S09.E20: Afghanistan

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Main topic: Afghanistan , the impact of the US withdrawal and Taliban control of the government

Also:  Trump's and media reaction to the FBI search of Mar-A-Lago; Shepherd Smith has the best story intros in the business; artificial intelligence image generators (John Oliver's cabbage love story)

Original air date 2022.08.14

[Annber03]

Hey, remember 20 plus years ago, when people expressed concern about whether or not we had an exit strategy when we were about to go into Afghanistan? And hey, remember in 2016 when people kept trying to warn just how much of a national security risk Trump posed to the U.S./the world at large, because of how utterly reckless he was, his general ignorance regarding domestic and foreign policy, and his amazing ability to just blather on and blurt out things he really shouldn't blurt out on a regular basis? 

Gosh. Sure wish people would've listened to those warnings and concerns. God forbid anyone take a moment to think about the long-term effects of their decisions, or anything. 

I agree with John's frustration over how the people of Afghanistan keep getting screwed over because we don't want to fund the Taliban. It's 2022, for cripes' sakes, surely we, as a world, should've figured out some way to help the people of a country who are suffering while also ensuring that the authoritarian/totalitarian leadership doesn't reap any of those benefits. It's not fair that citizens get punished because of the actions of their horrific government. Especially given various countries' roles in helping to destabilize the country to the point where the Taliban was able to take over in the first place. 

I also agree with John's rant about the whole thing of men having run the world for the most of human history, and how that's worked out. Indeed, haven't there been news reports about how countries run by women generally tended to weather the pandemic a little better than the ones run by men? 

Also appreciated the shoutout to the late lamented "Baby-Sitters Club" series :D. Hear, hear, John!

As for the big story about Mar-a-Lago being searched by the FBI this week...between that and the Alex Jones trial, all I can say is schadenfreude was having a week :p. But my god, watching the GOP throw a tempter tantrum and griping about how "unfair" the FBI is being is both hilarious and eye-rolling all at the same time. This from the same people who were gleefully celebrating them when they were looking into Hillary's e-mails, which, by the way, they shouldn't ever be allowed to talk about ever again, given the talk of how sensitive the classified documents Trump took were. Shut up and sit down and quit your petulant whining, for the love of God. And that goes for the supporters threatening FBI agents' lives over all of this, too. Get over yourselves already. I hope there will be more coverage of this story on this show, 'cause lord knows there's a LOT worth commenting on further here. 

At least we got a happy news story for a change, with the news of the Inflation Reduction Act being passed this week, so woohoo to that! Between that and John marrying that cabbage, nice to have a couple things to celebrate this week :D. To a long and happy marriage, John/Cabbage! Hehe. 

[Jodithgrace]

Not so long, alas. He’s once again a semi cabbage widower. 

[JustHereForFood]

It's a very sad situation, but I don't see what can be done now, other than try to help getting people that don't want to be there out. The situation is unsustainable for many reasons, just one of them being what was said about the age of population - you can't feed that many kids. It's why education is so important, especially for girls, because it helps lower the fertility rate significantly. I am more in the camp that sanctions need to be kept in place and financial help will ultimately make it worse. But if Ollie wants to send them some of his own money, he is free to do so, he has enough and it's probably better way to spend it than his usual antics.

But the situation is horrible for girls and women, I've just read about how there is at least one suicide per day. I wish the efforts would concetrate on getting them out of there (if they want to, of course).

Cabbage wedding - when you think you've seen it all. Is it just me who thinks that stuff like this takes away from the seriousness of the main segments?

[Spartan Girl]

10 hours ago, Annber03 said:

As for the big story about Mar-a-Lago being searched by the FBI this week...between that and the Alex Jones trial, all I can say is schadenfreude was having a week :p. But my god, watching the GOP throw a tempter tantrum and griping about how "unfair" the FBI is being is both hilarious and eye-rolling all at the same time. This from the same people who were gleefully celebrating them when they were looking into Hillary's e-mails, which, by the way, they shouldn't ever be allowed to talk about ever again, given the talk of how sensitive the classified documents Trump took were. Shut up and sit down and quit your petulant whining, for the love of God. And that goes for the supporters threatening FBI agents' lives over all of this, too. Get over yourselves already. I hope there will be more coverage of this story on this show, 'cause lord knows there's a LOT worth commenting on further here. 

That deserves its own episode without any interruptions.

[paigow]

Throw some giant cabbages into that Demon Doll deal with Australia... 

[PrincessPurrsALot]

2 hours ago, JustHereForFood said:

Cabbage wedding - when you think you've seen it all. Is it just me who thinks that stuff like this takes away from the seriousness of the main segments?

I find these segments help make the show more enjoyable.  It is a matter of balancing the hard hitting segments with whimsy and silliness.  The plan seems to be to have people listen to, absorb, and really think about the difficult topics, then feel a bit better overall with the silly stuff.  We're still thinking about the larger topic.  To me, it's not lost through a cabbage wedding. 

[Lantern7]

All this time, I’ve been using Craiyon (CrAIyon?) to project singers into other eras. I never thought of writing a soap opera involving John Oliver and a cabbage. The weird effects with his faces make things more unsettling. Why does that happen? To protect people from potential humiliation? C’mon, AI art generators! John regularly lusts for animals. Marrying a cabbage is plausible for him!

I looked up the thread for the last episode dedicated to Afghanistan. Turns out that was 51 weeks ago today. I’m thinking the topic was written on a calendar in pen, not to get bumped off or back by anything but the most distressing news. Given how the sky figuratively falls every other day, you can debate whether that was the right topic for last night.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Lantern7

[heatherchandler]

2 hours ago, PrincessPurrsALot said:

I find these segments help make the show more enjoyable.  It is a matter of balancing the hard hitting segments with whimsy and silliness.  The plan seems to be to have people listen to, absorb, and really think about the difficult topics, then feel a bit better overall with the silly stuff.  We're still thinking about the larger topic.  To me, it's not lost through a cabbage wedding. 

I like the funny, silly stuff.  I like the balance.  What I really don't like is when he takes pieces of something that is very serious and upsetting and laughs about it.   

I don't want to laugh at Trump talking about the dogs that were left behind because I am truly horrified and heartbroken that they left the dogs behind.  It is not funny, it is horrific what happened to the pets and service dogs.  They put them in a field with no food or water, at the airport, and they were left scared and to their own defenses.  Some were shot at, some starved to death.  The UK handled it better than we did, it was barely reported on here.

I believe all comedians should be able to make whatever jokes they want, and I don't believe in shutting that down.  But since this is a "news" show, I don't like laughing at certain subjects.

[JustHereForFood]

1 minute ago, heatherchandler said:

The UK handled it better than we did, it was barely reported on here.

I remember many complains about UK reportedly evacuating pets and then speculations whether that was even true or not. Since I tend to care more about animals than humans, I was very sad by the lack of empathy towards those animals.

[heatherchandler]

1 minute ago, JustHereForFood said:

I remember many complains about UK reportedly evacuating pets and then speculations whether that was even true or not. Since I tend to care more about animals than humans, I was very sad by the lack of empathy towards those animals.

I was horrified by it.  There was a big push by a group from the UK to get private planes to get the pets and service dogs.  People were upset that there was a push for the pets to get out until it was clarified that the pets didn't go into the seats, they went into the hold and actually having the planes would benefit a lot of people who wouldn't get out otherwise.  It was a tense time, I was following the rescue group on Twitter.

But why the US opted to leave the service dogs to fend for themselves, I will never understand.  There were people who wanted to help but the government shut it down.  

I cannot laugh at any part of that.  There are hundreds of hours of Trump saying stupid stuff, why pick that to laugh at?

[b2H]

I got mad at John’s report on Afghanistan, but not for the reasons most others have.

Our military worked with the civilian government in Afghanistan and their army for most of our time there.  Trained them, got them financing for what they needed, helped protect their people.  

As soon as the US left, the civilian government folded and bolted before the next sunset.

This is, in part, why they are where they are.  The civilian government was supported for years and the moment they were asked to stand on their own, they simply failed.  

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/15/world/asia/afghanistan-taliban-kabul-surrender.html

Billions spent in aid, and for what?

Edited August 16, 2022 by b2H

[ruby24]

I don't understand how it was ever going to be any different once we decided to leave. Seriously, John, how should it have been done OR should we have stayed forever? Because that was the other option. 

The best case scenario, the one they were hoping for that didn't pan out, was that the Taliban took over in a few months, rather than a few days. Even if it went that way the end result would be the same, would it not?

Or maybe Biden shouldn't have followed Trump's signed agreement with them, and what, came up with his own that would have played out slower, an exit over a few more years or something? Honestly, I just don't know what everyone who harps on what a "failure" leaving Afghanistan was thinks we should have done differently, IF they don't want us to have stayed there permanently. They never articulate it, and John didn't do that last night either.

[paigow]

37 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

Or maybe Biden shouldn't have followed Trump's signed agreement with them, and what, came up with his own that would have played out slower...

Jeff Bridges & John Lithgow stayed behind...

[swanpride]

At the very least they should have organised the retreat better. 

[JustHereForFood]

It's a damn if you do, damn if you don't situation. The US got shit for going there, for staying, now for leaving. If they didn't leave, that would have been bad too.

Just accept that some parts of the World are not yet ready for democracy. It took us in the West a long time too.

[Lugal]

The Afghan government was never going to survive anyway, it had no base of popular support and was widely seen by the Afghan people as an occupying force, not to mention the corruption.  It's the fact that it was so fragile that it fell within hours that took everyone by surprise.

45 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

Just accept that some parts of the World are not yet ready for democracy. It took us in the West a long time too.

Democracy can't be spread at gunpoint.  And let's not pretend this was about democracy at all otherwise we would be dealing very differently with Saudi Arabia and various other dictatorships around the world.  This was about geopolitical concerns and hubris.

[andromeda331]

I'm happy to see John just as upset about the canceling the Babysitters Club as I am. Thanks John. Damn you Netflix. 

Everything with Afghanistan is such a mess and so depressing. I hate the Taliban back in power. I don't trust them with money. They don't care what happens to the people. I hate the loss of rights for women and children. I worry about the people especially the women and kids. I don't know what to do or what we should have done.