S01.E02: Selina Kyle

[Turkish]

Bats is 75 years young actually.

So he is. Where did I get the 50 from? Oh, it's the 50th anniversary this year of "New Look" Batman when they re-designed him in the 60s.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Turkish

[Danny Franks]

Just got around to watching the episode. I'm not completely sold yet, but I think I will be.

 

I really like Gordon as a character, here. The only good man in a city of crooks is a powerful hook for him, and I like that he can see the corruption clearly (hell, they don't even try to hide it), and lets it be known that he hates it. Stuff like the beat cop casually saying that he gets paid to watch that restaurant, or the mayor making no bones about using tragedy to his advantage. Even Sarah Essen seems to be in on it all, which is an interesting choice.

 

Bullock has shown signs that there's a decent man under all that corruption, and it'll be interesting to see how they approach that, and how quickly they bring out his better qualities. I don't mind the idea of him being passionate about justice, but prepared to go beyond legal means to get it, but I can't see him ever really cleaning up his act. Him beating up the pharmacy guy in the station was very L.A. Confidential, and that's always a good thing.

 

In fact, there's a lot of Bud White in Bullock, and more than a bit of Ed Exley in Gordon. Though Gordon doesn't have the rampant ambition of Exley. I like the noir stylings of the show, so far, and these comparisons fit well.

 

I'm a bit tired of Fish, already. She's just too melodramatic about everything, and I don't think the character has much in the way of legs (not a joke about Jada Pinkett-Smith's height). A one season bad guy? Okay, but that's about as much mileage as they can get.

 

With Penguin, I think less is going to be more as well. We've seen how brutal he can be, and we've seen him taking his first steps back after his near-death experience. I think it would be best to put him on the backburner for a few episodes, and focus more on what's happening in Gotham itself.

 

I like Selina, and think she could be a really fun character, if used properly. A link between Gordon and the streets, an informant and a project for Gordon. The combination of upright good guy and street brat should be entertaining. And a much better fit for the show than Bruce Wayne, who frankly does not belong in this universe yet. He's not even in it, he's off in his mansion, outside Gotham, being cared for by his butler. Leave him there.

[Flyingwoman]

Robin Lord Taylor's Penguin srikes me as the bastard love child of Alan Cummings' Frandsen from "Sweet Land" and Alan Cummings' Saturninus from "Titus". I hope I hope I hope we get to see him and Mama Cobblepot together again before long.

For a second I thought the station was a church in the opening shot of Bullock and Gordon interrogating the kid: desks as pews, the Captain's office behind a railed altar, the staircases climbing up the sides in the back like giant organ pipes. Would love to know where they are shooting that. Am wondering why there were no actual interrogation rooms for interrogating though. The kid they questioned, and threatened, right out in the open, and the pharmacist appeared to be in some kind of holding cell. Not in the budget?

Have not seen The Mentalist, but did see Rome, and from that experience I think it's good Heller has a plan for the season. Rome season 1 felt much more taut and purposeful than season 2, which just sort of meandered until he'd killed enough time to show us Anthony and Cleopatra kill themselves.

I don't say this often, or in fact, ever, but Jada is so gorgeous in this role I don't mind a few over the top line readings.

[MarkHB]

According to some of the promotional material (including the 21-minute video), the precinct is actually a 2-story set they built in a soundstage (I couldn't find which studio they're using in NY).

[Snookums]

Throwing in on the love for Mama Cobblepot, in her faded teagown and elegance, rapturing away about how handsome and naive her creepster little progeny is. You can see why young Olswold didn't have many sleepovers.

 

Honestly, this episode made me think of the Jezebel posting about that terrible DC licensed Tee shirt that says "Training to be Batman's Wife", and one of the posters said she wanted a shirt that read "Training To Improve Gotham's Social Services" on the front and "Seriously, These Villains Need Help" on the back.

[SoSueMe]

I am far from the Batman mythology or comic demographic but I am really liking this show on its own terms. Don't know nuthin' about Penguin or Riddler or Catwoman, etc. (at least very, very little) . But I've got to say that I cannot look away when Robin Lord Taylor is on the screen. I guess I should rent a few Batman movies to become a little more informed but like I say, I'm liking it just the way it is, a la Mr. Rogers. 

[Oscirus]

I actually like the slow burn that they're doing with Riddler. I kind of wish that he would've had a hand in solving the mystery  of the fork and spoon since that final clue was right up his alley, but his inclusion made sense this episode.

 

The penguin's story seems to be far removed from the action and at times, it slowed the pacing of the show down, but for the most part, he's well played and I get what he adds to the overall arc.

 

Bruce and Alfred's relationship is intriguing but I want to see Alfred have a bit more control over the kid. As of right now, Alfred comes off as a dummy tasked with watching him.

 

I swear to god, if they don't stop with this Barbara/Gordon/ what's her face love triangle crap that they hinted at in the previews then ...

 

The criminals in this episode were fun and I'd love to see them brought back.

 

My only real problem was the Selina police station bit. Holy anachronism, batman.  In the day and age that they portrayed, why would she even think to threaten to accuse that cop of molestation. I can't imagine that was a big thing back then.  And even if it was, between a corrupt police station and someone with a rap sheet as bad as Selina's I doubt that it would even turn heads or that the cop would even blink at such a stupid threat.  I know we're supposed to believe that Selina's street smart but come on!

 

Quick prediction for the future,  Mooney briefly takes over from Falcone before falling victim to the penguin.

 

[Danny Franks]

 

My only real problem was the Selina police station bit. Holy anachronism, batman.  In the day and age that they portrayed, why would she even think to threaten to accuse that cop of molestation. I can't imagine that was a big thing back then.  And even if it was, between a corrupt police station and someone with a rap sheet as bad as Selina's I doubt that it would even turn heads or that the cop would even blink at such a stupid threat.  I know we're supposed to believe that Selina's street smart but come on!

 

From what I can tell, the whole show is designed to be full of anachronisms. Like much of Batman's mythology, it combines the noir with the modern, so you can have guys dressed like 1940s cops, you can have gangsters and molls who think they're from the 1920s, but then you can have hi-tech gadgets and weaponry as well.

 

And as long as they avoid any real life pop culture references that would force a date on the show, I'm happy to accept the mish-mash of genres and chronology.

 

The young street kid they arrested, the frat bros, they felt as modern as the lasers being fired from the 1940s cars in Batman: The Animated Series. I think that amalgam really fits the Batman mythos.

 

Throwing in on the love for Mama Cobblepot, in her faded teagown and elegance, rapturing away about how handsome and naive her creepster little progeny is. You can see why young Olswold didn't have many sleepovers.

 

 

And Mama Cobblepot clearly takes all her fashion inspiration from Miss Havisham. Oswald is just lucky he's not been groomed to be a breaker of hearts, and was instead left to his own criminal devices. And again, it's a great little bit of weirdness that makes Gotham feel like it should. That people like her could exist, and the cops don't obviously stare in horror and bewilderment.

[Trini]

 

And as long as they avoid any real life pop culture references that would force a date on the show, I'm happy to accept the mish-mash of genres and chronology.

Answering in the Other Versions of Batman thread.

[Kel Varnsen]

From what I can tell, the whole show is designed to be full of anachronisms. Like much of Batman's mythology, it combines the noir with the modern, so you can have guys dressed like 1940s cops, you can have gangsters and molls who think they're from the 1920s, but then you can have hi-tech gadgets and weaponry as well.

 

And as long as they avoid any real life pop culture references that would force a date on the show, I'm happy to accept the mish-mash of genres and chronology.

 

The young street kid they arrested, the frat bros, they felt as modern as the lasers being fired from the 1940s cars in Batman: The Animated Series. I think that amalgam really fits the Batman mythos.

 

I like the out of time nature of the show. It reminds me of Batman:TAS as well, or even Archer.

[Sandman]

I keep coming back to the silly, "no psychiatrists" line. Really, Alfred?

 

Did I mis-hear the context of that line? I thought it was Bruce who had insisted on "no psychiatrists," rather than his father. If Alfred said that Wayne Senior insisted on Bruce's "finding his own way," including no help from the mental health field, that's kind of ... well, crazy, but I could understand why Pennyworth might feel bound by it, but it made no sense to me that Bruce should have the final say in it (which is what I thought I heard).

 

Hey, I'm just glad that Alfred doesn't address his young charge as "Master Wayne" the way Michael Caine's Alfred did in the Nolan movies. That drove me batty! (... Sorry.)

[MarkHB]

Did I mis-hear the context of that line? I thought it was Bruce who had insisted on "no psychiatrists," rather than his father. If Alfred said that Wayne Senior insisted on Bruce's "finding his own way," including no help from the mental health field, that's kind of ... well, crazy, but I could understand why Pennyworth might feel bound by it, but it made no sense to me that Bruce should have the final say in it (which is what I thought I heard).

 

Hey, I'm just glad that Alfred doesn't address his young charge as "Master Wayne" the way Michael Caine's Alfred did in the Nolan movies. That drove me batty! (... Sorry.)

I definitely got the impression that the "no psychiatrists" thing was Bruce's idea, not his father's.

[Trini]

No; when Gordon asks if Bruce is getting therapy, Alfred says the Waynes had specific instructions on how to raise him. And he mentions "no psychiatrists" and (Bruce) choosing his own path.

[TresGatos]

I found a strong physical resemblance between Bruce and Selina when coupled with her curiosity about "the Kid" made me suspect she may be Thomas Wayne's biological daughter. I know it's not canon but the poster thinking that Thomas Wayne may have been more linked to Falcone than merely traveling in the same wealthy circles made me think it again.

[John Potts]

I'm liking all the villains (so far): the Crime bosses Falcone and Fish (given he's a legacy character and she's a TV invention... I don't rate her chances), Mr Nygma (OK, not yet a villain), Kittygirl, Penguin... I mean Mr Cobblepot and even our new pair this week who were suitably creepy. The corruption was believably handled (the cop not securing the murder scene because the restaurant pays him and the Captain agreeing to "Take a stroll around the block" while Bullock roughs up a suspect) and the power play between Falcone and Fish was reminiscent of last week between Fish and Penguin (although she did her power play in private whereas Falconne deliberately administered his beat down in the middle of her club). The only thing that really rang false was the homeless kids blindly taking the bait with the kidnappers - in a city as corrupt as Gotham, you'd expect them to be way more suspicious of a pair of do gooders handing out food.

 

On the good guy side, I did like Alfred who earnestly is trying to do his best as a parent and Gordon is (mostly) incorruptible if perhaps a little too naive (he has to realise that berating the Mayor is hardly the way to get ahead). Liked Bullock's comment that his "Goodie Two Shoes" partner probably wouldn't intervene because the guy was implicated in child abductions.

 

Sofie Fatale I love when she talked about the guy she keeps around for "exercise".

 

I guess it's something where a presumed misogynistic medium can have a woman treating a boy as a disposable sex partner just like a man would. Not sure it's anything good, but it is equality of a sort...

 

tennisgurl  I am curious as to what the heck he wanted all those kids for (I am just gonna go ahead and guess its not for a free trip to Euro Disney).

 

That would be ludicrous - Disneyworld is much closer. Though the possibilities run from forming a Fagin style gang to forced prostitution (unlikely on network TV) to unwilling medical subjects.

 

Jodithgrace There was a standup comedian in Fish's club in episode 1 that people were predicting would be the Joker, but could that have been this kid?

 

I think providing potential Joker candidates is going to be something of a running gag by TPTB.

 

TresGatos I found a strong physical resemblance between Bruce and Selina when coupled with her curiosity about "the Kid" made me suspect she may be Thomas Wayne's biological daughter.

 

That would make any potential Bruce/Selina hook up even more... problematic.

[Kathemy]

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