S06.E14: Chapter One Hundred and Nine: Venomous

[AnimeMania]

TOXIC - With palladium acting as his personal kryptonite, Archie (KJ Apa) decides he must build up his tolerance if he's going to stand a chance against Percival (guest star Chris O'Shea.) Betty (Lili Reinhart) turns to Jughead (Cole Sprouse) for help uncovering some repressed memories from her childhood. Meanwhile, Veronica (Camila Mendes) deals with a bombshell discovery that effects how she interacts with people around her, and Cheryl (Madelaine Petsch) debates whether she should reach out to a former childhood crush.

Original Airdate: May 15, 2022   8:00-9:00 p.m.    CW

[ruby24]

"We want you to have your 'main character' energy back?" Wow, what a way to shade your own writing, show. So, I guess what I'm getting is that the show couldn't figure out how to pair Veronica with Reggie without sidelining her as a character somehow, and so they split them up in order to have her interact with the mains again? 

I don't quite understand that. Pairing Jughead with newbie Tabitha has hardly sidelined him from the other characters in any way.

Not that it matters. This episode clearly reintroduced both Betty/Jughead and Archie/Veronica so I guess it's only a matter of time until we're headed down that road again. Senselessly.

I've never been more convinced that Archie and Veronica in particular simply do not belong together or have anything in common.

[Affogato]

10 hours ago, ruby24 said:

"We want you to have your 'main character' energy back?" Wow, what a way to shade your own writing, show. So, I guess what I'm getting is that the show couldn't figure out how to pair Veronica with Reggie without sidelining her as a character somehow, and so they split them up in order to have her interact with the mains again? 

I don't quite understand that. Pairing Jughead with newbie Tabitha has hardly sidelined him from the other characters in any way.

Not that it matters. This episode clearly reintroduced both Betty/Jughead and Archie/Veronica so I guess it's only a matter of time until we're headed down that road again. Senselessly.

I've never been more convinced that Archie and Veronica in particular simply do not belong together or have anything in common.

Yeah, I thought Reggie was a good match for Veronica. Now, if she has any moral fiber, she will end up alone.

Sheesh. The lipstick.

[SourK]

My hope is that this somehow becomes the OT3 solution to the Archie/Betty/Veronica love triangle and Jughead just stays with Tabitha. Or, I guess, dies when they save the world?

Meanwhile, Archie's solution to everything is to endure extreme amounts of physical pain because enduring pain = ennoblement = triumph over evil. So, first he injures himself with the magic metal, and then he drinks the poisoned soup, and then he lets Cheryl burn him with her magic, and the whole time he's just like, "There's no way this much pain can't work."

And Veronica's solution to everything is to make everyone watch her do a dance. I loved how Percival was just shaking his head like, "Man, she really outplayed me. Now the investors will super believe in her company."

Finally, I sort of buy everyone asking Cheryl for advice about magic because it's not like there's someone else to go to. But why is Veronica asking the coroner for advice about her weird poison abilities? Like, is there any chance he was going to say anything other than "I bet it'll kill you"?

Oh, also LOL at how Veronica's powers will be totally fine as long as she can control her emotions.

[ruby24]

Also this whole season's very likely to be somebody's dream in the end, I think. The weird random flashes to the other universe are still occurring, so that means something. Even if it turns out to be something stupid.

[tennisgurl]

I guess the best way to get Reggie and Veronica to stay apart is to have Reggie join Percival for no reason and for Veronica to give him a very narratively unearned fuck off speech, which it feels like she's had stashed away for quite some time. Wasn't their break up pretty mature in the last episode? Why do they hate each other all of the sudden? Can this show please keep its character motivations consistent for at least three seconds?

Has Veronica ever owned a business that wasn't just an excuse for her to give smug boss bitch speeches and to make everyone watch her dance? I loved how Percival was chuckling at her whole ridiculous spider dance, like he couldn't believe that this was apparently Veronica's best plan as to how to save her casino. "We want you to have main character energy back." This shows attempts at meta are so awkward, it just ends up feeling like even the show itself thinks that its writing sucks, but instead of improving it, they have to awkwardly call attention to how much it sucks. 

Alice having the serial killer gene and knowing that Hal is a murderer all along is clearly a retcon, but it is at least very in character for Alice. Betty really won the lottery when it came to those two as parents. I know its been a thing for awhile, but people super dramatically saying "serial killer gene" over and over never stops making me laugh, like evil is something you inherit like eye color. I know what they are going for, but its just so literal it becomes ridiculous. 

So was having a bunch of flashbacks to Bughead scenes and having Archie kiss Veronica shameless pandering to shippers or was it actual foreshadowing of who is going to end up getting together by the end of the season? I guess it doesn't really matter, I'm still pretty sure this all takes place in some parallel dimension anyway.

The creepy but helpful coroner is probably my favorite character at this point.

[thuganomics85]

So, Veronica being Veronica, once she finds out she's toxic (heh), she naturally goes all in with the black widow "persona" complete with black lipstick, black outfits, and a general goth look.  That is so on point for her!  But, hey, at least she not only kind of finds a way to control it; as long as she doesn't get to emotional or passionate ever (good luck with that); she finds out she is immune to other kinds of poison as well (and alcohol!), so I'm sure that will be helpful at some point.  Until then, she'll now thwart Percival and his attempt to take over the casino with... random dance numbers?!  It really felt like the writers just didn't know how to end this one and were like "Screw it!  It's dance time!"

Meanwhile Archie tries to at first "Superman" his way through his palladium weakness, but after it doesn't work, he turns to Cheryl for help.  Cheryl tries to use the Rasputin method instead and almost just kills him, which is kind of funny: mainly because I knew that Archie was never actually close to dying.  Instead, she uses another spell to "reforge" him and it seems to be working for now.  Even might be immune to palladium now.  We shall see!

Thanks to some mind journeys from Jughead, Betty finds out that Alice actually did have the serial killer gene this entire time and thats likely where Betty got it.  Also, she knew Hal was trying to groom Betty to be another killer, but was too afraid to stop him: at least according to her.  Eh, don't really care anymore.  Alice has just become so one note now.

They are so trying to bring Bughead back to the table now, right?

Snarky, trolling Nana Rose might be my new favorite character.

The mysterious Heather has finally arrived!

Archie dancing to Veronica's performance was probably the most fun the character/K.J. Apa was allowed to have on this show. 

[HeatLifer]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

So was having a bunch of flashbacks to Bughead scenes and having Archie kiss Veronica shameless pandering to shippers or was it actual foreshadowing of who is going to end up getting together by the end of the season?

I would lean towards pandering to their shippers. Context is important. Archie didn’t kiss Veronica on his own, it was Betty’s brainchild, they did out of friendship for Veronica, and Betty was present. There was no romantic foreshadowing that Archie wants to be with Veronica at all. In actuality, it felt like Varchie was wrapped up. There is no story I see, in my opinion. I’m intrigued with the Bughead flashbacks because it’s Jughead having them, not Betty. Could it bring Jughead/Tabitha some angst like in Rivervale where they ended up saying they loved one another?

[HeatLifer]

On 5/16/2022 at 11:15 AM, Affogato said:

Yeah, I thought Reggie was a good match for Veronica. Now, if she has any moral fiber, she will end up alone.

Sheesh. The lipstick.

I don’t think Reggie and Veronica are done. It’s very enemies to lovers.

[SourK]

On 5/16/2022 at 5:35 PM, ruby24 said:

Also this whole season's very likely to be somebody's dream in the end, I think. The weird random flashes to the other universe are still occurring, so that means something. Even if it turns out to be something stupid.

The way I feel about Riverdale in general is that I expect it to be stupid, but I want it to be cool. I feel intrigued whenever we get a flashback to the other universe, and then I feel pre-disappointment for whatever it turns out to mean.

4 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I guess the best way to get Reggie and Veronica to stay apart is to have Reggie join Percival for no reason and for Veronica to give him a very narratively unearned fuck off speech, which it feels like she's had stashed away for quite some time. Wasn't their break up pretty mature in the last episode? Why do they hate each other all of the sudden? Can this show please keep its character motivations consistent for at least three seconds?

I'm not joking at all: there was a moment when I thought, "Okay, so her power is verbal abuse."

4 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Alice having the serial killer gene and knowing that Hal is a murderer all along is clearly a retcon, but it is at least very in character for Alice.

I feel like it's also retreading a plot line that already happened. IIRC, Betty and Alice had to get rid of a body -- also from the kitchen -- because one of the Chics murdered someone.

I also feel like maybe the obvious conclusion to draw -- which I'm surprised neither of the characters drew -- is that Hal just lied and told everyone they had the serial killer gene, too. Also, now that Betty knows the word "grooming" she uses it for everything.

3 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Meanwhile Archie tries to at first "Superman" his way through his palladium weakness, but after it doesn't work, he turns to Cheryl for help.  Cheryl tries to use the Rasputin method instead and almost just kills him, which is kind of funny: mainly because I knew that Archie was never actually close to dying.  Instead, she uses another spell to "reforge" him and it seems to be working for now.  Even might be immune to palladium now.  We shall see!

Actually, now that you mention it, it would be really hilarious if Archie challenges Percival to another fight without checking to see whether he's immune to palladium or not, and then Percival just beats him up again. I mean, Cheryl's other advice has only been so-so. Maybe she's wrong about this, too.

[Noneofyourbusiness]

2 hours ago, SourK said:

I also feel like maybe the obvious conclusion to draw -- which I'm surprised neither of the characters drew -- is that Hal just lied and told everyone they had the serial killer gene, too.

Hard to lie about whether a piece of paper that Alice could also see says positive or negative.

[secnarf]

21 minutes ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Hard to lie about whether a piece of paper that Alice could also see says positive or negative.

Hal brought it in to her. Nothing to say he didn't print it off himself.

I'm undecided, or maybe just don't care enough, but it's certainly possible he was making it up.

[Dobian]

You have to admire a show that's so nutty, Veronica breaks out into a fully choreographed performance of Britney's Toxic in the middle of a shareholder meeting.

So this season we're getting nice Cheryl.  That means next season we will get psycho Cheryl again.

Betty is always talking about the evil inside her, but when are we going to get back to season 1 where she throws on a dark wig, adopts an alternate personality, and actually becomes the evil vixen we all want her to be?

Now we know how they get Archie and Veronica back together.  He's the only one she can't kill when shagging.

Now that Archie is no longer affected by paladium, can't he just crack Percival's skull like an egg now and get it over with?

I'm kind of enjoying the Percival season when he's not around.  Give the Archie gang a bunch of powers and let the hijinks ensue!

[the-grey-lady]

11 hours ago, Dobian said:

Now we know how they get Archie and Veronica back together.  He's the only one she can't kill when shagging.

LOL, what a great line. 😂

Yeah, that connection between their powers felt pretty pointed. Not subtle.

[HeatLifer]

59 minutes ago, the-grey-lady said:

LOL, what a great line. 😂

Yeah, that connection between their powers felt pretty pointed. Not subtle.

Archie and Veronica don’t work, though. There were reasons for that which was shown. Forcing them together because of sex is not a reason why two people should be together. Thankfully I am certain this was not a point anyone was making. There were countless ways to have teased Varchie if that was what was intended and they didn’t show it like that. It was a plot that cemented friendship between three parties.

Edited May 18, 2022 by HeatLifer

[the-grey-lady]

2 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

Archie and Veronica don’t work, though

We disagree on this point.

I think the connection between their powers was quite intentionally pointed, and the writers are setting up a Varchie reunion in the future. 

[HeatLifer]

8 minutes ago, the-grey-lady said:

We disagree on this point.

I think the connection between their powers was quite intentionally pointed, and the writers are setting up a Varchie reunion in the future. 

It doesn’t matter whether you agree with me, it’s what developed. You can believe a Varchie reunion is coming, but there is nothing that supports this through the characters. Archie has not been written as wanting to be with Veronica or being in love with her. Veronica not being able to kill him with sex doesn’t change that. Furthermore, you’re dismissing that Veronica’s powers are a way to push her being independent and on her own. It was not a set up to lead to Archie. You’re assuming everyones powers will never fade, too. 

[the-grey-lady]

1 minute ago, HeatLifer said:

Furthermore, you’re dismissing that Veronica’s powers are a way to push her being independent and on her own. It was not a set up to lead to Archie. You’re assuming everyones powers will never fade, too. 

Don't assume what I'm assuming or dismissing. It's rude.

And I'm not required to agree with you about what we've seen on screen.

[HeatLifer]

4 minutes ago, the-grey-lady said:

Don't assume what I'm assuming or dismissing. It's rude.

And I'm not required to agree with you about what we've seen on screen.

I’m not being rude to you. I never said you need to agree, but Archie and Veronica were shown not to work and that’s what happened in Season 5? Whether this is changed down the line does not mean it didn’t happen this way. I’m not making a plot up.

[Noneofyourbusiness]

17 hours ago, Dobian said:

Now that Archie is no longer affected by paladium, can't he just crack Percival's skull like an egg now and get it over with?

Not to mention, why didn't Veronica think of poisoning Percival? And the board.

[Chicago Redshirt]

7 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

Archie and Veronica don’t work, though. There were reasons for that which was shown. Forcing them together because of sex is not a reason why two people should be together. Thankfully I am certain this was not a point anyone was making. There were countless ways to have teased Varchie if that was what was intended and they didn’t show it like that. It was a plot that cemented friendship between three parties.

The reason given for Archie and Veronica not working is that Veronica wanted to go for big city NY life and Archie wouldn't give up RIverdale. 

Veronica can lightswitch to loving Riverdale and thus being able to get over her love for NY.

Or, if this power switch is semi-permanent, Veronica could come to grips that in addition to having Archie as her first love, and then her second love, he is the only one she can safely sleep with.

I agree that's a weak reason to be get together with him.

But the fact that they have the compatible physical powers as shown this episode may be the way that TPTB are teasing Varchie. Given the love of CW love triangles/rectangles/other geometric figures, it's entirely possible that we will see a Betty/Archie/Veronica triangle, a Jughead/Tabitha/Betty triangle etc etc. 

[rmontro]

It was funny how Veronica's precautions against poisoning other people involved wearing a veil and black lipstick (not a good look on her). 

Also interesting how one minute Archie is hoping for a child and a future with Betty, then the next he's making out with Veronica because... because he can, I guess. 

I liked the original Bughead run, but I don't care to see it again.  Jughead deserves better, I'd keep him with Tabitha.

I wonder what they did with the body?  Did they put it back in the floor?  Report it to the police (doubtful, considering they're under Percival's influence)?  Dump it in the swamp.  I like that Jughead left.  "Yep, there's a dead body in the floor we just tore up.  Well, see you later". 

[HeatLifer]

2 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

The reason given for Archie and Veronica not working is that Veronica wanted to go for big city NY life and Archie wouldn't give up RIverdale. 

Veronica can lightswitch to loving Riverdale and thus being able to get over her love for NY.

Or, if this power switch is semi-permanent, Veronica could come to grips that in addition to having Archie as her first love, and then her second love, he is the only one she can safely sleep with.

I agree that's a weak reason to be get together with him.

But the fact that they have the compatible physical powers as shown this episode may be the way that TPTB are teasing Varchie. Given the love of CW love triangles/rectangles/other geometric figures, it's entirely possible that we will see a Betty/Archie/Veronica triangle, a Jughead/Tabitha/Betty triangle etc etc. 

What you’re suggesting are rewrites, which can happen. However, it doesn’t take into consideration that Archie loves Betty. It’s not about Veronica changing her mind or needing Archie to sleep with her. That’s more than weak reasons. It’s using Archie as some object for Veronica. Moreover, to have teased triangles, Betty shouldn’t have been the one who came up with the idea out of friendship. She wouldn’t have been present in that scene.  Archie was not cheating and there was not the impression that this will happen in the future. I fail to see a Jughead/Tabitha/Betty triangle because Betty has shown no interest in Jughead.

2 hours ago, rmontro said:

Also interesting how one minute Archie is hoping for a child and a future with Betty, then the next he's making out with Veronica because... because he can, I guess. 

That’s not what happened. No one made out and he was not interested in Veronica romantically. 

Edited May 19, 2022 by HeatLifer

[rmontro]

2 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Veronica can lightswitch to loving Riverdale and thus being able to get over her love for NY.

Maybe Archie can buy a farm and we can have Green Acres II.

The chores!  The stores!

 

15 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

That’s not what happened. No one made out and he was not interested in Veronica romantically. 

?  That was more than just a peck they were sharing.  And speaking of sharing, apparently the characters don't mind doing that, at least when it comes to Archie.

[HeatLifer]

12 minutes ago, rmontro said:

?  That was more than just a peck they were sharing.  And speaking of sharing, apparently the characters don't mind doing that, at least when it comes to Archie.

They kissed once. It was short and they didn’t go in for more? I don’t know why this is being exaggerated or why the scene is not being spoken about in context. Betty and Archie felt bad for their friend Veronica and wanted to make her feel better. That was the purpose of Betty coming up with the idea. It was all to show a friendship, which was why Veronica called them her best friends and thanked them. There was nothing about those scenes that gave the impression of betrayal or cheating to come.

[ruby24]

Only the possibility that they may want to go ahead and do a storyline (even if just the one time on this show) that at least goes hard for the original comics triangle, since it was basically one of the things that defined it. I could see them doing that for like, 3 episodes or something.

[the-grey-lady]

16 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

Only the possibility that they may want to go ahead and do a storyline (even if just the one time on this show) that at least goes hard for the original comics triangle, since it was basically one of the things that defined it. I could see them doing that for like, 3 episodes or something.

I hope not. One of the things I liked about show from the beginning was how they didn't drag out that tired love triangle nonsense. It would even more annoying for them to do it now, when the characters are adults.

Although I think you're right. If they do it, it won't last. I wouldn't be surprised if they started and finished a "triangle" within the span of a single episode.

[HeatLifer]

32 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

Only the possibility that they may want to go ahead and do a storyline (even if just the one time on this show) that at least goes hard for the original comics triangle, since it was basically one of the things that defined it. I could see them doing that for like, 3 episodes or something.

I think if they wanted to go hard with a triangle they wouldn’t have made it into a display of friendship in this episode. I’m confident Veronica and Archie will not be behaving romantically or the plot would have been significantly different.

Edited May 19, 2022 by HeatLifer

[Affogato]

On 5/18/2022 at 4:37 PM, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Not to mention, why didn't Veronica think of poisoning Percival? And the board.

I think that was chekovs lipstick.