Ratings and Scheduling: Hail to the Gods

[Balaclava]

That is a very good point--there are more than a few Felicity Smoak fans who aren't Olicity shippers. The only reason I say don't piss off the Olicity shippers is that they're usually the ones being the most vocal and organizing all of the promo campaigns that the network loves.

Long story short--they would be complete imbeciles to kill her off, even if they thought it would create good drama.

 

And you are absolutely correct about that, i was just trying to point that beyond the shippers there are other types of fans to take in account, not saying you didn't.

[Morrigan2575]

Just checked, the Contracts are with Tribune not Clearwire, don't know where I got Clearwire from.

Looks like The CW has 3 major deals to work out, Netflix, Hulu and Tribune. Based on this article negotiations will start in earnest in January.

http://deadline.com/2015/09/cw-tribune-deal-renewal-talks-netflix-hulu-1201505947/

Hmmm. I wonder if we'll even have a CW next year (probably) but it's interesting to think about.

[Balaclava]

Yeah, the CW is deeply engrained in social media. They force actors and EPs to get on Twitter and engage fans. They also do a lot of promotion via social media.

 

i totally agree, when you have GB and others thanking people that watched and tweeted the show live, that should tell you something about how much they care. I actually saw GB asking people to tweet Blindspot ep live, and this is a show that has a 2.4 demo and is on NBC 

Edited October 11, 2015 by Balaclava

[Primal Slayer]

I've wondered about CWs deal with Netflix, I don't see what Netflix exactly gets out of the deal? They don't get the shows any earlier. I guess it is just streaming rights vs. Amazon Prime?

[TwistedandBored]

Doesn't CW also benefit from Overseas deals with Brazil/London/Paris being a huge market for them. The reason why they keep bringing back these low rated shows I am told is because of they make huge money from abroad.

[Edited by mod: please don't speculate as to whether specific countries are part of a particular fandom.]

Edited October 11, 2015 by MuuMuuChainsmoker

[quarks]

I've wondered about CWs deal with Netflix, I don't see what Netflix exactly gets out of the deal? They don't get the shows any earlier. I guess it is just streaming rights vs. Amazon Prime?

 

They pay to have another show that viewers can stream, which until Netflix has more original content, helps them draw in subscribers which then allows them to produce more original content. How long that model is going to last is anyone's guess, but for right now, offering several seasons of multiple shows does seem to working for Netflix and Amazon Prime, though Amazon's prime interest (sorry) seems to be drawing people to its website for retail sales.

 

WB does make money on overseas deals with CW shows.

[kismet]

Greys Anatomy centers around Meredith Grey, who the show is named after. They just aren't as tight as they are with Arrow. Even Buffy centered around Buffy but had characters do their own thing. Oliver at some point would have to learn to live for himself and of course killing off Felicity would be a big test for him. But either way as you said, Arrow centers around Oliver. Felicity is not Oliver just as Laurel isn't Oliver. Either could go, neither most likely wont.

But of course we get to spend the next 5 months seeing people speculate away and get emotional over the possibility of their favorite possibly leaving.

Grey's Anatomy was a pun. Grey's Anatomy is actually a text book that used to be required or at least part of the fundamentals of Medical School. It also happens to be Meredith's last name. Shonda is that smart & crafty. The premise of the show is following a group of residents learning to be surgeons and human beings. Every year the residents gain more experience and become the teachers. So cast can organically replace & replenish itself. Similar to how LoT is now being set-up in a way that can organically replace/replenish superhero team members.

Meredith is one of the central characters. But it is not just her story. There have been core central characters that get a focus every year. However, the show could probably survive a few seasons if Meredith was killed. It has survived the loss of Izzy, George, Cristina, Addison, McSteamy, Lexi - the list could go on. Granted Meredith is one of the cornerstones so it would be a loss & a hit if they killed her. But the show could probably survive, esp since they now named the Hospital "Grey-Sloan Hospital". You probably kill of every Grey and still have the legacy of the Greys, if the writers were still turning out scripts and characters people wanted to watch. Arrow is not as fortunate to do that. Without OQ & SA, there is no ARROW - unless they get creative perhaps with his son. They would have to establish a new Arrow, before it would make sense to keep ARROW as a show and not just spin it off if their is another viable story/character.

However to make a correlation back to Arrow, OQ is the main character of ARROW, his designated LI is FS. Everything he does is somehow intertwined with her, just as everything MG did was somehow intertwined with McDreamy. The characters are more than just fan favs they are cornerstones of the show's premise. Losing McDreamy was a shock, but the pairing had also spun itself for 11yrs in every situation. It needed a new injection. Now if ARROW is fortunate enough to run 11 seasons, I can see them killing the LI that fuels their hero's journey. Or if there are backstage shenanigans, contracts disputes or actors wanting out as people have alluded above. Everybody else was expendable to Meredith's journey except Derek; just like everyone else is expendable to Oliver's journey except Felicity. There will be a time when the writers decide to pursue what happens when their Hero loses his LI, and at that time I think there will be a drop in the ratings. I think it will hit ARROW harder, because it won't have as many other stories & characters to insulate its fall.

[kismet]

Just checked, the Contracts are with Tribune not Clearwire, don't know where I got Clearwire from.

Looks like The CW has 3 major deals to work out, Netflix, Hulu and Tribune. Based on this article negotiations will start in earnest in January.

http://deadline.com/2015/09/cw-tribune-deal-renewal-talks-netflix-hulu-1201505947/

Hmmm. I wonder if we'll even have a CW next year (probably) but it's interesting to think about.

Maybe SA will get his wish and be able to take the show to a place that is less restrictive on sex & violence.

 

Although, I really think the CW will find some way to survive. They always seem to make it out.

[bijoux]

Maybe SA will get his wish and be able to take the show to a place that is less restrictive on sex & violence.

 

When did he say he wanted that? Inquiring mind wants to know. ;)

[kismet]

When did he say he wanted that? Inquiring mind wants to know. ;)

It was at one of the cons around the time they filmed 320 & Paley Fest. ;) (You know the time when he had very little chill at times).

 

I guess after working on Hung, it must seem a little restrictive to be in a 8pm slot on network. I will say for all of the restrictions that ep still managed to be very steamy & romantic all at the same time. That being said, can you imagine the crazy that could ensue if some of the censor restrictions were lifted.

Edited October 11, 2015 by kismet

[bijoux]

Yeah, I'm not sure I would have wanted less censorship when Oliver and Laurel got it on in S1. What we saw was plenty awkward as it was. And 3x20 was fine (and foine) just as we had it.

Edited October 11, 2015 by bijoux

[Morrigan2575]

Maybe SA will get his wish and be able to take the show to a place that is less restrictive on sex & violence.

Although, I really think the CW will find some way to survive. They always seem to make it out.

Pretty sure The CW will survive. Not sure any Premium Cable Network would pick it up. At best, I could see it going to Syfy or maybe TNT.

[kismet]

Only premium i could see is Starz and that's with very bad odds. Maybe the new Freeform network (formerly known as ABCfamily) might want it. I can't see any cable network really wanting Arrow. I could see reruns but not to takeover production.

Perhaps a streaming network would be willing to foot production costs. Hulu might want to get more into superheroes. It does stream well.

But its not a ratings juggernaut and it doesn't have A list talent that has tge big name draw. At best wherever it goes, I see it more as riding the Flash's coattails which would be an ironic turn.

It might all be mute because I really think the CW will land on its feet. And even if it has to merge, I believe Arrow is strong enough that it would survive the merger.

[tv echo]

I guess I am only going to speak for myself then.  If they kill Felicity, I am going to stop watching Arrow, Flash, LoT and Vixen because they're a shared universe and watching them would just remind me of the huge hole left by her absence.  I've already stopped watching BlindSpot (boring) and never watched Mysteries of Laura.  As for Supergirl, it hasn't debuted yet, so I don't know if I'll love it enough to overcome my anger at the EPs.

 

Oh, and I had recently planned to buy (finally) the DVDs for Seasons 1 through 3 of Arrow.  But after watching the ending of 401, I think I'm going to wait until after Season 4 is over to decide.  I'm not going to waste my money on tragedy.

Edited October 11, 2015 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

To echo TV Echo, yeah if they kill Felicity I'm 100% out of The Flarrowverse. I have no desire to watch Supergirl and never watched Laura. The only one I'd still watch is Blindspot at least until that show goes down the drain.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[Princess Vanellope]

I guess I am only going to speak for myself then. If they kill Felicity, I am going to stop watching Arrow, Flash, LoT and Vixen because they're a shared universe and watching them would just remind me of the huge hole left by her absence. I've already stopped watching BlindSpot (boring) and never watched Mysteries of Laura. As for Supergirl, it hasn't debuted yet, so I don't know if I'll love it enough to overcome my anger at the EPs.

Oh, and I had recently planned to buy (finally) the DVDs for Seasons 1 through 3 of Arrow. But after watching the ending of 401, I think I'm going to wait until after Season 4 is over to decide. I'm not going to waste my money on tragedy.

I absolutely agree. If they kill off Felicity, I want nothing to do with any of the shows. I think you make a good point. Would people continue to watch Flash and LoT as well? After all, Barry would be a continual reminder to me that Felicity is gone. Same with Ray and Sara. I don't know if it would happen that way, but it would be interesting to see if it affected ratings on all three shows. That being said, I don't think it's her.

[Sakura12]

Killing Felicity wouldn't get me to stop watching all the shows because she's not part of the cast of those other shows. I like Felicity/EBR but I'm not that invested in her. So her absence on Arrow wouldn't effect the other shows for me. Mostly since I've already given up on Arrow and am only watching for Sara's episodes, once she's gone so is my viewing of Arrow.

 

I'm giving the Flash a second chance to see if it can get better, I'm excited for LoT for CL, AD, VG and WM. Blindspot is mindless entertainment and nothing else is on at that time for me. I'll either watch it live or let it collect on my DVR and watch them later. 

[Primal Slayer]

I highly doubt people would stage a protest in not watching all the Arrowverse shows. Felicity is a popular character but she does not have any power over Flashs ratings nor would she over LoT. They don't exist because of her and Flash is not the highest rated show on TheCW because of her.

[Morrigan2575]

I absolutely agree. If they kill off Felicity, I want nothing to do with any of the shows. I think you make a good point. Would people continue to watch Flash and LoT as well? After all, Barry would be a continual reminder to me that Felicity is gone. Same with Ray and Sara. I don't know if it would happen that way, but it would be interesting to see if it affected ratings on all three shows. That being said, I don't think it's her.

I have to agree with Quarks and Sakura the theoretical killing off of Felicity would have 0 impact on other shows, except for me personally. I quit Arrow because of Sara, I'm also only watching LoT because of Sara. However if they theoretically killed off Felicity I would drop all 3 shows but that's just me.

[apinknightmare]

My viewing of The Flash is intermittent, and any death on Arrow wouldn't change that. Barry continuing to be a moron while having everyone around him coddle him would, though. We'll see how that goes. 

 

I'm not interested in watching LoT, but I'll probably check out the pilot and see if it grabs me. If it does grab me, I'd watch no matter who bites it on Arrow.

 

I wouldn't watch Arrow without Felicity, because I tried and I thought it was...well, boring. I did give it another chance because I knew Felicity was being brought into the fold (thank you, Tumblr and Arrow-watching friends!). I wouldn't continue not only just because of Felicity being gone, but because I'm really tired of life shitting all over Oliver, and I'm ready for him to stop losing people he cares about. The show doesn't have to be The Flash in tone, but I do need the misery porn to stop where Oliver is concerned, and killing off yet another girlfriend would signal that we're still going down that path, and no thank you. 

Edited October 11, 2015 by apinknightmare

[Angel12d]

Yeah, I don't think anyone is saying that there would be a huge protest in not watching Arrowverse shows. People can only speak for themselves here. I'm with others though, if Felicity dies I won't watch any of the shows but I only watch the crossover stuff anyway so it wouldn't be a huge deal for me.

[Princess Vanellope]

I highly doubt people would stage a protest in not watching all the Arrowverse shows. Felicity is a popular character but she does not have any power over Flashs ratings nor would she over LoT. They don't exist because of her and Flash is not the highest rated show on TheCW because of her.

No one said she was? I do think, however, that there would be fans that would stop watching all 3. Would they all stop? No. But here alone you've had several people say they would.

But again, I doubt the network would give permission to kill off the female character on the show who consistently gets them positive media attention and has a particularly large fanbase. So there's really no reason to talk about it anymore, is there?

[Primal Slayer]

Speculating if her possible death would affect the ratings of all 3 shows basically would be saying that she holds a lot of power over the Arrowverse which is what I was replying to, that speculation.

[apinknightmare]

I need a death speculation free zone, where I can discuss the show as if that last minute hadn't happened, because we're only four days in to a potential 6-month wait (hopefully less), and I'm already over it. Is there such a place? It seems like heaven. 

[Primal Slayer]

If it did is speculation. Which is perfectly fine.

[Ann Mack]

I guess I am only going to speak for myself then.  If they kill Felicity, I am going to stop watching Arrow, Flash, LoT and Vixen because they're a shared universe and watching them would just remind me of the huge hole left by her absence.  I've already stopped watching BlindSpot (boring) and never watched Mysteries of Laura.  As for Supergirl, it hasn't debuted yet, so I don't know if I'll love it enough to overcome my anger at the EPs.

 

Oh, and I had recently planned to buy (finally) the DVDs for Seasons 1 through 3 of Arrow.  But after watching the ending of 401, I think I'm going to wait until after Season 4 is over to decide.  I'm not going to waste my money on tragedy.

YES so I'm not alone in thinking that "Blindspot" is boring. I watched the first 2 episodes and they were both yawnfests. I mean for someone with amnesia she really is remembering quite a bit. The fight scenes are laughable. 2 episodes in a row she fought someone back into an apartment and the dude can't even bother to remember his name right now had to come and pull her off the person. Both lead and co-lead are as dry as un-buttered toast. The only reason I can see for it getting more episodes order is that almost EVERY new fall show this season is SUCKING really bad. 

 

As for killing off Felicity if they (the EPs and showrunner) are that moronic then they need to lose viewers. They build Oliver and Felicity for 2-1/2 seasons and then demolish what they built in 1, yeah that's gonna go over fine with those who love Felicity/Olicity (and I'm not even talking about hard-core shippers). You have articles speaking about how they are the heart and soul (Felicity and Oliver) of the show. If you take away the heart than the soul doesn't matter because it will no longer have a means by which to exist. So what are the chances of a good survival rate so to speak if they kill off Felicity? It may continue on life support for a few episodes (maybe even a season). If this is the moment they think they can move Laurel/BC back into his life than they really are DUMBER than I thought, can they be that dumb?. Rightfully Arrow (Stephen Amell himself as the Arrow) gets and should get a lot of publicity but Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) without even being his designated love interest at the time was getting a lot too more than any other character on the show. I think Laurel Hurley (or something like that) wrote "Oliver might survive the loss of Felicity, but the Arrow can't", wise words my dear wise words.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Ann Mack

[Angel12d]

I need a death speculation free zone, where I can discuss the show as if that last minute hadn't happened, because we're only four days in to a potential 6-month wait (hopefully less), and I'm already over it. Is there such a place? It seems like heaven. 

 

PLEASE TAKE ME THERE.

[BkWurm1]

I do currently watch Flash regularly and am looking forward to LoT.  If something happened to Felicity, I'd would stop Flash because there are just too many intertwined mentions and any mention of anything Arrow related would kill any enjoyment of Flash.  The same likely would be the case with LoT but the shows that aren't in the Arrowverse wouldn't be affected.  I hate Mysteries of Laura and I'm not sure about Blindspot, (the lead guy is kind of awful) but Supergirl would have to be pretty bad for me to skip it.

 

 

BUT, I agree with apinknightmare.  We won't survive with our sanity intact if we don't get a break from the speculation.  Not sure how to accomplish it or where a safe zone could be established but I'm open to suggestions.

[MuuMuuChainsmoker]

Hi

 

Given the strong feelings/angst aroused by the last scene in Ep 1, the Arrow mods will discuss where the best place for people to speculate on who will be killed.  

 

In the mean time, let's try to limit the death speculation to the Episode 1 thread, the Spoiler Discussion thread or the Hopes and Fears thread.   It's only tangentially on topic for the Ratings threads and it's starting to become all death speculation, all the time.

 

And now for something non-death related:

 

https://www.facebook.com/BivoirCavies/videos/1681391515414298/ 

 

 

[wonderwall]

Can we just ban all death talk? Pretty please??? :p I know it's unlikely but still

[MuuMuuChainsmoker]

Can we just ban all death talk? Pretty please??? :p I know it's unlikely but still

 

I can't even get y'all to stop talking about how various fandoms feel, so......   :P 

[wonderwall]

I can't even get y'all to stop talking about how various fandoms feel, so...... :P

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[dtissagirl]

Live +3 numbers:

 

CW Live +3 numbers for Tues./Weds.: “Flash” 1.4 to 2.2, “iZombie” 0.7 to 1.0, “Arrow” 1.1 to 1.6, “SPN” 0.9 to 1.4.

 

https://twitter.com/TVbytheNumbers/statuses/653679746857877504

[Morrigan2575]

That's one hell of a jump for The Flash.

[kismet]

I feel like FLASH is getting mainstream press. It feels like more people are hearing about it who don't watch the CW. Whereas the other shows are just "CW shows" (no offense meant). FLASH feels more like a main network show in its advertisements and press. You hear about it on the radio, it got mentioned in the EMMY's prime-time broadcast. I wonder if that is why more people are tuning in to see what the buzz is all about. I don't know how long the influence will last, but it might be getting a bump from its mainstream buzz.

[Velocity23]

Flash always had big jumps in DVR though.

[dtissagirl]

Twelve hundred billion episodes of Sheldon Cooper talking about the Flash in the past decade.

[AyChihuahua]

That's one hell of a jump for The Flash.

Especially for a pretty crappy and boring episode.  (Not just my opinion, most reviewers seemed to feel the same.)

[Angel12d]

LOL those ratings. *sips tea*

Edited October 12, 2015 by Angel12d

[Primal Slayer]

I think The Flash will continue to get a good amount of press, just wait until the actual movie comes out and all the comparisons it will get in the media. Which brings me to: DC REALLY should cross promote their shows with their movies. Put trailers for the tv shows in theaters when the movies come out.

[kismet]

Especially for a pretty crappy and boring episode.  (Not just my opinion, most reviewers seemed to feel the same.)

TBH it was a boring episode IMO, perhaps not crappy - but not much to want a re-watch IMO. But people don't necessarily know that before they tune in. And a lot of people don't read reviews.

 

It will be interesting to see if week-after-week they can continue to have that jump. Hopefully ARROW can also maintain if not increase their ratings jump too.

[Chaser]

It looks like everything got a pretty good jump.

Happy for Arrow

[BkWurm1]

You know what I'm really surprised at is how many people still watch live.

Edited October 13, 2015 by BkWurm1

[Morrigan2575]

It looks like everything got a pretty good jump.

Happy for Arrow

With the exception of Flash which normally doesn't have much of a jump, all of the other increases are on par with their normal Live +7 numbers.  

[tv echo]

Digital Audience Ratings (DAR) - TV measures what entertainment content is resonating most across Facebook, Google+, Instagram, Tumblr, YouTube and Wikipedia combined. For the week of Oct. 5 - 11, 2015, Arrow was ranked #9 among broadcast programs (just behind The Flash)...

 

http://variety.com/2015/digital/news/snl-jumps-on-trump-shadowhunters-makes-debut-1201615787/

[Morrigan2575]

http://www.spoilertv.com/2015/10/ratings-news-15th-october-2015.html

 

Arrow - 0.9 18-49A and 2.47 million

Supernatural - 0.8 18-49A and 1.88 million.

 

Interestingly enough 302 had a 2 tenths drop from 301...I guess fans really don't like those last minute episode deaths :D

[Velocity23]

Final ratings!

[benteen]

Arrow got a big jump in the ratings last season when they did the Flash crossover.  I can't help but think it's eventually not going to be that big during the next big crossover (well, maybe after next season) if they keep having characters from both shows crossover so regularly and matter-of-factly.

[Angel12d]

Not surprised it dropped. They usually do after the premiere anyway. But I wouldn't be surprised if the flash-forward put some people off. I know it took the shine off the episode for me and one of my colleagues was like 'Oh, well, I don't wanna watch anymore now.'

Edited October 15, 2015 by Angel12d

[Chaser]

The ratings are still a positive when compared to last year's. I'm sure the brass is happy.