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Chit-Chat: The Feels

CM-BlueButterfly

By CM-BlueButterfly
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SoMuchTV

SoMuchTV

4 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I just read an article about Christian schools being funded by tax dollars. Oh, here it is- From NBC News.

WASHINGTON — In a sign that the barrier between church and state could be further weakened, the Supreme Court on Friday agreed to hear a bid by Oklahoma officials to approve the nation’s first publicly funded religious charter school.

Aha. I took it as a comment on the recent potus v bishop situation. But even in the case you mentioned, it seems like it’s more State (“Oklahoma officials”) who are breaking down the wall, not Church. 

Sometimes I find political cartoons a little difficult to interpret, unless I’m familiar with the cartoonist’s other work. I’ll have to check this one out. 

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Annber03
Annber03

And yet the same people who are awed by his celebrity are also the ones talkng about how celebritees need to stay out of politics. You'll pardon me if I can't take their critiques all that seriously. 

Annber03
Annber03

For as long as I live, I will never understand the hold this guy has over people. 

Annber03
Annber03

Everything I want to say would be a string of curse words at this point.  Hope you're happy, people who decided to be all precious with your votes or who felt this guy deserved another chance aft

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fastiller

fastiller

18 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I just read an article about Christian schools being funded by tax dollars. Oh, here it is- From NBC News.

WASHINGTON — In a sign that the barrier between church and state could be further weakened, the Supreme Court on Friday agreed to hear a bid by Oklahoma officials to approve the nation’s first publicly funded religious charter school.

Would be cool if a couple synagogues or mosques (or the Church of Satan) were to file an amicus brief or three.

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Lantern7

Lantern7

(edited)
1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

Whatever happened to "the buck stops here"?

FLETCHER, N.C. (AP) — President Donald Trump has ended the federal security detail for Dr. Anthony Fauci, the infectious disease expert who advised him on the COVID-19 pandemic, a person familiar with the matter said Friday.

Fauci is the latest in a string of former Trump aides-turned-critics to see their federal protection canceled despite ongoing threats to their lives.

Speaking to reporters in North Carolina on Friday, Trump said he wouldn’t feel any responsibility if harm befell the former government officials. A person familiar with the matter, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive security issues, said that Fauci’s federal security detail was ended on Thursday and that he has since hired private security.

When asked about Fauci and former national security adviser John Bolton, Trump said, “They all made a lot of money. They can hire their own security, too.”

Lovely. Could a GoFundMe get set up for Dr. Fauci? I bet enough money could be raised to build his dream house with at least three state-of-the-art panic rooms, as well as any security he would require. And you know that would piss YKW off something fierce.

Edited by Lantern7
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Dimity

Dimity

1 minute ago, Lantern7 said:

And you know that would piss YKW off something fierce.

He was already pissed because Biden did the pardon thing.  He was clearly dreaming of a whole series of arrests and trials and hopefully long prison terms for all the meanies who dared to stand up to the giant baby. 

What gets me angriest with regard to Dr. Fauci is that up til Trump he served under administration after administration without any issues - Democrat or Republican - he did his job and was respected for it.

And then along came Trump...

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bluegirl147

bluegirl147

26 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:

In the matter of Elon vs Trump-who will turn on whom? And why?

I think Elon wants Tik Tok and them will dump Trump…

I'm getting tired of billionaires looking for new toys to play with. For all the criticism that has been leveled at Bill Gates over the years he used much of his fortune to start a foundation who has done so much needed charity work.  

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Eri

Eri

(edited)
5 hours ago, Annber03 said:

I also think that the religious right's influence in politics highlights so clearly precisely WHY we desperately need to ensure we keep church and state as separate as possible. I do not care what one's religious beliefs are, there is no reason they need to be making laws based off them. That's not how we do things here, or not how we should do things here. 

And if religious people are going to stick their noses in the government's business, then it's only fair the government get to do the same. That's the thing a lot of religious people who want the church and state to mix don't seem to get - that whole "separation of church and state" thing protects them just as much as it does the state. If they don't want the government up in their business, then they need to stay he hell out of the government's business. 

This.. I've said it before but contrary to what the government thinks, this isn't a Christian nation, it is a nation where you are free to be Christian (or whatever religion you practice). If some politicians want the Bible back in schools, then I want the IRS in their churches - they want too much influence for institutions that get a lot of tax-free exemptions 😒 

(Btw, your grandmother sounds like a hoot and a half! I love it lol)

4 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I just read an article about Christian schools being funded by tax dollars. Oh, here it is- From NBC News.

WASHINGTON — In a sign that the barrier between church and state could be further weakened, the Supreme Court on Friday agreed to hear a bid by Oklahoma officials to approve the nation’s first publicly funded religious charter school.

Conservatives would love to push more of this because they want to privatize the education system so they're funneling state and federal dollars that could go towards public schools and instead allowing "grants" to go to private, charter or religious schools. Right now there are only 14 states that offer traditional school voucher programs, that I know of, and many state constitutions still have what are called Blaine Amendments, which prohibit spending public dollars on religious schools. That's one reason the majority of states still don't offer traditional vouchers. Now this administration is considering expanding the school voucher program at the federal level, which is concerning.

The Great Recession put many state education budgets in a vise grip that has yet to loosen. The states would have to cough up money of their own if they wanted to make this a universal thing - and what's the first thing these states cut when they're on a budget? Education. If the state dollars aren't reaching disenfranchised and low income families, I bet those federal dollars never will (wealthier and upper middle class families will benefit though based on the details of the bill, surprise surprise).

They want to gut government revenues and then use that as an excuse to cut funding to government services/agencies. Then, when they start to deteriorate due to underfunding, they can claim "See? It doesn't work! It's 'inefficient'!", and then use that as an excuse to privatize it (i.e. sell it all off to their business buddies at bargain bin prices).

It's a staple of the conservative playbook, across the world.

Edited by Eri
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peacheslatour

peacheslatour

(edited)
3 minutes ago, Eri said:

This.. I've said it before but contrary to what the government thinks, this isn't a Christian nation, it is a nation where you are free to be Christian (or whatever religion you practice). If some politicians want the Bible back in schools, then I want the IRS in their churches - they want too much influence for institutions that get a lot of tax-free exemptions 😒 

(Btw, your grandmother sounds like a hoot and a half! I love it lol)

Conservatives would love to push more of this because they want to privatize the education system so they're funneling state and federal dollars that could go towards public schools and instead allowing "grants" to go to private, charter or religious schools. Right now there are only 14 states that offer traditional school voucher programs, that I know of, and many state constitutions still have what are called Blaine Amendments, which prohibit spending public dollars on religious schools. That's one reason the majority of states still don't offer traditional vouchers. Now this administration is considering expanding the school voucher program at the federal level, which is concerning.

The Great Recession put many state education budgets in a vise grip that has yet to loosen. The states would have to cough up money of their own if they wanted to make this a universal thing - and what's the first thing these states cut when they're on a budget? Education. If the state dollars aren't reaching disenfranchised and low income families, I bet those federal dollars never will (wealthier and upper middle class families will benefit though, surprise surprise).

They want to gut government revenues and then use that as an excuse to cut funding to government services/agencies. Then, when they start to deteriorate due to underfunding, they can claim "See? It doesn't work! It's 'inefficient'!", and then use that as an excuse to privatize it (i.e. sell it all off to their business buddies at bargain bin prices).

It's a staple of the conservative playbook, across the world.

If they need money, why not tax the churches? They seem to think they have a say in our elections and our educational institutions, why shouldn't they pay taxes like every other organization?

Edited by peacheslatour
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Eri

Eri

(edited)

There's a number of reasons but a few to mention:

-Making churches tax-exempt is considered an enforcement of the separation of church and state, with the government not interfering in religious affairs in accordance to the 1st Amendment. 

-Historically, churches have been recognized for their substantial contributions to communities, including charitable activities, education, and social services so being granted tax-exempt status is a reward for their positive contributions to society. 

-The vague IRS tax laws and regulations, outlines the criteria for tax-exempt status regarding charitable, religious, and educational organizations. Churches qualify for automatic exemption under this section, provided they meet certain requirements. 

Churches and other religious institutions are supposed to be limited from engaging or becoming entangled in political activities, instead maintaining their focus on spiritual, charitable, and educational missions. The aforementioned Blaine Amendments are supposed to serve as an extra buffer at the state levels, but now we see that evangelicals have more indirect influence than they used to.

The politicians who are pushing these initiatives (10 Commandments in schools, required Bible lessons in the school curriculum, etc.)  to serve their base know what they're doing and should know better, but they don't care.

Edited by Eri
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Annber03

Annber03

1 hour ago, Eri said:

(Btw, your grandmother sounds like a hoot and a half! I love it lol)

I wish I'd been able to get to know her better - she passed away when I was very young. I only met her once, when my family took a trip to see her in Arizona, and I was three at the time, so I have only the vaguest memories of her. The only grandparent I ever had any sort of actual relationship with was my maternal grandma, and she died when I was ten. All my other grandparents died either when I was really little or, in regards to my paternal grandfather, well before I was even born. 

But yeah, from the stories my parents have told me about the ones I didn't get to properly know, they sounded like fascinating people. 

I meant to say in my last post, too - there's a church here in my town that has a rainbow-flag style poster up on the front of its building with the message "A just world for all" on it. It always makes me smile to see that whenever I pass that church. 

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Yeah No

Yeah No

10 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

The reason they do all that cheating is they know they have nothing of value to offer voters. Their policies are deeply unpopular and all they have is hate and division.  And demographically they know some states and the country as a whole is changing and not in their favor.  Without cheating they would already be a dying party.  Trump gave them a lifeline but once he is gone and we still have a democracy hopefully things will right themselves.

One can only hope for this. If this last election has taught me anything, it's not to take this for granted. The fact that more non-white people and young men voted for him this time doesn't make me too confident that things will go in the right direction. Although a lot can happen in a few years. Hopefully a lot of people will wake up.

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Yeah No

Yeah No

My sister in law (husband's sister) has recently started posting on Facebook to bitch about Trump and the Republicans. When we talk she and I usually always agree about politics. Today she was posting about birthright citizenship. She has never been one to post about politics on SM so this is a big change for her. I am actually pretty surprised and happy to find out that so many of her friends and family are in agreement on these things. Some of them are people I've known for over 40 years or their whole lives (the younger generation) and hearing their well thought out and informed opinions is pretty inspiring. I need to hear more of that these days.

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bluegirl147

bluegirl147

7 hours ago, EtheltoTillie said:

Hegseth confirmed by tiebreaker vote by Vance. 
 

 

McConnell voted against him. Funny how he does the right thing when it doesn't matter.  

So does Hegseth stop drinking after the vote or after he is sworn in?  Is he going to have to take a breathalyzer test every morning before he enters the Pentagon?  

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Dimity

Dimity

There was a threatened "Election Convoy" that was supposed to do a slow roll (deliberately driving down the highway at a pace calculated to piss off other drivers and block the highway as much as possible) in Ottawa today and I made the mistake of looking at the organizers FB page to see what was happening. 

The lies and the conspiracy theories were downright scary.  Either there are a lot of mentally ill people out there or these people are stupid and gullible and will believe anything you tell them if it fits their sad world view.  If what I read today is an example of the kind of info the MAGA have been feasting on for the last 8 years it's no wonder Trump has gotten the support he has.   It's sickening to be honest.

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peacheslatour

peacheslatour

16 minutes ago, Dimity said:

There was a threatened "Election Convoy" that was supposed to do a slow roll (deliberately driving down the highway at a pace calculated to piss off other drivers and block the highway as much as possible) in Ottawa today and I made the mistake of looking at the organizers FB page to see what was happening. 

The lies and the conspiracy theories were downright scary.  Either there are a lot of mentally ill people out there or these people are stupid and gullible and will believe anything you tell them if it fits their sad world view.  If what I read today is an example of the kind of info the MAGA have been feasting on for the last 8 years it's no wonder Trump has gotten the support he has.   It's sickening to be honest.

image.thumb.png.62684b3bb9dab7a7572382d2260efc44.png

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anony.miss

anony.miss

(edited)
11 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I have to ask is it true that there are those within the Republican party actually trying to tell people which states they can travel to?  The rest, yep, sadly I've heard about, but this one jumped out at me. 

 

Pretty sure the states reference =  right wing attempts to curtail/prohibit travel to a state where abortions are legal.

 

Edited by anony.miss
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Dimity

Dimity

21 minutes ago, anony.miss said:

Pretty sure the states reference =  right wing attempts to curtail/prohibit travel to a state where abortions are legal.

I'm not sure I even want to know how they think they can do this.  Checkpoints at the borders where any woman aged 12-50 has to undergo an invasive gynecological exam to prove they're not pregnant comes to mind.

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peacheslatour

peacheslatour

14 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I'm not sure I even want to know how they think they can do this.  Checkpoints at the borders where any woman aged 12-50 has to undergo an invasive gynecological exam to prove they're not pregnant comes to mind.

Whatever you do, if you're in your childbearing years, do not use any kind of an app to track your menstrual cycles!

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Ohiopirate02

Ohiopirate02

10 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I'm not sure I even want to know how they think they can do this.  Checkpoints at the borders where any woman aged 12-50 has to undergo an invasive gynecological exam to prove they're not pregnant comes to mind.

Sadly, this is what some people in states like Texas want though they would probably just use pregnancy tests at the border checkpoint.

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Dimity

Dimity

1 minute ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Sadly, this is what some people in states like Texas want though they would probably just use pregnancy tests at the border checkpoint.

I'd love to ask the Trump supporters posting here how they feel about this kind of thing but since they never seem to want to actually discuss the real issues and concerns people have with what the Trump Party are doing I know I'd be wasting my time. 

If I were living in a state like Texas right now and I had the means to do so my bags would already be packed and the moving van booked.

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Notabug

Notabug

(edited)
22 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Sadly, this is what some people in states like Texas want though they would probably just use pregnancy tests at the border checkpoint.

Indeed.  Laws are being passed making it illegal for a woman living in a state with restricted access to abortion to travel to another less restrictive state to have one.  The woman or anyone who assists her in her travels can be charged. 

Many, many women living in states like Texas and Louisiana are traveling to Arkansas and elsewhere for the procedure since practitioners in the restricted states are leaving in droves and access, even for pre-heartbeat terminations, is limited.

I personally know someone who lives in one of the aforementioned states.  Prenatal testing indicated that her baby had a chromosomal anomaly incompatible with life outside the womb.  If the baby survived to term, its life expectancy would be two months or less.  She is in her early 40's, this was her first pregnancy.  Carrying a child to term who could not survive would seriously jeopardize her chances of being able to conceive again and have a healthy child. She and her husband went to New York and stayed with a family member for the weekend to have the procedure.  She is now pregnant with a chromosomally normal baby.  Had she not terminated, she would still have several months to go before that child would be born and she might recover and try again.  Yet, we are being told that she is in the wrong, she is the criminal.

Edited by Notabug
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Notabug

Notabug

(edited)
31 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Sadly, this is what some people in states like Texas want though they would probably just use pregnancy tests at the border checkpoint.

There are state legislatures who have introduced bills requiring that all positive pregnancy tests be reported to the state.  I think they expect labs/doctors' offices to do this but I am not sure.  Then, there would be an absolute requirement that pregnant women 'check in' with the state at intervals and anyone who doesn't give birth to a live baby can be investigated and jailed if they cannot prove it was a natural loss.  Where the money for all this monitoring is going to come from is not clear; I guess they'll cut Medicaid benefits or something.  Considering there are also state legislatures that want to require doctors to take tubal pregnancies and place them into a woman's womb to try to 'save' the baby rather than remove them and save the woman's life, despite the fact that this has NEVER in the history of medicine been successful;  I don't think we can expect reason and sanity when it comes to these laws.  Just because they didn't get the required votes in the past doesn't mean they wouldn't now.  It's a brave new world, folks.

Quote

I'd love to ask the Trump supporters posting here how they feel about this kind of thing but since they never seem to want to actually discuss the real issues and concerns people have with what the Trump Party are doing I know I'd be wasting my time

I think many of them would say what they said last time Trump was in office, "Roe v. Wade is never going to be overturned.  You're being ridiculous even thinking that it might".  And here we are.  

One of my sisters is quite the Trump fan, we have a family text chain.  I commented the day after the election that my office was being flooded with calls from women wanted to get IUD's or tubal ligations ASAP before the new administration came to power.  I was accused of 'harassing' her and that my clients were obviously 'stupid' if they thought anyone was going to take away their birth control.  Because that is the level of political discourse we are seeing; it has become the norm for one side to call names and deny the obvious when encountering the ugly facts of their political choices.

Edited by Notabug
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ProudMary

ProudMary

26 minutes ago, Dimity said:

If I were living in a state like Texas right now and I had the means to do so my bags would already be packed and the moving van booked.

I know it's easy to say things like that, but many of us are living that nightmare. Your words that I put in bold letters are the ONLY reason I'm still living in a southern state and that others are, too. 

Go easy on us. 

 

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peacheslatour

peacheslatour

18 minutes ago, Notabug said:

There are state legislatures who have introduced bills requiring that all positive pregnancy tests be reported to the state.  I think they expect labs/doctors' offices to do this but I am not sure.  Then, there would be an absolute requirement that pregnant women 'check in' with the state at intervals and anyone who doesn't give birth to a live baby can be investigated and jailed if they cannot prove it was a natural loss.  Where the money for all this monitoring is going to come from is not clear; I guess they'll cut Medicaid benefits or something.  Considering there are also state legislatures that want to require doctors to take tubal pregnancies and place them into a woman's womb to try to 'save' the baby rather than remove them and save the woman's life, despite the fact that this has NEVER in the history of medicine been successful;  I don't think we can expect reason and sanity when it comes to these laws.  Just because they didn't get the required votes in the past doesn't mean they wouldn't now.  It's a brave new world, folks.

I think many of them would say what they said last time Trump was in office, "Roe v. Wade is never going to be overturned.  You're being ridiculous even thinking that it might".  And here we are.  

One of my sisters is quite the Trump fan, we have a family text chain.  I commented the day after the election that my office was being flooded with calls from women wanted to get IUD's or tubal ligations ASAP before the new administration came to power.  I was accused of 'harassing' her and that my clients were obviously 'stupid' if they thought anyone was going to take away their birth control.  Because that is the level of political discourse we are seeing; it has become the norm for one side to call names and deny the obvious when encountering the ugly facts of their political choices.

Since the Dobbs Decision the abortion rate of people from out of state receiving abortions here in Washington state has climbed 46%.

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Bastet

Bastet

(edited)
7 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

McConnell voted against him. Funny how he does the right thing when it doesn't matter.

So does Susan Collins.  Lisa Murkowski has a slightly better track record, IIRC, but it's the MO for Collins to make sure she has a hall pass from McConnell before she doesn't toe the party line.

2 hours ago, Anela said:

I don’t even want to be awake.  I was depressed before this.

Then you might not want to know what happened even later last night, but just in case:  Trump fired - in what looks to be a clear violation of federal law, mind you, but that's never bothered him - nearly 20 independent watchdogs of federal agencies (inspectors general; independent positions that conduct audits and investigations [into allegations of waste, fraud, and abuse of power]).  Get rid of a critical oversight component, clearing the way to replace them with loyalists so you can operate unchecked.  Autocracy 101.

I haven't had the energy (or a joint) yet to delve into it more today, but that's what I went to bed on last night.  Edited with an update: The Council of the Inspectors General wrote him a nice little response memo suggesting he check with White House counsel about the legal requirements to dismiss them from their presidentially appointed, Senate confirmed positions.

Edited by Bastet
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bluegirl147

bluegirl147

24 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Since the Dobbs Decision the abortion rate of people from out of state receiving abortions here in Washington state has climbed 46%.

Something they refuse to understand is if a woman wants to get an abortion she will find a way if possible.  And if she can't her life doesn't get better nor does the child's life once it is born.   When women choose to have an abortion there are reasons for that.   And if you prevent her from making that choice the reasons are still there.  You aren't helping her.  You are punishing her.  Which is what they want to do.

I hope there is pushback for Trump firing the inspector generals. If there isn't he is going to keep doing stuff like this.  And at some point he is going to decide he doesn't need Congress or the SCOTUS.  

43 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

I know it's easy to say things like that, but many of us are living that nightmare. Your words that I put in bold letters are the ONLY reason I'm still living in a southern state and that others are, too. 

Go easy on us. 

 

And this one reason why red states stay red. Those that can, leave.

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bluegirl147

bluegirl147

(edited)
5 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I wish the Democrats had tried to get rid of the EC permanently. Why should acres and acres of vacant land have as many votes as actual citizens?

Whenever someone posts the map and brags about all the red I always point out most of that red is scarcely populated.  And also point out the bright blue spots in the middle of a lot of that red. Details matter.

Edited by bluegirl147
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ProudMary

ProudMary

11 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I wish the Democrats had tried to get rid of the EC permanently. Why should acres and acres of vacant land have as many votes as actual citizens?

Unfortunately, the Democrats never truly held a Senate majority to be able to accomplish things like abolishing the EC because of Manchin and Sinema. Also, getting dark money out of politics, balancing the Supreme Court, statehood for DC and PR , etc.

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peacheslatour

peacheslatour

3 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

Unfortunately, the Democrats never truly held a Senate majority to be able to accomplish things like abolishing the EC because of Manchin and Sinema. Also, getting dark money out of politics, balancing the Supreme Court, statehood for DC and PR , etc.

Manchin and Sinema should have both been run on of DC on a rail, tarred and feathered and put in stocks.

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MostlyContent

MostlyContent

(edited)
33 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I wish the Democrats had tried to get rid of the EC permanently. Why should acres and acres of vacant land have as many votes as actual citizens?

I don't believe that Democrats can simply 'get rid of' the Electoral College.  We are a Constitutional Republic, not a democracy.   38 states would never vote to change the Constitution in that way (if that was even one of the items that could be ratified ....I have no idea).  So there would need to be a coup, I suppose, and looking at the different people and differing opinions, I doubt that would be successful.   

28 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Whenever someone posts the map and brags about all the red I always point out most of that red is scarcely populated.  And also point out the bright blue spots in the middle of a lot of that red. Details matter.

Yes, that's what I see when looking at a county by county map of the votes.  People who want to/have to live in cities have different concerns than those who do not (mostly).   

I like visiting *whatever city* for a weekend to attend a concert/play/restaurant but I would go absolutely insane trying to 'live' in one. 

As a Republican, I will wait a while to see how some of the concerns expressed here today shake out.  Admittedly, it does seem like fear mongering to me right now.   I can't really express an opinion about things that haven't happened/don't exist.  

ETA:  I'm talking about large, HUGE cities. Not, oh say, 60K or so.  

Edited by MostlyContent
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bluegirl147

bluegirl147

10 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Manchin and Sinema should have both been run on of DC on a rail, tarred and feathered and put in stocks.

Manchin was a senator from my state and honestly I was glad he didn't run again.   I knew his seat would go to a Republican but I didn't care.  I was so tired of him fucking up things when Democrats needed his vote.

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