TCM: The Greatest Movie Channel

[prican58]

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/05/02/what-the-hays-code-did-for-women

Haven't read it yet but it sounds good.

[elle]

On 5/6/2016 at 7:00 AM, henrysmom said:

http://www.eonline.com/news/762594/jessica-lange-susan-sarandon-to-star-in-ryan-murphy-s-feud-as-hollywood-icons-joan-crawford-and-bette-davis

Was Faye Dunaway unavailable?

Changing topics.....To Catch a Thief - love the movie, love the location shots and the clothes.  Question, since all the paroles were connected to one another and if one of the group broke their parole, ALL would have their paroles revoked; why would Bertani take such a risk to frame Robie?  If he is successful, Robie goes to jail and so do all the rest, if he fails, the results are the same, everyone goes to jail.  Is this explained better in the book?

[bmoore4026]

Well, I'm an insomniac and tonight on TCM's Underground program, they were featuring some of David Lynch's early short films.

Not much of a Lynch fan.  Eraserhead made me sick but I enjoyed The Elephant Man.

Of the short films, the one about the six guys throwing up annoyed me, the one with the alphabet freaked me out, and the one about the grandmother I thought was strangely sweet in a dark way and a bit sad.

So, what are your views on David Lynch?

[BooksRule]

Quote

So, what are your views on David Lynch?

I loved the atmosphere of 'The Elephant Man', the visual look of 'Dune' and the early episodes of 'Twin Peaks', but that's about all the David Lynch I could take.  

[Rinaldo]

I saw this via DVD, but I see on tcm.com that they've shown it (as I would expect), and this topic undoubtedly contains the most knowledgeable and eloquent bunch to discuss it, so:

I just saw The Fallen Idol for the first time. As I've said in this topic several times before, I admire Carol Reed as a director enormously and think he should be routinely listed among the top masters of the medium. This 1948 film (screenplay by Graham Greene, adapting his own story) only reinforces that opinion. What an achievement! -- capturing the limited point of view of a young boy in a limited geographical area (mostly inside an embassy) in the course of 3 days, and letting us experience his loneliness, his inability to fully understand the adults around him even as he lurks on the edge of their conversations, his wish to be of help to Baines, the butler who is his main source of kindness and consideration, without knowing quite how. It's suspenseful, angering, heartbreaking by turns. Helped tremendously by Bobby Henrey as the boy Phile (Reed had a special touch with children, see also Oliver!) and especially Ralph Richardson as Baines. (And Sonia Dresdel as the hateful Mrs. Baines, and an unexpected cameo by Dora Bryan as a streetwalker.) It's new to me, and maybe I'm tempted to over-praise it. But I think it really deserves it. What do others think?

[prican58]

4 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

I saw this via DVD, but I see on tcm.com that they've shown it (as I would expect), and this topic undoubtedly contains the most knowledgeable and eloquent bunch to discuss it, so:

I just saw The Fallen Idol for the first time. As I've said in this topic several times before, I admire Carol Reed as a director enormously and think he should be routinely listed among the top masters of the medium. This 1948 film (screenplay by Graham Greene, adapting his own story) only reinforces that opinion. What an achievement! -- capturing the limited point of view of a young boy in a limited geographical area (mostly inside an embassy) in the course of 3 days, and letting us experience his loneliness, his inability to fully understand the adults around him even as he lurks on the edge of their conversations, his wish to be of help to Baines, the butler who is his main source of kindness and consideration, without knowing quite how. It's suspenseful, angering, heartbreaking by turns. Helped tremendously by Bobby Henrey as the boy Phile (Reed had a special touch with children, see also Oliver!) and especially Ralph Richardson as Baines. (And Sonia Dresdel as the hateful Mrs. Baines, and an unexpected cameo by Dora Bryan as a streetwalker.) It's new to me, and maybe I'm tempted to over-praise it. But I think it really deserves it. What do others think?

I have seen it 2 times and I have to agree. Ralph Richardson is my favorite of the knighted Shakespearean actors of that era. I understand he was a bit of a live wire and I always feel an undercurrent of something wild in his performances.  

[wilsie]

I miss Robert Osbourne and I hope he is doing well. 

[ratgirlagogo]

On 5/9/2016 at 1:10 PM, Rinaldo said:

) It's new to me, and maybe I'm tempted to over-praise it. But I think it really deserves it. What do others think?

I agree that it's a great film and I don't think you've overpraised it at all.  For some reason Carol Reed is just one of those directors that isn't remembered as well as some other English directors of the period, aside from The Third Man of course.  I have no idea why.

[elle]

We were talking about Rita Moreno up thread.  She is in the new Target commercial with some other lovely ladies.  I am biased, no surprise here, I think she is the most vibrant and wish that I could look as good as she does now! much less when I am her age (84)!  She is also on Jane the Virgin as the grandmother of the titular character.  She really does meet her character's preferred name as "Glamma".

[Padma]

I'd forgotten how convincing Cary Grant was in "Suspicion" as a...loving husband? scheming murderer? There were scenes where, handsome as ever and without saying anything, his face looks subtly sinister, like he could have easily been a Ted Bundy-type--a good-looking, deceptively "nice", sociopath. Good acting there in the type of role he didn't often get. I was surprised accd to B Mankiewicz he vowed never to work with Hitchcock again after that film--and did hold out for five years until Notorious. As for Hitchcock, he called Grant, "The only actor I've ever loved in my whole life", so I guess they worked it out.  

Don't we have spoiler tags anymore? Anyway, spoiler tagged below, though it shows up differently:

 

In a way, it's too bad the studio wouldn't let them keep the original ending of Francis Iles' novel, Before the Fact (although there's some dispute over whether Hitchcock was also on board with the completely altered ending). One ending they had suggested in the spirit of the book--where she drinks the milk he gives her, knowing its poisoned, but has him mail a letter to her mother telling her she's been poisoned, but she loves Johnny too much to care--seems more interesting and plausible given the characters than the abrupt "car turnaround" happy ending with him really having been a good guy, if a gambler, all along. I mean, it's Cary Grant and Joan Fontaine, so I wanted a happy ending for them, too, but the car scene just seemed much too abrupt to me.

Edited May 12, 2016 by Padma

[wilsie]

I've watched "Suspicion" so many times and it's one of my favorite Joan Fontaine movies.  I love Cary Grant, so it's harder to pick a favorite of his, but this is certainly up there showing how good an actor he was. Padma, I'm glad they went with this ending.   The alternate is more interesting and plausible but I really did want a happier ending.  Does  anyone else think Joan Fontaine and Olivia de Havilland resemble each other, or is it just me?  I've known they were sisters for many years but I've just started to notice this. 

[Rinaldo]

I'm about to confess that I've never been able to enjoy Suspicion the others clearly do. I've enjoyed Joan Fontaine in other movies but here her acting just feels false and overwrought to me, and the plot resolution makes the whole thing vaguely pointless and unsatisfying. My last viewing of it was years ago though, so I suppose I owe it another chance.

[Bastet]

I find the ending really out of place and quite a letdown, so I always figured it was an alteration of the source material.  They did that so much back then when adapting stories into films, plugging happy endings in where they did not belong.

[Julia]

1 hour ago, Padma said:

I'd forgotten how convincing Cary Grant was in "Suspicion" as a...loving husband? scheming murderer? There were scenes where, handsome as ever and without saying anything, his face looks subtly sinister, like he could have easily been a Ted Bundy-type--a good-looking, deceptively "nice", sociopath. Good acting there in the type of role he didn't often get. I was surprised accd to B Mankiewicz he vowed never to work with Hitchcock again after that film--and did hold out for five years until Notorious. As for Hitchcock, he called Grant, "The only actor I've ever loved in my whole life", so I guess they worked it out.  

Don't we have spoiler tags anymore? Anyway, spoiler tagged below, though it shows up differently:

  Hide contents

In a way, it's too bad the studio wouldn't let them keep the original ending of Francis Iles' novel, Before the Fact (although there's some dispute over whether Hitchcock was also on board with the completely altered ending). One ending they had suggested in the spirit of the book--where she drinks the milk he gives her, knowing its poisoned, but has him mail a letter to her mother telling her she's been poisoned, but she loves Johnny too much to care--seems more interesting and plausible given the characters than the abrupt "car turnaround" happy ending with him really having been a good guy, if a gambler, all along. I mean, it's Cary Grant and Joan Fontaine, so I wanted a happy ending for them, too, but the car scene just seemed much too abrupt to me.

I've never been able to figure out any innocent explanation for what happened with Nigel Bruce.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I haven't been watching TCM much lately but anytime I do I notice Robert Osborne is not introing the movies.  Did they announce him leaving and I missed it or do we know as viewers?  I do love Mankiewicz though.  I am not a fan of Sally Field on The Essentials!  I hope she is done on that! 

[prican58]

3 hours ago, elle said:

We were talking about Rita Moreno up thread.  She is in the new Target commercial with some other lovely ladies.  I am biased, no surprise here, I think she is the most vibrant and wish that I could look as good as she does now! much less when I am her age (84)!  She is also on Jane the Virgin as the grandmother of the titular character.  She really does meet her character's preferred name as "Glamma".

I knew that was her! Yeah she is looking fab! Is she the next Betty White? I wish. Girl power, for sure. 

[Padma]

1 hour ago, Julia said:

I've never been able to figure out any innocent explanation for what happened with Nigel Bruce.

That was a bit of a problem. I guess by the end we're just supposed to believe it was an unfortunate coincidence, that Binky would drink impulsively and gregariously with people when he knew he shouldn't and that a random guy got him to make and lose a bet that killed him?  Moments like that make you wonder how the novel handled it. (I'm guessing one of my favorite scenes--the dinner party where the mystery writer and her brother were discussing methods of killing people--was taken from the book.

I'm kind of mixed on Joan Fontaine's acting, Rinaldo, but I actually felt this was one of her better roles. She's not terribly bright and a little bit irritating as a result, but she's not mean, very sincere and totally besotted with Grant and made the rest of the story work. This is one of my favorite movies with her. (And funny to me that, per Ben M., Grant was irritated that Hitchcock "favored" her so much throughout. She wasn't the usual "Hitchcock type" and I actually thought Grant got the better of it all from Hitchcock, just because his character was the more interesting one and it's directed to show that. But a more beautiful lead wouldn't have been as convincingly vulnerable (and I'm glad Hitchcock decided to leave out a lot of the sexual parts from the novel--Johnny's many marital infidelities, for example.)

[Bastet]

Quote

And funny to me that, per Ben M., Grant was irritated that Hitchcock "favored" her so much throughout.

Per various other accounts, and even by his own admission, Grant was rather insecure in that regard and made that complaint a lot.

[elle]

2 hours ago, Padma said:

That was a bit of a problem. I guess by the end we're just supposed to believe it was an unfortunate coincidence, that Binky would drink impulsively and gregariously with people when he knew he shouldn't and that a random guy got him to make and lose a bet that killed him?  Moments like that make you wonder how the novel handled it. (I'm guessing one of my favorite scenes--the dinner party where the mystery writer and her brother were discussing methods of killing people--was taken from the book.

I had hoped that it was explained in the book, otherwise I guessed that Binky called everyone "Old Bean" or at least when he was tipsy, so that clue was a red herring.

 

4 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

I'm about to confess that I've never been able to enjoy Suspicion the others clearly do. I've enjoyed Joan Fontaine in other movies but here her acting just feels false and overwrought to me, and the plot resolution makes the whole thing vaguely pointless and unsatisfying. My last viewing of it was years ago though, so I suppose I owe it another chance.

My issue with Joan Fontaine in this movie is I have a hard time believing that she is the "ugly duckling" or "shy spinster" she is supposed to be that no one else would have wanted to marry her.  The trope seems to work better in Rebecca because she is supposed to be so much younger than Max.

Hitchcock supposedly gave his apologies to  Daphne du Maurier for the change in the Rebecca ending.  I wonder why he didn't with this book as well.  Is this the only Francis Iles book made into a movie?

[voiceover]

So I'm watching Granger's Scaramouche (Ramon's silent version is better), and during the climactic sword fight at the Opera, I had a sudden image of the fascinated theatergoers holding up their phones to record it all.

[Padma]

It's a little disconcerting to see TCM's two back-to-back James Cagney films tonight. He's just so rotten, so convincing and so mesmerizing as the ultimate tough gangster in "White Heat" and then a few minutes later to see him dancing in "Footlight Parade" is just hard to adjust to. Talk about not being typecast. And no wonder, per Wikipedia, Orson Welles called him  "maybe the greatest actor who ever appeared in front of a camera".              

[Sharpie66]

I've never seen the film of A Midsummer's Night's Dream where Cagney played Bottom, but I can imagine he would be fantastic in the part! I really like him a lot in all of his roles. When I was a kid, I knew him best as George M. Cohan, since July 4th usually involved both Yankee Doodle Dandy and 1776 playing on the tv before we headed out for the fireworks. Then, as I got older, I saw more of his gangster films, but none of them beat White Heat IMO. Even in his final screen role, in Ragtime, he is riveting to watch.

Edited May 16, 2016 by Sharpie66

[Rinaldo]

1 hour ago, Sharpie66 said:

I've never seen the film of A Midsummer's Night's Dream where Cagney played Bottom, but I can imagine he would be fantastic in the part! 

He's all right, but the fact that he's not more memorable isn't really his fault. All the comedians' delivery is cranked way up, in order to (I'm guessing) sell the early-talkies audiences on the zany hilarity of Shakespeare. I'd say that this version of Midsummer Night's Dream is interesting primarily for all the historical lore surrounding it: Max Reinhardt (and his favorite composer Erich Korngold) trying to work in unfamiliar Hollywood circumstances (after collaborating on a famous outdoor production of the play in California), the story suffering in relation to the spectacle (ballets and processions steal time), and the actors (including early outings for Dick Powell, Olivia de Havilland, Mickey Rooney) probably getting little help. I enjoy watching the DVD, but not as a way to experience the play.

Edited May 16, 2016 by Rinaldo

[Crisopera]

Has anyone listened to the podcast "Secret History of Hollywood" by Adam Roche?   The Secret Histories are long-form podcasts, about a single subject/person/genre.  He started with Sherlock Holmes, moved on to sex in movies, then the Communist witchhunts, Universal horror, a great three-parter on Hitchcock, and the latest is the Gangster film. (He has another lighter podcast series, "Attaboy Clarence", which is also wonderful - it involves about 15 minutes of him reviewing 3 or 4 classic films, and then a radio show, usually a Lux Radio Theater version of one of the movies discussed.)  I can't recommend them highly enough - an amazing amount of information, presented terrifically well. 

[Milburn Stone]

18 minutes ago, Crisopera said:

Has anyone listened to the podcast "Secret History of Hollywood" by Adam Roche?   The Secret Histories are long-form podcasts...

You're not kidding, if the indicated time of Hitchcock Part 1 in the iTunes Store is accurate. I'm downloading it now, and it says the length of the podcast is 5 hours and 21 minutes! (And that's just Part 1.)  The combined time of the three parts is over 19.5 hours. Adam Roche must have a lot to say.

[Sharpie66]

Oooh, podcasts!! I will definitely have to check that one out--thanks for the rec!

[bluepiano]

On ‎5‎/‎16‎/‎2016 at 7:31 PM, Padma said:

It's a little disconcerting to see TCM's two back-to-back James Cagney films tonight. He's just so rotten, so convincing and so mesmerizing as the ultimate tough gangster in "White Heat" and then a few minutes later to see him dancing in "Footlight Parade" is just hard to adjust to. Talk about not being typecast. And no wonder, per Wikipedia, Orson Welles called him  "maybe the greatest actor who ever appeared in front of a camera".              

There's a moment in White Heat that never ceases to amaze me, no matter how many times I've seen it, when Cody (Cagney) tells Edmond O'Brien about his "conversations" with his dead mother. There's a wistful, dreamy look on Cagney's face, and while it's not like he's suddenly a sympathetic character, you're aware of the humanity exists even inside a vicious, cruel criminal. It's a moment very few actors could achieve with such subtlety.

Another movie in which Cagney brought complexity to an unsympathetic character was Love Me or Love Me.

I agree that Cagney had a lot more range than he's generally given credit for, as most people focus on his tough guy gangster roles. For me, my favorite Jimmy will always be the young, fast-talking, wisecracking, livewire of the early 30s, in pre-code movies like Picture Snatcher and Blonde Crazy that I probably never would've gotten to see if not for TCM.

[Rinaldo]

It's interesting that many of the great knighted British classical actors considered Cagney the greatest, too. They would note that he had great character range, being so convincing in each of them that one might be forgiven for thinking he could do nothing else.  And then there are his song-and-dance skills.

[Wiendish Fitch]

My Cagney film of choice is The Strawberry Blonde; in it, Cagney is cocky, jerky, vulnerable, romantic, boyish, and often heartbreaking. It's a joy to watch, and he and Olivia de Havilland are too cute together.

[prican58]

On 5/12/2016 at 1:01 PM, elle said:

We were talking about Rita Moreno up thread.  She is in the new Target commercial with some other lovely ladies.  I am biased, no surprise here, I think she is the most vibrant and wish that I could look as good as she does now! much less when I am her age (84)!  She is also on Jane the Virgin as the grandmother of the titular character.  She really does meet her character's preferred name as "Glamma".

I knew that was her! Yeah she is looking fab! Is she the next Betty White? I wish. Girl power, for sure. 

Sorry for the duplicate.

Edited May 19, 2016 by prican58

[Wiendish Fitch]

Rita rocks, what a survivor. I highly recommend her autobiography, heck of a read. 

[prican58]

Re Cagney, for me he is the best actor of his era and his closest competitor would be Eddie G. They just are so adept at doing any kind of role.

I was watching Footlight Parade on the TCM app and although I have seen it and Cagney innumerable times and this time I realized that his entire being is choreographed. By that I mean his movements, mannerisms, vocal patterns are just so dance-like. He just flows and glides and twitches beautifully. I don't think it was a conscious thing rather it's just his natural rhythm. It's not just when he dances. The scene could be anything.

In Footlight when he is trying to sell Guy Kibbee on a new way to do prologues his mannerisms, staccato vocabulary and the way he practically bounces off walls, it's as if he choreographed it all in his head on the spot! There is also the scene where he is talking about cats. Watch the way he moves his fingers to show how cats move. His fingers move almost like he dances...stiff yet fluid.

This guy was really one of a kind. 

[bluepiano]

23 hours ago, prican58 said:

I was watching Footlight Parade on the TCM app and although I have seen it and Cagney innumerable times and this time I realized that his entire being is choreographed. By that I mean his movements, mannerisms, vocal patterns are just so dance-like. He just flows and glides and twitches beautifully. I don't think it was a conscious thing rather it's just his natural rhythm. It's not just when he dances. The scene could be anything.. 

That's a great observation, and very well-stated.

I've always thought of Cagney's dancing as an extension of his personality, which is why it's so unique. It's totally Cagney. You couldn't imagine anyone else dancing like that. He's certainly no Astaire or Kelly, but to me the mark of the true artist is originality. (There are certain singers who are not great technical singers, but have a personal style that makes them special).

For the definitive Cagney performance it might be hard to argue against his Oscar winning role inYankee Doodle Dandy, in which his dancing is really on display. It's far from my favorite Cagney movie, as I find the sentimentality hokey at times, but Jimmy is always amazing to watch. Whatever a scene calls for, he delivers. And Joan Leslie is so adorable.

As I remember someone previously writing in the Forum, she was one of the few Hollywood actresses who could play "sweet" without it seeming phony or manipulative. Whenever TCM promotes a screening of Yankee Doodle Dandy they usually show an interview clip of Joan talking about what a joy Cagney was to work with, and how helpful and encouraging he was around her dancing. That's another part of the Cagney legend - that he was always the consummate pro.

Edited May 20, 2016 by bluepiano

[elle]

5 hours ago, bluepiano said:

Whenever TCM promotes a screening of Yankee Doodle Dandy they usually show an interview clip of Joan talking about what a joy Cagney was to work with, and how helpful and encouraging he was around her dancing. That's another part of the Cagney legend - that he was always the consummate pro.

I know that whenever TCM promotes One, Two, Three, they quote Pamela Tiffin saying how great Cagney was to her filming the movie.  I don't remember the exact, but when she asked him for advice he told her to "know your lines, know your marks, and be on time", after that they had a great time.

[Julia]

13 hours ago, bluepiano said:

That's a great observation, and very well-stated.

I've always thought of Cagney's dancing as an extension of his personality, which is why it's so unique. It's totally Cagney. You couldn't imagine anyone else dancing like that. He's certainly no Astaire or Kelly, but to me the mark of the true artist is originality. (There are certain singers who are not great technical singers, but have a personal style that makes them special).

For the definitive Cagney performance it might be hard to argue against his Oscar winning role inYankee Doodle Dandy, in which his dancing is really on display. It's far from my favorite Cagney movie, as I find the sentimentality hokey at times, but Jimmy is always amazing to watch. Whatever a scene calls for, he delivers. And Joan Leslie is so adorable.

As I remember someone previously writing in the Forum, she was one of the few Hollywood actresses who could play "sweet" without it seeming phony or manipulative. Whenever TCM promotes a screening of Yankee Doodle Dandy they usually show an interview clip of Joan talking about what a joy Cagney was to work with, and how helpful and encouraging he was around her dancing. That's another part of the Cagney legend - that he was always the consummate pro.

There's a challenge dance between Cagney as George M Cohan and Bob Hope in The Seven Little Foys I thought was fascinating because it made it clear to me in a way that Yankee Doodle Dandy didn't that Cagney was dancing in Cohan's style, not his own.

On a side note, this is Roger Ebert's take on Yankee Doodle Dandy

Quote

Cagney wasn't a dancer by Astaire's standards, or a singer by anybody's, but he was such a good actor he could fake it: “Cagney can't really dance or sing,” observes the critic Edwin Jahiel, “but he acts so vigorously that it creates an illusion, and for dance-steps he substitutes a patented brand of robust, jerky walks, runs and other motions.”

Which is funny, because he was a dancer in vaudeville for years before he started getting acting jobs.

[Rinaldo]

Yes, that last quote (Jahiel) seems either ill-informed or poorly observed. To a theater historian (like me, if I may be so immodest), Cagney's performance in Yankee Doodle Dandy is highly unusual because he studied and imitated George M. Cohan's performance style.

it usually doesn't work that way in movie musical biographies. Nobody expected Barbra Streisand to sound like Fanny Brice in Funny Girl (and she didn't, at all), and Doris Day was nothing like Ruth Etting in Love Me or Leave Me. But George M. Cohan had a highly distinctive vocal style (a half-spoken rant) and dance style (those "robust, jerky, runs, and other motions" mentioned), which were still relatively recent in memory when Yankee Doodle Dandy was made (indeed, Cohan was still alive), and Cagney was skilled enough to absorb them and temporarily make them his own. He's still himself, yet thoroughly Cohan too, which is a most exceptional achievement; he absolutely deserved that Academy Award.

So extraordinary is his work, that early in my History of Musicals course when I talk about George M Cohan, I use a portion of Yankee Doodle Dandy (the whole Little Johnny Jones stretch) to show them what he was like. (Cohen did record a handful of his own songs, but none of his famous ones, and his famed vitality doesn't come across in them.) I wouldn't do this with any other figure, and some of the surrounding details like the choral look and style are pure 1942 as I point out to my students, but in seeing Cagney's performance they're getting very close to seeing Cohan.

[Milburn Stone]

16 hours ago, bluepiano said:

And Joan Leslie is so adorable..she was one of the few Hollywood actresses who could play "sweet" without it seeming phony or manipulative.

Nice to see nice words about Joan Leslie, with which I totally agree. She stands out in exactly the roles that other ingenues of the time would have been forgettable in. In The Sky's the Limit, she holds her own against Fred Astaire, dramatically and musically. (Their singing/dancing duet on "A Lot in Common with You" is a delight, and she puts her part of the song across with considerable comedic intelligence.) I caught a portion of another of her films on TCM (which I think might have been Cinderella Jones--I had to look it up just now on the IMDB) in which she is the centerpiece of some big number that starts out in a malt shop and has music by Jule Styne, and again she's a delight. And she helps make the storyline portions of Thank Your Lucky Stars as enjoyable as they are.

I know someone who had occasion to encounter her professionally in her later life, and he reported that she seemed a happy, well-adjusted and lovely person, which doesn't seem surprising at all.

[Julia]

I just recently watched Hollywood Canteen. She managed to be likable in what could not have been an easy part to play.

[prican58]

Re Julia's comment about Cagney and Hope's challenge in "Foys", I have always liked that film and think it's one of Hope's best performances. I also love seeing them together and really, Hope comes across as a bit of an eccentric dancer himself. I love watching dancers like Buddy Ebsen and Ray Bolger and how they manage their own style using their long and lanky legs. They are so much fun to watch. 

Would enjoy a marathon of dance flicks that don't include Fred and Gene but rather with Buddy, Ray and even guys like George Murphy. 

[Julia]

Gene Kelly kind of squeezed them out of the final movie, but the little time he, Michael Kidd and Dan Dailey spent onscreen dancing in It's Always Fair Weather was a lot of fun to watch. It's a shame.

[Padma]

7 hours ago, Julia said:

There's a challenge dance between Cagney as George M Cohan and Bob Hope in The Seven Little Foys I thought was fascinating because it made it clear to me in a way that Yankee Doodle Dandy didn't that Cagney was dancing in Cohan's style, not his own.

On a side note, this is Roger Ebert's take on Yankee Doodle Dandy

Which is funny, because he was a dancer in vaudeville for years before he started getting acting jobs.

Ebert's comments about Cagney's dancing are very disappointing.  I don't know how anyone could watch Yankee Doodle Dandy and not see that he was dancing--and quite well, in terms of the film. It's very fortunate that Astaire turned it down--maybe he realized he was completely wrong for it. (Didn't realize until reading the above that Michael Curtiz and James Wong Howe were also involved). At least Ebert quotes another reviewer (Pauline Kael), “Though he was born in 1899 and is somewhat portly here, he is so cocky and sure a dancer that you feel yourself grinning with pleasure at his movements. It's quite possible that he has more electricity than Cohan himself had.” That seems much closer to the mark.  It's hard to imagine anyone doing so well (Ebert's review quotes Cohan watching and saying, of Cagney, "he's a hard act to follow.")

As for film biographies, I have to say that it was thanks to this forum that I recently saw the sequel to "The Jolson Story". As much as I always enjoy that movie, I'd never seen "Jolson Sings Again". Although the plot is pretty much all there in the title, I was pleasantly surprised. Larry Parks is great--the additional years give him an authority and maturity as Jolson that add a lot--his lip syncing is perfection, meaning not just looking -perfectly- like he's really singing, but also his facial expressions just as if he were the real singer. A really strong performance and a great selection of songs. Even a moving moment or two. (And I take back what I said about him probably not being a convincing romantic lead for Judy Garland. He was a really good actor--could definitely show maturity and strength as needed.  What a disgrace his career was ruined by the blacklisting, but at least he was not just talented, but a man of conscience as well. And "Jolson Sings Again", as a musical biopic, was very good.)

[Julia]

59 minutes ago, Padma said:

As for film biographies, I have to say that it was thanks to this forum that I recently saw the sequel to "The Jolson Story". As much as I always enjoy that movie, I'd never seen "Jolson Sings Again". Although the plot is pretty much all there in the title, I was pleasantly surprised. Larry Parks is great--the additional years give him an authority and maturity as Jolson that add a lot--his lip syncing is perfection, meaning not just looking -perfectly- like he's really singing, but also his facial expressions just as if he were the real singer. A really strong performance and a great selection of songs. Even a moving moment or two. (And I take back what I said about him probably not being a convincing romantic lead for Judy Garland. He was a really good actor--could definitely show maturity and strength as needed.  What a disgrace his career was ruined by the blacklisting, but at least he was not just talented, but a man of conscience as well. And "Jolson Sings Again", as a musical biopic, was very good.)

How did they address the Ruby Keeler problem?

[Padma]

51 minutes ago, Julia said:

How did they address the Ruby Keeler problem?

Keeler wouldn't let them use her name in "The Jolson Story" so his first wife in the movie was "Julie Benson". "Jolson Sings Again" begins after she's left him.

It was interesting to learn through some reading after watching this, how popular Jolson was with many African Americans. Musicians appreciated his popularizing jazz singing and how much he did to promote African American entertainers. As for blackface, African Americans apparently took it in the spirit he intended (respectful and admiring of the entertainers) rather than as we see it today (racially demeaning). I didn't realize that Jolson did an amazing amount of tours for the troops during WWII but also in Korea--pushing himself so hard on the last tour that it appeared to have contributed to his death.

[elle]

Quote

There's a challenge dance between Cagney as George M Cohan and Bob Hope in The Seven Little Foys I thought was fascinating because it made it clear to me in a way that Yankee Doodle Dandy didn't that Cagney was dancing in Cohan's style, not his own.

That is one of my all time favorite moments of cinema history.  Even though I know they are both playing characters, I feel you can see Hope and Cagney shine through in that performance.  Two old time vaudevillians putting on a great show!

[prican58]

Speaking of dancing, in my mind's eye I can see Bojangles, Greg Hines and Sammy  Davis Jr doing this routine side by side with each one putting his own spin on the dance. Or even doing the steps exactly the same at the same time. Where would you focus your eyes? Great stuff. 

Or even a dance off with the above folks along with Ann Miller, Fred, Donald,Gene, Bolger, etc. 

[Maizie131]

This afternoon I had the pleasure of watching Double Indemnity with Fred MacMurray & Barbra Stanwyck for the first time in several years.  Fantastic movie!  Afterwards I went in IMDB just for the helluvit to read the "Trivia" section and had to laugh at one of them: 

"On viewing the film's rushes, production head Buddy G. DeSylva remarked of Barbara Stanwyck's blonde wig, "We hired Barbara Stanwyck, and here we get George Washington."

I'm afraid I have to agree...

No matter -- one of my top 10 favorite movies. 

[prican58]

Watching 92Y On NYCLife on the local city channel here in NYC. Rita Moreno interviewing Gloria and Emilio Estefan. Awesome. If I can get a link later I will post it. 

http://92yondemand.org/emilio-and-gloria-estefan-with-rita-moreno-full-event

Edited May 23, 2016 by prican58

[voiceover]

Watching Hoop Dreams for the first time in ages.  The moment Arthur's dad says, "He told me 'I love you!'..he hadn't said that [in years]..." -- I'm just gutted, as I was all those years ago.

This film was so screwed over by the Academy.   If you missed it tonight, it's worth your time on the TCM ap.  It's a great sports movie, but even if you don't like basketball, it's so very much more.

Edited May 24, 2016 by voiceover

[Bastet]

I didn't realize it was airing on TCM.  That's cool; it may bring in a new audience for the film.  I think it's one of the best documentaries, and, yes, it's just disgusting that it wound up not even being nominated by the Academy.  But at least that debacle led to changes in how the documentary nominees were chosen.

[mariah23]

There's a new Saturday afternoon host.  TCM 2014 Ultimate Fan Contest Winner TiffanyVasquez will start airing in June.

Edited May 24, 2016 by mariah23