Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Rumsy4]

I'm pretty sure that just confirmed that whatever it is that's holding Emma back from opening up has to do with her past. I'm going with "hurt someone with her magic when she was a child, is afraid of doing it to Hook"

Well, it seems they've heard at least some of our critique. Color me shocked.

I was about to post this too. I would not get too excited about this, because in the previous three seasons they haven't shown any of Emma's childhood, so 10 minutes of it would be more that "the previous season combined".

Yeah--I think the only reason we are going to see more of Emma's childhood is because they are shoehorning it with the Frozen plotline. I doubt we'll get a whole episode flashback, though. They'll limit it to a couple of 10 minute installments.

ETA: I donno what I was thinking. I'll be surprised if it is more than 5 minutes in total.

Edited September 12, 2014 by Rumsy4

[Emma]

More Emma flashbacks?? I'll believe it when I see it.

[maryle]

That spoiler look so good !

more Emma past I hope we see her as a childn or tenneger.  Maybe the girl from the final will be back one episode. Honestly this season is intriging. The question will it last more than two episode.

[Shanna Marie]

Boy you are optimistic aren't you? lol. I think we've gotten like 3 minutes of kid!Emma and that's including the 2 minutes of baby!Emma from the pilot. So I'm guessing we're getting 3 minutes and 30 seconds now.

Yeah, I was thinking, "So, maybe three scenes of more than a minute each, tops?" Especially since most of the baby Emma stuff in flashback was more about Pinocchio and his decision to bail on baby Emma.

[Crimson Belle]

No offense, but I'm not with y'all on wanting to see more of Emma's past.  Sure, I want to see it, but y'all know good and dang well that with these writers, they'll almost certainly screw up the character and cause permanent damage to our perception of her.

[Jean]

Yeah this will be kid Emma.

 

 

I'm not too worried. First they're only doing it to draw a parallel to Elsa so they can't screw it up too bad cause....Disney. If it was supposed to serve another story yeah it'll be open season on Eva's evil lineage. 

 

I just wished they were more interested in world building and their own mythology instead of some shallow parallels.  There could be an interesting story there with the origin of magic with Elsa, Emma and Rumple's Dark Curse. They did say we were getting the origin of that curse/magic.

 

Also where is this childhood flashback supposed to come in? Or it won't get a full episode on its own and will be a scene randomly inserted in the beginning like they've done before?

4x1 is Elsa/Anna flashback

4x2 is Woegina's episode right?

4x3 is Charming/Will flashback

4x4 is the one with Zoso

4x5?

4x6 is Belle's

[Serena]

Episode 3 is the one where we're supposed to find out what Emma's problem is - I doubt we'll find out the problem before seeing the flashback. I have no idea, could they have both Emma and Will/Charming flashbacks in 403? That would be weird and confusing.

[RadioGirl27]

Also where is this childhood flashback supposed to come in? Or it won't get a full episode on its own and will be a scene randomly inserted in the beginning like they've done before?

4x1 is Elsa/Anna flashback

4x2 is Woegina's episode right?

4x3 is Charming/Will flashback

4x4 is the one with Zoso

4x5?

4x6 is Belle's

Episode 3 seems to be very important for her, and it's the one with the kiss. So it's probably there.

 

“In Storybrooke Emma and Elsa have “some meaningful interaction,” Horowitz says.”

From here

 

So they probably would have a conversation about their unwanted magic, and that's it. I can't get excited about this friendship when I know Elsa is leaving by episode 11.

[maryle]

Here's a little tiny bit rant about the spoiler and the Neal comment.

 

We actually have a real Emma spoiler (the lead of the show) after been mostly forget for tree years ( Adam admited )  it seems 4a will be finally an arc where she will be central and have some character development and people talk about her dead boyfriend .

I liked Neal, even if it was a miscast.

 But really !  Emma flashback should be about him !!! Don't think so. 

I want to see her troubled childhood and the time she chooses to be bail person.

 

Anyway, it will in relation to Elsa (magic) and with her problem to really open to love with Hook. So there no time to revisit her sad sad love story with her death ex.

Sorry do not understand some people each time we have an Emma new its always become about somebody else (Regina, Neal and even Hook.

 end of the rant.

 

It is tiresome!

 Let Emma build a swoman under the sun with Elsa but preferably with Hook

[sharky]

I'm not too worried about the Neal nonsense. That sounds more like it was a throwaway line from the columnist than an actual spoiler.

We don't know the nature of the 4x05 flashback but I wonder if that is Emma related. Hook's new hand will likely still be in full force and perhaps this Hook version 2.0 may stir in her some past issues.

[Souris]

Lana posted a BTS pic of her, Robert and Emilie.

 

I'm not feeling this ep so far.

Edited September 12, 2014 by Souris

[Dianthus]

Add me to the list of those who don't believe Hook would voluntarily approach his Crocodile for any reason. I think Rumple restores Hook's hand (and I hope Killian gets to keep it) b/c Belle a/o Henry a/o Emma discover(s) it in the shop. Especially if it's Belle, Rumple needs to maintain the fiction that she has the real dagger, so he restores Hook a) for the look of the thing, and b) he has an ulterior motive, using it to control Killian. Killian is not happy with this turn of events, which drives him to consider the crazy/stupid idea of self-mutilation. He can then angst over not having the stones to go thru with it.

Gotta love the irony, since Rumple crippled himself to get back to Milah and Bae, which was part of the reason Milah left him for Hook in the first place.

[stealinghome]

Hard to fully tell from that picture, but Belle's shirt/sweater combo almost looks like a Mary Margaret outfit.

[KAOS Agent]

I think the Emma/Elsa parallels aren't going to be as direct as Emma hurt someone with magic by accident as a child. It's more likely something where Emma did something accidentally and was harshly punished/locked up for it and/or internalized the blame and became even more withdrawn as a result. I'm also not holding out a lot of hope for actual Emma flashbacks. I've a feeling it's going to be like "Lost Girl" where someone else gets their story shown while Emma talks about her past. With Emma's story it's almost always tell not show.

 

As to the Neal line, Michael Raymond James has been in Romania filming a movie and now he's off to Boston to start filming something new, so happily I don't think Neal will be back anytime soon. It's a wonderful thing that MRJ has all kinds of work coming his way. He deserves way better than what he got playing Neal.

[Amerilla]

Since the only way Belle can know if she had the real dagger is for her to try to use it or for someone else to find and use the real one, someone like Henry or Emma or even Belle finding the dagger shouldn't really be a problem. Why not conjure up 50 different daggers and hide them all over town? "Oh, I just did that as a counter-measure. Wouldn't want anyone to find the real one."

I was thinking the same thing about the clothes, stealinghome.

[Shanna Marie]

I don't think finding the real dagger will be the problem. The problem will be Belle telling Rumple to do something and him having to do it or else she'll know she doesn't have the real dagger. It may even be unintentional on her part, where she doesn't think she's making a dagger command, just saying "Oh, you should do this," but as long as she's in possession of the dagger (or thinks she is), he has to obey if she's watching. And if he even resists too hard if she tells him to do something good, she'll know he's not as good as he's trying to pretend to be. He'll have to go behind her back to do anything nasty, and then he can play innocent, like he did with Zelena, because it would be impossible for him to do something Belle wouldn't want him to do.

[Souris]

Jared was also on set, along with the rest of the main cast. (Pics at links.)

 

So went to see Once Upon A Time filming and all main cast were there. It was all interior shots so we didn’t really get to see what was happening. I really wanted to meet Josh and Ginny and I thought there was a big chance but unfortunately not. Oh well, always a next time. We chatted with security guy for a bit and then decided it was time to go. The only people left filming for the night are: Colin, JMo, Georgina, and Emilie.

 

That makes me feel the ep a little more, to know that it's not ALL Belle.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Souris

[sharky]

But again Colin is in the modern clothes with no hook in sight. I don't know why but that's starting to make me nervous that he's without the hook for this long. I mean, I know Emma is calling him Killian now but at the same time, he's freaking Captain Hook!

[Dianthus]

Sorry, Sharky, but I think restoring his hand and then taking it away from him again is just mean. I understand where you're coming from, but once he gets it back, I'd really like to see him keep it.

[KingOfHearts]

I agree with both Dianthus and sharky. He's not Captain Hook without the hook, but taking it away again is just mean. Hopefully he can be his own character. I can count his similarities with the "real" Captain Hook on one hand.

Edited September 13, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Serena]

But again Colin is in the modern clothes with no hook in sight. I don't know why but that's starting to make me nervous that he's without the hook for this long. I mean, I know Emma is calling him Killian now but at the same time, he's freaking Captain Hook!

Well, at that point it was just Colin walking to set, so he wouldn't have the Hook. That's why we need them to film in Steveston: so we can see if he does have it while he's filming! It still seems so weird to me that they'd give the hand back to him, randomly, in episode 4. Like, it's not even a season finale. 

Can someone see if he's wearing the same shirt he was, or they're changing them?

[Amerilla]

I don't know why but that's starting to make me nervous that he's without the hook for this long. I mean, I know Emma is calling him Killian now but at the same time, he's freaking Captain Hook!

That's the thing, though: as soon as theydefinitivelyy decided to put him with Emma in S3, he ceased being Captain Hook.

They had to remove his original motivation of vengence based in the seemingly endless love for Not-Emma (and I think in retrospect that's one of the secondary reasons they wrote Liam in there, to show that Hook's desire to avenge lost loved ones wasn't just about Not-Emma*). He can't be a pirate and be with a Sheriff Savior. He can't sail the oceans blue - Emma's story is about family and Storybrooke, not adventures on high seas, so there's no need for a ship. There's no point in dressing like a pirate, since he isn't one. And since the wound of Not-Emma has healed, the injury he got that signified her loss is no longer important, so why not give him back his hand?

Problem is: now he's just an homeless, jobless, functional alcoholic - albeit an attractive one - who's mostly going to be consigned to just hanging around waiting for something interesting to happen to Emma. He's never really been his own character (his presence was tied first to Rumple, now to Emma) and I don't see that changing.

*They've made her so pointless at this point, do we really need to call her "Milah" any more?

Edited September 13, 2014 by Amerilla

[Stuffy]

I was so confused about the "Not-Emma" until I saw the * at the bottom. But then again I woke up too early on a Saturday and my brain isn't functioning yet.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Stuffy

[YaddaYadda]

I'll be incredibly disappointed if Hook is homeless.  The lip curse not withstanding (trying to take Henry away was a panic, dumb move), Hook was always shown as a resourceful/level headed guy, someone who had tons of tricks up his sleeve.  So he knew the curse was coming, he ditches his crew and sails his ship far away, then he proceeds to try and find a magic bean to get to Emma.  And in this whole time, he doesn't think of something to be able to take as much of his stolen treasures as he can?  He's a pirate!

 

And if he has no money, how does he get those new shiny clothes? 

 

Can they at least not kill the clever side of Hook?

Edited September 13, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[Anakerie]

Now I'm picturing Hook working a street-corner in Storybrooke. "Hey, Mate. Want me to swab your deck?"

[Mitch]

Now I'm picturing Hook working a street-corner in Storybrooke. "Hey, Mate. Want me to swab your deck?"

 

Hmmm, is that cloaking spell still in effect, cause I have to get myself down to Storybrooke stat!

[maryle]

I have zero problem for now with the new costume because it is to parallel Kristof and the fact that they both have to adapt to a new personal situation and the struggle with it. I'm very sure Hook will be resourcful and witty like before in fact he still is a pirate just a reformed one like Colin said at the Comic con.

I'm pretty confident that soon enough his pirate past will be central in an arc. Just not sure if it will be this year or next.

[Souris]

Ep. 7 is titled "The Snow Queen." Not that there was any doubt as to who Liz Mitchell is playing, but I think this removes any lingering doubt.

 

Wondering at the significance of the key in Adam's pic.

[BoPeeps]

Hook changed his clothes, not his soul. Killian was passionate and had an edge with a fast temper as well.

 

He will most likely continue to be camped at Granny's Bed N Breakfast, because we all know that no one needs money to live on in Storybrooke (snork). He, like everyone else in town, can be in modern garb while not being transported to any number of other realms, but can be a full decked-out pirate (including hook!) in flashbacks.

 

He'd make a great bartending pub owner, sea faring fisherman or sailing cruise captain, and regardless of how long he has it or if his hand is cursed, as long as he keeps a bit of the guyliner, all will be well. You can take away the fifty lb. coat but he keeps the same sultry eyes and lip smackingly, head-shakingly gorgeous face, sass and wit :) That all comes from within.

[BoPeeps]

I, like a lot of you, think that Emma's back story will have to do with her Elsa parallels of being a bit of an outcast as a child and probably having early signs of her magic and being totally scared of it.  We've seen several spoiler comments and pics where she is already interacting with Elsa.

 

Her history with Neal is over and quite dead. It was very short lived, but had a lot to do with her hideous trust walls being built.

We already know Bae's tragic back story and I doubt they will give use anything on the Neverland years because that whole mystery for all the characters there can still be used to cover up a lot of plot holes.

[maryle]

I like the title for episode 7. It should be a good one.  The master storyteller wrote it themself ! Adam and EddY.

The theory that the arrogant prince is from Frozen  could becorrect. I'm hoping there some Stevenson spoiler next week.

[retrograde]

Bit more detail from yesterday:

 

Apparently, this day this was the first time of so many cast memebers in one scene this season. During the day, we saw Jen, Colin, Lana, Ginny, Josh, Jared, Robert, Emilie and Georgina. They didn’t all come over to see us though. Jared, Robert, Emilie and Georgina did.

 

- Source

 

I was contemplating what kinda scene they would do, seeing the location they used is the one they use for library interiors, Jail interior, and hospital interior… Not sure if there’s more but seeing as Adam and Eddy said no Dr. whale for first arc then I guess couldnt be a hospital scene….

 

- Source

[Souris]

JMo posted an interesting photo.

[YaddaYadda]

That looks like the station, doesn't it?

 

ETA - Is that Graham's jacket?

Edited September 13, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[Serena]

The hook is there with Graham's jacket... what does it meannnnnn?

It is the station, she tagged #oncesheriffstation

 

EDIT: what about this!! Even more confused. Does she arrest Hook? And takes his hook? So that'd mean he still has it...

Edited September 13, 2014 by Serena

[stealinghome]

For a moment I thought Hook's hook was an umbrella. Ha!

 

If this means Hook is going to go work with Emma at the station, however, I'm going to roll my eyes so freaking hard. In no particular order: a) what are Hook's qualifications for being law enforcement, the fact that he's been a criminal for 300+ years, breaking every law at every turn?, b) given that the sheriff's office has been a major connection point for Emma and Charming, I'm going to be so pissed if yet again Emma's relationship with her parents gets screwed over for Captain Swan, and c) it just feels slightly icky to me to have the hook next to Graham's jacket. I don't know why, but almost vaguely disrespectful. (Or maybe I'm just irritated by any reminder of the fact that Regina still goes unpunished for murdering Graham in cold blood, so would rather the show not bring him up if it's not going to make Regina face the consequences.) Oh, and d) I really think it would be bad for the Hook character--and significantly less interesting for me as a viewer--to have him working with Emma full-time. The character badly needs something of his own (ie a job or a house or a non-Emma related friend or something) in Storybrooke. Puppy dog Hook was boring enough in 3B, I don't need to see him be further drained of any semblance of a life outside Emma.

Edited September 13, 2014 by stealinghome

[sharky]

So glad I wasn't the only one that noticed Graham's jacket. And yes, I do wonder what's going on there. We know that Emma is not afraid to put her friends in jail -- see Mary Margaret in season 1 -- so I'm really wondering what is going on with Hook that causes her to take that measure. Can this show come back on the air already!!!!!!!

[RadioGirl27]

She is so going to arrest him it's not even funny. The arrest would be for hitting Will or, even better, for something he hasn't done, but everybody thinks he has because he is a pirate. That way we would have a fourth source of angst between them in six episodes, and it would be the moment I totally give up on this show. So yeah, it's not funny at all.

 

Anyway, I think the hook hanging there with Graham's jacket means that the pirate is dead and now it's only Killian, or something like that.

Edited September 13, 2014 by RadioGirl27

[YaddaYadda]

Bad things tend to happen to people in that cell.  The wraith (Regina), Zelena...

 

The other guy in the cell looks so much like Justin Hartley from that angle.

[retrograde]

I'm not sure either of those photos indicate Hook becomes a deputy or gets locked up. Just that there was a scene in the sheriff's office last night, and these are two BTS photos from it. 

 

It does tell us the hook is still in play, one way or another, though. My question: Is that the full hook prop that the actor wears, or what is supposed to be the on-screen hook get-up that Hook the character wears? (if that makes sense)

[maryle]

Well I'm in the minority but I just love it !

Now I consider Hook a good contender for the Kai thing.

We already know that he is cursed and act shady ( punch Will, strange date, cut himself while drunk ...) something is definitively happening to him ... but what !

[Shanna Marie]

Throwing Hook into a cell would be a good way to force him to talk to her about what's up if he's acting shady or evasive, and if he's doing stuff like passing out on restaurant benches, she'd have a good excuse.

 

Or that may have just been a handy place to chill during a long night of shooting a scene that happens to take place in the police station.

[Serena]

The more I think about it, the more I believe Hook still has the hook. If he didn't, what would be the point of it hanging in the sheriff's office? Would Emma really want a dangerous weapon lying around, just for sentimentality's sake? I'd think Hook would either destroy it, and keep it somewhere safe. However, if he still wears it, and Emma has to arrest him, it'd make sense for her to take away his hook so he wouldn't use it to pick the lock.

[KAOS Agent]

JMo doesn't typically post spoilers. I think they were most likely filming in the sheriff's station last night and that's just something she thought would be a fun shot and something that makes her smile. It's not like they don't mess around with the hook. The kid who plays Roland was pictured with it last season. I don't know what's going on the the hand/hook thing and I'm not particularly happy with what appears to have happened, but I'll be waiting to find out what's actually happening there rather than getting worked up over complete speculation. 

 

They've made her so pointless at this point, do we really need to call her "Milah" any more?

 

I'm generally of the opinion that a victim of domestic violence deserves to be respected by retaining her name and her identity. Plot device or not, she deserves better than to be treated as if she's nothing. Or perhaps we should start calling Graham Not Hook? Also, Hook refers to her quite affectionately as "My Milah" even as he was talking about his feelings for Emma in his speech in Echo Cave, so no, Milah's not pointless to him. He's just finally realized that maybe clinging to anger and vengeance for 300 years hurt both him and other innocent people and maybe he should deal with it differently. He doesn't like Captain Hook and doesn't want to be him anymore. I understand that. Regina doesn't want to be the Evil Queen anymore either and most people consider that to be a healthy idea. 

Edited September 13, 2014 by KAOS Agent

[Rumsy4]

It may be a situation where they are forced to confront whatever new issues have surfaced. And if Emma threw him in jail, and she is sitting at the station alone with him in the cell across from her, that would be one way to do it. Hook could just be carrying his... er, hook around, because he's just not comfortable without it, tying into his identity crisis.

I do think that if Hook gets his hand back only temporarily, it seems cruel, but I seriously think he'll only get it back temporarily.

[Souris]

Rather than an arrest, it could be a situation of, "Rumple is trying to compel you to do something bad, but if you're locked in a jail cell, you won't be able to do it."

[RadioGirl27]

If this pic is really spoilery (we don't know for sure, probably it's just Jennifer playing with people), I think they are going to continue with the Snowing parallels, and someone (Rumple, Regina, the Snow Queen, you can choose) it's going to frame Hook for something (like Regina did with Mary Margaret) so Emma has to arrest him. That way then can create tons of unnecessary angst and they don't need to actually write something new and fresh for them.

Edited September 13, 2014 by RadioGirl27

[sharky]

It may be a situation where they are forced to confront whatever new issues have surfaced. And if Emma threw him in jail, and she is sitting at the station alone with him in the cell across from her, that would be one way to do it. Hook could just be carrying his... er, hook around, because he's just not comfortable without it, tying into his identity crisis.

I do think that if Hook gets his hand back only temporarily, it seems cruel, but I seriously think he'll only get it back temporarily.

I wrote a fanfic where she throws Hook in jail and I now see a huge error because I locked him up with the hook. Dude could just use it to pick the lock. D'oh!

Even though she posted the picture today, that may not mean that photo was taken in the past day or so. It could be something from a week or a few weeks ago depending. So I'm not sure if we vcam base a timeline off the photo.

[Souris]

They were filming last night in the building that houses the jail set, and she tagged it #fridaynightfilming, so I think it probably was from last night.

[retrograde]

It may be a situation where they are forced to confront whatever new issues have surfaced. And if Emma threw him in jail, and she is sitting at the station alone with him in the cell across from her, that would be one way to do it.

Based on the fan reports, Georgina and Emilie were filming with them the whole time, so even if this does happen, I'm not sure that's what they were shooting last night.