S47.E13: Bob and Weave

[ljenkins782]

16 hours ago, fishcakes said:

Oh, that's right! I'd forgotten she did that. I do think that was a very smart move.

I agree with this. Great strategists are fairly rare, and this question is complicated for me in that I remember earlier seasons much more clearly than later seasons. But to name a few, first I'd say Tina Wesson in her Outback season; she had no compunction about having multiple, competing alliances and she boxed Colby in to an F2 with her because she knew that there was a real danger that he'd ultimately go with Jerri/Amber if she didn't get Jerri out while Nick, Rodger, and Elisabeth were still in the game. Second, Vecepia Towery, who was the first real flip-flopper; she played Rob Cesternino's game before he did, yet she gets zero credit for it where he was always praised as "the best player to never win." Brian Heidik, the first to use a goat strategy, and who somehow managed to hide his true personality throughout the entire game; although to be honest, I'm not sure if this makes him a great strategist or just a sociopath. Yul Kwon and I'm not hearing any nonsense about an "overpowered idol" because he never used that idol except to force Penner to flip, then he voted Penner out because Parvati, also a good strategist, explained to him how he would lose at jury if he didn't; so that was the season of extortionists, albeit charming ones. Jeremy Collins, who is so very boring to me, but he played a smart, dull game. He started the whole "meat shield" thing by keeping Joe around to keep the target off himself as a physical threat; he also did this thing where he would often lie down or sit lower than whoever he was talking to, which is the opposite of all those management books that tell bosses to make their desk chair 5 inches higher than the other chairs to intimidate their employees. I also want to say Hannah Shapiro from MvGenX, although I can't recall the specifics now; I just remember that she was behind a lot of moves that Adam made and she had to talk him out of doing stupid stuff and ultimately he won and she got zero votes and I am still mad about that but in a now-vague way. And I begrudgingly will say Dee Valladares, who played an effective but repugnant-to-me game by keeping lovesick Austin on a string and then, to show the jury that she had been the one running things, by telling the jury how she played him.

I agree that Yul used the idol well, but the fact that he even had one to wield is yet another piece of luck. Without that idol, does that little minority alliance of 4 manage to topple the much larger group against them? Probably not. 

As for Tina have multiple alliances, I don't remember that season well enough, but I do think she had several pieces of luck in her favor, namely Rodger and Elisabeth being the duo that couldn't be broken up, but that could be used as a voting bloc based on their personal values. The other, much larger, piece of luck was Colby being the person he was. The 'wants to be seen as the good guy' guy who is also arrogant enough to assume he has it in the bag anyway, so he makes a terrible final 2 choice. 

Circling back to the original point of Rachel being a good winner, but not necessarily a good strategist, given the above examples, I'd say she's done her share of strategic play throughout the season.

Finding her idol without getting caught and never telling anyone about it, pllaying the SITD as a test to see if she needed to play her idol, shapeshifting into various alliances, playing Andy and Sam like fiddles before her idol play, and not making the emotional decision to repay Sol's kindness at a potential cost to her own game, all of that is pretty sound strategy to me.

[violet and green]

Rachel is a worthy winner - I'm just hoping for a plot twist.

Edited Saturday at 09:24 PM by violet and green
typo

[Duke Silver]

Oh Andy...tripped up by the ol' hubris monster, weren't ya'?.  hahahaha

[Diana Berry]

Andy with the beautiful teeth and fabulous hair. Why? Why? You could have been the Goat ( and not a Billy) but the greatest of  all time.  Sadly , the tribe has spoken.  Take solace that you join the club that includes fellow hair and teeth alumni Dee, Austin, and Hunter .  Fare thee well Andy Fare thee well.

Genevieve even corporate lawyers can outsmart themselves.  The tribe has spoken. Fare thee well Genevieve Fare thee well.

Teeny with their gorgeous eyes and porcelain skin with no visible pores lives to see another day.

Sue with her fashion statement mud  makeup lives to see another day 

GI  Sam doll  what exactly has he done? lives to see another day

Rachel is she an underdog? Is she a genius? I’m not sure she even knows lives to see another day

[iMonrey]

21 hours ago, SummerDreams said:

I don't dislike Rachel but I don't think she played the amazing game everyone is talking about. In fact, nobody in this season played a good game in my opinion.

I know I'm beating a dead horse but I don't think it's really possible to play a great strategic game on this show anymore. With all the idols, advantages and twists, it's basically a matter of stumble-fucking your way to the end. The game is playing the players rather than the other way around, and getting to the end is usually just a matter of dumb luck. You win too many challenges, you're targeted as a threat. You fly under the radar, you get dragged to the end as a goat and get zero votes. So the winner often ends up having played a middling game at best.

[DEL901]

22 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I know I'm beating a dead horse but I don't think it's really possible to play a great strategic game on this show anymore. With all the idols, advantages and twists, it's basically a matter of stumble-fucking your way to the end. The game is playing the players rather than the other way around, and getting to the end is usually just a matter of dumb luck. You win too many challenges, you're targeted as a threat. You fly under the radar, you get dragged to the end as a goat and get zero votes. So the winner often ends up having played a middling game at best.

I really hope season 50 is back to basics and they all run around looking for idols and advantages that aren’t there.  

[leighdear]

I'm still curious if a single person there still buys that Sue is "45".  I mean, come on!  Such a stupid thing to lie about.  If anybody has said a word about that, I totally missed it. 

I just can't NOT look at the weirdness of her face and her arms that look like a Shar-pei.  

[LadyChatts]

8 hours ago, DEL901 said:

I really hope season 50 is back to basics and they all run around looking for idols and advantages that aren’t there.  

This has always been one of my dreams is everyone to be hunting for idols and advantages and people turned into sacrificial lambs because everyone’s convinced they have one-only to find out there were none that season.  Idols I don’t mind so much, but I don’t care for the endless advantages and those that influence the game more than just saving oneself or their closest ally.  
 

I wish we could go back to 39 days for S50 and more of the Survivor element of the show.  Anyone that’s cast from the pre-new era isn’t going to know what to do with themselves (especially if they get people on there from the very early seasons). 

[PaperTree]

9 hours ago, DEL901 said:

really hope season 50 is back to basics and they all run around looking for idols and advantages that aren’t there.  

Hope springs eternal😎

[HappyDancex2]

7 hours ago, leighdear said:

I'm still curious if a single person there still buys that Sue is "45".  I mean, come on!  Such a stupid thing to lie about.  If anybody has said a word about that, I totally missed it. 

I just can't NOT look at the weirdness of her face and her arms that look like a Shar-pei.  

I’m not sure it ever mattered in this season.  It was clear they viewed her as the older woman momma type and that’s generally anyone older than 40.  She looks like a a type more to me…big fake boobs, lotta face work done etc.  She’s pretty common IMO.  Had she been exceptionally athletic with results to prove it then maybe lying about your age is something but my guess is that 23 year old teeny doesn’t give a hoot whether Sue is 45, 55 or 65.

if her real age ever comes up people are just going to blow smoke up her ass about how great she looks for her age.  What else can you say?  If she’s happy then more power to her.  She’s seems like a smart lady that maybe had to endure some stuff.  It’s just weird that she herself used it from the beginning like it was some “thing.”  A misdirection that yielded her something and for that point I think she overestimated the importance of it.

[millennium]

On 12/12/2024 at 10:42 AM, AntFTW said:

All is right in the universe again! Andy is gone!

 

I wonder if Challenge USA will be calling him.   He's a jerk, but The Challenge is lately short on supply of that particular commodity.  (Don't tell me who won Season 40, I'm still about six episodes behind!)

Edited Monday at 08:06 AM by millennium

[dancingdreamer]

On 12/13/2024 at 2:51 PM, ljenkins782 said:

So much of this game is luck (good or bad), especially with all of the advantages in play that I feel like a long-range strategy is nearly impossible. 

I agree, a lot of it is luck. There have been a few players, that have been able to think two or three moves ahead in the game. I can't  name them, once they are off my screen, I no longer care about them. But at the time...

[Lantern7]

Erik's take on the penultimate episode, "Who's There?"