Star Wars Rebels - General Discussion

[VCRTracking]

GREAT episode!  Loved Hera's Ryloth accent slipping out when she's angry. Vanessa Marshall did an outstanding job as always. Also loved the mention of Mace Windu and that moment on the bridge from the "Ryloth Trilogy" of Clone Wars.

 

Other moments I liked were Kanan being nervous about meeting Hera's dad, the teamwork he and Ezra showed in the blast door hallway and Ezra doing the Jedi mind trick for the first time. Like Rey he got it on the second try!

Edited February 18, 2016 by VCRTracking

[ganesh]

Ezra uses the Jedi mind trick and gets the captain of the giant Empire vessel to abandon ship. I guess since the Empire is basically churning out as much military might as possible that there's going to be a lot of weak minded people in positions of authority. Ezra is reasonably strong, but he's no where near Kenobi level. He's untrained and Kanan barely knows what he's doing himself. I'm not calling BS on the whole scene. I'm saying that the Empire is bloated and falling in on itself with a lack of actual talent in positions where it's needed. So really, all the rebels need to do is hold on and wait for a big opening where they can score a huge win. 

I'm probably reading too much into it, but by the time ANH rolls around in a few years, except for a handful of OGs like Tarkin, after about a generation or so, just to maintain the Empire, you've just got grunts everywhere. The Empire got old fast and just moved too slow which lets the Rebels have an easier time of it than one would think. Which is ironic I think because I could argue that the Jedi council got old too, though not as fast, but still a slow moving body, allowing Palpatine to operate right under their noses. When they could have injected some younger talent into the council; i.e., Anakin, and refused to do so because get off my lawn, basically. 

 

It's almost too bad that the whole stealing the plans for the Death Star is going to be an actual movie because this show could really do it right imo. 

[DarkRaichu]

Ezra uses the Jedi mind trick and gets the captain of the giant Empire vessel to abandon ship. I guess since the Empire is basically churning out as much military might as possible that there's going to be a lot of weak minded people in positions of authority. Ezra is reasonably strong, but he's no where near Kenobi level. He's untrained and Kanan barely knows what he's doing himself. I'm not calling BS on the whole scene. I'm saying that the Empire is bloated and falling in on itself with a lack of actual talent in positions where it's needed. So really, all the rebels need to do is hold on and wait for a big opening where they can score a huge win. 

I agree with your points.  Just to further the points, I am going to fanwank the commander of that giant ship was barely a lieutenant and the actual high ranking officer was on the nearby Star Destroyer.  The giant ship was only a floating hangar and not the flagship of that operation.

[ganesh]

That could be too. Still, you've got to have some rank even to be in charge of the hangar. Maybe people are given officer-ships out of patronage and nepotism. 

[benteen]

I wasn't expecting much from The Honorable Ones but I thought it was one of the best episodes that Rebels has had to date.

[ZoqFotPik]

I liked the comparison of Zeb being warmly greeted by his friends to a still injured Kallus barely getting acknowledged by the Imperials. I wonder if what happened on Geonosis will be explored any further.

Obviously it connects to the Death Star, but I wonder if the Crew will learn anything.

Edited February 25, 2016 by ZoqFotPik

[benteen]

One of the early issues of Marvel's Darth Vader comic book series explains what happened to the Geonosians.

[ganesh]

I don't really feel much sympathy for Kallus, but I appreciated the framing of the end. 

[DarkRaichu]

This is hands down the best Star Wars series ever !!  I am afraid to see the Rogue One movie since there is a good chance it will not be as good as this series  :P

[benteen]

That was another great one!  Frank Oz (who hasn't lost a step), James Earl Jones, Jason Isaacs, Matt Lanter...a lot of returning favorite here.  Did not see the reveal about the Jedi Guardian coming.

[VCRTracking]

Well if Ahsoka didn't know Vader was Anakin before, she sure as hell does now! That was a great moment.

 

So the Grand Inquisitor was a Jedi Temple guard?

 

Ahsoka looking back at Yoda's image as the temple was collapsing reminded me of the end of Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.

[call me ishmael]

Well if Ahsoka didn't know Vader was Anakin before, she sure as hell does now! That was a great moment.

 

So the Grand Inquisitor was a Jedi Temple guard?

 

Ahsoka looking back at Yoda's image as the temple was collapsing reminded me of the end of Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.

I thought that was Yoda's acknowledgement that she had been right about the Jedi at that point. Unfortunately, it is hard to see how it will save her.

[ganesh]

Surprising that Yoda took some of the blame (as he should) for the way things are. It latches up nice with the last episode of the Clone Wars. Ok, so he was afraid. He was so afraid of fear leading to the dark side that he didn't do anything? Whoa dude. You needed to abdicate and give someone else a shot.

 

 

I thought that was Yoda's acknowledgement that she had been right about the Jedi at that point.

 

That works for me. Go your own way and trust your instincts. Especially in light of his admission that he didn't do a good job.

 

I'm just hoping she doesn't go off thinking she can turn Vader back and it costs her. That Vader Guilt Trip was rough. I would like it if this show got into why they didn't let Anakin be Master and were so pissy about it. That's way more on the council. Asoka's got nothing to be sorry for. 

 

I do take the point that Ezra's "anger" could lead him to the dark side, but I'm not seeing an angry kid here. I suppose he's scared, and that could lead to 'dark side' decisions. 

 

Nice call again of Ezra communicating with the beasts.

 

So did the Grand Inquisitor die and then become this Guardian thing? I don't know anything about these. Was he one before and somehow Vader 'compelled' him to be the GI? Kanan freed the hold of the dark side by killing him maybe?

[ZoqFotPik]

 

So did the Grand Inquisitor die and then become this Guardian thing? I don't know anything about these. Was he one before and somehow Vader 'compelled' him to be the GI? Kanan freed the hold of the dark side by killing him maybe?

In this weeks Rebels Recon, the creators explain that while all of the inquisitors have Jedi roots, Yoda was behind all of the visions. So the Grand Inquisitor was probably a temple guard at one point, but that wasn't his spirit in the temple. The Temple Guards only appeared in 3 episodes of "The Clone Wars", most prominently Temple Bombing arc.

[DarkRaichu]

Well if Ahsoka didn't know Vader was Anakin before, she sure as hell does now! That was a great moment.

I thought Ahsoka recognized / felt the presence of Anakin in Vader in the 1st episode of season 2.  The vision just gave her confirmation.  I am afraid she is going to try and turn Anakin ("there is a way") and die in the process

 

I do take the point that Ezra's "anger" could lead him to the dark side, but I'm not seeing an angry kid here. I suppose he's scared, and that could lead to 'dark side' decisions. 

Ezra has grown quite attached to the crew of the Ghost.  I could see him angry if one of them is badly hurt or killed

[ganesh]

I could too, but I haven't really seen any evidence of "anger" --> dark side to the degree that the guardian was saying. On the other hand, he could have been playing more on Kanan's fear, since fear was the theme of the episode. That makes more sense, since Kanan admitted he wasn't a Master and had zero experience training a padawan. And if the guardian was just taking on the GI's visage, then indeed the entire thing was set up to instill fear in Kanan.

 

VERY worried about Asoka. I really really like the idea that she's been/will be this shadowy figure throughout the entire saga. I mean, there's no way she can take on Vader. 

[ZoqFotPik]

 

I could too, but I haven't really seen any evidence of "anger" --> dark side to the degree that the guardian was saying. On the other hand, he could have been playing more on Kanan's fear, since fear was the theme of the episode. That makes more sense, since Kanan admitted he wasn't a Master and had zero experience training a padawan. 

I think there have been a few instances of Ezra going dark. In the Princess Leia episode, he beat down a stormtrooper with a level of ferocity that seemed to shock both Leia and Kanan. Also, the thing to remember about Kanan is that he was barely a Padawan himself when Order 66 came down. 

[ganesh]

Eh, eye of the beholder. I suppose they have to show some restraint because it's a kids' show. The only other thing was when Ezea call up the Queen whatever on the Pitch Black base and totally sicced him on the Grand Inquisitor. But Kanan was out of commission and they were both going to die. 

 

It seems like the show is placing more of an emphasis on fear than on anger, as was the case with Anakin. 

Another thing I did like was that Yoda said, "Depends on how you define "winning"." 

[call me ishmael]

I think that there has been a lot of evidence of Ezra's fear though.  And as you say that was the theme of the episode.  And as we know, "fear leads to anger..."  To me the point about Ezra was his growing power and his not realizing that fighting is not always the best option, with Kanan it was about fear of failing Ezra, and with Ahsoka it was about fear of having already failed Anakin.  None of them could face up to the limits of their own power.

[ganesh]

I think it's much much more interesting to explore fear than anger. The prequels were basically just Anakin having a hissy fit and oh darksidenao. 

 

I'd say fear leads to desperation and frustration, which leads to anger which leads to the darkside. The rebels aren't making huge headway, and Kanan and Ezra are being harangued by the Inquisitors a lot. 

 

I think they need some kind of win soon. 

[Terrafamilia]

Heh, Chopper got his own C-3PO.

 

The depot with the buildings atop long stalks reminded me of The Jetsons.

I also kept forcing my suspension of disbelief in trying not to think of how Chopper managed to keep hold of that ambulatory strut throughout all the action.

[ganesh]

I'm not one for the droid stories. This seems the most "kid" of the series to me. Though, I did like that they have backstories for the droids and where they served in the war. I suppose it's a good point that just because their droids, they should have some basic rights, like to not be abused in the workplace. And they did show that the scope of the rebellion seems wider. 

[call me ishmael]

I thought that they would do more with the fact that the imperial droid had been a strategist previously.  If they bring him back I suspect they are setting up something like that.  Was I the only person who thought that he sounded a bit like someone doing an Alan Rickman impersonation?

[frenchtoast]

I thought that they would do more with the fact that the imperial droid had been a strategist previously.  If they bring him back I suspect they are setting up something like that.  Was I the only person who thought that he sounded a bit like someone doing an Alan Rickman impersonation?

Nope, we even looked up to see if it was Alan Rickman. The daughter says, while watching, "That sounds like Snape." (She's a Harry Potter fan and couldn't remember the actor's name) And son's response was, "Well, the droid won't be on anymore because he died."

 

I agree, ganesh, I find the droid stories so childish. And on top of that, I really, really don't like Chopper. At least R2 was loyal to Anakin. This was just a mess. And it also felt waaaay too over the top and kid like. Especially the Imperial commander. 

[ganesh]

Well, it gives credence to my speculation that a lot of the officers/troopers were just not competent because the Empire needed so much personnel. 

[call me ishmael]

I thought that was another example of how this is supposed to be--in part--a kid's show.  They played the imperial officer as a funny lunkhead until he got violent.  It struck me as trying to do too many things at once.  

 

But I also think that this is one of those issues were the Disney desire to throw out the old canon is going to hurt them.  One of the more interesting things about the novels about the years after Palpatine's death was the notion that the Empire--minus the Sith--had a lot of committed people to it who thought it was the only way to gain galactic stability after the Jedi had screwed up.  It was a bit Neo-Augustinian. Granted this is supposed to still be early years but I think that they are now back to episodes 4-6 where all of the lower level imperial officers and soldiers were played as idiots.

[DarkRaichu]

I thought that was another example of how this is supposed to be--in part--a kid's show.  They played the imperial officer as a funny lunkhead until he got violent.  It struck me as trying to do too many things at once.  

 

But I also think that this is one of those issues were the Disney desire to throw out the old canon is going to hurt them.  One of the more interesting things about the novels about the years after Palpatine's death was the notion that the Empire--minus the Sith--had a lot of committed people to it who thought it was the only way to gain galactic stability after the Jedi had screwed up.  It was a bit Neo-Augustinian. Granted this is supposed to still be early years but I think that they are now back to episodes 4-6 where all of the lower level imperial officers and soldiers were played as idiots.

 

The commander was a lowly ranked officer who commanded an Imperial Transport.  It would be illogical for the Empire to put their best and brightest to command such lowly position, especially if they were shorthanded.  As far as his treatment of the droid, it seemed to be in line with "We don't serve their kind here" sentiment seen in New Hope.

 

Also, the commander actually HIT the new droid when he shot it.  The regular stormtroopers would have missed shooting from that distance :D :D :D

[ganesh]

The Empire was notoriously bigoted, so I didn't have a problem with the behavior either. 

 

I never read the novels, but aside from maybe the tarkins, I don't buy that there were that many really committed people to it beyond maintaining power for their own self interest. I haven't actually seen TFA yet, but just in thinking about the breakup of the USSR, no one was really trying to hold the Soviet empire together, and you got a whole bunch of local warlords, which it would seem would be the tarkins. I think in one of the video games, they also proposed that this happened. Jedi Outcast II, maybe?

 

Given the sprawl of the Empire and just the sheer amount of personnel to make everything function, it's far more logical that there are just terribly unqualified people in positions of Imperial Transport command or some such, probably because of patronage or nepotism. I would think most didn't have much of a grasp of the larger political context. 

 

It's kind of how the Roman empire ended up falling too, right?

[call me ishmael]

The Empire was notoriously bigoted, so I didn't have a problem with the behavior either. 

 

I never read the novels, but aside from maybe the tarkins, I don't buy that there were that many really committed people to it beyond maintaining power for their own self interest. I haven't actually seen TFA yet, but just in thinking about the breakup of the USSR, no one was really trying to hold the Soviet empire together, and you got a whole bunch of local warlords, which it would seem would be the tarkins. I think in one of the video games, they also proposed that this happened. Jedi Outcast II, maybe?

 

Given the sprawl of the Empire and just the sheer amount of personnel to make everything function, it's far more logical that there are just terribly unqualified people in positions of Imperial Transport command or some such, probably because of patronage or nepotism. I would think most didn't have much of a grasp of the larger political context. 

 

It's kind of how the Roman empire ended up falling too, right?

If you've never read the novels it is hard to respond since my comment was about the novels. But i'm not sure i would agree about the USSR. Whatever else was going on there was a high level of professionalism and commitment in a ,ot of the military. And the Roman empire didn't fall 20 years after it was established. It took hundreds of years before that sort of rot took root.

[ganesh]

Palpatine's death was the notion that the Empire--minus the Sith--had a lot of committed people to it who thought it was the only way to gain galactic stability after the Jedi had screwed up.

 

This was what I was basing my comments on.

 

No, the Roman empire didn't fall in 20 years, but we're talking about a "space empire" so the concept of the Romans becoming corrupt and the military hiring poor personnel is apt. 

I think the USSR for post-Palpatine is a better comparison. They only lasted about 70 years. 

[DarkRaichu]

Time for my nitpick of the last episode.  So the turrets on Ghost and Phantom have enough firepower to blow up TIE fighters and dent the AT-ATs.  However, at point blank those same turrets did not even make those giant crawlers flinch?  How did the crawlers react the same when shot by hand blasters vs by much bigger caliber turrets? At least the force of the blast should have moved those crawlers a few feet back.  

 

Also, isn't it weird that all of the A-Wing pilots who died on screen were female?

 

Can't wait for the finale

[ZoqFotPik]

I wonder if Lt DIcer was related to Jedi Master Ima-Gun Di and Admiral Dao. I loved she was barely an afterthought once Rex was taken. For being Phoenix Squadron Commander, Hera really didn't seem to care that one of her pilots was presumably killed. Also another A-wing lost. I think that's around 10 this season. They really should capture some of those spider things and use their exoskeleton as spaceship armor. 

 

 

Also, isn't it weird that all of the A-Wing pilots who died on screen were female?

Most, not all. The two Phoenix Squadron leaders before Hera were male as was one of the pilots killed by the Mandalorians.

Edited March 24, 2016 by ZoqFotPik

[Terrafamilia]

Folks, if you are thinking of joining the Rebellion and fight the good fight, welcome. Just don't let the quartermaster issue you a red flight suit or you are surely doomed.

[BruceAE]

Folks, if you are thinking of joining the Rebellion and fight the good fight, welcome. Just don't let the quartermaster issue you a red flight suit or you are surely doomed.

It's a pattern I've noticed as well.  Stormtroopers and Rebel pilots - both destined to die.  Plus there were some pretty grisly implications as to how Lt Dicer died - Is it wrong that I am seriously disturbed about how she may have died?

On the topic of overthinking it - these creatures did seem pretty indestructible.  What other predators or aspects of the environment could have bred a predator as fearsome as that - or were they such a successful apex predator they wiped out all competition?  Or am I now overthinking a Star Wars animated show?

[DarkRaichu]

Folks, if you are thinking of joining the Rebellion and fight the good fight, welcome. Just don't let the quartermaster issue you a red flight suit or you are surely doomed.

I would think it was an homage to Star Trek.  The writers seem to be fans of Star Trek as well ;)

 

 

I wonder if Lt DIcer was related to Jedi Master Ima-Gun Di and Admiral Dao. I loved she was barely an afterthought once Rex was taken. For being Phoenix Squadron Commander, Hera really didn't seem to care that one of her pilots was presumably killed. Also another A-wing lost. I think that's around 10 this season. They really should capture some of those spider things and use their exoskeleton as spaceship armor. 

Come to think of it why would the giant spider be interested in the A-Wing?  The A-Wing was gone when Sabine and Rex arrived, only Dicer's helmet remained.  Maybe Dicer was able to escape afterall in her A-Wing?  Maybe her A-wing was damaged and it took her longer to reach the base.  I could not explain the complete ignorance of Dicer's faith and the missing A-Wing any other way :D

 

 

Most, not all. The two Phoenix Squadron leaders before Hera were male as was one of the pilots killed by the Mandalorians.

Ah I forgot about the previous Phoenix leader.  Although IIRC the male A-Wing pilot escaped the Mandalorians thanks to Hera.  I remember the female pilot was shot down as soon as the Mandalorians showed up.

Edited March 25, 2016 by DarkRaichu

[ZoqFotPik]

Ah I forgot about the previous Phoenix leader.  Although IIRC the male A-Wing pilot escaped the Mandalorians thanks to Hera.  I remember the female pilot was shot down as soon as the Mandalorians showed up.

One Female and One Male were shot down. Here's the scene.

[ganesh]

Hey, let's land on this planet and not do a biological scan, it *looks* uninhabited. Oh, there's actual life here! But it looks different than us! We have to shoot them all. The rebellion needs this base and we're going to do everything we can to keep it without even trying to accommodate the native lifeforms or not disturbing the ecosystem.

 

Yeah, join the Rebellion: We Fight For You! As long as you're humanoid enough. 

 

At least Ezra *tried* to make a connection. 

[VCRTracking]

Catching up with the past two episodes and halfway through The Forgotten Droid and I suddenly realized the inventory droid sounds like someone doing an Alan Rickman impression! Looking at the earlier posts I'm glad I wasn't imagining things!

Edited March 26, 2016 by VCRTracking

[DarkRaichu]

Hey, let's land on this planet and not do a biological scan, it *looks* uninhabited. Oh, there's actual life here! But it looks different than us! We have to shoot them all. The rebellion needs this base and we're going to do everything we can to keep it without even trying to accommodate the native lifeforms or not disturbing the ecosystem.

 

Yeah, join the Rebellion: We Fight For You! As long as you're humanoid enough. 

 

At least Ezra *tried* to make a connection. 

 

Dude, it is an episode of STAR WARS, of course they did not care about the natives.  Even Qui Gonn freely used Jedi mind tricks to get what he wanted from the Gungan king :P

 

Having said the above, I missed good Star Trek TV shows too.

[VCRTracking]

Just watched the latest episode. Thank god I don't have severe arachnophobia.

 

Who knew Zeb loved 80s rock?

 

No wonder there weren't any female Rebel pilots at Yavin in A New Hope. They've all been killed off by then!

[VCRTracking]

Just watched "Twilight of the Apprentice".

 

Oh. My. God.

 

Also, one advantage ancient Sith temples have over ancient Jedi temples is they have elevators.

 

Dave Filoni answers questions about the finale at IGN.

Edited March 31, 2016 by VCRTracking

[benteen]

Absolutely amazing finale last night.  Legitimately epic.

[revbfc]

It's nice to see this story move forward a bit, and it's always great to see Vader. Having said that, this amazing finale just underlines the weaknesses many of the regular episodes have.

[DarkRaichu]

Just watched "Twilight of the Apprentice".

 

Oh. My. God.

 

Also, one advantage ancient Sith temples have over ancient Jedi temples is they have elevators.

 

Dave Filoni answers questions about the finale at IGN.

The other difference is Sith temples go up with the most important part at the top of the pyramid, whereas Jedi temples go down to the center.  The 2nd time they visited Jedi temple at Lothal, Kanan and Ezra opened up another door underneath the door they saw on the 1st visit.

 

Wasn't it interesting that everyone kept yelling "look out" to Kanan throughout the episode and he ended up blind?

Also, Maul did most of the killings this episode, a smart way to clean up the inquisitors without putting blood on the Jedi's hands.

 

Maul seducing Ezra to the dark side in 1 hour episode was more believable than how Palpatine "seduced" Anakin in 2 movies.

Edited March 31, 2016 by DarkRaichu

[VCRTracking]

Well Anakin seemed like he was already on his way there more than Ezra IMO.

 

I loved when Ezra was running back yelling "Kanan! Maul tricked us!"

 

No shit Ezra, Kanan saw it coming(one of the last things he saw unfortunately).

[Maximum Taco]

Just watched "Twilight of the Apprentice".

 

Oh. My. God.

 

Also, one advantage ancient Sith temples have over ancient Jedi temples is they have elevators.

 

Dave Filoni answers questions about the finale at IGN.

 

If you choose the quick and easy path, you will become an agent of evil.

 

Jedi use the stairs baby.

[benteen]

Sam Witwer did another amazing job as Maul.  I was impressed with how he did the voice old and weak before turning it up to the Maul voice, which conveys a lot in the character's fury.  Witwer is awesome in whatever he does and I'd love to see him in one of the next Star Wars movies.  He and several of the Clone Wars voice actors provided additional voices for TFA but I'd love to see him in either a live-action role or voicing a CGI character.

 

Maul's seducing Ezra to the dark side was done in a subtle manner although I wish Ahsoka would have mentioned that Maul was a Jedi killer and a former Sith, among other things. 

 

The Ahsoka and Vader confrontation did not disappoint and the fight scene between them was awesome.

 

Ahsoka will be getting her own YA novel in October...

 

http://nerdist.com/new-star-wars-novel-featuring-ahsoka-tano-announced-exclusive/

[Perfect Xero]

I thought it was funny that Maul didn't want to fight Vader. Considering that in the later seasons of Clone Wars they almost always wrote Anakin and Obi Wan as pathetically weak chumps who were easily outclassed by Maul, Savage, and Ventress. Based on Clone Wars, I would have thought that Maul would have easily kicked Vader's ass in 20 seconds while yelling about how he was the true master of the Dark Side because he's so angry about his robot pants.

 

I thought it was funny that Maul is the DarkSide!Yoda, of course they had to kind of cheat visually to pull it off, because the harmless old man act doesn't work all that well when you're a tall tattooed devil-man with robot legs. That aside, it was easily the best episode of the series, IMO. Unfortunately it's usually only good to me when Vader, Ashoka, or the old clones are involved, I really can't find it in me to care about Ezra or any of the new characters in this series.

[VCRTracking]

Considering that in the later seasons of Clone Wars they almost always wrote Anakin and Obi Wan as pathetically weak chumps who were easily outclassed by Maul, Savage, and Ventress.

 

That has never bothered me. Especially since a Jedi always has to hold back because the movies even the new one proved anger and aggression tends to win mosts fights.  I'm still more mad about Hondo and the space pirates captureing Anakin, Obi-Wan and Dooku.

 

Someone changed Kanan's Wiki page:

[DarkRaichu]

I thought it was funny that Maul is the DarkSide!Yoda, of course they had to kind of cheat visually to pull it off, because the harmless old man act doesn't work all that well when you're a tall tattooed devil-man with robot legs. That aside, it was easily the best episode of the series, IMO. Unfortunately it's usually only good to me when Vader, Ashoka, or the old clones are involved, I really can't find it in me to care about Ezra or any of the new characters in this series.

Wait, since when was Maul tall?  I thought he was 5'6" in the movie? Shorter than Obi Wan / Ian McGregor for sure.  Did they give him extra long legs in CW?