S05.E04: Livin' La Vida Housewife

[zoeysmom]

I think this is them accepting each other for who they are. Neither of them are much for taking responsibility for things they may have said or done that were hurtful to the other. So, it would make sense that if they truly do want to move on, they have to stop demanding apologies from each other, because it would be an exercise is frustration and futility.

 

Lisa doesn't admit that she is wrong and neither does Kyle. So they have to decide what it is they truly hope to accomplish when dealing with each other. What they truly want to accomplish is for them to move on. Since neither is willing to give, their restaurant makeup session actually makes a great deal of sense to me.

Didn't Lisa apologize for a few misdeeds last reunion to Kyle?  Calling Mauricio an opportunist and a couple of other things.  When asked what she wanted from Kyle Lisa said, "nothing."  So I don't really think Lisa can claim she has a beef with Kyle.  I didn't really see where Kyle did anything earth shattering to Lisa last year.   My beef with Lisa is she claims she doesn't talk about the other women behind their backs-but she does with Ken and in her talking heads.

 

Lisa claims there is no reason to try and work things out in the off season because she wants it on camera.  Lisa shows a certain lack of sincerity to me.   Lisa first love is obviously Vanderpump Rules this show is wardrobe money for Giggy and the maid staff.  

[FozzyBear]

Didn't Lisa apologize for a few misdeeds last reunion to Kyle? Calling Mauricio an opportunist and a couple of other things. When asked what she wanted from Kyle Lisa said, "nothing." So I don't really think Lisa can claim she has a beef with Kyle. I didn't really see where Kyle did anything earth shattering to Lisa last year. My beef with Lisa is she claims she doesn't talk about the other women behind their backs-but she does with Ken and in her talking heads.

Lisa claims there is no reason to try and work things out in the off season because she wants it on camera. Lisa shows a certain lack of sincerity to me. Lisa first love is obviously Vanderpump Rules this show is wardrobe money for Giggy and the maid staff.

She did apologize for a few things at the reunion. Kyle wanted an apology for something Lisa said she didn't do. She still says she didn't do it so she hasn't apologized. They were basically at a stand off with Kyle demanding an apology and Lisa refusing to give one for something she said she didn't do. They really only had two options: let it go and move on or become enemies.

[MatildaMoody]

Didn't Lisa apologize for a few misdeeds last reunion to Kyle?  Calling Mauricio an opportunist and a couple of other things.  When asked what she wanted from Kyle Lisa said, "nothing."  So I don't really think Lisa can claim she has a beef with Kyle.  I didn't really see where Kyle did anything earth shattering to Lisa last year.   My beef with Lisa is she claims she doesn't talk about the other women behind their backs-but she does with Ken and in her talking heads.

That's a tricky one because I think it is expected that a woman would discuss her "friends/frienemies" with her spouse and it not be considered talking behind someone's back as a given. The tricky part is that it's being filmed, so we have to decide whether normal rules of talking to your spouse about what's happening would apply given that its being captured on camera. As for the talking heads, since those are largely created by targeted producer questions and generally happen after filming has completed, it's hard to apply a strict rule of "no talking behind someone's back." This is especially true since we can't be absolutely sure if the talking head that is being shown is actually addressing the scene it's being positioned next to.

 

I do agree that it is disingenuous to pretend that a conversation between husband and wife is a private conversation when it is being filmed, but I also think that is the nature of the reality show beast.

[quinn]

Responding to comments about Kyle in Kyle's thread.

[motorcitymom65]

I have believed the same thing about Lisa V. from the very beginning.  I don't think she has any truly close female friends-- maybe "social" friends, but no deep, abiding relationships.  For ex., Lisa V. claims she and Lisa R have been great friends for years, but she had no idea at all how old Lisa R's daughters are-- she was actually surprised when Lisa R told her.   It is obvious their relationship, while pleasant, is casual.  There is a give and take in real friendships that I don't think Lisa V. can manage for long. Eventually, she needs every friend to become a worshipper,  a project  or both. 

This and more of this all day long.  I don't think that Lisa V and Lisa R are good friends at all.  I think they are gals who have known each other forever (they say 25 years), but in more of a social way. They see each other at events and say "hi". Neither has any reason to dislike the other and that is about it.  As pointed out, Lisa V was surprised to hear the ages of Lisa R's girls, and I would bet everything I have that Lisa V has never met them.  Hardly close friends. 

 

I think that Lisa R and Kyle are better friends. Lisa mentioned in her first blog that the White Party has indeed grown in recent years. She said she could attest to this because she has attended every single party since Kyle started throwing them many years ago.  Since everyone seems to agree the party use to be much smaller with just close friends, it is telling that Lisa R was included from the beginning. 

 

I am fascinated by female friendships and relationships in general, hence my love of the HW shows.  I too have wondered about Lisa V's long-term friendships, mainly with other women.  While she has no issues trotting Mohammed and Martin out all the time, we have never seen her do the same with any women friends. Most of the other gals are seen doing something with a female friend, but not Lisa. Could be that her friends are too smart to want any part of this, but I find it hard to believe that there exists no famewhores in her circle of friends.  

 

The main reason for my curiosity, however, is with regard to all that went down between Lisa and Kyle during the S2 reunion and after. Sure, Kyle had some things to say about Lisa that were probably not easy to hear, but Kyle was telling her the way she sometimes made her feel in their friendship - that Lisa could be manipulative. Lisa acted like this was a friendship killer. She kept saying she still cared about Kyle, but that the friendship had changed after that and it wouldn't be the same. This was very strange to me, if indeed they actually were friends. Some of the harshest truths I have ever heard about myself have come from close girlfriends. They have told me I am loud, can be judgmental, and always think that I am right in every situation - all true - much as I wish they weren't.  I remember the comments in the blogs over the last couple of years. Lisa's supporters would constantly ask why in the world Kyle wanted to be friends with Lisa if she thought such things about her. Later, as per usual, Lisa began to ask the same thing in a couple of her blogs, because Lisa would always eventually use the comments her supporters left in her own narrative when she posted future blogs. I was stunned that this was the way that Lisa thought - that friends apparently liked everything about you. That someone could not be friends with you and care about you if they felt you had qualities and characteristics that they didn't like. What kind of a view of friendship is this? It seems like a view of someone has who doesn't have very many true, honest, long-term friendships. 

[Almost 3000]

I remember an entertainment news show had a segment about Hollywood mom's and it featured Kyle, LisaR and several others I don't remember, who lunched once a month as sort of a loose knit club. It was at the height of the Paris craze but before everything was a reality show but it did have the feel of an idea for a show. So Kyle and LisaR have been hustling and part of each others social circle for awhile.

[izabella]

This was very strange to me, if indeed they actually were friends. Some of the harshest truths I have ever heard about myself have come from close girlfriends.

 

I think the difference is your friends were telling you, and only you, what they felt.  Kyle was saying that Lisa preys on the weak to Taylor, and the stuff she said to Lisa was on television.  It wasn't a private conversation between the two of them.

 

And then the other part of it is that Lisa doesn't want to be friends with someone who thinks she's manipulative and preys on the weak.  That's not a relationship based on trusty and empathy.  That is frenemies, at best.  A person who thinks you're manipulative and prey on the weak is going to always be questioning your motives and every little thing you do and say.  Why bother at that point?

Edited December 15, 2014 by izabella

[motorcitymom65]

I think the difference is your friends were telling you, and only you, what they felt.  Kyle was saying that Lisa preys on the weak to Taylor, and the stuff she said to Lisa was on television.  It wasn't a private conversation between the two of them.

 

And then the other part of it is that Lisa doesn't want to be friends with someone who thinks she's manipulative and preys on the weak.  That's not a relationship based on trusty and empathy.  That is frenemies, at best.  A person who thinks you're manipulative and prey on the weak is going to always be questioning your motives and every little thing you do and say.  Why bother at that point?

True, but all then most of my interactions are done in private, because I haven't decided to show my life on TV.  They have. Lots of conversations and interactions are going to be shown to the world. Lisa got her diagnosis that she had skin cancer on TV, she had her first mammogram on TV, and cameras were around to document Ken's hip replacement. These are all things that to the rest of us are extremely private, but they decided to have a film crew around. That is just the way it goes for them. You cannot only get the good on TV, or the stuff that makes you look sympathetic to the world. Some bad stuff in going to creep in as well.  Lisa never said her issues were with Kyle declaring it to the world, she said her issues were that Kyle felt that way at all.  

[zoeysmom]

I think the difference is your friends were telling you, and only you, what they felt.  Kyle was saying that Lisa preys on the weak to Taylor, and the stuff she said to Lisa was on television.  It wasn't a private conversation between the two of them.

 

And then the other part of it is that Lisa doesn't want to be friends with someone who thinks she's manipulative and preys on the weak.  That's not a relationship based on trusty and empathy.  That is frenemies, at best.  A person who thinks you're manipulative and prey on the weak is going to always be questioning your motives and every little thing you do and say.  Why bother at that point?

I always thought what Kyle was trying to get across to Taylor is to quit making herself so vulnerable.  Taylor seemed to dump all her problems on anyone who would listen and then expect people to treat her as an equal.  Being them marital or financial, Taylor was inviting the other women to place her beneath them as they initially were in successful violence free marriages and financially secure. Taylor, the worst friend in the world, had heard the others' frustration with Lisa and it all had to do with Lisa foisting herself and her dog to the head of the class.  After the first season of the Lisa's clever but biting talking heads and Lisa trying to get to the bottom of the Taylor/Camille conversation the other women were wary of Lisa.

 

I always thought Kyle's Bobby Fisher comment was way too bold and it was the way she felt .  To me it seemed when Kyle's popularity went down the crapper with the outing of Kim's alcoholism, Lisa saw the perfect chance to become the THBIC.   Time to distance herself a bit from Kyle, play up we were the victim's of Cedric card and sign those contracts for a spin-off. She distanced herself from Adrienne and obviously Kim, and next up to bat was Brandi an easily malleable FOH and desperate for security and a permanent role as a RH(something this year Lisa readily admits to, as to Brandi wanting to be included as a RH). 

 

It was a very long honeymoon for Lisa on the RHOBH and then all of sudden the honeymoon was over.  She and  Ken talking about having to teach Kyle a lesson-after she had apologized.  Cozying up to Kim in Paris and smack talking Kyle, the introduction of the SUR staff.  My belief is what Lisa is now trying to undo is the pushing her Vanderpump Rules cast on RHOBH territory-for two seasons.  I think Yolanda and Brandi reacted to Lisa's inclusion of the dipshits of SUR on the RHOBH camera time.   This past week's episode to me is an attempt to rewrite Lisa's history on RHOBH, she was never the carefree, free of conflict Lisa she now wants us to buy.  I am still waiting for the self-deprecating humor from Lisa-the humor that excuses her rude comments to others.

[MatildaMoody]

[snip]

I always thought Kyle's Bobby Fisher comment was way too bold and it was the way she felt .  To me it seemed when Kyle's popularity went down the crapper with the outing of Kim's alcoholism, Lisa saw the perfect chance to become the THBIC.   Time to distance herself a bit from Kyle, play up we were the victim's of Cedric card and sign those contracts for a spin-off. She distanced herself from Adrienne and obviously Kim, and next up to bat was Brandi an easily malleable FOH and desperate for security and a permanent role as a RH(something this year Lisa readily admits to, as to Brandi wanting to be included as a RH). 

[snip]

I think this ignores what actually happened in those first two seasons and their reunions.

 

Lisa was the only person who didn't bail on Kyle after she outed Kim. Lisa defended Kyle in the press and at the reunion. She was never close to Kim. Kim admitted that she barely knew any of these women in her first season - it was why she felt so out of place and uncomfortable when Adrienne took them to the basketball game. None of the women except Adrienne even really tried to get to know Kim in that first and even in the second season. So, there was no distancing herself from Kim, because Lisa barely knew her. She did know Kyle though and defended her as her friend who would never intentionally harm her sister and who was not the bully that Camille was trying to paint her as. 

 

With Adrienne, both women were up front about the fact that even though they were neighbors and knew each other, they were never good friends and had only just started to get to know each other during filming. So, again, there was no distancing until that third season.

 

As for Brandi, Lisa kept her distance from her and only grudgingly interacted with her. The trip to Hawaii was the first time we actually saw Lisa give Brandi a chance and even then, Lisa didn't embrace her as a friend. That second reunion, Brandi made the play for Lisa's friendship because Lisa was completely blindsided by all of the animosity that was coming in her direction from Adrienne, Taylor, and Kyle. Brandi saw a chance to improve her standing and took it. 

 

As for screentime for VPR on RHBH, that isn't Lisa's call. She has an Executive Producer credit on VPR, not RHBH. She has no say in what production does on Beverly Hills. She can only go along or refuse. She doesn't cast or control what is being filmed. If BRAVO wants to cross promote VPR on BH, they will do that, but it isn't Lisa's call whether or not they do or which cast members will be shown. All she can do on BH is manipulate her own image.

Edited December 15, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[zoeysmom]

I think this ignores what actually happened in those first two seasons and their reunions.

 

Lisa was the only person who didn't bail on Kyle after she outed Kim. Lisa defended Kyle in the press and at the reunion. She was never close to Kim. Kim admitted that she barely knew any of these women in her first season - it was why she felt so out of place and uncomfortable when Adrienne took them to the basketball game. None of the women except Adrienne even really tried to get to know Kim in that first and even in the second season. So, there was no distancing herself from Kim, because Lisa barely knew her. She did know Kyle though and defended her as her friend who would never intentionally harm her sister and who was not the bully that Camille was trying to paint her as. 

 

With Adrienne, both women were up front about the fact that even though they were neighbors and knew each other, they were never good friends and had only just started to get to know each other during filming. So, again, there was no distancing until that third season.

 

As for Brandi, Lisa kept her distance from her and only grudgingly interacted with her. The trip to Hawaii was the first time we actually saw Lisa give Brandi a chance and even then, Lisa didn't embrace her as a friend. That second reunion, Brandi made the play for Lisa's friendship because Lisa was completely blindsided by all of the animosity that was coming in her direction from Adrienne, Taylor, and Kyle. Brandi saw a chance to improve her standing and took it. 

 

As for screentime for VPR on RHBH, that isn't Lisa's call. She has an Executive Producer credit on VPR, not RHBH. She has no say in what production does on Beverly Hills. She can only go along or refuse. She doesn't cast or control what is being filmed. If BRAVO wants to cross promote VPR on BH, they will do that, but it isn't Lisa's call whether or not they do or which cast members will be shown. All she can do on BH is manipulate her own image.

No one warmed up to Kim Season 1 or 2 because she was drunk and barely lucid.  Adrienne and Paul were kind but really no one wants to be around a drunk and because of her drinking Kim missed many events.

 

No one bailed on Kyle over outing Kim, not Taylor, Lisa, Adrienne or even Camille.  Lisa, in my opinion saw the opening to be cast favorite and went for it.  Which she has every right to do but there is always collateral damage. 

 

Adrienne and Lisa had a fall out during the second season over the Maloof Hoof, not using The Palms for the bachelorette party.  So they were never close and Lisa enjoyed putting Adrienne down-again in her talking heads.  So there was never a friendship with Lisa and Adrienne.  I don't know how blindsided Lisa was-she openly made fun of Adrienne over the Palms thing, her shoe line, Taylor started in with "why we are mad at Lisa" at her tea and Kyle said something to the effect she was attention hungry.  This all during Season 2.  So blind-sided maybe she didn't expect the others to call her out.

 

Let's just say-Lisa could have said-no to production wanting her  SUR cast filmed on RHOBH. Lisa could have said no to catering the RHOBH Chamber of Commerce party, in fact she said she was doing a favor for Kyle while being there as they normally didn't do that sort of work.   She wanted her cast there and it was offensive to the others.  Production can't just order people from other shows to appear on another project.  Lisa was taking advantage of the cross-over promotion.  I still believe this is why Yolanda got frosty with Lisa-all I recall Lisa saying-"I work, I work," yeah on another show and you can't be bothered to show up for RHOBH events.  I do believe Lisa learned her lesson at the Reunion-the cast does not want the crossover.  Brandi even went so far as to say she did not receive extra compensation for her Vanderpump Rules role that she did it as a favor to Lisa.  When you are THBIC any accepting or declining of any invitation weighs heavy on the event making it to air.  The other one that misses or takes off early is Yolanda.  Nene, RHOA, will tell anyone who wants hear all about it.

[CatMomma]

No one warmed up to Kim Season 1 or 2 because she was drunk and barely lucid.  Adrienne and Paul were kind but really no one wants to be around a drunk and because of her drinking Kim missed many events.

 

No one bailed on Kyle over outing Kim, not Taylor, Lisa, Adrienne or even Camille.  Lisa, in my opinion saw the opening to be cast favorite and went for it.  Which she has every right to do but there is always collateral damage. 

 

Adrienne and Lisa had a fall out during the second season over the Maloof Hoof, not using The Palms for the bachelorette party.  So they were never close and Lisa enjoyed putting Adrienne down-again in her talking heads.  So there was never a friendship with Lisa and Adrienne.  I don't know how blindsided Lisa was-she openly made fun of Adrienne over the Palms thing, her shoe line, Taylor started in with "why we are mad at Lisa" at her tea and Kyle said something to the effect she was attention hungry.  This all during Season 2.  So blind-sided maybe she didn't expect the others to call her out.

 

Let's just say-Lisa could have said-no to production wanting her  SUR cast filmed on RHOBH. Lisa could have said no to catering the RHOBH Chamber of Commerce party, in fact she said she was doing a favor for Kyle while being there as they normally didn't do that sort of work.   She wanted her cast there and it was offensive to the others.  Production can't just order people from other shows to appear on another project.  Lisa was taking advantage of the cross-over promotion.  I still believe this is why Yolanda got frosty with Lisa-all I recall Lisa saying-"I work, I work," yeah on another show and you can't be bothered to show up for RHOBH events.  I do believe Lisa learned her lesson at the Reunion-the cast does not want the crossover.  Brandi even went so far as to say she did not receive extra compensation for her Vanderpump Rules role that she did it as a favor to Lisa.  When you are THBIC any accepting or declining of any invitation weighs heavy on the event making it to air.  The other one that misses or takes off early is Yolanda.  Nene, RHOA, will tell anyone who wants hear all about it.

Taking to Lisa thread

[izabella]

They are living pretty large for such a reasonable net-worth.

 

I agree.  Those net worth figures are really low, if they are correct.  Eileen has been on television for decades.  How can she have so little to show for it?  

[MatildaMoody]

 

Production can't just order people from other shows to appear on another project.  Lisa was taking advantage of the cross-over promotion.  I still believe this is why Yolanda got frosty with Lisa-all I recall Lisa saying-"I work, I work," yeah on another show and you can't be bothered to show up for RHOBH events.

Of course Production can order people from other shows to appear on another project. The people can either agree or not. But, to say that Lisa has a say in who films on Beverly Hills assumes she has way more power than she actually does. And it is entirely possible that the BH cast believes she has more power than she actually does, but that doesn't make it true.

 

Lisa can hand over the cast of VPR all day long and if Production decides they want or don't want to use them on BH, they will. Lisa can agree or not, but she has no say in production for Beverly Hills. Of course the other women want her at their events, if anything they want all of the cast at their events because it will equal screen time, but it doesn't mean that Lisa somehow has more say than any other cast member when it comes to Beverly Hills. 

[WhoaWhoKnew]

I agree. Those net worth figures are really low, if they are correct. Eileen has been on television for decades. How can she have so little to show for it?

Daytime doesn't pay as well as prime time, which is truly a shame considering how much lead daytime actors work.

[WireWrap]

No one warmed up to Kim Season 1 or 2 because she was drunk and barely lucid.  Adrienne and Paul were kind but really no one wants to be around a drunk and because of her drinking Kim missed many events.

 

No one bailed on Kyle over outing Kim, not Taylor, Lisa, Adrienne or even Camille.  Lisa, in my opinion saw the opening to be cast favorite and went for it.  Which she has every right to do but there is always collateral damage. 

 

Adrienne and Lisa had a fall out during the second season over the Maloof Hoof, not using The Palms for the bachelorette party.  So they were never close and Lisa enjoyed putting Adrienne down-again in her talking heads.  So there was never a friendship with Lisa and Adrienne.  I don't know how blindsided Lisa was-she openly made fun of Adrienne over the Palms thing, her shoe line, Taylor started in with "why we are mad at Lisa" at her tea and Kyle said something to the effect she was attention hungry.  This all during Season 2.  So blind-sided maybe she didn't expect the others to call her out.

 

Let's just say-Lisa could have said-no to production wanting her  SUR cast filmed on RHOBH. Lisa could have said no to catering the RHOBH Chamber of Commerce party, in fact she said she was doing a favor for Kyle while being there as they normally didn't do that sort of work.   She wanted her cast there and it was offensive to the others.  Production can't just order people from other shows to appear on another project.  Lisa was taking advantage of the cross-over promotion.  I still believe this is why Yolanda got frosty with Lisa-all I recall Lisa saying-"I work, I work," yeah on another show and you can't be bothered to show up for RHOBH events.  I do believe Lisa learned her lesson at the Reunion-the cast does not want the crossover.  Brandi even went so far as to say she did not receive extra compensation for her Vanderpump Rules role that she did it as a favor to Lisa.  When you are THBIC any accepting or declining of any invitation weighs heavy on the event making it to air.  The other one that misses or takes off early is Yolanda.  Nene, RHOA, will tell anyone who wants hear all about it.

Brandi was never on VPR, not even once, so she would not, should not, have expected a paycheck from that show. What Brandi did was agree to help cross promote that show with the Scheana met up which happened on the BH show. She was paid for that in 2 ways, 1, she got a paycheck for the episode and 2, she got fan support for appearing to be the better person and putting the cheating behind her (which we now know was a lie).

 

As for Yolanda's little paint party, we know that Yolanda allowed the producers to handle the invites and arrange all the cars/limos for those that were attending. No limo was ever sent to Lisa's because they knew she could not attend due to a meeting with council members for permits needed for PUMP, a meeting that would have been scheduled way in advance. Now the question becomes, did Yolanda know Lisa would not be there, did the producers fill her in or omit that info for added drama. IMO, Yolanda knows how this works and she knew Lisa would not be there well before Lisa called, she was not surprised to get that call from Lisa at all.

 

IMO, both Lisa and Taylor already had opinions about Kim because of what Kyle told them off camera. Both of these women have said that Kim has been a worry for Kyle most of their adult lives and the only way they would know that is if Kyle filled them in on Kim's alcoholism/drug addictions.

[motorcitymom65]

Of course Production can order people from other shows to appear on another project. The people can either agree or not. But, to say that Lisa has a say in who films on Beverly Hills assumes she has way more power than she actually does. And it is entirely possible that the BH cast believes she has more power than she actually does, but that doesn't make it true.

 

Lisa can hand over the cast of VPR all day long and if Production decides they want or don't want to use them on BH, they will. Lisa can agree or not, but she has no say in production for Beverly Hills. Of course the other women want her at their events, if anything they want all of the cast at their events because it will equal screen time, but it doesn't mean that Lisa somehow has more say than any other cast member when it comes to Beverly Hills.

Maybe we will never know the answer to this, but I just think that Lisa does have more say on the BH show than the other gals do. Andy has never denied that some gals carry more sway, depending on how much they are necessary. He talks in his book about Ramona calling about a planned cameo by Jill in S5. He said she was pissed and said others were as well and so he decided to drop Jill.

I will always believe this is at the heart of the matter with regard to how the ladies really feel about Lisa. They know that she is simply more valuable to the network than the rest of them are. They not only have her starring in this show, but headlining a second one. I have heard that the VPR show is a cash cow for Bravo - more than any of the other shows because they basically pay the cast next to nothing (compared to the salaries on the other shows). Bravo is going to want to keep Lisa happy as long as they want to keep her around. Of course once they decide they don't need her things will be different. For now, I certainly believe she has the ability to tell the folks on the BH show that she doesn't want a server who works for her to work that particular event. She can hide behind production all she wants, but at the end of the day, she is production.

[MatildaMoody]

Maybe we will never know the answer to this, but I just think that Lisa does have more say on the BH show than the other gals do. Andy has never denied that some gals carry more sway, depending on how much they are necessary. He talks in his book about Ramona calling about a planned cameo by Jill in S5. He said she was pissed and said others were as well and so he decided to drop Jill.

I will always believe this is at the heart of the matter with regard to how the ladies really feel about Lisa. They know that she is simply more valuable to the network than the rest of them are. They not only have her starring in this show, but headlining a second one. I have heard that the VPR show is a cash cow for Bravo - more than any of the other shows because they basically pay the cast next to nothing (compared to the salaries on the other shows). Bravo is going to want to keep Lisa happy as long as they want to keep her around. Of course once they decide they don't need her things will be different. For now, I certainly believe she has the ability to tell the folks on the BH show that she doesn't want a server who works for her to work that particular event. She can hide behind production all she wants, but at the end of the day, she is production.

Andy described that Jill thing as him looking at a cast mutiny and therefore he dropped the Jill cameo. That doesn't suggest that Ramona had enough pull to prevent Jill from coming on the show. That only suggests that Andy didn't want the headache that would come with Jill.

 

And I will agree to disagree with Lisa being production, since we have absolutely no evidence of that. And also because we know that it would just be bad business for production to let one cast member control production. They learned that lesson with Jill back in the day. If Lisa is production, I doubt the entire argument about whether or not Lisa told Brandi to pack the magazines would have even made it to air. Most of the things in which Lisa looked bad to the audience last season most likely would have never played out. Very little of last season fits with the idea that Lisa is production while hiding behind them.

Edited December 16, 2014 by MatildaMoody

[zoeysmom]

Maybe we will never know the answer to this, but I just think that Lisa does have more say on the BH show than the other gals do. Andy has never denied that some gals carry more sway, depending on how much they are necessary. He talks in his book about Ramona calling about a planned cameo by Jill in S5. He said she was pissed and said others were as well and so he decided to drop Jill.

I will always believe this is at the heart of the matter with regard to how the ladies really feel about Lisa. They know that she is simply more valuable to the network than the rest of them are. They not only have her starring in this show, but headlining a second one. I have heard that the VPR show is a cash cow for Bravo - more than any of the other shows because they basically pay the cast next to nothing (compared to the salaries on the other shows). Bravo is going to want to keep Lisa happy as long as they want to keep her around. Of course once they decide they don't need her things will be different. For now, I certainly believe she has the ability to tell the folks on the BH show that she doesn't want a server who works for her to work that particular event. She can hide behind production all she wants, but at the end of the day, she is production.

I don't think it is logical to think Lisa is able to be a producer on one show and that she slides into a talent slot on the other with the same production company. Lisa was filming both shows at the same time last season-this year not so much. Since these shows don't work from a verbatim script any of the talent can behave any way they see fit.  Thanks for the tidbit about Jill  always wondered why we hadn't seen her mug.  I guess Ramona trumps the Countess in RHONY land. 

 

Brandi was never on VPR, not even once, so she would not, should not, have expected a paycheck from that show. What Brandi did was agree to help cross promote that show with the Scheana met up which happened on the BH show. She was paid for that in 2 ways, 1, she got a paycheck for the episode and 2, she got fan support for appearing to be the better person and putting the cheating behind her (which we now know was a lie).

 

As for Yolanda's little paint party, we know that Yolanda allowed the producers to handle the invites and arrange all the cars/limos for those that were attending. No limo was ever sent to Lisa's because they knew she could not attend due to a meeting with council members for permits needed for PUMP, a meeting that would have been scheduled way in advance. Now the question becomes, did Yolanda know Lisa would not be there, did the producers fill her in or omit that info for added drama. IMO, Yolanda knows how this works and she knew Lisa would not be there well before Lisa called, she was not surprised to get that call from Lisa at all.

 

IMO, both Lisa and Taylor already had opinions about Kim because of what Kyle told them off camera. Both of these women have said that Kim has been a worry for Kyle most of their adult lives and the only way they would know that is if Kyle filled them in on Kim's alcoholism/drug addictions.

Brandi's IMDB clearly states she was on Vanderpump Rules it was the first scene of the opening episode-so I can see where it may have been unclear. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm4541706/  On RHOBH Lisa asked her to talk to Scheana but the conversation occurred on Vanderpump Rules. I agree Brandi should not have been paid for the crossover but that is not how Brandi feels.

 

Here is what I don't understand about Yolanda's party-why not have it two hours later or in the morning or the next day.  Again there was Brandi with her two cents saying Lisa said she didn't want to drive all the way out to Malibu.  I have lost all ability to decipher Yolanda and her inability to understand production.  I do believe Carlton was called off of Yolanda's dinner party as well by production to isolate Joyce and Kyle.

 

I disagree about Kyle being the solo source of others knowing about Kim's drinking problems-the women were around her she was drunk and her reputation proceeded her in LA circles. Kyle made excuses and then she couldn't for Kim absences during filming.  Kim was drunk in NY, drunk in Las Vegas, drunk at the "Dinner From Hell" and drunk at the finale.  Just because Kim wasn't willing to talk about her Season 1 behavior it did not go without notice to the other RH and crew.  I do believe the intention for Kim being cast were all good.  I think she and her family erroneously believed that she would fall in line for the production schedule. There may have been a bit of a blind eye to the extent of Kim's drinking.

[Almost 3000]

I was on Kyle's side at least sympathetically during the limo outing of Kim. We as the audience had been seeing Kim's "problem" even though the storyboard presented it as at most the elephant in the room and the cast seemed to go along with it for Kyle and Kim's sake. Kyle had been living the stress of Kim's choices for years and fixing as best she could to the point she felt Maurico had the obligation of a second wife. Kyle wanted this show and the fame and opportunities it might bring her and she thought Kim could benefit in the same way. Kyle saw Kim blowing her chances all season long and the stress of that must have been overwhelming and we saw the result of that in the limo. She finally lost it along with the hopes she had for Kim's future and of course whatever feelings she had that Kim had failed her in Kyle's sincere attempt to help. all that bitterness and resentment spilled out and perhaps on some level Kyle hoped that putting a mirror up to Kim would force Kim to get help. It was real and raw.

[MatildaMoody]

I was on Kyle's side at least sympathetically during the limo outing of Kim. We as the audience had been seeing Kim's "problem" even though the storyboard presented it as at most the elephant in the room and the cast seemed to go along with it for Kyle and Kim's sake. Kyle had been living the stress of Kim's choices for years and fixing as best she could to the point she felt Maurico had the obligation of a second wife. Kyle wanted this show and the fame and opportunities it might bring her and she thought Kim could benefit in the same way. Kyle saw Kim blowing her chances all season long and the stress of that must have been overwhelming and we saw the result of that in the limo. She finally lost it along with the hopes she had for Kim's future and of course whatever feelings she had that Kim had failed her in Kyle's sincere attempt to help. all that bitterness and resentment spilled out and perhaps on some level Kyle hoped that putting a mirror up to Kim would force Kim to get help. It was real and raw.

This is interesting to me because I was totally shocked by Kyle's outburst. Watching that whole season the first time around, I saw absolutely nothing that pointed to Kim being an alcoholic. There were no knowing looks as all of the women sipped champagne on Adrienne's plane on the way to the basketball game. There were no awkward moments at the many wine filled dinners. 

 

When Kyle outed Kim in the limo, I replayed the season in my head and couldn't point to a single moment where her alcoholism was the elephant in the room. The whole thing came out of left field for me. And I thought it was obvious that producers had no intention of outing Kim because they hadn't done anything to give the audience an inkling that there was anything other than Kim having anxiety issues all season. While the producers ran with the accusation and season 2 very obviously showed that Kim had some major addiction issues, I saw nothing that pointed to it in season 1 prior to Kyle saying it in the limo fight. In hindsight, I can go back to season 1 and see some subtle signs, but as it was playing out, I saw nothing that pointed to story boarding Kim's alcoholism as part of the show.

[Almost 3000]

This is interesting to me because I was totally shocked by Kyle's outburst. Watching that whole season the first time around, I saw absolutely nothing that pointed to Kim being an alcoholic. There were no knowing looks as all of the women sipped champagne on Adrienne's plane on the way to the basketball game. There were no awkward moments at the many wine filled dinners. 

 

When Kyle outed Kim in the limo, I replayed the season in my head and couldn't point to a single moment where her alcoholism was the elephant in the room. The whole thing came out of left field for me. And I thought it was obvious that producers had no intention of outing Kim because they hadn't done anything to give the audience an inkling that there was anything other than Kim having anxiety issues all season. While the producers ran with the accusation and season 2 very obviously showed that Kim had some major addiction issues, I saw nothing that pointed to it in season 1 prior to Kyle saying it in the limo fight. In hindsight, I can go back to season 1 and see some subtle signs, but as it was playing out, I saw nothing that pointed to story boarding Kim's alcoholism as part of the show.

There may have been blog items at the time and Kim did no shows and was late and the cast seemed to politely ignore it but wherever I got the feeling Kim had problems I wasn't blind sided by the limo scene. Its been awhile so I can't pin point where I knew there were problems with Kim came from but part of it was from Kim's behavior on the show.

[motorcitymom65]

There may have been blog items at the time and Kim did no shows and was late and the cast seemed to politely ignore it but wherever I got the feeling Kim had problems I wasn't blind sided by the limo scene. Its been awhile so I can't pin point where I knew there were problems with Kim came from but part of it was from Kim's behavior on the show.

I had no idea what Kim's issues were in S1, but there was so much tension between her and Kyle, that it was clear there was something deep and ugly at the core. I remember not being at all shocked to hear it was alcoholism, but of course was shocked at the way the reveal happened. To me it still remains the most raw moment on Reality TV. I never blamed Kyle for it, because it was clear that it came from years of pain and hurt feelings, and was fueled by anger and too much alcohol on that particular night. Kyle has never tried to pretend it was an "ok" thing to do, and she never defended it. She said it was horrible and that she regretted saying it immediately. Andy said years ago that Kyle begged them not to air it because of Kim's kids.  

[quinn]

I think that Kyle was all kinds of wrong for her actions in the limo, but at the same time I knew within the first few episodes that Kim had substance and mental issues and that Kyle was her caretaker. Kyle mentioning that she was asked to look after her older sibling, Kim disappearing at Mohammed's dinner party, having to be driven home by Martin, and other comments by Kyle, Lisa and even Kim herself.

Also outside of the show itself, she was inebriated at the premiere party, filmed inebriated in an airport terminal (I think that came out while the season was airing) and behaved oddly on an episode of WWHL that served as an introduction to the BH franchise and its cast.

Edited December 16, 2014 by quinn

[MatildaMoody]

I remember there being strange tensions between Kyle and Kim. I thought it was odd that Kyle would so quickly go to bat for Taylor over her own sister. I also remember that Kyle and Kim had each on separate occasions said something about their mother wanting them to look after the other. I also remember Kyle being very impatient with Kim's anxiety when hanging out with all of the women at different events. 

 

But, BRAVO was never pointing to it having anything to do with any kind of addiction on Kim's part. If anything, it was as though they were trying to play on the rivalry of the child star versus the not so famous child actor - ala Baby Jane, rather than it pointing to some type of addiction.

Honestly, Kyle seemed much more drunk than Kim did in the limo scene. So, while the revelation of Kim being an alcoholic probably made sense to people who knew more about Kim's life and career, it totally came out of left field for me. My only knowledge of Kim had been the show - I was too young to know any of her Disney work. 

 

But the thing that stood out most to me in that scene was how it never had to get to that point. Taylor started drama with Kim. Kim tried to leave the party and the fight. Kyle involved herself on Taylor's behalf (again, I thought it was very weird the way Kyle would attack her own sister in order to defend Taylor's BS), and even as Kim is trying to leave and Adrienne is trying to intervene, Kyle just kept going and even got physically aggressive.

 

So, sure Kyle may have had a bunch of pent up stuff she was holding in against Kim, but I can't sympathize with her on the way she handled it because it was Taylor's shenanigans that instigated it. 

[tulip555]

I think that Kyle was all kinds of wrong for her actions in the limo, but at the same time I knew within the first few episodes that Kim had substance and mental issues and that Kyle was her caretaker. Kyle mentioning that she was asked to look after her older sibling, Kim disappearing at Mohammed's dinner party, having to be driven home by Martin, and other comments by Kyle, Lisa and even Kim herself.

Also outside of the show itself, she was inebriated at the premiere party, filmed inebriated in an airport terminal (I think that came out while the season was airing) and behaved oddly on an episode of WWHL that served as an introduction to the BH franchise and its cast.

She quite often just looked drunk to me.  Is she supposed to be sober now?  IMO, I don't think she really will ever be sober...in fact, I'm surprised she hasn't died as her liver must not be in good condition, to say the least....and I think alcohol is/was not the only substance involved

[motorcitymom65]

I remember there being strange tensions between Kyle and Kim. I thought it was odd that Kyle would so quickly go to bat for Taylor over her own sister. I also remember that Kyle and Kim had each on separate occasions said something about their mother wanting them to look after the other. I also remember Kyle being very impatient with Kim's anxiety when hanging out with all of the women at different events. 

 

But, BRAVO was never pointing to it having anything to do with any kind of addiction on Kim's part. If anything, it was as though they were trying to play on the rivalry of the child star versus the not so famous child actor - ala Baby Jane, rather than it pointing to some type of addiction.

Honestly, Kyle seemed much more drunk than Kim did in the limo scene. So, while the revelation of Kim being an alcoholic probably made sense to people who knew more about Kim's life and career, it totally came out of left field for me. My only knowledge of Kim had been the show - I was too young to know any of her Disney work. 

 

But the thing that stood out most to me in that scene was how it never had to get to that point. Taylor started drama with Kim. Kim tried to leave the party and the fight. Kyle involved herself on Taylor's behalf (again, I thought it was very weird the way Kyle would attack her own sister in order to defend Taylor's BS), and even as Kim is trying to leave and Adrienne is trying to intervene, Kyle just kept going and even got physically aggressive.

 

So, sure Kyle may have had a bunch of pent up stuff she was holding in against Kim, but I can't sympathize with her on the way she handled it because it was Taylor's shenanigans that instigated it. 

I cannot totally remember what led up to the limo scene.  For some reason that episode wasn't interesting to me until it suddenly got interesting.  

 

Wasn't Taylor reluctant to confront Kim? I don't recall it clearly, but in my head it seems like Lisa was kind of prodding Taylor to get into it with Kim.  

[zoeysmom]

I cannot totally remember what led up to the limo scene.  For some reason that episode wasn't interesting to me until it suddenly got interesting.  

 

Wasn't Taylor reluctant to confront Kim? I don't recall it clearly, but in my head it seems like Lisa was kind of prodding Taylor to get into it with Kim.  

What had happened is Kim was late and buzzed, she came over to the women and said she really didn't care for any of them and then paused and corrected herself as to Adrienne.  She and Taylor had words over Kim not defending Kyle in NY and Kim suggested Taylor leave and Taylor reminded Kim it was her party.  So there they were at the end of the season and wanting to take the one last photo (a practice that has since vanished) and Kim left with Adrienne in tow.  Adrienne, Martin and Kim apparently drove around a bit and Kyle came down to retrieve Kim and Adrienne and then the "what are you doing?" conversation started. Kim started by calling Kyle a phony and it went downhill from there.  It was not a good look for the Richards sisters.

[tabloidlover]

Daytime doesn't pay as well as prime time, which is truly a shame considering how much lead daytime actors work.

I am just flabbergasted that it would pay that little for the number of pages of dialogue she claims to have to memorize each night.  NO way would that be worth it, unless the paycheck was BIG...  Something tells me they spend beyond their means - that house looked pretty expensive even without the zip code of Malibu.  And she did admit that they started to bicker and have money trouble when she stopped working.  Very interesting - hope we hear more on this later.

[Found A Peanut]

It was Lisa that prodded Taylor to go "sort things out" with Kim. I think Lisa knew Kim was probably fueled up, too, or at least knew that Kyle was afraid she was. Kyle was uptight about Kim being late, iirc. Also, I think it was Lisa who seemed offended when Kim announced she didn't like anybody, causing Kim to do a quick backtrack and make an exception.

[long beach lisa]

1 shot for any mention of "going away to college"

2 shots for quavery voice while saying "going away to college"

3 shots for tears and quavery voice while saying "going away to college"

 

Extra shot for if the words "leaving me" happen during the going away to college conversation

Extra shot for mentioning how quickly he/she has grown up or lamenting at how fast the time has gone by

Extra shot for any scene involving shopping or packing for college

It just hit me that maybe these dingbats go so overboard nuts because one of their spawn actually chooses to attempt higher education. It seems on TV that the wealthier skanks -- Paris Hilton, all the Kartrashians, etc. -- don't ever bother with that kind of nonsense!

[Almost 3000]

It just hit me that maybe these dingbats go so overboard nuts because one of their spawn actually chooses to attempt higher education. It seems on TV that the wealthier skanks -- Paris Hilton, all the Kartrashians, etc. -- don't ever bother with that kind of nonsense!

And quite possibly the end of child support checks.

[long beach lisa]

I'm not sure what to make of Vince.  Haven't seen enough of him.  Got a douchey vibe tho.  Sheesh, he's really not caring much bout his looks these days, eh?  Guess he's given up on haircuts, working out & decent clothes -- or even shoes?  OK, so Vince looks kinda shitty now, but it makes me wonder why.  Hmmm, give him a haircut, a few months with a trainer & some nice clothes, I bet he'd look great.  So why'd Vince let himself go & is Eileen steppin' out on him cuz he ain't the looker she married?

I used to lust after VVP decades ago, but seeing him made remember that we all age -- some better than others, but time doesn't stop for anyone. He looks awful (relatively). I haven't watched a soap since "Another World" in college (used to frequent the coffee shop across from the NBC studio in Brooklyn, where they all ate -- good times), so my expectations of the new gal are pretty low. So far, she ain't bringin' it. And LIsa Rinna, whom I used to like, is super loud and trying way too hard, especially with (my aforementioned disdain for) her 25+-year-old hair don't. Don't like the new gals or the new "direction." The VanderPukes can leave anytime. People should be ashamed to pamper a pooch like that -- it makes them look vapid and desperate, not wealthy.

[long beach lisa]

Really, I'm not a Yolanda apologist, and I laugh at her as much as anyone does, especially some of her, uh, memories; but I found a number of her modeling shots, some unintentionally hilarious, just by Googling her (she's #5 on the list).  She may not have enjoyed true supermodel status and income, but she did work and probably made decent money.  It seemed like everyone with whom I went to junior high and high school (but me) had modeling portfolios, and a couple of them were signed by Ford.  There's money to be made in catalog and runway work and lots of other legitimate modeling jobs that aren't the cover of Cosmo or whatever.

Wow! She's stunning now, but as a young model Yo was unbelievably beautiful! I guess a PP was right when it was mentioned that a blank expression will keep one from supermodel status. Her girls, although wildly pretty, have nowhere near the looks their mother had.

[Almost 3000]

Wow! She's stunning now, but as a young model Yo was unbelievably beautiful! I guess a PP was right when it was mentioned that a blank expression will keep one from supermodel status. Her girls, although wildly pretty, have nowhere near the looks their mother had.

Keep going to the end and LisaV is in a music video putting on lipstick like its her job.

[ghoulina]

LOL, thanks for that link. Pretty interesting/funny. I have to say, Brandi looks like a corpse in her photos. Was she a model just because she is tall? I will admit that my modeling knowledge comes from watching ANTM, but she just looks so lifeless and dull to me. 

[Satchels of gold]

 

When Kyle outed Kim in the limo, I replayed the season in my head and couldn't point to a single moment where her alcoholism was the elephant in the room. The whole thing came out of left field for me. And I thought it was obvious that producers had no intention of outing Kim because they hadn't done anything to give the audience an inkling that there was anything other than Kim having anxiety issues all season. While the producers ran with the accusation and season 2 very obviously showed that Kim had some major addiction issues, I saw nothing that pointed to it in season 1 prior to Kyle saying it in the limo fight. In hindsight, I can go back to season 1 and see some subtle signs, but as it was playing out, I saw nothing that pointed to story boarding Kim's alcoholism as part of the show.

There may have been blog items at the time and Kim did no shows and was late and the cast seemed to politely ignore it but wherever I got the feeling Kim had problems I wasn't blind sided by the limo scene. Its been awhile so I can't pin point where I knew there were problems with Kim came from but part of it was from Kim's behavior on the show.

I knew there was a problem when Kim refused/was unable to back Kyle during the Camille fight in NYC. Kim's only response was "I get nervous". But then again I have dealt with alcoholics all my life so my radar is honed.

[ub40fan]

I know there are people like Kyle and myself out there...lifelong "caretakers" of our alcoholic siblings. I don't want to sound like a real bitch, but walk a mile in our shoes. If you haven't lived it you have no idea.

[Meli]

Actually my dad and his siblings went to school with Kim. Oddly enough none of them knew that she was a celeb. They also remember her sis Kyle who graduated from central union high school in 1987.