RadioGirl27 May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 This tweet by Jane Espenson gave me the worst thought. Is Emma going to become "masculine" now that she's the Dark One? Would they take their SQ baiting that far? I think I made myself throw up. For god's sake! I hope they kill Hook in the season premiere so I can stop watching. Link to comment
YaddaYadda May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 This tweet by Jane Espenson gave me the worst thought. Is Emma going to become "masculine" now that she's the Dark One? Would they take their SQ baiting that far? I don't understand. That's not what she's saying. The person is asking if either Hook or Robin will die, probably hoping for both and I didn't find anything wrong with her answer. I like you guys a lot, but sometimes, I feel you just look to hang on to stuff and read too much in some situations/replies. 7 Link to comment
Curio May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 That was just a really oddly worded tweet in general. Instead of beating around the bush, that fan should just come out and say what we all know they're trying to say. "Are you guys going to kill off Hook and Robin so SwanQueen can finally get together romantically even though we've been told numerous times in interviews and on the show that it will never happen?" Shoot, is that more than 140 characters? 3 Link to comment
Souris May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) I hope I'm reading into it. It's not the "anything that can happen" line that hit me. But what's with the "masculinity is fluid" in response to that? What a weird thing to reply. Why say that if it doesn't have something to do with the show? Edited May 12, 2015 by Souris 1 Link to comment
legaleagle53 May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 I hope I'm reading into it. It's not the "anything that can happen" line that hit me. But what's with the "masculinity is fluid" in response to that? Why say that if it doesn't have something to do with the show? Exactly. How is that even relevant to the question, much less the answer? I think Jane has been hanging around Adam and Eddie a bit too much lately. Link to comment
RadioGirl27 May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) I hope I'm reading into it. It's not the "anything that can happen" line that hit me. But what's with the "masculinity is fluid" in response to that? What a weird thing to reply. Why say that if it doesn't have something to do with the show? This. The "anything might happen" is the perfect response. You give that fan the hope that you are going to kill Hook and Robin and make SQ canon, even if it's not really going to happen. The "masculinity is fluid" is what makes no sense, so she is either toying with the fan, or it has something to do with some ideas they have for next season. And, really, if they are even considering making Dark One Emma bisexual/lesbian, it would be insulting, because they would be equating homosexuality with darkness and evilness. Edited May 12, 2015 by RadioGirl27 2 Link to comment
Souris May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 It would give them the perfect opportunity to bait SQ moments and put distance between Emma and Hook. That was too much of an out-of-left-field comment not to mean something. Link to comment
Altair Aquila May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 I'm guessing that Jane is not keen on rigidly applying the term masculine, or feminine, to any character, that's all. 5 Link to comment
Curio May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) I'm guessing that Jane is not keen on rigidly applying the term masculine, or feminine, to any character, that's all. Yeah, that's all I'd take it as. Some people might view Emma as having masculine traits because she's emotionally closed off, strong, and takes charge. People might view Hook as feminine because he enjoys wearing makeup and is completely open about his feelings. I think Jane was just trying to let that fan know "masculinity" does not equal a man. Anyways, back to spoilers. I'm really hoping Season 5 is actually focused on "Swan" and that's not just a fakeout for something else. I wasn't too worried about 5A being Emma-focused, it's always the spring arc that makes me nervous. Also, didn't Adam & Eddy tease a "hot" kiss in the finale? Did I totally miss that part of the episode? Edited May 12, 2015 by Curio Link to comment
Souris May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) This is just indicative of how little I trust the writers and how much I think they bait SQ! Didn't they tease a kiss that wouldn't work in the general manner of a TLK? What was that??? Edited May 12, 2015 by Souris Link to comment
RadioGirl27 May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) First press release for Season 5 “ONCE UPON A TIME” (Season 5)Master storytellers Edward Kitsis and Adam Horowitz (“Lost,” “Tron: Legacy”) invite everyone to join Emma Swan, Snow White, Prince Charming, the Evil Queen, Hook, Rumplestiltskin and all the other resident fairy tale characters as they cope with Emma’s new role as the dark one and they begin the search for Merlin.“Once Upon a Time” stars Ginnifer Goodwin as Snow White/Mary Margaret, Jennifer Morrison as Emma Swan, Lana Parrilla as the Evil Queen/Regina, Josh Dallas as Prince Charming/David, Emilie de Ravin as Belle, Colin O’Donoghue as Hook, Jared S. Gilmore as Henry Mills, Michael Socha as Will Scarlet and Robert Carlyle as Rumplestiltskin/Mr. Gold.Executive producers are Edward Kitsis, Adam Horowitz, Steve Pearlman and David H. Goodman. “Once Upon a Time” is produced by ABC Studios. Master storytellers.... Edited May 12, 2015 by RadioGirl27 3 Link to comment
YaddaYadda May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 Didn't they tease a kiss that wouldn't work in the general manner of a TLK? What was that??? I'm pretty sure they didn't. I think that what they were alluding to was how everyone would get out of the AU which happened to be Henry using Regina's blood as "savior" blood because she sacrificed herself for Henry. I see the press release. Do I dare hope that Robin and Zelena will not be fixtures on the show next season? I will be on a ledge somewhere if that's the case. I doubt a man in a cape will come save me. 1 Link to comment
sharky May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) Well, anything can happen is obvious. We've seen that before. But the "masculinity is fluid" could be any number of things. A heroine saying to a stereotypical hero that "The only person who saves me is me." Or I think some people have suggested that Merlin and Morgana may be the same person in Camelot. Or could it even be more than that? Maybe Merlin IS a woman in the Once world. We've seen what these "twists" from these writers look like. It was vague as all hell and I don't even think Jane has any idea about what's really going to happen next season yet. Maybe we should considering closing the spoiler thread for a few weeks until we actually start getting real spoilers? ETA: And seriously, no Robin or Zelena in the release but Socha is there? Robin and Zelena got more screen time in the second half than Socha all season! That guy must have some blackmail on A&E. Robin and Zelena will be back. It's probably just a technicality right now. Edited May 12, 2015 by sharky Link to comment
Souris May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 First press release for Season 5 Master storytellers.... That seems pretty much word-for-word to the press release for S4, just with Merlin & Dark One Emma replacing what they had for S4. I think it was about Elsa IIRC. But I remember the "master storytellers" term from that release. 1 Link to comment
Selina K May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 Master storytellers Edward Kitsis and Adam Horowitz (“Lost,” “Tron: Legacy”) invite everyone to join Emma Swan, Snow White, Prince Charming, the Evil Queen, Hook, Rumplestiltskin and all the other resident fairy tale characters as they cope with Emma’s new role as the dark one and they begin the search for Merlin. "Cope" with Emma's new role is actually more encouraging in some ways to me than 'search for Emma' or 'locate Emma.' I'm sure I'm reading into it, but it seems slightly more like Emma may be accessible rather than have disappeared. 2 Link to comment
OnceUponAJen May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 I wonder if Emma will be a part of the search for Merlin regardless of her Dark One status? Link to comment
Curio May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) "Cope" with Emma's new role is actually more encouraging in some ways to me than 'search for Emma' or 'locate Emma.' I'm sure I'm reading into it, but it seems slightly more like Emma may be accessible rather than have disappeared. Yeah, that's how I interpreted it too. But it would be strange if she's in Storybrooke right when we return in Season 5. It'll seem like a cop out to have her disappear from the street, only to be somewhere like the loft or Granny's completely transformed into the Dark One. With the dramatic way the cloud overtook her and what the show hinted about Merlin, my first impression was that she was taken to Camelot. Edited May 12, 2015 by Curio Link to comment
Mathius May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 I believe it's too early to announce who's been promoted to regular. Megan Ory and Emilie De Raven didn't get confirmed until June, and Colin O'Donaghue even later than that. Only MRJ got confirmed as a new regular straight away after the S2 finale, and Michael Socha actually got confirmed much earlier, right when OUATIW ended and S3 was still going on. So yeah, expect announcements of new regulars like Sean and Rebecca in June. Link to comment
mjgchick May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 I wonder if Emma will be a part of the search for Merlin regardless of her Dark One status? She has to be because I'm convinced Merlin and Mal had a one night stand. Emma promised Lily she'd help her right? I get the feeling we'll probably see Emma struggle with the darkness AGAIN but this time she might actually end up doing something she'll regret. Even though it feels like S5 is Emma heavy I thought S4 was going to be Emma heavy and she really just had late S4A. Link to comment
RadioGirl27 May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 "Cope" with Emma's new role is actually more encouraging in some ways to me than 'search for Emma' or 'locate Emma.' I'm sure I'm reading into it, but it seems slightly more like Emma may be accessible rather than have disappeared. I wonder if Emma will be a part of the search for Merlin regardless of her Dark One status? I hope so, but I think it's going to be something more along the lines of them having to cope with all the evil things Emma is going to do as the Dark One while they try to find Merlin before it's too late to save her. They are putting way to much emphasis in #darkswan not to go with it. 1 Link to comment
Serena May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) From the Upfronts, I don't know if Paul Lee said it? Next season "will be a big one", hashtag dark Emma. Edited May 12, 2015 by Serena Link to comment
KingOfHearts May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 From the Upfronts, I don't know if Paul Lee said it? Next season "will be a big one", hashtag dark Emma. *over-analysis activated* Could that mean it's a full 22-episode arc? 2 Link to comment
Curio May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 Could that mean it's a full 22-episode arc? I'm hoping so. Didn't an interview with Adam & Eddy come out recently where they said they were going away from the split season structure for Season 5? That would lend credence to Emma being the Dark One for the entire season. 1 Link to comment
RadioGirl27 May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) *over-analysis activated* Could that mean it's a full 22-episode arc? I think the Camelot stuff would last all season, like Operation Mongoose. But there would be two Storybrooke arcs: Dark Emma in the fall, and baby mama drama with Regina and Zelena in the spring. No way they are going to have Regina in the background all season.Really, I just don't want a whole season of Dark One Emma being all evil and pushing Snow, Charming and Hook away. Edited May 12, 2015 by RadioGirl27 1 Link to comment
KingOfHearts May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 (edited) But there would be two Storybrooke arcs: Dark Emma in the fall, and baby mama drama with Regina and Zelena in the spring. No way they are going to have Regina in the background all season. You know they're going to kill off Robin and start a spin-off of Regina and Zelena mothering Roland and Little Wicked. Edited May 12, 2015 by KingOfHearts Link to comment
retrograde May 12, 2015 Share May 12, 2015 I'm pretty sure the last interview I saw with Adam and Eddy about the season structure said they would do half seasons again. Link to comment
YaddaYadda May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 I'm pretty sure the last interview I saw with Adam and Eddy about the season structure said they would do half seasons again. That's what they said they were doing, but I don't think the whole Merlin/Emma issue will be resolved in half a season. Maybe they should leave 5A on a cliffhanger and I don't think they can resist the 2 hour finale format. I actually like the 2 hour finales. Link to comment
Watt May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 When is comic con? I need this scene spoiled already. Link to comment
KingOfHearts May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 (edited) When is comic con? I need this scene spoiled already. July 9th, I believe. They said they prefer the split-season structure, so we still are getting that. It may just be that the A and B arcs are more closely linked than ever this time around, like finding Merlin in A and then doing what they need to with Merlin in B. That's what I'm hoping for. More continuity and less difference, al a S2. At least they kept Cora and Hook at that point to keep it connected. Edited May 13, 2015 by KingOfHearts Link to comment
Mathius May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 They said they prefer the split-season structure, so we still are getting that. It may just be that the A and B arcs are more closely linked than ever this time around, like finding Merlin in A and then doing what they need to with Merlin in B. Link to comment
Souris May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 (edited) Really, I just don't want a whole season of Dark One Emma being all evil and pushing Snow, Charming and Hook away. Amen. I just can't see how I'm going to find this arc entertaining. A lot of people are excited about it, because they seem to think it's going to be some epic Captain Swan love story. But I think they're expecting too much and are going to end up really disappointed, because it's TS, TW, the kings of lack of payoff. It's not like they're suddenly going to stop focusing on Regina, master the arts of pacing and payoff, and start delving into rich character studies. You know they're going to kill off Robin and start a spin-off of Regina and Zelena mothering Roland and Little Wicked. I only wish this were true, so they'd be encapsulated far away from the mothershow. Edited May 13, 2015 by Souris 1 Link to comment
MMR May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 Regina (of course, who else) and Hook in new ABC upfront promo! http://scandalrehab.tumblr.com/post/118825955995/abc-upfront-opening-video 1 Link to comment
sharky May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 This tumblr post does a great job with rounding up spoilers from the beginning of season 4 with how they actually played out -- or didn't. Explanations about Will and Ana seem to be at the top of the "What the hell happened with that?" list. 3 Link to comment
Souris May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 Great post. They just say shit without it having any basis in reality, don't they? It's crappy to promise fans things and then not deliver. Link to comment
sharky May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 And yet we still never learn and come back here to dissect every single word they say. What is wrong with us? 3 Link to comment
YaddaYadda May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 I don't necessarily think that they lie as much as they drop stuff because of the next "exciting" idea. When I look at the season as a whole, there's no way they can fit everything in. I think what they need to do is stop saying "we will address this right off the bat" because they never address anything. Remember how they said they were going to address whatever went down with Emma and her parents. We got barely 30 seconds of that before Emma and Snowing were done in 4x17. A&E's pacing sucks and I think that if they make plans for the season, they should just stick with them. This is our arc for the season and then the smaller arcs. In no way should they focus everything on newcomers and I think they should just drop the flashbacks unless they are necessary. I'm assuming Merlin will get his fair share of backstory and it seems that Lily will be sticking around because newbie Lily's father is clearly someone super important. Meanwhile, we know nothing about Hook's parents, so I'm guessing they are completely irrelevant. Emma's own backstory is sort of irrelevant. We get it only when it's needed to bring in new characters (see: Neal, Ingrid and Lily). Knowing that we will have to contend with Zelena and her pregnancy next season makes me wanna break in hives. 2 Link to comment
RadioGirl27 May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 This tumblr post does a great job with rounding up spoilers from the beginning of season 4 with how they actually played out -- or didn't. Explanations about Will and Ana seem to be at the top of the "What the hell happened with that?" list. We knew all this but it's quite frustrating to see it written. And they have forgoten about "we will see Emma fighting for Hook". Hook and Will are the characters that are mentioned more times in that post, so I guess that unless Merlin is both Hook's father and the reason why Will is in Storybrooke and not with Ana in Wonderland, we can forget about getting some backstory for these two. Link to comment
FurryFury May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 I do hope that Zelena's pregnancy will be this year's Home Office. I mean, everyone hated it. Everyone. 6 Link to comment
retrograde May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 I dunno, I'm willing to cut them some slack on this. Fans and the media beg for spoilers and to know when we'll learn about X, but ultimately, plans change because of time, budget, logistical, and creative reasons and that's not unreasonable. 3 Link to comment
KingOfHearts May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 (edited) I wouldn't be surprised if 4B was changed due to the availability of guest stars like Rebecca Mader and Eion Bailey. I believe Zelena's pregnancy was written in to give her a reason to be a secondary character and keep her relevant. I would love for them to ditch the idea in 5x01, but I doubt they will unless they find another way to hook her up to the main stories. She's the other character they're perpetually in love with. Edited May 13, 2015 by KingOfHearts Link to comment
RadioGirl27 May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 I dunno, I'm willing to cut them some slack on this. Fans and the media beg for spoilers and to know when we'll learn about X, but ultimately, plans change because of time, budget, logistical, and creative reasons and that's not unreasonable. For me there is a big difference between saying something like "we would see a different Blue Fairy in the finale" and then not showing her because the actress is not available or there's not time, and saying "of course we are going to explain why Will Scarlett is in Storybrooke", "we are going to see more of Hook's backstory" (they have been saying this for two seasons now) or "we are going to see Emma fighting for Hook" and then nothing. Because it's not the same thing a sighting of a recurring character, than the backstory of a regular one, especially when the show has spent so much time explaining the backstories of so many recurring characters. At this point I'm pretty sure we are never going to know anything about Hook's childhood or about Anastasia's whereabouts. And if they don't want to tell those stories, fine, but they should just say it. It's not that difficult: "Hook's past is not important, what is important is his present and his future with Emma", or "Ana and Will are now divorced, and she is living in Wonderland with the Rabbit". And it's also different to say something before the season start shooting than say it when you have it almost written. When they said before 4B started that they were going to explain why Will was in Storybrooke, they knew it was a lie, because a big part of the half season was already written and yet, they said it. 1 Link to comment
YaddaYadda May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 we are going to see Emma fighting for Hook As they say, let it go! At this point I'm pretty sure we are never going to know anything about Hook's childhood or about Anastasia's whereabouts. If Hook's childhood is not relevant, then it's not relevant. They said we're supposed to find out about his father, I think. I'm assuming that has been moved. As far as Anastasia is concerned, I really think this whole thing got fucked up by Frozen. They probably planned on doing something, but even Will was barely on and Michael Socha has a contract. Link to comment
RadioGirl27 May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 If Hook's childhood is not relevant, then it's not relevant. They said we're supposed to find out about his father, I think. But that's the point, if it's not relevant, then they should say so and not answer with a yes everytime they ask them if we are going to learn something about it. It's been two seasons now that they have been saying that we are going to get more of Hook's backstory, and then nothing. And, maybe, they should consider that if the fans and the media keep asking about it, it's because they care and want to know something about it. 1 Link to comment
HoodlumSheep May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 Personally I thought I saw the "Emma fighting for hook" a little bit in 4b, but maybe I'm just plain loopy or something. Like, it wasn't literal, but I could see it a little here and there. Anyways, I do wish A&E would give clear cut answers though, but I guess that might be hard seeing how it always seems like they fall victim to the "shiny new toy" syndrome. Like how the whole magic vs science got tossed aside quickly for Neverland, or Frozen booting out Wonderland stuff, etc. Link to comment
YaddaYadda May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 (edited) She didn't go through the grand gestures that Hook has gone though for her, but she sure as hell defended him and tried to protect him. Oh and she also saved his life. I think all of this stems from the utter garbage we got in 4x11 anyway. Edited May 13, 2015 by YaddaYadda 3 Link to comment
Rumsy4 May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 I feel like more time is spent overanalyzing potential Qb on social media by the writers than on the Show in this thread. I doubt Jane Espenson meant anything SQ positive in her tweet. She didn't go through the grand gestures that Hook has gone though for her, but she sure as hell defended him and tried to protect him. I'm still bitter about the 4A finale, and the lack of resolution to the heart-plot with regards to CS. But Emma was very supportive of Hook through S4. I also liked the way Emma slowly opened up to her relationship with Hook. In 4B she was really free with him, and seemed very lovey dovey. Whatever Adam and Eddy might say, kissing scenes don't makeup for actual conversations, but of all the main couples in the Show, CS had the best scenes together this half-season. I can't believe Socha is still a regular for next season. Why does he even want to be in this Show?? He can't be that desperate for a job. Much as I dislike Robin Hood, it makes more sense to have Sean as a regular that either Will, or for that matter--Belle. 1 Link to comment
FurryFury May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 Why does he even want to be in this Show?? Money, dear sir. 3 Link to comment
Curio May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 (edited) I can't believe Socha is still a regular for next season. Why does he even want to be in this Show?? Yeah, I feel bad for the guy. He goes from being one of the most interesting and integral parts of one Once show to being completely dropped and forgotten on the mother show. And to rub salt in the wound, they drop his search for Anastasia in favor of the brand new Lily character no one* cares about and how we need to search for her dad next season. Why is Lily's dad so much more important than Anastasia? *Okay, maybe some people are interested in Lily. But generally speaking, it's hard to connect with a character who the writers literally just introduced this season and was tacked onto a godawful egg baby plot. Edited May 13, 2015 by Curio 1 Link to comment
FurryFury May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 The only good thing I can say about Lily is that I don't hate her (yet). Which is, really, more that I can say about half of the characters of this show at this point. 3 Link to comment
Curio May 13, 2015 Share May 13, 2015 I don't hate Lily, but I'm extremely apathetic to her. Which is almost just as bad. She and Maleficent could be dropped and never mentioned again on the show and I wouldn't even care. Same with Zelena. But if they suddenly dropped Will and never followed through on his search for Anastasia, I'd be upset. But hopefully Socha being a regular next season means he'll actually be involved with the search for Merlin. Then again, he was a regular this season and did diddly squat. Link to comment
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