YaddaYadda August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 That's the Cup of Hufflepuff. I'm sure that cup was a bit nicer than this one. It's actually interesting if Camelot becomes flashbacks, because it will actually mean that time has passed. I'm sure part of the reason they would be doing this is Zelena's pregnancy since she is set to give birth this season. She's a good way to measure passing time. Link to comment
RadioGirl27 August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 Dude. That's not the Grail. Yeah. The cup looks like a "thank you for participate" gift, something you give the kids that take part in a sport competition but doesn't win. 5 Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 Does anyone else find it a bit weird that Eddy says this about Charming and Arthur's relationship? I understood absolutely nothing from that article and I mean nothing. Stuff that went through my head was.. Arthur is gay and has a thing for David I don't know how special Guinevere and Arthur are since Gwen cheated on Arthur with Lancelot Are Arthur and Gwen really special? In everything that's Lancelot, Arthur loves her, she doesn't In conclusion, Arthur has a thing for David, David doesn't swing that way and is married. Arthur forever second best. And I did not understand anything about Merida either. She's going through her own stuff, which great. Main character stories, relegated to the back burner then Eddy complains about how they have so many characters. 3 Link to comment
Souris August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 (edited) Yeah. The cup looks like a "thank you for participate" gift, something you give the kids that take part in a sport competition but doesn't win. It does look really cheap-ass. Maybe they're trying to fake out somebody with a pretend Grail, like David did to Snow with the fake Excalibur. I snarked on Tumblr that it looked like David was bestowing his "Best Bro" trophy on Arthur. Bastard! Everybody knows that it should be Hook's. I agree that the most believable reason for Emma to give in to the darkness would be if she thinks Hook betrayed her. I hope like hell they don't have Hook actually betray her. It would make no sense and be totally counter to his character, but TS, TW. I fret about the "heartbreaking" aspect of Ep. 5. Edited August 7, 2015 by Souris 1 Link to comment
KingOfHearts August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 I think they called it the "Chalice of Antioch" but not totally sure (it was Chalice of something, anyway) There is an artifact in a New York museum once said to be the Holy Grail, but they call it the Antioch Chalice. 2 Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 Do they go and get that from Merlin's mansion since everyone seems to be back in Storybrooke anyway? I can very honestly say that the more "spoilers" we get, the more confusing this is. Also, I do wonder a bit if the show won't decide to go the Da Vinci Code route for the Holy Grail instead of an actual object. Link to comment
Souris August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 I have a feeling they will put some sort of spin on the Grail so that it's not so overtly religious -- like making it a magical object rather than a Christian one. With Robert's comments seeming to differentiate b/t Rumple & Gold, I'm rather imagining that Rumple will be interacting with Emma in her head as a representation of the Dark One within her trying to seduce her to the Dark Side. Link to comment
OnceUponAJen August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 (edited) There is an artifact in a New York museum once said to be the Holy Grail, but they call it the Antioch Chalice. If there were a Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch on Once, I would be most pleased. Edited August 7, 2015 by OnceUponAJen 4 Link to comment
RadioGirl27 August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 (edited) Does anyone else find it a bit weird that Eddy says this about Charming and Arthur's relationship? The word that comes to my mind when I think about Arthur and Gwen is betrayal, and I doubt they would be promoting that friendship between Arthur and Charming if it was just that, a friendship. So I think Arthur is going to betray Charming or, following the trend "the Charmings are terrible persons" that A&E seem to love, David is going to betray Arthur. Edited August 7, 2015 by RadioGirl27 Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 (edited) So Gold and Rumple are 2 separate entities inside one person? I'm guessing this would be the first time a person is not the Dark One without being killed. But isn't this who Regina is? Two sort of separate people in one person, especially since she's changed? And isn't this who Snow is? And okay, so Gold is Rumple's Storybrooke's counterpart. And Rumple wasn't always the Dark One and Gold wasn't the Dark One for 28 years because of the curse. But Gold is a a jerk and everyone during the curse was scared of him. Yeah, so dude will want the Dark One's powers back, I'm pretty sure. This doesn't bode well for Emma if anything (or even Belle for that matter or anyone really). Edited August 7, 2015 by YaddaYadda Link to comment
HoodlumSheep August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 I don't really like Robert's DO comments, or I don't understand them. So Gold is separate from Rumple? But Gold is still a terrible person. Rumple is a terrible person. Who is inhabiting who's body? There should be no "white hearts" considering they were both terrible entities. ???? 2 Link to comment
mjgchick August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 The backflips they are doing to explain this just to justify Rumple/Gold, Regina/Evil Queen and probably Emma/Dark Swan soon is ruining my excitement for this season. They better give Emma a good redemption arc. She didn't ask for this shit god dammit. 1 Link to comment
HoodlumSheep August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 Why can't they just accept that they are the same characters??? Why???? At least Emma will probably (hopefully) feel guilty over evil stuff she does when she eventually becomes good again. 3 Link to comment
Amerilla August 7, 2015 Share August 7, 2015 I don't really like Robert's DO comments, or I don't understand them. Running it through my A&E Decoder Ring, it seems to me it's a sign that show retains its basic unwillingness to step out of their comfort zone in any meaningful way. By definition, a "blank slate" Rumpel would require them to do something different from the Gold of Old or the pre-DO Rumpel. They'd had to employ some creativity, to have him interact with other characters in new ways, and Bobby would have to do more than just show up and nosh on some scenery. None of them seem willing to do that at this point. So, "Gold" will remain in a coma, while Rumpel, through some contrived bullsh....um, magic, will be just as he's always been, plotting and conniving to get his power back in either the 5a or 5b finale, depending on how long they decide to drag this out. 1 Link to comment
Dianthus August 8, 2015 Share August 8, 2015 KingOfHearts, on 07 Aug 2015 - 08:49 AM, said:There is an artifact in a New York museum once said to be the Holy Grail, but they call it the Antioch Chalice. Could it be the Chalice from the Palace? I hear it holds the Brew that is True. Or maybe that's the Flagon with the Dragon? 1 Link to comment
daxx August 8, 2015 Share August 8, 2015 No ,that was the vessel with the pestle holds the pellet with the poison the chalice from the palace holds the brew that is true. 1 Link to comment
KAOS Agent August 8, 2015 Share August 8, 2015 No, they broke the chalice from the palace and replaced it with the flagon with the dragon which has the pellet with the poison. Maybe that's why the guy ran. He knew the chalice was poisoned. 2 Link to comment
Souris August 8, 2015 Share August 8, 2015 I hope they didn't change their story plans for needing the Jolly Roger, only decided that it would be cheaper/easier to do it with CGI/set work. Link to comment
OnceUponAJen August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 I hope they didn't change their story plans for needing the Jolly Roger, only decided that it would be cheaper/easier to do it with CGI/set work. If it's because they needed to budget more money for the "Emma needs a house" account, I can forgive them. I think. 7 Link to comment
RadioGirl27 August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 (edited) I talked to the crew on the Lady Washington about OUAT filming. Was told that they were scheduled to film in September but it got cancelled. I am guessing that the show decided to go CGI/studio route instead. Either way it looks like the Jolly will be back in 5A. Maybe it's just me, but I don't see how you go from "they have canceled the filming in the ship" to "the Jolly Roger will be back in 5A". For me it sounds more like "they have changed the story and they don't need the ship anymore". And, really, looking at the filming spoilers we have, the change in the story sounds more logical. Edited August 9, 2015 by RadioGirl27 Link to comment
HoodlumSheep August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 (edited) ^ As long as we still get to see the Jolly in some compacity (whether just the deck or whatever) I'll be happy. Otherwise, they could have waited to bring it back at a later date (so when it'll actually get used). It does seem like an odd jump from "canceled usage" to "we'll totally be seeing it in 5a!" Edited August 9, 2015 by HoodlumSheep Link to comment
Souris August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 It could go either way, honestly. Though given the show's track record of dropping things I would be interested in, they probably dropped needing the Jolly Roger. So, table flipping. But it's also feasible they decided it would be easier/cheaper to do it on-set with CGI. I don't know how expensive it would be to get the ship up there & rent it for the time period they need, but it's probably more than using stuff they already do regularly. Link to comment
daxx August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 (edited) It would be nice if they could get some good stock footage of the Lady Washington under full sail for the special effects team to use. Not that floppy sail stuff they keep using. Dude, sails are straining under full sail, not all floppy. Edited August 9, 2015 by daxx Link to comment
Rumsy4 August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 (edited) It's difficult to know why they would need the Jolly for this arc. They travelled to Camelot through Tornado, so using the Jolly Roger to go through a portal was not necessary. Emma has a house in Storybrooke now. They haven't shown where Killian's been staying for 1.5 seasons now. So, unless they have a flashback to pirate Killian/Hook or Blackbeard, or they want to show Hook brooding in his cabin in Storybrooke, I think A&E changed directions about using the JR during this arc. Edited August 9, 2015 by Rumsy4 Link to comment
sharky August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 They may have wanted to get Lady Washington shots but just opted to go the cheaper route. It doesn't mean they necessarily dropped the Jolly Roger from the story completely. They have plenty of other options, including CGI, which they used last season. The shots in the finale and the shots with Ursala were all done in the green screen studio. They also have recreated part of the deck that they can build on a barge to make it look like the ship is sailing without having to have the actual ship. Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 9, 2015 Share August 9, 2015 All i care about is that the JR is needed in some capacity. Sometime in September means episode 6 or 7, maybe? Link to comment
Dianthus August 10, 2015 Share August 10, 2015 -Zoe-, on 08 Aug 2015 - 3:45 PM, said:Grail? Chalice? Flagon? More like Cup of Nup. What can I say, The Last Crusade and Monty Python refs were already made. Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 New Spoiler Title 5x04, Broken Kingdom Written by Goodman and Schwartz Not gonna lie. This? I'm actually really looking forward to. Just because Camelot and Arthur. Please don't turn him into Robin 2.0. Please! 2 Link to comment
KingOfHearts August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 I'm confused... how much focus are they putting on Camelot? Didn't A&E say it wasn't really about that? Link to comment
Souris August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 (edited) I'm guessing the Rumple "training" Emma is a mental representation of the Dark One. But, come on, Emma, why the hell would you trust even a Rumple inside your mind?? And I am so bloody sick of the apple imagery on every poster. It didn't make sense with Frozen, and it doesn't make sense with Dark Swan. Though I guess it is truth in advertising, since they make Regina overshadow EVERYTHING. "Broken Kingdom" could also have a double meaning, in Snowing's "kingdom" of Storybrooke. Edited August 11, 2015 by Souris Link to comment
RadioGirl27 August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 (edited) I'm confused... how much focus are they putting on Camelot? Didn't A&E say it wasn't really about that? They have casted Arthur, Gwen, Percival, Merlin and they are bringing back Lancelot, and they are making Merida related to Camelot too. Of course they are going to put a lot of focus in Camelot and it's characters. Definitely, there is going to be more focus there in the "core characters" not named Emma, Rumple, Regina and, at least in the first three episodes it seems that also Charming. Never believe A&E when they give interviews. Edited August 11, 2015 by RadioGirl27 3 Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 I'm confused... how much focus are they putting on Camelot? Didn't A&E say it wasn't really about that? It seems like this might be the first episode that actually does focus on Camelot or at least that's what I gather. Link to comment
LizaD August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 They have casted Arthur, Gwen, Percival, Merlin and they are bringing back Lancelot, and they are making Merida related to Camelot too. Of course they are going to put a lot of focus in Camelot and it's characters. Not necessarily. For 3A they had Wendy and her brothers, Pan-Malcom, Felix, Tink, Liam, Hood, Ariel, Eric etc and it still ended up being mostly main cast. They always cast a bunch of guest stars or recurring every half-season. 3B had a ton too but it was still all about Woegina. Most of them were just one-off characters or another body to stand around. Usually only 2 or so end up with any significant role at all. Obviously Arthur is one. Look at the QoD. Ursula was gone in 4 episodes and Cruella didn't do anything but snark until her centric. I think Ep. 4 will be half Rump centric, and half Camelot-Merlin. I'm guessing the Rumple "training" Emma is a mental representation of the Dark One. Not with the way Robert has been talking. If it was just some imaginary "friend" stuff I don't think he'd be making those sly remarks about Gold vs Rump or the twist they're pimping. Robert "I give no fucks" Carlyle would just come out and say it if it was just a lame thing like Rump being a figment of Emma's imagination. I thought Rump teaching Emma back in Miller's Daughter was interesting, especially juxtaposed with him teaching Cora. The setup was clever. But that ship, like everything else has long since sailed. Link to comment
Rumsy4 August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 (edited) Not with the way Robert has been talking. If it was just some imaginary "friend" stuff I don't think he'd be making those sly remarks about Gold vs Rump or the twist they're pimping. Robert "I give no fucks" Carlyle would just come out and say it if it was just a lame thing like Rump being a figment of Emma's imagination. Not necessarily. The writers don't always give full information to the actors. If Rumple is a figment of Emma's imagination, or a manifestation of the Dark One, Robert may not have that information yet, as the mystery may not be revealed right away. Edited August 11, 2015 by Rumsy4 Link to comment
KingOfHearts August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 Not necessarily. The writers don't always give full information to the actors. If Rumple is a figment of Emma's imagination, or a manifestation of the Dark One, Robert may not have that information yet, as the mystery may not be revealed right away. Wasn't Merida there when they shot the scene though? Link to comment
Rumsy4 August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 Wasn't Merida there when they shot the scene though? Did Merida interact with "Rumple" though? Maybe she interacted only with Emma, and couldn't see Rumple. Link to comment
LizaD August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 Not necessarily. The writers don't always give full information to the actors. If Rumple is a figment of Emma's imagination, or a manifestation of the Dark One, Robert may not have that information yet, as the mystery may not be revealed right away. I think they would tell Robert, especially if it informs the way he plays Rump or Gold and I think Robert would make Emma's image of Rump different enough from real Rump or whatever version they pick up. This isn't like Zarian. They told Lana that Woegina killed Marian at the start of 3B so that she could supposedly play out the dynamic between Hood and her. Not that I saw anything but that's what she said they did. Link to comment
Serena August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 (edited) I know it's futile to hope, but with ep 4 being an episode that's been Hook-centric in the past, plus "Broken Kingdom" being something that ties with Hook's backstory of rebelling against a corrupt king, plus Arthur's description, I'm kind of getting my hopes up about this ep. I guess we'll know more soon since I guess they'll start filming it tomorrow? Edited August 11, 2015 by Serena Link to comment
Souris August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 I saw somebody on Tumblr speculate that the Rumple tutoring Emma is his "soul." Since he didn't die when she became the Dark One, his soul is now attached to her because it was all tied up with the Dark One. So his body is in a coma in Storybrooke, but his soul is traipsing around Emma's mind. Which sounds utterly nightmarish, frankly. Though I'm not sure how that would work with that B&B jar Belle was carrying. Maybe it's empty now but they plan to use it for Rumple later. Link to comment
Rumsy4 August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 (edited) I think they would tell Robert, especially if it informs the way he plays Rump or Gold and I think Robert would make Emma's image of Rump different enough from real Rump or whatever version they pick up. I just don't think we can know what goes on behind the scenes for sure. At the time of SDCC they had just finished filming one or two episodes, IIRC. Carlyle intentionally plays Rumple with a slightly different accent in different flashbacks as a sign of how long he has lived. So, it may not be a big stretch retroactively if they show at a later date that "Rumple" wasn't Rumple after all. I had another thought. Rumple has been the Dark One so long (the longest?) that maybe his personality rubbed off into the Darkness as much as the Darkness seems to have affected Rumple. So, in the beginning, there is some battle to see whose personality traits will dominate the new Dark One--Emma's or Rumple's. The "Rumple" manifestation may be a symptom of that dissonance. ETA: Since he didn't die when she became the Dark One, his soul is now attached to her because it was all tied up with the Dark One. How many souls are inhabiting Emma's body now? Hers, the Original Darkone's, and Rumple's? The Nevengers' best best to save Emma may be to perform an exorcism! :-p Edited August 11, 2015 by Rumsy4 Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 How many souls are inhabiting Emma's body now? Hers, the Original Darkone's, and Rumple's? The Nevengers' best best to save Emma may be to perform an exorcism! :-p Maybe it's just Rumple. I mean the previous Dark One (at least Zoso) was killed so that Rumple can become the new Dark One. I'm assuming that if the (insert name here) Dark One is killed, then the person's soul dies with him? I know it's futile to hope, but with ep 4 being an episode that's been Hook-centric in the past, plus "Broken Kingdom" being something that ties with Hook's backstory of rebelling against a corrupt king, plus Arthur's description, I'm kind of getting my hopes up about this ep. I'm not sure that Hook's rebellion and fall from grace has anything to do with Camelot. If anything, Hook would recognize Arthur as his corrupt, genocidal king. I think episode 4 (Broken Kingdom) will likely tie in with episode 2 (The Price) on some level. Episode 3 seems to be David-centric and Jane Espenson is the one who wrote the David centric last season as well. i find it interesting that Excalibur, even though the sword was a fake, made its "first" appearance in Lost Girl. There was the chalice from which Snow drank Lake Nostros' water that healed her from George's poison during the wedding ceremony that was held for Ruth. That's already 2 would be things from Camelot. Link to comment
pezgirl7 August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 How many souls are inhabiting Emma's body now? Hers, the Original Darkone's, and Rumple's? The Nevengers' best best to save Emma may be to perform an exorcism! :-p I think I may know someone who could help with an exorcism! 9 Link to comment
HoodlumSheep August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 (edited) ^ lol! I would be fine with a switch up in the centric order. Patterns like that can get tedious for some people. However, I expect the 4th episode to be a Rumple centric, proven by The Crocodile, Nasty Habits and The Apprentice (which was kind of split between him and Hook, but Rumple got the flashbacks!). So I expect Broken Kingdom to feature Rumple quite a bit. Edited August 11, 2015 by HoodlumSheep Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 However, I expect the 4th episode to be a Rumple centric, proven by The Crocodile, Nasty Habits and The Apprentice (which was kind of split between him and Hook, but Rumple got the flashbacks!). Eh...The Crocodile was sort of Hook's Neverland origin story. i guess that one can also be called a split between him and Rumple. Link to comment
HoodlumSheep August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 Eh...The Crocodile was sort of Hook's Neverland origin story. I guess that one can also be called a split between him and Rumple. Yeah it was kind of split, just like The Apprentice kind of was. Rumple and Hook just love to share, don't they? 1 Link to comment
RadioGirl27 August 11, 2015 Share August 11, 2015 I know it's futile to hope, but with ep 4 being an episode that's been Hook-centric in the past, plus "Broken Kingdom" being something that ties with Hook's backstory of rebelling against a corrupt king, plus Arthur's description, I'm kind of getting my hopes up about this ep. I guess we'll know more soon since I guess they'll start filming it tomorrow? Noone wants a Hook centric more than me, but I doubt it. He is not involved in the Camelot storyline and with that title, the episode is probably about Camelot, so Arthur and Merlin are more likely than Hook. Link to comment
KingOfHearts August 12, 2015 Share August 12, 2015 That's already 2 would be things from Camelot. There's also the gauntlet everyone wants to forget (me included) from 4x11. Link to comment
YaddaYadda August 12, 2015 Share August 12, 2015 There's also the gauntlet everyone wants to forget (me included) from 4x11. The gauntlet was some contrived bullshit they threw in there to remind us of Camelot and that Rumple, you know goes there whenever he feels like. They just made up some object. Link to comment
KAOS Agent August 12, 2015 Share August 12, 2015 I have to laugh that saving Emma from going full on Dark Swan will be led by Regina because they fail. Good job, Regina! 2 Link to comment
HoodlumSheep August 12, 2015 Share August 12, 2015 (edited) ^ lol! You'd think the mission would be lead by...I don't know...her parents or even her boyfriend, but nope. Of course Regina's leading the mission. At least based on spoilers, there's a 95% chance she fails. Also, didn't people mention that the group sort of splits (in a matter of speaking; like they have different ideas) to follow separate ways in trying to help Emma? Which means Regina may also fail in keeping the group unified. I'm down with that (If that's the case). Edited August 12, 2015 by HoodlumSheep Link to comment
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