new dynamic before passing judgment.

Castle chasing a person who has left him for her obsession is pathetic by its mere concept in my opinion. The success of that execution is irrelevant.

 

I understand what you're saying, but the implication that Castle needs to win her back is just lunacy. Maybe the actual episodes will be entertaining, but Castle's still going to look pathetic.

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Castle chasing a person who has left him for her obsession is pathetic by its mere concept in my opinion. The success of that execution is irrelevant.

 

I understand what you're saying, but the implication that Castle needs to win her back is just lunacy. Maybe the actual episodes will be entertaining, but Castle's still going to look pathetic.

Castle said it best in an early Season 1 Episode,  No Guy likes getting dumped, I had a girlfriend that cheated on me and I drank my meals for 3 weeks and I didn't even like her, what would it have been if I loved her or words to that effect  WHY would any man chase or want to chase a woman who has left him for justice for a team she worked with less than one year, and throw away the future with the guy who has forgiven her repeatedly.  Espo said it in LinchPin A guy can only take so much but the Show Runners have sent us back to S 3 when Alexi H was still a writer.  They destroyed all the growth on the show especially for Beckett, by the last 5 minutes.  Can any fan trust the Love Beckett has?  How long before the Next Case sends Castle back to #2.  I am done with the show, at least live, I will select the episodes I watch on demand to avoid this trope

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Castle is the latest to adopt the prolonged ABC winter break strategy. It will air its fall finale in November and return in February.

 

I wonder what ABC will put in its slot come February? Because unless the writers can get it together, the fall finale will be the final episode.

Those long hiatuses (hiati?) are a good excuse to try out the new shows. Actually, didn't Castle start as a hiatus fill-in?

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Maybe saying that Castle has to win back Beckett wasn't the best way to put it, and it won't be the first time the showrunners have foot in mouth disease, but I generally don't like to let what they say in interviews influence how I perceive things onscreen.  If people don't like to think of Castle having to win Beckett back, how about thinking of it as him not giving up on her, on them?  Just because she's kind of giving up on their marriage and partnership doesn't mean he'll go down without a fight.  That's not Castle, especially when it comes to Beckett.  And I can think of this 'not giving up on Beckett' as an admirable quality in Castle, in a husband.  Doesn't necessarily make him pathetic or a glutton for punishment.  He loves her so much and his way of showing that is not by giving in to her, not by giving up on them so quickly, so easily.  He's proactively trying to do something to understand and change Beckett's mind; he's not going to take being pushed away without a fight.  Agree that it's all a fine balance in characterisation, and I have to wait and see if they make the right choices in characterisation going forward to keep us rooting for the relationship.

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Actually, didn't Castle start as a hiatus fill-in?

 

Actually, it is common for some shows to premiere mid season, hence the term "mid-season replacement", but yeah, technically those shows tend to air when others fail, although there are exceptions due to an overload of shows and some get pushed back.

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8X04 "WHAT LIES BENEATH - 3 HQ stills

 

Some more stills.

https://twitter.com/irsaju1/status/649295433848750080

 

And back in the interview room together so business as usual? 

https://twitter.com/BecklebeeCastle/status/649296563597131776

 

Obviously Castle is still finding ways to get involved in her cases. 

 

I'm looking forward to seeing that scene with Martha and Beckett together which should be in this one. I expect Martha is there trying to talk some sense into her daughter in law but I expect that advice to fall on deaf ears. 


Fred ‏@FredBC77  24 mins24 minutes ago
#Castle #Titles
Ep801: XY
Ep802: XX
Ep803: PhDead
Ep804: What Lies Beneath
Ep805: The Nose
Ep806: The Last Seduction
Ep807: Mr & Mrs Castle

 

Edited by verdana
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I must admit I'm worried this season will be shades of season 4 all over again with Beckett holding back due to her emotional issues whilst Castle is waiting around for some small sign she's finally ready for them to be together. What I would like to see on her side is that she's taking active steps to resolve her problem and clearly wants to be back with him. I dread seeing Castle being turned into a sad pathetic sack over this. I agree his natural sense of optimism would lead him to go after her which is better than being angry and bitter but there are limits to how far you push that aspect of his personality, because there comes a certain point when a sensible, mature person with any sense of self respect would call it quits.

Edited by verdana
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Maybe saying that Castle has to win back Beckett wasn't the best way to put it, and it won't be the first time the showrunners have foot in mouth disease, but I generally don't like to let what they say in interviews influence how I perceive things onscreen.  If people don't like to think of Castle having to win Beckett back, how about thinking of it as him not giving up on her, on them?  Just because she's kind of giving up on their marriage and partnership doesn't mean he'll go down without a fight.  That's not Castle, especially when it comes to Beckett.  And I can think of this 'not giving up on Beckett' as an admirable quality in Castle, in a husband.  Doesn't necessarily make him pathetic or a glutton for punishment.  He loves her so much and his way of showing that is not by giving in to her, not by giving up on them so quickly, so easily.  He's proactively trying to do something to understand and change Beckett's mind; he's not going to take being pushed away without a fight.  Agree that it's all a fine balance in characterisation, and I have to wait and see if they make the right choices in characterisation going forward to keep us rooting for the relationship.

EXCEPT Castle says he has to win her back in the previews, Again the contrived Angst and stupid reasoning is the final straw for me.  I am sorry to say I am not alone the ratings really hit this week, and that is coming off of a cliff hanger, now we know bet the numbers sink lower next week

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Ask Ausiello: Spoilers on Grey's, Castle, Sleepy Hollow, Supernatural, Nashville, Modern Family, Leftovers and More at TV Line 

 

Question: Anything positive for Castle‘s Caskett fans after this week’s “events”? —Mandy
Ausiello: As dire as things might appear for Rick, Kate and their marriage, you should find more than a little solace in the fact that Episode 7 — airing Nov. 16, during the heart of sweeps — is titled “Mr. & Mrs. Castle.” “It’s going to be a great episode,” co-showrunner Terence Paul Winter told Matt Mitovich. “For the fans who right now are going, ‘What the heck and Terence and Alexi [Hawley] doing?!,’ when they see that episode they’ll understand and see what we’re going for.”

 

So I've got to wait five more episodes to get why they pulled this cheap stunt? Okay. 

 

It's in sweeps so that tells me they're going to sprinkle some prime Caskett goodies in true "organic" fashion but nothing will change in terms of their situation. 

Edited by verdana
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Ask Ausiello: Spoilers on Grey's, Castle, Sleepy Hollow, Supernatural, Nashville, Modern Family, Leftovers and More at TV Line 

 

So I've got to wait five more episodes to get why they pulled this cheap stunt? Okay. 

Ha. That made me laugh, verdana, because that's exactly what I thought.  Oh, we'll know why by episode 7, won't we? Goodness. 

 

I think I'm still a bit broken by the episode. I'm usually much more (quietly)  positive about the show than this. 

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Must. Not. Read. Anything. Else. In. Interviews.  Because it's either going to be a pregnancy announcement or one of them will say it reminds them of the end of "Always."  I would not be able to read that without throwing up a little bit in my mouth, to quote that amazingly horrible movie Dodgeball.

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EXCEPT Castle says he has to win her back in the previews, Again the contrived Angst and stupid reasoning is the final straw for me.  I am sorry to say I am not alone the ratings really hit this week, and that is coming off of a cliff hanger, now we know bet the numbers sink lower next week

Exactly. It isn't even an interview this is coming from. It is Castle's own words in a promo.

 

Their view on relationships is so unhealthy that they somehow think that 1 guy would go through this much (with a history of being cheated on) and yet still try to prove himself to this woman. He already has done that. How can he realistically ever have faith in their relationship and her commitment to sticking around.

 

How about she prove herself to him?

Edited by Chado
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1. I don't think it is just justice for her old team, she feels responsible for their deaths because of what she did and feels a responsibility to avenge them.  And no, she's not in the military, but there is a bond in law enforcement and yes it brings up issues for her, so there she is.  2. As to whether a man would find a damaged/committed woman attractive and a suitable partner for raising a child, lots of spouses of military/police/dedicated public servants want to work through issues, be they the man or the woman on the outside looking in. I give a man on the outside no special treatment over a woman on the outside as being above it all.

 

I'm not in love with their thinking, but here we are and I've thought the first two episodes were good, so here we go.

1. Getting justice for her old team and wanting to avenge them in a legal sense is the same thing, but going rogue to get that result is her issue. If the Bracken data search was part of the fed task force agenda, then she is not responsible just for doing her job. She is a police captain with NYPD resources to only investigate NYC murders, but the DC team member killings are out of her control.  She was offered a security detail, but refused. She is too compulsive at times and refuses to follow law enforcement best practices. I am still not sure that she didn't put some of those bullets in Vulcan Simmons legs before he died. (She only told Castle that he was alive when she left the body shop).

2. Taken out of context. I was speaking to her walking away from her marriage without any explanation or discussion. Would she do the same thing again with children in the home?

Edited by VinceW
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I guess what I was getting at is that there are so many damaged men that are lead characters in so many shows and all anyone wants is for him to be fixed.  Here it is a damaged woman as a co-lead character in this show and all anyone can do is complain about her flaws and damage; and hope the man in her life is okay.

 

Anyway, this is all too heavy for what this show is really about, save for 10-20 episodes in its run, so these musings are likely over the top and irrelevant.  Carry on.

Edited by pennben
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EXCEPT Castle says he has to win her back in the previews, Again the contrived Angst and stupid reasoning is the final straw for me.  I am sorry to say I am not alone the ratings really hit this week, and that is coming off of a cliff hanger, now we know bet the numbers sink lower next week

 

Do we know who he's talking to in the promo? Cause he may be phrasing it that way when it isn't exactly what happens. Right now Castle has in idea what's going on, just that Kate left a few hours after she was so happy to see him in the airport hanger. I think it is reasonable for him to want to talk to her and find out what she's really thinking. They've been very solid until now, and he has to know there's more than what she's telling him. So trying to talk to her and seeing if they can work it out makes sense to me. I think Kate will need to prove herself as being ready to come back before they can fully reconcile though.

 

1. Getting justice for her old team and wanting to avenge them in a legal sense is the same thing, but going rogue to get that result is her issue. If the Bracken data search was part of the fed task force agenda, then she is not responsible just for doing her job.

I don't think the data search about Bracken was part of her work for the Feds. I think she did it on the side once she got access to the server, because she thought she'd find something to use against him that she hadn't had access to. I don't think she was ever assigned to investigate Bracken. But I guess they didn't really say.

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That is the biggest bait post in trying to get someone banned for responding.

 

Not really, I was responding to the post above me (that was responding to something I posted earlier).  I knew what I was saying was serious and not necessarily something part of this show's purpose (and I said that), but it is what I felt, so I said it. 

Edited by pennben
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EXCEPT Castle says he has to win her back in the previews, Again the contrived Angst and stupid reasoning is the final straw for me. I am sorry to say I am not alone the ratings really hit this week, and that is coming off of a cliff hanger, now we know bet the numbers sink lower next week

I don't see them dropping that significantly at least not right now, general viewers will want to come back next week to see how they're coping now the two parter is done and we're back to normal filler. I'd be more interested in seeing how the figures stack up after 8.03 as fans see what the normal episodes are like and go "oh so this is it then" and either carry on watching or shrug and cut Castle from their viewing schedule. Edited by verdana
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 Do we know who he's talking to in the promo? Cause he may be phrasing it that way when it isn't exactly what happens. Right now Castle has in idea what's going on, just that Kate left a few hours after she was so happy to see him in the airport hanger. I think it is reasonable for him to want to talk to her and find out what she's really thinking. They've been very solid until now, and he has to know there's more than what she's telling him. So trying to talk to her and seeing if they can work it out makes sense to me. I think Kate will need to prove herself as being ready to come back before they can fully reconcile though.

I had another look he's in the loft and I'm guessing it must be Martha or may be Alexis, I'd rather it was Martha as I miss Susan. I agree it's reasonable given he really doesn't understand the exact reason for her leaving and he'd want to get to the bottom of things before throwing his hands up in the air. Kate definitely has to prove herself because otherwise any reconciliation is pointless no matter how romantic because unless she can "fix" herself (or whatever you want to call it) it's impossible to imagine their relationship having a "happy ever after" because fundamentally it's flawed and unstable.  I'm not convinced the writers are going to delve too much into that aspect but if what they say is true and they plan to write more character based stuff then I hope I'm proved wrong about that. 

 

Earlier sneak this week. I'll post it on the media thread too. 

Sandra knows best © ‏@Sandraxf  3 hrs3 hours ago

For those outside the US: #Castle 8x03 "PhDead" Sneak Peek #1

 

Edited by verdana
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I really don't see them as two people trying to make it anymore. All I see are two walking talking plot devices devoid of any understandable motivations having their strings pulled by an obvious puppet master. This show is starting to remind me of the old Roadrunner cartoons. Just when Castle thinks he has her he gets run over by a train that comes out of nowhere. But just like good ole Wile E. Coyote, Castle just dusts himself off and gets back to the never ending chase.

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